administration officials fired documents that gave theence behind why president is or by y the justice departments opposition and thinks the california laws are lel ap unconstitutional and being sanctuary. >> good evening, everybody, and welcome. i am mark. executive vice president at arizona state you university and delighted to welcome you here to the o'connorf washington, d.c. center for arizona state university that is named for two distinguished arizona leaders, ambassador and sandra day o'connor and appreciative of the family for allow thisinment to to occur. and so we are deluded to open this week. have a whole week of activities and the center here

will house a variety of things asu is operating including affairs,n institute, actually, the policy outcomes which is part of the new school the future of innovation in society, and has our sandra day o'connor college of law washington program here and has programs such as the arizona state university center for the and incorporation with the new america foundation which is running events here. it is also them to forcronkite news bureau washington, d.c. for those with don't know in arizona, we have a onhtly 30-minute broadcast cronkite new on the arizona pbs aation and that program is program that is put on by students, andor fantastic station. they run a news boar bureau here

in washington. they also run one in los angeles and have a connection in doub lynn, ireland, as well. it is a tremendous program. thatht, we are delighted we have an event sponsored boy the walter cronkite school of journalism and mass communication and pleased that han is hereurcal la with us tonight. dean callahan is at the back of the room and leads the school it has been outstanding school over the many years that ithas been in charge and continues to excel. topic,, we have a great and great panel. i would like to introduce you to professor of jurn nism at university,e leonard downie jr. len was the amvetive editor for 17 year wee make him executive editor ameritus but the post dunn give such titles.

post for a very long time in his career including part of the editorial during the water gate investigation. perhaps, more famously now known advisor on thel movie "the post" under his washingtonof the post, len and the team of reporters won 25 poet prizes and sivenued the great leg great reporting for "the washington post." so pless join welcoming len downie jr. and our panel. [applause] >> thank all for coming. we do have a good pam here. we have nearest me, abby phillip,s who the white house correspondent to cnn, joined cnn year from "the washington post" where she cover the white house and national politician including hillary clinton's national campaign.

in the middle, we have ashley forer, white house reporter "the washington post," and senior political analysts for from 2011 to 2017, she was washington based political report fore"the new york times" the fine people who we have are over the years and the chloe androm me is senior producer for cbs this producernd a former for the "cbs evening news" and has covered several presidential and also wasm pans asia bureau chief for cbs headquartered in beijing. now, all of you have covered both the refeas administration form or another and the trump administration, so the first question is a softball, different, abby? >> how about everything? lot is different. i mean, i think, this white ause, the experience as consumer of information about this white house is probably

similar to what we experience as reporters in that it is probably chaotic as it seems to you and especially by the pastn administrations and covered past presidencies. often be aouse can controlled environment in which great effort to control the message to know what single day.t every there are lots of embargoes on know, obama you wide house is very much like that them they were not just trying to manage the messaging the west wing but also across the federal government and with this presidency, i is a little bit of the opposite of that. there are a lot of little theadoes happening all over federal government and that what is makes it so challenging to reporter, and i think, i assume, the consumer news can sometimes feel look you never know where to look next. that is because there is not a

whole lot of central planning happening here, and that is different. i mean, some people would say, it is good ored about or whatever. is just different. >> ashley, why in the white house where they attacked though press so much, seem to be the press,oughout why are there so many good sources for you all? think a couple of reasons. one is, as abby mentioned, this lot wavese is in a ways more accessible than previous white houses. changed when john kelly came in and implemented but i neverne, covered obama whit us who the way i am conversation president house.nticipate white youin the west wing or could be upper press having a uncommonp would not be for someone to see you and say, hi, ashley, hi, i think the the oval is free in office if you want to stop in

and say hello. that happened to a number of people. main, i wask toking to somebody they said outside of this oval, to see aikely preacher, an he'll vant and a of congressember waiting to see the president. in the obama white house, i any little story i was doing, you know, they had to know, what sorts of questions do asking, you which be topic?the do you have understanding if it would run on the front page and it was managed and the trump white house is not like that am? you have more acute sense of president is thinking because his tweets are literally what he is thinking in that moment. i don't buy the theory is sort of strategically drning everyone's attention away, you know, covering up one thing with another, it is just what he is thinking, then to your original question many dad sorses? again, this was especially true at the beginning, but the is someone who consumes a lot of news through

the television and that is of most compelling way to get a messtime him. you would think if you are a west wing stare you could walk to the oval to discuss and walk in, walk out in early did a is to revice president the president with a briefing back or deliver the message but it compellings to be with in front of him in person and more compelling to be in front of him through the sheen news.le and so you had people sort of thesehey were all of factions, fighting them out in the press bus that was of continue the most get efficient way to sway the president. >> how do you manage all of this chaos? in terms of how you are prepared and so on?ows >> barley. of the casterms itself, within of the most challenge in thises for morning show that is we have to, somehow, have a big prediction of what may be driving the news morning..m. in the and i work primarily day side

sayday before and i have to the number of times i have wong up to seven different stories hadof washington that we not originally had when i went to bed at 10:00. it is astonishing. days in particular like my favorite is not super may, we saw a forly that would maybe drive the russian state bleed had photographed the ovalan ambassador in the office and this story, i though, we were not going to do much than for the next few days. that afternoon, the president director, and that is par for the course right now. and i think the pace is really do have abecause we finance am of space. we only two two hours and the entire two hours of news from washington despite the nacht the washington bureau would like now staffed in a way that could han deal this, so it challenging.

it is mooing something we can do. we have to roll with it. it requires a lot of flexibility am the or day "the wall street journaled" a big interview the president as i was reading it the post brock her to ry about the expletive countries, so you direction,s are in if i knit. >> abby, some of this accessibility to sources in the white house, part of the in there, areing on people constantly -- do you have a sense of who is on whip which to foo fightto go out about things about the other them? yeah, i was going to add said, kindley just of the second player of this is fact thatwith the trump is a candidate who came into politics fairly recently, sew filled the white house with a lot of people who don't know him that well, who have not worked for him particularly long, some of whom are the arely webs, some of pom long time allies over the fewer

and fewer people left and what creates is those fabses that you just mentioned. a lot of people with a lot of interests working for this one person. that is very different from what typically get. buy the time you become president in the country, usually, you been in politics for awhile. developed an entire stable of staff of people who continuesly loy droll you. who have been with you. trump has had the challenge of working lot of people with him and frankly he doesn't trust a whole lot. into the jobsming from all kinds of different perspectives and don't trust haveother, alsoment they not worked with each other. many of them for very long and wes are as reporter often getting people fighting to throughe the president us through the media but also trying to one up one each other to push people out of trump's in circle out of the good grace

has changed one of the interesting things that to workten, i used ashley until recently. >> i know. mean, one of the things we often tacked about and talk and her job is just, so who is allied now? the time.hanges all would you be surprised. i think was an idea, um, you know, you might have one idea of who is allied with who. for example miller has spoken in the same breath as time been none but in the we have been covering this white house. theselliance has changed, people are making new ally apes and breaking old article the time. in testing but also challenging. a lot of it has to do with people trying to survive the white house. and in order to do that often, your allies ask they month to month because that

quickly things change around here. >> ashley, don't people get punish for talking actual of school? out of i can remember the obama administration. afraid of jay carney and afraid of talking and would be punished somehow? >> yeah. , i mean, yes and no. obviously if people are getting deeply reprimanded you would think it would stop. one of the problems is they have noted the great ability to sort of crack crown to figure out who is talking to who? anelieve that they had e-mail or a phone record or some hard proof i think would be consequences and every now and then you see something like that, liking now, they sort of banned cell phones in the west within, personal cell phones those are cell phones you can receive texts on, app, amess anticipating lot of pom in the white house preferred to communicate with pin and did that under the gis of security, but

crackdowns seem to happen in moments where there were a lot of leaks coming out of the white house. the problemse of is -- and i have to saner general kelly healths has gotten lot disciplined and some people who don't lec at all. but i think the problem is they sort of don't, they have leakpity to fer rite out within other brief point to what abby was saying, that sort of toltales you how are you cover this white house but you may notice if you are very, very washingtonr of the noose some of the white house stories we have a line that is the rest ofd in journalism that says this portrait of the president and in result of 27s the interviews with, you know, senior white house officials, friends, outside confidants, et cetera. the reason we do that is partially it avoids having to like source every single graft flow but morethe importantly, the real reason we

do it. to cover this white house at the beginning you had to talk to that many people. and my understanding and again, i covered inst this capacity. but there were certain people in obama white house told you something you just knew it was true. house.th the bush white if whoever told you something, you could just sort of like put in your store rain feel confident. and especially at the beginning factions and factions, in each person's story some sort of getting percent tag of the truth vow some sources like wikipedia a good jumping off point and i would never put i in the people who are reliable to get the fullest pish the truth you had to people and all the lie apeses and sort of in doing that you could actually come figuring out we believe what happened.

>> cane ask prev troy that. i think a lot. logical question is so are they lying to you then? answer isk the sometimes. the answer is also that people within the white house often visibility they don't have full visibility of what is going on. and what conversations the president is having at 10:00 at night with his friends and how it chans his thinking by the he wakes up the next morning and then, so people are operating times with to and, and whaton ago.as true two hours there is a sense of lack of dense among people who ought to know thing. they may not always know what israel and what is not. in part because of how trump often, he draws from special and array of advisers people around him but never sure where he is heading with his thinking. >> appear, obsly to the public that you get a different picture

of what is going on from different networks. and how is that, how does it feel at cbs. what do you make of what fox doing or what msnb crist doing? what do you sees the charter in we seeme now that different views of administration and different channels? terms of our charter. i was looking at the steps the other day. in 1980,i think, 52 million people were watching the big three networks and now that.f we're at 25 million. we are not heavily in flew ended what fix or msnb are doing, that is not how we operate. say, ry been in cbs for a listening type, in the current many waysorning, in we are programming the other two takeng shows in trying to a serious step at the news up the morning which has pot been are doing a good job at it, think i. it is still new in many ways, the thing we have decided to

andly down on is time giving stories the time they deserve and also, inviting lawmakers to come to our show and this is one series call ised shores that matter and so we five or sucksone minutes of tv in the morning to talk about something from a policy perspective which is unusual and we do not see that on our competitors we had the house on thee other day, and on tax reform and minutes which is a lot of time and unusual. lawmakers who you don't see on the competitors, senator langford, senator jones did his first us, senatorth gardener who didn't have a lot of visibility but was critical player and is becoming even more so. that is the kind of thing we are doing. in tellers of being more serious. that is our answer. are. think we and there has been ah appetite

for it which i find to be encouraging. >> ashley, this president has few fully full, very scale press conferences and the other kind we're used to in most seems to beons but on television and quoted in the newspapers everyday. how would you describe the accessibility to the press and would you want to change the way it works? ways, he is some more accessible because you are when heot of sorses and sweets you what he is thinking thatou know you can watch 5 minute ral i on saturday night and have a good win do into the head in that moment. say i am aally little surprised he has not done more press conferences and in part because on the calm paint was not uncommon are and again, most, even other candidates i have cover or polls you put in a request and you go back and with the staff and they say, ok, we can get you ten minutes here's. all right. my comewaiting by pooter on the campaign at least you put in a request you know

then youdate trump and would be like out waiting in line at a food cart and your cell phone would ring and it was the candidate. so we have someone who really in and engaging with the media you wanted to challenge is people say he this is he is his of staff. he is thinks he is his own political strategist and of one-on-oneort with the media, he is, he can of quite good and quite engaging and charismatic not just in one-on-one interviews especially actually because in on one-on-one interview shall you can see it is easier for sort of pin him down, go deep on popple sis and less familiar.e with or in a room like this. if you are standing up here. that is a good forum for him. is someplace we are is comfortable there is a home i cab not quite remember. rigs whenhe admin everything was going wrong. maybe you remember. >> this was the only press conference he gave. he came it to east room and he

took back control. is, you know, sean spicer cannot speak for me. for the.t speak i can speak for myself. he did. cabinethen opens up the meetings the televised cabinet meetings on the one hand i often the lack of deep approximately sy understanding, but they also show someone who is sort of a deal maker and can win over a room and in this ry places and so, yes, i would love to make it more accessible ap love to sit him down at the washington post for an interview and come tow amefing room once a week, i not sure why he doesn't. think he is good in that format. >> speak of the briefing room. the public, the white house press briefings are beginning to accept ap were of some kind. are they useful any more? hem them? still go to we do go to them. >> we do go to them. useful? i mean, some days i think they

are useful. days think they aren't. the greatest use, and i think you is true not just of the house buts the obama would go towhen i press briefings. the greatest use is to create a public record what the white house is position is on a given subject. i think it is actually becausely important when everything distill and we find out ether what the real at the pointe are where there is a decision that needs to be made. we can compare that to what was said when we asked the question. i think it is important. there have been i loft ties in haswhite house where it turned out that statements that are made from that podium are true based ont facts we have learned. it is important for the public to know we are doing that kind of due diligence. think it is in dy and age pes whether therenow are questions about what is

truth, what is true, what is false. easier to show our work when it comings to the truth by saying here is whats with said on this day. here is what we know now. when we can show readers and viewers that record matters especially now at a time when people are all questioning you know, just what israel and what is not. so it is good for from that perspective. things one of the bad about the press briefing that is often the answer is can become circular so whatever question you have asked it the one well, you are who is reallying that. that i is not helpful. kinds those kinds, those of back and forths are not helpful. but to the extent that we can answers on facts and i think it is still very important. to the extend it becomes this trolling, not so

helpful. >> yeah. just to add to this. too, that ishere, tv is a little bit of a curse of the press briefing, too, because consider corehe apes who want to ask the same question and want to skit on often i am the person who is asking for that. it is one of the real his that contributes to the sick are dynamic,the circular also, you just run done the rabbit hole the same thing over again.r understandably frustrates sun think iah sanders and i wo be curious to see how much we see the press briefings and how play in network stories and cable news the actual pieces themselves in three years or so. i mean, i remember when i was covering the obama white house, due respect to, it was a high bar to have josh one of the evening news stories. everywhere.is on top of that. so much happens after the

there are also completely outdated and ir rel matter often in a minutes after they conclude. so just toed ad to that as well. ahead. >> do you want to say ago? no. >> ok. i will ask you about the tweets. have been talking about the tweets. say thee crits who press shouldn't cover any more. then, because not always true and true also. and of tep reacting to what he is reacting to what he sees on fox news. what do you think he's the fall u. whats the newsworthiness of the president's tweets. do have a philosophy of how they be covered? yeah, the debate about whether we should or should not cover thetweets was fair during campaign. then it felt felt like a valid question. this is the president of the united states and he is saying something f. and so, it is shouldsomething that potentially be covered, i think

selective inle what we cover if he is just kind trashing the media? i think its never to the advantage when the media become the story. so whenever it becomes about with us, it is not good. but i think, again, the have what the president is thinking and any given moment it is on his mine. i do think i can only speak to the post, this is probably true versely shall we do try to add contexan sort of fact checking to the tweets. it would be irresponsible. well, he is the president. said something. here is what he said. you say said said this. he is saying this about president obama but it is worth tally noere isle evidence for that claim, in fact details to the contrary i think value and service to readers. >> abby? >> think i we should cover the tweets.

ashley said this earlier, the literally giving as you window into his mindset and day.hinking every single that is an incredible amount of aces that he reporters could dreamed of five years ago or ten years ago it is important. it is telling. kind of truck toll myself because sometimes i see that is lake the president is city thissing this thing, and then the president literally just tweets it. is just, it is, it is important. the president literally just is thinking, a he want,s what he likes where hash when you can tell he when he is angry and happy. is critical to covering this white house because it takes the of stuff become we no longer have to together i rely on other people moods weing the condition say this is what he said on this subject.

in the time of me to are and times up how important it for the news media to investigate allegations of inif sexual harassment by the president? do you think they have any political impact inwhat's the thigh i theonse k? responsibility is automatic. do think that one of the stranger things is how the rules don't apply in term of things that would have mattered before. time talk lot of talking about a porn star who was paid off right before the election. conservative republican on the hill don't want to condemn really engage to perhaps not know anything about it. and i don't think we can be outcome driven. whether it is something the american people care about. whether republicans care about it. i think it is our duty if you

are faced with evidence to pursue it and to do diligence. one of the problems is having the fin nate resources are now do everything we need to do. adding newconstanley resources but i think every day, bere are things we could working harder on that we just can't be. is so you think it important. this stormy daniels thing, we for 60menvaued her misthat is going to be legal thing. that is going be a real thing. i need to stay employed. i think, i think his behavior, of.s the president the same logic applies to the bets am some ways. he des and says are presidential actions a stap presidential sames of fact. precedence for this, too, and 20 year ago it

happened. >> yeah. lakes. >> ashley, what do you this the am paque of the mooler investigation on moral in the white house. do you have any sense of where you think it may in going and the fears are in the white house about where it may be going? >> yes and no. think, you know, we only have glimpses inwhat mueller has asked and so i think the besteally has sense of where it is going in terms, in terms of moral, it is reallied about for moral, i think this president can take a lot of criticism, he can talk a lot of bad stories. he is actually quite good at boning back, but there us thathing against russia will never not drive him crazy. i know this is a little bit of psychology but also armchair psychology i have gotten back from people in the whipping, but he basically has hard time. he is inchannel of saying the possibly seem to be true.

absolutleyat rush sh sper ferred in the 2016 presidential election and yet he the electoral college fair and square. he sort of feels like if he that russia's it delee legitimizes the victory and one thing he cannot toll rite. it comes up. there are people who are in and out of the president's circle, right? buts like hotel california the people who are cast out for good and never recover are the cardinalo commit the sin of in his mine crossing him ow on russia. jeffat is attorney general session because he recused himself which the president matterthe probe and no what jeff sessions does and mat are how tough he is on drug sentencing and terms and immigration he can just never recover and thief bannon, too, was in and out of the out ofnt's circle and the white house. trump was still talking to him

and then steve been none made to michael saying wolff in that back into the meeting that the president's son theat trump tower with russian lawyer was possibly treasonnist and that was the end been none so something that the president cannot stomach and something that makes ways that often exacerbate the problem and seng out. sort of have the two pk ket, right. the collision and the and sorton of justice of the fact of this makes behavior you ward the second back ket more lockley because he is reacting to information he is is of course that all bad for the west wing. wolff book, how realistics, how much reality is there from your experience? geneshink it just on -- it depend on what part of referring to.re my rule of thumb on the michael

wolff book generally that is when people are quoted in the book, you should just take the quote. example. steve been none. one of the reasons steve bannon part of that book permeate sod deeply was because he was on the record. those were his boards. he never denied them and they were telling where he was at the time when he was talking to theael wolff and builds level of access wolf had for some period of time and in the was wing which extraordinary and so i think is very true, um, i really, i don't want to get into -- i haven't actually -- i shouldn't admit this. rad theot actually entire book cover to cover but as it per tans to how it come, that is how we approached it a lot of assertion aiden the book that as journalist, he interpreted what he took in from the sources and thattized it into something he thinks gives it a good

picture of the white house and part of that is the level of fairlyaos that is accurate picture but that is lass fairly accurate picture that you can read in the post and the new york times and on cnn every single day. the other thing as i said. the real on the record quotes of people who work in the west wing think those were, ofws the most important part the book from our perspective acause it let, it set off whole still of bannon being excised and also kind of a trump yun of the verse that i think is still ongoing story about the been and then the trump white house and how they deal facteach other and the that it leibs in the president's mine they are not necessarily this entirely the same thing any more.

come pen men taters often describe the press as put theme trying to them out of office and how, how that? reag to do you any sense among the pom you work with and the coverage its anti-trumpng as opposed to the normal accounting that one would want with the president, too normalan, i think it is accountability, think it is easy narrative to say that we are are and iv the resistance also think it delve tells with the enemy of the american people. opposition party and the rhetorics that this white house has attached to the news media. i think i think, it doe pen on how tired you are. thatou feel when youer language. but think technically, we worked environment with strong press frem and the first are not sond things bad. i actually think about this a

beijingng been based in where the very different rule of thumb when it comes to press freedom and watching, watching people in china use some of this party enemy of the american people rhetoric to just treat their own scary.and it is and i think that if you see in places like-gry or turkey or the physically pens who are using this rhetoric as well, they are adopting pro trump commentator rhetoric the president's own language to just fy incredibly harsh crackdowns on the own amplications the are wide ranging when you take on the press but i feel what we're doing every day is a job. and it is about accountability i don'tonsibility and see an again to oust the stretch tefy any imagination.

>> ashley and abby. of you been the targets of anti-media and personal media and anti-media either on the you are outwhen with the president? >> i have an antidote about this. i was covering him during the campaign and i travel. work for "the new york times" but i traveled with him and onee reporters i red a lot. we posted a story that the did not like and so we in san this huge rally diego and like 10,000 or more people and the way the press was was to be clear shall all press no matter what candidate i inered you are sort of closed but normally you are the back of the room but with trump we were sort of part of the show because right ins this moment when he would, you know, say look at those cameras in the not of the room they are showing the crowds then another moment when he just heard to the press pen and cnn sucks is part of the way he would call for

building the wall. show in thetrump mild of the room and 10,000 people or more and he just, he complaining about the story. he says you know where? parker. a woman named a woman, they were at the most, i actually had a little name that i quickly slid my laptop over. the most dishonest. the most despicable. t are not here are they? i am sitting in the front row entire crowd. then the good part about being a print reporter is that knows who i am. right? and so i will say, a lot of good on tv so a lot more, especially women, felt a lot more, you know, this has othereported, but cnn ap outlets got security guards for

their female reporters to walk cars after rallies so it legally disconcert unfevers experience for me being called out by name in a farley neg of and a crowdresident of 10,000 people but i know the stories with accurate which was cared about and i knew no one knew what i looked like. happened to you. >> i have gotten a lot, the internet has become really aggressive in this era? it has been kind of building for money years but i had people post the parent's address. this and i won't call person a reporter but a conservative person who writes and publishon-line a story about my mother including posting her photo online and it is in an attempt me for coverage of a

that kind ofte and a thing has escalated and it can be scary. that my personally. i mean, i don't. obviously, you are concerned about your physical safety but i don't worry about people on-line. me personally it is really i worry more about the in pack on their family and people who didn't sign up for this. i didn't sign up for this income my mother did not. that us the kind of thing that has really escalated and when i was at the post and i was very much like when things like that happened they were like we have resources to help you. the news organizations have get point where they know they ned to protects journalists and so physically and on-line and protech their well.es as because it is, discriminating the kind that you get online. >> one thing the obama administration that is they

actually prosecuted people who out classified information to the press and subpoenaed members of the press recordscords and other and so on as part of those prosecutions. now i know the attorney general got like 35has investigations. some large number. are you fearful that that is actually going to happen during this administration? >> i am fearful of that. to say for as much as the president literally yells about reporters and what we are doing, we don't have a point. have agapes rossen situation. inevitable it is. i don't know. i mean, that is up to the inorney general who is precarious spot with the boss and i think we are with waiting to see what happens. i don't really see any indication that there is going any sort of active push to

print media. sorry, any media right now. to turethe in are talk there and the mandate is there. the intrastructure is there. i don't know. it is a fear. i don't think it is a fear we should be consumed by all the time as long as we have organizations who support us. >> ashley, are any of the source fearful of discussion classified information with you? >> i think, i should say, most of my -- i guess i don't technically know what is and what is not classified always. bar forrns out a low something being classified and story i am worrying on now. where -- this is not someone trying to leak but trying to be a good steward within the administration and want to help the understand something. they are fearful and i am lake, me. this cannot be classified. you know? they are sort of trying to walk don't so they personally violate anticipate norms. but i will say, i think on the

whole again, in terms of the stories dow which are much more political based and i think it is sort of not the same level of sources as people on the russia team or the investigative team know, some of the stuff is like, you know, what channel is the president when he got md at the attorney general? not to ermine the stories i do. that level of classification. >> abby, has the press made any would bethat you concerned about during this coverage? i am thinking for instance, how of the initial coverage of john kelly was he is going to come in and straighten house and going to become more regularized and there won't be so much chaos and so on. now there have been stories that exposing other aspects of kelly's behavior that doesn't if it f that i nertive? nar sniff. >> i think we have shall certainly made mistakes. we made mistakes first of all,

that happens. we tried to correct them when they do happen. they happen. the problem in this at anytration is always time spie happen. in general even something as mall as early days when atrump presidency reporter didn't see the martin luther king jr. bus ten oval correct an had to tharp the president would not stop talk biting. he is still talking about it on twitter. so mistakes like to, small, big. matter. we are disproasker ately, they used against us. the think what you are also sking is are we making mistakes mistakes. i wanti we sometimes --

to use the john kelly is saying as maybe as the best ebbs ample of this. because i think that our interpretation of john cannily largely based on what people knew about him at the time. about kelly is that not a whole lot of people in washington knew him all that well. he was not known to have deep know,cal views on, you policy. he was military pepper. he was then on the hill for his the military and he had friends on the hill in that issues but we have learned more over time about his broader arrive sun jeks for the first time in as far as we know in the public has had to weigh in on those things and his stewardship department of homeland security was one thing but now he is actually in a completely position we are is not just executing the law which is

peoplewould often people he dealt with issues at dhd enforcing the law as it was. house, he isite advising the president on what law, and to take the so we are gaining a broader, and a better understanding of him. as reporters, we have thee responsibility to have that greater understanding play out, learning it. i mean, i think, we, it would it would be in fire ingest we should have known july all of john kelly's deeply beliefs about dreamerss and about and whether some of them are too lazy or not. not of these issues have really been played out and we would, i remember in the early days whenyon kelly was

selective. we were knowledge base about what he believes about anything. and i remember talking to sources about this and people saying, you know what? he doesn't, he didn't really go there a lot of times in the personal bea leafs. now, he is just in a different job. i think a lot of things like are developing in this administration. they are changing all the time. i think the knowledge of situations is evolving some of it has to do with the fact that many players are new buys to the political scene and don't have a whole lot of record for kind of take through as they would through normal staffers so we are dealing with that. i think is a struggle. it is part of a job but i wouldn't. i personally would not characterize them as mistakes in that way. >> ok. addsh zi i was going to this this is a defense or one criticism in the media often gets that is quite fair and everyone carves about drama and story and why down the

focus on the poll san what the voters care about which is a valid criticism that everyone is aware of and working toward and seems like a bit of that figured out but with this white story at of how to overstate sort bound the personality and the politics and the drama are with is actual policy so it is quickly sort of connect the dots. at the way tariffs went down. would you have to start with the britishat ran in a tabloid of hope hicks on a night out on the town that story ran that lead to two of the ex-wifes coming forward with allegations of domestic and emotional abuse and that lead to a number of people in the white wase lying to us which helpful to know as a reporter who does and does not lie to you lead to rob porter who by all accounts was hidely of professional and quite good at the west wing job of how bad he was based on the allegation and his personal life

and leaving the white house and tohad all process in place basically make sure that on trade especially rigorous was run and a lot of people who did not believe in were free traders were using him to block and when the white of there house dissolved into chaos because they were dealing with income before he other allegations and sort of mini fronts andum ber of that allowed peter navarro to oval office when general cannily was not paying attention and a breakdown of protocol. we'll bring you tariffs then the president announced tariffs pretty serious policy implications for the implications for the global then that was deeply tied into how he felt and the sort ofnd the drama sew have to if you want to tell the policy story and ununderstand the decision you have to understand all of those other

things that in theory seem more trivial but i would wagger the president or not. things i grewof to hate as executive of the wash core corepost was the ant dinner and it became a hollywood show and potential sources and get know them better over dern. i see cbs people going this wear. that is worthwhile at all? >> well, whether it is a differents question but i do believe cbs this year, be going i don't of the way whyte house correspondents dinner. think it is stressful. think this year was more presidentg with the not there. it was one of the more substantive dinners and less about the celebrities and but, re, i will keep it brief. am sure will be there. it seem look the president will show. that will change the equation. >> i was going to ask that.

>> yeah. >> yeah. are we allowed to say that? i believe he is going to go. think he may have. i was talking to somebody today who said may not. never know. >> was he pleased with the gridiron? enjoyed himself on the gridiron and seat low bar and that was helpful. time. good and so sort of a two mines that may encourage him to go but also want to go out on a good note and test the luck with the correspondent dern. >> one last question then you can ask questions. a microphone that is shared for that that is right over there. there.ver so a quick lining are round question. how much longer will jared and be in the white house? personal capacity, um, will be through the end of the first term.

to weigheally want into any of the more evidence as to why that may be. the reality with jared, to be a where what is his, he has such a wide portfolio right now, without security clarence particular that issue gives him a problem of credibility whether or not the mideast peace is actually finalized does abilitythe actual technical ability to do anything do question how he finds hess way with limitations including the russia investigation, too. still torn. ivanka profile that everyone hated. i don't know. i think i could see them trying out because admittedly they are under scrutiny they are to and do not enjoy. at the end of the school year

would be a natural transition whether it is this year or next year. there is a thought that jared soft landing pad on the campaign. we reported this. get a clearven signal to him on this. will say, you know, e are horrible. getting killed. i van a is my little girl they theno go back to new york in the next breath and will say you cannot leib. i need you here. your counsel. he is sending mixed messages that feels like probably out first the end of the term. the other part of me feels look these two people are their family and survivors. sop willing to bet on this. will only add i totally agree everything both of them just said especially the idea that trump doesn't quite know whether he wants them to stay or go. i think he feels badly for histhis has turned out for daughter and son-in-law who he

thinks is, you know, undea scrutiny he has been getting. allalso, one new factor in of this that is now there are fewer and fewer people that the president knows and likes and trusts around them and hope hicks is definitely leaving. we know that. people who know trump wonder what happens to him when one left. in, youhat is a factor know, both, whether he wants to help fewer people around him and that he trusts and then you know, i think, also, there has a recent effort underway by people to the white house in the public and the media to bolster jared. this was op-ed was written past week talking about how far he has been treated and how much he has been doing so you kind of have to read those ran as asar red and i wanting to kind of settle them

selfs a little bit more and dust around the presence here. who knows? guess but is anyone's right now the going theory that the soft landing this is campaign. be heating up soon. >> dy not ask you about melan degree. questions from the audience? >> yes, sir. >> wait another microphone, please. >> thank you. my question is the first term and that struck me. is the second term expected? what is the mood like? or when thesident candidate was running people did not take him seriously? inside? is the mood is he planning for a second term? do you think there are chances? media taking hum seriously? he is running. running.s he said is running.

he talked over this weekend is keep america great point.tion and i, i know, i don't go though white house everyday. defer to abby and ashley about the mood inside of the white house. to the point of jared's the choice of the campaign manager already and he did capacity and what for the campaign. technically in police and being built and you have groups and for thewn holding derns dinners for the president and i the rest ofou on it. here.hing totally goes whether he says he is running i think you have to take that seriously to your point about the campaign and we are accused a not take him seriously be

being literal about everything, weakest answer, but it certainly suggest that is think there is speculation that hate the job, um, how much he hates the job is probably too early to tell he certainly enjoyed the time.rt of don't know what do you think?

the president is exactly what you would expect. we know from our sources that the president things about this all the time. he thinks about his poll numbers, the election prospects, how he is doing in iowa.

he thinks about and talks about it all the time. it is a sure sign he is acting on that and what he did with tariffs. move not attical all about republicans and 2018. it hasn't helped him a lot. even republicans will say maybe not so much, this is all about the president in 2020 and if he can go back to his voters and say, i delivered this for you. it is about those union emma democrats to get people to stay or come over to him. >> another question. >> in the same vein i have been told about people like sean hannity or personally charming or engaging, are the people in the administration who have been vilified by the left or who you found to be actually more

sympathetic or professional? i find myself having good thoughts about sean spicer -- can you say something about that? >> are you in the entertainment business? [laughter] think it should go to ashley this question. i always tell people -- to the rest of the world, they are we tissue of this an administration. they are people who have personalities, and many we knew before the trump white house. -- there are a lot of people who are perfectly lovely to work with on a day-to-day basis who are professional. i will tell you two things. a lot of people tell me that when they meet trump, that is

how they feel about him. he is nothing like the caricature on television and you meet him in person. he is very inviting and easy to talk to, warm. i have talked to all kinds of people about meeting with trump, some people who don't really like him and they will almost all tell you the same thing, they enjoy the face-to-face with them. i have heard people say that about ivanka as well. she comes across a little bit as there is a screen in front of butreceiver on television, in a room she is believed to be very diligent. democrats on the hill will tell you this. she is engaged and the like working with her. there are people like that who are different than the person that you see or they act out on television on cable. was going to use the

president and ivanka as the same examples. i haven't spent a lot of time with them, but we did an interview with ivanka and anchored the entire broadcast from inside the white house, which was fought with peril and they upped the ante and we aired a portion of john dickerson's interview with the president from the white house. which did not think the president in the most favorable light, make president with child petulant, because we were in his house and he came down and spent time with us and was jovial and resting in person, focused and clear. completely friendly. i will say this and think about her. she does know her stuff and is steeped in policy. us, which she fed

especially goes a long way camera crews. was are interesting examples of people who get a hard time almost every day, and ashley knows to story short on ivanka and how people feel about ivanka. >> i sat down with ivanka and jarrett a number of times and they are incredibly polite. i wrote a story that followed the line, follow the house of questioner, and he couldn't have been nicer and more polite. front the story coming he mentioned it -- and i think i had to deal with stephen miller on stories and people have a lot of opinions about him. professional, polite. i did a profile on him, not revealing sources, but one thing that supposedly about this profile -- everybody in the white house, and even people who diametrically disagreed with all of his views like them as a person.

i kept on trying to get someone to explain to me how you find them so charming? but he is someone who is widely liked throughout the white house. it is particularly uncommon in this white house, and he is incredibly loyal to the president. that is in short supply in this white house, he doesn't agree with the president and all views, but you wouldn't see stephen miller freelancing and sank his personal views on immigration. holden miller will try to the present back but would accept the decision and what pulled back. there are a few notable exceptions, i had positive experiences dealing with people in a professional basis. >> questions on the side of the room? wondering about the rest

of washington that seems to lose coverage because of all the air room.out of the or missing stories because of everything happening in this chaotic administration? that is such a huge factor in this political environment that we are in. there is a whole government out there that i personally believe is undercovered. there is a lot of policies being changed, regulations rolled back that affect real people. i know there are a lot of reporters out there trying diligently to chip away at those stories every single day. i think the new york times last week ran a great story about the deepwater horizon regulations that are being rolled back. there are stories about air quality and water quality. -- there stories about

stories about what cabinet secretaries are spending and how they are spending that are also important. cory said this earlier, we need infinite resources to not just cover the trump white house but the administration. to end a competition to that is -- even if there is a drive to roll things back, there is also a certain amount of chaos that makes that drive actually difficult to cover. the normal administration there would be a transparent process where stakeholders are brought in and they get to weigh in on it and are informed of things are happening. often in this white house, that process never happens. people on the hill are surprised sometimes when things happen that directly affect their district. as the public is when they read in the newspaper.

it makes it more challenging to cover, but no less important. were a we all wish they million more people -- >> one of the challenges, cabinet secretaries -- some of the stuff gets covered but doesn't get the air time or attention to breathe and get results. oftentimes the way change happens is because public accountability and the media shining a spotlight on something. for instance, if you take any cabinet secretary -- taxpayer-funded trip with his wife to europe where they went to wimbledon and he is charged with carrying for the nation's veterans, arguably one of the most important things and something trumpcare's about. a wonderful story that got little attention because of the absurd details -- the insurrection that his agency, he

has an arm guard standing outside of his office. --any other administration the process will be the article runs, the ig comes out, and people are clamoring -- believe it or not people are not doing things because it is the right thing to do. clamoring for change and administration realizes they have to pay a penalty if they don't switch this up. people in washington are saying they were stunned and relieved that they were not getting a ton of questions on shulkin because it happened during the rob porter then, and there's mastic abuse, and stormy daniels, and it doesn't quite stick. my impression is congress is not doing a whole lot. it is either in opposition of the president or holding him accountable that normally, give-and-take what go on with white house and the congress, progress may not be holding up on its and.

is that the right impression? my colleague, major garrett says that is daily struggle at the white house is to separate the interesting from the important. i think we are starting to figure out how to do that at the white house. the first few weeks of covering the trump white house -- we were blasting every tweet onto the air without knowing what is happening. even building new software to make sure that the tweets are on tv faster. it is crazy. we are starting to stabilize a little bit in the white house, and we realized that there is this eunice and inexperience and to some deliberate plot destabilize the entire country. on the congress front, i was --king to our correspondent and she was talking about how frustrating it is covering congress right now because

republican leadership is so hamstrung by the president, at least in more public forums. it comes back to the tweeting. way, it is easy to say i did not see the tweet, but there are presidential statements and every third one has a policy implication and your hearing that from the speaker of the house. that is a big challenge. as a think in terms of the rest of washington, one of the most interesting places is the judiciary. i'm of the people who cover the supreme court for us feel like it is your typical republican white house. the appointments are solid conservatives. the federal society is successfully informed of the decisions there. there is a little bit of nearness with the tweeting, especially taking on the courts which cause lower court to take

a look at things more closely than they might have in terms of executive actions. but to the point, things are happening quietly. that judiciary has chosen in record numbers. they are dwarfing what obama was able to do in terms of judicial appointments and that is the kind of thing -- political has this column, five things you missed while trump was doing god knows what. policy thinks we are missing or not paying a ton of attention to. -- at the endss of the day i tried to read all 750,000 emails i have gotten. and some days there is so much craziness in the white house -- it is buried that congress has mandatory sexual-harassment training. especially in light of

weinstein, it could be the lead story any day. i think congress -- it is a hard time, especially with the renewed gun debate saying they done.tting a ton >> i am reminded we are running overtime. one more question and we are finished. i was looking for a woman's question. we have a lot of men. [laughter] right there. am a, stacy myers, i contrite alumni. speaking about the gun debate -- when you guys do cover him and he says something that seems to be a major policy statement. he said that opposite with the nra -- >> the age limit? >> he has this past president of

contradicting himself a rolling it back or do you have to wait until he basically says the opposite 24 hours or less later? i think the north korea meeting is a good example of this. there is the cap. this is not criticizing my bosses. he is going to meet with kim jong-un, where's it going to happen, maybe in geneva or something like that. and maybe there is a 10% chance so, happens, probably -- the point about running for reelection again, you have to cover it in the moment as it happens with the appropriate context and look at the implications. out of the gimmicks he say i am not going to pay attention and is what the changes might tomorrow.

i think it informs patterns of behavior and legislative tendencies. you may be able to infer from some of his actions. >> especially some of the policy stuff is on immigration and guns, he says one thing and then goes back to the other side. is the balance of what the president said which is inherently newsworthy and putting it in a relative -- relevant context. especially when this is a weird thing to adjust to. less policy, but people. was going to become the next secretary of state -- and president trump feels like he is the only person -- if the news leaks out who he is going to choose and it leaks out. he might change his mind because he is angry it leaked or because he watches a lot of news coverage of pompeii and it turns out he is not as great of a pick as the president..

and use that affected their decisions -- i am sure obama or bush or whoever is appointed leaked out, they would be frustrated when choose a different cabinet secretary. you notice a lot of the stories are irrelevant caveats, and the president said he is going to pick so and so, but nothing is a done deal until he announces his decision. >> and his staff want stop trying until the words have come out of his mouth and have been printed inlood, -- blood, on paper. [laughter] >> it is time to stop. [applause] all, you are all a great audience and a fantastically great panel. [applause] i want to introduce michael, the individual responsible for this building and the vision and

trajectory of arizona state university. >> i am not responsible for the building. i am part of a team responsible for the reconstruction of the old adage that a public university should serve the public. and quick commercial about asu, and our dean, in fantastic job of making things happen. we are excited about our news bureau here. we built a 15 years, public university designed to be built around the idea of inclusion and the success of our students is the measure of our success, not how many students we could not admit. we maintained the admission standards of the old universities of the 1950's. do well in high school and you will find a way to make your way through university, and to do that at skill has been exciting for us. also help a student by that is representative of the totality of the socioeconomic diversity

of our nation. we have students from over 200 native american tribes at asu. that is one example of that diversity within the institution itself. we also want to be committed to the notion of taking responsible to for the outcome of the community that we serve. bad in terms of outcomes and opioid academic is running rampant through our society and this is happening -- the life expectancy of americans is down it again on average -- two years in a row. those are our responsibilities, so it is a different mindset. our journals and school and engineering school -- everything was about and every unit we don't is completely different purpose than traditional model for universities. this center is not here to advocate for anything. the center is here to recognize

the two women we named the center for, barbara barrett and justice o'connor, it is here to engage with ideas and move past the notion of arguing. arguing is getting us nowhere, it is of little merit in its present form. -we and that's those ideas to some kind of conclusion and move forward? that is what we try to do with the reconstruction of the university. thank you. [applause] >> the reception starting a millie in the lobby of the building and if anybody is interesting taking a tour of the building, that is a building guide on the table and we have got stations on every floor so you can wander around. thank you again for coming. enjoy the rest of your evening. [applause]

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>> tonight on c-span's landmark cases come will explore the 1886 case of hopkins were a san francisco ordinance discriminated against the chinese undramatic owner. and by stanley matthews found in favor of the laundromat owner and established the protection of the 14th amendment applies to immigrants as well as citizens.

examined this case the high court's ruling the professor of asian american studies at columbia university and author lucky ones". and founder and president of the heartland institute. watch and marquesas live tonight at nine eastern on c-span, she spent a hour, or listen with the c-span radio app. while you watch from a order your copy of the landmark cases companion book. is available for eight dollars of the five cents m and for additional resource, there's a link on our website for the national constitution center's interactive constitution. earlier today, arizona state university hosted another discussion, this one with national security and military experts on the future of warfe.