military and veterans in the last year with leo shane from military times. and then we continue with sarah kendzior discussing her book, "the view from flyover country -- dispatches from a forgotten america." host: good morning and welcome to "washington journal." the government shutdown in its eighth day with no immediate end in sight with republicans and over the in a deadlock demand for a border wall between the united states and mexico. it has hundreds of thousands of federal employees on furlough are working without pay and headed towards financial distress days after the christmas holiday and with the house switching to democrats immediateanuary, no resolution in sight. is the government shutdown worth it over the border wall?

if you support the federal government shutdown, call 202-748-8000. if you oppose the federal government shutdown, call 202-748-8001. if you are a federal worker affected by this partial government shutdown, we want to hear from you at 202-748-8002. you can always reach us on social media, twitter, @cspanwj, and facebook.com/c-span. does notal government seem to be moving to opening up as congressional leaders and the white house have been silent over the last couple of days over coming to a resolution over the fight of the border wall. in the washington post, they say that congressional leaders are not even in town with senate majority leader mitch mcconnell and senate minority leader charles schumer having returned

to their home states. aids for paul ryan and nancy pelosi are not revealing there were about. emerging consensus on friday that there would be no deal before democrats take control on wednesday of the house. altering the balance of power in washington for the first time in the donald trump presidency. the president initially demanded $5 billion for the wall and democrats rejected it, refusing to go about $1.3 billion in order will secure the funding that did not include a wall. i do not to progress made indicating nancy pelosi will compromise before january 3, mark meadows said in a text message to the washington post. president trump brought up the border wall during history of overseas during the christmas holiday and here is what he had to say. doingent trump:

everything in our power to defend our homeland and to stop terrorists from entering america shores. that includes strengthening our borders. we want to have strong borders in the united states but the democrats do not want us to have strong borders. only for one reason, because i want it. [laughter] president trump: if i said, standing here looking at these warriors, you are modern-day warriors, but looking at this warrior group, i think i will say, i do not want the wall and they will give it to me. i figured out the solution. pelosi iy, tell nancy do not want the wall. we get the wall. another way of doing it. [cheers and applause]

host: let's go to our first call of the day from mike calling from cary, north carolina, he supports the shutdown. caller: good morning. how are you? host: fine, go ahead. caller: i support it, not thrilled but support it. it is politics. i will tell you where i come from. so you do not think i may raising right wing neanderthal. i watch president reagan negotiate with the democrats on the amnesty that was granted in 1986 for 3 million illegal aliens living in the country and the deal was supposed to be, we will let them stay, they have lived in the country, they work, most are good citizens or most are good people, not citizens, let's be clear about our terminology.

the deal under the simpson was only act that the border would be further secured and we would tighten the flow of illegal immigrants into this country. here we are 32 years later and the situation has only gotten worse. i am a conservative and a republican, both parties are to blame for this and they both have different political agendas. parties, atgo, both least on the surface, had identical approaches to this and agreed that securing the southern border was right and it needed to be done. a sovereign nation has this right. the democrats have -- if you look at history, don't take my word, i am nobody on c-span on saturday morning drinking his coffee, eight years ago chuck schumer has a speech you can find on google, 50 years ago, robert f kennedy and walter

mondale, marching in southern california against illegal immigration and illegal immigrants that were affecting the wage rates of the union great workers -- grape workers. the democrats used to be for secure borders and so on and so forth. they have thrown in with changing the demographics of certain states, like they have done in california and now they just do not care. host: how does shutting the government down get you to that solution? that is where we are now. cutting out government services -- caller: i do not know but politics is about leverage. politics is about taking what is have -- president trump making what appears to most americans in my opinion, i am not a pollster, a reasonable

request, $5 billion for border security. if you want to call it a wall, whatever. ,e spent $11 billion per day every day, 365 days a year governing this country for all of our programs. he is asking for the amount of money we will spend today from midnight to noon, that's it. he is not asking for anything that is over the top or on amount of money that will bankrupt the nation when we are already $20 trillion in the hole. on top of that he has placed back, several months ago, he was more than willing to offer the continuation of or somehow have to's edition chip for up to -- or somehow a path to citizenship for the daca kids, some in the 30's now, and chain migration,

if one person makes it into the country, they should not be allowed to bring in 30 of their relatives from another -- it is untenable, especially with a massive welfare state. these are reasonable requests that most old-line democrats once supported. the democrats walked away from that deal. this is the only tool he has. he will have a democratic house of representatives come january and is making this play now. it is the only tool he has. i have to say right now, one thing that should be in this conversation and most of the major networks ignoring it, and thank you for the time you are giving me, the awful murder of a police officer in california. that is part of this problem. he was murdered by an illegal ofen who had the state

california law enforcement authorities, they are not allowed to alert i.c.e. to criminal illegal aliens in that state because of sb54. you have sheriffs and police in california being interviewed and giving press conferences about the murder of the fine young police officer. they are railing at governor jerry brown and the democrats that run the state because they basically just have given up. host: let's go to christie in boston, massachusetts. she opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning. i do oppose the wall. i agree with the first caller on a number of issues. seever, i personally cannot that my tax dollars go to pay for this how many billion dollar

other money can go to assure more border security. president trump did promise that mexico would pay for the wall. things may move more quickly in the house and senate if the ladies and gentlemen were not paid. nobody is being paid, no exceptions. they would get off their hands more quickly and get back to washington and do their job. the: you seem to think that government shutdown, congress should not be paid during the shutdown. caller: precisely. that is exactly right. no senator, nobody should be paid. host: how do you get around to

that? they congress decides whether they get paid. how do you convince them to put their own paychecks at risk? caller: i just turned on the television, i watch her program every morning and i did not think far enough. ifelieve it would be fair there would be a bunch of people if thatnew law and could be put into action. --re have been lost past laws passed to suit certain congressmen and senators. weekend, i cannot pinpoint it, but it can be done and i believe that things would ,ove much farther, much faster

and nobody should be paid. they are selecting people from who are paid and not paid, who may get back pay, this is not clear. i think it is outrageous. host: mary calling from both your city, louisiana, supporting the showdown -- motor city, city,ana -- bossier louisiana, use of for the showdown. showdown --rt the shutdown. the way to pronounce the city is bossier. it is french. host: ok. caller: anyway, democrats want all of those people to come in here because they are stacking the deck.

, when theye doing get both houses back, they are going to start hiring -- make it our rights for them to vote. not only that, they will pardon the people minds against republicans so they will only vote democrat. that is why the democrats want them here. big business want them here for the cheap labor. and the catholic church wants them here for the membership because they lost a lot of membership during the sex scandal with the priests molesting children. are very devious.

republicans -- they think short-term and he democrats think long terms. host: the democrats say they offered $1.6 billion for border security to the president. that is not insignificant, is it? caller: it is not insignificant but it is not enough. trump was at, if democrat, they would have given him $25 billion but he has know, heried to -- you is a deal maker. ok. to $5 billion.n

mexico going to pay for the wall , he was not talking about them writing a check, what he meant savings this country would be able to save from those people coming over here. the democrats say they do not get benefits, but i live next door to them, that they have moved. those in childbearing years, when they get here, they get pregnant and have a baby. i have seen it. when they have those babies, they can apply for welfare, food stamps, housing, because that child in the country is an american. that is how they do it.

those people use our own laws against us. host: john in that phase, new york. you support the showdown. caller: good morning and happy holidays to all. i support the shutdown because we need the funding for the wall. everyone is probably familiar with senator schumer who seems to be the voice of the democratic party and the one in president trump's side. i am an independent voter. but senator schumer, in new york where i am from, has nine fully functioning offices. nine offices for one senator. one and washington, d.c., one in albany, new york, melville, new york, new york city, syracuse, new york, rochester new york, binghamton, new york, and

peekskill new york. it seems totally wasteful for one senator to have nine fully functioning, fully staffed offices when we are in a crisis with border security. it is ironic. familiare people not with senator schumer should get on the phone and ask him why he has nine offices. and they could ask him, whatever happened to dr. ford who seem to disappear after the brett kavanaugh fiasco. it is ironic. host: let's go to gloria in meridian, mississippi, she opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call. i am not going to spout racism about those people and having babies. i oppose the shutdown because money was allocated for border security in the budget last year.

that money has not been exhausted. and now donald trump is asking for another $1 billion. we are already rising in deficit. let's put more to add to the cost. it is ridiculous. use the money for border security. i have not heard of one terrorists who has crossed the southern border. host: when you say border security, i assume you do not mean building a wall. what do you mean by border security? -- making sure we are hiring more federal agents that can staff the border. we do not need a wall. it donald trump wants a wall and 30% of his supporters want a wall, let them pay for it because he is just throwing out red meat for his base. host: there is a partially built

fence between the united states and mexico. what is the difference between that and building a wall? caller: that fence is already secure. we had a caravan of these rapists and murderers as the president said, on their way to invade the united states. how many invaded the united states? during the midterm elections, all the news was, on fox news and affiliates of that were saying the caravan is coming to rape and murder our people, where are they? they do not talk about them because they were stopped at the border and not allowed to enter. from decatur, georgia, a federal worker. caller: one thing i do not hear donald trump saying is that

mexico will pay for the wall. this was all through the campaign, mexico will pay for the wall. it sounded like a bait and switch con game. now you want to shake down the taxpayers. that is paid and switch. furlough oru on working without pay? caller: i am working. host: your department is still getting paid? caller: yes. host: keep going. caller: most illegal immigrants come by airplane. most overstay their visa. immigration is as american as apple pie. wall, youl build a have to take down the statue of liberty. thank you. host: let's go to tweets from viewers. one viewer who supports the

shutdown, saying, yes, sometimes hard things have to be done for the country. another viewer that says, no, considering only 11% entered that way at a cost of $25 million just for a wall that does nothing -- $25 billion just for a wall that does nothing without actual human border security -- it is ludicrous. another viewer says why build it when the next president tears it down. patty in connecticut, you support the shutdown. good morning. caller: i would like to tell gloria that no terrorist came through, they did and were arrested. does she know about the illegal immigrant who killed a legal immigrant police officer in california and left his wife and eight-month-old child behind? you do not know how many people

want this wall. i am talking democrats, republicans, and the defendant -- and independents. it is suicide. if that is not done, i do not know what will happen to this country. another caravan is on the way. host: one of our viewers says i love the illegal immigration comes through on airplanes and when people overstay their visas. how will the border wall effect that? caller: israel, 99% of people getting in their, it will help. it will not cover it 100% but any little bit to help would work. i do not care if they are coming in on helicopter, airplanes, trains, you have to stop it. the ones here illegally, time to go door-to-door and anyone who overstays their visa, just like mohammed atta. host: phoebe in pennsylvania.

she opposes the shutdown. caller: i do not oppose the shutdown, i wish the government would shutdown for much longer because i think of a lot of the things it does is more harm than good. but i do not like the wall. -- let me make sure -- caller: the wall is a terrible idea, we do not have a right to put a wall there, it in the wetlands, animals migrate over that space, it is not a question of keeping out somebody. that is ridiculous and inhumane and it will not keep anybody out because you can go around a wall. when you build a wall it is therefore a long time and causes problems for everything. host: let's go to dorothy and columbus, ohio.

dorothy opposes the shutdown. dorothy, good morning. caller: good morning. my comment is, when i was in school, we learned that the government says we the people, for the people, by the people. my whole thing of it is, as the one lady said, if you are going to have a government shutdown, no one should get a paycheck because, if you work for the people, and you are put in office by the people, you should not get a paycheck either. you should not be exempt. the other thing i wanted to say is that we go to all of these foreign countries and tell them tear down the wall, i think of the berlin wall. but we are trying to build one. we should protect our borders but we do not need to build a wall to protect the borders. shutdownpose the because it is awful that we had

a half a million people that are out of work, without a paycheck, because of people that are in the office looking for their own agenda instead of the people's agenda. host: how long do you think this holdout should have happened on the democratic side, because with our compromise, it seems like the government will continue to be shutdown? caller: it will be a different play ball on january 3 because of their position in having more seats. said, everyone is putting the people as the pawns, i think it is wrong. i will not call him president trump, donald trump, as well as all of the political people, are not doing what is right and best for the people. host: let's go to robert calling

from benton harbor, michigan. robert supports the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning. how are you? host: fine. go ahead. caller: i support the wall because the mexicans come here -- they are hard workers, why can't they come here and work and go back in their own country? they are over populating this country. and who will be in mexico if they come over here? wall do you think that a that will probably not be billed for a while. anything -- built for a while. anything -- would stop anything? caller: it will just be an ongoing situation.

they will continue to come over here. something we start, we cannot stop. host: dave calling from armstrong creek, wisconsin. dave opposes the shutdown. caller: i do not think the government shutdown will solve anything. we have had this problem for many years. there was a comprehensive immigration bill passed in the senate. unanimously. they never brought it to a vote in the house. i amr as border security, all for that and i know we need to control our borders. but i think the major problem is people would not come up if they did not have people hiring them. solid programt a

-- monitor employers from hiring these people. as far as drugs coming into the country, we are the biggest market for drugs and drugs will get in somehow, no matter what. i think they need probably structures in key places. as the way donald trump put it, when he was getting elected, he made it somewhat they will make this beautiful border wall and mexico would pay for it. now it is almost symbolic. host: dave, how long should democrats hold out? the longer they argue, the longer some federal workers will be without a paycheck or be working without pay? how long should a holdout? caller: no matter what happens

it will go into january when democrats take over. then he will not get any funding. they have already offered him billion,st it was $1.6 and they had deals -- it seems like every time there is a deal ready to go through you hear some right wing talk say something and he pulls the rug out from underneath it. he is supposed to be this deal maker and he makes these deals and reneges on them. the -- this will go into when the democrats take over the house. this problem will take a lot more than a wall to solve. it is a problem. but there is a lot of things that go into it.

i do not think a solid wall, the way he wants it, will solve anything. thank you for taking my call. host: homeland security secretary kirstjen nielsen appear for the house judiciary commission last week, here she is detailing the successes at the border. >> championed a border wall system to include infrastructure technology and more personnel, we are building a first new border wall within a decade and expanding replacement wall. walls work. where we have them, we are blocking illegal aliens from getting into our country. we need more, much more, from congress but if we do not get the resources we will use every available option to make sure we keep building. rise in theessed a apprehensions in the southern border including a quasi-percent increase in one year, we have implemented virtually every measure to end catch and release and keep as many illegal aliens as possible from being let go and to our country.

we have worked for the pentagon to deploy troops to the southern border, helping us achieve tens of thousands of apprehensions and turn backs and have dramatically increased referrals for prosecutions of single adults illegally crossing the border. we have launched a concerted effort to arrest criminal aliens with a focus on targeting violent gang members, resulting in a more than 10% increase in removals and arrests over the past year. today i can say that now nine in 10 aliens arrested are either a convicted criminal, have pending criminal charges, or are fugitives. we have worked with the northern triangle countries to counter of migrant smuggling and transnational criminals and the drug trade, we have stepped up efforts to protect women and children from being abused, kidnapped, sexually assaulted at avoided and doubled the agreements with local law enforcement and have ramped up efforts to combat opioids and are holding countries accountable.

these successes and much more are a testament to our devoted workforce and their unbending commitment to the rule of law. host: she was at the border met with and we -- officials in el paso to talk about some of the issues going on at the border. she will be at the border today as they talk about issues involving migrants and the health care done for them by the united states. let's go to larry from head to go, west virginia. a retired federal worker. caller: good morning, sir. i have been watching c-span since it came on the air. more so since i have been retired. i could care less about the shutdown. i think a wall is ridiculous. i have been laughing about that since this clown ran.

i look at it as a paid vacation. i have the money or i can live. i like those kind of times. i retired out of the washington, -- iarea and the general appreciated all that. i do not care about the shutdown. but i do not think we need a wall. i really don't. we need something like gun control. let's focus on important stuff, children who are starving and dying at the border. that is about all i can say right now. thank you for taking this goal. host: dennis calling from winston-salem, north carolina. dennis opposes the shutdown. caller: good morning. i am a disabled veteran. storm.urt in desert

i am against a wall because this country is built on people who came into this country and --ald trump went crazy about from differentng areas of the world for freedom. from countries who have been oppressed him war. i feel building this wall is the stupidest thing in this crazy one, we need, drones. yes, we do have a drug problem coming from the border. if we had more guards, they would not cut down on that. host: it sounds like you are

against the wall but for more border security. you do not think those things are equivalent? caller: i think it does but $5 billion, no. if we go for the amount that government will give him, yes. that is a good amount. that $5 billion, no, that is ridiculous. if he wants to spend it, stated on the military, do not pull troops out of syria and afghanistan. isis is still there. we have not cut off the head of the snake. you are looking at another 9/11. rochelleverse, texas, supports the shutdown. caller: good morning. i do support the shutdown because the president said he would take responsibility for it.

i am waiting for him to take responsibility for it. i am also supporting the shutdown because he said that mexico was going to pay for it. i am waiting for mexico to pay for it. that will not happen. people are called witt and actresses, one from connecticut fromth an accuracies, one connecticut said it is a terrible thing but what she does not know is there are people coming in through canada into the northeast who are setting up shop who are illegal. we had somebody call from north carolina talking about his about thehis concern policeman shot in california. talking about how the sanctuary cities were responsible for that but they are not. the sanctuary city -- whatever bill, does not say that the policeman cannot report these people to i.c.e.

i am a retired federal employee. from the veterans administration. i am also very concerned because , whoe moneys that this man is occupying the white house at this time, wants to put towards this bill. he knows nothing about history. he knows nothing about anything. host: were you ever furloughed? caller: never. never. that is one of the institutions that will never be furloughed. we pray for it but were never lucky enough to be a part of that. host: eddie is calling from the bronx, new york, he opposes the shutdown. eddie, good morning. caller: good morning. good morning. i oppose the shutdown. n children didala

not have to die and congress should investigate what happened to them. willnot think the wall stop anything, we can slow them down a bit, but what they will do, we will have to build a space for in brazil connecting it to french guiana and a futuristic railroad going to central, going to the united states and canada, maybe going to russia, that would bring down the severe economic disaster that has said central america. -- that has hit central america. you have a crime wave their the governments cannot handle. point do democrats need to worry about the fact that these federal government employees are being furloughed or having to work without pay?

how long do you say democrat should let this go on before it becomes too critical? caller: they got to make a plan to end this by middle or end of january. past february.o you have to come in with a plan and ended by january. host: what do they give up to compromise with president trump and the republicans? caller: you are going to have to put in more special agent's down there. more heavy drones to patrol the place. like i say, some form of barrier. we have to control the border. we cannot shut it down because we are economically tied with mexico, but we have to control the borders so we do not have an overflow when people try to rush in to get in.

we have laws in this country. cubae from guantánamo bay, and became a citizen in 1989. we have laws. nobody is above the laws. these people are not citizens and are not above the law. der: colleen calling from ry, new hampshire, you support the shutdown. caller: i do support the wall or a fence and want to point out, i have not heard anyone talk about the plan from charles schumer he will put forward in congress to assist on doris and -- on doris guatemala with getting their economy going in central america and also stopping corruption in the country. as be never seen successful but i would not support the bill, it is a

seven-year plan, starting with 2019 and $2 billion just for 2019. i am curious what charles schumer was support $2 billion for other countries but not support either some type of wall. thank you. ben callinggo to from springfield, massachusetts. he opposes the shutdown. caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call. i oppose the wall. -- i have beenny listening to the debate around this issue and was wondering how many people who give the opinion about the wall, but the border, who have ever been to the border or across the border. there is a fence now. people who have

gotten caught who come in illegally. the other part of that is, someone mentioned people cannot come on a visitor's visa and overstay, or a student visa or work visa and overstay. if you build a wall from san diego to brownsville, texas, , elr you leave new mexico paso, texas, west, southwest most corner of texas, that is where the rio grande is. it runs all the way to the gulf texas.co in brownsville, if you build a wall across from san diego to brownsville, what do you do about the pacific ocean? what do you do about the gulf of

mexico? how far out in the gulf of mexico will you build a wall? how far out in the pacific ocean will you build a wall? people can come in by vote -- boat. host: what is the solution to decreasing illegal immigration? before donald trump started campaigning and trying to separate people on the basis ,f some origin or other method some other manner, there was no problem. the problem with the illegal approachedas been starting with the obama giving moreon, officers to patrol the border and the number of border patrol byrds has increased

thousands in 2008 and nobody talks about it. the secretary of homeland security talking a while ago, she said everything was ok. but you still need a wall. talking about how efficiently the administration has dealt with either google crossings at the border -- with a legal crossings at the border and how effective ice. has been then why do you need a wall? the candidate and the president said that mexico will pay for it. there are people who believed that when he said it. theve heard members of republican party say it themselves. i hear people now trying to

explain how people will pay for it. a tariff is not mexico paying for the wall, that is a tax that will be paid by the producer or the marketers of products. earlier this month, border protection commissioner testified on border security and immigration reform and at the u.s.-mexico border. >> there has been a lot of confusion and some controversy ofr the supposed composition these recent caravans. the president has insisted that the caravan includes some very bad actors. ,hile a number of people including some commentators in our news media, have insisted that it is largely or at least

substantially composed of women and children. can you set the record straight? does the caravan includes some dangerous criminals? believe itent do you is a risk to our national security? >> thank you, senator. they caravans from mid-october coming to the united states border are different in many respects. , one thatravans happens annually in the spring, religiously organized and primarily about awareness, only 300 members of the caravan reached tijuana and the u.s. border. this group was different, the size was different, its composition, primarily single adult male, over 60%. unfortunately, the tactics they used at three international

borders, the way the injured guatemala, assaulted police, pushing past them, the way they assaulted the mexican federal police at the southern border, including throwing rocks and dismantling border infrastructure and ultimately crossing the river unlawfully and pushing past federal police when they asked him to regularize and register their presence in mexico before moving further. and the events of november 25, same group, sam aggression, same tactics. this concern was noted when they entered guatemala and why we touested assistance from dod prevent a mass rush from our point of entry to maintain security and safety of all involved. >> based on its composition and the behavior, you cannot look me

in the eye and say this group of poses no threat -- this group poses no threat? >> they clearly do. host: livingston from new hampshire. a retired federal worker. good morning. caller: good morning. i oppose the wall because the a wall -- the wall is not about american safety, it is about when they came, here they were legal, the , theeans, --illegal europeans. they did not include native americans or people of color and now they are afraid because they are afraid of losing the majority. that is the truth. tell desk foro

c-span to tell the history of -- theyed states gradually became the majority and may laws -- may the laws. the law. safety. is not about look at what the united states have done to most of those countries. they do not care about the leaders. as long as you can take the natural resources. america -- [indiscernible] let's go to dorothy in florida.

dorothy opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call and happy new year. i oppose the wall only because we are in the 21st century and i think there are more modern ways to do things, rather than build the wall. wallnk trump just wants a because he's is a spoiled brat, rich boy, who does not get his way and kicking and screaming, and people out of work are suffering. i am on social security and had to go one month without my social security check, if i did, i could not pay bills. i wish those people well. in addition to that, however, i think we make it too easy for people to come here because they do not have to learn the language because all of the businesses have one for english and two for spanish.

we did not do that when my mother came here from poland or people from italy or anywhere else that did not speak the language. they had to learn it and most of these immigrants do not learn the language. people who have been here for 30 years do not speak english. when my grandson was in college, he had a medical emergency and went to the emergency room. he had to pay the bill. if you were an immigrant, he would not have to pay any medical bills. that has got to stop. if you do not make it easy for them to come here, it may discourage some from coming. host: let's go to diane calling from austin, arkansas, she opposes the shutdown. caller: good morning -- she supports the shutdown. caller: good morning.

i support the shutdown. we are not working together for what is good for the sovereignty of the united states. we are having huge numbers of immigrants come over. year.topped 158,000 last you are talking about the population of memphis every six years. it is huge economical burden on this country. you have to have interpreters for all the schools, they can get food stamps, hospitalization. it does not have to cost our country like this. host: at what point would you say that they should stop immigration and when should they started back? this is a country built on immigration. caller: my people came here in 1680 and to the last caller, we

fought in all the wars and my people, in the revolutionary war, supplied food and militants for the that were fighting the british. if they would have gotten caught , they would have been hung for treason. i know american history. we sacrificed a lot. we need to have a border wall. they need to come in legally. laws are not upheld now with sanctuary cities, officers in those cities, it is against the law for them to communicate with ice. if they are looking for a criminal, they cannot give any information to isis to catch criminals. the government and the sanctuary cities, they are upholding those

be arrestedhould for obstruction of justice. host: kenneth calling from diamond, missouri. you support the shutdown. caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call. i support the shutdown because in the san diego area, on the news, it is stopped this illegal immigration 98%. that is where the border wall is finished. if we complete the wall all the very end upthe thing,it does the same stops all of the immigration down to where it is only 2% get through. i do not know why people are against this. host: you said that you think the wall that has been completed in san diego has stopped 98% of

the illegal immigration? caller: it has been on the news. host: which one? news and got it on fox they stated that 90% of the illegal immigrant -- 98% of the illegal immigration has been stopped in the san diego area. immigration,egal these people do not assimilate. should go back white in the almostwhen they stopped all immigration to make sure they assimilated. that is what needs to be done now. stop the immigration and let them assimilate into the population to be citizens of the united states. and make sure they learn english. they all must learn english. that is what we speak, not spanish and portuguese or some other language.

english. thank you very much for my call. host: john is calling from massachusetts. john opposes the shutdown. caller: how is it going? eventually, apparently people do not know the true history of this country and one of the purple dust people that called and had it correct, european descent have been coming here and control both sides of the world, this is a white supremacist power structure that has been going on for 400 years, you colonize all countries, you put dictators in, you overthrow them, you take their resources, you use them against them. this has been going on for 400 years and on top of that, i want to talk about religion. you have europeans that came here, whitewashed religions during the renaissance, and this is what the people think.

the original people that were here were genocide since going back to the russian to the germans. do not come over here saying that you do not want people over here because the people that are over here are from this side of the continent. you are the invaders, you came from europe 400 years ago and genocidal so-called place on both sides of the country -- on the backs of the people of color and this is the continuation of colonialism and imperialism by europe, the queen of england, and the united states. that is why colored people do not have a chance anywhere because you have been bombing them and now you turn it into a religious war. s of the bibleew are not in israel, those are converts, they have no blood tied to that country. host: alvin calling from houston, texas.

alvin supports the shutdown. good morning. caller: yes i do support the shutdown and if we allow democrats, they will have south america, mexico, everybody over here and we have to stop this, i do not care if it is alligators, crocodiles, whatever it takes to stop them from coming here. stop it. host: george is calling from michigan. he opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning. thanks for taking my call. , $5 i find ridiculous billion for the wall, they have e-verify, if all of the employers, that is a simple solution to a $5 billion canary for the wall. understand the animosity and the hatred to people south of the border for no reason at all.

merry christmas, i guess. [laughter] host: coming up, a military times reporter to talk about the top veteran stories of 2018 and later on day seven of our author series, featuring the most important books of the year and we will talk to an author about her book the view from flyover country. we will be right back. ♪ >> this weekend, c-span's cities tour takes you to santa monica, california. we highlight santa monica's literary life and history. today at noon eastern, a visit with journalist and author saul

rubin as he describes santa monica's culture, economy, and more. >> santa monica is a progressive southern california beach city. it is a major tourist destination, most well known for being a place where people may come to enjoy the day, be a tourist, and is also now a popular place for young tech companies. >> sunday at 2:00 p.m. eastern on american history tv, the author of "santa monica pier: a century on the last great pier"re pier: sarah's -- shares the history of this pier. life,ple of all walks of all income levels -- there are almost as many reasons to come to the pier as there are people

who come to it. if you ask people why they came, you will get a different reason from each one of them. noon easterny on on book tv and on american history tv sunday. "washington journal" continues. host: we are here with leo shane, the deputy editor of "military times" here in washington, d.c. we will talk about the past year in military and veterans issues. good morning. so let's start with current news. guest: it feels like a year's worth in the last two weeks. host: james mattis will wrap up his tenure monday. guest: yes. the deputy will take over january 1 day of quite the

--ople -- up people upheaval. host: so what were his successes and failures? guest: he leaves as a popular figure as defense secretary. he was beloved by the military. we had a poll that set up to 85% of military folks respected him. he was someone viewed on capitol hill as being an adult in the room, someone who moderated some of trump's more impulsive habits on military issues. he successfully got a larger military budget he has talked about needing to rebuild the military. we saw the military budget rise in fiscal 2018. but there was a fight between him and the president over his plan to withdraw troops from syria and afghanistan.

some of the ways the president has talked about foreign allies. so he leaves with a mixed legacy paid a lot of respect, but in terms of things he has accomplished and how much you moderated the president, we will president decides to undo the half steps and cautious steps mattis put in p lace, we will see if that disappears. host: you already mentioned this, but patrick shanahan comes in behind secretary mattis. what is that transition going to be like? guest: it will be interesting to see how long he is in the role. when secretary mattis announced his resignation, initially he said he would -- wanted to stay in place until the end of february 2 ensure a smooth transition. next year, we are going to have a new chairman of the joint chiefs, a fair amount of regular military turnover anyway.

thepresident, after reading resignation letter, did not like that plan and told secretary mattis he was getting out within a couple of weeks. now the deputy secretary is stepping in. he is known as someone who is high on talking about pentagon efficiency, about ways to cut waste at the pentagon, ways to make it run more like a business. he will be looking to put that stamp on the pentagon. the question is how long will you be there? -- he be there? we are not sure when the president will announce a nominee. we saw from the department of saga, whenfairs randy jackson was nominated and it ended up being two months of scandal -- controversy. so a lot of folks in the military community are hoping it will not be for months until we

have a permanent replacement for mattis. assuming that as someone who was not controversial. shanahan, heick got confirmation already. he is respected on capitol hill. but whoever comes up, there will be a ton of questions about the syria policy change, about strategy.oader there are a lot of issues to be worked out. we will see how that shapes military policy. host: we will put you on the spot. if not shanahan, who's up? guest: there are a lot of names. jack keene was one of the names thrown out. he has publicly said he is not interested in the job anymore. a lot of buzz around tom cotton.

there is a lot of controversy around him as well, at least with some of his colleagues and how he would go through the con permission process. heather wilson, the current air force secretary, could come the first woman to become defense secretary, but she has sparred with the trump administration over the creation of a new space force. the one thing we have learned from this administration is expected the unexpected. there are probably a few names out there that none of us in the defense reporting community have even thought about what the president is seriously considering. if you are making bets today, the best bet is patrick shanahan. we have seen the president put acting secretaries in and then eventually rollover that job to the permanent job. host: that's let callers join in. we have some special lines. we are going to have active military, so if you are an active military member, we want

you to call (202) 748-8000. veteran, retired military, we want to hear from you at (202) 748-8001. either oneot fit in of those categories, we have a line for you as well. we want you to call at (202) 748-8002. and you can always reach us on social media come on twitter, @cspanwj, and at facebook, facebook.com/cspan. the president went to visit the troops in iraq earlier this week. that was his first visit to troops in a combat zone. how are you hearing that night? guest: this was a point of controversy. earlier to pay respect to the troops and get a better understanding of what was going on. as many things do, with president trump, there was a fair amount of controversy. he made comments about military pay that were inaccurate when he

was there. there were concerns about units taking pictures with "maga" hats and trump re-election stickers. some of this is just a normal controversy that surrounds trump on just about everything. what we heard from a lot of the folks were saying that he needs to get over there was that it was good to get that out of the way, good to get perspective. and it is good to see troops -- for the troops to see that the commander-in-chief would offer that level of support. we will see if that is a one-off trip. we know president obama and president bush did not just make it a one-off thing. they wanted to show they were still connected to the troops and aware of that. but it was powerful symbolism for the folks serving to see someone that high up visit and pay their respects. host: you brought up a couple of the controversies, one, the "maga" hats. two, the military pay raises.

let's start with the pay raises. guest: with a military pay raises, the president -- this is an issue we have been tracking -- the president told the troops he has given them their first pay raise in 10 years. it is not true. the military gets pay raises every year. there are different ways you can flex it with how it compares to civilian pay raises and how much it can -- how much it keeps up with inflation. the president has been saying he thebeen giving -- given biggest pay raise in 10 years. he also seemed to imply he was pushing for a 10% pay raise this year. it would actually be 2.6%. there is no administration in the -- there is no evidence the administration have been pushing for 10%. so it is hard to parse out he got carried away with exaggeration. but it is a pattern that has developed since last may that we have been watching that now we

are starting to see a lot of administration officials repeat and trump supporters repeat. came intoe trump office, the military has not not in a pay raise in 10 years. well, the letter has been getting a pay raise since the 1980's. host: let's see exactly what the president said. [video clip] >> and you just saw that. you just got one of the biggest pay raises you have ever received. unless you do not want it. does anybody here -- is anybody here willing to give up the big pay raise you just got? raise your hand, please. i do not see too many hands. don't give it up. it's great. nobody deserves it more. you have not gotten more than one in more than 10 years. we got you a big one. i got you a big one.

there are plenty of people that came up and said we can make it smaller. we can make it 3%. we can make it 4%. i said no. make it 10%. make it more than 10%. it has been more than 10 years. more than 10 years. that is a long time. yourself outy put there. you put your lives out there. so congratulations. host: let's be specific. you are saying that trump's statement that it is the largest pay raise is -- guest: this is the largest pay raise in 10 years but this is not the first pay raise in 10 years and certainly not the first pay raise in more than 10 years. last air, there was a two point oh percent pay raise. raise.ar will be a 2.6% not -- i do not want any of our readers or viewers to get disappointed when they get their

check next year. it doesn't seem like something the president seemed -- needs to exaggerate. it is a good accomplishment, something republicans have been touting, that they have been able to provide enough military funding to provide a stable pay raise for troops. but they have gotten a pay raise every year for the last 30 some years. host: let's let some of our viewers joined the opposition. joseph is calling from san antonio, texas, a veteran. it morning. -- goo dmorning. caller: how are you doing? i am a vietnam veteran. i've been listening to c-span for a long, long time, when brian was there and everything. i just want to congratulate that to you guys. and i want to say that to be a veteran into the rational and what i am going to say is that i msnbc, and i also

listen to fox. two points i want to make. one, with fox, all they do on fox is have how the president loves the military. you get all the stories about the military, which i find repugnant. -- we find out a couple days ago that he had a doctor that gave him a deferment because hers just was renting from his dad some building. my point is i do not like the president speaking for all people in the military and all veterans. because that is just a lie. lies and lies. thank you for having this gentleman on tv. thank you. guest: thanks for the call. host: what veterans issues did

the president face this year? guest: real quick, for the caller, because he brought up this point of the military and whether they like trump or not, we have done some polling. we have seen mixed results. folks when a lot of they think of the military think of a monolithic conservative bloc. what we have seen in our reporting and polling is there are a lot of folks who have out trump and a lot of folks who support him and his issues. one of the rings his supporters left was the appointment of secretary mattis. it will be interesting to see whether or not his popularity goes up and down. on the issue of veterans issues, the biggest utterance issue of 2 waseterans issue of 2018 the firing or quitting of david shulkin.

upheaval, the new secretary comes in, robert wilkie over the summer -- he promised to clean up the department, put some of the drama behind. we entered this year sort of the same place we were last year, which is a lot of folks feeling good about the future of v.a., feeling like there have been a lot of improvements, but also keeping an eye on the white house, saying when will you inject more political drama? sydney,t's go to calling from louisiana, also a veteran. caller: i am a vietnam veteran. i want to say this privatization of the va hospital is destroying the v.a. hospital. host: in what way? caller: we no longer have the emergency room at the hospital.

we no longer have doctors at the hospital. you have to drive more than 40 miles to the v.a. hospital. you can go to the public doctor. notpublic doctor will accept us, because once you turn 65, you use that a care plus v.a. they are turning us down. the nearest person we can go see his 120 miles away in lafayette. my neighbor did not want to drive that 100 20 miles. he had to pay to have skin cancer removed off of his ear, because we cannot get any service. the young guys may still be getting service. i do not know. but these doctors are saying we will not take you because of your medicare. the are just destroying v.a. guest: this will be the big

issue to watch in 2019. last summer, the president signed into law the v.a. mission act. one of the provisions was a complete overhaul of the v.a. community programs, the programs that allow veterans to go to a local, private doctor instead of v.a. care. right now, they are writing the rules on how this will work. the devil is in the detail. veterans groups have said it is important to have more options and access, especially in areas where there may be understaffing at the va hospital. there is a lot of concern this will end up being a funding stream from the v.a. and a lot of the money will go to private doctors. you will get an entire class, generation, veterans who use doctors outside of the v.a. and do not have the same level of care and monitoring.

v.a.veteran goes into that doctor, they have familiarity with the wounds of war, agent orange issues, ptsd issues. someone in the private sector may not have that. a veteran mako in for something minor and will also complain they have trouble sleeping or work.focused in a v.a. dr. may be able to see signs of ptsd where a civilian doctor would not. this to be really drilled into in the coming months. how do we make sure the v.a. system is will a viable and that veterans have that as a first option before they just go to an outside doctor because of convenience or perceived

frustration with the v.a.. host: you jump to my next question, which is how will the house change affect the budget? guest: on the veteran's side, i think it will be less controversial. that has been a figure where both democrats and republicans have continued a steady increase in the v.a. budget. on the defense side, it will be more of a fight. the president is interested in a increase.on democrats say if you want to keep dumping money into defense, we need to have commiserate increase in other domestic priorities. either give more money for things like state department, forming security, for all of these other issues, or trim back defense. the incoming house armed services chairman, adam smith,

has said he sees a lot of areas where the u.s. could cut back on defense without accepting more risk than we already face. you will see how nasty it will get -- are we facing another shutdown problem at the end of the year, at the end of september, when the defense budget runs out? host: ivan is calling from california. good morning. know --i would like to all of these military people talk about the president. -- if all of these democrats do not like the way our country is being done, there are third world countries that will be more than happy to accept them into their arms. check andgive them a free medical and take care of them for the rest of their lives.

guest: you are allowed to have opinions in the military. we have not heard anyone speaking out directly against the president. you are allowed to express concerns and support for his policies. in the pool we did in the fall, we saw a lot of folks who have military love his policies, the buildup of the resources. a lot of folks right to us and i wish he would just put down his phone and stop tweeting. if you took the role more seriously in terms of staying focused on the job and less focused on public outcry and response. i think a lot of folks think the ,ilitary has this monolithic almost mindless, block that does what they are told. and getting to cover the military and veterans, we see a

lot of nuance and concerns. a lot of the same issues seen in the broader public. maybe definitely bent a little more conservatively, just based on our polling and exit polls. host: to bring this back around to the president's trip to iraq, where he also talked politics, about the border wall and handed out "maga" hats. what was wrong with that? guest: it remains to be seen if anything is wrong with that? the defense department will leave it to local commanders to decide. there are rules about politicking in uniforms. there are rules about displays that are seen as partisan in one way or another. hats ise signing of the something different than at least one soldier who held a trump reelection flag. that seems to be a politicking

push. i do not know if that is necessarily a mortal sin, but certainly the kind of thing where a commander should step in and say there are rules about politicking for one thing. if you hold up an american flag to celebrate the president, that is fine. if you hold up a trump flag, that comes across as something different. on the signing of hats, that will be left up to norm -- to local commanders to decide. the defense department has said they will leave it to local commanders, to let them sort out, and remind folks that the military is supposed to be seen as separate from politics. the commander in chief comes to any military facility, there are a lot of selfies and handshaking and autographs. i do not know that that part is unusual. trump has done a better job at branding himself and his campaign, so that brings with it

some other interesting twists. host: let's go to richard, calling from montreal, canada. good morning. caller: good morning. i want to know why mr. shane mr.n't want to report that obama fired secretary mattis. how come that is not being talked about? isn't that corrupt journalism? guest: i do not think that is corrupt journalism, but we can talk about it now. d outtary mattis was force of the obama administration, and president obama was criticized about some of that. different administrations, different policies. some of the credit that trump has gotten for ringing him back in seems to have gone out of the window with the way he forced m

attis out. mattis left a very respectful letter. will be interesting to see how president trump handles that in the months to come. if he decides to go after secretary mattis, as he has done against previous cabinet members sendyrical photos, it will shockwaves through the military. this is still a very respectful person in -- respected person in the military. he issident trump decides going to name call and pick apart secretary mattis, i think there will be a lot of folks in the military who will reevaluate where their support stands for the president. callingt's go to king, from baton rouge, a veteran. caller: good morning.

i am a volunteer for the veterans and military. i was against the draft. now, i am against the pay in the military. highest paid people in the world -- what is the wall without the wall. -- guest: military pay is always a tricky issue. it is hard to say that troops do not deserve it. it is hard to say you do not want to give them more. but there are a lot of issues with how you balance the budget and how you pay for defense. if we give that 10% pay raise to all troops this year, we would be looking at the budget ballooning significantly. i think it would be somewhere on the order of about $12 billion over the next five years in additional pay costs. dance thats at a

congress and the pentagon have to do. how to make sure that we are compensating these folks well, how to make sure they have g.i. joe bill benefits, but also how to do that in the environment where they have the best equipment and training and readiness. what we saw during the obama for many inersially the military community, was a discussion of pulling back military pay. aybe making military pay go little below where it should be based on the calculations and on the private sector or formula. for three years straight, military pay raises were half a percentage point below what other folks in the private sector would have been expected to get. that created somewhat of a pay gap and infuriated a lot of people in the military, saying you are balancing the budget on the back of military troops.

congress and to get more money. we will go ahead if that is something democrats want to do. -- we can provide better support programs. those are important and how we compensate troops as well. host: let's get one more question in from donna, calling from virginia. good morning. caller: i just have a question or two. it seems like everyone is again, president trump, for whatever little reasons they can find, like signing his hats, bone spurs orhas whatever. why does nobody ever talk about obama, never served? i am really curious why. lot abouttalked a

this. i would encourage you to read more "military times" and more newspapers. president obama is not president now, so he gets a lot less coverage than the current president. but we have written quite a few stories about the trend of military service in our presidential candidates, who have served, who have not. there are a lot of folks who have a lot of respect for the military, have a lot of respect for that service, and feels like it brings a little better perspective on foreign policy issues and national security issues. there are a lot of people who push back and say that should not be the only qualification. we have seen the number of presidential candidates, especially this last cycle, who actually served drop to a small percentage. we are seeing the number of veterans decrease in congress, almost every cycle. move to an all

volunteer army, there are few people who served. an unblessed -- and unless there is another vietnam that creates a widespread draft, we will not see the level of the 1970's, where upwards of 70% of congress served at some point and all presidential candidates had been there. it is an issue. i do not know that president extra is getting criticism. the way he got his deferment at the time is controversial. president obama was not old enough to be eligible for the draft, so that is not an issue that is there. there is quite a lot of talk about both president bush's s ervice. and president clinton, when asked about the don't ask, don't tell law, got tons of criticism for not having experience.

thank leoould like to shane, deputy editor of "military times" for being with us this morning. coming up, day seven of authorgton journal's" series. we will talk to sarah kendzior about her book, "the view from flyover country." ♪ >> tonight at 8:00 eastern, conversations with three retiring members of congress. andr roskam, john duncan, mike coffman reflect on their time in congress. >> we go on our devices and what things weekly. 14 jefferson wrote this years after he wrote the declaration of independence. he said the ground of liberty is to be gained by inches. we must be content what we get time for -- time to time and

internally press forward. it takes time to persuade men, even if it is for their own good. my point is we need to culturally step back and say these things take time. >> to think that we have spent trillions on these wars and that the war in afghanistan has been going on 18 years -- i think it is ridiculous. i think, also, these wars and our foreign policy has caused us to have more enemies than we would have had. they have done more harm than good. >> in the congress of the united states, in the house of representatives, even with the reforms that nancy pelosi's mydged to accept, based on counterparts, i believe there is too much power and -- in too few hands.

i fear that is not going to change. >> watch conversations with the trying members of congress tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span and c-span.org and listen with the free c-span radio app. "washington journal" continues. of thet is day seven author series, eight days featuring what we think are the most important books of the year. joining us to talk about her book, "the view from flyover country," is author send -- author sarah kendzior. good morning. tell us why you decided to write this book. guest: the book is a collection of essays, most written between 2012 and 2014. they touch on all kinds of issues. economic issues, social, political. the thing that holds them together is the collapse of institutions and the erosion of

social trust. that is something america experienced in a profound way after the recession in 2008. host: i am from mississippi. you are in st. louis. what exactly is flyover country? guest: the term "flyover country" is usually used in a pejorative way by people who live on the coast who imply that where we live is not really worth talking about, not worth investigating. it is where you "fly over." in my book, i talk about what it is like to live here. it is not a monolith. you are talking about the majority of american space. we have cities, we have rural areas. there is a perception that everyone who lives here is an elderly, white, trump supporting former manufacturer or farmer. you find that same kind of diversity as you find on the coast it and you find the same

problems, only inverted. in big coastal cities, you have justification and high costs of living taking a toll, where i live you see abandonment, apathy, a lack of jobs and opportunity. if there is one thing that holds "flyover country" together, it is the collective feeling of abandonment. the feeling that people only come here if there is a disaster, a hurricane, and election, a riot. not --se, people who do people do not seem to care if we live or die. you: in your subtitle, enter the forgotten american. what do you mean by that? i think it applies to most americans. what we see as a country, particularly since the recession and since the war in iraq and other issues, is a lack of

opportunity. an inability to move forward. a sense of abandonment. a sense that things are not holding, that there is nothing for folks even if they have done well in their lives. something about children denying chances. it is the cost of higher education soaring. things like unpaid internships and labor he had a kind of pay to play economy becoming the norm. over and over, we are told this will change. we will go back to "normal." the newately, this is normal. the recession, the restructuring , also the restructuring of our values and what people expect out of american life. i think this open and a place for somebody like donald trump, a classic demagogue, to come in. he exploded real pain and

vulnerability. although i take trump in this book and other places, that pain is real. it is shared by people from all sorts of different backgrounds and regions. so this idea of the "forgotten people was quote encompasses much of the country as a whole. host: we heard some of that same conversation from claire mccaskill as she left the senate, talking about not forgetting rural america. are these the same kind of people? guest: no. i would make that category broader. i think claire mccaskill forgot about st. louis when she was campaigning. it is a city. a majority black city. focus on white, rural workers are someone who was forgotten, while it was accurate in describing the pain those workers experienced and the necessity at looking at their problems, that should also apply to a place like st. louis.

when i look at my state, when i look at missouri, i see all of us in this together. ural manufacturing workers and farmers being hit by things like the trade crisis, facing the same denial of opportunities. i see st. louis, which has undergone decades of decline, facing the same problems it has in terms of the loss of jobs, the loss of civility. life. of erosion of civic we are in this together. unfortunately what is governing is is a gop legislature pummeled outsidemoney, by influencers. it is not serving the public, not looking out for the people. everyone in missouri deserve someone -- something better than that. host: one of the things i've noticed in reading your book is -- letere does not seem me just ask you the question.

how much influence do people in flyover country have on the political situation in the country, how much influence do they have in washington, d.c.? guest: that is a great question. on an individual level, people who live where i do tend to be ignored. by also apply that to anybody who does not have a lot of money living in a battered, blue-collar city on the coast as well. overlooka tendency to the big power players that come out of this region. people like the koch brothers and other powerful families putting money into politics and directing things. those folks have an inordinate influence. one of the things that have changed is the geographic dispersion of powerful industries now posted on the coast. you have seen gutting of a lot of fields, one of them media. so now journalism is conducted by people living in l.a., new

in san francisco, some of the most extensive cities in the country. d.c. as a center of political power. entertainment.of the capacity of people to take part in this economy, but that is not what has happened. they have conglomerate it to the coast. have to be able to pay for college, live in a place where you are paying $3000 a month or an apartment. that locks out a majority of americans, looting americans from middle-class or lower-class -- including americans from middle-class or lower-class backgrounds. host: we will open up regional

phone lines. if you live in an eastern or central time zone, we want you to call (202) 748-8000. that is for the eastern and central time zones. if you are in the mountain or pacific time zones, we want you to call in at (202) 748-8001. for the mountain and pacific time zones, that is (202) 748-8001. and we are always reading on social media. if you want to shoot a something on twitter, we are @cspanwj. and on facebook at facebook.com/cspan. chapterdevote an entire or to the postemployment economy. tell us exactly what that is and how that affects the average worker. guest: basically what we have seen is the erosion of jobs. you can trace this in certain injuries -- industries, like manufacturing, back to the reagan era. internship,this temporary jobs, fellowships, positions that last one or two

years that do not offer benefits. faith and justod move from one precarious position to the other without actually being able to build a career, get savings, except for this rarefied class. this gets worse and worse as time goes on. i first started writing about this in 2012. six years later, we are dealing with the same problem. the same folks who cannot find a , they are still struggling. these side doing hassles to survive. that is just a chatterjee -- that is just a tragedy. a leads to a lot of pain and instability. it leads to people being unable future, a way forward. unless we remedy this in some we willo not know where

go. this leads to plutocracy. all of this fits together. these are not several things. so i am a bit anxious in what we will see ahead. host: you read about social safety net programs. what did you see going on with those programs when you started writing and has anything changed since then? guest: awareness of the problem has changed. i wrote so many of these essays five to six years ago. people thought i was crazy one i talked about things like the need for a higher minimum wage or simply saying that economies not good, not working for people. what we had heard is that the economy had recovered. maybe it did recover for some folks, but it certainly did not recover for me and not for most people i talked to. most people were living on the edge. basic social safety

net programs cut, that is more catastrophic now than it was 10 or 20 years ago, because the cost of those programs have skyrocketed, of health care, childcare, childbirth, education. all of these things. people look at them as luxuries, but they are necessities, particularly if you are a parent. you do not have the option of just opting out of this way of life. you have to provide for your family and are the most vulnerable. on the whole, it is the most vulnerable americans who have been hurt. it is the children, the elderly, veterans. people who have sacrificed or people in to precarious a position to hold their own in such an un-'s pathetic economic climate. sympathetic

economic climate. host: let's go to allen. caller: what do you think about the fact that obama's health plan has totally destroyed america, in my opinion? month $3000 or $4000 a for medical. few can afford that amount of money. what has really destroyed america is the fact that greed that doctors have and the medical field, the pill pushes. pushers.- the pill what is your opinion on that? guest: i think there is a lot of corruption in the medical field. i think that is one of the reasons we have an opioid epidemic. the biggest dealer is your local walgreens. in terms of health care, obamacare is a plan that has obama's name but was enacted

differently in different states and was enacted and effectively in many states. it is true that, for many folks, the cost went way up. another places, it went down. it varies person to person. we need a more comprehensive plan that allows everybody to get health care. i do not think of health care as a privilege. it is a right, a necessity. what we need are for people to not be so defensive when folks like yourself are critiquing obamacare. the reality is it hit a lot of people hard financially. work,t why didn't this who was responsible for the fermentation? it was passed by obama and devised by him with good intentions. why did it fail in certain respects and how can we improve it? that is something we need to discuss now. we have people doing gofundme's

for health care, for funerals. that is a terrible sign of the state of this country, that people have to resort to things like that. host: kendrick, colin from michigan. good morning. caller: good morning. we have seen the democratic party moving way to the left. i am wondering if flyover country is going to stay like trumpnd is president going to be reelected if democrats do not move to the center? guest: interesting question. i will give an example of a paradox i am seeing. in our last election, missouri looks on paper like it moved to the right. we used to have a more split legislature. we had mccaskill and then roy blunt. now, it is almost entirely republicans and josh hawley won.

on the surface, it looks like missouri is moving right. but we had propositions for a higher minimum wage, the protection of labor unions, medical marijuana, and a bill that is supposed to clean up dark money and corruption in politics. those all passed in massive measures. people supported these initiatives, which would be labeled as progressive, more left-wing initiatives. i feel like these labels are detrimental. it is more important for people to just talk about the issues and say what will this bill mean for my life, for my community? instead of saying i want this because this is what democrats or republicans want. that is not helpful. these things affect our lives. unless you are incredibly wealthy, you are not immune from any of these. going forward, that would be the most beneficial thing for the democrats do.

talk in a straight ordway about what kind of policies they want to pass and try to get away from these labels. another thing that has changed since 2008 is a majority of americans are independent, unaffiliated voters. i think it shows how these labels do not currently fit our reality. think listening to people's problems, being receptive to people's pain, taking it seriously, coming up with a plan to solve it -- that is there job -- their job. host: one of the sec wrote was about the downfall -- one of the essays you wrote was about the downfall of the shopping mall. a lot of the shopping malls i grew up with in mississippi are now gone he had some of the shopping most in washington, d.c. are now gone. guest: the shopping mall replaced downtown. i do not remember a time when

downtown and downtown shopping was a ring. that all happened before i was born. that is a story my parents and parents -- my parents and grandparents told me. but the mall has now been replaced by online shopping, by corporate conglomerations like amazon. what you are seeing is a retail crisis. you are seeing a loss of jobs in that sector. you also see the loss of them all as a public -- the loss of the mall as a public space. when that is all you have, that is where you see people in the community, where you can get a job. that is where i worked when i was younger and needed money. that loss is a big deal. in 2013.hat back the situation with retail has gotten much worse. think, in terms of how people

experience the economy -- the economy is not strong. the economy is not the same thing as the stock market, although that has also taken a hit. people are still feeling the same economic pain as 10 years ago. it will just keep increasing because of automation and because of things like amazon, which have removed jobs from different localities and put them into warehouse structures. it is a big social and economic change. dee, callingo to from florida. caller: good morning. love you to death, jesse. this is for the young lady. i will try to be as spiteful as i possibly can. but she has done nothing but complain and wine about -- everything coming out of her mouth, she has this book, but

she is more like a complainer rather than telling what is going on in the country. i would appreciate it if you would look more adult and not like a little girl. guest: that is an accurate commentary. called inessay is defense of complaining. this is not the first individual to say this kind of commentary about me. i think complaining is pointing out problems in the hope that things can be fixed. if you do not tell what the problem is, if you do not identify it, it never gets solved. complaining is a form of compassion. i do not complain in order to call people out and meet people feel bad. i do it because i would like to see things get better. other folks will not necessarily step up and call this out. i think we have over the last few years a culture of complaint that i think is healthy. a burst oflly is is

civic activism and awareness. of people saying i deserve better than that, innocent people deserve better than that, my neighbor deserves better than that. in order to make that point, you need to complain about it. so i am not ashamed to have done so. you talk of the things about a lot is the plight of unpaid interns. what draws you to that issue, and what factors could lead to changes in that unpaid internship system? internshipunpaid issue something that has improved a little bit since i first wrote those essays. it is certainly brought up more. andsee people in congress others deciding to pay issues, usually after a lot of low back. again, if you complain, you may actually see results. what bothers me about the concept of unpaid internships is the thought that this is

something you need to do. you are paying corporations to work for them. it is supposed to work the other way around. it locks out the majority of the american population, especially when most jobs are conglomerate is in very expensive cities. most people, especially young people 18 to 25, they do not have that kind of income to go internship inpaid policy or media. those are influential industries. so you end up with individual industries hiring from a narrow part of the american public, from people who have inherited wealth, who have limited experiences in their own life, which is important when you are working in policy or media. you are deciding what stories to tell, deciding what narratives are important. when you only pick from a small pool of people, that is detrimental to the country as a whole.

host: let's go to robert, calling from north carolina. good morning. caller: good morning. if you really want things to get better in this country, you need more limited government, especially at the federal level. i am sure as a leftist -- not a liberal, i am sure you are a leftist. i think you want the federal government to take over more control, more power, make decisions for americans. if you want to follow the constitution, you have the right to life, liberty, and everything else, you have to earn. it is not a right to have health care. you got to earn it the estates need to have more control and get the federal government out of it. this is a diverse country. we need decisions to be decided at the state level. thank you. guest: thank you. you are right in that i disagree with you. i think some things are rights. health care is a right, education is our right. on the other hand, what i do not like is wastefulness in

government. i think something should be controlled by the federal government, other things by the state. what i am seeing everywhere is this reckless, irresponsible spending. i am seeing inflated salaries, projects that are not completed, like decaying infrastructure. we all use roads and bridges, all use things like the 911 system, which went down for 37 states yesterday. that is a crisis situation. we need a federal government on top of it. what i do not like our pet projects or people spending millions of dollars for things that go nowhere. what we really need is responsibility. we need accountability and transparency in how different divisions of the government are spending our money. we do not have that now, especially with the trump administration. they have been hiding things in

their budgets, taking things off of websites. we definitely need to turn that around if we are going to get the kind of government we deserve. to highers turn education. i want to read a little bit of what you wrote. for upper-class parents, the college admissions process has become a test of loyalty. what you spend, what values will you compromise for your child to be accepted? four lower class parents, admissions is -- students,dle are the stranded players in a rig game -- rigged game. thatis the best way college admissions can help in the current economy? guest: what we have seen is a rise of credential is in. it is basically purchased merit. people describe -- disguising

wealth as merit, where in reality they have parents who s.a.t. for things like tutors, waste a pad applications and get you in there. the thing that frustrates me is the number of jobs that require a college education, and the skill set did not change. what has changed is people just want that piece of paper or they refuse to train people. one thing i wish would happen is corporations would stop requiring a college degree. it is obscenely expensive, in most cases, unnecessary in many cases -- there are all beastly jobs that you need a college degree for. i am not against college as the commission of knowledge and learning. ideally, this is a great thing. ideally this is something that improves young minds and prepares young people for not just the workforce but the world. i do not really see that.

when i talk to college students, they are worried about the money they are spending, they are worried about the prestige of the institution they attend and how job employers will respond to it. i think there are -- there is too much emphasis on that. that is often a financial decision. people go where it is cheaper or where they get a scholarship. it is not a decision. it is our reaction to the situation and their experiences. it does not reflect merit anymore than someone like jared kushner buying his way into harvard. that is the kind of stratified society we have laid out. i wish people would stop judging each other over whether and where they went to school and i wish companies would stop judging applicants by the same criteria. host: what jobs do you think now require a college degree that should not and how should we change the admissions system to be fairer?

guest: all sorts of jobs. you can look at secretarial or office work, which often requires personal assistant type of work. you can look at manufacturing. my grandfather started out working in a factory as an assembly line, and he worked his way up to where he was inventing mechanical parts. when my uncle went to work for that factory, he god only knows what happens now. even though both are talented men, i don't know if either would be hired. i have seen this requirement sometimes in the services industry. department stores, every now and then, someone will send me and ad that requires a degree. we've been struggling since the recession to keep up and they don't have this extra money to put into higher education,

especially when that is not necessarily the career path they want to take. not everybody wants to be a doctor or lawyer, not everyone wants to learn to code. that is fine. people should be able to pay their bills whether or not they are willing to shell out for this extremely expensive credential. host: richard calling from washington, d.c.. good morning. caller: hi, sarah. i love your complaining. don't let anyone get you down. in the vietnam war era, watergate, those kinds of things. my generation, we made some mistakes -- we lost our way a bit. thisl like we've seen all before.

we should make sure this doesn't happen again. guest: thank you for calling. . i agree with you. i remember as a kid, my parents people me they felt learned their lessons from watergate about government corruption. we learned the lesson from vietnam, we would never get in a quagmire of a war that brought down the country where so many lives were lost. obviously, we haven't learned those lessons. i remember my grandparents telling me about the great depression, praising fdr saying we have programs, people working on poverty to improve it and help people suffer less as a society. sometimes, i feel like we have

all these problems at once in our era, a battered economy, a corrupt government, an uncertain situation with the military. it is a very frustrating time, a very painful time. we can really do is try to call out these problems in an honest and compassionate way. i'm not expecting things to get easier or less painful. what i have seen in the last few years are people waking up to this, feeling this civic obligation, a genuine concern for those who are less fortunate. people aren't taking things for granted anymore. away,our rights are taken you don't take them for granted. it's encouraging for me to see people rise up even though the situation is more dire. that is the first step. that is having common sense, being pragmatic, being a good

and compassionate citizen. that any choice individual can make. host: tom calling from idaho. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking a call from the flyover state of idaho. sarah, god bless you, you make me crazy. we do not have a right to health care. right to force me to pay their medical bills. this entitlement group of people we've raised in this country acting like the world owes them something like the government can fix it for them -- folks, it is your responsibility to take care of your life and your family, to work hard and take care of others around you. the federal government is a

wasteful bureaucracy taking our freedom by putting on layer after layer of rules, regulations, creating this unrealistic expectation that the government can somehow fix your problems. full up your boots, get to work and handle your business. god bless you and have a good day. guest: thank you. again, i think health care is a right not a privilege. people don't choose to get sick, they don't choose to have children who are sick. people who get older don't choose to need government o helpance to nee them get through life. there's a bit of a lack of compassion assuming everyone has the ability to pull themselves up by their bootstraps. a two month old in the hospital isn't going to be able to do that.

can't do itns because of the cost of health care. there's a lot of fault on the medical industry, this corporate conglomerate of health care and its total lack of response ability. -- responsibility. a lot of folks want more transparent bureaucracy without this redtape, without all these hurdles to jump through. found signing up for obamacare as an onerous process. sick, ifamily gets someone you love gets sick or has a disability, you will want someone to look out for them. you have people who do work hard and want to work hard but don't

have the ability to get a job. they are in a terrible situation. it is common sense, it is the right thing to do to help people get support. if they can't get it from their employer, can't get it from the health care industry, it does fall on the federal government to do that. i don't feel bad saying that at all. host: one of the things you talk about and one of your essays, you think the term "muslim world" should be eliminated. talk about what you think we shouldn't use the term "muslim world." guest: that was a term used during the war on terror in the early 2000's. uzbekistan,studying a muslim majority country from the former soviet union.

i spent a lot of time in that part of the world. i used to live in turkey. there is diversity in the , different ways of practicing it, people with different beliefs, it's the exact same thing in the muslim world. neither of these worlds actually exist. there is doctrine and practices that many people share, but they vary by cultural context, they vary by country. world" was muslim treated as as much of a diverse place as any other religion would be. as we have begun talking about other issues, the rise of autocracy and fascist movements and white supremacist movements, we have moved away from this and list them in his asian -- this

endless demonization of muslims -- i wish people would choose their words with care and respect for diversity and the variety of human experience. host: frank calling from utah. good morning. caller: good morning. i live in flyover country. i appreciate what you've been saying and i support you in so many ways. however, i have a couple of comments. earlier in the program, you were making a comment on how political parties insert things ratheris certain banner than talking about issues and you thought that was counterproductive. i don't feel like health care is a right. you -- ie same page as

suggest we make more headway if we stated we all needed to work on our democracy and work together to try to put into place a good enough health care program where people were covered. claim itisive to just is a right. it falls into the same category you are talking about earlier. guest: i think that is a good point. the way you phrased it probably would resonate more broadly. that is definitely something to think about. generally speaking, these binary categories don't often go over so well. just stating what policy you work, those would

are the methods of debate or persuasion that might get you places. host: tom calling for massachusetts. good morning. caller: good morning. i'm calling because you are -- i'm not cared about. , low income my life i went tof i retire, social security and they said i can only collect social security if i work. it's unfair, it is criminal. i have to keep on working. i've been working for almost six decades now. note, you haveke i protect the constitution,

should be treated equal like everyone else. we created social security for providing an income for people 65 years and older -- once i retire, every cent will be taken away from me. that's what i'm living off of now. rent.sn't even pay my -- i'm my food and bills not part of democracy, i'm not treated equal at all there. it is complete discrimination. nobody in the country cares. to politicians are supposed protect my rights to be treated equal.

i'm in my sixth decade of work. i'm old. i can't go no more. i'm breaking down. it's depressing. howink about it every day, i'm being treated differently and not equal. itre's a law that does this, takes away my rights to be treated equal. guest: thank you for calling. i hope people are hearing out what you are going through. folks especially in the last 10 years are going through the same thing. your retirement has been taken away, you are forced to work endlessly, the cost of living has skyrocketed. you are not alone in this. wereh fewer people going through this experience.

it is clear from your call that it is a painful one. i'm sorry you have to go through this. we need reform in this way and we need people to address this is happening. we need people to stop bragging about the economy being so good or democracy just naturally institutions or naturally upholding themselves because that is not happening. they are breaking down and letting people down in the process. they're letting people down who work hard all their lives. they deserve more than they've been given. host: one of the issues you take on in your book is free speech. i'm going to read a little bit about what you said. in the summer of 2012, thousands of people took to the streets to protest a repeat assault on their religion.

-fil-alking about chick fli those forced to live in countries without free-speech no one of the greatest values is that it allows citizens to speak the truth about their situations. free speech means the right to offend and the right to defend. talk a little bit about that. thet: especially nowadays, we can free speech is say whatever we want and you are not supposed to complain in response, you are not supposed to defend the people being attacked. that is untruthfully categorized as a form of censorship. i have lived in or worked with statesfrom authoritarian

who would love the level of free speech we have in america. sentences orveiled code. free speech is nothing to take for granted. when we have a political culture that is increasingly dominated by lies and slander and hate speech, of course you should defend yourself and correct the lies and call people out for endangeringrs, other people's lives with conspiracy theories. that's also a form of free speech. needwe talk about it, we to think about why people value it. they arerally not that able to baselessly smear other people or be baselessly smeared by other people.

people want to be able to speak the truth and talk back to people in power and detailed the conditions of their lives -- detail the conditions of their lives. no one should take this for granted. there are so many countries in this world that could never have a show like this, they could never have different points of view and me here shooting my mouth off. it is a gift and a right and something we should speak about. host: let's go to christine calling from rhode island. good morning. caller: good morning. good morning, sarah. i was just calling because everything you are saying is so true. you.: thank caller: good morning. i think i got disconnected there for a moment.

i think everything you are saying is so true. i'm living through it. we are just barely making it now with the raises of the rents. my landlord said he's increasing our rent $120. my husband worked for a company for 17 years. they got rid of senior staff and -- my daughter worked for a corporate company, cvs, they outsourced her and wanted her to go to the philippines to train. they gave her a severance pay and sent the whole department on their way. job and then they want you to pay a $900 co-pay,

you don't have the money. ,he companies that hire you they hire you at 32 hours so they don't have to pay benefits. it is a mess. i'm so happy you are on the show. andare speaking the truth that is part of our freedom of speech. we do have a right. as far as the government shutting down, the bipartisanship in our white house right now is shameful. they should have stayed in the house, debated it and came up with a decision because this is all a campaign propaganda thing again. we have to get to the bottom. these people need to stay in the house. they are getting paid. guest: thank you for sharing your story.

this brings a lot of issues -- ageism and corporate culture. so many companies will cut off withoutking hours giving you benefits. working people are nearly a full-time job or two of these kinds of jobs to pay their bills and still not getting benefits. i'm not sure you can work harder than that. the government shutdown is very frustrating and frightening. i have an essay in the book about the previous government shut down in 2013. which was different than the shut down i endured go and rub -- endured growing up. what you have now is a lack of leverage among the public, a feeling that politicians can get away with absolutely anything,

an apocalyptic vision from our "leaders" about where this country can go. there's this vulture like aspect to it. if things crash and burn, certain people are able to profit over that instability. people are not thinking about politics, not thinking about holding their representatives accountable. it's a frightening time. i hope your situation improves. host: how do you address the issue of racial tension in your book? guest: in a very forthright way, i hope. that's another misapprehension about the term "flyover country." they think this is a whites only kind of place. decades, has had

centuries of racial strife and inequality. we have a systemically racist country, a country founded on the taking of native american lands and slave labor, followed by jim crow laws and internment camps. and theook at trump powerful individuals supporting him and think this is a new phenomenon. unfortunately, this is part of the american fabric. it's a direction we've been trying to move away from overtime with the civil rights act and the voting rights act, which was partially repealed in 2013, and is now getting worse. you cannot separate the issue of race from any other issue i discussed in this book. you cannot separate it from the economy or politics or voting. racism is the original american sin and it is still something

people are struggling to remedy. they are not making a move to remedy it in this current government. citizens to behe responsible and learn history, the actual history of the united states and recognize the patterns, how one decade moves .nto another a lot of white people are learning the hard way that this was not the case. host: tina calling from milwaukee. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for c-span. such a mighty young woman. you are talking about experiences i've had. i'm 81 years old, i came from mississippi, i am a professional, i have a grown son who is an executive with a company, but my grandchildren

are fighting what you're talking about. they are college graduates, they work hard, they are dealing with part-time jobs, no benefits. when people call in and speak about we don't want to give people help, i pay my taxes, i don't want to be taking care of someone else's health, that is such an affront to the human nature, it takes my breath away. there's a lot of racism, people are just mean and getting meaner. thank you so much for your book. i will buy it and pass it around the family and let them know that people are struggling and you are going to be struggling, young people, because these people have the mindset of not thinking about you, they are helping their coffers gain more power and more money and you are

losing and there will be slavery, but it won't be black people only. god bless you and i hope you continue to get the message out. guest: thank you very much. ae thing that has happened, lot of people have internalized this idea that if they have fallen on hard times, if they are lacking something in their life, it must be their fault. that message has been hammered time inple from memorial -- we've seen this economic restructuring where a lot more people are falling into the category of having to work part-time jobs, not being able to get by on a day-to-day basis. that's a majority of people. able tower group benefit from this structure.

fault, you arer in a growing and sinking boat of fellow americans who are also suffering in this way. it is not a reflection of your worth, your ability, your merit. we have a lot of people who are very talented and hard-working who would love to have a full-time job. they would love to be able to work at the things they are good at. they cannot pay their way through the door. that's a tragedy for them on a personal level and it is really detrimental to our country. up andlthiest will rise everybody else gets crushed. ronald calling from vallejo, california. good morning. caller: good morning. i was born and raised in vallejo. right now, i'm calling you from

torrance memorial hospital. wagek here as a minimum valet. this christmas morning, i came ill, and here i am. i don't have any insurance. so, it is on me. going to cast dispersions of blame on anyone. i live in the state of california, born and raised here, and i tell people i'm amazed at what the state was when i was a little boy and seeing what it has become. you are the type of to four could talk hours. -- for hours. it is a privilege.

i'm sitting in this hospital bed and it is a privilege. -- i have a friend i've known since can the garden -- since can the garden -- since kindergarten who is an ophthalmologist. until they can snap their fingers and create doctors out of a cloud of smoke, it is a privilege. is's pushing 60 and she still paying on her student loans. i hold out hope, however. have you heard how the university of new york was the first one to step over the line and say are medical doctors, students are free tuition? did the same thing and eliminated student loans on anyone else who went to medical school that owed them.

the money is there. these institutions are megaliths of money. this is on the left and right. theyeft is more emotional, take me off more -- tick me off more. the last part of what he was saying, it's true that all these universities are megaliths of money, they are places that can afford to lower their tuition to make it accessible for more people. one thing i'm wondering about, the generation that became saddled with enormous debt, whether for undergraduate or graduate education, are now old enough that they have children, they have teenage children applying for college and they are still paying off their own debt. debtll have this cycle of

and inability for people to pay their way or help their children pay their way. this whole thing is going to blow up. this has been a bubble for a long time. we are seeing incredible frustration, we are seeing college debt forgiveness becoming part of mainstream political campaigns. people can't take it anymore. the money is there, just not there for us, for normal folks. eventually, this will implode in people's faces. host: we would like to thank sarah kendzior for a great conversation about her book, "the view from flyover country." thank you for spending time with us today. guest: thank you for having me. host: coming up next, is the government shutdown worth it over the border wall? shutdown,port the

202-748-8000. if you oppose, 202-748-8001. government workers, call 202-748-8002. this week on newsmakers, two house democrats will chair committees and 2019. from the interviews you can see in full tomorrow at 10:00 a.m. and 6:00 p.m. on newsmakers. >> the first priority we have is an important one, to resolve the spending limits for the fiscal year 2020 budget. law under thehe budget control act of 2011. defense spending would be cut by 11%. nondefense spending cut by 9%. those are pretty dramatic cuts. one,is item number

negotiate new caps. pass ahat, we will budget resolution that reflects democratic values and the promises we made during the campaign. we are going to deal with health care costs and creating jobs through infrastructure. >> what will the numbers look like for health care? >> i'm not sure exactly what the numbers will look like right now. one of the things we need to do because we have a diverse caucus with 66 new members, we need to consult with all of them to see what their priorities are. >> my priority is infrastructure, helping working families, education, health care, making life better for working people in this country. >> how will things be different from the republicans? >> i would hope we can get bipartisan support. if we don't, i will move ahead

and make sure we are making those investments that really affect working people in our country. >> explain why the appropriations process is set up the way it is. can you meet the deadline of passing 12 spending bills that the appropriations committee has not been able to get to the floor for a vote in many years? >> there's no question that we can pass 12 appropriation bills. there are sixive, that have not been passed yet that are ready to go, bipartisan. the one on homeland security, there seems to be some discussion with the white house. >> "washington journal" continues. host: we are doing open phones, going back to our original question of the day.

we are on government shutdown day number eight. is it worth it over the border wall? if you support the shutdown, call 202-748-8000. if you oppose the shutdown, call 202-748-8001. we want to hear your opinion, 202-748-8002. let's go to john calling from virginia. >> good morning. thank you, c-span. i oppose the whole thing. it's a political stunt by our celebrity apprentice president. it's all about politics, which --s said he's campaigned on he said in the office the other day he would be proud of a

now, he is trying to blame everybody. the man is in over his head. host: how long should democrats hold out? how long do they hold out before saying it's not worth it? caller: both sides are using wrong. a tool, which is the president is wrong all the way around on all of this. nothing is going to save us. there's no caravans coming after us. sean hannity is running our country. host: let's go to steve calling from cleveland, ohio. steve supports the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning, c-span. i support the shutdown.

we ought to outsource all these federal workers, school teachers and all, and get rid of them. host: you think the federal government should be privatized? caller: i think they should outsource it. is his fascism. rooseveltt dictator, -- we just print money. when jimmy carter took over and build houses and gave them to speed up to 1987, the snl bailout, it's called fascism. boom, the dot com com bailout, the banking

bailout, the obama bailout of the automotive industry -- nobody's doing nothing about it. they are printing over $30 million a day -- $30 billion a day. nonethis thing collapses, of you people will have any money. oligarchy, aial two-headed one-party. it's worldwide. host: if you privatized those government functions, what happens when those companies go out of business? caller: the other lady was talking about all these college-educated people -- there are no trade workers left because of free college and it's just too far gone.

our last hope was ross perot. the whole world is printing money at the national michael rate -- at an astronomical rate. , allwhere this is done it's done is drive real estate up to where it's not financially available to the regular working-class people. host: diane calling from washington, d.c. good morning. morning.ood one of the things no one is talking about is the federal contractors -- whether you are an actual contractor or working on a contract. the federal employees ultimately will get their backpay, but it's the rest of us that stand a chance to really miss out and

lose. folks inoking at the janitorial services, people working in the cafeteria, that's one of the stories no one is talking about. host: what would you say to those who say that's the price of working with the federal government? caller: then nobody should get pay. federal employees shouldn't be reimbursed. how about our congressmen and elected officials? they are allegedly working but not doing their jobs. if those federal employees aren't getting paid, they shouldn't be getting paid. why are we letting our elected officials not doing their job get paid? it's a conversation not being had. host: how do you convince

congress to not pay themselves? caller: that's never going to happen. we need to exercise our rights to vote in the next election cycle. host: let's go to arthur calling from norfolk, virginia. arthur is a federal worker. good morning. caller: good morning. i am a federal worker. not totally affected by this part of the government, but you did say those who are affected and those who are not. i'm working for the department of defense. there andcontractors others who are affected. i do associate with them. security,lieve border whether the semantics of the wall, that one word is the

sticking point, it can stay a virtual law and just enhance border security, which is the ultimate goal. i've been through shutdowns before where i was furloughed under president obama. believe,,,,,, -- this, i believe, is a necessary thing. if the democrats are going to hold out and not give the president what he's asking for, it's not only the president to blame. host: how did you survive through the furlough? caller: the money was paid later, but i also had money working, my wife was she wasn't touched by the furlough.

so, we made it. host: let's go to stephen calling from indianapolis, indiana. stephen opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning. host: we can hear you. go ahead. caller: i oppose mr. trump's shutdown. eveno oppose his wall, though i approve of border security. --ppose the drugs inc. sent being sent from mexico into our country. i also oppose white americans sending thousands of guns for the into mexico mexicans to kill their citizens. there should be just as much outrage about the guns being sent to mexico to kill mexicans

as they are concerned about the drugs being shipped here to america to kill american kids. from virginia calling pennsylvania. good morning. caller: good morning. i agree with the shutdown. our government is too big anyway. they should cut the whole government and half. -- in half. we have pelosi and schumer to thank for the shutdown. trump said he would shut it down if he didn't get money for his wall. pelosi and schumer are just not good politicians. they are out to destroy the country. destroy our constitution, destroy our rights and this is what happens. which departments do you think we don't need?

in half. said cut it .t is too big that's why we can't find out who is stealing, who is not stealing, because the government is too big. house sayingte they would take less money for a border wall while democrats say they would be willing to give the government some money but without a wall. would you be accepting of any compromise here? caller: no. we want the wall fully funded. we want a big wall. we want the wall. we don't want people entering our country illegally. they are criminals. they are breaking our laws. don't people understand that?

host: let's go to dave calling from lynchburg, virginia. dave opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: thank you for taking my call. the government shutdown shows the government doesn't work. it is a bust. all the people in washington will affect our credit rating. what happened to the way it was supposed to work? where are all the elected representatives when people going to work every day are getting paid? they are on vacation still getting paid. this government doesn't work the way it is set up. we need a commonsense way of doing business. ?ow about a third party look at what you've got, sit down in a room and talk about it

and then figure out a logical approach. don't go home. paid, youon't get don't get fed. we will stick you in a shelter in florida. host: dave calling from ohio. good morning. -- dee calling from ohio. caller: good morning. i heard last night that there's another caravan forming and they are on their way up here, there is 15,000 in this caravan. they are not coming for jobs. that's the reason e-verify wouldn't work by itself. mexico offered them jobs and they turned it down. they want to come to america where they can live free. our country is ruled by judges turninggals -- we are into a socialist country. every socialist that ran in the

last election got elected. heard that the defense department is paying $10,000 for toilet lids and $1000 for a coffee cup. that is pure wasteful if that is true. why don't they cut off a law thator make they cannot borrow any more money? they have to live on what they take in. we take in one million legally every year. we should not take any in illegally. let them come in legal and we one million a year and 63% of the immigrants that come welfare.re on that's over half of them.

how much it imagine costs the taxpayers. why don't you have someone on your show that tells all the expenses with the immigrants? i wish you would do that. you have everyone that tells how great it is and how we need them so bad. you never have anyone on to tell you the expense of keeping these people, 63% of them on welfare. host: judy calling from oklahoma. judy supports the shutdown. good morning. caller: yes, i think we should shut it down like the woman before me said. what are you going to do with all these illegals coming over here, the 15,000 on their way over here? $5 billion forem

the wall to stop a bit of this, over $5, we are paying billion to feed these illegals. hirepelosi is wanting to and make the government bigger and pay more money to hire a bunch of lawyers to get rid of trump and trump is the only one in there trying to stop these illegals. in california, they are saying -- aok to have illegals lot of those illegals will be coming over to my state of oklahoma. i don't want these illegals over here that kill people, go out and murder people, break into people's homes. what is wrong with the

democrats? obama lied all through his campaign about health care and everything else. on there 7487 lies that trump said. obama that's did all he did was lighe. all you stupid democrats out itre just signed it, passed and then what did you get? you have all those people out there paying more for insurance $2500.th care over

pay attime she had to the doctor's office on top of that, they raised theirs around $5,000 a year. you want to talk about how trump peoples to save all the and save all the people first in the united states. louise callingto from tacoma park, maryland. louise is a federal worker. caller: thank you for taking my call. i cannot believe what i just heard. three people in a row talking absolute lee crazy that's absolute crazy. -- talking absolutely crazy. for our people to think the president we've gotten out isn't

a liar is crazy. for him to shut down the , he's forcing republican people to be without their jobs, too. how dare he say that only democrats are suffering from his government shutdown. i voted for george bush. many of the republicans know that this man is crazy. he's looking like he's out of his mind all the time. the people saying he's looking out for us, they sound ignorant. they must sit and listen to fox all day long. lies, so what?ny they are still lying. you ought to be ashamed of yourselves. i want to let the viewers

know, here's the story the previous two callers were talking about. this comes from the san diego union tribune. another migrant caravan with 15,000 participants is preparing to leave honduras on january 15. they say they are even bigger and stronger than the last caravan. a member of the migrant advocacy said this. thousands of central american migrants remained stranded at the u.s.-mexico border, languishing in crowded tijuana shelters. i just wanted to read that so we would know a bit about what the previous two callers were talking about. like calling from a grin, ohio -- akron, ohio.

mike, are you there? we hear you. this,: the hero in all of wayne lapierre of the nra. if you're a fan of wayne lapierre, get in your pickup ak-47s,oaded up with call your friends and have your own caravan to go to the mexico border. this line, the last line of democracy -- why don't they load up their gun racks with ak-47s? what could possibly go wrong?

this could be a way to make up for it. wayne lapierre should lead the way. the wing limbaugh as man and ann coulter as his wing woman and you can have a wrestling match. i would pay big money to see that wrestling match. nra, please come to the rescue. what could possibly go wrong? host: mario calling from lebanon, ohio. mario supports the shutdown. caller: good morning. for having then 2009 speech from chuck schumer. i would urge you in public service to re-air it once a day during "washington journal." we have chuck schumer himself

going through and making the case for why we should have justg borders and have a legal immigration process. he even uses the word "illegal" immigration and "illegal aliens." not "undocumented." trump, i would advise him to go funeral --it every you had someone from new jersey who went on a killing spree in missouri. californiameone in who crashed into folks -- they had to release someone because , moved him toy ice and he went on a killing spree. now, you have the situation with killed by anho was

illegal immigrant. you can have trump just pulled and go fromout funeral to funeral. host: let's go to sam calling from kansas. sam opposes the shutdown. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. got four points to make. we have only a few minutes left to go in the show. caller: let's give trump his $5 billion for his wall. in return, let's have him devise his twitter account for good -- give us his twitter account for good. politicians the should wear on their lapels who is sponsoring them.

they have to get so many people to give the money, by the time they get up there to washington, they don't have room to make any decisions because they are already bought and paid for. population doesn't understand how the government works. we should give a tax break for people to get back to school to learn how the government works. how can you be a responsible voter if you don't know what you are voting for? you're just watching someone on tv and that's all you're making your opinion on? let's get real with this. host: we want to thank all of our callers and guests who joined us today for "washington journal." join us tomorrow morning at 7:00 a.m. for another edition.

have a great saturday. ♪ [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2018] ♪ ♪ , we go to hawaii and show you the state capital, the uss missouri at pearl harbor and the book selection of daniel inouye. artists,orm with reporters and former inmates on committal justice reform. for the past seven years, c-span has traveled across the country, telling stories about the unique history and literary lives of

cities outside washington. tour on c-span, are cities -- our cities tour in hawaii. >> i want to welcome you all to hawaii,capital. the hawaiian history is unique and in america we were an independent monarchy than a provisional government and out-of-state. -- and now a state. the palace was a royal palace and it became the seat of the provisional government of hawaii and the seat of the territorial government and hawaii became a joined the union in 1959 until 19 to the eight this was the capital.