bully published on july 3. his other books include ", use andorce" "state of union," 14 more thrillers. interact by phone, twitter or facebook. are special series with author is sunday, live from day to 3:00 p.m. eastern on book tv on c-span2. washington journal continues. host: malcolm nance is that our table this morning. "the plot to destroy democracy." that you for being here. let's begin with the conclusion. what is the conclusion? guest: the conclusion of what is happening with regard to our government? the story is not over yet. we have a long way to go with

the investigation into what happened to the united states in 2016. was one of thei first people to actually say on national television what was going on on the morning of july 25 when we started seeing the wikileaks, for the attacks on the democratic convention. what was very clear was that this was a very deep, broad intelligence operation being carried out against the united states. not against the democratic party. if it hadn't been in the interest of the kremlin to do something to the republican party, they would have done it with equal vigor. by doing that they took their shot at breaking american democracy. host: who are they? guest: vladimir putin and his organizations at the kremlin. putin is an interesting character. he's the next kgb officer -- an

ex-kgb officer. raise a communist. when he was 13 he went to a kgb open house and asked how to become part of your organization. it is significantly talk about his history as an officer in russian intelligence. that theyvil villains were portray during the entire time of the soviet union. but when russia collapsed, their strategic objectives never collapsed. they just became rich, a consumer-oriented country and their objectives to place themselves at the center of the political universe arise from the number three superpower position because russia is a poor country. they have nuclear weapons. that and trying to find a cultural identity is what vladimir putin latched onto and pushed. russia is a traditionally conservative nation and they are becoming by their own reckoning the center of christian conservatives and in the world

-- conservativism in the world. opposed tolways been that. mission is to realize the global access of washington in european capitals to break that link, get rid of the atlantic alliance that has existed since the end of world war ii and reorient it from moscow from the european capitals to washington. host: you write, "once kgb, always kgb." tell the viewers about your expertise. guest: i come from the naval intelligence world, signals intelligence. i was a cryptologist. i was a specialist in the middle east. you are a specialist in the middle east, what you know about russia? backrted in the cold war, in the early 1980's when russia was a barrel it threat -- zero lead threat -- viralent threat.

working the middle east, the russians were everywhere. kgb were everywhere. the matter where we stopped, no matter what we did, we were briefed on how they did the collection operations, where should you expect to see them, how to they carry out broad scale intelligence operations. when you get out in the field you see it. host: even reroute -- guest: a men's bathroom in naples. a small cafe. they look for where the americans were in the position assets out there. many of the old hand guys in the cia can tell you this was their modus operandi. flooded field and try to collect as many people as possible. lay out the motivation for interfering in the 2016 campaign. where are the dots? guest: there are so many you can actually confuse them. the dots are fundamentally

simple. whenever the prequel to this book, i had written that in five weeks because i was researching a book on isis' hacking and we isis,two a tax attributes tv5 in paris and the warsaw stock exchange, were in fact an advanced persistent threat 28 and 29. the very russian cyber entities that hacked the democratic national committee. as soon as i learned that in april of 2016 it became clear this could not be appointed in. why would they go to the democratic national committee? is only one reason why an intelligence agency would do that and start releasing the documents. they were affecting watergate all over again, but without the chief burglars and the security guard catching them. they used social media to disseminate damaging information at the speed of light.

it was not about hillary clinton so much. it was not so much about donald trump. it was initially about breaking united states' electoral process and sowing chaos. when they saw the opportunity to put in someone amenable to them, they did it. host: you were critical of the media and how they covered the mill story. is that of focusing on who is leaking the emails, they were focused on what was in the emails. guest: right. if you look at the information that was contained in there -- my favorite is, well, debbie wasserman schultz was biased against hillary clinton. r sh -- she rigged election. nothing works like that. debbie wasserman schultz was a very good friend of hillary clinton. who did you think she was going to vote for? conspiracy theories were amplified by a news media that was hungry about the one word

that have been out there from the previous few years, emails. the mills were nothing -- the mills were nothing. russian intelligence understood that they understand us. they know were the fault lines in american democracy lie. freedom of speech, freedom of the press, and they can recognize -- weaponize those media and using social turn them into daggers at our throat and they did that. they took those weapons in the used that the staff the american democracy to the point where right now we are lying on the floor. host: what is another dot? guest: this story of hillary clinton's 30,000 emails. fascinating. when i was doing reporting with werewe found best we brought on board monday because a fox news commentator said in april or may 2016, he had heard

a story that the politburo -- listening -- the kremlin, vladimir putin and his top associates, all of whom rx kgb e etuv officersx-. -- ex-kgb officers. that is called crown jewels in intelligence. there is no one in u.s. intelligence that would never open their mouth if we knew what was actually being said amongst five people in vladimir putin's offices. we trace it back to a source that appeared to be a plant from a russian story that came from one of the russians called sputnik. within 60 days is showed up on fox news. 60 days further, donald trump would be on stage saying russia, if you're listening, please

release the 30,000 hillary clinton emails. that information warfare operation work as planned. thrown through where i got to the mouth of a presidential candidate and was believed to be true. there is no way it could be true, right? no one releases discussions of the top five guys in the kremlin to the public to say they're having a debate about hillary clinton's emails. but it became so pervasive people to this day say it is a fact. this is the core of russia's military psychological warfare and information warfare against the united states. the last point i think that is most significant in this discussion is the fact that used wikileaks. assanges -- julian hated hillary clinton. be made that clear on his own blog. they knew they could not get it through to the larger news media

themselves so they leaked all this material to wiki leaks. theleaks prompted up to news media and successfully broke the democratic party other convention, and writers of the day of the election started pumping out information, some of which was patently false. all of which was stolen from innocent american citizens to the point where mike pompeo designated wiki leaks a nonstate intelligence agency, which means actor. which means the u.s. government can take action against it, just as they would against the fsb. host: what does all that prove? guest: russia carried out exactly what the cia reported. that the russian intelligence agencies at the direction of vladimir putin carried out a deep, broad, multiyear intelligence operation against the united states in order to damage our political process and

candidate for one that helps them achieve their goals. host: will go to raymond in southfield, michigan, democrat. -- manafort,lm, i in my mind, he owes russia a lot of money. he is safer in jail than on our streets. he did not produce. what you think? guest: anyone who is under trial and remanded to custody is safer in jail than they are on the street. the street has cars, do you have a heart attack. i know what you are getting at. those conspiracy theories where things happen to people, those things don't really happen. they happen in russia with alarming regularity, especially if you're a journalist or

someone they suspected have a trade them. vladimir putin said the greatest betrayal that he has that you can do through the russian federation is to betray the nation by speaking to foreign journalists or acting as a spy. this is a nation he grew up as a kgb officer. back in the day spies were thrown alive in a furnace by their peers in prison. he has a belief anything that betrays the russian federation is an anathema to him and they take action on it. they kill people around the world. that does not happen in the states. host: they tried in london. guest: the weapon systems they are using when they carried out using polonium, matilda, from a reactor that produces atomic weapons great plutonium, they send messages with the weapons they choose using nerve agents that come from the soviet

stockpiles or -- that i say soviet? russian and soviet stockpiles. they are sending very specific messages. the key message is they don't care about your government. doing that in london, trying to kill a former spy who had been exchanged so the game should have been off tells them they don't care about western democracy or western security and they can carry out the same activity in the united states. host: what was paul manafort's role in russia interfering in the campaign? guest: the background of paul manafort, what he is being investigated and indicted for being held in prison for his very interesting. paul manafort was the ultimate fixer. in the early 2000's he became a fixer for the pro-moscow government in the ukraine. this is the same government that power,all due to people

but he was paid to arrange activities which most americans would consider crimes. ukrainians consider them crimes. they said he was paid millions of dollars off the books in cash. one of those activities resulted in an attack on u.s. marines in the crimea and forced them to have to, under bottles and rocks being thrown at them, leave the country from the nato exercise they were carrying out. damaged his activity he the national security of the united states which allowed russia to seize crimea. in theet's go to doubter bronx. caller: good morning, mr. nash. greta, i would like to make three points. point number one, do you thember how long it took bill clinton investigation? it was over 2.5 years. and the guy from

south carolina, trey gowdy, remember how long it took to investigate hillary clinton? over three years. why is it all of a sudden they are now calling and saying this investigation is lasting too long? how could donald trump on national tv, on fox television, with bill o'reilly, russia does bad things. they would break a 75 year alliance that was built on america's strength to make the west the power it is today. but donald trump says we do bad things too, and o'reilly says he kills. trump says we kill in murder, too. don't you think of to know the

people have not seen donald manp is loyal to this because they have something on him? they have the money. a rush of bank has loaned donald trump money you cannot get from america. guest: let me answer that. first of all, he is right. this investigation has been going on for 397 days, a special counsel's investigation. let me characterize this in a way everyone can understand here. this investigation of the trump campaign and russian interference or possible american citizens conspiracy with russian intelligence agencies is the single most important and significant and dangerous investigation in the history of the united states. there is nothing that is equal to what is happening right now. if everyone thinks this is a hoax and they think it's a joke

and they think it is some x-files conspiracy, you need to understand that this investigation started because american citizens were found by u.s. intelligence agencies to have been in director medication with known foreign intelligence officers. that is how this started. it turns out some of them were associated with the trump campaign. if you think we should defend this nation, that the national security organization and our intelligence agencies are here for our defense, you have to allow them to determine was this election and was this president influenced by a foreign nation. host: to you think so? what evidence is there that donald trump, the trump organization, the truck campaign colluded with the russians? -- trump campaign colluded with the russians? guest: evidence is a legal term for information and materials in the hands of the justice department.

this is why we are having an investigation. there are a lot of circumstantial information. i consolidated a lot of that in my last chapter. i really think whatever is going on the donald trump and moscow is suspicious. it is suspicious because there is not a person in the united states intelligence community or the personal reliability program, nuclear weapons, or anyone with secret about confidential who would not have their security clearance pulled, looked at, their lives dissected for some the statements and only came for the president, but from all of his staff. we have a former director of the defense intelligence agency who became the national security advisor to the united states who has pled guilty to lying about his contacts with a foreign government to the fbi. to the fbiou lie about anything? whatever it is.

it is serious. anyone that thinks this is not significant, this is a gain, that you were -- game, you are playing into the hands of the kremlin and the people have already indicted 13 russian intelligence operatives and two other organizations. is insane. host: publishers weekly said this about your book. nance produces no evidence or that putin mastermind the global populace right, or that russian meddling decided the election. host: you know, that was an interesting review because everybody has their opinions, but to say there is no evidence that russia has anything to do with the global right is insane. -- thejust last year russian candidate against the emmanuel macron in the french election has over 50 million euros in loans from moscow.

everyone knows she was vladimir putins'preferred candidate. putin told her something if you don't halt immigration in europe france will become occupied by its colonies. organization in greece is openly siding with united russia. the government of austria, ofp, has openly signed contracts with united russia and vladimir putin for political and governmental and financial support. half of eastern europe -- half of the european nation conservative organizations of which they have alliances everywhere, they call themselves the world nationalist conservative movement. acts are pernicious things. idealistically an empirical fact. those are facts. most european conservatism is funded through the russian federation.

use the google machine to find out about that. with regards the evidence as to conspiracy of people in the united states operating with the kremlin, the mueller investigation already has a national security advisor to the united states pleading guilty. and man who claimed -- george papadopoulos, to play guilty to lying to the fbi about his contacts with russian intelligence. you have other people, including the direct associate of paul manafort, his deputy, the deputy campaign manager of the trump team pled guilty. they have already put people in prison. they have already indicted russian intelligence agencies. you have to have a very close to mindto not think -- closed to think these significant coincidences are anything other than organized action. ian fleming, the guy who created james bond had a saying. once is happenstance, twice as coincidence, 30's enemy action. that has been updated by the

intelligence community. we have a saying i was fully call the nance law. coincidence takes a lot of planning. host: ray in iowa, democrat. caller: malcolm, loved watching you on msnbc. two quick points. an innocent man does not act like trump is acting. i've always said as soon as he was elected there would be some kind of civil unrest or civil war. give me your points on that. guest: lets stop all this civil war talk. guys need to you what about those books about what is going on in 1860. that nation was split right down the middle. let's talk about the point of hiding information. there have been over 13 people it wentrump campaign before either law enforcement organizations or governmental

organizations and lied about their contacts with the russian federation. why? that is the only thing people in counterintelligence ask when the suspect you of doing something nefarious with another government. the next thing to do is whip yourfinances apart -- rip finances apart to see if you have dealings with the hostile intelligence agency. why the donald trump, jr. lie about a meeting in which he was going to get hurt about hillary clinton? that has been exposed. by with paul manafort lie about his dealings with the russian federation and offer to give private briefings to a man who withs $10 million in debt about the inner workings of the trump campaign. why with the president of the united states for almost five years now glowingly show a level of obsequious to a foreign power, annexed kgb officer --

to theb officer-, lie american public and strive to stop a federal law enforcement investigation that was duly appointed into his campaign and into his workings. it is not just that he feels some sort of umbrage and the fact someone is looking. any decent person would say this is my life. i want you to investigate it. is the full authority and power of the nicest government, but someone who works hard to fire your principal investigator, to inspire to fire the next investigator, this is what a mafia chief was become a mayor does. this is not going to work and i think so long as the nation understands there are people looking out for this nation, we will all come to a successful conclusion of this. host: he wrote any final assessment that a trained

intelligence professional will conclude president trump was a spy's dream. is for personal characteristics and indifference to anyone but himself with the exploitable. 1987,s as far back as russia have their sights on trump is a potential asset. little did they realize he would be as effective as a winning trusted agent. host: everything there is true. what you pointing to? guest: donald trump is a spy's during. when people recruit agents, they recruit money general matrix on the mice matrix. m, system of money. second, convince them to come to their ideology. money generally works. c, they can either coerce them through blackmail or co-opt them by getting them agree to do something so long as it benefits them. finally they massage their ego. mice is a dated acronym used in the community.

there are more sophisticated way of recruiting agents but russia uses that to identify people who could possibly be brought to their fold. said what officer they kgb -- i use that interchangeably. the modern fsb is the kgb with new letters. and better computers. he said that type of person we tried to recruit more selfless -- weressists self-absorbed narcissists who are greedy. you massage their ego. what is the evidence may have? another thing people need to understand is the russians carried out a psychological worker operation technique called reflexive control. if they were interested in you and they think you can be an asset to them, they will using media, friends, money, whatever tool they have necessary, they will build a framework around

ideas information and that they have manufactured that they think you are amenable to and they will essentially create a perception bubble around you so when you make decisions, you will make a decision -- that them. donald trump in 2013 had a two-hour meeting at a restaurant and moscow when he was there for miss universe with the 12 richest oligarchs of russia. including a personal representative of vladimir putin. when he came out he was spouting the kremlin party line on the dissolution of nato, the breakup of the european union, the un necessity of the world trade organization, the breaking up of the atlantic alliance, crimea and was a russian speaking province of russia, ukraine that should've been under russian control. the president of the united states has said, defended and

continues to say this. he does not fundamentally believe in the atlantic alliance, which means the belief the united states and its allies defeating the axis powers in world war ii and assembling a new world under the marshall plan in creating a network of democracies that have a national security infrastructure and collective strength in nato, in trade links that would benefit both sides, he does not believe in that. as a matter of fact he has said to people including the president of france recently, what you get out of the european union? donald trumpleaving the eu would destroy the eu, which is like letter couldn't loan marine le pen 50 million euros last year. it was only the common sense of the french people that say the united states and democracy for the second time in its history when they chose mccrone. -- macron.

guest: -- caller: if you could tell the viewers about how we intersect ourselves into other people's elections like we did in jerusalem and places like that? we're the ones that are sitting there doing the same thing the russians did to us, and get you people never talk about that interaction. i would like for you to explain --people just than just just -- i get sick and nauseated about all this stuff everybody talks about. host: got your point. guest: are you sure you are a republican? host: were a republican. guest: i don't normally hear people attack the party light of american exceptionalism. yes, the united states has done nefarious things in the past.

anyone who reads history, understands history, believes in history knows that. when we are taking the one step backwards we are often trying to take two steps forward. iran in 1952 created a maelstrom that brought the ayatollah back in 1979. look where we are. they tried to acquire nuclear weapons. we do stupid things sometimes. that being said, we don't do that all the time as a governmental policy. governmental policies that pop up from time to time by turning -- in turning the japanese are stripping children from the parents of the border, these are individual things that were not founded in this nation. you will not find this in the constitution. in russia the policies are set by the ex-kgb officer in chief. when he says killing journalist, the journalist will be killed. when he gets his former chef of private security contract in

syria and says it they can get rid of u.s. special forces at a certain oilfield, they can keep the oilfield, they will attack u.s. special forces which they did this year and lost 200 men to us doing it. the united states is still an exceptional shining city on the hill, but i will not close over that point. the headline of the president meeting with vladimir putin before he goes to the nato summit. trump expected after moscow's help in syria. guest: i understand that and that is great. we want to curb iran's presents. my niece was in combat was your off of yemen. into a shipping missiles smuggled into the country fired upon her worship. she and her crew to get back to them, but that was nowhere near syria. i thought iran you 1988 in the persian gulf.

iran has a strategy they want to affect or exercised power in the middle east. but we are not going to get that by surrounding syria to vladimir putin. vladimir putin enables iran to in syria.ria -- to be him to attack the kurds. we have abandoned our allies we've been fostering for eight years and seven syria and russia is now massacring people. this is a step backwards geopolitically. russia is not our ally. russia is a strategic adversary. we need understand they do not do things in america's interest. they do things in the interest of vladimir putin and his ultrarich oligarchy, not even the people of russia. caller: hello. i have two quick questions. yes, when can it

reasonable, intelligent person began to call the president of the united states a traitor to the united states? i grew upquestion is, believing it could not happen here. that somebody like adults that were cannot rise to power. lph hitler cannot rise to power. host: guest: i want to make this very clear. that term "traitor" is a legal term. in a time of declared war, a person working with a foreign power to damage her own nation. withve not charged anyone treason since the rosenbergs in the 1950's. even aldrich ames was not charged with treason. he was charged with espionage, releasing classified

information. no one gets charged with that. it would be exceptional that would have a declared war and have to have video of him handing that over the nuclear codes to a foreign power. you can do trader nation, and i legally have your is a situation that is pushing itself in spite of inch -- inch by inch pushing than it into a benedict arnold motive. what is happening here is for his own purposes, the president of united states. he is protecting whatever relationship he has with vladimir putin. -- asngly, strongly someone who loves this country deeply from my heart. my family has served in every war since 1864 when i great, great-grandfather escaped slavery and joined the colored troops. this nation must be protected first and foremost.

if he has a debt financially to vladimir putin, just tell us. we are a very forgiving country. but these actions we have seen where he is dismantling the atlantic alliance, party appears asbe reengineering america not of a g7 or g8, but this autocrats -- axis of between moscow and north korea and beijing. attacking allies in europe and engineer the elections of moscow-backed parties in germany, france, italy. no president of united states is ever done this. we did not lose one million men in world war ii to end the american alliance with european allies. host: answer the question why the president would betray his country or speak in positive terms about vladimir putin. where would you go? you said money, but how did you

find out? guest: he left the special counsel do his job and that is what is going on. this is what the president and his allies in congress, the article 1 people who have been put there to exercise the powers of restraint and active guardrails -- act as guardrails are actingidentcy like the politburo in rubberstamping whatever he says in trying to stop these investigations. the special counsel's job is to determine what is going on. why were all of these people the trump campaign lying about their contacts with moscow? why? has this occurred 10 years earlier, maybe treason trials would have been brought. we cannot explain it. is unexplainable. it has to be investigated. we have to allow u.s. law enforcement and intelligence to get to the bottom of this.

--st host: claimed into texas.lint in the people in congress for now are self-interested. they don't to go against trump. we had a midterm coming up and they are scared to death. they are afraid of this man and that is sad. my second point is trump will be going to the nato meeting. secondly he will be going to russia to see vladimir putin. it is strange he is going there in september, just a few months before the midterm election. my suspicion is if there is collusion somewhere, he will work out a plan -- this is just hypothetical -- he will work out a plan with the russians to interfere with the midterms so

or republicans and democrats whoever is backing trouble stay in power. host: malcolm nance? guest: i think him going to the nato summit is going to be really interesting television. comment reported by the washington post recently. he made a comment to the ambassador of sweden. it appears he did not understand sweden was not in nato. read the briefing book. cap somebody read it to you. we would not tolerate that in the armed forces. he did not understand sweden was not in nato, and he was talking to them as they were. treated -- the prime minister said we're not in nato, we participate in nato. trump said that is what i would like to do the united states. we created nato. we owe a debt of gratitude to nato. 9/11, when this nation was

attacked, the canadian ambassador to nato was the one that invoked in the article five treaty powers that brought all the 26 nations at the time to the defense of united states when this city right here out that window was smoldering and burning. we still have our debt in our buildings. -- dead in our buildings. we created this alliance as a body of national security, national and collective defense against adversaries like russia. but we should not do is suddenly, arbitrarily with one man decide the entire history of the united states, from 1939 two today should be eliminated because perhaps he owes a debt to the cardinal of the kremlin. host: are the midterms vulnerable to russia? guest: yes, they are absolutely vulnerable because we have done absolutely nothing since 2016. the russians don't have to hack the results.

over 25 states were scanned by russians intelligence, the russian military intelligence. they were looking at the voter registration rules. all yesterday was create one piece of software that changes everybody's addressed by one digit and all those people will be disenfranchised and everyone will not be allowed to vote on that day. that gets you a critical election. votes trump won by 77,000 in three states. that it. of thousandsdreds of people who were disenfranchised by errors on their voter registration. host: are you saying the russians threw the election by 77,000 votes? guest: not at all. the russians created this entire wall of perception management that they did. they changed the debate of the election to be completely about emails by stealing emails and pumping them into the election.

no one has ever attributed any vote as stolen because of action of russia. but then again, nothing has been audited. we will see with the special counsel comes up with. host: john, republican. caller: i'm a surfer from california and i got to tell you i know when someone is blowing smoke it me and this guy is a partisan hack. i have to say he is connecting dots that are not connectable. that drawing conclusions aren't logical. i will tell you why. you can laugh all you want but i will tell you why. if hillary won the election, you can make the same case about hillary getting russian collusion behind her. don't you agree to that? you are shaking your head yes, so you have to agree there are winners and losers in every election. just because trump won does not mean he was backed by russians.

backed occupy wall street. that came out in the senate hearings. yes they did. they backedearings, both sides to cause disruption. that is what you're going to find out. you are such a partisan and to say this against the united states of america when we are on a good track and come out like this and have a hack book without any -- from mueller's investigation, forming a conclusion without anything coming out. when it comes up mueller has nothing, you will have egg on your face. hearingse benghazi took six investigations over six years. came out with no indictments. nothing. absolutely no one was brought to account for anything. they cleared hillary clinton on every account.

the caller needs a little therapy. esill out and get some wav because this investigation has been in power for less than a year and have already indicted senior campaign officials. you have to believe with yourself or your lying eyes. this has already occurred. i'm not a partisan hack. i am just a hack, but what i laid out in the book is all documentable. we have 60 pages of references. i can't help him. he has made me cry. [applause] -- [laughter] host: i will go to mike in illinois, independent. caller: hi. hitler said tell a lie often enough, people will tend to believe it. this is a complete lie. earlier you said russia is a

conservative christian nation. we want to deal with a conservative christian nation because we are originally a conservative christian nation. furthermore you said they can hack into voting records. he go to the polling place, show an id and folk -- and a vote. likely we did for 200 years before we got these damn in theaters. a democracy is one of the worst forms of government. as democracy is mob rule. guest: let me address that. we are a constitutional republic. to republic is a democracy in rich the rights of the minority are protected. dictionaries, use them. this is not a lie. it is not a lie. this the not come out of thin air.

the entirety of the u.s. intelligence community did not come to an agreement because it was fun. we don't do that. when we come to a conclusion we have high confidence that a foreign power has interfered with the most fundamental parts of our government, we have evidence, people confessing to this that they have a live to the u.s. government and we have an investigation, a national security counterintelligence which is spy hunting for you civilians in action that started before the election, we need to take this seriously. this is nothing less than our way of life on the chopping block. if you don't want to believe it, don't believe it. you cannot say nothing is happening. hillary clinton did not have her entire campaign meeting with russian officers of the kremlin and then lying to federal law enforcement about it. that never happened. if it had, believe me, we would be having treason trials going

on right now. let me make one last point. think if donald trump tells you something, it is true, it is true. you have to start thinking for yourself. people have to start thinking. all i have laid out in the book is all the previous reported information and intelligence that has existed about this campaign and how they have -- how russia uses its intelligence agencies to create these conservative christian organizations around the world, recognize them, and when they get into power they start dismantling their own democracies. the easiest way to destroy the democratic -- a republic constitutional republic is to have elections internally and take it apart yourself. oft: you talk about the orb influence around the president. do you address steve bannon in this book and the role he played?

guest: i do. steve bannon was a senior advisor to the president, that he is also a student of the russian philosopher alexander dugine. he believes in breaking up the atlantic alliance. is not believe the axis between washington, d.c. and europe should exist at all. he believes that needs to be undermined at all costs and that should be replaced with an axis between moscow, the european capitals and then subservient united states. he has a website on the internet. goes that on twitter and tweets in russian. they say all of this publicly. steve bannon is a disciple. for thelf said he calls elimination of the federal government, or functions of the federal government. he now acts as his own version rasputind and going --

going around the capitals and ask them to embrace white supremacy, to embrace older conservativism, to embrace anti-immigrant fervor and to destroy the european order that has existed that we fatwa or two over. host: robert mercer? guest: the funder of all of this. he funded cambridge analytic a deadly believe may have had a link to the russians. in fact, the head of channel 1 in russia, that ted turner of russia, said he was breached by donald trump on cambridge analytic a's efforts -- analytica's efforts in 2014 and 2015, the same time russian intelligence treated the internet research agency and started engineering social media through facebook and twitter. none of these things are coincidences. coincidence takes a lot of planning. this and they not only hit us, they hit the

french, the british during brexit. the british are now having investigations that the robert cer of england funded the same thing and secretly met with the russians. host: jim, the democrat. you are on the air with malcolm nance. caller: thank you for c-span and thank you, mr. nance. i have heard you speak on msnbc and you do an outstanding job. let me apologize for that fellow on the west coast who called you a hack. it is much like you are saying. people want to believe what they want to believe. somebody asked a question earlier or you answered a --stion for someone that someone said, why don't more republicans stand up to president trump? how did he even get elected? it was, to me, i would portray

it as a lot of people wanted to write his coattails. -- ride his coattails. he speaking about the mercers and the singers and the washington freebie can, the people who essentially started the dossier against candidates from. a lot of republicans will not acknowledge that. he started that what he did not like him. they did nothing to had a snowball's chance of hell in winning. they were more in favor of cruz and rubio. host: can you tell us your perspective on the dossier? steele,hristopher former mi six intelligence officer, committed professional. there was no one i know that didn't know him that said he wasn't top of his class. former chief of the russian

ati-6, british intelligence -- at mi-6. he was contracted by a republican donor to create an opposition research folder of rumors about donald trump and his contacts with russia. it was not started by hillary clinton, not contracted by the democratic party. it was contracted by summit funding ted cruz's campaign. he did research. the campaign decided not to take the package. the package was offered to a democratic donor. the research is solid. ae russians are validating lot of the pages because it appears over the last two years several people believed to be sources for christopher steele's dossier had mysteriously shown of dead. actually has information used in it by the central intelligence agency that twoged to validate at least

full pages of the low points from the own independent u.s. intelligence, which means whatever is in there, and we don't know what points they are, it is real. host: what he may be done a specific points? guest: that was briefed to president trump in a classified briefing and we don't know the top-secret information they have or specifically which items from the 36 pages u.s. intelligence is well aware of. host: richard, republican. caller: i am 71 years old. i want to make one comment. barack obama stood on the stage in front of all the reporters , that youonald trump could not invent our election. go out and win the election. barack obama was president for eight years. the said no russian could ever do this to our election, after

being president for eight years. -- i among the states th have watched this unfold. what is sad is 34 million americans lost their houses and jobs while government ships their jobs to china. we don't worry about china even though 95% of merchandise comes from china. host:. about the role of the obama administration, the intelligence they were seeing before the election. you think they should've said something? guest: barack obama -- i visited the white house when he was there. barack obama's biggest fault is that -- it is not a fault. he truly loves this country. i have heard a lot of nasty things said about the barack obama. one trip around this white house made it clear he understands the and dignity depth

and will the presidency. experimentnds as an that thing going for 243 years, he will not upset that cart despite the fact he had information in his hands which could have thrown the election away from donald trump. a free and fair election must be free and must be fair. sked the intelligence agencies to find at what is going on. the fbi asked for a warned against an american citizen who was believed to be a foreign intelligence asset. that is as far as i can say to that. what he also asked with a gang of eight, the top senior leaders of congress be briefed into what they had. they had of the senate, mitch mcconnell, refused to allow the name russia to be assigned to a letter saying we found

information in foreign interference. when the president came on television in october and said we have evidence a foreign power is meddling in our election, to pick up the phone and called vladimir putin personally. john brennan called the director of russian intelligence dosonally and warned them, not interfere with the actual vote. that is exactly what i would expect lincoln to do, or washington, or jefferson. i do not expect the president of the united states to jump up and put his dom on the scale just before an election. that is someone with dignity and decency. even now he is not speaking out about it but i hope he certainly isn't the last president that will maintain that decency and dignity. host: malcolm nance, what are you watching for next from the mueller investigation? guest: the indictments. they are people overdue for indictment. jared kushner.

not for the reasons most people think. the mueller investigation can investigate any crime they find, but there was a report last year that was pretty well sourced that jared kushner had a meeting with the russians ambassador in the russian embassy in washington, d.c. and with him was michael flynn. the now many for national security adviser. he said they should create a back channel using secure russian reppo graphic systems, knowing the cia and the nsa could not break the communications. any other american citizen, if they had done that, what walked out into the arms of the fbi. that was left unanswered. team said it was misinterpreted and he just wanted a channel to speak to russian liaisons with syria and we have an operations center in syria that meets with the russians regularly and gets

information, does not require a secure cryptographic system from the use of russian diplomat. host: who else and i did -- indicted? guest: everybody that is involved right now is under investigation. food the other players are -- who the other players are? robert mueller likes to surprise us. throw curve balls. people we did not know about, george papadopoulos were indicted and other lower level players. he is working his way up. whatever happened, clear something happened, if we will put our heads in the sand, it will happen again and this nation will be lost. we will assist in the destruction of our own constitutional republic, our own democracy. host: malcolm nats.

-- nance, thank you for the conversation. thank you for watching. we will be back tomorrow morning at 7:00 eastern time. enjoy your weekend. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] recentsupreme court's term wrapped up this week and the washington council of lawyers will look at some of the major cases in the term, live at 12:30 p.m. eastern. chief justice john roberts sits down for an interview a