that impact you. coming up thursday morning, on florida and campaign 2020. the federal response to the covid-19 pandemic. and president of the foundation for research on equal opportunity talks about the u.s. response to the coronavirus pandemic and the herd immunity approach. watch c-span's "washington journal" live at 7:00 eastern thursday morning. be sure to join the discussion with phone calls, text messages, and tweets. >> thursday, the harvard kennedy school's institute of politics hosted a virtual discussion with political reporters on the 202 presidential campaign0. live coverage begins at 6:00 p.m. eastern on c-span. host: jim tankersly covers tax issues for the new york times and is the author of a new book titled "the riches of this land:

the untold true story of america's middle-class." guest: thank you for having me. host: how do you define the middle class? guest: there are so many ways you can define the middle class and some new ways people have over time. sete it as an aspirational of economic security items that americans want to have to make their lives feel safe and secure , and to pass a better life onto their children. i defined middle-class as someone who is able to buy their own home, their own car, send their kids to school come a safer retirement --, save for retirement. stablel people feel more through tough economic times. -- if you can build enough wealth up to buy those things, i think in america we would call you middle-class. are strivingle who for that security are aspirational middle-class. host: how far back in our

history does the use of the term middle-class go to refer to economic success? guest: we think of the middle class as quintessentially american, but it is relatively new term in terms of popular news and literature. there is references to a dating back to the 1800s, but it referred to very different things. we didn't really start seeing the explosion of both the middle-class and the use of the term middle-class until about the middle of the 20th century. the run up to and aftermath of world war ii. host: you are writing a book about a finding the middle-class , that it is the most important question in public life today. it was amid the rise of populism in the early 2010's that swept donald trump into the presidency , especially now that the

country has fallen into the swiftest recession in the country's history. when that laid bare the fragility of workers lives and dreams lost in the 21st century. where did the good jobs for american middle-class go? where will we find new ones? does your book explore where that is? guest: it does. comprehensive argument for what happen to good jobs and why we shouldn't expect particular jobs to return. it is a variety of factors including international trade, technological advancement, a shifting composition of an economy away from manufacturing. a crucial part of the american economic equation over time has not happened. in the past when good jobs have gone away, once sprung up to replace them. that was true when we transitioned from an agricultural economy to a

factory-based one. those jobs were better. we have not seen that this time around. millions of workers have been marooned in jobs that pay less and frankly do not make as good a use of those skills as the jobs they lost. i laid out a comprehensive -- makeup-- line i am goings not like to one particular industry. i am going to people. the argument in the book is that the american middle-class surges when we have a particular formula which is we empower people who have been disempowered in the economy to pursue their talents and make the best use of them. in this case that means investing in women, people of color, women of all races, metabolic -- -- fromng high skilled

around the world and give them access to capital. they will create businesses, economic growth, job growth, income growth, and ultimately the good paying jobs of the future. host: jim tankersly, his new book is, "the riches of this land: the untold story of america's middle-class." if you earned below 50,000 a year -- below $15,000 a year, that number is (202) 748-8000. if you run between $50,000 and $100,000 a year, (202) 748-8001. all others, over $100,000 a year, (202) 748-8002. you can also send a text at (202) 748-8003. on those jobs, there is a line and bruce springsteen's song about the textile mill across the railroad track, those jobs ain't coming back. do you think sometimes people

have unreal expectations of the return of industries, or the types of jobs that used to be part of the success of the middle-class? guest: i think people have been sold some unfortunate oversimplified visions of how a nostalgic economy can be brought back. i want to be clear i do think we could create hundreds of thousands, if not millions more manufacturing jobs now, but i do not think it will be the jobs we lost. if we look at the way the economy has evolved, those jobs are now requiring different skills. there is much more automation in american factories. the latest economic data, we are seeing factory production searching, but hiring is not. -- reduction surging, hiring is not. people have rising hopes that the good jobs they lost could someday be returned. it is seductive to think if we

just change trade policy we could just get those jobs back. when you talk to businesses, when you talk to economists, it is much more complicated. greathink there will be middle-class jobs in america, and we could have a surge of them. i do not think it is likely those will look like the jobs we lost. the politicians who promised we could bring back those old jobs -- i have been covering politicians my entire career -- i think they are misleading workers and voters. host: you touched on this a moment ago. i want to read this part of your -- you write, "i have learned in my reporting that the united states economy thrived after world war ii in large part because america made it easier for people who had previously been shut out of opportunity, women, minorities, immigrants to climb the economic ladder.

to make better use of their talents and potential. they were the unsung engine of what most americans now think as a time when the economy worked best." are we not doing that as well as we did and that post-world war ii period? guest: we are not. in some ways it is the same. similar impediments exists. we did not finish the work of the civil rights era. black americans still face actual quantifiable discrimination in basically every step of the way in their lives, from education up through the job market. that is true of other americans of color as well. it is also truly do not support women in the way we should -- it is also true who we do not support women. they have become our most skilled workers, as measured by education.

have policies in place that adequately help working mothers balance the demands society has on them for work and childcare. between the persistence of discrimination, new types of discrimination, and the overall shifts in the economy, we are not doing enough to open those pathways. meansod news is that we've got a lot of potential sitting here. if we could truly have equality of opportunity in america, the ability for every talented worker to do what she or he is best at, there is a productivity boom waiting to happen and it would not be that difficult to tap. host: limits the themes of law and order, and response to the pandemic, do you think the economic strength of the middle-class, that message as a campaign issue is getting buried? guest: on one hand, yeah.

we have a lot of important issues. i cover economics, so i want the economic story leading the newspapers. i also think there are crucially important health questions and questions about other things. in what -- in the other sense, it is the same question. everything is wrapped up and indistinguishable. it is impossible to distinguish between issues of race and economics in america because so much of your economic outcomes depend on your race from birth to death. we are having a big struggle over a bunch of those things in the midst of a health crisis. i do agree we are not hearing as much about what candidates would do for middle-class taxes. areink both candidates

attempting to speak every day to the americans they consider to be middle-class who might be swing voters and make the case for why their policies would -- theirt lead policies would lead to a better way of life. host: first up is ron from west chesterfield, new hampshire, below $50,000. caller: good morning. below mentioned, i make $50,000. i have for a very long time. i find you do not have to be black to be able to miss out on a lot of opportunities. out you don't really need an awesome job to be able to accomplish your american dream. what has messed my family and i up, despite the fact i work a lot and still make up for whatever money i can, i find the big corporations and wall street is what have really screwed us up into thousand eight.

2008. what took away -- that's what took away my dream, i probably won't end up owning a home. that was from the greed of wall street and big business. they did that to me. also, taxes on the middle class. the large corporations and the wealthy have all these tax breaks, and the poor can't afford taxes. onerous on paying taxes is the middle-class. it is no wonder we don't have much of a middle-class anymore. if the government and wall street would stay out of my way, i might could actually accomplish my american dream. not from a lack of working, i will tell you that. you areou have money or born into money, it is basically like you are not allowed to get beyond a certain point before somebody screws you over.

host: what kind of work do you do? guest: -- caller: i own my own cleaning company, that is not doing well. i'm doing contracts through my cleaning company, but also i am currently working part-time for walmart. host: we will hear from jim tankersly. guest: first, my heart goes out to ron. i want you to know you're not alone in the kind of struggles you are describing. millions of americans saw their dreams wiped out in the 2008 crisis. i have a big part of the book on how that affected people's economic standing, their ability to reach their dream and their optimism there -- also, the main character in the --k is a man named a green ed green who has had to take multiple jobs to put together the minute -- the middle-class

life that was formally one job. the problem is not that americans don't work hard enough. american workhours have gone up. that more than explore -- i want to get back to the very first thing ron said, which i think is important and kind of quietly lost. workers without college degrees, workers in the working-class have this solidarity now that crosses racial lines. the economy is treating them poorly no matter what race they are. it is not making full use of their talents. underpinning the book as a research project from economists

from stanford. one of them told me last year that the quiet change in the american economy is that over the last couple of decades, white men without college degrees have started to experience the kinds of difficulties, economically, to get ahead that in the past women and minorities have experience. part of the argument of the book is that all of those workers are in this together. out are all being -- losing at the feet of guys like me, white men with college degrees. those are the folks the economy has worked really wherefore -- really well for the past few decades. host: larry is next. go ahead. tankersley, mr. america is based on six classifications of americans.

it is all based on education, income and lifestyle. maze -- a toughwer class have time going through the maze. lower middle class and upper middle class find their way through the maze. lower upper class can fly over the top of the maze. the upper upper class has always been over the maze. had namesupper class and traditions like the rockefellers while the upper lower class are like the apple and the google. they are not upper upper class yet. they're coming too, but they don't have that name from tradition. i don't know if you agree with me or not. i like that metaphor.

tend to segment groups exactly like that in my mind, but one of the things about class in america is that it is rigorously defined. i have my own definitions i was talking about in terms of consumption and security. maze involved is an evocative way to think about this. host: you cover economics for the new york times, how long have you been thinking about this idea of where the middle classes and to write this book? have: the long answer is i been thinking about it since i was a kid. i grew up in a timber town in oregon, what was then a timber town. in the 1980's and 1990's, i watched an economic ladder snap out from under a bunch of kids i would to school with, and their families who worked in or around

the timber industry as it cratered. i guess i was more into economics than a lot of more socially adjusted kids might have been in high school. thendered a lot, when is economy going to work again for these guys who i liked and who worked hard and good but their hands and suddenly didn't have as much opportunity as their dads had? my entire career, i have been chasing that question and it has gotten bigger and bigger. whether as a political reporter asohio, or now in washington an economics reporter come i always come back to the question of when will the economy start working again. not just for the kids i would to high school with, but all of the hard-working americans no matter their race, gender or ethnicity who have, just like ron was saying, worked really hard not getting back out what they put

in. host: our line for those over $100,000, joe, oklahoma city. caller: some of the first 'sholars -- first caller stole my thunder. i really don't make over 100,000 dollars, but what struck me as i do not think they are going to be voices calling in for the billionaire class. i think americans need to realize that we have 650 billionaires in america. that 650 billionaires own 90% of everything around us. the media, the government. i think money in politics is one of the reasons -- you can't get policy when the buy thetrarich politicians to make the policy. you've got pelosi who talks

about investing in people below that superrich category, but her policies never really quite match up with that. mitch who is have up there to stop anything. plan, look at trump's tax $1.5's tax plan gave went to -- 83% of it the most ultrarich people in the country. here's another -- [indiscernible] going to exponentially grow where you have billions worldwide, workers being replaced. plan did away with depreciation for capital expenditure. brand-newey get a

machine, they don't have to take that out over 20 years of depreciation to get the right off on their taxes, they can expense it year one. trump's tax plan is going to crush automation jobs away from people. we have too much money in , now with netdia neutrality being killed, i want , ar guest to talk about kiva grassroots lending organization. host: ok, you have put a couple of issues out there. jim tankersly, your thoughts? guest: i covered the trump tax cuts. statistics.f those the 83% is only true if you are looking at the distributional score of the final year of the task at. -- tax cut.

the accelerated depreciation he is talking about, that actually is an expiring policy. republicans want to make it permanent. a very salient point about money in politics, which is something that people worry about and have tried to fix for longtime. most on the news of the themes of what i write about, the experience of automation. it is true, there are going to be millions of jobs automated. we are seeing it right now. it is potentially unsafe to have human workers back on the job, companies are trying to find ways to get machines to do that work. on the one hand, that is bad. on the other hand, it is going to make the cut -- it goes back to this idea of can we find better things for those

workers to? american policy over the past few decades has not invested in this idea that there is a norma's potential in human labor still. an optimist in human labor. i think there has been this disconnect. renewedrately need questions on how do be good people, how do we empower people to start the companies that create the jobs that will actually make use of the skills for workers that are right now being lost. question from southeast pennsylvania, what is the difference between middle-class and working-class? is the difference economic or cultural? distinction a without a difference. just like middle-class, it is different words people use.

i tend to think that working-class signifies what i mean as the aspirational middle-class. people who are working hard who want to have that middle-class security i can't afford their own home, maybe can't save for retirement, or get that job that allows them to send their kids to college, or maybe they don't have health care but they are working hard. space ofuch broader work then the working middle class. other people have definitions come i don't think any of them are right or wrong. host: also from pennsylvania, philadelphia. richard is next. caller: good morning. my concern is that, as somebody who will soon be retired, i am males movingack through this economy. you made reference earlier about the difficulty. males, at young black

needing to do these skill environment the america has always been in, how does this tie to education, which we see has been -- especially among working-class and poor, black people have been out a disservice. the --tioned also about i am going to be generous and say the biases within employment. whether the bias is unconscious or conscious, which has blackted lack males -- this moving into "middle-class." this threat seen will be addressed?

the biases have maintained consistently, for a long period black males out. as far as employment and the educational skill development, in order for even in the manufacturing area, taking out the unions, becoming apprentices. this thing of black mail , how doesand biases this change? economy that you may be writing guest: you have absolutely nailed the central tension and difficulty in our economy right now. it is very plain to see just how much of a problem education and discrimination are.

black men and women are an enormous house of untapped talent. it is unjust they be confined to schools that are not as good. making it more difficult to make it through college and have more difficulties landing jobs, being paid equally and being promoted once they do. all of these things are true. say isbook, what i there are no easy answers. the very best thing we could do for our economy right now would be to eradicate systemic racism and sexism. that is not something you could do overnight. i'm not pretending everyone will change their mind and just stop discriminating. these biases often are unconscious. companies hire people the way they always have. that brings people into a certain pipeline.

are very overt. sometimes discrimination is very overt. issues oflar, the educational equality and investment have been a struggle for decades. they have been a policy battle. there have been times when policymakers have been much more dedicated in solving them than others. i would like to be able to tell my one quick trickier we could solve the problems of education of mass incarceration, housing disparities. even if you are able to make maze as ahrough the black man in america you are thaty to end up in a house is undervalued compared to a house in a white neighborhood for no reason other than discrimination. to fix those things. those are policy failures.

this idea that we all do better when we treat everyone fairly. truly equalize opportunity. this is not a 0% gaime. like it would be holding back other groups. everyone would do better if they could finally get ahead. or easy toot small change things. be honest with ourselves about that as we fix them. host: you write in the book that if we want to know how to revise the middle-class we need to understand how it boomed in the aftermath of world war ii. there's a story white america has told itself about how and where that boom occurred, we need to start with the classic whitetail in order to fill in the part it leaves out and

correct the lies it tells us now. a question from twitter asks is your book address the role that fdr's policy played in creating the middle class? guest: the book picks up where fdr leaves off. it mentions one thing in particular. the policies of getting the new deal, getting america out of the great depression and of course, the war are very important. the war is maybe one of the most important parts of the start of the story. .he war was a forcing agent before world war ii, white women in particular didn't work outside of the home very much in america. black women had high labor force participation for a really long time. the war effort came and millions of american men went overseas to fight. by necessity, american women

fill those roles. they were factory workers and other types of workers. wart off, it sustained the effort and helped. second off, it kicked open a door. they flooded out of the labor force for a little bit when the soldiers came home. very quickly they were back into it. 27 million american women joined the labor force. that is a huge surge. the war is a big part of that. surge is the part they leave out of the story. so much of what we hear is the 1950's, to beaver 1960's men in the suburbs. it is true but the other thing that is happening was to sustain the high economic growth and low unemployment that we had in the boosted 60's that

income and pulled millions of people to the middle class, we had to add millions of workers. which we were of all races. workers had to be empowered to do higher use. that is the real magic of what happened in the civil rights era. 95% of, something like doctors and lawyers in america were white men. era through rights hard work and protest, americans tried to break down those barriers. more women and men of color started flowing into those jobs. those jobs got better. people got better at those jobs. that created economic growth which boosted incomes and pulled people into the middle class. it's a bit of a bank shot but it is very important. is jimur guest

tankersley, covers economic issues for the new york times. the untold true story of america's middle-class is his new book. we go to bill in erie, pennsylvania. caller: good morning, thanks for taking my call. i want to make one thing clear. america is where it's at today because of people that have been working in washington, d.c., for the last 50 years, 40 years. every time we try to limit the terms, nobody will go for that. you have people down in washington making these policies .or 40 or 50 years along comes a business guy like trump. i don't like trump because he is a big mouth. he's only been in washington four years. had peace and prosperity before the pandemic. that's what we all want.

didou look at what he before the pandemic, black, asians, latinos, women were all doing much better under this president. one of your other callers mentioned mitch mcconnell and nancy pelosi. there's a video that goes around this morning. down.ody else is shut she walks in and gets her hair done. it's a ruling class. elitists have been in washington all these years. that is why america is where it's at today. build in pennsylvania, jim tankersley. washington fort more than a decade now and i remain stunned at some of the

class works.ng i think the frustration with state legislature and local officials. there have been policy failures up and down. they start in washington, i agree with that. i want to comment briefly on his thoughts on the pre-pandemic trump economy. everything bill said was true. the president didn't actually jobs,r the major gains in repatriation of jobs from china, or 6% economic growth. if you look at actual growth looks like the second term obama economy. good but noty amazing, not like the late 1990's.

started with an economic expansion. really a historically feeble economic expansion. the levels he is able to claim success for were easier to achieve than someone like president bush who came in and inherited an economy falling , evenecession in 2001 before 9/11. true, the frustration is real. we really need to have an economy like our economy was doing before the pandemic. that has been hard for us to achieve. the role of various policies and getting to austin that point at that time. host: we will go to julia in boulder, colorado. first, i so appreciate your articulation of the ways in which issues are characterized that are issues

economic as well, thank you for that. i have a question that comes from an article you wrote last week about the durability of president trump's economic approval rating. thataid in the survey increasing polarization and political fidelity has a or disengaged altogether americans economic experiences from the economy. serious if the supporters of president trump who suffered youomically and conversely suggested the democrats pessimism may owe much to their view of trump as it does to clear assessment of realities. my question is if you think about what americans could do

politically and policy wise to support a private middle-class, could you talk about the impact of this phenomenon where americans of voting on their economic future may have something other than their own economic interests? guest: great question. thanks for reading that article so closely. it is really a wild phenomenon the last few years. withve been doing polling an online program called survey monkey since the beginning of the trump era. thehe worst time in economy, which is basically right now, republicans feel better about the economy right now then the best time for the democrats well before the pandemic hit. democrats were doing very well economically in 2017 or 2018 but they felt very pessimistic about it. republicans who are really hurting now feel optimistic about it. think the reflection of the

long-running disconnect people have been dealing with the economy themselves and this sort of increased tribalism in with the real economic outcome. economy ispe the going to actually deliver for you or to paraphrase the previous caller that the ruling class will design the economy or set the rules of the economy so that it will benefit you in the way you expect it to. say thed move on and .conomy is just one more thing do i feel like people like me are being heard? democrats do not feel empowered or like they are being heard, republicans feel empowered and feel like they are being heard. i worry about that polarization and our ability to enact these

policies. cutstrength of the economy across political lines. there is no other way to say it. areout workers who republicans, democrats, independents. we would not be able to restore the middle class without those workers. ,e have much more in common they're much more entwined with the higher end, upper-class americans who still have seen the economy working for them for a long time. i'm sorry i don't have a great answer about how to fix that. i think it's a huge source of concern. something we all could be thinking about as we cover the american economy and political system and ask how responsive it will be to the concerns of the people who are being hurt by changes in the economy. host: a comment from jt in

kentucky, i'm no longer considered middle-class here in kentucky. it's all about jobs, jobs, jobs. it takes three jobs here to make a living. in your research for your book, do you find that was a common occurrence? that's what it's taking a lot of people to be considered middle-class these days? certainly for families. they must have much more hours work now than they did 30 years ago, 40 years ago to be considered middle-class. i don't know where in kentucky the commenter lives but in particular if you live in a large metropolitan area with higher housing costs over the last decade in particular it has been much hearted -- harder for you. you have to work a lot so you and your partner, roommate, whatever to be able to be able

to afford that middle-class security. again, the main character in the jt, has tot like work several jobs just to create and maintain that middle-class life for his family. i do think the hours worked phenomenon is there. it is something that just gets left out. a lot of people in washington want to tell you the middle class has done just fine ignore the fact that any income gains we have seen for middle-class workers over the last two decades are attributed to the workload. host: here in the nation's capital, brent is up next. caller: good morning. when you first began your comments you are saying how there has been a promise of returning manufacturing jobs and that promise is often falling through. at the current period in time,

our nation will make that difficult to achieve. some of what we consider to be intentional new manufacturing jobs including renewable energy, clean energy, , what is the risk it if we don't move on establishing those as new manufacturing jobs sooner that automation will take some of those jobs before that could occur? really interesting question. thank you so much for that. in general while we want is for manufacturing to be the most cutting-edge, innovative stuff possible. i think there are ways in which that ends up being a lot of job creation. i don't know that early entry necessarily guarantee is a lot more jobs. except for the one way i can are competing in

particular with other countries that have cheaper labor on solar panels you may in fact have much more pressure to automate in the united states to be cost competitive. if you could establish dominance in a part of the field there is no competition for. if you create for example -- lot ofas a hired manufacturing workers in the united states. that is because they are on the cutting edge, they are certainly a partne in this, it is of the clean energy economy right now. they are job creators because you need people to stay on the cutting edge. it isng answer would be helpful to be on the cutting edge of all of the technologies that will solve human problems

and deliver benefits to the withry both economically social benefits as well. market evolves through that to be an area of dominance. rx colors from wisconsin, go ahead. caller is from wisconsin. paid 70they actually something percent. that is a huge difference. another huge difference is today even a college education for and at the same most of thentry -- educated people are trapped. they are sabotaged under $2 trillion in student loan debt

from which nearly every consumer protection has been removed. these are predatory loans. there's no bankruptcy protection, no statue of limitations. wrecking our younger people. this student loan catastrophe is wrecking. i would point out the president has the power to cancel these loans by executive order. penny for one national debt. host: are you paying? caller: i won't pay a penny until we get the bankruptcy rights. this is a failed lending system. 80% of our borrowers will not be able to repay their debt.

that is not me talking. that would be a good way to stimulate the economy right now. guest: the student loans are wealth building and moving into the middle class. is a huge issue for policy. i think he is absolutely right. the way the economy has changed has totally advantaged people with college degrees. the supplemental class job. waysf the more innovative that you could get into them to fix all of this to think skilled deployment development for this time ofybe in higher education prices we should be considering who needs

to go to a four-year school and for what? whether that is in fact as related to what you then go into the job market as we have. other countries do it differently. they have a lifelong learning or registered program. there are plenty of other models that we might want to consider. there is a big, difficult topic. we want to keep saddling students with debt. also, accumulate wealth. host: do think going to college is sort of baked into that whole idea of seeing better than you did? better than the aspirational quality of the four-year degree. it is important and if you take that away, things change. how important do you think that

is? it is very important. it is not an entire requisite. you don't have to go to a four year college to get into the middle class. there are still good jobs out there. they are much more difficult to get. is still a real premium for people who go to college and who did versus those not. just getting that degree is not enough. latter that i want my child to go to college. i went to college. my parents wanted that for me and my brother. i don't have any illusions that just going to college and graduating will be enough for my son to get a middle-class job when he grows up. i think that is part of the challenge here. leesburg, virginia, jonathan is next up. caller: the only reason school

is because the government pushed out the private sector loans which drove up the cost. maybe if we could get out of that business the cost might go down because the universities might compete for the dollar for once. when it comes to inner-city policy that is affecting minority communities, best thing to do is actually lower those taxes to incentivize businesses to come back in because unfortunately on the democratic side cutting taxes is not in the vocabulary. it doesn't make business sense to them. if you're managing the location, you have to understand everything on the table. if you are sucking the well dry you need to let it go back in and basically let loose, thank you. actually -- back when i

was a reporter in ohio i wrote a lot about state economic policy. a wrong way to lower taxes to try to attract businesses. ohio did it for a really long time. it was part of a big series my colleague and i did. you could throw tax incentives at companies to give them advantages over everyone else. that does not correlate with rebuilding economies. it is sort of chasing waterfalls. there has been a lot of data about it. the local level, creating jobs. we think about chasing businesses as opposed to seeing the conditions for businesses to that companies want to move

to to be close to. base clusterdge that spawns off other companies. beis something we need to really thoughtful about. there seems to have been america sort of reflects the handouts of companies that want to move in. int: we will hear from chris boiling brook, illinois. taking myank you for call. the declineis about of themiddle class, one things i would be interesting in hearing -- interested in hearing is the democrats in the u.s. to develop like china or india.

what do you think the trajectory of where we are going with respect to technology and jobs is? with respect to some of the other middle classes around the world like china or even in europe? guest: i like that question a lot. i don't get into it really in the book at all. it is very domestic focus. rise of the a great global middle class. for thereal victory markets and for the power of the global economy to lift people out of poverty the last several decades. there are people who argue that has come at the expense of the american middle class. while i think there are trends in globalization that hurt americans, i don't think it has to be that way. there's no rule that the american middle class must suffer in order for a global middle class to grow.

that anyone has to suffer for a global middle class to grow. i think it could be quite positive for the entire world to povertyle lifted out of and able to put their talents to use in their own country. to innovate and leave better lives for everyone. we would be better off where democracies flourish and are more stable. i don't think these would come at anyone's expense. it has been the case in america that the american middle class hasn't sagged while the global middle class has grown. even while the richest americans have done extraordinarily well. , theyk for some people decided that rise of the global middle class came at the expense of american middle class workers. host: jim's new book, the riches

of this land, the untold true story of america's middle class. you could read his reporting at nytimes.com. >> c-span's washington journal, every day we are taking her calls live on the air about the news of the day and will discuss policy issues that impact you. ,oming up this morning agriculture and consumer services commissioner on florida and campaign 2020 and the federal response to the covid-19 pandemic. president of the foundation for research on equal opportunity talks about the u.s. response to the coronavirus pandemic and the herd immunity approach. watch c-span's washington journal, live at 7:00 eastern this morning. join the discussion with your phone calls, facebook comments, text messages, and tweets.

♪ ♪ >> you're watching c-span, your unfiltered view of government. created by america's cable television companies as a public service and brought to you today by your television provider. chairser federal reserve took part in a discussion on monetary policy and the response to the coronavirus pandemic. the event starts with an outline of the central bikes -- banks reversed versions of its long-term goals and strategy. the brookings institution hosted this to our virtual event. >> i want to welcome everyone today. my name is stephanie aronson. i'm the vice president and director of the economics studies program here at brookings. thank you for joining us for today's event, organized by our hutchens center on fiscal and monetary policy on how the fed will respond to the