one decision. maybe we will look to other people like the world is falling in because of another decision. >> you can watch this event tonight at the university of colorado law school tonight at 8:00 eastern on c-span. the impeachment inquiry hearings continue next week when house judiciary committee chairman jerrold nadler holds the committee's first hearing in the president trump, focusing on the constitution and the history of impeachment. watch live coverage wednesday, december 4, 10:00 a.m. eastern on c-span3. chairman nadler extended an invitation for the president and his counsel to appear before the committee. read the letter to the president on a website, c-span.org/ impeachment. follow the inquiry live on c-span3, online at c-span.org, or listen live on the free c-span radio app.

host: this is clarence page, a columnist for the chicago tribune joining us on this thanksgiving day. we appreciate your time. especially this morning. guest: glad to be here. host: i will read the headline of your column. it says welcome to the other side of a generation gap and enclose the journalist from years ago. "although we still have to face our responsibilities someday, our first impulse is to turn our backs and form a second society of our own. someday we shall know for whom the bell tolls but for now the sound is covered by the sound of our hot rods and beatles records. ? wrote that guest: i wrote that in 1965. the quality has held up so well over all these years. our wonderful advisor, bless her heart, she just passed away a couple of years ago at the age of 102.

she first put the bug in my ear about considering journalism for a career. i thought she was not at the time. host: what are you hoping to accomplish when you wrote that? guest: my generation had been a cover story in time or newsweek. i thought this was a good article and i thought it would be good for us to talk about in the student newspaper. they were talking about how baby boomers were different from previous generations. we were raised on television and did not have to go through a recession or depression. little did anybody know how much more of an adventure -- this was 1965. we already had dr. king's march on washington and numerous other .vents that occurred the assassination of jfk. then we had in the latter part of the decade the vietnam war and all the protests erected. -- erupted.

it was interesting for me at that time. we were kind of cocky. we had the world ahead of us. the economy was doing well. more of us were entering college than the previous generation. there was a sense of optimism and also some trepidation that we weren't all that candid about at the time. that was just part of our mystique. i have a son who is now 30 years old. i call him grandma's revenge because -- a funny thing about parenting, you know that you are indeed a grown-up when you're hear your own parents words coming out of your mouth. you must think money grows on trees, all these innocuous comments now they have such power when you're raising a child of your own.

it was interesting for me to see this ok boomer remark has become the great retort of this new generation. the millenials and post millenials. they see the world differently than we did. we can talk about that. host: how do they see it? guest: it is interesting. we see in the polling going on that young people tend to be -- tend to vote democratic more than older voters who tend to vote republican. at the same time, i found that my son, once he got to college, seemed to be a lot less patient than my generation about change. of course we were impatient compared to the earlier generation. as a result, we now see young people having the cancel culture. they have decided if somebody's

speeches unworthy of being heard, they will just shut it down. my generation was more of the free speech movement. they started campus activism in 1964 at the berkeley campus. we have a different view of that today. i find myself talking to my son about how it is better to let bad ideas die from their own illogic then trying to silence the people who speak because then you make a martyr out of them. these are the kind of chats that go around our thanksgiving table. host: clarence page will be with us for this discussion on politics and generational issues. if you want to ask questions, we have divided the lines differently today in light of our discussion. (202)-748-8000 if you are under the age of 35. if you fall between 36 and 55,

(202)-748-8001. if you are between 56 and 75, (202)-748-8002. you can text us at (202)-748-8003. what do you see today as far as views held by those who are younger than you politically? what are the differences that are interesting to you? guest: one difference is they don't have a draft. it was hung over our heads throughout the latter part of the decade back in the 60's. we talked about how -- i learned about drill sergeants when i got infted after i graduated 1969 and started working at the tribune. that made such a big difference in activism. when the draft ended in 1970, after the kent state massacre, that whole disaster, and also the jackson state massacre.

things got quieter. the danger of being drafted into the war really took the steam out of the student activist movement at that time. now we see a new student activist generation rising up on a variety of different causes. not as centralized as things were back in those days but nevertheless, young people now are standing up to gun violence, for example. my generation did not worry about being shot in the classroom. we were worried about them take into a war overseas. there is a sense among young folks now that we boomers have to catch up. i don't blame them. we were the same way about the older generation. why don't you guys get out of the way and let us take things over? that has not changed but the trappings of it changed. i mentioned the beatles records and motown, the culture of the

1960's. today's culture -- i knew i had grown up when i was saying, turn down that noise and change the station on the car radio to a golden oldies channel. now that is some good music. host: what are the things students look at, one is student debt. guest: thank you for bringing that up. it is one of my favorite examples. when i was coming out of high school, i applied to ohio university and was accepted. my freshman tuition was $770 and with room and board it was about $1240. that was a big difference to when my son came along in the late 1990's. it was like 10 times what it was when i was going to college. student debt became as much of a factor in young people's lives as the draft was in our lives.

it has not caught on as much as social security or medicare expansion because young people don't vote in the same numbers as older folks. we saw that but we saw that change in bill first race with al gore. young voters turned out in larger numbers. when barack obama ran. they went and sought out the around.ters, first time and i think today, you're not seeing as much of what -- well, democracy haven't gotten their act together. they don't know who their nominee is going to be. but we also have a situation today where young people aren't property owners like older folks are. you know, this is one thing that can make you a conservative. ha! and having to pay property taxes. and being invested in the

that way. it has a big impact on causing moree to vote conservatively. so that's interesting to me now, because, as i've told my son, you've got to get out there and vote, because if you don't play you don't have any standing to change the rules or whatever. i expect to see a much larger turnout of young people becausee around, partly of that student loan issue. bernie sanders has been very that,ive at promoting effective at promoting the health care for all issue four ago. that, i think, is a big factor for this generation. calls,re we take some that student newspaper that you pointed out has a group picture. what's the importance of the picture? >> well, that group picture on the front page is our editorial staff, and i show this to my friends and say, guess which one is clarence? [laughter] >> i'm not the only -- the not but the only black person

the only -- well, me and david god rest his soul. he passed away about three years ago. he and i were the only guys on the editorial staff there. that was actually something of a ouringer of the way profession has gone. many more women now -- back in days, in the mid-60's, not only were black folks rare in newsrooms but so were women. nowadays, things have not enough, much, of course. but people don't jump out of surprise at ah female editor in chief or a female publisher. number of them come along in their careers. of those factors make a difference on our generational change and outlook on life. >> our first call for you comes from albany, georgia.

in the category of between 56 and 75. eva, good morning. >> good morning and happy thanksgiving to our nation and thank you for c-span. too come out of college.69 graduating '69, celebrating the 50th class here. is, as it have seen relates to the generational, as been -- as a physician also. my husband, the same. people who came out of harvard and duke andersity, radiologists ob/gyn. and i see their friends being multigenerational, multicultural in the context of indian, chinese. celebrated our columbia medical school graduation in new york at the 21 club. we are, black folks the cotton fields of georgia. so i have seen quite a bit of

country.in our i think we have much to be thankful for. we are seeing young people now conscience that is real and whole, because they're seeing their lives unlike my people, who come from the opportunity that a family, a community and hard work and perseverance, as we think on them.giving today, gave there are many people in the world, in our country, who are not and have not had that foundation. evenow right now that after those of us view my sir -- and i appreciate you. you have been a voice of reason. solutionsk pragmatic for our country. i read you. >> thank you. >> online and i used to get you, as my husband and i went to university of chicago during residency. biggest difference, i think, is we do have a problem in our country that we have not people. in our i was listening to the gentleman the ohio, who talked about

farming issue. there's a gentleman that's consideready to running against jim jordan. when i think about how we came together as black people and jewish people and white ofple -- now, the browning our country came after the '65 laws, you know -- >> i hate to stop you there. i apologize. out theret a lot already. mr. page, pick something from it. and go with >> i'm glad you mentioned the multiculturalism. one of the lesser celebrated -- it gets crowded out in our memory. in '65, the year after the civil '65ts act, same year as the voting rights act, there was also the national immigration passed at president johnson's urging, which shifted our -- impetus

fromr immigration policy, euro-centric, flipped that around so we had larger quotas for the rest of the planet. also, there wasn't that much of a driving demand by european come to the u.s. then. earlier.ly peaked as europe got back on its feet. at the same time, we became more multi-racial as a country. now, immigration policy is this us in europe for places,t of other because people are looking negatively at the impact of diversity. that's a big shift here in the last few years. a nationals out of policy being set in washington. but i do find that young you saw themean, picture of my high school there. had, i don't know, about -- hard to say now -- about 10% or

or so of my high school had -- was black students. and today, my son has grown up evermulticultural world since preschool. so he's much more relaxed about social and racial diversity than my generation was. these thingsl of make a difference. but one thing we older folks can be too sanguine about the way young people get along each other across racial and ethnic lines, going, oh, they cute and adorable when they work together? the neo-nazis, right fringefar groups, and i have to say, there's always been some groups who can be as well racially discriminatory in their outlook. that is a new factor that's come up, because we haven't talked

enough with young people. so after the fact, you might looking at, are we comfortable with our own diversity? >> this is from west virginia. ahead.o you're on. >> yes. 1964.uated in that didn't -- in west virginia. i've seen that are really big changes from 60's,s date back in the 70's and even 80's, when the got out draft was, you of high school. you went down. you either took the draft or ilisted in the service like did, for four years. then the other thing was, west 90% democratic in the 60's, 70's, 80's and even early 90's. 90% republican. that to one thing. the clinton administration, when they came out with gun control p west stronga went from

democrats -- and they had senator bird, rockefeller -- and 90% republicans. the whole state has changed based on, i believe, the plus firearms. thank you. >> very good point. i remember that well. i grew up in southern ohio. i also worked the summer of '67 upward bound, one of president johnson's war on in the programs appalachian area. he's right. west virginia was always a very democratic state. and the flipover did come in 2000. i remember it well because al wanted all gun owners to have these i.d. cards and the allocated a $25 million ad campaign, a lot of money in days, talking about al gore wants to take your guns away. flipped torginia become a republican state. remained so since. even the democrat, joe mansion,

senators from west virginia, when he was campaigning, first thing he did, himad this commercial of firing his shotgun at what i think it was -- >> a general target? a proposal. one of the proposals of the democrats, he was firing his at it on the street. and it worked. it was effective. still one of the last remaining folks, democratic in a state that votes predominantly republican. in thisthe fence now whole debate about impeachment. point.ah, it's a good generationally, we are a more down -- polarized now politically. recall,- he won, as i five states plus arizona, home state.

thought, of folks well, conservative wing of the republican party is dead. ha ha, you know. 1980, when ronald reagan won, and we saw the conservative movement still alive and well. in thehave donald trump white house and democrats are wondering how to come back. that's a big generational difference now that we see, compared to the old days. now thismentioned, young generation is pushing gun control. >> i'll just show you the a recent gallup to youngn it comes adults, when polled about the are grasp they had of socialism. son went through that too, much like i went through my grateful dead phase. i'm still a grateful dead fan. anyway, but yes. this younger generation -- i been madeie sanders the difference there. and a.o.c.

alexandria ocasio-cortez made popularizedrther it. young people aren't scared of the word socialism like my generation was. team,mber in the debate our national topic was socialized medicine. nationale u.s. go to a health insurance plan? '63, as in 1962 or recall. so this is not a new issue. the bighat time, argument against it was, it's socialism! forgetting that, say, social is socialism by that measure or a few years later, medicare was passed. same argument was made there again by ronald reagan, among effectively. but it didn't stop medicare from enactment. and becoming one of the most popular programs the federal has today. so this new generation -- i call

bernie bros generation. bernie sanders has made -- well, taken the fear out of the word socialism and now young at, what canoking government do to make sure that covered in this country like they are in countries? >> let's hear from someone who is over 75, from stockbridge, georgia. you're on with clarence page. go ahead. >> good morning. i'm a wanted to say disabled veteran and i come from a military family. i wasck in the 30's, when born and on up through my after war.it was war and then we got into world war ii. and then all my uncles, which came from a large family, were in it also. and i didn't go to school with black, brown or yellow. school with whites. and i had a different culture.

later, when i went into the military, i soon found that they were my best friends. they backed me up wherever i to be backed up, in whatever decision i made in the military. can't say that it was the wrong thing to do, because it for us to come together, all of us. not justwhite people, brown people, and not just black people. that we need to put aside our differences and work together. world would be better if we forget all the niceties of life and look at that are not as fortunate as we are. the generational gap, i see a lot of young people that need to be talked to. need to be told what it is hard way.ings the and if you ever learn that you

succeeded, it's because those that came before you showed you how. >> ok. thanks, caller. >> there's a lot there. it's very true. i think -- i want to say a couple of good words about young people, for one thing. i'm very impressed with the student interns we get these days. no less crazy than we were about journalism, about professionalism, about public service. and their -- they are very smart. they've got to be, to understand all these digital gadgets and usedus older folks to get to them in this age of twitter, et cetera. i feel badly for them in terms of, as i mentioned, the a college education, has gone through the roof. that's the -- importance to america's development in the past. it's going to be important in the future. need to work on that. the difference -- i don't want

thank the caller for her service. there's a big difference in by this participation younger generation now. there's not a need for a draft heavy recruitment nowadays, because rumsfeld said, can replace humans with computers. besides, the new generation of combat is more digital. differencea big there. i never thought i would be saying this, because i tried so the draft that i sometimes wish -- i told my you can't get drafted so you can learn something about discipline, organization, et cetera. that's when i know i really am old.ng offerse's a viewer who this characterization. saying younger voters tend to and idealstion rather than experience and analysis. hence, politicians with ideas

up to scrutinyd have coopted our younger voters. >> well, you could say that -- everybody who says something they don't agree with, have been coopted. don't we all vote on emotion, it. we get down to i've learned a lot since i attitudes my own after donald trump's victory. most of us were geared to the trump was suchd a long shot. was republicans thought he a long shot. let's not make the deal out of attacking him. have looked at the diversity of people in this country and those who have not been benefiting from change over the last few decades, or those whose anxieties have been growing. but they haven't had a voice out there, somebody speaking for them.r to politicians must never forget, you've got to get -- the first

in politicald back science and covering politics in chicago was never forget your base. start your campaign with your base and you end with your base. donald trump has put a base together out of people, many of whom didn't feel like they had a voice in government, that washington wasn't paying attention to them. to that it was irrelevant their daily lives. he gave the feeling that relevant. can be did donald trump appeal to emotion any more than barack obama did? no. they both appealed to emotion on some level or other. to it's also important appeal to people's feelings, not everybody is a political junkie like you and me, pedro. themselves inerse politics, in washington every day. whoe's a lot of folks really need to feel some sense washington. to otherwise, they are not going to take it that seriously.

and they're just going to view it as one more tv show. if anybody knows tv shows, it's donald trump. that the think democratic field gets that, what attracted those to donald trump? do you think this current field gets that? question.rrent i've been disappointed on the democratic field for a number of reasons, gaps that i see out there. has been, for example, consistently leading. he's been slipping lately but because of hisng experience. people are accustomed to him, especially black voters. appreciate that. but i don't think he's tried hard enough to be hip, to be up-to-date with what young people's attitudes are. thethus, we have some of gaps that we've seen him make in terms of, well, sensitivity recently, in the last debate here about issues affecting violence and women.

and there's, on the other hand, pete buttigieg, who has been a great surprise with his success. also, a centrist like biden. me as my son says, he remind too much of my r.a. back in college, dad. r.a. comes to the door, hello, we're having a good time here, but there's a strange odor in the air. we can't have that around here, blah blah. imageot this party pooper among young people, so he's got to watch out for that. elizabeth warren has struggled with -- she wants medicare for all but she struggles with how it.ay for bernie sanders doesn't let himself get caught up in that. he doesn't worry about how to pay for it. let's just do it. and do away with corporations. certainlyan, corporate insurance, private insurance. me, becauseienates

as flawed as it may be, i like my insurance plan. have theant to government come and say, well, we've decided we've got a better you.for so much trouble barack obama had with that notion and his plan did not cut out the option of having a private insurance. but elizabeth warren is still trying to catch on with that. now her latest revision, she does allow private insurance down the road. a problem oneve way or the other. cory booker or a kamala harris, withve all had problems connecting with -- problems connecting with voters. well, and whoever gets the nomination, we're going a consolidation of support in the party. but they've got challenging ahead. from northar carolina. rockwell, north carolina, larry. larry, go ahead. on.re >> yes. let me put my two cents' worth

in. just turned 64. and i've never voted. i registered when i got my renewed one time. i registered republican. lot of things they stand behind. i like my guns. i'm a collector. but this guy that's president he's -- all you got to do is just sit there and listen to him. you can do- it's all is sit there and listen to him, really despicable. i remember, something's really him. with that show you had on last night with them four guys talking, telling everybody that something really is wrong with this guy. >> ok. that's larry in north carolina. of donald trump, and i'll draw from your experience, from covering the clinton thatchment, parallels you're seeing between then and now, the differences you're

and now.tween then >> certainly the big parallel is int before, at this point, the impeachment process, we were toecting the republicans impeach bill clinton along party lines and then he had a good surviving, being expelled from office by the democratic dominance of the senate at that time. and that's what happened. see the parties are reversed, but the same scenario here to be unfolding again. i think this is certainly a discontent. i think the democrats -- i changed my mind. first i thought it was foolish of democrats to push for impeachment. gonna be good's for us in the long run in this country, because we need to -- throw down as to marker and say this is not acceptable. i know republicans i've talked privately, who will talk about donald trump's unacceptable behavior.

they are -- they know if they criticize trump in any way, their owndangering re-election f that's the one thing, with a politician, no matter what matter. don't endanger their re-election. they don't want to sabotage themselves. it's a level of character that we saw on display among watergate., back in and nixon himself, who at a certain point, when howard andr, somebody came to him said, mr. president, it's time, he stepped aside rather than face the impeachment that he saw coming. and donald trump is not going to step aside. [laughter] fight to tog to end, one way or the other. and that's a big difference. and i can't fault him for that, because that's what bill clinton did. about were complaining bill clinton. why don't you just resign? i myself thought he wouldn't did.the year, but he and he came out the other end. he had won the public over to his side. what trump is trying to do now. that really hasn't changed.

theolling tells you, and parallels we draw, where the parallels were with bill they are now with donald trump. >> one thing that strikes me right now is that donald trump's approval, first of all, haven't 50% up, never gone above through his entire term so far. that's a first among presidents began.olling and secondly, the -- yeah, it of swing backkind then, in the clinton era, where well, maybe he deserves to be impeached but rise to the level of being kictd out of -- kicked out of office. defendersump's himself kind of use that as a model now. denying herump was did anything wrong. now he's kind of going silent on issue, while his defenders have swung over to, well, maybe did something wrong but it doesn't rise to the level of impeachment. to defendeasier place

oneself, especially when the constitution has set up a aocess that's primarily political process for kicking rathery out of office than a legal process. >> clarence page is with us, a for the chicago tribune, joining us to talk about various issues. hear from wily in louisiana. morning to you all. i want to say one thing to mr. page. i'm 79 years old, veteran of vietnam. 1968.n the second tour in i'm just surprised to see the aboutvide, people talking make america great. ever since i've been on earth, have been inns charge of america. so what are you talking about, make america great? see the young people in the audience with that hate, screaming behind this guy, and i my friends that i talked to for years -- i was a mailman

found outrs -- when i they were trump supporters, don't have anything to do with each other. and i can't see, in my few years left, that we'll ever come together. >> thank you for your service and thank you for calling. about thate along same time. we are seeingat well, an attitude on the part of many folks that our system is in trouble. a good lookto take at it and try to correct those drifted apartave from the american ideal over the years. vietnam war followed by lotrgate, i think, left a of us cynical and sarcastic about the ability of government value of the the virtues that we identify with the land of the free and the

home of the brave. i hope we will be able to plod out of this period now with a new attitude of hope. >> i was going to ask you, michael, off of twitter, adds this. idealism of youth is what attracts them to politics. do you think that idealism is still there? see it all the time with young people around this town. go over to the washington internship center, where you'll see very bright, young high school kids there, just eager to part of what has been state ofas the deep bureaucracy, blah blah blah. but the notion of public in life doing something larger than just yourself, that notion is fundamental. thethe notion that this is land of opportunity, to be able to achieve your dreams and help other people achieve theirs. that hope is still out there. am very excited about -- as muchfeel confident, as my son and i argue about politics, i feel comforted by

i'm seeing generally as to what's going to happen to the inherit, andey they are inheriting it. i can complain all i want to, going to be gone while they're taking over. them.got to help prepare >> from brooklyn, maryland, in our 35 to 55, category. calling.r go ahead. >> i have to apologize. i called in on the wrong number. a coupleted to share of things real quick with clarence. i know those generational issues talking about today, my time goes back -- my first in thengs were back eighth grade when i was in my history class. me, doory teacher told you know what the definition of history is? it's when people have documentation that can back series of events. i was quickly corrected. no, it's when two liars get they agree on the same thing. that kind of resonated with me. thentil i went into

national guard, 1966. i couldn't quite figure out why we were going into sovereign nations to take on corporaters so the manufacturing people, our military, were getting wealthy politicians going right along with it. t following that, all the way up i'veaq and afghanistan, got four children who are all on the same page. who where the beneficiaries of what it is we have done through our corporations and now our politicians? that is where the generational divide is coming. the country is so divided because of what is going on now to reunite and to restructure what we have. it looks like that is going to be a long road for these kids that are now coming up. that is what i had to say and i appreciate you giving me the time. host: thank you very much. guest: very quickly, i share your feelings about what got us into vietnam and what is the

egacy. i am so thankful for the vietnam series because after my service i am able to see just why because -- the big issue here is a difference in perceptions. viewing vietnam as a place to push back global communism and the threat it posed to the united states and the vietnam -- - and the vietnamese view it as the latest chapter in their century-old struggle for independence, first from france and the later from the states and other outsiders. you are in a much better posi tion to fight when you are fighting for your own homeland then trying to take control of somebody else's that you didn't even know how to find on a map a few weeks ago.

that is the difference between the u.s. and the vietnamese perceptions of the war. burns, he hasen collected the amount of lying that went on from washington about what the war was about, how well we were doing. it really appalls me. talked to -- i talked to robert mcnamara before he died, secretary of defense back then, captain of our vietnam policy. about, he wrote -- he knew that in 67 the war was lost but did not know how to get out of it. that is where lbj was at and everybody else but they didn't let the rest of us know it. in 69.rafted it struck me naturally.

had half the names that you now see on the vietnam memorial. the war went on and we see now that all of that loss-of-life occurred. general.r in i could reconcile with myself saying that we at least learned a lesson that we will not repeat. some years later we have the war in iraq. i remember colin powell and other vietnam veterans were not as eager to go to erect as those who did not serve -- go to erect -- -- go to iraq as those did not serve. we ended up in another vietnam situation and we are still living with that disaster around the middle east that we see today. this is one of those generational differences that holds up because somehow the same mistakes keep getting made in washington.

host: if you had to send a message to the younger people? i remember advice my grandmother gave me after i finished high school and was starting college and she said just prepare yourself because some days the doors of opportunity are going to open up and you want to be able to step inside. that was a common saying among a lot of black folks who were colleges, of black that opportunities were opening up and that we needed to take advantage of them. i say the same thing to young people now. i say be flexible. especially if you are a journalism major. lee flexible because lives change -- be flexible because life changes. you want to be ready for when change occurs.

like my father used to say, there are two peoples in this world, the movers and shakers and the moved and shaken. host: clarence page serves as a columnist for the cup -- for the chicago tribune. announcer: c-span's "washington journal" live. coming up friday morning, author doug reed discusses his book "inside trump's white house: the real story of his presidency." and alan rickman discusses impeachment efforts and he believes president trump's impeachment is inevitable. be sure to watch c-span's "washington journal" friday morning. join the discussion.

>> i'm going to state as a democrat where all 77 counties in 2016 voted for president trump. i think there's been enough evidence in what i have seen which is unfortunate -- unfiltered on c-span and without commentary from millionaire anchors that there needs to be a trial in the senate. let the process work its way out. if trump is not guilty, let the process work its way out. >> live coverage of the impeachment inquiry and the administration's response on

c-span. c-span, your unfiltered view of the impeachment inquiry. >> the house judiciary committee holds a hearing next week with constitutional scholars as part of the impeachment inquiry on president trump. it's intended to focus on the constitutional grounds for presidents on impeachment. according to a statement from jerrold nadler the president has been invited to attend and have his legal counsel participate by answering questions we will have a live question on c-span3. you can also watch online at c-span.org or listen live on the free c-span radio app. host: this is adam goodman who joins us from st. petersburg, florida. he serve as a republican media strategist to talk about the impeachment inquiry. thank you for joining us on this thanksgiving day.