change the equation. i think it made it a moral and ethical question, and readers realize this, too. when i was at the kennedy presidential library, i looked at the letters kennedy was receiving and librarians were sending him letters, schoolteachers sending him letters, did you really ride this book -- did you really won -- did you really dove right this book -- did you really write this book? >> c-span, your unfiltered view of government, created by cable in 1979 and brought to you today by your television provider. n journal continues. host: joining us from new york city is coalition co. president and ceo, carol jenkins, joining us to talk with us about the e.r.a. and efforts to revive the e.r.a. and past the e.r.a. carol jenkins, give our viewers

a brief history of its passage and why it is current, now. for havingks so much me, again. i love being on your program to talk with you and your viewers. about this extremely essential amendment that we need to place on the constitution. the constitution needs to be fixed one more time. it has been amended, 20 seven times. the e.r.a. would be the 28th amendment. it will effectively say that you in factibit -- it would put into the constitution prohibiting discrimination by sex. that is a major advancement in our constitution. prohibit this termination. that is why we need it. it would be to put women into the constitution. , it did notitten include women. women were deliberately left

out. yesterday, we had a huge day in the house of representatives. delegates and representatives passed a bill by jackie speier, from california, that would dissolve the time limit that was imposed on the e.r.a. bill, when it was passed by congress in 1972. so, where we are now with the equal rights amendment, originally proposed by ellis paul in 1923. we have been working on this for almost 100 years. 50 years since congress passed it by two thirds of the representatives there. now, ratified by 38 states across the country. what has happened is that after a long period of what people considered stalling or no visible action, we have tremendous action. we have met the requirements

outlined in the constitution on article five for amending the constitution. we have the two thirds vote. we have the 38 states. it next step is to certify by the archivists and make it happen. that will give millions of girls rightsen in this country and privileges that they do not have now. host: you pointed out the passage in the u.s. house, extending the timeline. this is a headline in usa today. the house breeds life into the equal rights a minute. it faces a challenge in the u.s. senate. it has to pass the senate, correct? guest: it does, indeed. i want to say it is not a matter of extending the deadline. it is a matter of dissolving, removing completely, the time limit that was imposed. we don't use the word deadline. it was not in the amendment itself that the states voted on. it was in the joint resolution

or the introduction, what some call the preamble. it was nothing that the states voted on. votedething the states on. we believe it can and should be removed. it has to go to the center and we have a bill there. senators ben cardin and lisa murkowski have a bipartisan bill that already has 44 cosponsors and we hope it will be moving forward in the u.s. senate. host: tell us about the state level. the state of virginia has passed the e.r.a.. statesber -- guest: our legal task force does not believe that will work, that they have the right to. you cannot have excessive legislative bodies undoing what

earlier bodies have done. it would just breathe chaos into everything that we try to do in the country, legally. so, there is obviously a lot to be determined as we move forward in trying to get the amendment totally accepted and placed as the 28th amendment to the constitution. host: carol jenkins is our guest, joining us in new york, talking about the equal rights a minute. the effort to pass it is certainly successful. the measure was passed in the house, yesterday. and the challenge ahead in the u.s. senate, as she mentioned him to go. we welcome your calls and comments. four republicans. (202) 748-8000 for democrats. for independents, (202) 748-8002 . i wanted to play the comments of justice ruth bader ginsburg.

she dealt a fatal blow to the equal rights a mimic. her comments were used in the floor debate in the house, yesterday. here is what the justice said. >> there is a distinction between equal protection clause and having an actual amendment that lays it out. years ago, i was involved in some litigation involving extension of the deadline on the equal rights a minute. we recently had virginia passing equal rights amendment. leaving aside whether any deadline will be extended, what is your prognosis on when we will get an equal rights amendment on the federal level? >> i would like to see a new over.ing, to start there is too much controversy about latecomers in virginia, long after the deadline passed. plus, a number of states have withdrawn their ratification.

count a latecomer on the plus side, how can you disregard states that have changed outlines? host: what did you think when ginsburg justice repai say she would like to see a new beginning? guest: the timing could have been better. it does not come as a complete surprise to us because she has said that before. what we know is she is a fervent supporter of the equal rights amendment. what we believe is that we can start over. session, every represented of carolyn maloney's bill, we do exactly that. -- representative, carolyn maloney's bill, we do exactly that. while we have this other activity that we have been working on, this amendment that we have been working on for almost 100 years, we do not want

to dishonor the work of 100 years at 50 years, or, for some ,eople who are still with us 1923. we are prepared to complete this movement to its finish. we believe we can get this amendment ratified and placed on the constitution. if we do not succeed, we are willing to start all over again. easily. scare that we understand, we get it. yesterday, for instance, at the house of representatives, i took my 10-year-old granddaughter with me. she has been working on the e.r.a. since she was seven years old. i wanted her to see the good results of the work that she did in accompanying me to a representatives office and offices, trying to get them to support and be cosponsors for the amendment. i have a photograph of her

--ting next to at least the conversation they were having was that if we succeed 50 in this effort, ellie's years would surpass avery's three years. if we don't and we have to start all over again, it is possible that avery's legacy will be 50 or 60 years in the future of trying to do that. remember, it is getting a two thirds agreement in congress and getting 38 states. that is a tough order. we can do it if we have to start all over again. i would rather honor ellie's 50 years of work that she has put toit, rather than task avery get these kinds of rights for girls in our country. do we really have to wait

another two or three or four generations before girls have the same rights as men or boys in this country? host: we have a number of calls to gretchenwill go in montauk, new york, first. good morning. caller: good morning. i was so happy i watched it on to gretchen inc-span, yesterday. i met ellie in the 70's. i have been working as long as her. aboutthat movie on hbo ruth bader ginsburg and she made a brilliant comment that the word woman is not used one time in the constitution. are doing it and thank you so much. you make my day! guest: thank you for calling in. we will do it. hopefully now, we are determined to get this done. thank you for your work. host: in california, democrats

line, go ahead. caller: hello. guest: hi, good morning. we didn't catch your comment. caller: have you read the brilliant matilda, josh and engage? lyn gage? guest: i have heard of her work. is that a favorite source of yours? i no of her work but i am not read her work. i know people who are working on her legacy which is extremely important. host: what is your comment? caller: she was a brilliant writer. like ruth bader ginsburg, she -- sometimes you have to change the words of what you are trying to get to. if you can't say what you mean, you can't mean what you say and you can't get what you want. i think women don't want a quality they want equivalent rights as wind. they see men or other women

working in a different category, doing the same work they do, and they are getting paid significantly less because they are not in the same category. the people right next to them, the men next to them are getting equal pay as they do. they are not getting the equal pay as the people in a different category. work, youquivalent should get equivalent pay. host: we will get a response. guest: we agree. i think that so much of the research demonstrates that women , we say are the chief of labor in our country. magnificentulted in profit lines for so many corporations and even small companies. they are consistently underpaid for the same equivalent as he would say, for the same work. even some of the good guys who think and say great things about equal pay and of how supportive

they are of women, when they look at their books, they discover that they are paying the women than -- less than they pay the men. these are the good guys. we had press conferences and releases saying yes what? we can say -- guess what? we can now say that we pay the women but we pay our men. we have had to make adjustments to do that. it may have costed millions of dollars to do that. is one of the things that will change america. america, we think of it as this great democracy. it is one of the great ones. it does not treat its women well. are in not until women the constitution. we have tried everything else. we have tried the pipeline. we have spent trillions of dollars, trying to equal things up and it has not worked. people are still the floor of our country. the underpaid, the underemployed.

the only thing that is going to change that is e.r.a.. host: let's go to michael in alabama. first times is my calling c-span in several months. please forgive me if i sound nervous. this jenkins, before i ask my aestion, let me, as born-again saved christian, let me apologize thoroughly for all of those white males out there, some black ministers who say they love women so much but, in opposing not only the e.r.a. but some of the radical ones, such things as female governors, they constantly quote saying they love women, they quote first corinthians chapter 11 and first timothy chapter two and first peter, chapter three. all of which -- they interpret

these literally for the 21st century and i want to apologize about that. my concern, however, is even though i am a political liberal when it comes to washington's fiscal policy, gunowners responsibilities and foreign policy based on human rights, i am a little concerned about and wonder about whether or not conservatives -- religious conservatives are correct about possible side effects if the e.r.a. were passed. filing who as people want unisex bathrooms, same-sex or,rooms, filing lawsuits one incident i think in the state of oregon, flaming male cross-dressers leading children in storytime at a public library, would you address those concerns for undecided american voters, thank you so much.

thank you so much for your call today. you have raised some important issues. we want to say that we totally .espect personal beliefs those of us working for the equal rights amendment, none of us want that to interfere with anyone's private, personal beliefs. the equal rights amendment is about giving girls and women equality. that is what we are working for. i know about all of the side that are brought up. this is not the form to the side or debate those personal beliefs . this is a question about constitutional equality. do you believe that women should have equal rights in this country? that is a straightforward question that can be answered yes or no. peopledo, then that

rights amendment is a way forward for you. if you don't, object. we disagree with people on all kinds of things. and we respect the disagreement. the ability to. if you believe in equality for do,n and, most americans our research demonstrates that 94% of all americans want constitutional equality for women. 99% of the millennials, the young people want equality for women. whoe are people out there say no we don't. in 2020, we consider that to be mystifying to us. but, you are right to believe that is absolutely yours. -- but you're right to believe that is absolutely yours. extending the deadline

ratification, removing that, going onto the senate, say it passes congress, a number of legal experts have cast doubt on whether the removal of that deadline can be applied retroactively. what could be ahead for the e.r.a. and the courts? could this wind up being a supreme court decision? guest: it could. many say it most likely will. for all of the legal activity that we have had surrounding the sure helately, i'm dreamed it would never be his faith that he would be sued by alabama and two other states and three ratifying states. my people in massachusetts. they are demanding that he not certify virginia, and therefore orplete the requirements

make the e.r.a. the 20 of women or that he do it, we have definitely entered the legal phase of this. the courtroom phase of it. fortunately for us, the executive branch has no authority in amending the u.s. constitution so it is an opinion. not anything that is valid, in terms of determining the outcome. he said he will not do anything. the archivist says he will not do anything until there is a final court order. we assume that he means the supreme court. int: we will hear from anne

louisville, kentucky. caller: i would like to talk about what i was reading about this morning that is happening in connecticut, about two young andwho identify as women are competing against women in a track and field event. if we are wanting equal rights on yourn, the lady panel nose in your heart -- her heart and anybody would know in their heart that women would not be able to compete against a biological male in a sport. my daughter is us women. all you would have to do is look at the competition times of the men against the women and you can see that there is no way that women can compete. sportsare looking at across the board, how in the world could anyone say that women are being treated equally when they are allowing dialogical males to compete against them in the exact same sport? host: we will get a response

from carol jenkins. guest: we think that is a matter that is best decided in the courts. having much to do with so equal rights amendment, that we have to separate the things that people may object to . i think those things are handled best in the courts. i believe the supreme court is taking up cases that will resolve so much of the gender problems, controversy for us. how many states have made an equal whites -- equal rights amendment part of their state constitution? guest: we think there are about 25 states. which is, you know, a hefty number. the equal rights amendment movement continues, there will be more. states,with on ratified

working on the federal level. we have a call, every other week, we talk about strategy. things that have worked and have not. virginia is our star because they did such a magnificent job on the federal level. an york state is considering equal rights a minute that we have been working on as well. and is an expanded inclusive e.r.a. -- amendment that we have been working on as well. that is an expanded and inclusive e.r.a. it deals with race and gender. i think that, moving along, new york state would be the first to do that kind of inclusive e.r.a.. the governor is now supporting that. 62-0 inte passed it, the last session.

the assembly is about to take it up, now. as we move forward in this country, we will be looking at all kinds of constitutional createdn that has persistent problems for us. even though we have some laws that have worked very well for us, we can look around at our country and no that there is know discrimination -- there is still discrimination and huge gaps in terms of wealth gaps in our country. one of the ways of fixing that is by amendments. host: we will hear from bill on our democrats line. caller: good morning, c-span and thank you very much, miss jenkins. happy valentine's day. guest: thank you. watching yesterday and what is it with the conservative white republicans? why do they hate women? why are they afraid of women? i happen to be gay.

ago, past.5 months transgender remembrance day. palm springs, one of the gayest places on earth is where i live, and it is like why can't we just get along? the other night downtown, there was a lady on the street, in a wheelchair. she must have been 70 years old and homeless. of theto work with one food banks in palm springs. the senior center here, 300 people a week go through there, for food. over 140od bank, people are hurting. it is a mess. it is not benefiting anybody but the rich. host: that was a little off the topic but thanks for calling in. let me ask you about some pushback from the conservative eagle form and a statement about the e.r.a. -- forum and a

statement about the e.r.a. that says it will not give women any more current rights in the what they have -- than what they have. the supreme court, they say, has already applied the 14th amendment to women's issues. that is from the eagle forum. and there has been a great deal of progress. clearly, if you look at america and you look at its women, it has not been able to fix the , --s of deep-seated eded systemic problems in our country. i have great appreciation for those who are trying to use the 14th a moment to get records for women. so many things are not covered by the 14th amendment. i think that, you know, we just

have to take a look. the previous caller was talking about food insecurity and food banks and hunger in our country. i respect is bringing that up, because most of the hungry in this country are women. most of the homeless in this trying toe women, house and feed their children and have not been able to do that. domestic violence and aggression in the workplace have not been able to get sufficient recourse. we believe that the equal rights amendment will give constitution -- constitutional, federal recourse to women in these issues. all praises to the 14th amend. host: the language of the proposed equal rights a minute. equality of rights under the law shall not be denied or abridged by the u.s. on -- in any stay on the count of sex.

i don't have my constitution in front of me but that must be the shortest of language in any of the amendments to the constitution or in this case, the proposed amendment. guest: that's right. a little mystifying to all of us working so hard on it why there would be so much objection to it. mostly, it is because we are trying to -- fix so many issues in this one a mimic. we have to ask ourselves, this said, she grandmother said i want you to see the faces of people who are courageous enough, brave enough to do the right thing. they are doing this for you. nancy pelosi said to my granddaughter, this is all about you. this is all about the future generations of girls that do not need to live in a substandard environment for the rest of their lives.

we can get this done now. get: let's see if we can another call. lawrence from frostburg maryland, republican line. caller: thank you so much for c-span. i want to express to you the e.r.a. is not and should not be a republican or democrat issue. it should wholeheartedly be an american issue. piece that was put just a moment ago on the 14th amendment, somehow negates the , i don'tthe e.r.a. think that that can be sustained. it was in 1920, 60 years after we had the passage of the 14th amendment with the protections lost that we had to have the passage of the 19th of mimic which guaranteed the right to vote. i guess my concern is, with this

between the house and the senate, is it time for republicans and democrats to stand up, particularly people like moscow mitch, who have been appointing so many judges that will stand in the way, in terms of the judicial process, of fortifying some of the gains for women. this is not a republican or democratic issue. this is for our mothers, daughters, children, grandmothers, two standup united. host: we will get a response from carol jenkins. guest: thank you so much. it is a human rights issue. i agree, we agree. when you go across the country, asking people, they all say yes. we just have to get it done. thank you so much for your

impassioned support. host: here is paula, next up, in the nation's capital, democrats line. caller: yes, good morning c-span. thank you so much. i just had two thoughts. the first thought is i have been a federal government worker for a long time. things that the federal government, there is a false equivalency as far as women advancing in the federal government, where there are women now in positions, i work in human resources as a director, where we are in leadership positions. over time, these positions have ofn reduced in the level work, how they are classified and how they speak. there were men in these

positions, 20 years ago, that were executives. now, overall, in the lower level rankings, but still running the same kind of programs. you look at it as women advancing. it really isn't an advance if and we arere reduced earning less money. that is the first thing. the second thing i would ask of feel that theyou equal rights amendment can -- can it affect the right to choose? i'm not well versed in it. has may be a question that already been answered. but where is that connection? host: ok. guest: good news for you. the equal rights amendment will

affect the u.s. government and discrimination there. and discrimination in state government. two things. once it is ratified, there is a two-year waiting period. and then it applies to federal and state governments, initially. itturally, the impact of will change our country, dramatically. as for the choice issue, i think that, as i have said before, there is a format for roe v. wade. that is the law of the land, decided by the supreme court. we believe the courts are the place to debate those kinds of issues. and not to put that on the back of equality for women. we should be able to get this done in a very speedy and fair way. pay andr comment about she works for the federal government, let me ask you about title vii and title nine.

title vii applies to the civil rights act and prohibits discrimination against women in the workplace. with 15es to workplaces or more employees. title ix prohibits discrimination on the basis of sex in schools. in title vii, why hasn't that been enough to equalize both pay and treatment in the workplace for women? think, in so many cases, it is a person by person, case-by-case kind of approach. you have to go to court and have a lawyer and pay thousands of dollars in so many instances to get your due course. moni --where all the money has been donated and given the time's up for lawyers and given to women who feel that they have been discriminated against. moneya time-consuming,

consuming approach to equality. e.r.a. woulde the assist those. we are not talking about replacing any of that. we are not talking about diminishing the effect and value of that. yes, keep that and add the e.r.a.. enhances equality for women and gives it a fundamental right in federal cases. so many cases go all the way to the supreme court. justice will decide there is no grounds for it here. it is rejected, out of hand. this would permanently instruct -- enshrine the rights of girls and women into the constitution. i say just look around. look at pregnancy, women who are pregnant are being fired every day in this country, because they are considered a handicap to whatever workplace they may be in. adjustments are being made in many cases for the men.

giving a replacement, a desk job and things like that. all we need for evidence is the status of women in america and we know that it is substandard and we believe the only way of fixing it, we have tried everything else during a century of working for the e.r.a. and it has not worked. we have yet to make progress. we are nowhere near the equal girls that women and deserve in this country. they require something radical, big and fundamental. that is what the e.r.a. is. host: 10 more minutes without guest, carol jenkins, the copresident and ceo of the e.r.a. coalition. we welcome your calls. .epublicans, (202) 748-8001

democrats, (202) 748-8000. , (202) 748-8002 . i will play you the comments of here what you and have to say. >> it is problematic on several fronts. the resolution is unconstitutional. the time limit expired decades ago. congress cannot go back and remove a deadline from a previous constitutional amendment initiative. the supreme court has recognized e.r.a. expired. the department of justice issued a ruling saying congress may not revive or propose an amendment after the deadline for ratification has expired. limit --move the time saying we can remove the time limit is futile. if the time limit could be extended, the e.r.a. would not bring women anymore rights than

they currently have, right now. the it would entrance legality of abortion. -- entrench the legality of abortion. in 1998, the new mexico supreme court ruled that the equal rights and women in their state constitution requires state funding of abortions. federal courts are likely to do the same. host: a number of points in yesterday's debate. feel free to respond to any one of them. guest: i will say that the department of justice memo, opinion, has no affect, other the archivist from doing his job, momentarily. there are lawsuits.

nevada, illinois, and virginia, ey aree insisting that th doing their job. it has moved to the courts. that is where it ultimately will be decided. i think that we have covered so and of the outside issues placed it on the back of this one a memento gift women equality in this country. i say, it gives the impression that they hate women. i don't believe that is the case. we are just so fixed on the fact up withen can just put not being in the constitution, not having equal rights forever. they have done it, so far. i feel like there is a feeling out there of why should it change? it should change because it has to. the will of the people says that it must. even when we only had 35 states

ratified, i think about that and say how remarkable was that? that was 70% of the country. now that we have 38% -- 38 states ratified and we are working on a 50 state goal for the e.r.a. coalition, we work every day to see the other 12 states that have not ratified ratified. we are moving forward. we intend to finish this. we intend to make sure women have equality in this country. host: let's hear from joe in maine, next. caller: thank you c-span, for taking my call. the disproportionate amount of women who are not paid the if they will up the minimum wage, how will they ever take care of women or men? they are leaving them in

poverty, a sickly 40 hours -- basically 40 hours for minimum wage, you can do the math. how can you live on that? my second point is the senators and congressmen, it is my understanding that senators and wereessmen, some of them involved in sexual assaults that were covered up and they used senate money, taxpayer money to pay off these women and cover up, not always women. i will make that point. and cover up for themselves. they refused to investigate it earlier in this year. they refuse to investigate it now. sexual assaults where they use taxpayers money. there are people serving in congress and the senate, right now. it is outrageous. people expecting these to change a law that is going to get them in trouble? the facts on these assaults --

host: we will let you go, there. guest: we have a lot of work to do, don't we? that the equal rights amendment is -- would be able to assist women who have been the victims of aggression, sexual aggression. the me too movement -- #metoo movement has been a revelation to this country. people are on notice that this will not be tolerated. i appreciate your understanding and perception of what is going on. it is a little bit outside of my expertise to comment on the senators activities. we hope that they will support women. that senator cardin is convinced that should this bill remove the deadline and to the

senate floor, it will pass. it is a question of unlocking it. we talked about equal pay. the question from marietta saying why the disparity between black women and white women and other women of color in pay, doing the same job? will the e.r.a. fix that? thet: it will, because of cultural impact. we see it happening now that people are realizing that something is amiss. it has been amiss for ever. that,at they recognize they are beginning to make changes. still, you realize the figures in this country, the pay gap, a latina woman has to work an a whiteear beyond what man has worked to earn the same amount of money. what a white man earned in 2019, what - patricia,

calling from franklin, indiana, democrats line. caller: i was calling about the ratification. i think it can be done. i think miss jenkins can get a hold of it. i sure hope so. know, sometimes, all women are not married. they are the head of the household. you know, they have to feed their children or, you know, they have to work to make ends meet, where the it is -- whether it is rents, food, whatever. yes, we need this ratified, very much so. indiana.ricia in

where does indiana stand on this, carol jenkins? guest: give me a moment for that. [laughter] caller: i did not -- host: i did not mean to put you on the spot. any final thoughts for the caller, otherwise? guest: thank you so much for that. as we have pointed out, the women of america are the ones who are the hungriest. theones who are suffering most. what they need is legal representation in the equal rights amendment. so, i would send you to our website for more information. e.r.a. coalition.org. can go onstreated you our advocacy map. you can see whether or not you are a senator because that will be the next important thing, to

see whether or not you are a senator -- your senator is a timensor to remove the limit deadline bill. that is coming up in the senate, soon. please do that and thank you so much for your calls, today. ,ost: carol jenkins announcer: c-span's washington journal live every day with news and policy issues that impact you coming up this morning, we'll discuss election security th katherine waldren and a look at the equal rights penman.t with edith watch washington journal. join the discussion. and be sure to watch washington journal for museum week. we'll explore george washington's mount vernon. the national museum of the marine core, the