very thin strand of glass allows , as far as we can tell, unlimited amounts of information to be pumped through it by lasers. it's used around the world underseas, to carry communications. and more and more countries are ensuring that every one of their citizens has act stose a fiberoptic connection. >> awe thord andujar vard law school professor susan crawford discusses her book "fiber: the coming tech revolution and why america might miss it." >> there will be no wire better than fiber that will emerge over the next few decades and we are right now leaving behind a lot of the country when it comes to great communications capacity and as a nation we're falling behind in the global race to be the places where new ideas come from. >> watch "the communicators" onight at 8:00 on c-span2. here's a look at our primetime

schedule on the c-span networks. starting at 10:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. a discussion on the trump administration and the new 116th congress. at 10:00 p.m. on c-span2, a look at the current political situation in venezuela. and at 8:00 eastern on c-span3, lawmakers and entrepreneurs examine the u.s. job creation and how technology is changing he economic landscape. >> c-span's "washington journal" live every day with news and policy issues that impact you. coming up tuesday morning, pennsylvania republican congressman scott perry discusses the government shutdown and border security. also, former custom and border protection commissioner talks about illegal immigration and border security issues and npr justice correspondent carrie johnson will be with us to talk about the open dage of testimony for william barr, president

trump's nominee for attorney general. be sure to watch c span's "washington journal" live at 7:00 eastern tuesday morning, join the discussion. here and jacque sims she serves as policy director of the american federation of government employees, the largest federal employee union in the country. did you ever think this would go 24 days? guest: it was my worst fear. that yes, i am surprised it has gone this long. host: how does this end? guest: i have no idea how long it will go. beiously, there does seem to some good possibilities for a successful resolution to all of this if senator mcconnell allows a vote in the senate of the house passed bills.

when that will happen, i don't know. host: do you think that is the most likely path? what are you hearing for members of congress? guest: our members are calling their senators and urging them to urge senator mcconnell to thew a vote on more or less exact same bill that passed the senate unanimously on december 19. host: until the into the program this morning, especially for federal employees, call (202) 748-8000. all others, call (202) 748-8001. jacque simon is with the largest federal employee union. should the federal government expect to lose employees when this is all said and done? guest: that depends on how long this thing last. there are some misconceptions salary and wages the federal employees earn and the

members of our union are very modestly paid. they are dependent on trepidation security officers. they started $28,000 a year and they take a less than $500 a week. economic is your resources, you can't go very long without a paycheck. will verypeople who committed, they take it very seriously, but they can't do it for free. talk about the call outs. could that be used as a tactic to put pressure on ending the shutdown? guest: callouts? host: the tsa callouts? they are calling out sick? guest: that story has been exaggerated somewhat great is not condoned by our union and it

is not endorsed by our union and there is no sick leave during the four low. they can't even really take sick leave. you also have to include the fact that there is a lot of cold in theiroing around job exposes them to the general public every day in a very intimate way. as al qaeda factors that could explain that. we are not encouraging people not to go to work who have been directed to go to work. we are telling our members absolutely, if you have received notice from your agency telling ,ou you are required to work that your job has been designated accepted, then you should absolutely go to work. host: can you quit if your team to the fed -- an essential employee? guest: you can always quit by not showing up, you are absent without leave and ultimately, if you are absent without leave and subsequently when the government reopens, you inform the employer

you weren't just absence, he resigned, yeah, you can quit. host: is there any penalty you could face if you do that at a time when you are deemed essential? guest: technically, yes. mostct, we expect at least supervisors and managers to understand when you are in a non-pay status, you are allowed to use sick leave. but if you are genuinely ill and , theynot come to work would be very unlikely to impose discipline on the employee. of course, we would represent them because we would not want anyone to face any harmful consequences, any disciplinary use offor a legitimate sick leave. host: how many federal employees do represent? 700,000.,000 -- guest: host: how many are directly affected? guest: about 250,000 or so.

area?mostly in the d.c. guest: mostly outside the d.c. area. we represent fema workers and margaret homeland security, or control, ice, tsa at airports across the country, park --vice, forest service, hide hud, we are dispersed everywhere. host: if you're a federal employee and wanted tell us about your situation, call (202) 748-8000. all others, call (202) 748-8001. you are suing the federal government right now over the shutdown. on what grounds? of theit's a violation fair labor standards act, it's a law that guarantees a worker certain protections and one of them probably most famous is the minimum wage. employer in the

united states has to pay a worker at least the federal minimum, $7.25 an hour, higher in some places. after an excess of 40 hours a week for some employees, you are entitled to time and a half for overtime. when the government is requiring people to work and paying them nothing, that andates minimum wage laws other wage and hour laws. not the first shutdown and not the history -- not the first time you have sued. i'm not an attorney, so it was say too much, but we sued successfully in 2013. host: what to do when? -- what did you win? guest: back pain. we are confident of success. host: back pay at this one is pretty certain. guest: congress has passed legislation.

host: what are you suing for? host: there is damage is 1 -- guest: there is damage is when he failed to pay online. in greene co. springs, florida. good morning. caller: good morning. i would like to ask -- i am for the wall and i'm for trump 100%. he is not kicking the can down the road, he wants to fix this problem. sue the is, if we can state's for these sanctuary cities, when you go to bed at your head downay on the pillow because you lost a loved one that should not have been in this country, why can't we do something about that? , sanctuariesork for all. california. that is not fair.

that is just not fair to us. the democrats do not want to fix this problem. i think they are getting money cartels or -- doesn't make any sense. why would they want to fix this problem? i'm not sure i agree with all the premises of the question but i do think democrats and republicans care a lot about border security and the safety and security of our country. now wherek right there is disagreement is both means and ends. i think the idea of shutting down the government in order to force a particular solution about this issue is one thing debate in a reasoned the congress of the united states with the white house is another. we certainly have very strong

support within our union for border security. we represent border patrol agent's and we represent ice agents. they do the actual work of providing for security at the border. about thaty much issue, but we want our members to be paid for the work they do. host: i know you have met with speaker pelosi and minority leader chuck schumer. have you actually met with president trump? guest: no, we have not. not at the national level. president recently sent president trump a letter asking for a resolution of this impasse. senatehim to allow the -- to instruct senator mcconnell, who seems to be taking his cues from the onsident, to allow a vote the house passed appropriation bill and get the government back open again and then proceed with

debate over border security. host: did you get any response to that letter? host: -- guest: no. host: any plans to meet with anyone else at the white house? guest: yes. our members are calling their congressional representatives and senators asking for a quick resolution of this impasse. we're focusing mostly right now on the senate, asking the senate to take up the house passed appropriation package and the funding measure for the part of homeland security immediately and reopen the government. jacque simon with us for another 15 minutes, talking about the story we have been talking about for over three weeks now, the 24 of the ongoing government shutdown, the special line for federal employees, call (202) 748-8000. all others, call (202) 748-8001.

margie is in meadville, pennsylvania. good morning. caller: good morning. i would like to make a comment to the young lady. the whole first hour of c-span this morning, i got the impression that the general public was very blasé, their ,ttitude had a little hostility these jobs are good jobs with good benefits and people think they should have put something aside because this is not the first shutdown. is, do yourestion people pay union dues and are you avoiding those union dues for this time, or are you helping your people monetarily? that would be my question. thank you. guest: thank you for calling me a young lady. dues when receiving

our members are not being paid. we don't have the resources to ,elp our members financially some unions have a strike funds, but since federal employees are barred by law from ever going on strike, and of course, we would never call a strike, we don't have those kind of resources to help people out. think none of our members who are being affected by the shutdown have savings. some do. what we hear from a lot of people is they had enough but maybeo make it through one missed paycheck. and now, things are getting really dicey. and the timing could not be worse. january is a particularly bad month financially for a lot of people. you have all the bills coming in from christmas and if you have any kind of medical appointments

or prescription drug costs or anything like that, this is the beginning of the year, you have there he high deductibles you have to pay. copayments, federal employees in recent years have actually been healthout of traditional insurance plans, so many of them have a high deductible plans they are having to pay out-of-pocket to go to the doctor, to go to the hospital, to get her medicines. it's really hitting people very our members,mber, there are some well-paid federal employees that are members are the rank-and-file, and very modestly paid people. these are people who are making $30,000, $40,000, $50,000 a year. in most parts of the country, your middle class at that level. but you don't really have a lot of cushion after you have paid your taxes, you health insurance, your 401(k), your

childcare, your rents, your car payments, maybe a student loan payments. there's not much left over. think -- host: do you think federal government employees should reconsider the idea of a shutdown fund? goal of anynot the organization to create a fund for irresponsible politicians. this is not a cost the rest of us should have to bear. this is very serious business. this is the government of the united states of america, it needs to operate in a more reasonable and responsible fashion. frank is an big rock, tennessee. good morning. caller: first of all, i'd like to say god bless all of those people who are having to put up with this. i think they should be paid some kind of interest plus any penalties incurred by their bills.

i feel for them. trumpalso stand behind and the wall. the democrats need to do their job. they are going on vacation now down the philippines. they don't care about this country. they need to come to the table and work for this country. guest: i don't know -- i would be very reluctant to say that either democrats or republicans failed to care about this country. if anyon't know democrats or republicans are currently on vacation. at least from what i have read the newspaper, it is president trump who has got enough and walked out of the room in the context of efforts to negotiate and region into this impasse. there certainly are republicans who have come forward and said they were willing to have a vote on the house passed

appropriation bills and that is clearly the pathway forward. question theling get started out as you is to blame. you're putting the blame squarely on president trump and republicans in congress are in -- in congress. want to assign blame one way or another but it does seem to be an absolute refusal on the part of o'connell to allow the senate to vote on the house passed appropriation bills. fits, that seems to be where the solution lies and if he continues to refuse to allow a vote, then he has got responsibility for that refusal. host: "washington journal," poll, 53% ofhis respondents to that poll blame president trump and republicans in congress for the shutdown, 29% democrats in congress, 13%

blaming both equally. constance is a retired federal worker in virginia, good morning. caller: good morning. everybody is trying to be so politically correct. but if mitch mcconnell would bring that bill back to the floor, the ones that they themselves passed in december and have the house vote on it, it would pass. mitch mcconnell is the one that is holding up this thing, along with he says he's going to bring it back because the president will veto it. that's all besides the point, president trump did not put mitch mcconnell in office, people did. and he should be doing what is right, right now. and i call on mitch mcconnell and all the republicans, senate and the house, to do their jobs as the lady just said. yes, they should do their jobs. nobody should be held hostage

,ecause of their shenanigans they have the lowest rating ever, the house and the senate and the president and all the republicans held the house for two years. host: what federal agency did you work in? caller: transportation. host: did you ever go through a shutdown? caller: yes, i did. host: how did you deal with it? caller: i was in supervision at the time and i was given a package two weeks before the shutdown and i was to put the employees out. which is what i did. it means that i went around to stations that employees were in job,ut them out of their but they blamed it on the employees, but it was not their fault. the administration actually put the employees out. and called a strike.

this was in new york city. jacque simon. you make a lot of very good points, particularly the fact that the senate voted isnimously on a bill that virtually identical to the one that mitch mcconnell refuses to allow a vote on now read the new congress new year, the 160th congress and there are a few new senators, but if they vote the way they voted on december 19, there is enough support to override any kind of veto. simplereally a fairly and straightforward path out of this mess. we were just on the verge of avoiding a shutdown in late december when the president responding to some critics on cable news decided to move the goalposts and there was a bill he was ready to sign and then he decided he would not sign it.

and you described him as a clear way out of this and it is for mitch mcconnell to allow a vote. scott, i federal worker. go ahead. i would like to provide my opinion on the blame. first of all, it's not one party. it's all the politicians are to blame. there is that they are and voted in the public office to negotiate on behalf of the constituents. they are not doing that. present obama ran and one office based on change. also got intop office based on change. america wants change. they want politicians that will provide them the information they needed. another thing, congress, they failed their job with three continuing resolutions. the did not fund the government when they should have read

october is a new fiscal year and congress didn't do it then. they weren't negotiating back then. they are failing. another point i would like to mention is federal employees, we can file for unemployment of we so need to. because we are in a furlough status. host: is that some thing you are recommending employees do? yes, we are. we are recommending unemployment eligibility varies by state. we are absolutely recommending that furloughed employees applied with unemployment benefits in the state that helps you keep the audience together. this thing is over and you get back pay, your to refund many of the unemployment benefits he received. absolutely, you should get unemployment insurance benefits if you're able. house advisor kevin hassett had an email -- heading

-- had a interview over the weekend they talked about furloughs and the impact on federal employees. >> workers are furloughed. they are not allowed to go to work. ends, they goown back to work and get back pay. a shoot -- a huge share of government workers that are going to take vacation days and then we have a shutdown, so they can't do work and so then they have the vacation, but they don't have to use their vacation days. come back and get back pay and in some sense, they are better off. guest: that is absolutely absurd statement. federal employees are not better off as a result of the shutdown. are are hurting, they facing very serious financial consequences.

some even will have their security clearances placed in jeopardy when they fall behind on their bills. it's one of the first things that put the security clearance and ultimately a federal job in jeopardy is falling behind on your bills. people have to pay late fees, they may lose their day care slots, they may even lose their homes if god for bid they were already behind in their payments. this is unequivocally, unambiguously bad for federal employees. that's why the overwhelming majority almost the complete majority want this thing to end right away. minutes on day 24 of the government shutdown and take a few more calls with jacque , in idaho falls, idaho, good morning. caller: good morning, c-span. thank you for taking my call. that a lot of people just don't understand anything. workers never hold

people as hostages. is in the government president or congress, republicans and senate republicans, if they don't have no concern about people and workers, they can do anything. just like that tax cut they gave , they could've thought about the wall then. use that money to pay for the wall. could just come out and tell the american people you know what, i want to build a wall and i want you guys to pay for. just be honest with the people. and then they will go from there. host: jacque simon. right.you are there were many opportunities of the last two years when the republicans controlled both the house and the senate and obviously the white house when

they could have passed funding for this particular elements of border security, this notion of a wall. and they did not. i think your characterization of the currenti think your charactf the current situation as holding federal employees hostage, we've used the word extortion, we've used the words ponds, hostage situation, any of those things i think are good descriptions of what's going on. and it is shameful. host: lee is in south portland, maine. caller: this is lee, good morning to you. what i wanted to say is mitch mcconnell will not bring this bill of to be voted on because his wife works for donald trump. she is secretary of transportation. to me, that is a conflict of interest. no wife many of those senators has anything to do with passing laws should be working for the president. it is definitely a conflict of in