will talk about the results of tuesday'smaries azona republicanongresan paul gosar discusses divisio innep conference on immigration policy. then democratic congressman from rhode island, david cicilline, talks about democratic messaging heading into the 2018 midterm elections. be sure to watch c-span's "washington journal" live at 7:00 a.m. eastern wednesday morning. join the discussion. sa is an author filmmaker and most recently in the news for receiving a pardon from president trump, joining us from houston, texas. good morning. guest: good morning. host: could you remi viewe of t situation that caused you to get the pardon in the first place? guest: yes. my college friend wendy long was running for the u.s. senate in new york in 2012. we've been friends for 25 years. i gave her $10,000, the

campaign-finance limits. i wanted to do more for her campaign. i convinced two of my friends to donate $10,000 aece. reimbursed them. i exceeded the campaign-finance limit by $20,000. host: how would someone else have been fined or punished for doing that and how did you end up going to a facility for that? case, i was aical first-time offender. the main point, my motive was not corrupt. the candidate did not even know that i did this. in cases like that were no corruption is involved in my -- mixed guided affection for a friend. those cases are handled with community service and a fine. in my case, that was not so.

host: was that because of the things you had saidhat the obama administration? guest: i think it did. my reason is twofold. my first released documentary film subtitled obama's america. i know the president was mad about it. a few weeks latee fbi me . my door no case in american history where someone has been prosecuted. host: that is the argument that yoyer made inhis case.

selective prosecution, that is your contention. guest: i now know a little more about the case. the congressional oversight committee has a copy of my fbi file. the fbi when they found out about me assd $100,000 at the outset to investigate this case. .hat is strange there is no reason to highlight my conservative politics. int: the judge in this case his judgment saying there was no evidence of discriminatory effect or purpose. what do you make of that reaction?

guest: we are talking about a clinton appointee judge. we told him the only way to show -- to look inside the fb files and in the government files, normally obtainable, the judge flatly refuse to let us see the .saying there is no select a prosecution but he would not let us find out if there really was. us forr. desousa is with the next half hour. (202) 748-8001 four republicans -- for republicans. (202) 748-8000 for democrats. (202) 748-8002or indendent you are on with dinesh desousa, go ahead. caller: accepting a pardon is an

admission of guilt. stuffs little alibis and he's ginghem away by accepting thar guest: first of all i think that is logically idiotic. if someone is wrongly convicted pressured oror is bludgeoned into making a plea deal and then you are pardoned like something the part you are doing no more than clearing your record and rectifying the original injustice so the notion that just because you accepted a pardon automatically means you are guilty is reasoning for stupid people. host: you eventually pleaded guilty to this. guest: you have to realize the process that leads to this. what the government does is they try to threaten you with all kinds of preposterous and redundant charges. we will get you for mail fraud. you put the check in the mail. thanks rod. -- bank fraud. we are going to get you for

filing a false document. i didn't file any documents. but the guys who sent the money in the filed - they say we are going to send you to prison for years and years, it will destroy your reputation and your life unless you plead to this thing in which case we will drop the rest of it. this kind of bludgeoning tactic pressures the innocent into pleading guilty. callnt to ask a question. are you an immigrant? guest: i came to america at the age of 17. caller: that's interesting. thed a question about intersection of propaganda and information especially when it comes to media. the citizen united thing came from a movie right? kind of what you went through came from a movie. interesting what you thought rightin wtever

you want to call it, taking up something left us a lot, medi. i will sit and listen. guest: i think there's a greater realization not just of the importance of popular culture, but the real emotional power of throughto reach people their heads and hearts. for years i was a writer and speaker. i don't think the obama administration would have regarded me as important enough 2012 ased a movie in 2000 theaters, the second-highest grossing political documentary ever made. will say what makes you think he cares about your movie. the reason i thinkhat is because shortly after the movie came out attacks on it began to appear on a website called barack obama.com. that's how i know the narcissist was upset about my movie.

host: what kinds of things did you say about him particularly? -- do you think that caused what he think the white house reacted because of that? guest: here's a sample from that movie. obama had been traipsing around the country chanting the phrase we are our brother's keeper. his argument for economic redistribution and obamacare. i went to kenya and i found obama's actual brother living in a sort of third world slum in the muck of nairobi. i asked him, what has obama done for you and the guy says nothing. this guy has not lifted a finger to help me. this kind of thing in a movie when i'm talking to obama's actual brother transcends the debate about obamacare. showing the president of the united states to be a hypocrite and i think obama did not like that. he's a patty guy and he apos to go aftc

me. caller: good morning. i want to ask a question that i want to make a comment. ofe you not founduilty campaign-finance violations? guest: i was. caller: ok. you think the mayor can people are stupid and idiotic. as a black woman you are -- i am offended that you would go after the first black president to demean and malign him and what you said about michelle obama, as a black woman, you are right. we are very upset. talking about narcissism, what about this narcissistic person in the white house now? that's not narcissism?

the only reason you're on c-span . offended that you have this person when we have --in-amer iladelphia eagles. why don't you have some of the eagles on this morning? think as a black person i would think you wldealize just because someone has been convicted of a crime does not necessarily mean they are guilty or that they've received equitable and fair treatment. is criminal justice system far from equitable not just in a racial sense but in a political sense. to give an example, rosie o'donnell, the comedian, admitted she had violated campaign-finance law fmesin fiv. in theory, five u.s. attorneys could file charges against her today but there is no talk of her beingharg because there is no corruption involved in her

case. rosie goes if i gave too much money give me the ney b i would have liked to have gotten that treatment. host: from florida, independent line. caller: i'm glad to speak to youcalle .e re-watched your movie previously mentioned in one of the other calls. we watched it from beginning to end and i want to thank you for making that movie. my question to you is going to be when you spoke to his brother and when you went to the grave ,ite of the former president off camera you impart any information on how their society, their culture also felt about him. when eric holder put you in a cell how did you feel about that day? kenya aten i was in the obama family homestead i got

a window into obama. think of ob tst africaam president, civil rights guy. thiwe of him in nnection to the civil rights movement. obama's ideology is anticolonial. obama wrote ak,res father. wte of what i n his father d his father was this african socialist who hated the west, hated america and wanted to have global redistribution of wealth away from the industrialized countries and to third world countries. thesis that this is obama, was president trying to achieve. , i was locked up overnight for eight months in a confinement center

and turning to the matter at hand this case, he goes, i got to tell you man-to-man, you g

screwed. yes, you committed a technical violation, you should ha gotten a fine. but those guys, meaning the obama guys, went after you with everything they got. it's a terrible injustice and he goes, in fact, i have the power to correct it. so i'm going to be giving you a full pardon in the morning. i want to give you your life back. i want to clear your record. and then he closed by saying, i want you to go out there and be the great voice of frm have been, only with a more magnified reach. host: a bigger voice than ever. what does that mean to you now? guest: is ironic because the reason i'm getting a bigger voice than ever is because the left isinout big-time over my pardon. they're making a bigger, a more resounding yell over i and all the other pardons put together. and as a result, it tells me that they think that i'm -- unleashed i'm somehow dangerous to their ideology. so i'm going to go out and keep doing what i'm doing. not just with the books, i have

a big book and a new movie aust. i resisted talking about it because i don't want to use my pardon as an occasion to promote my book. but i'm very excited to say i'm in the final stages of editing a movie. this will be mfourth documentary film out this year. host: general theme of the book and glove is? guest: the book and movie are called death of a nation and the two themes that i am going to deal with are racism/white supremacy, and the other is fascism. these are the two most incendiary labels in american politics. they have both been dropped, not just on president trump, but on the right. this notion that the right is fascist. fascism is rig wing enomenon. or that racism and white supremacy are staples of the republican party. these are two themes that are investigated in the book and movie. host: from our republican line from north carolina. karen, good morning, you're on. caller: yeah, hi. i'd like say to that i'm very happy that president trump

pardonned y. and i'm one of the democrats that voted for barack obama twice. and then crossed over to vote republican for the first time in my life. . i wish you would do something about angela merkel. it was not v and ila wish you would do something about angela merkel. it was angela merkel who, when she was up for a nobel peace prize, made those statements. if you can get here, we'll take you in to the syrian refugees. l .eace prize she never even got 'know if germanis ever g ce back from what she has done. host: thanks, karen. thank you. guest: i will say that europe is theng a serious problem best ans take them at game against that seem largely digest -- largely indigestible.

german?rkey become a can a pakistani becoming lisman? -- become an englishman? america has been a better solvent for assimilation than europe. we have done better with immigrants here than over there. people tend to attack president trump for being a rand this is based on the fact that trump is supposedly against immigrants. trump has always drawn the line and illegallegal immigrants. it's important to realize most legal immigrants who come to america are nonwhite. and come from asia, africa president trump has never said he wants merely white immigrants from iceland or new zealand and fewer immigrants from barbados or bombay. he just does not want illegal immigrants to break the law and come here in the wrong way. joe, goodington, d.c.

morning. caller: good morning. , hented to ask mr. desousa is a film writer and all. supporting you base, that is ok. you are equipped to attack obama. now you are being supported by the president and administration. it works like that. at nht when yo downyou lot yourself and think you are not so secure after all. none of us are. i think that sometimes we get so partial that we can do more damage than good. you may do some things that tablesxpose and turn the . at the end of the day, see who you are.

youare still mr. dinesh and may be in that culture and that environment that supports you and makes you feel good and successful. that's all well and good. host: thank you, joe. guest: i would like to try to say were my politics comes fm. when you talk about things like my base, i don't run for office. i don't have a base. i'm a nonwhite immigrant who came to america with $500 in my pocket. i've seen the american dream as a reality in my life. ofelieve in matters opportunity that enable people who start out at the bottom to be able to climb up the ladder and make a better life for themselves. when i look at the two parties it seems to me one of them is offering me a ladder and the other is offering a rope. you got democrats on the top of the building. you don't have to try but we will lower a rope toou, you grab onto it and we will pull

you up. i say to myself you are going to pull me up but then i am dependent on you. what if you let go of the rope? i would rather see a ladder propped up against a wall and climb up on my own and have a earned achievement instead of someone else giving it to me. this is the reason i leaned to the republicidticay to protect host: letters of opportunity. you heard from the president once. have you heard from him since he received your pardon or anyone from the white house? guest: no. the kind of call that was tainabout something that was a done deal. essentially trump said i will be announcing this by tweet tomorrow morning and he did. since then i have been out talking about it. my prosecutor preet bharara has been on cnn. the nash voluntarily pleaded guilty. what he does not say is all of the strong-arm tactics the

government uses to get you to do that. they basically bludgeon you into it and put on a pompous road and go he voluntarily didt. i'm glad we are having this debate. political justice is a terrible thing. we want lady justice to be blind and not selecti. host: you did respond in a blunt way. you say? guest: twitter is a rough medium. we tend to fire back and forth sometimes in the heat of the . i did what i call my karma is a bitch tweet. you thought you could advance your career by being a little water carrier for obama in getting me but now you got fired and i got part -- pardoned. host: jessica in virginia. caller: i have two quick

questions. the first is, you have claimed that in your act of committing election fraud that there was no coupt intent. you used donors which would be indicative of premeditation and from premeditation would conclude there's corrupt intent. how would you go about explaining that? if you generally believe you were coerced into pleading guilty, what have you done, if anything to advocate criminal justice reform? guest: your first question had to do with corrupt intent. you're right. i had intent. i used straw donors. i was trying to get around the campaign finance limits you have admitted to that from the beginning. i never denied it. i was on megyn kelly's show before my trial talking about it.

wasn't corrupt intent? what corrupt intent means is that you are trying to get something out of it. there are lots of cases which the government has prosecuted were someone says i will get this money for you and then i want to be appointed judge or i will get this money for you but i want my business to get a tax break. this is what the law calls quid pro quo. the essential definition of corruption. when there is no corrupt intent and a first-time offense as in my case and when the amount involved is quite small, $20,000, there is no case in the history of the united states where somebody was indicted, prosecuted, locked up for eight months, sentence to psychiatric counseling, given probation for five years for this kind of an offense. it is unheard of so it suggests that these guys were trying to, in some ways, carry out a vendetta for whai had id about president obama.

criminal justice reform is badly needed. said i wasasically not a very self reflective man and he was going to help me by dering undergo mandatory psychiatric counseling. think of my fence. i did not commit a perverted deal. i gave moneyo my own 25 year -- a friend of 25 years running for senate. my motives were obvious. one writer characterized as misguided loyalty to a friend. the judge thought i had to go to a shrink for this. i characterize this as a reeducation program. click i was trying to get me to kowtow to obama. if i have started making regular appearances on msnbc he would have pronounced me cured.

host: let's hear from andrea in michigan. republican line. caller: i'o ve that president trump pardoned you. i've seen your movies. i'm an african-american feme and allhese people calling in ,ou really got imprisonment because of what you did against obama. people so much in denial especially my own race. they will call in and probably be comforted. but i want you to there's a large majority of us black people -- and i had a black woman, educated black woman with two masters degrees and i want to let you know i'm very proud of the films you put out. even the host when he asked you what does obama have to be mad at, go look at the movie.

the truth about a whole bunch of stuff. host: mr. desousahost:? guest: a lot of my recent work -- if i had singled out obama, attacking obama would be one thing. , even moreent movie critical of hillary that i had been up obama. the subtitle of that movie is the secret history of the democratic party. in that movie i show that many of these things blamed on the right and america were perpetrated by the democrats. democratic party is the party of slavery and segregation and jim crow and the ku klux klan in opposition to the civil rights written -- host: bristow, virginia, democrats line. ali. caller: good morning.

do you believe that president raised byn american an american family and is culturally american that does not have any cultural background as a kenyan? yet, you went to kenya and interviewed his brother. together --t i am african. i know what our people do, they dependable. i am not sure of your background, but i am sure you are familiar what i am talking about. don't you think of that is not right to go and interview someone in kenya for someone who was born here as an american -- can you answer that for me? guest: certainly. do i think that obama is an american? yes.

he had a white mom and a kenyan dad. his dad was never an immigrant, he was a foreign student to came to america, studied, and went back to kenya. who influenced him more? the mom or the dad. the answer, his dad. father." "dreams of my describesk, obama taking a trip to europe and to kenya to learn more about his mother and father's heritage. history trip to kenya as described in over 100 paget -- his trip to kenya with described in over 100 pages. he talked about weeping at his father's grave and the moment of a pip anywhere his father's -- and a moment of you t --

and a moment of epiphany. people say, where are you getting it all from and i am getting it from obama himself. host: gary, miami, florida. caller: thanks. theyou cover in the movie fact that obama says he attended reverend wright's church for more than 20 years and he did not know what reverend wright was saying even though reverend married him and his wife, blasted psalm, baptizes children, and the fact that reverend wright prior to that had been a black muslim and often accompanied farrakhan to --ya to visit said off

to visit sadaffi? and can you comment on this picture that just surfaced of obama? the matteressence of ishat obama moved in very radical circles in chicago. he was close to the former domest terrorist, he was in church, height's knew what those men represented and what they believed, but there is a powerful desire not just by obama, but by the media to camouflage his background. to present him as a very mainstream guy. all of this was swept under the rug. a lot about obama to this day is not known. he has never released his college transcripts. very odd that there are aspects of his life that remain for people like me who have studied him, remain sort of like

you would say a blackhol because of the extraordinary degree of media protection of obama. i would sit down with reporters who i had known and they would you got shafted, i am sorry this is happening to you. thelday, you' o left, it would be important if you wrote something in the new york times, and they would say, no, i could not do that. they were all protecting obama. w simperative to them that the first black president succeed that it did not matter what he did or what he believed. and this isre call from oklahoma, independent line. >> yes, good morning. good morning. i would really love to know your origin of your country that you come from for i am a proud

african-american and i never de ny my heritage. i have never seen her movies, but sometimes you sound very arrogant, sir. what makes you so arrogant? host: we will leave it there. i can i do not know if answer that, i am not arrogant. i am sometimes combative because i am in a combative situation and i tried to give as much as i get. i am very proud to say i was born in india. middle class parents and i went to school in bombay. came as a first-generation immigrant at the age of 17. america has been the land of opportunity for me but i have also seen the american nightmare and imagine hearing the immigrant hearing the united

states of america versus dinesh imagine having them go through your tax records, your everything, so i've seen the upside and downside of america. having grown up in oul and familiar with another, i think there are a lot of wonderful and unique things about america. what makes my work controversial is that i am old enough to say so. host: >> the house is back in about 15 minutes for a few votes. members debating seven bills from the natural resources committee. already the chamber approved a bill by voice vote making route a historic trail. roll call votes at 6:30, live coverage here on c-span. education sec retake -- -- secretary betsy devos told a federal commission today that a commission won't be looking at

the role of guns in school violence. she was answering senator's questions about 2019 budget request for her department. you can see the entire hearing tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern here on c-span, here's a preview. >>ou are the chair of the president's school safety commission that was formed after the school shooting in florida that left 17 students and educators dead. our country is now averaging a school shooting each week. in fact, one day after the commission met last month, another 10 students and teachers were killed in santa fe, texas. i understand your commission intends to release recommendations by the end of the year. will your commission look at the role of firearms as it relates to gun violence in our schools? >> thanks, senator, for that question. it is an honor to serve and lead this commission. we are focused on the 20-something different provisions --

>> i know. i understand there's a lot but i'm also thinking the chairman has -- i'm trying to give you a question that could be answered yes or no. will your commission look at the role of firearms as it relates to gun violence in our schools. >> that's not part of the commission's charge, per se. >> so you're studying gun violence but not considering the rofle of guns. >> we're studying school safety and how t our students are safe. >> you're studying things like how much time is spent on video games, but there are other countries where they spend just as much time but have a tiny fraction of the ootingwe do. the gun of choice for mass shoot sers an ar-15. do you believe an 18-year-old high school student should be able to walk into a school and minutes later come out with an ar-15 style gun? and hundreds of rounds of

ammunition? >> well, sir, i know that this body and your counterparts on the other side of the capitol have addressed a number of these issues and i know that you're going to continue to debate -- >> i'm trying to give you questions that can be answered yes or no. letrepeat it in case i wasn'tlear. do you believe an 18-year-old high school student should be able to walk into a store and minutes latere out with an ar-15 style assault weapon and hundreds of rounds of ammunition? >> i believe that's very much a matter for debate and i know that's been debated within this body and will continue to be. our focus is on raising up successful, proven techniques and approaches to ensuring ols are fe for students to -- >> are you looking at other countries where students have spent just as much time on social media and video games and everything else but have much lower gun violence in their

schools? >> we have a very important meeting last week in maryland at a school within a district that has employed a -- an approach called pdif for 16 or 18 years. >> maybe i didn't make my tho countries whereou looking the students do just as much time on video games and just as much time on social media as we gun ut do not have violence, are you looking at those at all? >> not per se. >> thank you. so we'll look at gun violence in school bus not look at guns. an interesting concept. >> president trump brought in a military band and chorus for a performance of the national anthem in lieu of an event celebrating the super bowl champion philadelphia eagles at the white house this afternoon.

philly.com writes that philadelphia mayor jim kenny earlier took a shot at the president's fixation on crowds calling the president, quote, a fragile ego maniac obsessed with crowd size, afriday of the embarrassment of kilo throing a party no one wants to attend, close quote. that from philadelphia's mayor. here's the event as we wait for the house to come in at 6:30. ♪ >> ladies and gentlemen, the president of the united states.