in elections at the local, state, and national level. >> at 8:00 p.m. on the arrillency, author john f talks about nixon's early life and career. 1947 and 1948, he campaigned for the martial law. then his best judgment, not his obedience, and he convinced them. when the -- he did not just win the republican nomination, he won the democratic nomination. onexplore our nation's past american history tv every weekend on c-span3. host: anna edney's with bloomberg news as a health policy reporter and we are

talking about teenage vaping. interest from congress. what is driving this? guest: interest started a year ago last summer when numbers showed teenage vaping rose significantly between 2017 and 2018, 78% jump in the number of high schoolers using e-cigarettes and congress was concerned because there is a playbook from big tobacco that they think looks very similar and they are concerned we could lose all the gains we have made in getting people off of cigarettes. host: focus on the company juul, why is that and what is the company? guest: juul is in san francisco, they have an e-cigarette that is very discrete and really appealing to teens. a live talk at schools that you

can hide it in your sweatshirt, people may not know when you are using it. there were some really great flavors that teens like that were able to be sold in convenience stores. now those are just online except nthol that aree still in the stores, but that has been the e-cigarette of choice for kids from the evidence from different surveys. that company has taken all of the focus of the teenage vaping epidemic. host: we see a certain age that you have to buy tobacco products, what is the standard for these e-cigarettes? guest: they are the same because they contain nicotine. they are considered an addictive substance even if they do not have all the things cigarettes have in the tobacco. the standards are the same. no one under age is supposed to be buying these. is legislation from senate

majority leader mitch mcconnell that is being considered that would raise the age to 21. host: one of the things that is particularly focused on the juul side of it was the idea of marketing. what are the concerns of congress over this? guest: there were a lot of instagram posts from juul that had younger looking people that were really appealing to youth and juul was seeking out influencers. we found out the other day in the house congressional hearing of people who could kind of make these look even cooler on social media platforms and get kids interested. this iseting point of kind of to go and look and see how much this is like what big tobacco did. could there be concerns there that they are getting kids hooked on a new addictive substance. and is there marketing really targeted towards kids versus adults that they are supposed to be marketing towards. joins us forney

this conversation. if you want to ask about the use of vaping products and specifically juul, you can call 202-748-8000 in eastern and central time zones, mountain and pacific, 202-748-8001, perhaps you are an e-cigarette user, 202-748-8002. we will hear from one of those people that testified, a young person named caleb mint, that talked about a juul representative who came to their school. we will hear what they had to say. [video clip] >> caleb, what grades were you and philip in the year of the juul presentation? caleb: ninth grade. >> what were students told about the presentation before it began? caleb: we were told we were having a mental health addiction seminar that we have three times a year and teachers are told to leave the room so it is a safe space for kids to talk. >> did most of your classmates

believe juul was safe prior to the presentation? caleb: many kids were already doubts ofd had their whether it was safe, but a lot of kids still thought it was possibly dangerous. >> did the presenter ever mention his connection to juul were your teachers in the room when he spoke? caleb: he did mention his connection to juul and my teacher for not in the room when he spoke. >> did he ever say juul was safe? caleb: yes. >> did he call juul totally safe more than once? caleb: yes. >> what impact did those totally safe comments have on your classmates, some of whom may have already started vaping? caleb: my classmates who were already vaping, it was a sigh of relief because now they could do so without concern. host: anna edney, how did juul manage to get in the schools in the first place to make these presentations?

guest: the report from the house subcommittee that looked into this showed juul was giving funds to a lot of the schools, $10,000, and some with even more of a summer camp type thing and to go in for one day they were given money to gain access to the students. host: when congress heard about the young people or at least the ones we heard from, what was the reaction from legislators? guest: there was a lot of outrage because one of the things missing from that presentation is any of the risk that could be involved with juul. these are not completely safe or totally safe products that we know of like the congressman said. like the congressman said juul insinuated. there is concern that they are selling something to kids that the teens do not know all of the

risks to this and they assume that they are doing something -- a lot of them do not even know that they are using an e-cigarette. i have talked to caleb and other teens who have used these products or tried them before and they have no idea of what the actual consequences may be down the road. host: one of those expressing outrage, senate majority whip dick durbin. let's hear what he had to say. [video clip] 2017 and 2018, the number of american teenagers using any tobacco product increased by nearly 40%. this was the largest single year increase in youth tobacco use ever. that's right. all of our significant hard-earned gains to reduce use of tobacco products are being reversed because of e-cigarettes accompanying the kid friendly flavors. all of the full-page advertisements decrying children, you see them in the

hill, roll call, politico, washington post, new york times, wall street journal. this is not a new tactic. that is exactly what big tobacco did. and we said lay off the kids. they bought full-page ads in the wall street journal saying we do not want kids to smoke cigarettes. how many kids do you think get up in the morning to read the wall street journal? exactly. none. campaign to try to say that they have a business model that is not really direct it at the kids. the facts tell us otherwise. host: go ahead. guest: i think he is encapsulating a lot of concerns . you heard him mention big tobacco and that is the theme over and over again. juul was actually bought by -- , they usedtria

to be philip morris, they bought a 35% stake in the company and there is concern that big tobacco is losing ground on cigarettes and try to make it up somewhere and that this is not proven yet to be a totally safe alternative. host: for the senator's claims about the rise in teenage vaping or use of tobacco by teens and attributing that to juul and similar products, is that a true statement? guest: there has been evidence of that and that is coming from the government. the food and drug administration just started their first tv ads against teenage vaping and one of the things they say is, you could actually be more likely to start smoking cigarettes if you use these e-cigarettes first. host: the first call from beverly

in washington dc. you are on with our guest. go ahead. beverly in washington, hello? caller: yes. host: albert in maine, hello. you are on. let's try beverly again. go ahead. caller: yes, i am calling because it is very strange that the government would even let havehildren and grown-ups access. it is strange that the government and those in charge -- yes, good morning, thank you. host: just keep talking on the phone. strange caller: strange that the -- caller: strange that the government and those in charge and putting that terrible thing out there for students and grown-ups to have access to, it appears they should be charged.

it is like a crime. host: apologies for that. anna edney? guest: you raise a good point about teens getting access to this and that that should not be happening. concern in thes beginning, the fda said they wanted to make sure that adult do have access to it because potentially e-cigarettes could be a good way to get adults to stop using cigarettes. that is something that is still sort of being studied and looked e-cigarette companies need to turn in applications by may 2020 to the fda to get a marketing clearance. we will know more about the data on smoking cessation. they are trying to strike a balance between adults of being -- adults being able to use these potentially to stop using cigarettes and keeping them out

of kids hands at the same time. a little more to keeping them out of kids hands because the use of them has grown to epidemic proportions. host: and 2018 according to the than one in four high school students, and one and three middle school students use the tobacco product in the past 30 days. is the juul product technically a secession device helping you to curb smoking? guest: it is not. that is something that has to get approval from the fda. you have to put in an application as an over-the-counter drug product to to be a smoking cessation products. juul does not have that, no one has even tried to get that as far as an e-cigarette is concerned. there are the potential for these e-cigarettes to go through a pathway at the fda where they would be designated as modified

risk and they could legally say they are less risk even cigarettes. less risky than cigarettes. we do not know yet if they will even apply for the modified risk or if they will go through regular approval to say you can stay on the market. are usingo many teens this, how are they getting the product in the first place? guest: that is a good question. there is a thought that some of -- if your friends are 18 and you are 17 and 16, they are buying a bunch of them and able to get them. that is why there is this movement to raised tobacco age to 21 because there is more of a gap for kids being friends with that age. kids find ways around pretty much everything. that has been some peoples' thaw on this. if we do too much -- peoples'

thought on this. if we do too much to keep it out of adults hands, kids find a way no matter what. host: is there a means to buy it online? guest: there are ways to buy it online and you can buy those flavors of feeling to youth, mango, cucumber, they are supposed to be age verified. whether the technology works or how well it works is a question that is out there and something the fda will look at. host: greg is in arizona for our guest anna edney. go ahead. caller: good morning. i have a comment and a couple of questions for your guest. i smoked cigarettes for 52 years. i tried everything. i tried all of the gimmicks that were out there and nothing worked. i finally discovered vaping. what the fda is doing as they

are taking the option away from existing smokers to have an option to get away from combustible tobacco, and they are trying to do away with it. i would like anna to comment on the extensive regulation and needs to money that be spent with the fda in order to get approval for a lower risk product like vaping. recently the chewable tobacco industry spent millions and millions and millions of dollars, hundreds of thousands of pages over a 20 year study to get a label change on the reduced risk for chewable tobacco. worse news products. e products. the option to get anything clear through the fda essentially does not exist. as far as teenage vaping goes, teenagers will experiment. i do not care if it is drugs, sex, alcohol, they will experiment.

the key to keeping a teenager away from vaping is to educate them that this is not a totally safe product and never been recommended as a totally safe product. the vaping industry will tell you that if you do not smoke now , do not start vaping. guest: first of all, congratulations on finding a way to stop using combustible cigarettes. as far as the fda regulation goes, juul technically is considered a silicon valley startup and i think we have seen a lot of clashes with silicon valley. other industries come to mind like the gene testing like 23 and me which clashed with the fda. it is tough because they want to innovate and to do it quickly. but we have regulations in washington that exists across the country.

they need to make sure the products on the market or want to make sure the products do what they say they will do and do it safely. it is a high hurdle. other things go through the fda as well. devices, so one of the things that juul has the advantage is that they now have the backing that altria, the and no not beoro, as hard for them. but it may be harder for the smaller vaping companies that we have not heard of, more like mom-and-pop institutions. it will be tougher for them. they could possibly go out of business. that is kind of the way that we see a lot of things working with the food and drug administration, but there is the balance to make sure that

companies claiming their products is doing is actually what they are doing and doing it safely. host: what is the level of nicotine between a juul product versus a combustible cigarette? guest: juul pod is equal to the amount of nicotine in a pack of cigarettes. i have talked to younger adults d per day, same nicotine as a pack of cigarettes. host: a caller from california, gabby. caller: it is abby. i vape. it is the same as greg. i had been smoking for a lot of years and i just quit recently, juul -- aot use a different device. my question is, secondhand smoke, my brother swears it saved, i am not sure what the research is.

if you could help me with that. guest: i think there is a lot of research still to come on that so i cannot unfortunately give you a definitive answer. the government has not weighed in. these are products that do not just type nicotine, they do have flavors in them. flavors are something that are approved for ingestion. something that we eat. but there has not been something that necessarily the food and drug administration has said is totally safe to inhale. when you are dealing with your longs, it is a totally different thing. i think, again, when we get some applications from these e-cigarette companies in the next year, i think we will start to see some of that data and at least what studies they have done because they have to show essentially that their products are going to be more beneficial

than harmful to society. unfortunately, i cannot help you out a whole bunch right now, but i think the data is coming in the near future. host: is it water vapor that is consistent with the smoke you see someone breathing out? guest: exactly, water vapor, not tobacco containing tar and other things in tobacco. it is water vapor that does have other chemicals in it as well, not just water. a lot of people think it is just water but that is not the case. host: sylvia in south carolina. caller: i watched the hearing on c-span and i was still confused on how the product is packaged and where the warning was and placed in the stores. host: we got your thoughts, thank you. guest: there is supposed to be a warning on the package. and in any advertisement. i have seen them on store

windows or doors that will -- they say juul and says this is a nicotine containing products. i do not remember exactly where it is on the package but if they were, if the fda would go after them if that was not on there, so that on any of their advertisements. host: let's hear from the cofounder of juul as he testified at the hearing and gave his perspective on this topic. [video clip] >> to understand our stance on teen vaping, it is helpful to understand how this company came about in the first place. adam and i smoked. we tried to quit and failed. we were on our way to becoming one of the nearly 500,000 americans who die each year from smoking related disease. for us, giving up smoking

required an alternative which did not exist at the time. we founded juul labs to invent one. the product we developed holds the promise to do what no previous technology has done, smokers stop smoking combustible cigarettes on a widespread and consistent basis. recent behavioral studies find that more than half of adult smokers who purchased and use juul products switch completely from smoking cigarettes within six months. a fact we could not be more proud of. that study aligns with real-world experience, in 2018 cigarette sales declined 5%, the fastest rate of decline in a decade. mr. chairman, put simply, juul labs is not big tobacco, we are here to eliminate its product, the cigarette.

host: he mentioned the word adult smokers several times, how do they address the teenage vaping side? guest: what they have said is that they were never intended for teenagers. they have not been trying to go after teenagers. and they are working hard to keep the product out of teenagers hands. they did voluntarily take -- after the fda caught on to them and issued some ultimatums, they did take their flavors out of stores so you now can only get the menthol and tobacco in a convenience store gas station or wherever. they are trying to show they are making efforts to not let teenagers get a hold of these in the future. host: more regulation? guest: certainly, they would rather not have more regulation but do that on their own. host: when it comes to

regulation, are there bills in congress or an effort in congress to put more regulation on the industry? guest: yes, the tobacco 21 bill to raise the age and that is aimed at e-cigarettes. there are members who want to ban flavors completely. they do not want any flavors of these available because -- even mint and menthol are attractive want the they just tobacco, that would be the only one out there. host: linda in florida, you are on with our guest. hi. i will push the button first. apologies, i did not get you right away, repeat your question or comment. caller: i have a question as far as dosages. my significant other has been using one of the vaping products. i do not know if it is juul for whatever, i refuse to allow him,

he does not smoke cigarettes in the house, he does not smoke them in the fairly new vehicle we bought. or around me. the vape does not bother me as much and he wants to quit smoking. our --s they advertise are $400. hypnosis and it has been years. wonder, he has problems getting the lower dose nicotine cartridges. "washington journal" live every day 7:00 a.m. eastern. we will leave this for the last few minutes and take you live to hear from assistant secretary of state for international security and nonproliferation,