that we are proud of having those ratings. of honor.t is a badge i hope i will get a lot of my colleagues to wear them as well. i think i will. it is very exasperating. however, that these young people are going to make a difference because not only are they passionate and brilliant and articulate, but they are also not partisan. they have succeeded in taking this debate out of the partisan environment and that will ultimately make a big difference. >> washington journal continues. host: joining us now is gary schmitt. geary is a former executive officer of foreign intelligence advisory board. he is codirector of the center for security studies at the american enterprise institute. he is here to talk about the recent changes in president trump's national security team.

more shakeup news. thank you for joining us today. before we get to that, we read a headline a little bit ago that talks about the russian apparent cyber attack or attempt to attack the american energy grid. how significant is that? that russia is targeting now critical infrastructure within the united states? >> it is critically important. anything innk that this country runs on the grid from the telephones and to all of the electronics that we use and the like -- our grid has been exposed for a number of years. i remember talking to a cyber security firm a couple of years ago and they were telling me about some of the efforts they were tracking from both the russians and the chinese trying to get into the grid. this has been a problem for a

number of years and it is good to see it has become more of a public issue. host: you agree with the experts that so far it is not time to --ic but it it is something but it is something that the united states should be keeping an eye on. >> i do think we should panic. the truth is, when you talk about cyber security, it always offensive ever. i think some news about this might generate more energy to beef up our defensive posture. host: and now i want to move to the personnel issues surrounding national security. the washington post is reporting that national security adviser h.r. mcmaster is all that out. it says president trump had decided to remove h.r. mcmaster as his national security advisor and is actively discussing his replacement. comfortable is now

with acting without mcmaster but is willing to take time executing the move because he thes to injure that both three-star army general is not humiliated and that there is a strong successor lined up. what was that move mean in terms of national security? >> i think it is damaging, frankly because i think when you have a situation where you want somebody with expertise, somebody who has been there and tos constant turnover leads instability. at least instability both inside the government because you have a new person that has to direct security policies but also internationally, people begin to wonder if you are really speaking for the president because there is so much turnover. they are never quite certain how long person x might be in the position. instability is quite damaging to the agenda of the president. host: you're talking about

timing. on the heels of the firing of rex tillerson. from ajust weeks away potential meeting between president trump and the leader of north korea. let us talk a little more about that timing. the one reason that mr. tillerson has been let go was because the president was uncomfortable with the secretary of state who wanted to move into that office someone he had better relationships with. pompeo knewat mr. he was getting the job a few months ago and has been .reparing for the switch sadly, i think it was handled poorly. i think mr. tillerson finally being told that he was gone by a tweet was not the appropriate way to do that. host: in terms of the report -- not wanting to humiliate general mcmaster.

it seems like this drawn out process might be affecting the exact opposite result. >> i think so. you never want to embarrass people. mr. tillerson is a decent man. probably not the right man for the job for a variety of reasons but humiliating someone actually not only humiliates the person but it can send a signal to the rest of the government about the instability in the white house. host: we are joined by gary schmitt, the codirector of the atter for security studies the american enterprise institute as well as the former executive director of the white house for an intelligence advisory board. we are talking about the national security team. and the shakeup within. democrats can call 202- 748-8000. you talked a little bit about

whether or not rex tillerson was right for the job as secretary of state in the first place. he had the backing of former republican officials such as former secretary of state condoleezza rice, former -- formerly head of exxon. why was he not a great fit at the top of foggy bottom? >> first of all, he had never been in d.c. being inside the beltway experience does matter. i do not think he had a particularly strong foreign policy vision. that, he you add to did not really have a personal relationship with this president and given this president's personality, i think it was inevitable there would be these tensions and difficulties. everyone speaks of mr. tillerson as a decent human being but he was probably a fish out of water. host: let us take a look of a tillerson'stary

farewell address after news of his firing broke and what he said about russia. mr. tillerson: much work remains to address the troubling actions of the russian government. .ussia must assess carefully continuing on their current trajectory is likely to lead to greater isolation on their part. a situation which is not in anyone's interest. colleagues in the state department and inter-agencies, much remains to be done with our mission with allies and with partners. i close by thanking all for the privilege of serving beside you for the last 14 months. importantly, to the 300 plus million americans, thank you or your devotion to a free and open society.

to ask of kindness towards one another. to honesty. worko the quiet and hard that you do every day to support this government with your tax dollars. one to leave know this place a better place for the next generation. i will now return to private life. as a private citizen. as a proud american. proud of the opportunity i have had to serve my country. god bless all of you and god bless the american people. god bless america. host: his decision to focus on russia as part of that farewell address -- russia, and area that he and the president did not always agree. what do you think about what he said about russia? was it a message to the white house? definitely. there was always a tension in a lot of policy areas but particularly the tension with the congress and the national security bureaucracy including

the state department believed that russia was a threat that had to be dealt with more strongly. and the white house was not on the same page. that, theg said national security strategy that they released in late december, in other words the white house strategy does speak about russia as a competitor. what of course, you can say that you still have to do things to match your rhetoric with the deeds. our: virginia is calling on democratic line from washington. good morning. caller: good morning. i have just one thing to say. you know, i feel as though russia put president trump in office. president trump, mr. trump, it did not want nobody that does not like him, love him, and agree with him.

america was strong. i feel as though he has got to go. and got to go in a hurry. if not, i would like to know how much do the united states of america owe russia since he has been in there. host: i want to jump on two of those points. russian meddling in the election and the idea that the president seems to be coalescing around people that do not disagree with him that much. obviously, against people that have challenged him. >> on the first point, with the electoral interference, it is absolutely essential that we prevent that from happening to the degree that we care. we are and open society so the doors are always crack open a little bit. open aalways cracked little bit but on the other hand, we have to deter that by taking strong actions.

with that respect, so far, the white house has been lacking in that regard. i think i disagree slightly about people agreeing with him. when he was a member of congress and also as the director of cia, made clear that he thinks russia is a real problem. in that respect, if there is a disagreement between the president and mr. pompeo, it is a little bit over russia. host: and pompeo, who has been selected by the president to gove as head of the cia and to the head of the state department. talk about his reputation. is he someone that world leaders are likely to put their trust in, maybe more than rex tillerson? the centralhat is point. he does have a good relationship with the president. they did know each other before the election. daily basis, key has

been briefing him as director of the cia. that does matter when speaking to foreign officials because they will have more of a sense that when mr. pompeo is saying ask, it is something that the issident -- is saying x, it probably something that the president agrees with. lawrence is on the independent line from syracuse, new york. good morning. caller: could you talk more on the grid. i am concerned. could you talk about what happened if people were to hack into it? i have heard people have the capability to attack a nuclear it could have a malfunction and could explode. could you talk more about that? >> i am not an expert on how the grid works but i do know there have been dangerous, for example

with nuclear power plants, if your safety mechanisms are disabled, the chances of an accident which would be a serious problem, when you're talking about that kind of power tont, are issues that need be addressed. in some respects, it is always difficult to protect your cyber systems. one of the things i think people look at is getting redundancy into the systems so that if there is an attack you have backup systems that will allow you to put things act in order in a very quick fashion. it is a question of defense and also a question of resiliency. host: johnny is on our republican line from woolford, virginia. he is clearly our first read party president. what i mean by that is russian backed.

i make no bones about that. are going to have to go back to morse code because of the way these guys are getting things done. our checks and balances are not coming into play and i am disappointed about that. ourt our legislator and judicial branch. in place to are check this guy and they will not do it. he is definitely a read party president. host: i would like to give gary a chance to respond to the issue particularly about government oversight and checks and balances. >> one thing -- one lesson we can take away from the current situation is that if this is a parliamentary system and mr. trump was the prime minister, there would be a lot less checks and balances. to the degree that republicans control both houses of congress

and the white house, congress still has investigations going on, the courts have often said no to the president when he has put forward executive orders. you know, it may not be the healthiest of situations but it does suggest that our separation of powers is working better than many people really expected. gary we are joined by schmitt of the american enterprise institute. he is also former director of the project for the new american century and and adjunct professor for the school of advanced international lesions at john hopkins university. he is here discussing some recent moves within the presidential administration as part of his national security team. if you are a democrat, you can 02-748-9000.

now, let us talk about the president's pick to lead the cia. gino. she has been described as a tough, direct person from her time at the cia but there has also been some controversy over this nomination according to the washington post. just over a year after the september 11 attack, the cia dispatched the better and clandestine officer to oversee a secret prison in thailand shortly after agencies -- agency contractors in a frantic hunt waterboarded an al qaeda suspect many times. she began her deep involvement in the agency's counterterrorism

efforts. and showed her willingness to be interrogation system. is she going to have a tough time with confirmation? what are your thoughts about her nomination overall? >> she is going to have a tough time. and it is probably a useful exercise that we had this debate about interrogation again. i do not think that can be avoided. she will also have a tough time as a political matter because the republicans that might senators,r, only 51 they have a one senator margin as a majority in the senate. and rand paul has already come out against her nomination. >> and senator mccain, although ill, will probably also good against her because of issues

related to waterboarding. that brings you down to 49. she has a reputation for having 30 years of exemplary service as a clandestine officer. thedo not get to hold position she has had unless people think you are doing a good job. on the other hand, she will have to defend what her role was during that. of. period. host: is it a defense that she was carrying out the orders from the top and at that time, those interrogation techniques were not banned. will that carry any weight? >> politically, not as much as one would hope because i think it does matter if you are not living in a rogue way but are carrying out responsibilities. and i think most honest people would say that the issue is a complex one and so it is not so clear that what she was doing was illegal at the time.

it may have been unethical. but that is a debate that we are going to have to have. host: when is calling from -- gwen is calling from columbus, georgia. caller: hello, kimberly. schmidt, i assume that you have multiple degrees behind your name. i challenge you to read the definition and characteristics of a sociopath. all of what you're talking about and everyone else is talking about on how this happened. regarding rex tillerson and his firing and others. the chaos going on on a daily basis. this is all based on a president being a sociopath. anyone dealing with a person like this will be instantly turned to church.

this country, the fbi department, all of it will fall. i keep saying this over and over. you cannot deal with a sociopath. everyone seems to be ignoring this. host: i would like to give gary schmitt a chance to respond. >> i do have a lot of letters behind my name but none of which are medical. psychologists and psychiatrists and one of the things they will say is that you actually have to have a patient before you are able to comment on the mental health of someone. but, let me go to a larger issue which is we have a presidential system and so it is extremely important that when we think about voting for president's that we think about -- about voting for presidents that we think about voting for their character. cabinet officers are elected so they have a personal standing within the cabinet even with the

prime minister. in our system, the executive power resides with one person on theit is incumbent american population to understand that when they vote, they're making a major decision about someone holding a massive amount of power in a single person's hands. gina.another point about her supporters made a correction about her record. they had previously recorded that she was overseeing this thailandr dark site in during the waterboarding of an al qaeda officer. and that took place before she arrived but she did still oversee this facility and participated in the destruction of a recording. will that play a role in her confirmation hearing? >> people are going to ask her

whether she thought it was legitimate to do so regardless. even though she was not the officer in charge at the time, she will still have to defend her role subsequently and whether she agrees with that policy. vincent is on the line from tulsa, oklahoma on our republican line. good morning. gary, who did you work for? and i workedtown for senator moynihan, a democratic senator from new york. when he was vice chairman of the intelligence committee, i was the democratic staff to rector. and then i worked for president ronald reagan during his second term in office in the white house. host: john is calling from hot springs, arkansas on our independent line. caller: hello, kimberly.

mr. schmidt, i would like to ask your opinion on something. guy, when the chinese president was having dinner with mr. trump down at mar-a-lago, trump told him -- i just launched cruise missiles into syria. but he did not tell the president of china that he had called russia that he was launching missiles. knowing that russia supplied the chemicals that the people there were bombed with, why would he call russia? >> i think -- two thinks. we also want to exhibit just how powerful we were so we put fighter jetsth over syria and we wanted to show the russians that they could not actually deal with that plane,

that they could not see. an example of american power and strength. also, i think the white house is very determined to punish the government that engaged in the chemical warfare which was the syrian government of assad. i am not surprised they told the russians beforehand because again, this was a very strategic strike against a go -- against the government for its behavior. host: i would like to talk about the morale within the state department. after the departure of secretary of state rex tillerson and leading up to that. we have also seen a lot of foreign service folks leave. what is the morale within the state department both abroad and at foggy bottom? >> honestly, not particularly good. the senior jobs at the state department have not been filled. mr. tillerson had a specific idea of how he wanted to run the

department. any government department can be managed better. way to get abest reorganization done is first to get the trust of the employees so that when you do make a decision about reorganization they have a sense that you have a better understanding of what their tasks are and what the job is. unsuccessful to put it mildly. and i think one of the things about mr. pompeo is you have not had the same sort of complaining from agency personnel about his administration there. so, i think that suggests he has a better understanding of how washington bureaucracy works and how you have to build up the trust of the people you are working with before you make changes. host: stephanie is on the democratic line from highland,

california. good morning. caller: good morning. i just want to say that it is a very scary time what is going on right here. civileople that work in service are very dedicated, especially having worked over 20 years myself. i worked for the government. and we are very devoted employees. and i think it is just a shame that they would fire mccain -- days before he is set to retire. i think it is political. it has been said that all of the government employees at every agency, or agencies are under attack. we are americans first. we may have our own independent view, but we are americans and we need to stick together. it is very scary.

i do not think america can last four years under trump. this is not a reality tv show. i want to give gary schmitt a chance to respond. >> mccabe spent 30 years serving the country and it is tough to fire him and possibly put his pension at risk at this moment. on the other hand, it was not the administration that suggested he be fired. it was the internal workings of the justice department, the professionals that came to the conclusion that she had essentially lied to investigators. the administration may be pleased that he is gone or is fired but on the other hand, the original judgment to do so was not in fact there is. -- was not in fact theirs. host: your colleague at aei,

wrote a piece regarding mike pompeo and his ability to turn the department around. appoint people. policy -- she said the state department has been mia in this administration insofar as tillerson has worked to derail the national security council and trust. do you agree that those are the areas that pompeo has to focus on? boss, i thinks my i agree wholeheartedly with her. no, look -- going back to mr. tillerson, he had a specific thought about how he wanted to manage the place and it did entail a small group around him. there was less interest in getting personnel in place. and i think that is really wrong. the point of the state

department is the department heads, the bureau heads, the assistant secretaries. when those people -- when those jobs are not filled or when they are left with the uncertainty, the result is you will have a less effective state department. is on our republican line from swartz creek, michigan. caller: i just wanted to make a statement. i wonder how you can get this job when you are so anti-truck. -- anti-trump. host: emily is calling from san francisco on our republican line. good morning. caller: good morning, i love you in green. happy st. patrick's. this is a democrat we are speaking to but i hope you can

honestly answer this. coupconcerned about a in our government. a silent cuoup. and democrats unwilling to accept president trump because they had a plan of globalism along with hillary clinton. and mccabe was the one who oversaw the trials on her stealing money for the foundation. there are so many dangerous things that we have to protect ourselves from. host: we are almost out of time. i want to give gary a chance to respond. >> i am much more confident about our system of government and confident about the character of the people, even those surrounding the president. .r. pompeo is a veteran h.r. mcmaster is a distinguished general, loyal.

general kelly, chief of staff, is a remarkable american veteran -- american military veteran. i am pretty confident that our system, despite these troubled times, will hold. host: gary schmitt, codirector of the -- and former codirector of the white house national security advisory board. you can see his work at aei.org. coming up, dan hawkins will be here. -- hel be talking about is with the national association of community health centers and he will be talking about their role in u.s. health care. we will continue our spotlight on a magazine series. with author matt forge. stay tuned.

>> this weekend on the c-span networks. saturday at 9:00 eastern, american tv history on c-span3, a daylong coverage of -- for theater. with anna holloway, co-author of our little monitor, the greatest invention of the civil war. william harris, author of lincoln and congress. michael burlingame, abraham lincoln, a life. stanley harrell, lincoln and the abolitionist's. and the author of's debt and, lincoln's war secretary. sunday at 1:00 p.m., book tv on c-span2 is live from the new ineum of the bible washington, d.c. discussing the bible's influence on literature and its impact him government, legal systems, education, and

human rights with the museum's director her. we will also take your calls during the program. watch this weekend on the c-span networks. q&a, aay, on c-span's college professor, tom cronin talks about his book -- imagine a great republic. of majork a reading american political classic is very empowering in terms of this country stands for something very special. and the great writers like stowe that we want to be someone special. not just a city on a hill but a city that loves one another and is willing to work with one another and understand that politics is i