institutes dr. kevin gosar discusses the impact on the u.s. postal service. "washington journal" is next. washington journal is next. ♪ good morning and welcome to "washington journal." and local governments think about reopening the country post coronavirus pandemic, the question emerges on how to keep small businesses alive until then. a program designed to do that from the small business administration is out of money, threatening both small business owners and employees. congress is stalemated right now on the future of the paycheck action program as the country begins to talk about life after coronavirus. we want to know what you think about the small business loan program being out of money. we are opening up special lines for you this morning.

that means we want to hear from small business owners and small business employees, and we will open up a special line for you. if you own a small business, your number is going to be (202) 748-8000. if you work for a small business, we want to hear from you as well. your number is going to be (202) 748-8001. european counts as well, so we want to know what you think about the small business loan program being out of money, so your line is (202) 748-8002. keep in mind, you can always text us your opinion at (202) we are always reading on social media. on twitter at @cspanwj, and facebook at facebook.com/cspan. once again, small businesses are the life lot of america -- lifeblood of america, and the coronavirus pandemic has hit them hard. we want to know from you how you are surviving if you are a small

smallss owner and a business employee. let's get some information about the program first. let's go to politicos caitlin who is on the line and here to talk to us about what is going on with the small federal business loan program. caitlin, good morning. guest: good morning. thanks for having me. host: first and foremost, tell us what the paycheck protection program is and why is it out of money? right, well this small business lending program was created by the $2 trillion economic rescue package that congress cleared last month, so totaledkage of loans $350 billion, and was meant to smallas a bailout for businesses with fewer than 500 employees, and meant to keep employees on their payroll. as can apply for this loan

long as you're promising to keep all of your employees. you're not going to fire torybody, you are going keep paying everybody. in exchange, the loan could be forgiven. this pot of money has proven enormously popular, as you said. it ran out of money just yesterday. that was expected all week. obviously deadlocked right now in terms of what to do. do we swiftly replenish the funds for just this program, or do we provide funding for other priorities as well? caitlin, exactly who gets this money and what can they do with it? can businesses get this money and use it for other things besides employee paychecks, or is it designated for employee paychecks only? caller: it was primarily drafted at -- guest: it was primarily drafted as an incentive to keep employees on the payroll. like i said, in exchange for the funds, the loan can be forgiven

if you are promising to essentially retain all of your employees and maintain their salaries as well. this has proven enormously popular, more than 1.6 million and at least 5000 lenders participated. it was exhausted very quickly once the program was essentially set up. it was not without its glitches, the small business administration, which ran the program, experienced a lot of technical difficulties. inre are a lot of issues applying, and it definitely did not -- you can't say it went off without a hitch, essentially. the program has gotten a little bit of blowback, because, for example, major restaurant chains have qualified for some of the loans, if you have a lot of legitimate small as this owners saying well, that is not a small and you have a lot

of legitimate small business owners saying well, that is not a small business. this will need to be replenished very quickly. the conversation in congress right now about getting more money into the program? is there a partisan divide over whether the program was working, or is it over something completely different? guest: both democrats and republicans realized that small businesses are very much in need of more money. the program needs to be replenished. pelosi, speaker nancy pelosi and senate majority leader mitch mcconnell in agreement on that. that is pretty much the only thing they agree on. speaker pelosi and house democrats, they want some conditions placed on any new infusion of funds. for example, house democrats want to ensure that any new funds, at least some of that is going to community-based lenders

, underserved lenders, underserved small businesses owned by women and minorities that they are ultimately getting some of this money and not being cut out. in addition to that, house democrats also want to provide $150 billion for state and local governments, about $100 billion for hospitals, and they want to increase the maximum food stamp -- republicansis are essentially saying, you know, these are the priorities that are not as urgent as the small business needs. --s small process program small business program ran out of money. states have not run out of money yet. two trillion dollar economic package last month provided $150 billion for states. they argue that the small business program needs action now and the other things can wait until congress comes back

in early may and they start negotiating a huge package, but immigrants are pretty insistent on the fact that state and local governments are signaling a dire businesseslike small at this time, in addition to health care providers. they are saying, this is extremely urgent. it requires urgent action as well. there was essentially a logjam all week when it comes to this discussion, but we started to see some signs of progress when it comes to today. said mccarthy congressional leaders were inching along when it came to figuring out exactly what to do. politico's daily newsletter that publishes in the morning, it publishes also in the afternoon, had some early details on what a legislative framework might look like. not yetobviously very finalized, very, very much subject to change, but it does anear that there is

agreement may be forming around possibly providing more than $250 billion for small businesses, in addition to making some funds for community-based lenders, something like $75 billion for hospitals, but all of those details are very much subject to change. it is possible we can see an agreement may be early next week. last question a for you -- is anyone checking to make sure that the businesses that are getting these loans is using the money for what it is supposed to be used for? we remember during the last depression, corporations got government funding and used it for stock buybacks. is anyone checking behind this money to make sure it is being used for what they say they needed it for? right. the huge economic relief package that congress passed last month, it was the largest infusion ever of federal funds into the economy.

definitely eclipsing the 2008 financial crisis. that did come with a number of oversight provisions, which are slowly getting off the ground at the moment. basically, when it comes to a small business loan, that comes with its own oversight. but in terms of some of the other big pieces of the bill, congressional leaders found that it was very much necessary to have sort of a three-pronged oversight approach when it comes to implementation of the huge relief package. essentially, those three things again,ll, you know -- this bill was passed a few weeks ago, so the money is starting to flow, but not all of the mass of oversight protections are there. there are some provisions that prevent recipients of the aid, especially corporations, from stock buybacks, from executive bonuses, things like that.

basically, congress is trying to establish a five member congressional panel that will not oversee the small business loan, but the separate $500 billion corporate relief fund for big businesses, big distressed industries in addition to a special inspector general appointed by the president and confirmed by the senate will also separately oversee that fund. as the third prong of oversight, a sort of pandemic relief panel made up of inspector general's across the federal government will oversee basically general implementation of the bill. again, those three things are still kind of getting off the ground, you know ca -- you know? the president has gone some criticism for intervening too much in the process and trying to interfere with oversight. hopefully in the next week we will see those three oversight protections become fully formed. thankwe would like to

caitlin emma, budget and appropriations reporter for politico, for coming on the program this morning. caitlin, thank you so much and stay safe out there. "ruling ideas: the black book of the american left." thank you so -- guest: thank you so much. askedpresident trump was about additional funding for the small business loan program during a press conference yesterday, and here is what he had to say. [video clip] negotiations are underway for the next round of funding for small businesses. if tens of millions of dollars went in a matter of days in the first time, will this second relief package be enough? get us toly, it will a point that will be rather beautiful. we think that will be the points -- and it could be we need one more, but it could be at a certain point we need to stop. it has been a success and sq executed flawlessly, and the banks have gone --

done a good job. the community banks have been incredible. we had over 4000 community banks. they gave the money out. it is so organized and it has been such a great program. essentially we are waiting for $250 billion. the democrats are refusing to -- this is money that essentially is going to the workers. it will keep the company's whole whole, restaurants and a lot of companies, and it is a small amount of money relative to what it represents , because it represents small small businesses represent approximately 50% of the power of our business enterprises. not all the big monster businesses that you read about every day, it is all of these small businesses. it is something that should be approved by the democrats and republicans who want it badly, and the people want it very badly. 10% of the loans given

out work for $5 million, but some could not get a loan for $100,000. is that acceptable? nobody knew it was going to be this successful. when you say the money is gone, it has been a tremendous success of the program. somee really want it, and people will not be able to keep their business open unless they get that money. it has been a tremendous success, it has been executed flawlessly. with a few exceptions it has really been good, and i think the democrats are going to do it. is away on pelosi vacation or something and she should come back. she should come back and get this done. host: i want to emphasize some -- president trump said something president trump said during his conference there. the actual numbers of small businesses in the united states. information has been updated for april 2020. how many small businesses are there in the united states?

there are 30.2 million small businesses in this country, which compromise a whopping 99.9% of all u.s. businesses. now, they pulled this number from the small business association's office, which a small business as a firm with fewer 500 employees. this includes law firms, hedge funds, and other firms you might not they go when someone uses the term small business. how many americans are employed by these companies that have less than 500 employees? andera.com, small businesses employ 50 million , which makes up to 45% of the country's total workforce. almost half of all of the employees in this country work

for small businesses. we will talk to some of our small business owners and see what they think about this program and if they have been able to take advantage of it. let's start with juliet, from rockport, massachusetts. good morning. caller: good morning, jesse. you are back. i applied about three weeks ago to no avail. my bank is being uncooperative and unresponsive, because they did not have any guidance at that point in time from the fed, if you will, the fda. i urge the bank officer to send me an application, and i had absolutely no luck. then i went to the economic idustry disaster loan, which filled up the application with success online. i was under the impression that i would be eligible for a $10,000 forgivable loan, which would be a grant in essence, but anot in the mail a --n

email the other day that said since i am a sold would only be, i eligible for $1000 of that to be forgiven. then i got a notification from the state of massachusetts that i as a sole proprietorship, because i and other independent contractors in the gig economy, will be eligible for unemployment benefits. but they had to create a new portal because they have never done this before. they had to get guidance from the federal government. they basically said they wanted to use my business as an experiment to see if the portal actually worked. when obamacare debuted, no one could sign up because the website shutdown. it could not handle all the people at the time. so i was able to successfully

apply for what they call the pua pandemic unemployment assistance, through the state of massachusetts, which i will be eligible retroactively to get money from the last day that i worked, which was four weeks ago. i'm thinking there is light at the end of the proverbial tunnel after all, and we will see. i'm hoping all the other small independent contractors out there will find this conduit through their own state to get assistance and unemployment. juliet, it sounds like most of the assistance you have been getting has been coming from your state, not the federal government. not this multibillion-dollar program that came through congress. caller: no, the $350 billion success going no through my small bank. i have been banking with this thing for 25 years. they were frustrated too,

because they were not getting the right guidance and they were overwhelmed with inundated calls from other local businesses, and it has been a nightmare. actually i have savings in the ink to keep -- thankfully have savings in the bank to keep me solvent during this interim the governor baker, he might be extending foreclosure until the 15th of may and beyond, so we don't know. meanwhile, i am hoping and praying that the pua, the pandemic unemployment assistance will come through, and i will get some retroactive unemployment benefits. subsequent to that, additional benefits, plus the $600 they are adding on. ithink that is actually to -- am grateful for it, but i do not know if i will need that $600. i do not have employees, so i do not have someone else's family to worry about feeding, if you will, but i hope the other small

businesses out there have the opportunity to look into the pua . host: let's go to john, calling from westwood, massachusetts. good morning. caller: good morning, jesse. how are you? host: i should have asked juliet this question as well. what small business do you own and how many employees do you have? an accounting firm here in westwood, and i have three employees. i have worked for the last two weeks, night and day, to prepare these ppp applications, having applicationsst 70 for small businesses in my area. the last caller was also from massachusetts, and i would say to her that she would be eligible for massachusetts, probably the cap on unemployment

here is $832 a week plus the $600 stimulus that has been added. she will be getting $1400 a week, and that will be retroactive to april 1, the $600 is anyway, and that will hopefully help her out. my experience over the last 2, 2 and half weeks preparing these applications is exactly what she said. i have worked across 20 and trying tos follow the rules of each particular bank in place, there are particular forms that need to be filled out. every small business in this state has found they have had to go through their own bank in order to apply. they cannot cross banks, or i was not able to until the very thatable to find a bank

would accept applications outside of their own bank. that bank with paypal. eventually, paypal came on board, and we were able to load applications into paypal and use their loan builder bank to actually get a little bit of funding. now, the only 70 [inaudible] i have prepared applications for, of those, i have gone one funded and nine approved for funding that will have to happen over the next 10 days. that is all i have been able to do for my 70 small business applications. host: john, is the hold up on the side of the bank? is the hold up on the side of the business is applying for the loan, or is the hold up on the side of the federal government? --re's the checkpoints here chokepoint here? caller: the chokepoint is in

to approve these loans, because they all went through the banks, and the banks in turn have to do their packaging of the loan and shipping it to sba for approval, and i think the sba has been completely overwhelmed. talk to mary, calling from pearl, mississippi. good morning. caller: good morning. i have worked with an owner from a small business in trying to get one of these loans, and that was not exactly our experience. our problem was that the sba would not provide the provisions to the bank that they were to follow. processed. loan we literally had the complete package delivered on the first allow the sba would funding, which would april 3. the bank kept getting changes in information from the sba that

continued to ask for new information. they were not able to get it into the computer because of all the changes the sba was making until april 10. we got approved by the sba the soe day it was sent in, we did not have a problem with the sba, but now we've lost the because this bill was passed on march 27 and we are sitting on what, april 18, and we have yet to receive our money. host: so you're saying that you actually had your loan for the business you are working with, that loan was approved by the sba, but you still have not actually received the money? caller: correct. john is right, they are supposed to fund within 10 days, and we were told that we would be funded within 10 days, which is monday. but the sba, because they continue to change regulations to the banks, we still have more than one application, we still have more than one worksheet

form that the sba can't change. sent to us by email, we filled it out and submitted at the same day. i think our bank did an incredibly good job trying to follow the rules the sba was issuing. host: let's talk to jim, calling from bellevue, washington. what type of business do you own? caller: a small printing business here in washington. i have a lot of hispanic employees in my field, and i'm thinking about -- have you ever had vaccines? vaccines, or a perfect candidate for trying the possibility of -- like smaller businesses like orchards and meatpacking plants. this is where a lot of will be willing to volunteer to try that polio vaccine, which actually has rna

for months orl, years even. why do you think that young people don't get the symptoms from this covid? it is because they all have had like polio,ines rubella, measles, and they were all vaccinated. these folks, they never had that. host: i think we were seeing a lot of younger people showing up with coronavirus, so i do not know if we can say that this is something that is not hitting the younger population just as well as the older population. percentage, it is very minimal compared to ours. ands and 50's, 60's 70's. my dad died over a month ago.

he was 85. whether he died from this or not we never did find out. want oure -- look, fearful leader said, what do we have to lose? host: let's talk to gary this morning. good morning. caller: good morning. yes, good morning. i am a disabled veteran and i am a little confused. if the people have already been laid off and they are on unemployment, they are being counted as the unemployed, wire businesses getting funds to root -- why are businesses getting funds to retain them once they are already gone? if you are getting funds to retain them, aren't they going to be double paid? another thing is that some of the small businesses that we talk about, one of them made $42 million in profit last year and

they got a $20 million loan. me in a capitalist society, if you got that kind of profit, you ought to be able to carry your employees for a know? while, you they are laying off their employees and they got a $20 million loan. as soon as joe biden gets in , they will start demanding that social security cut.edicare be somebody has to pay for this sooner or later. the is reason i was really concerned about it. thank you for letting me get that in there. host: one thing we don't think about as small businesses are actually farms. definition the same the sba is using for other businesses. agriculture secretary sonny perdue talked about an assistant for farmers and people

who work in agriculture. here is what he had to say. >> american agriculture has been hard hit, like most of america with the coronavirus, and president trump is standing with our farmers and i'll americans to make sure we all -- all allicans to make sure we get through this national emergency. usda is announcing the coronavirus food assistance program. this new 19oned, billion-dollar program will take several immediate actions to assist farmers, ranchers, and can rumors in response to the covid-19 national emergency. in response to the covid-19 national emergency. billion in is $16 payments to farmers and small businesses that experience unprecedented losses during this pandemic. we decided to use the funds in the ccc, the current funds of -- 6.5 million

dollars, combined with the covid money, rather than wait for the replenishment of the ccc funds in july. it is becoming apparent we will need the additional ccc funds as we continue to track the economic losses. secondly, and this is really usda will bee purchasing $3 billion in fresh produce, dairy and meat products to be distributed to americans in need who are food bank foodrks -- through our bank networks, as well as other community and faith-based organizations. having to dump vegetables that not only for market is financially distressing, but heartbreaking as well to those who produce them. this will only provide direct economic relief, but allow for the purchase and distribution of agricultural abundance in this country to help americans in need. host: let's look at some of our

onets and texts coming in the program that is now out of money. one tweet says sent the application to the bank, never got it received. bank says don't worry -- never got a response. the bank says they never got a record of this. it was documented. bank doesn't pick up their phone. fedor and out of money. fed ran out -- the of money. loan never happened. tweet that says, there needs to be a reclassification of small business, a small business is very different from a company of 100 and a mom and pop of 20 employees. starting point lead itself to the failure of the smaller companies getting funds.

another says the big boys get to use the treasury. are talking this morning about the small business loan has run out of money, as the country starts to think about what happened post coronavirus. we are opening up special lines. we want to hear from business owners and employees. we want to hear from you if you are working for a small business and are hoping to get part of this patient protection program let's go to gerald, in bend, oregon. good morning. caller: good morning. how is it going? host: just fine. go ahead -- first, what type of small business do you have and how many employees? caller: i own a janitorial business and provide essential business, you know, sanitation and that stuff like that, particularly during this time in

the pandemic. for myself, i only have myself and usually one other employee that works with me running my stuff, ok? i am an extremely small business. i may still proprietor. is -- this small type stuff they have going on, you see, i was not looking into it too much. the businesses that i provide essential work for, essential businesses here and the sanitation side of it, heaping people safe and their health of so they don't catch this -- help so they don'tp catch this. one of my clients happens to be one of the largest tire dealerships in the northwest. they are having a tough time, so my feeling, you know, why build them out -- bail them out?

i'm getting pay later and later. it is a tough time because i have had to lay off so many people. i try to get these loans, and i have a person, i do not have a 720 five go score. -- i am a person, i do not have fico score. i have a 640, which is pretty decent, but either way, i cannot get approved for a loan. what am i supposed to do? am i supposed to close my shop up, close up doors on my stuff and stop running or what? that is my question. you know, if we are going to help financing and help small ,usinesses get through this

let's do it the right way. host: let's talk to lynn, calling from monterey, california. what type of business do you have and how many employees are working for you? caller: i am a dentist. i had two employees. my services have been declared non-essential. host: have you applied for the ppp yet? what is your experience? caller: i don't qualify. in order to qualify, you have to give your employees at least 40% of what they used to earn, and my hygienist has already applied for the time it, by have the loan papers to look at. i cannot afford to pay her $50 an hour to do nothing, and hygiene services have been declared non-essential. you going to are

do? i know you are probably still a contact with your employees, because you want to open back up. doing?e they caller: one employee comes in for four hours a day, she helps me writing checks against the balance that is overdrawn, and the other one is on unemployment. she had a good income, but my services have been declared non-essential. i went to dental school instead of medical school. today --very busy would have been very busy today if i had gone to medical school, but my services have been declared non-essential. i can't make a living. is yourat do you think future? how do you think you will be able to survive through this? caller: i am doing my darndest. i applied for the loan of

$10,000. there is no reason i even applied, no activity on that whatsoever. again, i would employ people, but i cannot go on justifying a $50 in our employee with no work -- $50 an hour employee with no work. [inaudible] caller: it's josh, you said it right. host: what's happening with you? caller: we are a small roofing business. we only take care of the small area around us, and it has been really hard with this corona, because no one is trying to get people on the roof anymore. let's go to elizabeth, calling from waterbury, connecticut. what type of business to you on?

own?r: -- do you caller: good morning. i have a small little luncheonette. i employ three people. i am running on maybe 20% of my business because i don't have any sit-down, and i am next to a university so everything is closed around me. i wanted everybody to understand is sohis ppp program fraught, just so everybody knows, 4% of the loans that were made accounted for 44% of the dollars already spent. they should have had a maximum. of business that made more than $5 million a year, then you didn't qualify. how does ruth cruise's

steakhouse qualify for $21 million? they are a chain. you have to have 500 employees -- these are mcdonald's. all of them applied. this is not small business. i am a small business. i carry maybe 3, 4 employees. that is it. i do not make $20 million. they report that they make all of this prophet all of these years, millions of dollars worth of profit, and now all of a sudden they are applying for these loans. the care'sied for acts, the ppp, i have not gotten a cent. on fumes, tapping into my savings and my credit cards. this is our tax dollars. this is what gets me pistol off -- pissed off.

we pay our employees, we follow the rules, and all of these big businesses are getting the money. it is just not fair. i'm sorry i am running on, but i am so upset over this. host: let's go to our caller from wayne, new jersey. you work for a small business. how is that working for you? guest: caller: i would love to know caller: -- caller: caller: i would love to know your opinion about this. it is aor a church, catholic church and i have been getting paid. the church applied for the sba loan. i have no idea if they got it or do yout my question is, think it is right that churches should be asking for this kind of money? i always stop there was a separation of church and state, and while i am happy to be i don't know.ney, i don't know what the word is. i do not understand the whole process.

today, i am appalled by the but i do notthing, know how a is considered small business. -- a church is considered small business. iran, from talk to west chesterfield, new hampshire. where he is a business owner. what business do you own? caller: you guys rock. i love this show. i have pretty much the same problem as one of the last allows that called in, janitorial service? i own a small cleaning company and i have for close to 20 years now. i have an a plus rating through the bbb. i do not have any employees right now. i have not recovered from 2008, my business hasn't and i haven't either. -- 2008, i finances had to fire all of my employees,

i have lost a lot of my contracts, and i have not been able to replace those contract yet. bad becauseore is loans8, the predatory back then ate me alive. they basically drove me into bankruptcy. i would probably qualify for a , i really don't know. i have gone to work part-time for walmart just to try and make ends meet, but i am making at walmart in two weeks when i was making in one afternoon working for my company. if i can even get help at this point, because like the other gentleman said with a score, as well as not having any other employees and everything, i do not know if that would cover me or if i

could even get the loan. i i could get the lin loan, wil have to pay something like that back or would it be more of a grant or something? i do not know what is out there for me, whether i would qualify for anything, but i do know i am in pretty bad financial shape -- i have been since 2008, but i so i doelp back then not expect any now. this weekend, c-span cities tour explores the american story as we feature the history and literary life of brian, college city texas. collegeur brian literary offerings. inis presley was drafted 1958, transforming a teen idol into a soldier.

[video clip] the firstdrafted into peacetime conscript army the u.s. had ever had. we had constriction a year before world war ii, -- conscription a year before world war ii, but elvis was in the drafted army, a very distinct you know terry force -- distinct military force that we have never had since. it was extremely ineffective because of extremely high turnover. norm a sociala experiment. it was the first peacetime attempts to bring people from all over the united states, from also to those is a -- all sorts beliefs, and created an army out of that. host: let's see what our social media followers are saying about the ppp.

here is one tweet, that says three weeks is literally lightspeed for the federal government to implement a brand-new program, talking about the ppp. here is another tweet that says, the federal government needs to get the rest of the funding signed up on so our businesses can are in open and pay our employees. it is crucial to a small businesses and family businesses . for onefrom facebook, i am not surprised. another post from facebook that says, did planned parenthood run out of money or the nea or ntr or pbs? did we run out of foreign aid? it's always the little guy that runs out of money. the lives want to fund every group that gives kickbacks to the left but ignore the folks

that paid taxes and make the economy work. to our phone lines and talk to some more business owners, small business owners and see what is going on with them. let's start with robert, calling from were sister, massachusetts. good morning -- worchester, massachusetts. good morning. caller: good morning. i am plate 10 -- i employee 10 and they are all minorities. i am so happy i talked to every host of the show. it is good to see you. we do carpentry. we do electricity. roofing,aning, we do we do everything. what happens right now is that all of the white companies -- i

don't want to get real negative, jesse, but we can do anything. have 20 employees, i employees that went down last week. i paid them, their wives, their them,en, i take care of but this money for small business -- i am a small business guy. i take care of my own small business. i don't need no government to come tell me how to take care of my employees. understand what i am saying. my employees are the greatest thing that ever happened to me. i have 10 employees and [inaudible] very, very serious thing i'm talking about. that's all i have to say, jesse. talk to tina, calling from gainesville, florida. what small business do you own? caller: i have a regional shop

-- retail shop. host: how many employees do you have working for you? the host:out six at time. have you been able to get an application in -- at the time. host: have you been able to get an application in? caller: at first, i was told that they would not give it to me unless i already had a loan with them, then they got some backlash for that, so i reapplied and then they said, you can't have it unless you have no loans with anyone else. i didn't, so i applied, and they put in a third application. and they mentioned oh, now we are changing it from 500 employees to 50. technically, that was nothing to do with me, but i wanted to let this be known out in the public, that having to go through banks has been a major disaster. i hope anyone who has control over this may be can fix it

somehow. jerry,et's talk to calling from phelps, new york. you are a small business employee. what has been happening with you? caller: we are a veterans organization and we heard about this thing -- i was watching it we had already decided to try to continue to pay our employees as long as we could. i think this thing cannot out on friday, so on a monday i contacted our local bank. they sent us a link, with a lot the application and monday morning submitted all the paperwork. what -- iproved by think it was the end of the week for a loan. i did not think it was very hard to process at all? host: have you already received

the money from the loan? caller: i was going to continue on -- the fly in the ointment is now the way the unemployment is being paid out with the $600 bonus. some of our employees have decided that is more to their advantage to file for unemployment rather than continue to pay them. so we have had to restructure so loan now and resubmit it, waiting to hear about that. michael,'s talk to calling from cleveland, ohio. what type of business do you own? caller: yes, hello. it is deemed essential because it is in the auto repair area, and we went through our bank to apply for the loan. a gave me the list of stuff that we needed before we started.

and itan online process, gives you [inaudible] the are still preparing documents for the loan. we did it the first day, april email, you know, got an yesterday or the before that documents for the loan are being prepared. once we get that and go through it, and electronically sign for will be available. how many employees do you have and what are you doing with them? you said you are still open, but i am sure you are not seeing as much business as you would have a month ago.

what are you doing with your employees? how are you handling it? caller: where small, three full part-times,ree and i have been able to keep everything running as of now. once the funds come in, i expect to be able to continue for at rent eight weeks and pay -- to pays to rent rent and utilities and with our wages. host: let's talk to eddie, calling from dunkirk, new york. what type of business do you have? caller: i have an electrostatic painting business. i paint roof restores, go to colleges and schools in western new york. and i have applied for the small on thes loan to the sba

29th, and i also applied recently, our federal crime in loansproved to do the vba college i live for on wednesday, but then i got an email from the banquet thursday -- bank by thursday that the sba is out of money. host: will you have to reapply, or are they just holding your application and if they get more funding it will go through? caller: he said they are actually holding my application. i did go on the sba website and it shows my application has been , andved for the pvv alone i called the sba and she said the bank will approve you, and i said no, the bank has to be approved by you before they give me approval. once they are guaranteed, they give you money for the ppp loan.

the other money i did through on the 29th of march. a week later, i get any mail telling me that i need to changed theuse they application. the first one did not have the $10,000 vance. they wanted me to do another application. the first application was accepted, but they put it on hold because a new one came out. let's talk to roger, calling from salina, kansas. good morning. caller: good morning. i farm, and i know the farmer's , but my wife and my daughter also have a small retail stores for more they have to not to stores in two locations.

my daughter was on top of it when they first started speaking about these loans, and said -- they had never borrowed anyone any money before, so i said you need to get your information into whatever bank you want to go with. top of it,y on getting the tax returns in and getting everything that they needed. as soon as they got the money ready, she was approved. they are a small business, they two main employees and probably nine part-time employees, students and things .ike that they were approved, they received the money, but it is just enough to take care of rent and their two salaries halfway, but they were his way things to

get real or so great they cannot do anything. on until things change. host: let's look at the latest story from the wall street journal, what is happening with the mixed small business packet -- next small business package. this came out on april 17. every plantation of popular loan programs for small businesses showed signs of easing friday as one of the measures sought by democrats in the negotiations with treasury secretary steven mnuchin over the next round coronavirus eight. coronavirus eight. house minority leader kevin mccarthy said that he would support combining hospital additional $250 billion for the paycheck p,otection program, or pp

which exhausted its initial $350 billion allocation on thursday. hospitals are the modern-day so soldiers, kevin mccarthy said. i would like to see the money and ppp and the hospitals. democrats have been sparring for it about the makeup of aid and in these it includes coronavirus pandemic. they want to expand access to the loan and include more money for hospitals, food assistance, and state and local governments. republicans have said they want to keep the bill focused on increasing small business aid and defer other funding debates until broader legislation is crafted. mr. mnuchin and democrats were coalescing around adding about $75 billion of hospital funding to the package. let's see if we can talk to a

couple more business owners before we wrap up the hour. let's try randy, calling from kentucky. what type of the business do you own? export i own an import, company, and it is one of the essential businesses -- actually, several businesses, but two of them are considered essential. [inaudible] we've laid off some employees. we have not laid them off, we becauset sent them home we don't need them, and we give them the full unemployment and they get the $600 also, so we pay that through our business with this ppp loan. the employees that work are pretty upset about that, because making only about $500, $600 a week on average.

saying, how come you don't let me sit at home and draw $1152 a week? they are pretty upset about that. they want to be sitting at home, safer in the environment that is -- it is, so they are also because of the car and all the expenses that go along with it. i heard a lady ask why our areches and preachers getting this money. it is because all preachers and churches are 501(c)(3) corporations. they are all owned by the government. the gentleman that owns all the corporations, that happened back in 1954 under lyndon baines johnson. let's talk to brian.

what type of business do you own? guest: commercial fishing. i was trying to do the ppp, and i don't even really have a payroll because my people get paid on percentage of the amount of shrimp we catch. we only work so much time out of the year, so it is not a steady, steady thing. i might have three or four different people working for me at the end of the year and on and on. i could not even do the ppp with the forgiveness thing. i had to do a different kind of sba, and i have not heard anything from them. also, the price of shrimp right now is so low. caught 40 to 50 count $1.40 a pound.

yesterday, i heard they want to give us 80 cents a pound. that was 40-something years ago, where is the cost of living increase? host: i would like to thank all of our business employers and employees and all of our callers the first hour of the show. coming up, a discussion with pat schou of the national rural health association. later, we will speak with clarence anthony about the impact that the pandemic is having on cities around the united states. first, yesterday, there was an event hosted in washington, d.c., and the maryland governor was asked about the coronavirus aid governors have asked for. here's what he had to say. [video clip] with thea call governors yesterday, and we made that pitch. the stimulus packages that have

been through congress have been helpful. i think they are going to help folks in need. they were getting checks out to people, hard-working folks who desperately need them. they are helping small businesses that are really impacted. but the states have an important role to play. not a penny of any of the revenue so far helps states back pay their revenues, and there are tremendous shortfalls. we have had to take all of these aggressive actions. our small state of maryland in july 1 for the quarter ending july 1, we project we potentially may have a shortfall of up to $2.8 billion in revenue. we need the demand on services that are critically important as greater than ever, so we are asking for the government's assistance. the president has indicated, and secretary mnuchin have indicated they would like to provide more help. it is tied up in the congress and senate.

they broke yesterday, and i do not believe they are coming back until monday, but the governor's association is pushing hard to try and get something in this 3.5 stimulus package that is before the senate right now. journal": "washington continues. host: we are back with pat schou , the president of the national rural health association, here to talk about how the corona pandemic is affecting rural areas. good morning. caller: good morning. -- guest: good morning. thank you for inviting me to be on your show. host: tell us what the national rural health association is and what you do. rural healthtional association started in the early 1980's as a way of bringing rural providers and people interested together. we have over 21,000 members.

it is a not-for-profit organization comprised of people from universities, rural health clinics, people in long-term care health centers, and anybody who would like to expand the voice for rural health. we are concerned about education, research, munication. anything that can advance and support our rural communities and activate and increase access for rural health care in our communities. up theou also head illinois critical access hospital network. tell us what that is. ofst: yes, it is a network 57 critical access and small rural hospitals across illinois. there are 51 critical access, and that is a small hospital, about 25 beds or less, and we have six hospitals of what we 25-50 beds,s, located in our rural communities. they are similar to other states, but in 2003, a group of

small hospitals came together and said, we want to have our own organization so we can have training, services to help members.he that started with 20 and we now have 57 the state. i work for them. host: tell us how the coronavirus pandemic is presenting itself in rural areas. i know for a lot of the last viewers have told us about the city. how is it affecting the rural areas? roll: it is starting to through our rural communities. there were earlier hotspots that were near large urban centers, like new orleans, areas where there was transportation centers, they were near areas where they were recreational skiing places, and so forth. now, it is starting to roll through the rural communities. and our practices

and our physicians have been getting ready for the virus to spread through. we are having -- i think there is now up to 80% of all the rural counties across america have had one or more corona-positive viruses. we have had a few losses, the the most, -- but for part, people have been healthy and they have been able to shelter-in-place or admitted to the hospital. in illinois, we have not been any of our patients on a ventilator or anything like that, but the virus has been moving slowly from chicago downstate, so to speak. around ther states country, it has been in the urban areas and moved out because it is less dense, and as people travel, our families and friends go to different places, they come back, and that is generally how we get it in rural

illinois. host: what is access like for health care for those living in rural communities? for example, my parents are in mississippi. the town they live in has one hospital, and they continually have been downgraded my entire life. what is health care life for those who live in rural communities are now -- like for those who live in rural communities right now? guest: i'm glad you brought up the hospital because that is very important in the rural community. that is really the main source for physicians, ems, nurse practitioners, pas, home health services. it all really evolves out of that rural hospital. the hospital will generally take the lead and partner with local health departments. the local health department is very important, particularly when you have a pandemic like that and the partnership of sharing that, resources, information, and trying to keep

the local population safe. the hospital is like the hub. it partners with the health department and co., fema, and other organizations, so we try ,- health department, county fema, and other organizations. so we try to make sure there is access through that area. host: we know before the coronavirus pandemic started, the rural areas were facing a huge problem with rural hospitals. here is some data that we have from the university of north carolina, that shows that eight rural hospitals have closed so far already this year. and we are just in april. eight have closed already. in 2019, we lost 19 rural hospitals, and there has been a total of 170 closures since 2005. ofs that equate to a loss quality health care in rural

communities? guest: yes, it does. we are concerned about that. a lot of it has to do with financials. reimbursement systems change, and so, it is very important that we keep our rural communities and hospitals active. if you lose a hospital, think about the situation with the pandemic, these rural hospitals are able to take care of these patients in the rural communities, and they don't have to travel. they can get care right there. they can have their babies. they can come in if they have a heart attack. mississippi,as in and i'm sure that is a farming area where you grew up, they have to have local access. if you do not have that local hospital, that ems has to drive sometimes 40 to 50 miles, so you lose that critical time of her covering and help for that patient -- time of recovering and help for that patient. are many organizations

working hard to keep our rural hospitals open for that access point. it is very important. we serve elderly patients in our rural counties. the national averages about 14%-15% elderly and counties in urban areas. 19%,ral areas, it is sometimes 30%, the county is elderly. that access point is very important. most of it has to do with financial changes and reimbursement systems, and so forth. seeing any rural health care facilities or rural health care systems that are already getting overloaded from coronavirus pandemic patients? or it just hasn't gotten that far yet? guest: as i mentioned a couple of minutes ago, there were several hotspots around the country, such as indiana, montana, colorado, louisiana near where they had recreational or transportation hubs or in

urban areas like new orleans. they were really very much overwhelmed. a critical access hospital has 25 beds or less. cms was greatmic, about opening the door and allowing these hospitals to expand their numbers so they could take care of patients. in many of those hotspots, they had to expand their bed count from 25 to 35 so they could accommodate the patients coming in. and then actually partnered with neighboring community hospitals to send some of those patients there. the vast majority of rural hospitals have not had that influx of patients coming through. we have had patients admitted, where they have been treated at home and shelter-in-place, but we have not been overwhelmed, other than those particular hotspots. a hospital works very hard at controlling it, separating people when they come in with suspected cases in the triage area, so we really try hard to

control the onset of that in our rural communities. host: let slip some of our viewers take part in the conversation. we will open it up, special phone lines for this conversation. if you live in a rural area, not the people who live in the city, if you live in the rural area and you would like to talk about health care and what you think may happen if coronavirus hits the rural areas harder, your number will be (202)-748-8000. once again, if you live in a rural area, we want to hear from you. we are talking about health care and coronavirus. (202)-748-8000. if you are a rural health care provider, whether you work in a rural hospital, medical clinic, if you have your own doctor's office in a rural area, we especially want to hear from you and what you are seeing and how you are surviving during this coronavirus pandemic. the number for rural health care providers is going to be

(202)-748-8001. and if you want to talk about rural health care coronavirus, we want to hear from you, even if you do not fit into the categories. the number for everyone else will be (202)-748-8002. keep in mind, you can still always text your opinion. we are always reading on social media, on twitter, at --@cspanwj and on facebook.com/c-span. little bit about the unique health challenges that people have in rural communities. i am assuming there are different issues that people who live in rural communities have to deal with healthwise than people in urban communities. what are those issues and how can they be resolved? guest: as far as specialty care and services that you normally have to go to a larger facility,

we have been able to work with our clinics and hospitals as being able to use telehealth, being able to use the apps on your phone or on a screen, like in your computer, whatever it might be, and help to connect with specialty care that maybe you are not being able to travel with that. in our rural communities, we have also set up -- no different than the urban areas where you can drive by and get your lab en, evenr you can be se in the car. they have been accommodating that, being able to come out and treat the patients, so they can stay in their car if they are afraid to come in the hospital. i think that is very unique for us that we can do that. basically, we have plenty of space, and we are able to do that. we also have been very concerned about our long-term health with folks in our nursing homes that are in our communities. and connecting with them and the

hospitals. reach out to them periodically to make sure they are ok. and are able to get the care and treatment they need. host: you mentioned telehealth a few seconds ago. one to to talk about that -- i want to talk about that. a lot of rural areas do not have access to broadband. how can they use telehealth if they cannot get on the internet? guest: that is a good question. particularly, when you are in lockdown, you cannot go to the library, to the schools to get that, so your house or your apartment complex, or wherever it might be that you have access to the internet, if you do not have that resource, you cannot get on. that makes it a challenge. it is also difficult for many of the older folks. they are not used to using a provider.alk to that is different for them. we have had many elderly

individuals do very, very well with telehealth. they are comfortable, but others are not that savvy. if you do not have broadband, what do you do? you have to drive or call someone to pick you up, take you in, and you have to practice social distancing with the masks and so forth. hadresting enough, we have reports of people driving to mcdonald's and getting access to their internet service so they can call in and make that contact. it is a problem, and that is something that we need to do as a country to make sure everyone has access to broadband, even in the more remote areas so that they can, in a case like a pandemic, get access, or at least they can use their phone, computer, whatever. interesting enough, along with broadband, you still have to have the tools. you have to have a phone, smartphone, or computer, and you have to be comfortable. so we have made much progress in that area, but we still have a

ways to go. we are learning from this pandemic, to more need to go with telehealth -- pandemic how much more we need to go with telehealth. host: we will start with sheila, calling from personnel, oklahoma. good morning. caller: thank you for taking my call. i am very concerned about our hospitals. verge oftal is on the closing because we do not have the covid virus here, so you cannot do elective surgeries. i have heard her talk about computers. i don't own a computer, sir. even a mcdonald's to go to. and goodness are governor has the foresight. he will start opening the hospitals for elective surgery because we do not have this problem in oklahoma. and think about the flu. , and yet, itcines

still doesn't keep people from flu. even when you open up, you are going to have the virus, but the older people will stay inside. i will be staying inside. we will be taking care of ourselves, but we need to have the elective surgery to keep our hospitals alive. i do not want to them to disappear. host: pat, i have seen a couple of other people on our twitter feed have said that as well. it is the lack of or the banning of elective surgeries that is hurting these small hospitals, these rural hospitals the most. is that what is happening? guest: yes. we talked about the hotspots, but i have said the vast majority have not been impacted. and they did. they are not having the elective surgery. they are not having the physical therapy treatments or the o2 occupational therapy treatments, you know, any of those outpatient, elective things, even lab work. it is a problem.

think about our rural community hospitals. most of them take care of 80% outpatients. if you take almost all of that business away, it is a financial strain. i agree with sheila as she mentioned that as a concern. want to takeitals care of our patients whether covid or not, and that is the number one concern, but after that, how are they going to financially keep things going without having the ongoing business? they still have to have staff in place. many have been able to reassign staff. let's say you work in the outpatient surgery department. those staff members have been reassigned to triage and so forth, so you still have those costs. most of your small hospitals employ physicians and nurse practitioners and physician assistants. you still have to keep them on salary. we need them. if you are an orthopedic surgeon, and you are normally doing a number of cases, 10, 12

cases a week, and you are not doing any of those, you could see the financial strain of that. also, those people need treatment. we need to have a good plan and be prepared to begin to roll out so we can keep our small hospitals open and take care of it. we do not want to prevent people from coming to the hospital for other things because if they have had an injury, they need physical therapy. we are very much needing to open up. the financial picture is very much foremost in their mind sides being available to take care of all of you. callingt's talk to don, from stanton, michigan. good morning. caller: good morning. ofh, i am very concerned what the load is going to be additionally on these small, small town hospitals as the covid spreads, like here in michigan. the weather has been pretty cold for this time of year normally, and i think that has kept a lot

of people indoors, but once the weather warms up, people start going to the lakes, or cottages, coming from the more rural areas, where the covid is more prevalent. besides the normal accidents that are going to happen as people get out and about, and people ignore the governor's travel ban, and, yet, i really think there is going to be a definite strain on the local hospitals. i am very concerned about that. host: go ahead and respond, pat. guest: thank you. i agree with don. we are always trying to be ready for that. we have the threat of the covid virus. we know it could hit us anytime. about this. you mentioned recreation, but we have a number of small hospitals located near prisons. miles toof 2200 b 10

15 miles from a small rural hospital or meat plant -- might be 10 miles to 50 miles from a small rural hospital or meet-packing plant. at the hospitals have been trying to do is meet daily, not only with their staff or but they aretners, planning for this. they have reached out to neighboring hospitals and trying to decide if a patient comes in and we do not have enough room, how do we transfer the patient that may be is not as sick or does not have it? and how do we protect those who have the virus from those that do not have that? we have been working hard to make those plans. we do not have a perfect world out there, but i do understand don's concerns, and i hear that every day when i talked to hospital ceos and staff. they really are concerned about it, but they are doing the best they can. we worked out arrangements for transfers, or if the hospital does not have an intensive care unit. many of these small hospitals do

not anymore, but they can make arrangements for transfers or bring highly trained people into care for the patients in the meantime. the good news is if we have had a few weeks to plan for those things, put strategies in place, we still have to be smart as people in our communities and practice are social distancing, and be careful of what we do. we have been planning for it. we cannot predict the unknown, that are planning, working with our partners, the larger hospitals, so we can take and receive patients so we are ready for your. host: let me read you a list of tweets from our viewers because they all say the same thing. i want you to respond. here is one that says -- hospitals are laying off people because they banned surgeries. the next one says -- the biggest challenge in small hospitals is having to shut down and take

financial hits because the crisis is overblown. hospitals prepare for patients that never materialize. one more -- two more -- one says, hospitals are furloughing staff because of lack of patience. nursing homes are, too. one last one says -- our rural hospital are furloughing workers, waiting for covid-19. so far, only one case in our county. our hospitalist public owned and doing well. all of the tweets talk about rural or small hospitals either taking financial hits, laying off people, or furloughing people because, a, they are not able to do elective surgeries we were talking about earlier, or b,, they have been stacking up and waiting for the coronavirus patients to show up and they don't have anyone. now they are laying people off. what is going on out there, pat? guest: that is very much true. they have had to furlough. people have taken time off. they have used their vacation

time, trying to be ready if they are needed but also understand the financial responsibility of the hospital. yes, that is the biggest thing. 80% of the business in many hospitals is gone. we understand that. we have to be at this readiness, but, yet, we have to be able to financially keep her hospitals strong. if you lay staff off, will they be able to come back? will they go someplace else? you work hard to find a position to come to your community, and if you have to furlough that person, that is really a problem for us. issue out critical there. now, we have had some relief in our hospitals through the cares buildd so forth to help those gaps and finances through accelerated payments, through the $100 billion we have gotten a percent increase for our rural

hospitals. it may not be enough. one thing i heard in your last segment, you talked about the small business loan. manyhas been available for small hospitals with 500 beds or less, but there is a catch to it. many of our rural hospitals are government-owned, and they were not able to apply it. we have had some hospitals affiliated with other systems, even though they are independent and have a different number, and they still have not been able to apply. yes, we know we are furloughing. we have to do that. we have to keep our doors open. it is like a small business. no different. that support out there is critical for us, and we need people to act and support us. we need congress, and state legislators, to help support us to keep that open because we are fragile. many of our hospitals have less than 50 days cash on hand. some are in good shape.i mentioned a couple of hospitals

had strong cash, but many do not. hospitals why small are more fragile, and we have to be careful about that. and theoughs -- furloughs, and not being able to do elective, even though we are trying to be safe, is really difficult. host: let's talk to steve from ridgeway, pennsylvania. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. area ofn a rural pennsylvania. we have two confirmed cases. the county south of us has four. directly north has one. directly east has one. our regional health care system recently laid off 600 people. when i say recently, this week. my concern is not only the lack of services available, but now, if the coronavirus becomes rampant and prevalent in our area, what is the incentive for

these people who have been laid off to come back to work and go back into the hot zones? we are talking a double-edged sword here that i think in pennsylvania has been a lot of it has been pushed on us by the draconian rules of our governor tom wolf. the rules change daily it seems like, or every other day. i talked to health care professionals, pharmacists, and registered nurses who work in , it isystems, and it is the blind leading the willing is what it seems like to me. host: go ahead and respond, pat. guest: it is similar to illinois, and i can speak on behalf of of the folks in illinois at hospitals that it is a worry. as i mentioned, i like the term of the double-edged sword. yet, youto be safe, know the financial impact. in my county, there have been a couple of cases.

nobody has even been hospitalized in the small community hospital that serves the community that i live in, and, yes, we are experiencing that in illinois. and we understand it from the health care community. we understand the transmission and the concern of that, but we are also going to build guidelines for us to be ready. and our hospitals that laid people off, if you have physicians and others who are being laid off, how are we going to get them back? will they come back? that is something that keeps our hospital administrators and staff up all night. i do not have an answer for you, but we have to begin to make plans for us to come back safely so we can be prepared. i do not have an answer for the gentleman in pennsylvania. is the same in illinois and other states -- it is the same in illinois and other states. we are talking about how we can come back and do elective

surgeries. i was on a call friday with the ceos i represent, and one of the ceos had been in contact with legal. how do we safely begin to bring our staff back in? how do we safely begin to open up surgery? we are trying our best to lay the groundwork. wandsh we had that magic to make everything right at this point, but i understand the gentleman's concerns. host: let's talk to ben from hogans berg, new york. ben is in the health care profession. what do you do in health care? caller: i am a family practitioner in rural upstate new york. way up near the canadian border, where the coronavirus has been fairly a small amount at this point. talking i think we are

about a different thing. small hospitals were in big trouble already, well before this pandemic. abouterybody is talking they cannot survive without "elective surgery." that is almost any anomaly. if it is elective, why would you run to surgery? i see patients all the time that i do pre-op clearance on for prostate, cardiac catheterizations. costly,overdone, very and hospitals have become dependent on this money. maybe that is why our health system costs are totally out of control. once this pandemic calms down, we really need to look at this. guest: thank you for the work you do in new york.

i know being a family practitioner is a challenge, and thank you for all the work you've done over the years. your comments resonate in the fact that we can't rely totally on surgery in our hospitals and many rural hospitals we don't. , ot, procedures such as pt speech, the lab work, just getting a mammogram, all those things to keep people healthy or to follow up if they have diabetes to get the blood tests, those are all part of the business we haven't been able to do. someoneendoscope for struggling with changes in their g.i. system, as you know, those things have been eliminated and are not to be done unless it is a true emergency. that does help to keep the

hospital financially. we need to rethink how we are doing our reimbursement. our organization manages accountable care organization. we have hospitals participating independent doing what we can to rebuild our primary care focus on health and prevention. we are in that transition for more of a value-based care and taking care of the patient itself. we can't rely totally on surgery, but it does help, and if it's needed our hospital wants to be able to provide it. we have orthopedic services in many of our older folks who need ips, so weints and h try to do what we can in our rural communities. i understand we need to relook at our reimbursement system and i hope we are able to take the time to do this when we finish

this pandemic and think about how we can preserve access locally and look at prevention and keeping people healthy as well as balancing and keeping our hospitals, physicians, and practices strong. host: that's the perfect segue to something you have said before. you have been quoted as saying this pandemic is going to make us, i assume rural hospitals, rethink our business. in what way do you think small hospitals need to rethink their business? guest: i think we've learned a lot about our population. what are the needs of our population? what is important for health care? it makes us think technology is going to be more of a factor. we all still like the one-on-one, but we are going to have to learn how to use telehealth. how are we going to do that? it can be used very effectively.

we still need one-on-one. how are we going to be prepared for that? i think using that same term, rethink how we deliver health care locally -- is it a combination of technology?are we going to be more flexible? are we going to allow people to go more into their homes to have health care? are we going to do more home health? are we going to partner with our shelter care places to provide care for our elderly instead of having them come into a clinic? how can we rethink and plan for our population? we're learning a lot about how people use health care. what are their basic needs? how we are understanding the use of our technology as we move forward. pennsylvania. caller: good morning. in oregon a democrat in the house of representatives said he

had $6,000 per patient to care for them. in virginia they are getting $400,000. why is there such a disparity in payments? sick person of the same virus. if you don't know the answer, could you please look into it? guest: i'll just answer as best i can right now. i don't know the particular cases for the patients. if the person in oregon, maybe they were just diagnosed and are able to have medication and be treated at home. they are having to pay for testing, the doctor's visit, having the chest x-ray to diagnose the pneumonia. costly to not be as take care of them in the home. that is what i am assuming.

as far as in virginia, i don't know that case exactly, but maybe this person had to be on a ventilator. maybe they had multiple issues. had to be had to have fed intravenously and the treatments were more expensive. they might have to do with the severity of the illness. sometimes you are able to care for patients in an area less expensive than a larger area. those are some of the variables. it could be the location. it could be the condition of the patient and the treatment they require. that is the best answer i can offer without looking at both situations and the bills and so forth. host: sylvia, good morning. caller: good morning. i'm very concerned.

i live 25 miles away from the hospital. we do pretty good that way. i have my mother here. she is 88. i am very concerned about people -- we have a grocery store my want toruns, and people come in anyway and they say they don't want to social distance. they are coming from the cities, they are getting frustrated, they say they don't care if they wear a mask. they are getting upset. i can see the shenandoah valley mountains from my window. people want to climb it anyway. i'm just saying to the people out there, i call him dr. northrom, he--dr. is our governor, be patient, where the masks. i only have a little bit of lysol spray and i'm having trouble getting it.

people need to understand when they come in our area they need to do what our governor says. social distancing and stay whale little longer and not be so frustrated. we are not able to go to the doctor as quickly as people in new york. host: let me add on a little to what she said. is there a concern that coronavirus is going to run through rural communities? it hasn't yet. are we still concerned about it coming out to those communities and affecting the people who, like the caller said, are 25 miles from a decent hospital? guest: i think that is the concern and we still want to be careful moving forward. we want to think about reopening our services, but we want to be careful. we want to continue to wipe things down with the bleach, the sanitizer, we want to use masks.

as we become used to being out in public -- and i think the caller is correct. we want to be careful. let me share an example of how it happened in a rural hospital in illinois. this is the first part of march. he was at a conference in chicago. he came home. i think the gentleman was over 65. he went to church and hugged one of the ladies in the church. i think she was over 65, too. he wasn't feeling well that day. she was fine. after a couple of days he became ill and she became very ill. she lived in an independent living center. it was spread that way. the person lived in the community, went to a conference, came back, hugged someone at church. these things do happen in our and i think that

is how it will happen. we have to be very careful. if you're not feeling well, stay home. as we acclimate to being used to the community again and being safe. i think that's the best answer we can do right now is to be smart about how we open it up. we're trying to be careful. some of our hospitals are right next door to large recreational as prisons,ll long-term care facilities. we are trying to be very careful. people have to be very smart. host: paul from minnesota. good morning. caller: good morning and thank you for the call. i have a couple questions. theve a 38-year-old nephew, other day he came home from work and was having heart problems breathing. then he started to spike. he went in and tested he didn't have it.

he had burning eyes and no smell. he is waiting now under quarantine to see if things are going to be working out.the other question is, is all the medical people trying to do -- i know they are trying to do the best they can get out and try to figure out why, what, how, and what can be fixable. is mr. trump, is he still trying to get medical taken away from people in courts? are they still going to be covered? understand his question. is he concerned about the young man that is 35 who is still not feeling well? is he going to lose his medical coverage? host: that sounded like what he was saying. guest: is that correct? host: he is already gone, pat. oh, through the

president, others, the governors of various states, they have been working with insurance companies and medicaid to cover people through this crisis. if there -- through this crisis. if there are any suspicions of covid, they will cover it. he can contact his state representative or senator and ask those questions. don't just accept it. reach out to people who can help you and find a solution. i hope that gentleman stays home until his symptoms have resolved. should contacthe their primary care physician or nurse practitioner and find out what they can do to recover and feel better. caller fromast stevensville, michigan. caller: how are you doing, sir?

i have a few opinions and a couple of questions for the nice lady on tv. host: make it quick, we are running out of time. caller: they ran out of money for the small businesses.the democrats are willing to give them the money, but they want to give all of the hospitals and governments money because they lost revenue. they can't run a deficit like the government. you need to give each state $10 million to the hospitals and governments, so when this pandemic is over they start even like they were before. got his people to go around the state not wearing mask and protesting. that is not doing no good. that is disrupting people trying to do the best, and they spread corona, the virus. all of these evangelist christians and christians are saying the way he is doing it

is right. they know it's not the truth. the truth is the truth and a lie is the lie. you know the saying, a piggies a ig even ifig is a p you put lipstick on it. god bless you, ladies like you are my hero, but take care of the state so they don't suffer. you have to go on and in these rural hospitals, they have a small budget. host: go ahead and respond. guest: thank you for being our champion and speaking out for us. we do need more financial support so we can keep together. what has been provided to us through the cares act has been a good step forward, but we need more. these small hospitals are like a small business. they have to function from day to day and make tough decisions. they don't have big war chests and are important to keep our

rural community strong. we have wonderful food at low price, mining and natural resources and have a wonderful economy prior to this. you have to have a community strong and part of that is health care. having a hospital, physician errors, clinics able -- s, clinics able to take care of us. we appreciate the support. it is important we are ready for the next future when the pandemic goes away, and we are still intact. host: we would like to thank the president of the national rural health association for taking us through how small and rural hospitals and medical care will survive this pandemic and what comes next. guest: thank you for inviting me here today. host: we will look at how the

coronavirus pandemic is thecting cities with national league of cities. street institute will talk about the impact the pandemic is having on the postal service. first, during a press briefing yesterday governor roy cooper responded to president trump's announcement on the guidelines for reopening the country. here's what he had to say. [video clip] help isill know more needed from the federal government on testing. yesterday shared guidelines for the country to be able to reopen. it was good to see many of the national criteria might match what we are doing in north carolina. but i and other governors across the country have been clear. we still need assistance with testing, supplies, and personal protective equipment.

the president has left the responsibility to me as governor to make decisions about how and when we ease restrictions. i accept that, but when governors are faced with global supply chain breakdowns when it comes to supplies and equipment, the federal government must help more. and they have some, and we appreciate it, but not enough. in our statections without enough masks, gowns, and aoves is like setting off on three-day camping trip with enough food for one night. we need all of these supplies to collect more test samples to ensure hospitals and first responders have what they need. ♪ "washington journal" prime time, a special evening addition

on the federal response to the coronavirus pandemic. our the city and her personal response to the pandemic, and the director of ucla's center for global and immigrant health to talk about the spread of the virus and the latest data on how well it is being controlled. join the conversation monday at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. c-span has round-the-clock coverage of the federal response to the coronavirus pandemic. it is available on demand at c-span.org/coronavirus. watch white house briefings, updates from governors and state officials, track the spread throughout the u.s. and the world with interactive maps. watch on-demand, anytime, unfiltered at c-span.org /coronavirus. >> "washington journal"

continues. host: we are back with the ceo and executive director of the national league of cities. he is here with us to talk about the coronavirus pandemic's impact on u.s. cities. clarence, how -- are you doing this morning? guest: i'm doing well. thank you for having the national league of cities on. i'm a fan of yours. keep up the great work. host: for our viewers, explain with the national league of cities is and does. guest: the national league of cities is the oldest municipal representthat cities in america. our mission is to be the voice of cities. cities, towns, and villages in america.we advocate on behalf of the issues impacting cities. we provide technical assistance,

best practices, next practices, and we get our leaders prepared to provide solutions and deal with the real issues every day that they are facing in their communities. host: the national league of cities conducted a survey of is going find out what on during coronavirus. can you tell us what you found out? guest: we really found out that it is going to be a devastating time for cities. right now, as well as after this een minimalized in some way. 88% of cities, especially those 500,000, is00 to going to see a 17% reduction in their revenue. about 98% said they are going to see a shortfall because of the

pandemic they are dealing with. butknow, they had a budget, it did not in any way anticipate such a tragedy that we are experiencing in america right now. said they are going to have to furlough employees. some of those employees are what we consider essential today as we go through this covid-19. that can include some of our fire services, emt's, as well as public servants. most heartening is also 38% to eitherthey expect furlough or lay off employees. this is already happening all over america. i got to tell you cities like cincinnati, ohio is already

laying off employees. we have cities like new york that will have to cut essential services, and they are a major member of ours. they are looking at those kinds of things now. san antonio, a city of over one million, has already indicated they will have to either borrow money or lay off employees. .ur survey startled us we knew this pandemic was going to have an impact or is having an impact on cities, but in some ways until you start really looking at the numbers, until you start digging into what is happening in america right now in terms of stay-at-home and closing restaurants and other had plannedno one for this and no one was prepared. leaders are on the

forefront trying to figure out how they are going to get through this pandemic so the as ifns are safe and feel they have a future in this nation, specifically in the city they live. host: one thing in your survey i want to point out is all the way at the bottom on your page of llc.org. it says more than half of all cities of all sizes reported police will be affected. see type of effect do you on law enforcement from this coronavirus pandemic? guest: there is no question that is an essential service. public service is very important to every city in america. when you start looking at making cuts, you do look at everything. sometimes we focus on public

safety, which is essential, and i think as we look at our budgets in our nations and city i think that would be one of the last things they would look at. but, you know, public safety is highlighted. other programs, small business-funded programs, housing initiatives, homelessness, all of those will also have to go into the process as they look at providing the basic services initially, and then the other programs will also have to be looked at. as a former mayor in florida when we went through so many hurricanes, those were the kinds of decisions i had to make. they were not easy, and they will never be easy.

and villageswns are not like the federal government. we don't print money. we have to balance the budget every year. in balancing the budget we have essential all of the services and needs of the community, no matter the size, and make those tough decisions. new york has already decided they will have to close parks. they can't continue to do those types of services full-time as well as manage their budget. i think right now they are looking at ways to save during this time. you can also expect that professional development programs around equity and excellence, all of those things, including furloughing and laying off employees. that is startling. that is why we are pushing so hard to get the federal government to recognize we are the implementers.

and might be the funders, the state may be mandated to manage, but when it comes down to what is happening in america, it is happening in neighborhood s, it is happening in communities, it is happening in the streets of our nation. it is not just happening statewide. this is the essential point that we hope your viewers and listeners will take away from this conversation we are having. ,his is not about numbers policy, and politics. host: for our viewers, explain how this pandemic is affecting city's budgets. tax revenue is getting lower? people are leaving? how does this pandemic affect a city or town's budget? cities around america are

structured differently, and villages, and towns. in certain states sales tax is a basic revenue. for major cities like washington, d.c. or the virginia area or maryland. or you can look at ohio and california. tourism tax in nevada is devastating that community, because they live, eat, and sleep on that. all of that has closed. there is nothing going on in las vegas right now. new york, the tourism. even small cities have certain ands that they live by develop their budgets by. baked those revenues are into the budgeting process.

then you have to look at your expenses. we have to balance our budget. we can't just go in and create debt without money to fund that. the shortfall for many city leaders is about hard decisions. when you have to make those hard decisions, as a former mayor i can tell you, there is a lot of sleepless nights, tossing and turning, and the fact that you really have to look your citizens in the face every day oryou cut elderly care senior city centers. or if you cut the youth programs, or the housing. and that is what we are fighting for in washington every day. to get our federal government,

congress and the administration, to understand that cities are the place that this is being implemented, and carried out every day, and we need a partner with the federal government. shortfall.eeing this i already indicated 98% say all of those revenues i just mentioned to you are being cut or lost because of this pandemic. host: let's let our viewers take part in this conversation. we will open a special line this morning. if you live in a city, just like the last hour we had rural residents, this time we want citys. i want to know what is going on with your services and if you are concerned about your city's budget. your number is (202) 748-8000.

employees, whether you work for your city's transportation department, your policeyou are the ones the budgs will affect, i want to know what you think. for new -- for municipal 202, 74 8-8001. if you do not fit into those categories i still want to hear from you. that telephone number will be 202-748-8002 and you can always text us at 202-748-8003, and we are always reading on social facebook.tter, we are getting several people texting us asking you as a former mayor, to give us your areion on the places that

trying to reopen, for example here's one tweet that wants to know if it is safe to open large open places for large gatherings , and another one that asks about governor desantis, what do you think about his decision to allow florida beaches to reopen? and one more that says smart cities will reopen and get their citizens get back to work and play. what do you think as head of the national league of cities, should places start reopen? anst: i think that that is important question, and everybody is wanting to get back. i think that every governor, is bests to assess what for their community. consideration the health and safety, and longevity of that community. what we do not want to do is

rush, because we are all sequestered in our homes in quarantine, staying home. wehink that, first of all, need to listen to the scientists and health professionals. guidance,s provided and i recognize that the president has a three-step plan, but the first thing we need to do is be able to understand that if we do not manage this in the appropriate way, what we will whenis a resurgence, so, we see the numbers start to balance off and not continue to in hospitals and the tests are not increasing, it may not be the time to move quickly. i think, specifically what governor desantis, he is

assessing what is happening in florida, and he has made a decision that that region of florida, which is the jacksonville area, is an area that he feels that has slowed down, or has not increased as much. have made that decision related to the beach is in florida question -- beaches in florida because of the desire of the people? i am not sure i would have done that yet, but the governor has more information than i do. stateayor, we see the every day, we walked down towns or drive around every day. we have a lot more information than any other level of government, so i think that the mayors in america have to be

smart, and someone talked about smart cities. using data, using your health department information, and making a decision that is best for your city long-term, because we do not want to do is have a regression in -- and have to go backwards and start this process over again. i think if we can just hold on and look at the data and the science, and make that decision based on that information. act: congress has the cares which set aside $150 billion for cities. here's a little information. fiveity and counties with -- 500,000 residents spending must be related do to the public health emergency. what does it take for cities to get that money, and have we seen

that flowing in? question,t is a good and we think the administration as well as congress are moving quickly to get the cares act passed and signed, because it is very important that we have those resources. ofthink that those cities 500,000 that have gotten those dollars, that is 36 cities. it is important that they use them and get the programs and the testing, and systems in place. that, as ie indicated, there are 19,000 villages, and and we want to make sure that as we look at cares act 3.5 that more cities are able to get those dollars, because what is

billion,, of that $150 your viewers and listeners, please note that that is shared with the state, tribal government, and that is shared as well, and as it relates to -- 29, we have 29 billions of those dollars go to cities that are 500,000 or more. we know that our leaders are going to be able to use those dollars, but our advocacy is got we want those dollars to directly to cities. 3.5, andvocating in those dollars are allocated directly to all cities, towns, and villages. , all residents,

that are left behind will have dollars and moneys to get working, because what we are aeing is, we basically have one two punch. revenues are being slashes at the same time expenses are growing. we thank the administration and congress for the 500,000 population cities that have gotten those dollars, but we need to work hard to make sure of chattanooga, tennessee, jackson, mississippi, and another point of fact is that there are some states, like 27 states, that do not have a city that is over 500,000. we are not seeing any dollars go to those cities. getre advocating hard to

all-americans to be able to have money come to their cities so that they can start their recovery. host: let us let our viewers join in, and we will take our first call from kevin from denver, colorado. he is a municipal employee, or you in the government or do you work for the government? caller: i am the municipality stately director and a member of the organization of the national league of cities. myself and 48 of my colleagues on all working with nlc behalf of our municipal members. host: go ahead. caller: i just want to reaffirm what clarence is saying, and let me just say that the work in the national league of cities, inrence, and his staff bringing municipal issues to washington, d.c. and keeping them in front of leadership is

outstanding. our 200 70orado, member municipalities around the state are dealing with reductions in revenue from 25% becausesome, sales tax that is the driver at revenue in colorado municipalities. of course, that is because businesses are closed. that has a trickle-down effect, a -- much bigger than trickle-down, because we are seeing cities announcing restrictions and operations, furloughs, budget cuts, layoffs, and then this is in small towns. impacts, and they will have impacts on municipal services that people care about. it is just imperative that congress and the administration understand that, and work to

support municipal operations through this downturn, so we can keep delivering services that people need, expect, and want. host: good response. first of all, thank you for calling in and we appreciate your support. i did not see that coming at all. host: i was going to accuse you of that in a couple of seconds. guest: i know. you know, kevin is right. cities right now are struggling, and in colorado, as kevin talked about, colorado springs is a small city of 10,000. furloughing 179 employees. we do notweek, and see that translated in real life.

be an employee that is essential to the city, who is making minimum wage or living wage. isthat 10% of their check going to have a tremendous impact on the lives of their families, so this is what we look at every day. kevin has been advocating with get dollars to every city in colorado, and mayor hancock, the mayor, is one of those leaders who was that she was working hard. what kevin said is the same thing that is happening in every state in america, and we need to be able to have a partner with our federal government to help get started and kick up our economy again.

host: i want to read a tweet from you. you were a former mayor of a small town in florida, maybe around 5000 people if i remember correctly. this person on twitter says that cities say they are stretched in their budget, yet they have recklessly made their own bed with exorbitant pensions and wayted a retirement class above most private sector employees. citiesrson says that have made their own bed by overspending. do you agree? i do not agree. i think that if you look at city budgets, and i have said this before, cities have to have a balanced budget, and they manage their budget based upon the revenues that they have like any other business.

aery mayor is a ceo just like private sector ceo. i think that some of the statements about municipal service or leadership is not accurate because i have worked in the private sector and i can tell you that it works the same way. it is about revenues and expenses. through thisies, time of prosperity that we have had the last eight or so years that have saved reserves that they are going to use right now, aboutt, the mayor talked a report to his citizens and talked about the fact that they had 307 million in reserves and that will be eaten up because of pandemic -- because of the pandemic. that is not misuse of funds or giving raises, and let me also

be very candid with the tweeter. municipal employees deserve the same life that the private sector does. they go to work and they work just as hard at every level. they also deserve to be able to retire, and live the same level of lifestyle that they did when they worked. just like private sector. i think the misnomer is that because you work for government, you do not put your heart in, you do not get up every day and make sure that the streets are clean, or the parks are safe, or the community, when the fire truck comes, that those persons are qualified and ready to sacrifice their life. our employeesof

that serve our communities that are working hard just like in the private sector. i do think that there needs to be some sensitivity on both sides. and, in my role as ceo of the national league of cities, i have really focused on making sure that there are conversations between the public and private sectors, because good public policy is not developed just by working in a the hall, needs to engage private sector as well. good communities are not just developed by the private sector, they need the public sector input. when a leader or mayor, or councilmember, or leader of any type, private corporation, recognizes that, our communities will prosper more, our economies will grow, and are cities,

towns, and villages will be a place where every citizen says that is my home, not as just a place i drive to work. they say that everybody is working to make the community better. toope that my comments here, the person who gave the question, i think that i would love for you to go and spend a department in any city government, and i think you will see that you have hard-working folks, just like those in the private sector. host: let us see if we can get a couple of quick questions before we end this segment. chicago, to janet from also a municipal employee. what part of the city do you work for or are you in city government? caller: i am retired from chicago police. host: go ahead. caller: he has a point, but

since the appropriations for up, there isc went a whole lot of stuff that we could have done when the money was there, and each city could've still held its own, or had the possibility of holding its own. in the reality of things, it then't matter what ceo, money is not being cut equally. this is something of the people every day that i have to go out and see, and even retired, when our model was serving the people. oute people helping people here. to see something as so desolate, i see where we are trying to help each other out. there seems to be more compassion because we know that

this can strike anybody, it is not limited to pre-existing conditions, and i have 12 and i am doing fine. host: let me get one more call her in and i will have you respond to both of them. let us go to mark from california. good morning. caller: hello, i appreciate you taking my call. aam a senior coming from different angle, i am behind what you are talking about and i was worried about this as soon as we were told to stay home from work because i realized the funding for municipalities was going to fail. many of us seniors have in massl bonds quantities versus being involved in stocks or security that was supposed to be the most secure investments. i am wondering as far as bond failures or as far as bonds fit where municipalities are looking at cutting costs. where do bonds fall in, and i

appreciate you and the governors , and nancy pelosi, i saw her in an interview. she was talking about the next tranche of money for the cities and municipalities because of the reasons we are talking about. so i wonder where all of this fits together for the seniors, and i hope you can fight heavily for this because this is critical for the investments of our elderly. host: go ahead and respond. guest: i do think in this time the security of the municipal market is pretty strong. wherek you will still see the treasury is going to put together that would enact those securities. issues arese bond backed by water and sewer and ae and other revenue, treasury has recognized that, and they put a fund together so that states and cities will be able to apply for those dollars.

as it relates to senior locales, i hope that governments and county governments will be able to continue those services, because we and you deserve that, because you have given them so much of your life. the other question related to decision-making and the covid-19. i would like to come back at some point and talk about this. pat, before me, talked about the rural concert as communities, and we are concerned because the access to health care in my city west of westhour palm beach. it was a poor community, the average per capital income was 17,000, and the access to hospital and quality service was difficult to get through. , alsofant mortality rate

the access to real jobs was really tough. there is a population in the rural communities and that you have seen the data about people of color whose -- you are being impacted by this virus at a higher rate than any other group. datae pushing also for the to be aggregated in a way that we can look at the rates, -- race and ethnicity of those who have tested positive, but also, those who have died, and we know that there are 17 states that are reporting it in that way, but nationwide, there are a lot of other states that are not addressing this by race, and we think that is important, not -- it is important now, but more important as we make decisions

about where those dollars are going, and covid-19 may be the virus, but the system failure is the crisis for those people who are not getting the services now, not having testing centers in their communities, not being able to access it because of lack of transportation, it goes on and on. i know there is a lot more we can talk about, and i want to thank you so much, and thank you on behalf of members of the fi inc., keep pushing for our cities and we need this audience as often as we can. i appreciate this. host: we want to thank clarence anthony, ceo and director of the national league of cities. we will have to have you back on. guest: thank you very much. host: coming up, we will take a

look at how the u.s. postal service has been impacted by the coronavirus outbreak. kevin kosar of the r street institute will join us. we will be right back. ♪ >> this weekend on book tv, at 9:15 eastern, ben bernanke talks about the actions that the fed is taking to mitigate the economic effects of the covid-19 pandemic. his latest book is "first responders." we are not talking about a stimulus package because people cannot go out and shop, that we are talking about emergency relief. but we need to primarily do is make sure that people can survive this with very low income, that businesses that are losing revenue can pay their

bills and their rent, >> and the utilities. co-founderquare offers his thoughts on innovation and competition for thetup businesses in " innovation stack." >> it turns out there is a thing that happens, this process that can happen when you start to solve a perfect problem, something not solved before, because most of what we do is copying, and most of our tools and training, and comfort is with solutions that exist. >> at 10:00 p.m., in "hacking darwin" jamie mitchell looks at future engineering and if that technology can be used against covid-19. >> we have been able -- never been able to develop diagnostic tests. now with the diagnostic

sequences that george innovated, we will watch this viral genome mutates as it spreads around the world, which is important. >> watch book tv on c-span2. the presidents, just released from public affairs presents biographies of every president organized by their ranking in the presidential historian survey. visit our website, c-span.org/thepresidents. order your copy today. washington journal" continues. host: we are back with kevin kosar, research vice president at the art institute, and we will talk about the impact of the coronavirus on the united states postal service. good morning. first of all, tell us what the r

street institute is, what do you do? guest: we are a think tank in washington, d.c., and we study a wide range of issues and tried to bring practical solutions to the table. telecom, tobacco farm thection, security, and postal service. host: we will talk about the united states postal service. what do we know right now about the health and financial impact that coronavirus has had on the united states postal service staff and revenue? guest: we do not know nearly enough. have a very clear picture of the postal service before coronavirus, and it was an agency struggling because mail volume has dropped 30%, and the agency has difficulty

maintaining operating costs, but then coronavirus hit, and mail volume plunged as much as 30% already, because most of what businesses, sent by and so much of america, so many of them are closed down. have -- has the postal service ever been in a situation like they are in now? have we ever seen this? is this business as normal or have they always been in trouble like this? thet: 10 years ago situation changed for the postal service. the mailally, because volume stopped growing. you look at the data on mail volume over the course of the last 120 years, and it was upward. you only have recessions where mail volume drops and then it

bounces back up because mail was the medium for communication and for doing business. the 2008 recession broke that growth, and mail volume has not come back. stillhe postal service has a very large workforce of half a million workers and a very large remit, namely it has to deliver six days a week to every address. that is not cheap. host: looking at the post office's website, it says that the post office is the only delivery service that reaches every address in the nation. residences, businesses, and post office boxes. with all of that known, is the post office too big to fail. guest: that is what i have argued. we are all dependent upon it, we

as individuals, businesses are dependent upon it, even the companies that look like they are competitors to the postal service, the private shipping companies, even they depend upon it. to fly the contract postal service's mail because the postal service does not have airplanes. companies make details where the shipping companies will move products a certain distance and then we'll handed off to the postal service to deliver at the last model -- the last mile. it is essential. i'm thinking in my own experience the past week or so, i have gotten a postcard from the cdc with tips on it informing me how to avoid coronavirus. i had my minivan registration so i could drive my vehicle legally, all the magazines that i subscribe to, a bill from the local tax authority reminding me

that -- all of this stuff comes through the mail and without postal service, we would not get it. we should be thankful to the postal workers out there who are risking their health on the front lines six or seven days per week. host: the post office is an entity that is talked about in the u.s. constitution. is the post office required to exist because of the u.s. constitution? guest: the constitution says congress has the authority to create post roads and post offices. there is a lot of variety that can be chosen from. the postal operations have always been a mixture of public sector and private sector. in the days of ben franklin, they did not build a lot of post offices. they located post offices inside

of taverns and general stores. there have always been private companies that have helped move the mail. it has been a complicated relationship. folks are wondering whether or not there is some sort of private sector, capitalist or company that wants to take over the postal service and do what the postal service does, i have been in this term 17 years and i have not seen anything like that. postal service business is an expected business. business,fficult hauling mail to all 50 states. incominging all of the mail, it is a complicated mess. situation.agine a let's make sure our

viewers know they can join the conversation. we are going to open up regional lines about our conversation about the u.s. postal service. if you are in the eastern or central time zones, your phone number will be (202) 748-8000. if you are in the mountain or pacific time zones, your telephone number will be (202) 748-8001. we are going to open up a special line for postal workers. if you work for the u.s. postal service, we want to hear from you. you have a special line, (202) 748-8002. once again, postal workers, (202) 748-8002. keep in mind, you can always text us at (202) 748-8003, and we are always reading on social media. cares act provided

$10 billion for the postal service. $30 billion.r why was the $30 billion balked at? in part it was because many people on capitol hill were surprised by the request and the magnitude of it. i also think that the data that could help make the case why such a large bailout was needed was not presented. came back service after making that initial $75est and then asked for billion. i think that had a lot of people's heads spinning. more than twice the initial request. act, what we got was a $10 billion initial borrowing line from the u.s.

treasury. it helped the u.s. postal service remain liquid so i could pay its workers, but in the long run, it will not be enough. host: you have an article that to killmp is not trying the u.s. postal service. like you said earlier, do we hear a lot about the postal service trying to be privatized or it going away? do you hear a lot about that? do you think the administration is trying to kill the postal service? guest: no. the administration is not trying to kill the postal service. president is popular in rural areas. popularthe president is

among senior citizens in this society. they depend on the mail. so many americans get subscriptions by mail. 20 million people in the previous election -- gop voters got ballots by mail. disrupting the postal service would have catastrophic results. if the president did that, he would pay a terrible price. host: let's let some of our viewers take part in the conversation. let's start with paul from reston, virginia. good morning. caller: good morning. this is a great segment. as the guest pointed out, the postal service offers a lot of different services to individuals that includes mail and packages. i am wondering to what extent

the postal service understands the cost for each of these products and how good is it at pricing the products so they are profitable or at least break even? pricing is one of those issues that folks outside about. hear very little but it is extremely contentious inside the beltway. it is contentious because there is a huge amount of money involved, and there is the question of fair competition. the postal service is an agency that is self funding. not something the taxpayers support. operating costs are paid for by people who send mail. they want to watch their bottom line, and they want to make sure they are paying a fair price.

one development we have had in the past 10 years is that the postal service's mixture of mail has shifted. down,mail has been going the number of small packages has been going up. to maintain fairness and meet the requirements of the law and to protect the private sector, we need to make sure the cost attribution toward all these products is done well. i think the process by which this happens is not as transparent as a lot of people would like. a lot of questions have been raised. host: let's go to tucson, arizona. she is a postal worker. good morning. are you there? caller: yes, i am. host: go ahead. , i have beenosar

interested in what you have to say as a 26 year veteran of the postal service. one of my biggest issues is the environment has changed and the union is one of the biggest obstacles to any changes that need to happen. there are many employees who believe everything that union tells them. the union will not allow anything to change because they are protecting their turf. i am a letter carrier. my union is very strong and they oppose five-day day delivery. any change that needs to happen, you have to deal with the union. there are employees like me that believed change needs to happen. i believe in reform, downsizing, making us more competitive, streamlining. do you ever approach this reform in a sense that we need to engage employees to help us fight the union? servicent of the postal

is horrible. it is a toxic environment. there is a lot of waste that goes on and money that is lost because we have so many lay layers of- management. i believe it is another area that needs to be addressed. guest: thank you for your comments. continuing to go out there and serve each day. you are absolutely right. union leadership, their job is to get as good of compensation and working conditions for their workers, but in a time when we and mail volume going down, it is harder and harder to earn revenue, driving up operation costs each year, it is inherently problematic. this is why we are in the

situation where there is a deficit. issues like the five day mail issue, the public opinion surveys i have seen show the american people generally are quite happy to shift to five day mail if it would bring with it further stability to the postal service. unions and note, the other interest groups have been steadfast against it. i am wondering if we are good into the point where the financial situation is so dire that some of the big players in postal policy will have to come out of their foxhole and cut a deal. a day, itng to find might not be until autumn, or it might be in winter or early spring, where the post office runs out of cash. i am hearing a version of this question several times online. i am going to just read one of

the tweets that summarizes all of the questions around this issue. this tweet says, the postal service needs to be relieved of the burden of funding their pension 75 years in advance. this has to happen right this minute. no other business is required to do this. republicans have been trying to kill the usps for years. having to fund its pension 75 years in advance. can you explain what this is about and who cause this problem? myth: this is a popular that has been around for a long time. folks want to see a nonpartisan authoritative source. ,f you go to my twitter feed you will see this morning that i linked to reports that explain -- pension benefits for

75 years. modest postals a reform act by congress. union,supported by the democrats, republicans, all voted for it. one of the aspects of that law was it said the postal service was doing something very dangerous. it was paying its retirees out-of-pocket. there were calculations that noted that the postal service was going to have a lot of retirees in the coming years and the calculations showed there was no way the postal service would be able to pay for all of those retirees' health care benefits by reaching into their pocket each year. funddea was let's create a and free fund these benefits. billion -- the0 postal service paid into the

fund for 10 years and the rest of the cost would be stretched out over a 40 year period. after 2012, the postal service stopped paying. it did not have the cash on hand, which prove the entire point of the retiree health benefits fun. -- iney was not set aside can tell you since 2017, have been getting their health care benefits out of the fund. i don't want to think where would be if that fund did not exist. host: let's go to robert from alexandria, virginia. robert is a postal worker. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for having me on. supervisor, and i heard the comment from the gentleman before. i don't necessarily disagree

with what he is saying, but what i think he is alluding to, it is a very difficult time that is unprecedented that none of us are prepared for. there carriers are out they day, and although amount has significantly dropped, we do have an increase in package volume. our delivery service has not been interrupted. we are still delivering to covid hotspots, we are still out there delivering the mail, getting people their medicine. cvs has upped the ante in the fight. therestal workers are out and they are working very hard to try to maintain normalcy in this environment. as a supervisor, i could not be more proud of my carriers and everyone in the office. if you are out there and you see

a carrier, thank them, it is something that is very difficult to wake up in the morning, seeing numbers on tv of people hospitalized, and knowing you are right in the middle of that. supportu all for the and we will be here continuing to serve you. guest: thank you. you guys are doing so much out there. with covid around, one thing we forget is we are in the course of a presidential election. we still have primaries to get through and a general election. we need to postal service their so people can vote by mail. we don't want to have to force people to go to polling places. thank you for being out there. one thing i argued for in my politico piece on how to save the postal service, you guys should be getting an appropriation of $1 billion per

year for your first responder duties. you are out there in the middle of a pandemic and you are not getting anything extra for that. let's go to bob, who is calling from san jose, california. bob also works for the postal service. good morning. caller: good morning. i am a retiree from the postal service. i am still active in the union. my friends are in the post office, so i am constantly aware of what is going on there. with they disagree idea about the pre-funding issue. that has already been discussed. the other thing i was concerned about was the person who was opposed to the unions. haveint there is we negotiations with the post

office every few years when the contracts come up, and if there is no settlement, it goes to arbitration and an arbitrator make the decision that is binding for the postal service and the union. benefits arehat either given to the letter carriers or denied, it is essentially up to the arbitrator. if an agreement cannot be reached between the postal service and the union. the other thing, i am a strong supporter of the union. work environment from some of the abuses that people have complained about. days whenback to the they were talking about going 1990's,ack in the people shooting up the post

office and stuff like that. because of the coordination between the union and the postal wording we have strong in there that says all people, regardless of if they are a supervisor, employee, they are all to treat each other with respect and dignity. host: go ahead and respond. guest: the postal unions serve a valuable purpose. that is not covered much in the media is the situation where postal workers who got injured on the job, and then were put in modified work responsibilities, and significant portions of them after being put in those responsibilities, were shifted out of their jobs entirely. there is a big lawsuit about that. it involves postal workers.

doubt, has been helping in that fight and helping with that situation. i take my hat off for them. when it comes to arbitrators making decisions about what collective bargaining agreement should be between the postal service and the workers, workers almost inevitably -- and that is why i think the law around collective bargaining should be changed as a simple prohibition -- a condition in the source of rendering. host: we would like to thank kevin kosar, research partnership vice president of the institute for being on with us this morning and talking about what the u.s. postal service is doing during coronavirus. thank you so much. guest: thank you. host: online learning is

something teachers, parents and students have all had to adapt to during the coronavirus, like myself, with all the schools last week, the education secretary spoke with glenn beck about the future of education. communities, states, taking this opportunity seriously to think differently about what continued learning means. this really is a moment for transformation, particularly in k-12 education. on the higher education side, many schools have done distance-learning, online learning. many of them had a smooth transition to be able to serve their students. in the k-12 world, it is a different story. where it is places been embraced quickly.

educators want to see their kids continue to learn. they are willing to step up and do what it takes. it is also an opportunity for families to take a step back, and acknowledge, first of all, that families and parents are the first educators for their kids. right now, they are more in tune to what has been going on for their child's education that any time in recent history. i think they are going to have a lot to say about how the rest of this school year unfolds and how their summers might look toferent if there is a need continue learning through the summer. this is an opportunity for us to collectively look very seriously at the fact that k-12 education for too long has been very

static and stock in one message of delivering and making instruction available. host: we are back with a saxophone and keyboard player. he is here with us to talk about music education while we are at home during the coronavirus pandemic. good morning. guest: good morning. important is, how music education during this time? we have a lot of things going on with coronavirus. how important is music education? guest: i think education in general is very important. it is better to know something than to be ignorant. especially online education. my daughter is an elementary school teacher and she is doing all of her teaching online. host: both of my children play

the violin, we are trying to get them to do their music study online. it difficult, or how easy is to transfer from in person music education to online music education? guest: i don't think it is all that difficult. -- i lost a matter of my train of thought. [laughter] host: that is ok. transfer from to an in person instructor to an online instructor? guest: if you are doing it in real time, it is basically the same thing. course is already prerecorded. songs -- big hits that i

have played on. i am just going through them and i'm showing students how to play those particular solos. they are all written out. host: how did you develop this course? what made you decide to do this? you must have started this before the coronavirus pandemic. what made you decide to go online? guest: i started last year. sixcorded a medley note of songs that i played solos on. melodies, or ahe paraphrase of the melodies. we were thinking, we should do an online course. why not? basically, the online course takes from that recording. course -- itline

is called sax education. how did you come up with that name? tell us about what people will see if they get into your course? my publicist came up with that title. that is perfect. i used to have a quartet called the casual sax quartet. that is how it came about. host: i have to ask you, how did you get the name, mr. casual? it was my casual view of everything. i definitely like to improvise any chance that i get.

solosof the saxophone that i play are pretty much what they are, but i also have a chance to improvise. host: tell us about your career. , do you stillour play, or are you mostly in the teaching realm? guest: the teaching realm is a new thing for me. i have given some private lessons before, but this is a different area for me. i am still playing. everything is shut down due to the coronavirus crisis. dates have been postponed. hopefully there will be people showing up to the shows. 1976.ed them in it has been a while. host: i have to ask you, what are some of your personal

favorites that you have been on and you have been featured on? guest: i like this stuff i actually play saxophone on, because that is not all i do what i perform live. i play the keyboard, sing back run harmonies and play percussion. my favorite right now is the one i get to improvise on a little bit. i can't go over that, that is my favorite. host: i think i am right there with you. inside, is this a good time to pick up a musical instrument? is this a good time to perfect your musical instrument if you played a lot time ago and just have not picked it up for a while? guest: sure. it is something to do other than tv --watching a show on that is ok, too.

you might as well accomplish something. thingshat is one of the you hear repeatedly from students, if you had to give students of the saxophone or the keyboard advice on something they need to do that would make them better, what with that piece of advice be? all ofi always say learn your scales. get comfortable with all of your scales because as a saxophone player, you will be playing f sharp and c sharp, especially if you are playing with guitar players. host: how important is practice? children with their violins if you do not practice, you will not get better. how important is it for musicians to practice? guest: it is very important.

i remember when i was a kid, i used to hate to practice. there was a point where it was , i can really learn something here. then i would start practicing so much that my parents would ask if i would want to go outside. i was into it. practice is very important. how would you get better if you don't practice? host: tell us about how you got into the saxophone how did you get into music? was it something that was passed down through your family? how did you start playing? guest: the first instrument i played was piano. my mom and i both took piano but thenhen i was 5, we moved from pennsylvania down to florida and did not have a piano anymore. they were starting up a band in

school in the third or fourth grade, i needed to pick an instrument. is easy, i will pick saxophone, and i stuck with it. nothing is easy if you really want to get good. adviceny last pieces of for our musical fans out there? courseould pick up your and maybe things will go a little bit easier, right? guest: the courses, they can get them through my website. come on and check it out. normally $79.99, but recently, it has $50 off, so it is $29.99. host: we want to thank mr.

casual for being with us this morning and advocating online music education for all of us. thank you so much for the time. guest: thank you. host: we would like to thank all of you for sticking with us today. we will be back again tomorrow morning at 7:00 a.m. everyone have a great saturday and continue to stay safe and healthy. ♪ [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] ♪ changed sincehas c-span began 41 years ago, but our mission continues. to provide an unfiltered view of government. we brought you primary election

coverage, the presidential impeachment process and a federal response to the coronavirus print you can watch all of c-span's programming on television, online or error-free radio app and be part of the national conversation through c-span's daily washington journal program or social media. c-span, created by private industry. america's cable television company as a public service and brought to you by your television provider. tv,his weekend on book tonight at 9:15 eastern, the former federal reserve chair talks about the actions the fed is taking to mitigate the economic effects of the covid-19 pandemic. his latest book is first responders. >> we are not really talking about a stimulus package because people can't really go out and shop. we are talking about emergency relief.

what we need to do primarily in the fiscal package is make sure people can survive this period with very low income, that businesses losing revenue can pay their bills, pay the rent, pay the utilities. >> sunday on afterwards, the square co-founder offers his thoughts on innovation and competition for startup businesses in his new book. he is interviewed by washington post reporter. >> it turns out there is this thing that happens. this process that can happen when you start to solve a perfect problem, something that has not been solved before. most of what we do is copying, and most of our tools and training and comfort is with solutions that exist. book,10:00 p.m., in his the atlantic council senior fellow looks at the future of genetic