arguments, first trump versus new york on whether the president has the authority to prevent noncitizens from being counted in the census. that's followed by van buren versus the u.s., a case dealing with computer fraud. the house begins the week with a pro forma session with no votes scheduled but later in the week, they will take weapon measure -- take about measure of legalizing marijuana. on c-span2, middle east institute host a form to combat isis in syria and iraq and a 1 p.m. eastern, coverage of the arizona secretary of state's certification of the 2020 election results and the senate is back to consider a judicial nomination for the southern district of mississippi. coming up on today's "washington journal," new america foundation political reform project will share -- later, look into how covid-19 is affecting nursing homes and

assisted living facilities. with dr. david gifford and we will also take your calls and you can join the conversation on facebook and twitter. "washington journal" is next. ♪ host: four weeks after the election, joe biden and kamala harris today will receive their first presidential daily briefing with their inauguration as president and vice president just over six weeks away. this as president trump and his first tv interview since the election continues to maintain that he won. good morning, it is monday, november 30, 2020. glad you are here. we will start the program by asking you this, how has president trump changed the republican party? here's how to join the conversation.

.emocrats, (202) 748-8000 republicans, (202) 748-8001. .ndependents, (202) 748-8002 you can also send us a text at (202) 748-8003. make sure you tell us who you are and where you are texting from. on twitter, it's @cspanwj. and we are at facebook.com/c-span. we will show you some of the maria bartiromo interview this morning. but this caught our attention, too. senateirman of the budget committee, former new hampshire senator, judd gregg with an opinion piece this morning, is there a post-trump gop? received 74p million votes in this year's election. joe biden got more than 80 million votes. even if you take out california, which would be a uniquely healthy development for the rest of the nation, biden attracted a

distinct majority of the electorate. it's an unacceptable conclusion for trump at an inescapable conclusion for those who want to rebuild the conservative majority in the country. many argue that these numbers just reflect that the country is the divided. actually, it reflects a great deal more than that. if you consider who voted for trump and did not, it becomes apparent that there is a definite workable coalition that his center-right end if activated it would be a effective alternative to the democratic movement. it is still worth a try. upon 70 million voters, a lot of americans, but not a winning plurality, it seems there were three broad groups. these are the large segment of our society that feels genuinely disenfranchised. these are not the folks that "the new york times" in the rest of the national media tell us

about. mostly people that make up what used to be called middle america. hillary clinton summed them up in the minds of the condescending class that dominate the media and academia as deplorable's. they don't like being looked down upon by the smug. they may drive pickup trucks, they may work for a living at jobs far removed from the world of california. many go to church on sunday and until trump came along they felt no one spoke for them, a genuine gripe at how the coastal elites score and their values. they saw trump as expressing and capturing their frustrations and they still do. they are only republicans in passing. ."ey are populists and passion more specifically, our question for you this morning is how has president trump changed the republican party? line to8-8000 is the call for democrats. (202) 748-8001 four republicans.

for all others, (202) 748-8002. on twitter, much later after the interview with maria bartiromo, president trump tweeted "no way ." lost this election ," "presidenttoday trump continued to protest the election and did not say when he would drop election lawsuits and that his planes might last past the electoral college vote and even the inauguration of joe biden --

host: one more tweet on that, rick klein, the political director at abc, with a tweet this morning saying that today alone, wisconsin and arizona are expected to certify election results and the pennsylvania legislative session, the last chance for the trump lawyers and what they have touted. here is what trump had to say. [video clip]

they stuffed the ballot boxes. i have been hearing that expression for years. they stuffed the balance -- the ballot boxes and they use covid as a means. joe biden did not get 16 million more votes than barack hussein obama. he didn't get it. calls.ead to your how has president trump change the republican party? democrats, (202) 748-8000. republicans, (202) 748-8001. .or all others, (202) 748-8002 edward, michigan, good morning, go ahead. caller: [laughter] i was going to say that trump has completely destroyed what i thought of as the republican party as far as a platform with ideology. i would say that he has destroyed the norms that used to be in the republican party. the republicans used to follow

the rules. they would release tax returns, they would release, you know, their physical exams. they would, they would, you know, release their holdings, their financial holdings. then they would divest financial holdings after they assumed office. it wasn't rampant nepotism. they wouldn't hire the son-in-law and three children going around the white house. none of that is the case now. the norms have been destroyed. this is what is so terrible about trump. host: do you think, of the norms that have been destroyed for the republican party, does that pretend potential changes for the democratic party or in other parties? people who run, the former president this, we can do it. caller: that's the possibility.

once you destroy the norm, right? once you break it, than anybody can, yeah, you could have democrats who are, how would you say it, less morally proper? they could say well, look at trump. he kept all his properties. he visited his properties. why can't i do that? you know what i'm saying? you are going down a path that i think of as authoritarianism. there's probably a better word for it. host: another view from michigan, republican and independent, jack, go ahead. caller: good morning. thanks, c-span, for taking my call. i got a couple of comments i want to make. host: do us a favor, hit the mute button on the volume and go ahead with your comments. caller: let me get my tv turned down completely. calling, what i

was calling about, i personally think the election was ruined, like trump is saying. that part don't make any matter. i don't know if biden got 80 million votes, they are saying, but anyway, i got something i want to say for all intelligent democrats out there. now, i know,ing like i said, you didn't care, 30% of the votes were against trump. but if he wasn't involved in all that stuff in china and stuff, i got a bridge i want to sell you. host: that's jack in michigan. more of your calls momentarily.

joined next by the chief congressional correspondent for the associated press. with the house and senate returning in a sprint run for the finish of the lame-duck session. lisa, they've got 10 or 11 days left to get things done. why has the house itself pushed back their start time this week? yeah, good morning, bill. that was the announcement late last week, the house would be pushing back their start time, coming back wednesday. looks like they are trying to do in that same announcement, the majority leader, steny hoyer, also encourage lawmakers to stay close to washington at the end of the week because they were hoping to finish up their work very early next week. i think if you read between the lines there is a sense of maybe they try to push through the weekend. or you know, wrap up as soon as possible.

also, don't underestimate the situation with the coronavirus. you know, right before the holidays there was an outbreak on the hill among a number of lawmakers who announced they had tested positive and i think you know, the idea of bringing people in, even though there are protocols at the capital, it wears on the lawmakers. a number of senators tested positive in the capital. in a number of house members as well. i think maybe trying to truncate the schedule, getting folks in and out seems to be the plan. piece this morning by your colleague at the associated press is that congress returns with virus aid, federal funding unresolved. it seems more than usual at the end of a session, there's a lot to get done in 10 or 11 days. absolutely.

my colleague, andy, has a great rundown on the ap website. it's a great rundown of what's in store. congress often does this, where they sort of spend time not quite resolving issues and then get to the last minute and they are in crunch time and they jam through. often this happens at the end of the year. it's especially compounded this year because of the lack of funding for, like you say, both to fund the government and let's just go through the issues. they need to fund the government by december 11 or there will be a government shutdown, a federal government shut down. folks do not believe we are headed in that direction, but that's always a possibility. they are working on what's called an omnibus spending bill that would fund the government across all the agencies well into the new year, possibly into the full next fiscal year. you know, that would be through september. we will see how far those

negotiations go. there's a concentrated effort now to get that done. that said, you know, president trump would have to sign a bill like that for it to become a law and there are still a number of priorities that he wants that congress is unwilling to provide funding for. for example, the border wall with mexico. are still later we talking about this. we will see if they are able to resolve this massive spending package or if they have to punt and just do a smaller measure to keep the government running. and then they are also trying to coronavirus sort of relief package. whether it gets tacked onto the spending bill or is a standalone. again, people might have been hearing this, it's been six months more. eight months, really, since the last big aid package for the

virus and the majority leader, mitch mcconnell, house speaker nancy pelosi, they are not budging. neither of them have been willing to compromise on their priorities for that package. of course speaker pelosi once a big, robust aid package to fight the coronavirus. mcconnell is only willing to do a much more modest, targeted relief package of $500 billion. they are also trying to negotiate that. otherare a couple of bills. there's a national defense authorization act passed every year getting held up right now as well on troop drawdown levels that the president wants. renaming of the confederate bases. it's in the bill in the president has said that he doesn't want to do it. so, you are absolutely right.

a big end of the year pilot, like we often see, but perhaps even more so this year. coming insenate is today, the house coming in for legislative work on wednesday. the day after the election you had a piece saying that the election spit -- splits congress, gop bolstered as democrats falter. focus on that, republicans picked up gains there. they are still in the minority but they are close. guest: they absolutely are. another house race came in over the weekend. this really changes the dynamic in the house, where speaker pelosi as the leader of the democrats didn't have a huge majority but she had a robust enough majority. now it will be much, much more slim. that just doesn't leave a lot of room for errors. if you only have 5, 7 seat majority, you can only afford to lose a few folks on any given bill.

it really creates a new opening for the gop leader. for the republican leader, kevin mccarthy, to decide how he wants to operate in the new congress. does he want to continue in that opposition party position? or does he see an opportunity to work with the biden administration and try to cut some deals in a way that republicans might like. certainly folks like incoming president biden's a centrist and a lot of views and might be willing to make some deals like that. so, this will be the test of the new congress. of course, that all happens in the new year. congress, you know, set to be sworn in, typically on the third , january 3. that's a sunday if they stick to that date this year. we will see. host: lisa, always great to get an update from you.

folks can follow her on twitter, thank you so much for joining us. guest: you bet, thank you for having me. your calls,ue with comments, texts, and tweets, how the republicaned party? on the social media, text here from pat in indiana. "trump has destroyed the republican party. no morals, everything goes." darrell says "the negative effect he had on the republican, most people think, but republicans won down ballot. not to mention his epic failure on the pandemic rachel on facebook, "he has abandoned ideological conservatism for populism, moving from economic liberalism to trade protectionism bolstered by expensive industries." 19 on

facebook, "he didn't change it, he exposed to the corrupted party. that's why we love him. he exposes the corruption of matter the party or the organization. that's why he's hated." massachusetts. go ahead. caller: i agree with the last text you read. that the republican party may not have changed that people ini think many the country are now voting for or have voted for trump because he represents something very different from what the parties offer. i think he is exactly what the founding fathers wanted. the founding fathers wanted a leader. they, they, and i think they wanted parties that were

separate from the leadership that a president can provide. i think that is what trump does. that's why i voted for him. i think he tried to represent trying to rather than gain power just for a party like the democrats do today, who then turned their backs on the people and do just whatever they think people ought to, ought to be or have. you think that means a change for the party in general? do you think this approach changes the party? that's what i'm not sure about. i'm not sure how the party has changed. but i do think the leader of the senate represents more of the republican party.

how has it changed? i'm not sure on that. but i know they are a lot more careful about how taxes are spent. i think the democrats under pelosi, they are talking about ah, ah, ahon dollar money that is going out to help the people, but it is not well-crafted and i think the republican will craft it better. but if i could add one comment about the votes? here in massachusetts we have always had very careful election commissions that make sure that if you are voting, you have to be there or you do it by absentee ballot. in this year, they come here newton, massachusetts, the election commissioner sent out ballots to people that requested them by mail.

the staten to that, sent out thousands and thousands of more mail-in ballots to places where people haven't lived for 10 years. so, there was a flooding of mail-in ballots here in massachusetts. i don't know if that happened here in other states. i agree with trump, something happened in this election that never happened before. int: let's hear from cheryl provo, utah. also on the republican line. i'm so happy that we have this venue where we common citizens can express our view of politics. trump will always be considered a winner. and that he will never, never be considered a loser. even if he is not going to be the president for the next four years. the reason for this is that he

has changed politics forever. politics will never be the same after trump. what we are seeing now, with him challenging the election, is that we are going to get it refined and corrected because of his efforts. nonstop work president. he was elected to do a job and i moreim work nonstop, work than any other person i could see. i want to tell you about my grandson at the thanksgiving dinner, when he identified that he supported trump, after the dinner i asked him how he had .he courage to say that he's only 14 and he said because i watched what was happening and

i know that those sitting at our dinner do not study the issues. i think we have a lot of hope in the future of this nation when child, 14 one young years old, that studies the issues. host: did people around the table give him a hard time for his answer? caller: no, we directed the conversation differently than to be about politics. host: ok. cheryl, brooklyn -- i'm sorry, i will get to you. valley,james in spring new york, democratic line. go ahead. caller: good morning. sorry to hear from utah and massachusetts, but i know people like that, i've got a couple of friends and family members that are trumpsters. i love them, but i don't really

like being around them a lot. they are like the president. they don't listen. they don't listen. they hear. they get things twisted. has destroyed the basic decency of the office. country, i'm sorry for how we just let him go on and on and on. i listened to him yesterday. it's sad. the office is going to get ready to get turned back to some decency. don't need to go all the way back like it was. i think biden is going to turn it around and turn it over to a younger crowd. these people we got running the office now, it's just sad, man. i'm a vet and it really hurts. was -- on "the washington times," trump judges refused to look at evidence of .raud

"judges continue to reject the challenges of the november 3 .esults as groundless he will likely never accept the legitimate -- legitimacy of the .ind from joe biden "we are trying to put the evidence in and the judges won't allow it. we have so much evidence. they stuffed the ballot boxes, everyone knows it fired by therebs, president, was on "60 minutes" last night vouching for the security of the elections. [video clip] christopher krebs, fired by

president trump the election, farcical. allegations he sat down with us for his first interview before being forced out. -- since being forced out. >> let me get your reaction on some of these voting fraud claims the president is alleging. all votes in the united states of america are counted in the united states of america. i don't understand this claim. all votes in the united states of america are counted here. >> voting machines corrupted by mysterious actors in venezuela. >> again, there's no evidence that any machine i'm aware of has been manipulated by a foreign power. >> communist money from china and cuba used to influence the election. >> we can go on and on with all the farcical claims alleging

interference in the 2020 election. the proof is in the ballots. the recounts are consistent with the initial count. to me that's further evidence, that's confirmation that the systems used in the 2020 election performed as expected in the american people should have 100% confidence in their vote. >> you can see the full interview with christopher krebs, sunday. from last nights "60 minutes" program. this headline, from fox, "u.s. already setting covid-19 records , experts say thanksgiving could have made things worst, a surge superimposed on a surge, pouch you warning the coronavirus pandemic may soon get worse." this tweet from hoover technology, "moderna plans to request a clearance for vaccine

technology on monday afternoon analysis shows it was highly effective in preventing covid-19 ." our question for you, how is president trump changed the party, the republican party. trump has seen the party become more xenophobic, more overtly racist, more illiberal. but policy have they done in the last 40 years that specifically helps working people? all of these trump supporters he cutsr trump because their taxes, but the tax cuts will see taxes go up in 2021. appoint --olden golden toilet in a golden apartment in a building with his

name on it. the republican party has become more populist? votes to putte their taxes cut for the top 1%. there is not one single evidence of voter fraud brought up by the army of trump's legal team and they are trying to steal the election. how can job biden compromise with people who tried to steal the election. host: let's hear from mark in hawaii. go ahead. , soer: this is my opinion you'll understand why i feel this way. five swing states for trump. suddenly they decide they will close for the night and in the morning all of a sudden biden is ahead? that's fraud. that doesn't happen in a legitimate academic reality

where you deal with statistical analysis. that doesn't happen. the u.s. was stolen and now we are under the control of a criminal network. that's what happened. host: from facebook, roger says this about our question this morning about how trump has changed the republican party. "he has caused them to stand up for christian family values, making it more for the american people and not special interests." steve on twitter, "to survive, the republican party must have mainstream candidates who are willing to compromise and behave like adults. joseph, republican line. theyr: regarding nepotism

have become more prideful of our country. it's important to recognize that the u.s. is considered a negative body by the obama administration. president trump wrought new emphasis to the importance of making america first. that thertant republican party now recognizes the pride that we have as americans, it's emphasized in our economy and also in our defense of our country. thank you, sir. ok, collin, california, democratic line, go ahead. caller: thank you for having me on. party, theepublican previous preconditions, more prominently coming to maturity, such as the dishonesty, the lacking credibility with the

things that they propose. and respect for diversity. all those little things are way more prominent now after trump. in addition, they have no responsibility for the nominee they have now. that's kind of new for the republican party. they used to have a smooth surface running between their values and the christian that everyone knows is backing them. you don't have a smooth flowing line between trump and christian values. that's a massive deviation on the part of the republican party. i really appreciate you having me on today, thank you. salem, oregon, republican line, dennis, go ahead. caller: i think trump has done real good. he has brought some honesty back here. he removed a lot of the bad actors there in the government. changed toem have

trump fire down on fake news, allowing that fake news to be caught. bad.that trump is we are all here on this side pretty hard. it's pretty bad that democrat party is so crooked and biden cannot be put in presidency. the united states cannot take a crook and let him be our president and run our country. he has talked about what happened to him with burisma and all that. with china and with russia and all that. he couldn't care. ,ne thing i have seen a lot with all the negative, negative, negative. fake news is putting biden in. biden didn't run. we don't know what he's up to.

he hasn't answered the question. question answered the about his hunter kid. you know? host: one of our guest yesterday was a republican former member of the george w. bush administration. he talked yesterday about the republican party's what he termed mistake, and following president trump. [video clip] >> i think they thought they could contain and control him. that the office wouldn't be hurt at the outset of his presidency. what they didn't understand was the fundamental thing you have to understand about donald trump, in my estimation, he's a man with a disordered personality. he suffers from sosa thief. if you had understood that at the beginning you would have known that there was no line he wouldn't cross. there's virtually nothing he wouldn't do, no place he wouldn't go, no dark alley he

wouldn't wander down. because they made that link with him so early and it never broke, trump brought them to places that i think at the dawn of the trump years they never imagined they would go. question, how has president trump the republican party. we hear from a republican in georgia, they just finished up their recount. jody heist tweeting that some georgia leaders claimed there was no significant election fraud but prove it to the millions of americans who doubt our elections, let's have a real investigation and full-scale audit, if there is no fraud, or comenothing to fear line greg bluestein tweeting that the rocky relationship between brian kemp and donald trump hit a new low when the president said that he was ashamed that he endorsed the fellow republican in a what -- tight race for governor in 2018

." , pennsylvania. debbie, good morning. caller: the republican party really needs affixing. i mean, it's just been worse since reagan was at it. he taxed unemployment. he taxed social security. mr. trump said he was going to give all of us $25,000 a year with no federal tax. what did we get. $12,000 a year. that's what we got. the working man get any better with mr. trump. i did vote for biden. i am a democrat, but i did vote for trump the first time. but i thought i will never give the man another chance. thank you. ok, we go to new jersey, republican line.

high. hey, you are on the air. hey, you are on the air, go ahead. ok, yeah, sorry. i would like to make a comment against the democratic administration. ok, wereratic voters, bidenng in voting for joe to be president of the united states. that is a wrong move. that is the worst move in any political election ever. ok? oh, obama is behind joe biden 100%. he is his ghost minister. dowill direct joe biden to whatever obama wants him to do.

he has no inclination whatsoever, joe biden, to represent the united states of america. boss.his own theoesn't care about american people like president trump does. not 100%, he doesn't. ok,the democratic voters, ought to stand up and look at mirror andin the say to themselves that it's wrong to have him as president, ok? i reject and i am going to get a whole organization of republican rejectok, to reject, to the joe biden administration. i reject him as a president.

that's what i have to say. that the democratic voters are a bunch of no stupid people i have ever seen or heard of. biden, from the delaware news journal, he suffered hairline fractures after twisting his ankle playing with his dog. fracturing his foot playing with his dog. an injury that his doctor said would require him to wear a walking boot for several weeks, twisting the right ankle, the 78-year-old was being examined out of an abundance of caution and was diagnosed yesterday in delaware. johnstown, pennsylvania. hello, angela, on the republican line. president trump, how has he changed the party? caller: i wholeheartedly agree with debbie from new jersey

about trump. he loves his country and he shows it with all the work he's done for us. the one thing i would like to talk about is this thing. i believe in the personal responsibility of every individual the -- in the united states. when it comes to voting, i believe that everyone, if you can't vote at the polls, then an must go, ok, and get absentee ballot. it's your responsibility. if you are disabled and not able to go to the polls, you have to get an absentee ballot and vote absentee. none of this just sending ballots out where they go to everybody that are dead and wherever they are. that isn't, that's not right. that is a party running a voting system. we want the people of the united system.o run the voting host: pittsburgh, pennsylvania,

democratic line, good morning. i believe trump has changed the party for the better. there was a bunch of weakness that is gone now. these people are so strong on nown, two years from breanna have five dollars a gallon. and the racism from obama and his wife, it's another word for black people that hate white people. --host: let's go to greg. caller: donald trump represents the complete, complete transformation of long-term operation making, turning the geo tv in su p into a foreign ased entity as donald trump a long-term asset agent of russian interests going back to

the late 1980's. and also a long-term operation within the republican party engineered over the years by the council for national policy to create a close relationship between the u.s. and russian media, with combined interests close to the goals of israel and the domestic zionist lobby in the united states, breitbart, expanding their empire and the things they have funded over the years. my belief is that given the assertion of foreign money coming into people like lindsey graham, kevin mccarthy, and mitch mcconnell, who was not initially on board with all things trump. we have seen the complete transformation of the republican party into a completely foreign owned entity and that is what we are seeing now with these politicians who have become obsequious to trump, who were not on board in the first place. host: since their reporting on

the hill in their memo column, gop mulling future after trump, writing that republicans are mulling the direction the party will take from here now that it is crystal clear that trump will leave the white house in january . "what kind of role will he seek? and second, is the more populist and national direction the right one for the future"? you can read all of that column at the hill.com. line, go ahead. caller: i as a republican, i think donald trump woke up our sleepy party. it's unfortunate that most of the republican senators have not stepped up and spoke out for him due to this voter fraud. president trump predicted in the

beginning we would see high voter fraud. and that's exactly what's happened. people should only be allowed to go to the polls and vote in person. .o this won't ever happen agin i will refer to mr. biden is my president. i won't refer to him as president number so and so. i don't agree with his plan. tohink that what he's going do to our economy is going to be horrible. our jobs, everything, we are going to see things go in a neutral direction and we are going to start seeing him apologizing for america again. to apologize for my country. my veterans. hell no. but i will refer to him as president biden. host: larry, mississippi, democratic line.

president turned it upside down. this man has made this country hated all over the world. leaves, the attorney general of new york is going to show what kind of person this man really is. have a nice day. host: 15 more minutes of your calls on our morning topic, how has president trump changed the republican party. democrats, (202) 748-8000. republicans, (202) 748-8001. all others, (202) 748-8002. on another issue, supreme court reporter for bloomberg reporting that with the census case today, the supreme court finally takes clash final polarizing involving donald trump and illegal immigration. more on that story from "usa

," donald trump ending his tumultuous time in office the same way he started it, cracking down on undocumented immigrants and asking for help from the supreme court, the mode of being more political than ideological, seeking to exclude undocumented immigrants from census documentation, a policy that could affect the distribution of federal funds. the high court will hear oral arguments on monday and has promised to rule by the end of the year and if they hand him a lame-duck victory or just vacate a district court ruling against him, the result could be a loss of house seats in traditionally democratic or blue states led by california. a reminder, we will cover that oral argument this morning in the census case coming up at 10 a.m. eastern, live coverage of that here on c-span and on c-span radio.

two supreme court cases for you this morning. one at 10:00, one at 11:00. , next.ear from jeannie livingston, louisiana, go ahead. how are you? i voted for the very first time in 16. i voted because i saw the country was going. trump has never gotten any credit for what he's done. the onesrats, they are who caused the issues. they said he wouldn't work with him -- they wouldn't work with him before he took the oath of office. done or didn'tot get done was their own fault. i don't understand how it can be blamed on him when they are the ones who done it, the ones who caused it. thank you. bradley is next in northport, michigan. not changed the

party. he has become the party. you can hear these people in their voices. they are all in. it's a following. he will dictate a cutlass and mindless republican party, as indicated by these republican callers. it's very sad and tragic. thank you. this from "the wall street "trump" this morning, says his own fbi is ignoring his claims of election fraud, calling them missing in action in an interview on fox news, "you would think that if you were the fbi or department of justice this is the biggest thing they could be looking at, where are they, i haven't seen anything. the senator from missouri was on "state of the union" yesterday. he responded to the allegations of fraud in the election, here

is some of what he had to say. [video clip] >> as the rules chairman you have a birdseye oversight view of the election, do you think it was rigged? yes or no? rigged,'t think it was but some things were done that shouldn't have been done. there's elements of voter fraud like in every election, but i don't have any reason to believe that the numbers are that it would have made the difference. >> not enough to change the results? >> when they opened the ballots, they would have let people see that they were checking the signatures. when you send the ballots out to people that you don't know if they are they are not and they come back and don't check the signatures, that's a huge problem. but i don't think we demonstrated -- >> just to put a button on that -- >> wisconsin, finalizing results over the weekend. this is the front page of "the , "confirmingst

sunday that joe biden beat president trump in the key swing .tate by more than 20,000 votes the completion of the recount requested by the trim paint -- the trump campaign was an add-on to the pileup of defeats by the president as the president continues without evidence to claim that the widespread fraud affected the results. suffering losses in federal courts every day -- state and federal courts every day, and sunday there was little change in the final breakdown of the 800,000 ballots cast in the two jurisdictions and in the end the biden lead over trump grew by 87 votes and under wisconsin law, trump was required to foot the bill, his campaign pit $3 million only to see biden widen

his margin. on twitter, this one had a question this morning saying that president didn't change the party, he put a microscope on and the effect has been putting a spotlight on republican hypocrisy." lydia, minneapolis, good morning. caller: i'm calling on the independent mind. some independents are on the left, that's me. i vote green party about half the time for president. i did not this time, i voted for joe biden. i think that what trump has done has brought out some of the worst features of the republican party and magnified them. as well as turned into a cult of personality. it may not remain that, republicans have their own ambitions. challenge the trump supporters to broaden their sources of information.

oftenhocking to me how they say how great donald trump has been for regular people when he's not. it's not that i don't have my critique of the democrats. i think they are often spineless. but the country is in a crisis from the pandemic right now and it has impacted the economy and i have to say, much to my own surprise, i have been increasingly impressed by joe biden and how he is trying, in his calm, humane way, to bring us together. i really want to challenge republicans in trump supporters in particular to try to reach out a hand, instead of a fist. certainly, anybody who is democratic, liberal, aggressive, a lot has been put on us to listen to trump supporters. i want to ask them to try to do a little listening, to.

and think about how -- this pandemic could bring us together. i know that sounds cheesy, but we could say -- you know what? the virus doesn't care about your political affiliation. all of us are at threat. all of us know someone who has lost a job or might use their small business. havet want to say that we an opportunity in this long, dark winter to listen to each other. my brother is a total trump supporter and we are still talking. so that's something. say let's try to move on. point, what donald trump is doing to our democracy right now is dangerous and disheartening and is up to week, the people, to say every vote counts and over and over again, , affirming the joe

usen victory, let's try and this pandemic as a way to unite. thank you for c-span. host: thank you, lydia. kyle, republican line. caller: good morning from california. it's funny, you are asking all of these democrats and independents about the republicans, but they are not going to give you a fair shake on it. the thing about republicans and how trump has changed the party is that, you know, this has been coming for a long time. the previous batch of republicans that were in office, george w. bush, you know, they kind of sold the republican party out to washington. what you are seeing is, you know, what donald trump tapped into in his own way is that anger. you saw that with the tea party and then it manifested itself over time, you know?

you saw more and more populist candidates coming out. so, you know, that's how they changed it. the other thing is there is a cultural war going on with the left and a lot of people aren't into that, aren't into what the left is preaching constantly. tapped into trump that. he stood up to them in the culture war, where most of the old republicans would just give us a little win on economics and you can win the culture war. that's why they are so angry and all these calls, calling the republican party racist. when you can't argue something based on the facts, you yell racism. he changed the party for sure and it's probably moving in a better way, a more pro-american way, which is much better. host: kyle, thank you for that. this is an opinion piece from peter marie chee.

"joe biden has a mandate to work with moderate republicans. voters chose a moderate joe biden who won the democratic primaries but by sending more republicans to congress who rejected the radical joe biden who embraced socialist measures in the general election, the majority may be weary of the trump distain for science, but only gave the president-elect a mandate to work with moderate republicans, sacrilege to nancy pelosi and chuck schumer. the first order of business should be to enlist republican onders in selling americans vaccine with mitch mcconnell and joe biden taking shots, urging americans to accept paperless contact tracing and quarantining as necessary. mr. biden must broker a stimulus package for republican leaders that provides at least $1 trillion to replace lost state

supplementalnding unemployment benefits, offering grants to businesses for relocating and retraining workers." alice, democrat, new york city. hi there. caller: good morning, happy holidays. first i would like to say that i believe donald trump did his best to make america great. i'm not going to say it great again because america hasn't always been great. i do believe that he has sullied the republican party. the evangelicals, bite appealing xenophobia,bigots, and he brought out all the nasty hiding and,ave been unfortunately, the republicans are realizing what's going on. i know several republicans, they are good people, true conservatives.

i believe in their ideals, i used to be a republican. donald to the fact that trump has appealed to end andacted so many racist individuals who are obviously not educated in some ways. not that i am, but i think that he was attractive to people who just are not realistic about caring aboutust people. i mean it's ridiculous, the whole situation with covid. president trump has never come out to honestly say that he feels sorry for those who have died from covid. go on and supporters on about this whole election fraud, which is, you know, not true. if it was the other way around, you know, they would be going, ok, say, you know, go against

democrats with their beliefs. i believe democrats would just let it go and be, ok, fine. the republicans won. next,republican line, florida. dana, make sure that you mute your volume, there. go ahead with your comment but turn down the volume. dana in florida? dana, florida, my fault. you were probably made -- waiting for me to push the button. caller: are you there? host: i'm here and you are, too. go ahead with your comment. caller: thank you. i listen to a lot of collars. you know trump won the election. they are not watching all the evidence. all these people for michigan and pennsylvania that signed these affidavits are lying, ok? trump won this election. they hate this man, they want him out, they got him out.

joe biden, they are going to regret putting him in. i am a trump supporter, but i'm not a racist. that's all we have been called for four years. and now because biden one -- if biden had lost, they would've fought from tooth and nail for this and i think donald trump should pardon himself before he leaves that office. because they are going after him even after this. they hate this man. this is not over, look what happened to his campaign prior. carter page, all of them, now they are filing lawsuits. are all these people just lying against the government? i watch on c-span when they are there in front of the justice thing. we made an accident, we should have done things different.

after you messed of a man's life? washingtonahead on journal. in our next segment, want to talk about a new proposal that would increase the federal government's role in the election process. we are joined by a proponent of that proposal. the american health care association chief medical officer will talk about the effect covid-19 has had on nursing homes and assisted living facilities across the country. ♪ >> the u.s. supreme court hears oral argument in trump v new york today. the court will hear whether president trump has the authority to exclude undocumented individuals living in the u.s. from the senses proportion debate. listen to arguments live today on c-span.

or on the c-span radio app. >> tonight, netflix founder and ceo reed hastings and business professor aaron meyer discussed the unorthodox workplace culture behind one of the largest tech companies in the world in their book "no rules rules: netflix and the culture of reinvention." >> we have to do what is right to help the customers and company. you can be trying to please your boss, you're not allowed to let me drive the bus off the cliff. you have to fight for the benefit of the company. don't seek tosay please your boss, seek to please the customers and grow the company. we want people to actively think independently matches to implement their bosses wishes.

>> tuesday, treasury secretary steven mnuchin and federal reserve chair jerome powell testify before the senate banking committee. they will provide an update on emergency measures for no -- for relief triggered by the coronavirus pandemic. watch on-demand or listen live on the c-span radio app. "washington journal" continues. host: we are joined by the senior fellow heading the political reform program at new america. here to join us to talk about a new proposal calling on the increased role of the federal electiont in the process. before we get into your proposal, let me ask you about the election itself.

record turnout, record participation and by the federal government's own statement, a secure election, the most secure in election history. what are some of your observations and things you found surprising? the electionest: was a very secure election by all standards. in the weeks and months leading up to the election there was a tremendous amount of litigation and dispute over how mail-in ballots would be counted and some other issues of electioneering. following the election, there's been, as everyone is aware, tremendous amount of litigation and a fair amount of uncertainty as to how and when results would be certified. , butbeen a secure election

it is an election in which there is a tremendous amount of disputation over how votes would be counted and when and whose votes would count. all of that has created tremendous fodder for all kinds of conspiracy theories about the election itself. host: your proposal with new america foundation, the headline on the piece says america needs a new federal election agency. part of what you write is this, voting is -- as a result, most americans distrust our elections and unfortunately have had some reason for their skepticism. fair, secure and straightforward voting is the foundation of a functioning democracy, but a lethal combination of partisan politics, a long-standing neglect and sheer cheapness is because their system to fall into disrepair.

to fix it we need to give american democracy infrastructure the same attention and resources we gave two other national priorities. of a federalea agency that would oversee elections. we have to understand first how elections operate in the united states. every state and local jurisdiction sets their own rules for who can register, when they can register, this year we saw that highlighted with the arguments about when mail-in ballots should be counted and who should get a mail-in ballot. is that depending on where you live, you have different voting rules and in a country in which we have some national elections the depend of

the voting rules everywhere, we wind up sharing the same present, congress and senate, all of us depending on where we live, it may be hard or easy to vote. we may live in a lopsided district or a competitive district. we may live under independent redistricting commissions, we may live in a place where it's easy to get paper ballots, we may live in a place where the election trail is not as clear and secure. the idea is basically that we are one country and we should all vote under the same rules and everything should be fair and equal because we are all americans and we should all be treated equally. host: the problems with america's elections, all voters are not equal. you argue our elections face security challenges. voting is too complicated and federal oversight is severely

lacking. let's talk about that. we have the election assistance commission is a federal agency and commission. what is their role? guest: their role is pretty limited. at this point it's mostly just to administer funds to help local administrators, to make sure everyone can vote under the help america vote act. commission that's been pretty deadlock for a while. it doesn't really do all that much. minimal role in enforcing violations. the fundamental problem is there's just no baseline for how people should vote in this country, which is

why there have been so many fights over voter suppression, voter fraud, early voting, mail-in voting. we are living in a country in which we all depend on a safe and fair national election. yet where we vote very much determines how hard it is for us to vote and creates tremendous uncertain great area of -- gray area of litigation. --a sense it's that just creates tremendous opportunities of for grievance and for legitimacy . the foundation of any democracy

is that we have elections that are free and fair and equal. everybody's vote counts equally and that is something that really seems like we don't have so much here in the united states. proposedyou see this federal agency on elections the more than just an agency that provides money and assistance for states to vote, but actually helps them with the process of voting? do some security that has gone by -- that is done by homeland security and other agencies within the federal government 202-748-8003 >> we have this -- the commission you mention, this also federal election commission which regulates campaign-finance

. it's an equal number of republicans and democrats which means it's deadlocked and does nothing and it's basically totally ineffectual. some aspect of election security overseen by different agencies and there's the voting rights violations that are enforced by the department of justice. there is this patchwork of federal agencies. a patchwork of state and local jurisdictions and what it means is there is no one clear set of rules. but also that at the federal place that is no one oversees the election process as making national standards which congress would need to have. a useful analogy is to the

environmental protection agency, which richard nixon put in place when the environment was a clear problem and we were seeing clear degradation of the environment and there were a lot of different federal agencies that have various jurisdictions over different parts of the environment and what nixon did is he put them all under one toncy with a clear mission protect our environment and then over the years, congress strengthened the agency by giving them particular powers and putting in place particular national standards. whatnalogy works because we are seeing and have been seeing over the last several decades is a degradation of our electoral process to hyper partisanship. we've seen more and more state legislatures trying to shift the rules to benefit their party. we have seen more litigation undermining the consistency and

faith in our national system of elections and we see more and more opportunistic political actors trying to say that any results that do not help them are illegitimate and, because there are so many different rules and such different incoherent enforcement. it is easy to find imbalances and inconsistencies and that tolly undermines our ability run elections that are widely seen as fair and free. which is the foundation of democracy. host: our guest's with new america foundation, advocating for the increased federal role in running u.s. elections. do you support that? if so, the line to use 202-748-8000. if you oppose that, 202-748-8001

. you can send us a text 202-748-8003 with your thoughts. tell us your name and where you are texting from. you mentioned the ineffectiveness of the election assistance commission. you write a little more about the potential criticism of a federal agency. outrote critics could point this agency could be used for partisan advantage. that's why it must have a strong mandate based on widely supported principles of democratic fairness as well as an empowered inspector general to monitor potential abuses. we propose an extensive vetting appointees. a bipartisan list could be put forth confirmed by the house of representatives. that is a twist right there

having the house approve that. nonetheless, would you agree in these times it's hard to get people to agree on who a nonpartisan person is. agree, which is why i to ground important this agency and principles we can all agree on. free and fair elections in which all voters are treated equally in which the process is straightforward. i think a strong inspector general is extremely important. critics have pointed out that such an agency does put a large amount of power in the federal thernment, which is why intentions of that agency is important. there are a lot of lawyers and folks who are committed to

ensuring that we have an election every time we vote that and treatd free people equally. and what we see and what we have seen for many years in this country is that there plenty of local jurisdictions that have lyt treated all voters fair and equally. there are states that have done a tremendous amount of gerrymandering. there are a lot of states that made it harder for some people to vote largely because of what party they tend to support. these behaviors and actions really undermine our collective faith in our democracy. certainly it is challenging to find people who are seen as nonpartisan. but i think there are principles

we can all agree on as the foundation of a fair and free democracy and that having consistent standards everywhere is really essential to having elections that we can all agree are legitimate. host: you mentioned the environmental protection agency. give us an estimate of how big you think this sort of federal agency on elections could be. how big, the number of personnel, the budget. it depends on visions. i don't want to put a firm number on it. it has to be a few hundred staff people probably to oversee -- ithing depending

depends on how much congress really wants to allocate for security. important -- at the end of the day it might save taxpayers money because a lot of the money is spent in purchasing of election security across the whole range of state-level jurisdictions and if we can streamline that process and make it more efficient and also all ,he money spent on litigation .hey have to pay for that host: so house democrats have proposed hr one, some of the

ideas you are talking about included in that package? guest: one way to think of it is that it is an add-on to hr one. hr one sets a baseline and an important baseline for fair standards, treating all estates equally. independent redistricting commissions. basic standards for voter registrations. what the agency does is it fortes one central hub enforcing those rules, but also helping local administrators. they've done incredible work to make this election run smoothly and fairly. often they are attacked by their own state legislatures and state governors who were trying to get them to do partisan work when they want to just administer

elections fairly. i think we should see this those locallping election administrators to do the work and give them the support and resources and also helping to share best practices. hr one. be an add on to forink it is essential really putting a floor on what should be pragmatic. host: talking about increasing federal role in federal elections. we asked if you support or oppose that. he's also the author of a new book, the case for multiparty democracy in america. we have calls waiting period upper mar brougham, maryland supporting the idea. caller: thank you for taking my

call. i think this is too important for us to take a hodgepodge approach across the nation. i think like highway signs are all green and stop signs are already throughout the nation that our voting system should be one way. not done here differently than somewhere else because it does allow for things that have happened recently to come into play. i think it is too important for us to not consider that. i know it's difficult to do something. i would take it a step further. not just offering help, but really consider all being on one page. i don't see why that would be problematic. we all want to be able to play by the same rules. , itfor those who don't causes to raised eyebrow if you want openings for confusion. i'd like to hear your remarks. have a great day.

guest: thank you. i like your analogy to highway signs. another way to think about this after world war ii, we built the interstate highway system to standardize travel across the country. had one set of roads was consistent everywhere and was also a national security issue. so in the case of a national emergency it would be easy to move resources. you could certainly draw parallels to our election system that given the password nature.

it is easy to find a hole somewhere. as a national security issue it make sense to have one secure national system. election security experts have been warning about vulnerabilities in our system. biden won and really came down to five states that were reasonably decided. you can imagine a few jurisdictions and the results could've gone a different way. because we have this very

closely divided electorate in elections do come down to a very small number of seats. we have the georgia summer election. that will come down to just a few jurisdictions. -- georgia senate election. ifs also bad for our economy we have election uncertainty. it creates a tremendous uncertainty. if you care about the economy, national security, you should care about having a clear set of standards for our elections. washington hear from with lonnie who opposes a rule. wart: -- caller: i'm a cold soldier who fought against communism and i'm going to put it like this. i was a missile tech radar communications computer whiz.

i'm the guy responsible in 1985 for sending multiple packets over the mail to the pentagon. this computer situation has gotten off track. my son is a computer i.t. engineer and i know what he does and who he works for and i'm not an essay, but you guys and your computers need to go away. we need to make this a manual system. we all need to get up off our spots, go somewhere and vote. if it's a kiosk or live where everyone can see it. no one needs to be getting in with a thumb drive or disk or anything else in this foreign mass, everybody in the country outside our country wants to be in our system. get them out. goodbye. host: any response? lonnie is right in one respect that there should be a paper trail for all ballots. providing an of

opportunity to check if things are uncertain. i think this agency would require all election jurisdictions to have paper ballots which is an important security backup. require --should not depend on everything to be electronic. to have artant federal agency in charge that every jurisdiction has a paper trail because without it, things could get screwy. mentioned thatbs paper trail that had increased from 2016 about 80% of votes cast had a paper trail compared to this year were 95% with a

paper trail regardless how the vote was cast. where does this leave states in terms of states setting -- what would be left for the states to do in terms of setting their election laws, rules and policy? -- no this federal agency would only have jurisdiction over federal elections. house, senate, president. states have a lot of local elections are governors. cities run their own election. the cities and state could still run their own elections however they want. this would concern federal elections. dealing constitutional power they would have. name this agency is

setting a floor, a baseline standard of what constitutes a free and fair election. more, theyant to do would be free to do that. but it really sets the baseline of how you ensure free and fair elections so that everyone's vote is counted equally. let's hear from willie in mississippi. caller: thanks for taking my call. i am supporting this. they need to do away with the -- i bet college and a you he wouldn't volunteer to count those votes. election they were not voting in every election.

that's not what this is all about. it's all about being on the same track. in my state they do a lot of suppressing of the vote. states they have a whole entire month to early vote and they vote on weekends. you have same-day registration. people go down to register and vote that same day. i just want people to understand, people have things to do. food andvered your your food did not get there and you were mad because i had to go and vote, how would you feel? that, with the idea we the federal government and this agency would say here's what you

need to do for early voting. is that part of your proposal. that would require an act of congress to empower that agency. hr one, that there would be an enabling piece of legislation that congress would pass that would be a baseline standard in this agency would help to implement that. and also make sure states follow the standard rules so that if you are voting in mississippi or in california, you get treated equally and your vote counts the same. let's hear from edward in cypress, texas. everyoneood morning to at the c-span team.

i wanted to ask a quick question. the previous gentlemen had made soomment about not being gung ho about the electoral college. i have that same energy. specific ask very question as it pertains to gerrymandering. prettyder myself to be a bipartisan person but i wanted to ask when pertains to gerrymandering do you believe the process is maybe a little maybeanced in that it's -- for lack of a better word, it's a little too uncontrolled. do you really believe gerrymandering should be something that is ever-changing or should be much more the consistency. redistributed and

manipulated to be in favor of a specific part of the next go round. thank you and have a blessed day. topic of the gerrymandering. what some states do is they have independent redistricting commissions, which are not partisan. trying toot one party advantage itself. of competingumber considerations in drawing districts better. an independent redistricting commission said to do a pretty good job in canada. the u.k. also has a national independent redistricting commission.

so the idea is that we shouldn't let pars and legislatures draw districts in a way that unfairly advantages their party in the next election. that's like playing a game of football and whoever gets -- whoever scores a touchdown gets to decide on what rules it wants to play for the rest of the game so the team that's good at passing says you have to pass on three of the four downs. that disadvantage is the team good at running. play sports, we have a consistent set of rules. it doesn't matter if you win, you don't get to then change the rules. in politics, if you win the election, you are in power and you get to change rules.

that's been going on a long time in this country. two folks have mentioned this in a row and i think the electoral college makes no sense. never really served the role the framers expected it to. it was sort of a late summer compromise and all the framers were sort of exhausted and couldn't agree on how to elect a president. and no other country in the world has ever looked at it and said that's a good idea. the requiresd say a constitutional amendment and throughout the history of the united states, we had numerous debates about getting rid of the electoral college going right

back to 1800. , therers of arguments have been four times in which one chamber did pass a constitutional amendment to alter the electoral college only to see the other chamber not approve it. it's been something we've been trying to get rid of in some form or another for a long time and it sticks around because in one of the two chambers there's always at least one third of the representatives who think it benefits their party to keep the electoral college. but it still makes no sense. the: you talked about parties. your new book is about the two-party system. quickly, why do you think the country would be served by

having more parties rather than what we have now, essentially two ruling parties. guest: if you look at what's been going on, this hyper partisanship. you can look at it in terms of this election issue which we've been discussing. when you have two parties competing for narrow majorities. do tolittle thing you can rig the vote in your favor becomes that much more important. and then once the other side starts doing it, you feel justified in doing it. that escalating hyper partisan warfare and it's been going on , including of areas elections. it's destroying our faith in democracy. it's become red versus blue america. when you think that half of the country is evil or dangerous

because they support different party -- they support a different party, that creates a sense we just can't come together and solve the problems we need to solve. is anarty democracy alternative vision in which there are numerous parties and the coalitions are a little bit more flexible. instead of democrats trying to cross the republican stretch across the democrats, different parties forming different coalitions and no one party thinking if only i could rig the vote in my favor. there are no permanent majorities. there's just different governing coalitions. also a two-party system forces identities andwo we know from group psychology divide people into

two teams, see that face the other one as dangerous. some people might be out there watching this saying haven't we always had a two party system and why is it a problem now. there's a couple of reasons why it's become a real problem. although we've had a two party system in name. what we had for a long time are two very loose and overlapping party labels. and a lot of different state and local parties. that created some loose jointed whohis in our party system went across the aisle because they didn't have strong identities as democrats or republicans. you could say we really had something like a four party system.

as politics nationalized in the , that system collapsed into a two party system. now politics is thoroughly nationalized. very closely divided and it's divided over this question of who are we as americans. what is our national identity. america is this multiethnic society in the most dangerous way to divide a multiethnic society is to have one party for arguing that america should be multicultural society and another party arguing that we need to go back to more traditional values. singleld have more of a identity. binaryt creates this

high stakes which is incredibly dangerous. one of the narratives coming out of the selection is latino voters are not a monolith. but our party system makes them into one. ascentralizes them democrats. i think a multiparty system would allow many communities to express the diversity of even there within communities and create a space in which everything was not zero-sum, which is destroying our democracy. in many ways that with the core of these problems. -- that was the core of these problems. i hope people engage. thety much almost all of democracies are multiparty

democracies. the u.s. is an outlier. that would require electoral reform. calls withgo back to lee druckman. go ahead. caller: good morning. trumpid you think of firing chris krebs? the only one that's putting doubt on this election is trump and his cronies and fox news. we don't need more federal role in elections. it was great,id that we did a good job. it is trump. i have republican friends and i've been a democrat my entire life. been5 years old and i've voting since i'm 21. and we never had problems.

we could discuss anything. whohis piece of work trump should be tried for treason hisuse he's putting up right hand to uphold the constitution and now look what he's doing now. thoughts, they mentioned chris krebs and his statements about the security of the election. certainly trump has taken strange, byuld say american standards, approach to the transition of power, that's putting it generously. reasonsink one of the why trump has been able to cast so much doubt on the electoral going ons because for two decades now, the republican

party has been casting doubt on the fairness of the electoral process and many republican elected officials have been. you look at trust in elections for republicans and it's plummeted. arguings have also been there is tremendous voter suppression and that may be even that cost democrats the election in 2016. and had democrats lost this election, there would be a lot of arguments on the left that somehow voter suppression or some unfair process because democrats to lose. i'm not sure. i'm pretty sure biden would have conceded. pollingif you look at , these over many years, you will see there is a lot of doubt being cast on the system

and the reason for that doubt is because as i've said there are different rules everywhere and a lot of those rules are put in by partisanisan -- legislatures. and there's also tremendous litigation activity around those rules. not to defend trump in any way. i think he is a committed threat to our democracy. but he didn't come out of nowhere. thealk about trump as supply of misinformation and conspiracy theory. market fors also a that and a market that has been created over many years. say we think we can just will get trump out of here and end this uncertainty and illegitimacy will go away. host: the president keeping up

his efforts to challenge the election results with a tweet this hour saying i'm not fighting for me, i'm fighting for the 74 million people, not including the many trump ballots that were "tossed." let's go to carmen in chula vista, california. good morning.er: i'm for more federal restrictions. there's so much room for interpretation for each state and for each county in return. seeing, we need clarity because it's causing a lot of confusion. we need to standardize each of the elections and how they should be run. people talked about the early voting.

this affects a lot of poor folks. they need early voting to be open on sundays because a lot of people work six days a week. these are very small ways of repercussionsthe are not even able to be counted will. -- not even able to be counted. people are very naive in there isn't manipulation because politics is about power and when that comes in, pretty much anything goes. i'd like to give an example in citizens votedhe to allow felons to vote. and it was overturned by trump

appointed judges. thinke repercussions i florida would've gone to democrats. no doubt about it. host: thank you for the call. any further thoughts on what she had to say or thoughts on your proposal. correct that is torida voted overwhelmingly give x felons the right to vote in the state legislature overturned that. it's something federal standards felonslarify is that x have a right to vote. they have served their time. that's the standard in most states. but again, if you live in lon, youand are an ex-fe are disenfranchised.

that was something that was done by a partisan state legislature. republicans in florida thought it would help democrats if more x-felons voted. this is the funny business and partisan shenanigans that undermines our sense that our elections are on the level. carmen's sentiments echo the concerns a lot of people in this country, the rules are rigged against them. and if were going to live in a democracy, we shouldn't feel like somehow the rules are rigged against us. host: really enjoyed the conversation this morning. thanks for being here.

more ahead on "washington journal." next we will talk with the american health association chief medical officer duck about the impact covid-19 is having on nursing homes and assisted living facilities. your calls and comments on the supreme court case on the u.s. census. ♪ >> the u.s. supreme court hears oral arguments in trump v new york today at 10:00 eastern on c-span. the court will hear rather -- will hear whether president trump has the authority to remove undocumented immigrants from the senses apportionment base. c-span or on the c-span radio app.

>> tonight on "the communicators." ceo reedounder and hastings and business professor aaron meyer discussed the workplace culture behind one of the largest tech companies in the world. do what you think is right to help the customers and the company. you can be trying to please your boss, you are not allowed to let me drive the bus off the cliff. you have to fight for the benefit of the company. boss,seek to please your seek to please the customers and grow the company. just to implement their bosses wishes. >> "washington journal"

continues. host: dr. david giffords is with us this morning this segment to talk about the impact of covid-19 and how health care facilities and nursing homes across the country, good morning. how many -- give us numbers on how many facilities, assisted living facilities your organization represents. about 15,000 nursing homes in the country and 35,000 assisted living. host: what has your organization done since the beginning of the pandemic, the changes to the spread of the virus, the -- to stop the spread of the virus in those facilities. guest: the challenge has been learning about the virus.

early on we didn't know much. did not know so many people who did not have symptoms could spread it. we did not know what right practices were. it was hard to control for the first several months. now we have a better sense, we are starting to get a grasp. what we are learning is as the virus is in the community it spread to the facility. workers live in a home, families are visiting all bring the virus into assisted living and nursing homes. have your facilities gotten better at taking those initial steps in addressing the things like quarantining, social distancing and separating and isolating people in those facilities who do have the virus. thet: those are a lot of new steps people are taking.

partly the availability of resources is limiting. the number of tests, the amount of personal protective equipment , masks and gloves are still hard to get. that's been a challenge. wall street journal reporting the news covid deaths in u.s. long-term care facilities and they write , experience from the early days of the pandemic and research have shown community level outbreaks pose a significant risk. what's next steps do you think have to be taken to try and get a handle on the virus. we have been tracking it since the beginning and the amount of covid outbreaks in the nursing homes directly correlates with the amount in

the community. if we can get control in the community, we can get control in assisted living facilities. people need to train not to congregate in large groups, family get-togethers are a challenge. we are very worried the recent holidays are going to contribute to the spread and through the summer we saw outbreaks in nursing homes that were linked back to events in the community. our guest is david gifford bread we welcome your calls and comments. for those of you in the eastern and central time zones. .02-748-8000 202-748-8001 for those in mountain and pacific. for those with a family member in a nursing home, 202-748-8002. we welcome your comments via text, 202-748-8003.

-- niney have you been months into the pandemic, have you been able at your facilities been able to provide personal protective equipment, been able to staff as well as you had hoped to? personal protective equipment has gotten a little better. but the challenge still has been the n95 masks that filter out the virus and the gloves. those are principally made overseas. as we opened up and the virus spread, everyone is competing for those. we need to ramp up local production to help with that. we are just out there competing with everyone else. the same with testing. we got test supplies and some test equipment, but not enough. turnaround times for testing can take three to five days or

longer and that allows a virus to spread while you are waiting for results. moderna is going to ask the fda for emergency approval. nursingthe plan in homes across the country? how will the vaccine be administered? guest: we are excited about the prospect of the vaccine. that will help us with residents and the staff in these facilities. the federal government's been working on a robust plan where they will work with walgreens and cvs to administer the clinics. host: the former head of the cdc tweets it's increasingly likely an effective vaccine will be available in the coming months, that's why it's more important than ever that we slow the spread. let's hang on until vaccination is widely used.

physical distance, mass, handwashing are key. how about the intake of new patients into nursing homes? how has that changed during the pandemic? they: when they come in, are usually kept in a single room and treated as if they have covid. for usually the first two weeks. forget that if you get exposed to the virus, if you don't develop symptoms or test positive often for a number of days. that's why everyone has to quarantine when people get exposed. we see a lot of people who test negative and say i don't have it, but you're still within that 14 day window, you can still change. people are misinterpreting a negative test. we have to assume they are

exposed on the day of discharge from the hospital so they have to be capped in isolation for 14 days. realere must be a emotional toll on the residence residents at -- nursing homes not being able to see their family. do you have any sense of that? guest: it is very tough. particularly for individuals with dementia who can't remember why this is going on and each time it something new. it's been very tough. parents are 88 and 89 and they live about 45 minutes away and i've hardly been able to see them. that's been very tough. host: showed some photos of various facilities with the staff masked up.

some workers in some states have gone on strike, demanding pandemic and hazard pay. is that something your organization has looked at? >> certainly we've been arguing from the very beginning that we need the right equipment for staff to take care of the residents. we've also been advocating to congress to provide as much resources because not only is ,he cost of equipment gone up so has the cost of hazard pay and salaries to the staff. we certainly need additional resources from congress. host: dr. david gifford is our tet -- guest. chief medical officer of the health care association. we welcome your calls. again, if you have a loved one

in a nursing home, you have a separate line. the biden-harris campaign had put out during the campaign, a proposal, the biden-harris plan to make nursing homes and long-term care facilities safe. some of what they say in the proposal is that they say that more than 200,000 americans have lost their lives because of covid-19. the pandemic has had devastating impact on older americans and people with disabilities and the workers who care for them, particularly those living in nursing homes and other long tim -- long-term care facilities. this, thee plan says biden-harris administration will protect residents and workers in nursing homes and long-term care facilities. they say joe biden will protect residents of nursing homes and facilities. he is committed to providing older americans and people with

disabilities as safe and dignified community to live in during the pandemic and beyond. ensure effective point-of-care testing in contact tracing is available at every facility and ensure updated public health guidelines are followed with respect to frequency of testing for residents and staff. diseasean infectious specialist in every regulated setting. among the points, ensure that all workers and residents in long-term care facilities have optimum ppe. by fully invoking the president -- defense production act to increase production. you have a out that shortfall of the n95 masks and other ppe. it sounds like you would support some of this plan, at least. guest: it sounds like a sound plan, and we would support it. we have been an advocate for the and anon prevention nest advocate for more testing and

supplies. an advocate for more n95 masks and increasing local production for that. i think all of those things would definitely help. host: let's hear from jeanette in florida. go ahead. caller: good morning. good morning to your guest speaker. home,in a nursing advanced nursing home. a black girl brought it in their and gave me -- gave it to the wing. they put me in a covid wing. they said that i had a fever. they threw me in the covid section, then they took me out of that nursing home and threw me in another nursing home. me my medsot giving right. i am on morphine and percocet for pain. i have extremely bad pain, and i also have osteomyelitis, which is a rare cancer of the bones. in my leg.

aty cut my toes off countryside hospital. host: are you currently in a nursing home now? caller: no, thank god, i am home. i want to be at home. these nursing homes down here in florida are terrible. i can't go on like this. i never want to be put back in another nursing home. i got scabies in the second nursing home. jeanette in florida. any response? most people don't want to go to a nursing home and understandably, want to be at home. as she described, certain people need to be there after they come out of the hospital for some rehab and care. others, sometimes just don't have family members and cannot live at home alone. it is really a last resort, and we understand that.

they are very sick and very disabled, as you could hear from her story. i think during this pandemic, it has been a little bit chaotic with having to move residents around and trying to shuffle them into covid wings in different buildings. that guidance has been ever-changing as we have learned more. early on, we were moving people around based on symptoms, which in retrospect, we have learned is not necessarily the right thing you need to based on test results. i think those are all good points she has raised. host: in general, where's most of the guidance coming from? do most nursing homes and follow state and local guidance on their operations? guest: most of the guidance has been coming from the cdc. and need ofhe pace getting information out there, there has also been a lot of state guidance and local guidance. frankly, at times, it has been confusing.

you have some states saying whatever you do, do ask but not why, and other states saying make sure you do why but not x. that is a very confusing thing. i think we are starting to see a little bit of reconciliation, but we really do need consistent guidance. host: let's hear from alice in new jersey. you are on the air. caller: thank you. i listen to c-span in the morning. i get so aggravated. i'm so glad i finally got through to you this morning. is how ist to know joe biden going to do all of say, things that you especially today, when he has dementia? everyone knows he has dementia. how long is he going to last as a president? host: that is alice in new jersey?

an earlier caller mentioned she was not able to get her medications. how has the pandemic made that a challenge for your residence pretty much nationwide, in addition, not being able to go out and see specialists? andt: in the nursing home assisted living setting, they usually work with a pharmacy that will shift -- ship medications there. few rely on going out to a local pharmacy. if you work with a long-term care facility, you should be able to get medications. inhave not seen a shortage this setting. and the humidity, it is different because it is harder to get in and out and travel around. host: how hard has it been to maintain staff in terms of the nurses and other aides and doctors who come to check up on their patients? staffing was a problem before covid.

we were asking for help in trying to recruit and get more staff to work in nursing homes and assisted living. the staff has been tremendous. they care for residents often like their family members. many times, residents don't have family members or they are far away. they have been fantastic with that process. many of them have been sick and died from covid. that has been added stress. many of the changes that have had to go on with testing and monitoring at all of the equipment and keeping people in their rooms, has really increased to the need for more staff. -- host: before the pandemic hit, what was your organization's approach to a potential spread? what was the worst case scenario you may have envisioned before all this started? guest: this is pretty close to it.

that disproportionately affects the elderly. a very serious virus which often lands the elderly in the hospital. certainly, we have seen most of the deaths in the country being in those who are old. we take care of people mainly over the age of 80 with many chronic diseases. as jeanette mentioned earlier on. that has been a real challenge. to have a virus that really and notthis population everyone else in creating shortages like this, really has been a worst-case scenario. host: let's go to james in connecticut. caller: thank you very much. what i would like to ask you about is as someone who has at a inh level medical position the country, can you discuss the supply chain issue in terms of getting access to masks that are

made in the usa? hasnderstanding is that 3m butmain plans, -- plants, the main issue is that we hear that the precursor chemicals and fabric that must be used has come from china. in other words, all roads lead to china, even before we want to produce more masks. can you explain to the american population if we need to lower our epa standards allow chemical plants to reopen in the usa so that we can make the precursor chemicals that coat the fabric for the masks? no one seems to explain how these masks are really produced in a supply chain. i would appreciate your higher-level overview. point.it is an excellent even if you are to open up and make plans in the united states, the raw materials for many of these come from many places around the world.

making axico has been lot of the personal protective equipment and many suppliers have turned down to mexico. certainly, the raw materials have been a problem. early on, the materials that made masks to wear the same ones used for gallons. when we had a worldwide shortage of masks, everyone took material and started making masks and it created a shortage of gallons. masks also take time to build the right equipment. on andt can't turn it make it right away. that has been a challenge in the supply chain as well. i think it really speaks to why we need to look at where we fit in the world and how we relate to all of the different countries because working it alone and trying to do it alone, lots of -- but, it wouldn't work. it is really going to take the world working together to battle this pandemic. one line for those of you

who have a close friend in a nursing home. on that line is diane from akron, ohio. caller: my mom is in a nursing home. she did get covid. luckily, she recovered from that. there is a lot of problems with this nursing home. although it is highly rated. toare considering moving her a different facility. i would like to know what the doctor thinks are the most important things to look for when you are trying to search for a decent place with decent food and a good staff. i will hang up. enke. -- thank you. guest: i'm glad your mom recovered. the majority of people who have gotten covid have recovered. -- howas house to select

to select a nursing home, it is a very common question i get given my role. the first question i usually ask is why does someone need the nursing home? are they going there for rehab care right after being in the hospital? are they going there to live? did they have dementia? how mobile are they? you want to match up the needs of the individual with the facility. the other issue is there is a very good source medicare compare where the federal government collects a lot of different information on survey inspections, staffing levels and outcomes. i would look at that. i would not just look at the overall rating, whether it is a five star or whatever star it is. i also want to make sure that the areas of need are doing well. if they are going there for short stay care, i want to focus on that aspect.

for dementia, i want to focus on the longer-term aspect. sourcethat is the best to look for information and sorting it through. certainly, you need to visit the facility and see what is going on. are the staff interacting with residents, or our residents not being interactive with staff? that is a little hard to do visiting now because of covid, but that is something i would often do. i think people often try to pick the facility closest to them so that they can visit more frequently. but is an important aspect, proximity to you may not be guaranteed the best facility, and you may have to go further to get a better facility. that is a balancing act many people have to balance as they pick a facility. let's hear from john in philadelphia. caller: good morning. i have four questions for you.

is, why are nursing homes so negligent? another is, why not a mask mandate throughout america? the super spreader events .re allowed to take place i think the recommendation for wearing masks is really key in the distancing out there is needed. somehow, people are perceiving these masks as just protecting them and their freedom. the challenge, we know, is about half the people who develop covid never develop symptoms. you could develop it and unknowingly pass it to other people. even if you are to develop symptoms, for two to three days before, you could spread the. virus to other people this is why wearing a mask is really showing respect to the

, that, however it may be you are respecting the spread to other people. somehow, we lost that message out there. i think that is an important message. forest hills, new york. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i assume by your title, that your task is to ensure that medical practices and diseases are fought across the board. jeanette, wasler, openly racist. why didn't she say something about that? what was the relevance of her having to inject that woman that brought the covid into the nursing home wing where she was was black? don't you think you should have

said something about that? thank you. think this covid has disproportionately affected african-americans, latinos and asians. that has been a significant problem and many of the workforce are minorities in long-term care facilities and need better access to care and resources that are out there. it has nothing to do with their ethnicity as to what the problems are that are out there. that is a point that we need to address. some of the facilities that take care of more african-americans, latinos, asians, need more resources because they tend to be in poorer neighborhoods with less access to resources that are needed. thatnk we have learned some of these things are built into the system and we need to

address them. host: some reporting over the holiday weekend indicating there is a further search in covid cases. a report in "the washington post" as hospital beds inside a hospital, where will all the patients go? dr. deborah birx at the white house was on "face the nation" yesterday talking about her concern over a potential rise in post-thanksgiving numbers. [video clip] >> if you looked at the second wave going into memorial day weekend, we had less than 25,000 cases a day. we had only 30,000 inpatients in the hospital and we had way less mortality, weigh under 1000. we are entering this 3,t-thanksgiving surge with 4 and 10 times as much disease across the country. that is what worries as the most. we saw what happened post-memorial day.

now, we are deeply worried about what could happen post-thanksgiving because the number of cases, 25,000 versus 180,000 a day. that is why we are deeply concerned. it looks like things were starting to improve in our northern plains states. now, with thanksgiving, we are worried all of that will be reversed. david gifford, given the potential for a rise post-thanksgiving, what further actions are you proposing for your facilities that are represented by the association? guest: i think we have the same concerns. earlier -- in many situations, nursing homes are the relief valve for hospitals to clear out individuals who need care so they can make room

for all of the sick people coming in. so seriousirus being with the elderly, you don't want to move everyone out of the hospital into a facility. when the outbreaks are occurring, we are sending more people to the hospital in the icu, which is increasing occupancy. this is why we have been calling withhis to be a priority ppe and n95 masks and testing. right now, you can still go to a clinic and get your test results back within 24 hours, but many nursing homes send their test results out and they still get them within five days. we need to be at the front of the line to get those results back because the residents in these facilities are affecting the care and the hospitals. host: could you see a return to potentially some of these mobile hospitals that were set up in april and may and such if the cases got that bad? guest: i hope not, but that is a

possibility that could happen. host: let's go to new jersey. this is ethel. caller: hi. my daughter is in a nursing home in jacksonville, florida and i live in new jersey. i would like to get her here, but she keeps going from the nursing home to the hospital. weeks, she went back to the hospital twice for the same thing. had open heart surgery, that is why she is in jacksonville, florida. she really lives in georgia, but they sent her to jacksonville to get open heart surgery. she has been there for a year. now, she is in the nursing home. is she for covid?

does she have covid? caller: no. she had open heart surgery. host: right. caller: [indiscernible] i don't know how i can get her back here to her home. host: ok. any observations? guest: no. ethel, sorry your daughter is going through that. i think it is a good example of the people that need nursing home care are very sick. they often go back and forth to the hospital because they are very sick. even when they get all the right care. that has been a challenge.

one potential silver lining out of this is that people are beginning to explore the use of zoom and videoconferencing with that. anduld encourage you to see make sure you videoconference with your daughter and staff in the facility and ask them those questions. i think those are all very good questions you should be asking them for. hopefully, we will have better communication because as ethel is describing, this is a very common scenario where family members live many states away from someone in a facility and cannot go physically visit them even if there was not covid. host: let's hear from lisa in florida. good morning. caller: good morning. thanks for taking my call. i have a mother who is in a care facility here in pencil gorda -- punta gorda. i struggle with the fact that i

am unable to verify her level of care. she is uncomfortable, she has a very short attention span. i'm not able to get close enough to even hand her a banana without getting shouted down by the facility staff. i understand trying to prevent the spread of the virus. however, my concern as the only person in her life who is invested in her well-being, how do i verify that the nursing home is actually doing their job, taking care of her, clean,ng her sheets are that her physical well-being is clean? i found sores on her arm, excedrin i cannot seem -- etc. i cannot seem to get satisfactory answers as to what is going on, how they are caring for her. she doesn't have any comorbidity type of aspects. she cannot advocate for herself.

struggle to advocate for her. what do you recommend for that and who holds nursing homes accountable when they are shut down to the degree that those who care most about the people inside cannot verify the level of care? host: appreciate that. thank you. guest: a couple of things. guidance allows for compassionate visits, not just outdoor visits. needs ane really checkup or is missing you a lot and it is affecting their mental health, that is now qualified as a compassionate visit. you should be able to use that. if you go to the cms website, they do have the guidance on compassionate visits. tested beforeget you go in, make sure you don't spread it. the staff there are absolutely

terrified of getting the virus in. they really are taking sort of any extreme measures to prevent any potential spread of the virus. that is having an effect. another option would be to do some videoconferencing with your mom. hopefully, if she is able to express that. the other is, we have seen family members volunteer and some of them training as nurses aides to work in a facility and not just care for their family members, but others as well because we do have a shortage out there. i think those are all potential options. if you wanted to go on the ,nternet and google your state you could contact them with concerns in the facility. host: next is bill in virginia beach. caller: are you talking to me?

host: yes, we are. caller: great, thank you. in january. be 71 heart patient, i had bypass surgery in 1999 and i take a half dozen pills a day, a couple for cholesterol, one for blood pressure and one for the heart. i am in good shape overall. other than being a little overweight, i feel pretty good. att of the time, i hibernate home watching tv and people like yourself. my main question is this. , ioticed on television believe they call them therapeutics. there were a couple of them, the names slipped my mind. you're probably familiar with them. they were given to president trump when he went to the hospital. an oxy something and the

other started with an "r." he had great success with those and they made him feel really good and took care of his symptoms. he was in and out of the hospital rather quickly. i was wondering if these types of drugs are currently able to be used in some situations for people in nursing homes. you had a good point. there are a couple of medications that can be used, remdesivir is one. it took me several months to get the name of that one downright. another one is high-dose steroids. those are the to the president received that can be helpful. comeedications that have available -- i cannot pronounce the names of those. the antibodies are antibodies

that fight the virus and block infecting more cells in the body and spreading it through the body. you need to use it early on in the process. the two medications i mentioned in the beginning, remdesivir and the steroids, need to be administered in the hospital. the antibodies are meant to be administered in a clinic or other settings, not in the hospital, because you want to treat someone early on. once the virus has multiplied and spread throughout the body, using those antibodies may not work and makes things worse. we do have a couple of promising treatments out there. i think we are advocating they make those available for the nursing room setting -- nursing home setting. i think they have made all of those medications available to the hospitals, and we have to figure out how to get those from the hospitals to the nursing homes. caller: i have three separate

questions. first, have you noticed an uptake in family trying to discharge their loved ones from nursing homes and take care of them at home with more people being unemployed and whatnot, just to prevent their contracting covid? secondly, i read where minnesota's governor sent emails to state employees asking if they would volunteer in long-term care facilities -- settings for up to two weeks, no experience necessary, if this is actually a good idea and that they have been successful. think it kind of exemplifies the crisis in staffing that we are experiencing. lastly, do you anticipate they will be mandating nurses for the vaccine, and be wary this could be a concern with more staffing problems if nurses are not comfortable getting this new rollout on the vaccine? thank you for your answer. guest: good questions.

certainly, we do need more staff to come in. i would say any volunteer work coming in, there is work that could be done that could free up staff for the residents. there are short-term courses you could take. we have not seen that many family members trying to get people out of the facility because usually, someone is there and cannot be cared for at home. if they could have been cared for at home, they would have been. some people are at home now, but some people are still trying to work from home remote the. that has been a hard aspect of it. we haven't really seen that much of the change. what we have seen is fewer people going to the hospital for elective surgeries. care andd then need

have not been going to the facilities. we have seen a big drop in the facilities out there. on the mandating of the vaccine, i don't hear anyone planning to mandate the vaccine. i will be first in line to try to get the vaccine. we know they work very well. i am really encouraged by the data and we encourage all the nurses to get them. host: dr. david gifford, chief medical officer with the american health care association. we appreciate you joining us. guest: my pleasure. focus onad, we will this story, the supreme court case coming up in less than 30 minutes. trans-bid to exclude undocumented immigrants from reapportionment arrives at the supreme court." our question for you, should undocumented immigrants be counted in the u.s. census?

>> the u.s. supreme court hears oral argument in trump v. new c-span.theon court will hear whether president trump has the authority to exclude undocumented individuals from living in the -- living in the u.s. c-span, on demand or on the c-span radio app. >> tonight on "the communicators," netflix ceo and a business professor describe the unorthodox workplace culture behind one of the largest tech companies in the world.

think have to do what you is right to help the customers and company. you can't be trying to please your boss. you have to fight for the benefit of the company. in general, we say, don't seek to please your boss, seek to please the customers and grow the company. we want people to actively think independently, not just implement their boss's wishes. communicators" tonight on c-span2. >> "washington journal" continues. host: we will take you live to the supreme court, the first of two cases today. the u.s. supreme court weighs trump did to bar u.s. immigrants from census totals. this is set to take up donald

trump's contentions effort to exclude illegal immigrants from a population totals used it to allocate u.s. house of representatives districts to states. theright to challengers to july directive include various states led by new york, cities, counties, immigrant rights groups. they have argued the president's moves could leave several million people uncounted and could cause california, texas and new jersey to lose house seats, which are based on the state's population count in the census. the court, which has a 6-3 conservative majority is scheduled to hear an 80 minute teleconference. they write that president trump lost his bid for reelection on november 3 in this case focuses on one of several policy moves his administration is rushing to complete before joe biden takes office on january 20. our question for you, should

undocumented immigrants be counted in the u.s. census? one line for democrats, one for republicans and one for independents and all others. we will take you live to the supreme court here on c-span and on c-span radio just about 10:00 eastern as cameras are live now outside of the court. this is the washington free beacon. toump asks supreme court keep illegal immigrants out every does during -- redistricting." the trump administration will press its bid to exclude illegal aliens from the population baseline for awarding house seats on monday in the supreme court, a move that would shift political clout away from states with large undocumented populations. president donald trump's july order to exclude illegal aliens from the report -- apportionment

could be one of his most consequential acts in office. states like california, where approximately 6% of the population is undocumented, will lose out on congressional seats and untold millions in federal funds if the administration prevails. congressional analysts suggest democrats will lose the house in 2022 on the basis of reapportionment alone since red states with growing populations are expected to gain seats. right leaning states like florida and texas could each pick up one seat fewer as a result of the order. writes thatacon" the dispute is moving at a fast clip. president trump must transmit a reapportionment to congress by january 10, 2021.

the constitution requires the government to conduct a census every 10 years. our question for you this morning, should undocumented immigrants be counted in the u.s. census? one line for democrats, one for republicans, independents and all others. president trump has not tweeted this morning about the case. he is, instead, focusing on the elections again. in this case, georgette. "why won't the governor of georgia, the hapless governor, used his emergency powers, which can be easily done to overrule his obstinate secretary of state and do a match of signatures on envelopes. it will be a gold mine of flawed and we will easily win the state." president trump also saying, quickly check the envelopes versus the number of ballots. you may just find there are many more numbers of envelopes -- ballots than there are envelopes.

so simple, so easy to do. georgia republicans are angry, all republicans are angry. get it done!" from georgia on our democrats line. i think the immigrants should be counted on the ballot. he lost fair and square and i don't understand why you don't give it up. he is a dictator. host: why do you think that the emigrants should be counted? caller: they are here. they should be here. they are here, they should be counted. host: let's hear from barbara in maryland. immigrants should be counted due to the fact that we pay the tax for them.

we need to count them. ok, barbara on our democrats line. we started to read this earlier. this is the "philadelphia inquirer" report. "trump's bid arrives at the supreme court." robert barnes reporting "president donald trump will swing for the fences and his last immigration battle at the supreme court where he claims authority for the first time in the nation's history to exclude undocumented residents when deciding the size of each state's congressional delegation. opponents of the plan say it is foreclosed by more than 200 years of practice. the text of the constitution, the authority granted the president by congress. three lower courts have ruled against a trump, and a fourth set the time was not right before a decision on the

questions merit. his lawyers will tell the court that it is up to the president to decide whether undocumented immigrant should be counted, a decision that could have far-reaching implications for states representation and power in the congress and billions of dollars in federal funds." next on our republican line is sonya in omaha, nebraska. caller: hi. host: go ahead. caller: i don't believe so. i believe it undermines our national security, people that are here have worked extraordinarily hard to do everything they can within their political round to protect our country. we have had some really rampant of illegal immigration. still trying to deal with that now.

that needs to take priority right now. host: james in virginia. caller: how is it going? i definitely think that we should count them. the reason i think we should count them is because they are here and if we are going to continue to pay for them regardless of whether we do or do not have the money, then we should have the money. otherwise, you are taking resources out of the mouths, pockets, whatever you want to call it, of those who are here legally, those who are americans. they are losing out. people at undocumented at the cost of true americans, seems ludicrous to me. marcel in is maryland. caller: good morning.

the foreign immigrants should be counted. the part of the population [indiscernible] they should automatically be counted because they are part of the population at the time of redistribution. host: betty in new orleans, louisiana. your thoughts on the supreme court case? it will air live on c-span at 10:00. go ahead. should i'm calling about undocumented immigrants be caught -- counted in the united states? host: you bet, go ahead. caller: i think they should be counted. those people come here and work youre fields picking vegetables, cleaning your houses.

why should they not be counted in the census if they are here whether they are documented or undocumented? not all people that are documented are doing the work that these undocumented people are doing. those people are working because they have to and they want to work. why anyone would say that they should not be counted in the census. yeah, they should be counted. i used to work, i am retired, but those people work. if it wasn't for those people that is doing that work in those fields and those gardens and barns, you see what the world is like [indiscernible] you see what the farmers have to go through now. host: craig kaplan tweeting this p's policy tom

exclude undocumented immigrants is up this morning." the coverages out, of the u.s. senate. "mark kelly will be sworn into u.s. senate wednesday at noon per senior democratic aide. heldast time democrats both senate seats was 1952." this is front page of "usa "progressives demand .old policy from biden aren't interested in giving president-elect joe biden a honeymoon. after helping to mobilize election turnout of young people and left leaning democrats, leaders of the self-described progressive wing of the party

want to hold the biden administration to promises made on the campaign trail." caller: maybe i am misunderstanding. it is not just about our electoral college. i know i am a republican and it is popular amongst my views, but this is the equivalent to -- excuse my goofiness -- the mighty ducks episode where they change the line so they could get the player to play and win the thing. this is the census. it is more than just our electoral college and how we defined where the [indiscernible] come from. whoever is here should be counted, it is a census. host: luis in north carolina. caller: good morning. this trump administration is going to continue on throwing

the straws to try to find something he can get to the supreme court so he can say hey. he already furthered the supreme court for who we think is going to roll in his favor. i don't know if he is talking about legal or illegal because we know legal people can vote and illegal people would not have a social security to be able to register. regardless of all of that, why don't they just look at taxes in florida to see if there was illegal immigrants voting in those areas? trump just knows that once he is out of office, he is going to jail, simple as that. host: michael is next up in fort wayne, indiana. your thoughts on the census. and simple,s plain they should be counted. i say this, and i will make it short. it breaks my point to hear all of these -- makes my heart to hear all of these, what my

grandparents used to call, white ,olks who don't give a darn who don't think about other human beings. in that case, we should go back to the natives and ask if they want us here and we just had thanksgiving. they should be counted. they are human beings, white angelical christians. have a great day. host: some reaction on social media and via text. this is steve in corpus christi who says, if you don't count them, how do we know who is in the country? is,a in maryland, "the fact the constitution is worded as .very person, not citizen even further evidence is that slaves were 3/5 of a person, as disgusting as it is to use that as evidence, for census purposes

in the past." in michigan, they should absolutely be counted. they pay taxes like everybody else except trump. they are also essential workers. they are putting food on our tables. we should be thankful because they do the work others don't want to do. caller: the question is simple, our these people members of a community? you don't have to be a citizen of the nation to be a citizen at the local and state levels. to say that people should not be counted because they are undocumented is kind of absurd because they are not technically u.s. citizens, but they are citizens in their local , columbus and cincinnati and buffalo and new york city. they are citizens within these communities and should be counted as part of the population. on ouret's hear from dan

republican line in oregon. caller: hello, how are you doing? host: fine, thanks. caller: haven't talked to you in a while. no, i don't think they should be. they are here illegally, and then you get these callers here saying they are part of the community, but if they were here illegally, they would not be part of the community. i hear a lot of callers really mixing things up. this one gal calls up, they clean our houses and pick our food. they don't clean my house, i clean it myself. i am 60 years old and it is a lot of work, but i'm not going to hire somebody illegally to clean my house. until people get their facts straight, they really need to figure out what is going on here. if they are in the country illegally, they should not be counted in the census because they are here illegally.

that is the bottom line. host: here is an analysis of the case on slate.com. must choose court between trump and the constitution in the census case." they write "the critics have charged it is a fancy word to reach conservative results in sanctioned discrimination. the supreme court's blockbuster census case will be argued on monday and will be a major test of whether there is a principal core to conservative original is in -- originalism. it will help show whether the courts conservatives are willing to follow the constitution's text and history where it leads. presidency,is president donald trump has flouted the parts of the constitution he does not like. involvesnew york president trump's decision to disregard the federal government's constitutional obligation to count all persons residing in the united states in apportioning representatives for

congress. on july 21, president trump --ounced it would be further, they say the constitutional question in trump v. new york is open and shut. the constitution through article one and the 14th amendment exclusively requires an actual renumeration of the people and to count the total number of people in each state. the constitution's framers wrote the requirement to conduct a census count of the people directly into the constitution -- the first nation in history to do so -- in order to prevent manipulation of our democracy. it is fundamental to our democracy that the government cannot ring the census excluding persons living in the united states from the account used to

apportion representatives to congress." luis, go ahead. caller: i believe they should be counted. i feel like illegal immigrants, undocumented immigrants and body the idea of america and the dream that so many strive for. semantics aside, constitution says, we the people, not we the citizens. we really need to reevaluate our humanity and our soul as a undo thef we are to steps that we have taken to improve our country and move forward as a nation. that's all. host: thank you. syracuse, new york, next up is ray on the republican line. caller: we definitely should not count undocumented people in the census. think if you were going through the voting booth and they say,

ok, but the undocumented guy over there, you're not going to be able to vote today. that is the reality. undocumented is undocumented. they are not citizens. they are not entitled to be counted. it is common sense. it is the constitution. just because it is done for a while, does not make it right. host: texas, we hear from michael. caller: good morning. i believe if this case is constitutionally open and shut, it will give the american people a good chance to see the moral qualifications of justice barrett. furthermore, i know several undocumented immigrants, some of which are the hardest working people that i know. i believe they should be counted. these people are not free riders. they have some of the highest work ethic and they are unbelievable people. they worked just as hard as any other citizen in the united

states. i would think they should be counted in the census. host: jack on our republican line in fort lauderdale. go ahead. caller: i just wanted to tell you that i lived in mexico for five years, back and forth from the united states to mexico. when i showed up at the border, i had my passport and i had the paperwork on how long i could stay and when i had to leave. i would not for around. i know exactly when i had to leave because i knew the mexican government would not put up with it. i really abided by all the rules and regulations and people that also lived in the areas i lived in in mexico did the same exact thing. i don't understand how we have all of these illegal people in the united states without the paperwork. can you explain that to me? host: to michigan, we hear from robert.

should undocumented immigrants be counted in the census? believei absolutely they should be included in the census. we are already sending back to mexico, or wherever they are coming from, the presumption is that much of trump's argument is referring to people coming in through the border. we already have ice going around going after people. i think the people that have been here for years and years, they have a vested interest here. the bottom line, we refer back to the constitution. the constitution is something is supreme court, i believe, to follow and not whether they are going to give someone a political advantage. we should remove this partisanship when we are enforcing these laws. host: thank you. coverage coming up in just a few minutes. the first of two supreme court

cases. oral arguments today. as we pointed out, the justices are hearing arguments virtually once again this session and likely into the new year as well. our coverage here in just a few minutes on c-span and also on c-span radio. marian on ouris democrats line. caller: good morning, thanks for taking my call. i think we can simplify this. the constitution clearly says -- and this is all republicans, and i totally get that we have to worry about illegals versus legals -- but the constitution is very clear. we are supposed to, in the census, count everybody, not every citizen, everybody, so that we have a good understanding of how many people are actually living in this country. if a president can basically say we are not going to count this particular group of people, what is it in the future going to be that a president may say, well,

republicans, or let's not count somebody else. it isvery clear, and stated so specifically in the constitution, that we are to count everybody, not every citizen. i think that is really important. host: nancy is in pennsylvania on our republican line. caller: hi, my name is nancy from pa. i am an 80-year-old person. no, i do not think they should countryed in our because number one, if we look at some of the things they are doing to our people when they , and then another thing, a lot of them are on the welfare system. a lot of them are getting social security and getting all of the benefits of a lot of american people don't get. and i am talking from experience, from my town.

i know what i am talking about. host: ellen in california. go ahead. caller: good morning. the constitution does require that all persons be counted, so i don't believe that is the issue. however, i am very opposed to illegals getting the rights of citizenship and being allowed in this country. congress's failure to impose the current immigration laws or revise them. we could provide for them with other programs. we have enough illegals in this country already to take care of all the farm work and other work that needs to be done by people, by americans who don't want to work these jobs. that does not include real estate and many other jobs that undocumenteds are being allowed to do at this point. host: we are going to let you go

there with the court about to gaveling. the first of two cases we are bringing you, trump v new york. next, to the u.s. supreme court. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org]

>> justices of the supreme court of the united states. all persons having business before the honorable supreme court of the united states are admonished to give their attention for the court is now sitting. god save the united states in this honorable court. >> we will hear argument first this morning in case 2366, trump v. new york. general wall. >> mr. chief justice and me it please the court. this case should be over.