discusses how congress can work with the biden adminstration. news literacy founder alan media discusses the news and how to combat misinformation. ♪ host: good morning. it is thursday, december 17, 2020. congressional leaders say they are close to a stimulus bill after months of legislative gridlock on capitol hill. expected to be included in that bill is a new round of direct stimulus checks for millions of americans. we are beginning our program by asking you how you might use another stimulus check from the federal government. our phone lines are split regionally this morning. in the eastern or central time zones, that is (202) 748-8000.

in the mountain or pacific time zones, it is (202) 748-8001. you can also send us a text this morning. that number is (202) 748-8003. if you do, please include your name and where you are from. cat jus -- catch up with us on twitter and on facebook.com/c-span. you can start calling you now as we take you to the lead story, the front page of today's "washington post," "deal on relief bill insight." the packages expected do include hundreds of billions of dollars of aid for ailing small businesses and jobless americans, tens of billions of dollars in aid for vaccine to street and in schools, and a one time check of between $600 and $700 for millions of americans below a certain income threshold. the details and that threshold still being worked out this morning. we are asking you have another stimulus check is included in

the bill, how would you use such a check. a congressional correspondent for fox news with the latest on the negotiations, his tweets from early this morning, " "pelosi'sorning, office indicates pelosi, schumer, and may 8 and spoke by phone late last night about a bill and will exchange more paper this morning in an effort to finalize a deal." steny hoyer, the majority leader in the house, this is what he said. "if we don't get done by friday night, i don't want to shut down the government. if we need three or four more days, we will take as much time as necessary to fund the government and give relief to those who have been savaged by covid-19."

that covid-19 deal coming together, that relief deal, some 900 billion dollars, and the possibility of some $600 or $700 stimulus checks going out to millions of americans. that is what we are asking you about this morning. one of those members on capitol hill who has been pushing for direct stimulus checks on the senate floor for weeks now, senator josh hawley, republican of missouri. this is what he had to say. sen. murray: back package hawley:s to ash sen. that back package -- sep. hawley: that back which continues to take ice, and i want to emphasize how important it is to work over government, over big businesses, but to give assistance directly to the people themselves. people know how to spend their money and what is best for their own families. the quickest way to help people in need is to give them direct

assistance and let them make the choices for their own families, for their own kids, not to have to wait in line for some program , not to have to talk to some bureaucrat, but be able to their own choices direct with assistance that comes direct to them. that is going to be in this bill , and i am going to continue to fight to see that it is in the bill, and that any relief passed by the senate prioritizes working people with direct relief. some have questioned whether this is really necessary. some have said, well, it is not an emergency. this bill is only for emergencies, and direct assistance isn't an emergency, to which i say, is it not an emergency that working people are having to line up for food, literally line up for food in this country, in this day and age because they don't have enough money to purchase

nutrition for their own children? host: republican senator josh hawley on the floor of the senate yesterday. one note, one other type of aid expert to be included in the final package is some form of additional supplemental federal benefits for unemployed americans to the tune of $300 a week, although how many weeks that would last for is still up in the air. perhaps upward of 14 weeks. but as that story notes, the addition of direct stimulus checks is expected to perhaps come in part by reducing the amount of unemployment aid in the final bill. toldessional leaders have other lawmakers that they plan to reduce by about a month from the original plan, according to people whose book on anonymity. that could mean that extended unemployment benefits would expire at the end of march. we will watch what comes together in the final days here at the end of the 116th congress

, but we are asking you this morning how you would use another direct stimulus check. first out of louisiana. caller: good morning. today is my 50th anniversary from the day i arrived at vietnam for my home, and is also my 70th birthday. host: congratulations. happy birthday to you. caller: thank you. what i want to say is i was completely disabled in vietnam, and the government has been taking care of me for the three years i served in the army, for the 50 years i've been here. because of what they've done for me, me and my wife are in good shape. but my daughter and my son-in-law, they need the money because both of them are in the service industry.

man at anaintenance apartment complex, and she did gyms, and both of them got laid off from the beginning. the first checks they gave them, the money a week that they gave them, it helps them out a lot. but for the last year, they have not been receiving anything, and they are going to be glad, they are telling me now they are glad to be getting something. what they are giving them is not enough money. peoples rent are behind months. people don't have food. they gave all the money to the ceos, and they gave all the money to the businesses, and they didn't have nothing to say about that. but when it comes to the people who are the important part of this nation, it is not we the

senators, we the supreme court. it is we the people, and they need to take care of the people better. i am just blessed that the government and the v.a. takes care of me and my wife. i just want to say i am glad they are getting something, but that $300, $600 a week, they are two, three months behind. it is not going to help them. it is helping them because it is giving them something. they've been doing a lot of personal jobs and stuff to make , buttil they can get a job everybody that is out there waiting for the money, i'm glad you are getting it. i'm just -- i just wish they would give you something better. host: in terms of wishing the federal government would give you something better, this is elana omar -- this is ilhan omar, the congresswoman from minnesota, her tweet yesterday.

"every member of congress should be ashamed. a one-time $600 check and $300 of unemployment insurance is embarrassing. countries around the world are doing right by their constituents, providing $2000 to $3000. we should act urgently and accordingly in addressing the economic pain of our constituents." this is sandra out of alabama. caller: yes. things,e informed of and i am truly blessed here as well. the issue is that i see so many people who are going without in my town, which is a very rich town. there are so many people in the food lines. i've never seen anything like it before in my life. go into they people

different places here to get help to get payment on their bills, on their utilities. my utilities are about to be disconnected because i don't pay a simple bill of $68, and it is a sad shame to know that there are other people like that in this little town, this rich town, this red state. and the sad part about it is when i look at the people in congress right now, mitch mcconnell, you should be ashamed of yourself. president trump, you should be ashamed of yourself. you don't have the same type of to live off paycheck-to-paycheck like most of these people do. the people should be ashamed for doing redneck politics and redneck economics.

host: let's go to chris in connecticut. good morning. your next. caller: i have a little spiel on colin kaepernick. collin cap reinecke, get a life -- colin kaepernick, get a life. you showed white america -- host: we are talking about the stimulus check. what are your thoughts on that? caller: before i die of old age, i would like to say this. host: ok, go ahead. caller: let's see. can turn off the tv and support the troops. that was really stupid. you think because your cause is just that you can do anything and deserve to be rewarded with a big, fat football contract. host: ok.

we will go back to the topic of stimulus checks. how would you spend another one if it came to you? this is marcus out of shreveport, louisiana. go ahead. caller: hello. how are you doing, sir? i'm ok. every time you turn the channel nation of america, we hear the marches, but we don't see the people. you know what i'm saying? for instance, i'm in shreveport, louisiana. we have people that have big dreams down there. they are giving out these checks, but about it. the pandemic came at the wrong time. people weren't prepared for that. but you've got other people who knew that was coming and still didn't give no warning. but at the same time, if you're going to give people stimulus checks, give them more than money. give them hope. give them power. but the community i live in,

we have unity. but the country ain't built on unity. if this guy kills somebody, he goes to jail. but what about the people that are homeless, don't have nowhere to go come on the streets -- host: marcus, did you get one of those checks back in the spring or early summer, one of those $1200 checks? caller: i didn't receive none. i wasn't able at the time because i was a victim of a crime. i was shot up, and i wasn't able to get none. host: marcus, would you get one this time? obviously, the details still coming together, but are you in a position where you think you might get one this time? caller: i mean, i am hoping i can get one because god saved me, and i can walk, i can talk. but i don't want the money. i want the power. i want the respect.

do towhat could congress advance that, marcus? caller: repeat that again. i'm watching you and i'm talking. host: what could congress do to advance that, to uplift people? is there anything that could do by law? caller: there's a lot of things they can do. they got enough people to go around and knock on doors and asked people how their day going, do you need this here. they are giving people money that already have money. there are people that don't have money that need the money. they've got to learn how to respect everyone if they want to be respected. host: we showed you senator josh hawley, who has been calling for stimulus checks and more money than the $600 that we are talking about. he's been joined in that effort on the senate floor several times by senator bernie sanders, the independent from brabant -- from vermont.

this is bernie sanders from yesterday in the senate. [video clip] say tonders: the posters the american people, we are in the midst of this terrible crisis. what do you think should happen? overwhelmingly, some 80% of the american people, republicans, democrats, independents, they say that in the midst of this emergency, we need the united states government to respond to our pain because we don't want to get evicted. we don't want our kids to go hungry. we don't want to be saddled with incredible debt. the government has got to do something. 80% of the american people understand that. when you ask them what is the most important thing that can be done, there's a long list of things. they say the most important thing that can be done is in this moment, help my family out. get me some money so i can pay my bills, so i don't get

evicted, so i can feed my kids, so i can go to the doctor when i get sick. get me a direct payment. host: senator bernie sanders on the floor of the senate yesterday. we are talking at this point somewhere in the area of $600 or $700 stimulus checks to go to millions of americans under a certain income threshold. that looks like it will be part of this $900 billion deal coming together. that therel remember was a stimulus effort back in the c.a.r.e.s. act, that $2.2 trillion deal passed in march. it was $1200 payments that went out to about 160 million households at the cost of an estimated $300 billion. that was based on adjusted gross income in previous tax filings. there was also a $500 additional there for each qualifying child for americans who got those checks. they went to people making less

than $75,000 a year, or couples filing jointly making less than $150,000 a year, although the level was adjusted. there was a sliding scale after that, so people above those income levels did get some part of those $1200 checks. the federal reserve of new york looked into how people spent those checks that were part of forbes.r.e.s. act, and with a story on the findings from the study. they found that only 29% of americans spent stimulus checks on consumption. some 36% of those who receive those checks put it into savings. 35% of those that receive checks spent it on deck -- that received checks spent it on debt repayment. here's how it broke down for those 29% who spent it on consumption. spent it on

necessary living expenses, 8% spent it on nonessential spending, hobbies, leisure and vacation. 3% of those who spent it on that donated it to charity. those findings again from the federal reserve a new york. those numbers to those receiving unemployment insurance, how people who receive those unemployment benefits spent their money. here's how those numbers broke down. when getting on and play mend insurance, 29% of respondents in that survey spent on consumption, 23% put it into savings, but about 40% spend it on debt repayment, a much higher number -- 48% to spent it on debt repayment, and much higher number than those who spent it from stimulus checks. we are talking about $600 to $700 checks now, and asking you how you would spend that money. bill in cleveland, ohio, good morning.

you are next. caller: good morning. i am also a vietnam era veteran. this is the only time in history that i can tell the difference -- that i can't tell the difference between food lines and testing lines. i was not doing very well, but as much-needed as i have for that stimulus check, i am still going to give some to food banks i volunteered to give my life to this country. of the people, for the people, by the people, not of the business, for the business, by the business. i think we've got to stop governing for white people. i think we've got to start governing for americans, for america. people, don't you understand the whole world loves us because they all want to come here? because they want to be americans. to an n't want to come

s-hole country. they don't want to come here for that. i did want to ask something. has anybody been paying attention to the russians at biden's inauguration? there aren't any. if trump hardens himself for a felony, he has to admit a felony. wouldn't that make him ineligible to run for president again? i think we've got to stop running -- ruling by cruelty, and i think the georgian people have to do the right thing i voting democrat. thank you very much, and godless america. host: joe biden was in georgia earlier this week, stumping for those two democratic candidates in those runoff races in georgia. those races set to take place on january 5. joe biden also this week introducing new appointees to

his cabinet. one of those that was introduced yesterday, mayor pete buttigieg, selected by joe biden to lead his transportation department. he would have to be confirmed by the senate. the story noting that he represented another first for president-elect who has promised to build the most diverse leadership team in history, an openly gay cabinet nominee confirmed by the senate. he is the youngest person named to the cabinet and the first millennial names to that cabinet. pete buttigieg yesterday talked about the significance of his nomination. here is a bit of what he had to say. [video clip] i am also mindful that the eyes of history are on this appointment, knowing that this the first time an american sent ant has ever openly lgbt cabinet number to the senate for confirmation.

i camera member watching the -- at 177-year-old years old, when amon was denied a vote in the senate because he was openly gay, only being able to serve by a recess appointment. at the time i had no aspirations of being appointed by the president to anything. i was hoping to be an airline pilot, and i was a long way from coming out, even to myself, but still i watched that story, and i learned something about some of the limits that exist in this country when it comes to who is allowed to belong. but just as important, i saw how those limits could be challenged. decades later, i can't help but think there is a 17-year-old somewhere who might be watching this right now, somebody who wonders whether and where they belong in the world, or even in their own family. i am thinking about the message that today's announcement is sending to them. so thank you, mr.

president-elect. thank you for honoring your commitment to diversity with this administration you are assembling. host: mayor pete yesterday being announced as joe biden's selection for his secretary of transportation. back to your phone calls this morning, asking how you would use another stimulus check. this is paul, columbia, missouri. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i first would like to thank all the veterans in our country for their sacrifices. for stimulus checks, i take care of my 81-year-old mother, and i am 57. the first stimulus check, we used it to stock up on everything we could because we knew it was going to be a long haul. we pay down some bills and everything. that's where all of that first

check went to. the second one, if we get it, is going to go right back to the government because of taxes. taxes are coming up. it is going to go right back to the mall -- to them all. personal taxes, and that's it. it's going to go right back to them. that and more. so that's where it's going right back to, and everybody should think about that because that's where it's going to. inc. you for taking my call. -- thank you for toggling -- think you for taking my call. host: thank you for calling in. caller: i am calling from michigan. checket another stimulus in that amount, it will probably go to maybe my phone bill or my car. when i got my stimulus check earlier this year in april, that money went to my rent.

people whow too many have a mortgage or even their rent worth $600 or $700. i am just disappointed because i have been trying to cover these senate hearings, and a lot of these politicians, they all say they are for american people. i am 33 years old, and the first time in my life have i ever had to ask an organization for housing assistance because i am struggling that bad. that is the common topic in grocery lines, at work. everybody is hurting. $600 to $700? i guess beggars can't be choosy. i'm grateful to be getting something. but i need help with my rent. you can work with the banks maybe for your car note. you can kind of negotiate your credit card payment. but your rent? you fix moratoriums have been lifted. we need to pay our rent. host: where did you go for help,

if you don't mind me asking? was grand ledge economic area partners. host: and were you able to get that help? caller: yes, i was, and i was really thankful they gave me that help. so i know there are organizations out there helping, and thankful for that. it was the first time i have ever had to do that. but we are hurting. we need to pay our rents. we need to pay our mortgages. my car note is $300 something. that doesn't even include insurance that you have to have to drive to work. this is ridiculous that we wait all this time for them to give us that. i agree with the representative ilhan, what she said. it is not doing right by us. work, are going to working reduced hours.

the least they could have done is given us some money to pay our rent, especially with christmas coming up. host: thank you. this package is expected to include some $25 billion for new emergency rental assistance program. ,hat is excited to be included as well as an extension of eviction moratoriums. again, the final details of this package still coming together. this is being reported in papers around the country. also want to show you some of the front pages of papers around the country, with headlines having to do with this stimulus deal in these checks we are talking about. we will show you those as we hear from robert in california. good morning. your next. caller: stimulus checks. in a multimodal transportation

corridor retrofit? biden's sons played with electric slot cars. that is zero emission technology. power the we transportation systems with zero electric sustainable -- host: what the folks have been talking about on capitol hill is that people need help now, and they are arguing that direct checks into people's mailboxes is the quickest way to move that money out. caller: rather than just give the money, we have all our highways that would give him -- that could be turned into zero emission transportation corridors. that illuminates the fossil fuel that causes -- that eliminates the fossil fuel that causes 80% of all known cancers. that is sent a super one -- that is a simple one. we don't have to pay any intellectual property. an electric slot car from here

to new york, zero emission? we have the technology, and we have people that can retrofit from one coast to the other. 1812e second one, scotus says you have one drop of this, that's what you are. one drop african, your african. america areof native american and european. host: we will continue to talk about the topic that is on capitol hill today. we will for news throughout perhaps this mornings -- news perhaps throughout this morning's program on a deal. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] i think caller: they should give everyone the stimulus check because a lot of people are

behind. unfair that the people are not getting help for rent allfood and i'm not sure their lights are on. how many people have profited from stimulus? a lot of the rich people did but i'm curious to know if they did. host: when it came to the cares act, getting a check, the $1200 check from that march bill was based on adjusted gross income so it's based on your tax filings from the year before, if you made over $75,000 the year before, you did not get instantly as check. not get a stimulus check. the threshold was $150,000 for households for those filing jointly.

that was the cut off and we don't know the exact cut off this time. there will be certain thresholds expected in this round of stimulus but we don't know the final details of that yet. that's brenda out of south carolina. if you comments from twitter to --

a few comments from social media and we are getting your thoughts this morning as the sun rises here on capitol hill. that is union station. we are taking your phone calls this morning. that's just after 7:30 a.m. on the east coast. wilmington, west virginia, good morning. caller: good morning, how are you doing? if i got the $600 stimulus check, i would pay my bills that i'm behind on like my electric and my homeowners insurance. i am on a fixed income, i only get $800 a month and i have a house payment and it would really help. it would help to get some extra money to pay some bills. host: what did you do with the $1200 back in the spring? caller: i pay bills within it gave me a couple of months break.

i was able to go out and buy something good to eat and stuff because it let me catch up on all the bills that i was behind on. got, il of them that i am behind on my electric bill with mya month because, little check, it doesn't cover everything. i have to let one bill go per month and then catch it up the following month and then let another one go. host: what's been happening with your bills during the covid pandemic? ine you seen anything change your bills over the past nine months? cold andt's getting all the power bills and gas bills and stuff are higher. with the little money that i get, i cannot pay all my bills

every month. got that $1200, i paid my bills for like two months and i wasn't stressing over them. if i get this one, i will do the same thing. a lot of these utility companies have programs for folks who cannot pay during the pandemic and are willing to work with customers. have you used one of those programs? caller: no, sir, i like paying my bills. they said they won't turn off your electric and stuff like but i cannot take that chance. i am disabled. get cut off, i am screwed. host: florida's is next, good morning. caller: the way i would spend my

stimulus check has a lot to do with the amount of the check and the purpose i am allowed to spend it for to qualify. stay a like your help to very important fact -- to state important fact. i will try harder today. each trillion dollars that is equally amongded the approximately 100 million accounts in the united states, is about $10,000 per account. i will say that again. every trillion dollars spent without any paperwork or , ifnistrative overhead divided equally in the spirit of power to the people is about $10,000 per family unit account.

do the arithmetic and you will see the numbers. when i spent money that i receive, especially if it's $10,000 available to me, it's not the first person who spends the money that's important. if i spend money, someone receives the money and they get to spend it again. people are not thinking clearly or at least the people who want to get paid to administrate these programs rather than giving power to the people, perhaps they are thinking too clearly because they failed to explain to us to give us a choice but the best way to stir the economic pot is to allow everyone of us to be an economic stirrer, to receive money and spend money. therefore, tomorrow morning, each of us could wake up with

about $10,000 in their account. we have already spent over $3 trillion. most of it is available only if you show proper paperwork and jump through hoops and a lot of people i have heard use the word respect and it's disrespecting the poor people. imagine if each of us already had $30,000 in our account. please, people, fire the administrators, fire all of these paperwork people and just write the checks. too bad we cannot go backwards. wouldn't it be better to distribute the money equally and allow each person to spend money , knowing that when they spend it, someone else receives it and that serves the purpose in the best way to stir the economic pot. one website that c-span viewers are familiar with his

u.s. debt clock, talk about how many trillions of dollars have been spent so far and it might be a good time to note with the u.s. national debt is at this point. point,7 trillion at this an interesting column with the debt clock is the portion of debt per u.s. citizen, about $83,000 at this point, per u.s. $19,000, comes to 200 almost $220,000. you can check out that website. it's u.s. debt clock.org. in madison heights michigan, good morning. caller: thank you very much for taking my call. hearing arethat i'm definitely heartbreaking. i think every middle-class american can use the money

whether they need it or not. we can use it and stimulate the economy. i have to say welcome to trump's america. it is a shame what we have gone through the last year. i hope that all the viewers out there give the -- kudos q does because it was their votes that put the stimulus through. no republicans voted for it at all. , hell give trump credit didn't have to sign it but he did sign it. it's too bad that it didn't come fast enough because he wanted his name on the check. he didn't realize that it goes into people's accounts mostly. i am very glad that the one term warm is gone. gone. term warm is

- worm is gone. host: go ahead, sir. [indiscernible] host: you think californians are more frivolous? caller: yeah. just talking to -- some of us are going to be hit hard and -- a toyan by that is or something like that. as opposed to where you think the money should be going. economy but the

know --d stuff are, you and i don't want to get a hut on the bills, i just want to pay as i go. host: that's sacramento, california. the lead story in today's wall street journal --

the story from today's wall street journal on consumer spending. yesterday on capitol hill, the federal reserve chairman jerome powell made an appearance and ofked about the importance congress passing a robust stimulus deal. this is part of what he had to say. [video clip] >> the case for fiscal policy right now is very strong and i think that is widely understood. the details of it are entirely up to congress but with the expiration of unemployment benefits, the expiration of eviction moratoriums with the virus spreading the way it is, there is a need for household and businesses to have fiscal support. i do think that is widely understood. i think -- i certainly would

welcome the work that congress is doing right now. it's not up to us to judge that work, it's really there's and i don't have a view on the size of it. it's obviously a substantial bill. host: federal reserve chair jerome powell yesterday in his comments was that we are taking your commas this morning on "washington journal." as we look at the possibility of another deal which seems likely in another round of direct stimulus will be included, how would you spend that? earl in atlanta is next. caller: thanks a lot. creating to spend mine a black separatism movement. i think we have to find another way, another alternative. america is going to go through a lot of pain this year. there is going to be more police violence, these crazy white groups are going to go crazy again. we got to separate.

host: what does that mean? caller: we have to look to and the riches of africa and secure our fair share of it. america is never going to love us. we got to accept that. all of the problems that white people are having to deal with or indirectly related to race. they are suffering because they want us to suffer. earl, would you consider leaving the country? caller: i want to at some point but i wanted to be my choice and i want to be under the right circumstances. there is no hope for black people here in america. none. host: when was the last time you were hopeful about that issue? caller: when i was about six years old. and i am 64 now. host: what do you remember when

you were six? caller: i grew up in birmingham, alabama. take it from there. host: what made you hopeful then that you remember? during up middle-class with two parents who work like hell to make sure i had everything i needed. host: that's earl in atlanta this morning. this is marianna in texas, good morning. today i will use my stimulus check to continue to help my grandson and my granddaughters go back to school. i too am a senior, i am 70 years old and on a fixed income. we had to come and live together because there is no way we could make it, we are asking your to

come and stay because you cannot make it in a house by yourself. you cannot pay these bills and .y electric eaves going up i went to get three ply toilet paper and then i changed to one ply toilet paper and i'm still paying too much. there is price gouging and you have to get somebody to live with you to try to make it. my grandchildren will suffer terribly if they don't have an education. the youngest one now is 21. he has a scholarship and that was taken away because of covid. we don't want him in the streets because there is no future there. go but and when i go, i this baby has got to have some kind of future i listen to the gentleman talk about the opportunity of how he's feeling.

for 400 years, we have been suffering with the fact that the more we do, the harder we work, the more these people will love us and it's a lie. i am just frustrated. to go to africa, we don't know anything about africa. there is no heaven on this earth. i do believe in separation. i really do. go to church, they burn it down. we had our own wall street and they burned that down. we are seeing a lot of people integrate which is ok because i love people and i want everybody to get along. let's not be delusional and think that these 70 million people that voted for trump is going to go away. they will try to do it again.

we've got to help biden because without helping him, we cannot help ourselves. we take our stimulus check, whatever's left in it, to try to , feed themer people and try to support the democratic party. we have had callers who identify as black who call in and say they are trump supporters. what would you say to them? caller: i would say wake up. they are not going to love you. hoping inaying and the churches are the worst of saybecause as long as they jesus, we will soak them for money so you have to stop supporting these so-called christian churches. pat robertson is the godfather

of all of them. we don't know where their money is going. these people who go to africa and sell these kids, they come up like christians. all that stuff is delusional. -- you got top deal with reality as well as being spiritual. the two work together. ist: thank you texas, this vonnie out of georgia, your next. caller: good morning. do with the stimulus check that i have, i am a baby boomer and 59 years old. just did my marketplace insurance. that will cover my insurance. i had to move out away from my afraidds because i was

that i would catch the covid. i have underlying issues. in about three months, i was homeless. i do witht should this next stimulus check i get. i looked at my insurance policy and i think that will pay my premium. understand why a lot of people are not practical about this situation as far as what you will do with this money and you should be thankful for this money. a lot of people have died due to the covid. considerationk of from our government. i'm just so sad because as a farmer,my father was a

i learned that what you reap you will so. i don't understand why people don't get that. this will backfire on them what they're doing to the american people. enough is not being done with the money they are giving these nonprofit organizations. evicted inhave to be order to get help for your rent. your life -- your lights have to be off to get help for your lights. boomer andam a baby i just lost my husband october 2. i am trying to figure out, you give all these -- all this money to these organizations and nobody is watching these organizations. to be realize you have almost evicted to get any help? sorryvonnie in georgia, for your loss. about 10 minutes left in this segment of "washington journal

"washington journal the." we want viewers to call in and tell us how you would spend another stimulus check. it could be in the in the area of 600 or $700 a let us know what you would do with that money. i want to keep you updated on other actions on capitol hill yesterday including the former director of the cybersecurity and infrastructure security capitol hill testifying before the senate homeland security and governmental affairs committee. he was fired last month. he is defending the election security at that hearing yesterday before the government affairs committee and homeland security.

this is the fox news story and yesterday's hearing. [video clip] >> it's just galling and i have to point out that the purveyors of russian disinformation, hillary clinton's campaign, the dnc, the steele dossier, the ranking member appears senator grassley and i have disseminating russian information. that's where the disinformation is coming, that's where the false information, the lies and false allegations. i cannot sit by here and listen is not and say that this disinformation. this is getting information. we had to take a look at this to restore confidence in our election integrity. we will not be able to just move

on without bringing up these irregularities, examining them and providing an explanation. we need to see where there are problems that we can correct that moving forward. >> mr. chairman, have to respond. you say i am putting out disinformation but i had nothing to do with this report. >> you lied repeatedly in the press. that i was spreading russian disinformation and i told you to stop lying and you continued to do it. >> mr. chairman, this is not about airing your grievances. >> senator paul. >> this is simply not what we are dealing with. make allegations and drop it there. this is terrible what you are doing to this committee and all the great work you talked about. >> this is what you have done to this committee, spreading disinformation, nothing could have been further from the truth and you are spouting it again.

senator paul. >> mr. chairman, this is outrageous. host: that was yesterday on capitol hill and if you want to watch that senate homeland security and governmental affairs committee in its entirety, you can do so on our website at www.c-span.org. back to your phone calls this morning. about five and is left in the segment, let us know how you would spend another stimulus check. bill, annapolis, north carolina. caller: good morning. i'm a lifelong republican. i will not receive a stimulus check. if you owe any money, they will not send you a check. the point that gets me the most about this is my neighbors. as a somewhat successful black man, i have noticed we are dealing with a lot of republican jealousy. one of my friends who i've known since high school, we were looking at a job site and he when did you get ahead

of me? , what makesng someone say that? i didn't realize we were in a race. beenmade me think he's using a measuring stick that i wasn't part of. i noticed that all of my say theyn colleagues are into equal and equality but they can say that but they aren't. the thing about the stimulus check, why don't they give out a stimulus check because people nut -- needed step most of them don't get it because they've already got it. host: this is jerry in arkansas, good morning. receivedes, i haven't my $1200 check. they told me back in june that they had the wrong address. out.t that straightened they said you will get it within

3-4 weeks. it never happened so this went on for a couple of months and they started talking about they had a computer glitch. this has gone on for two or three months. and aeen checking on it few days ago, they told me they didn't have my address. i feel like i'm getting the runaround. so you are not confident that it will be fixed at time around? no, i talked to my bookkeeper and he said it should have been deposited into my account because i am on social security. it just doesn't make sense to me with the technology we have that

this could happen. host: thank you for the call from arkansas. this is vincent in richmond hill, georgia, good morning. caller: good morning, i am in a situation where i really don't need the check. my wife works for one thing i would like to do is i would like to receive the check in order to give it to a charity of my choice. rather than give it back to the government. i don't know exactly what they would do with it. host: where would you give the check? caller: i would give it to a any program that would give direct help to people that need it. host: thanks for the call from georgia. one more call from ocean shores, washington, good morning. caller: good morning, i don't need the stimulus check because i work for a living. another important thing is i've

saved. because you are self-employed, a couple of colors back touched on the fact that we don't get a stimulus check anyway because i have tax debt rolling for almost eight years. the scenario that people don't think about is when you are self-employed, you have to say because you don't get unemployment or anything from anybody. when it comes time to pay taxes back to 2008, i had a chance to send in my 25 thousand dollars which is about what i pay average per year into the government for the prior year or hold it and continue to live. the last statement i want to say is the president needs to use the presidential order for martial law to hold a new election and hold a constitutional convention at the same time to straighten the country out. host: our last caller in this first segment of the washington

journal. coming up in an hour this morning on c-span3 is that food and drug administration, to consider emergency use authorization for the moderna coronavirus vaccine. you can watch that live at 9:00 a.m. on c-span3, listen to it on the radio app, or watch on c-span.org. sick around on "washington journal -- stick around on "washington journal." we will be joined by former republican congressman tom davis and what is next for biden. the news and literacy founder and ceo alan miller will discuss his recommendations on how to combat misinformation. we will be right back. ♪ american history tv on

c-span3, exploring the people and events that tell the american story. every weekend, saturday at 6:00 p.m.. the civil war, on the relationship between union generals grant and sherman, with retired general david petraeus and his story. , flagler:00 p.m. college professor michael butler on to music in the post-civil rights era, highlighting artists james brown, marvin gaye, and george clinton. eastern, at 6:00 p.m. on artifacts, we are at the smithsonian museum for the alexander von humboldt exhibit. the presidency, a virtual tour of the george w. bush presidential library in dallas, show kidding the legacy of the nation's 43rd president.

this weekend on c-span3. >> the food and drug administration meets in open session to approve modernity's vaccine for covid-19 -- moderna's vaccine for covid-19. stream live and on-demand at c-span.org or listen on the free radio app. "washington journal" continues. host: always glad to welcome back tom davis, former seven term republican congressman. after leaving congress, theauthored the book " political divide, congress in crisis." thebill that seems to be on cusp of coming together, the con taps that concepts and how it came with a group of -- concepts

and how it came with a group of bipartisan politicians. guest: this is a group that came -- higher congressman bickering and making the compromises that are needed to get things done. it started with the critical mass and has moved from there. as you look at the next congress, which will be very closely divided, this group takes a leadership role in pushing the leadership of both parties to try to get together and get things done. on and iten this go keeps getting worse. host: the last couple of days still demonstrate the power of leadership on capitol hill. yes, this emerged from bipartisan legislators, but we are in the final days and the

negotiations are still going on among the big four, late-night meetings, and we are waiting to hear from the speaker and majority leader. it is those folks that are doing the final negotiations. guest: sure, they are. the leaders are elected by their caucuses and they have to be responsive to their caucuses. if they put bills on the floor a majority of their caucus does not like, they will not be leaders for long. we need to understand that. what we've got here are starting in the middle, but as this is growing, the common denominator, there is some commonality on what each site is willing to take, and that may be the bill that comes. it may be a smaller piece than a lot of people envisioned but is taking care of the people in need. host: this bill emerging after months of gridlock. what bills and the 117th congress are ripe for bipartisan

negotiation for something to emerge the way this did? guest: what we have seen is basically the last decade, the government's model has been to govern through executive orders, and the regulatory regimes and the bills that go through every year, the appropriation bills, 12 appropriation bills which were offered on an omnibus, and the authorization act where you can sprinkle some things in. after that, basically consensus bills for the most part. the big things, as we take a look at the debt, infrastructure, immigration. the parties have failed to address and so far, uncomfortable votes for many of these groups. i think with a new president, we always have an opportunity to see if we can get off to a good

start. it is important for your viewers to understand 80% of the time in effect, this is the new normal of government. a book about this, there are a group of americans who don't cross either party. now we may have a divided government, even with this presidential election that has closely divided the country. it forces compromise. sometimes, divided government works and sometimes it fails, and it has basically failed the last few times with the last couple of presidents. it worked really well with bill clinton. we had welfare reform, four years of balanced budgets, but it has deteriorated since then. things that have gotten worse are kind of macro factors, but more party distance than ever before, so the members pay attention to their primary

voters who are a thin ideological slice of the electoral pie. three quarters of the members, the only race that counts is the primary. november is no more than a constitutional formality, so they keep their time and attention to primary voters, the people that like them. primary voters tend to be more ideological and don't support compromise. they think they are right, the other side is wrong and demand ideological fealty. for the mostel part are feeding viewers and build up a viewership intensity that is ideological. information but for affirmation to get their worldviews validated. people walking around in information bubbles, they are right and the others are stupid. you saw this between senator johnson and senator peters.

they each have got different worldviews and you do not know what is going on. that is common across america at th point, and you have to understand campaign finance turned out to be a failure because the money has moved away from the parties, which have been a centering force in the american politics, out to the wings. ideological money from special interest money, or as we raise , the now off the internet sharp edge pitch tends to exact money on the left and right and is kind of promotional and to take it from the parties. the fact that these districts are no longer centered, the information people get is no longer vented but tends to be shaped -- vetted but tends to be shaped by the listeners' or viewers' worldviews.

host: talking about the partisan divide, what to expect from the incoming biden administration. republicans, (202) 748-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. independents, (202) 748-8002. congressman tom davis eastern. i appreciate you listening to our previous segment. yesterday in the first segment of "washington journal," our question for republicans was what do they think the future of the republican party held. i wonder how you would answer. guest: i think we see some discernible trends. one is over the last couple of decades, the republican base has migrated from the country club to the country, coming much more rural party. it started with social and environmental issues in places

like west virginia. it is social issues. these are cultural and real view issues. it has basically made the republicans dominate rural america. democrats dominate urban america. the closer to a city you are, the more democratic you are likely to vote. this is not set in stone. we have to remember it is not static. it is constantly changing. the coalition that elected joe biden by a narrow margin is a coalition united around one thing, beating president trump. they will have their own fights within their party over which way the party goes and the republicans will be fighting. will donald or his family try to continue to lead the family --

the party, or will they allow that or are they looking to turn the page? over the next four years this will be fought out in parties -- party conventions. a lot of it will be dependent on what president trump does, how he handles himself. host: what did election day tell you about the biggest change in the republican coalition? guest: it was basically the coalition you had before, but they pulled a lot of votes out of rural areas. whoever ran -- the people that ran the president's campaign did a wonderful job but they did not account in their modeling. the reason president trump lost was himself. people might have liked the job he was doing and that is why they voted republican down ballot, but did not like him, did not like his rhetoric, did not like the way he treated people, etc.

opted to keep the republicans in charge of the house at the congressional level to put a check on democratic excesses, but because of what they viewed as trump's unpredictability, day today his lack of discipline and the like, that is hardly an endorsement for a mandate for joe biden. he is going to have to deal with it, but he is president for four years and has the veto and appointed powers. he understands the institution. it will be a major challenge for him and kamala harris who ended up being vice president. how does she act? how does she position herself to , if ite party post biden is successful? we don't know how these play out at this point. host: plenty of calls for you already. tom in new york is an

independent, you are on with tom davis. caller: good morning, c-span. thank you very much. i think this gentleman is wrong. i think president trump won by lancelot. i think when they stopped the counts in the early -- the middle of the night and there were ballots coming in that nobody could see, i think that is what is really going on. i think president trump won in a landslide and these people cheated. they spent four years trying to bury our guy. we think they would stop at the very end after trying desperately for four years and getting nowhere with their lies, their cheating. host: got your point. tom davis on folks who think there was massive fraud in this election? guest: i think there is fraud in every election. it occurs in mail-in ballots, the nature of the beast. we could describe how it goes on, but i have not seen any evidence in this election it

incurred on such -- occurred on such a massive scale that the election would be overturned. many judges appointed by president trump, if they saw anything wrong and could overturn it, they would be inclined to do so. the idea that trump won in a landslide is ridiculous. he won very narrowly the first time out and this was always going to be a close election if he won. about elections for a long time on the republican side and i don't know that anybody looks at this as a trump landslide by any stretch of the imagination. nobody has won a landslide since 1984. what we called the judicial administrative remedies are exhausted. the electoral vote has come and it will come to the floor. if somebody wants to challenge it in the house, democrats will

still --llenge -- will let's either pass laws or have people in place to make sure this doesn't happen. no, this was not a trump landslide. host: east orange, new jersey, allen, democrat. caller: good morning, mr. davis. i was calling in regards to how in god's name they allowed a person to come up -- how and god's name they would allow a person like donald trump to be asvocal and as disrespectful a human being, and no one says anything about it. now as everybody is calling, they are saying it is a foul because of the fact that he

lost, but people got sick and tired of him running the country. he is not a politician. donald trump is a businessman and he's not a good -- he did not do such a good job as being a businessman. i don't want to say anything else. host: would you prefer politicians to businessman to run this country? caller: i would prefer politicians simply because the country, you have people's lives that are in your hand. business people are all about business. they are only about the big businessman and people that has money. what about the little small people that they looking for, like the middle-class? you don't hardly have any more middle-class people in america. host: tom davis?

comments, if we compare the first two callers, they had completely different worldviews coming out of completely different information silos. that's the difficulty in governing in a very divided country. people coming with different reference points and different information, it makes it hard to govern. host: does it make it hard to work on capitol hill? you referenced that contentious moment in the senate of homeland security -- homeland security and government affairs meeting yesterday. do governors enjoy each other anymore? are there friends between folks on different sides of the aisle? how much do they actually hang out with each other outside of when the cameras are on at these committees? caller: i think they get along -- guest: i think they get along far better than people in television land see, or what you see in the media, but part of

this is capable -- catering to the party basis. about 75% of the members are primary voters so that is where they view their time and attention, their speeches, voting records. on a personal basis, i don't think it is that divided. morewe saw yesterday was contentious than we ordinarily see outfront. the no labels group and house and senate, it is a bipartisan group of equal numbers of democrats and republicans, a bicameral group and they get along very well. they are very close friends and not just political friends. i think that is the growing spirit on capitol hill, people coming to try to get things done , and they find a structure that makes it hard to get anything done and hard to compromise. host: how big is that no labels group now? guest: it is dozens of people,

50, 60 members sometimes. is only 30, and it is bicameral, senate and house members. they have become a force as we have seen this covid bill package. they came up with their own bill. the problem solvers don't operate independently, but they are influencers on the leaders of both parties, and they have played a huge role in getting this as far as it has gone. host: bernard, new york city, republican. caller: good morning. i am very fed up with so-called republicans like the rhino you have on now. pusillanimousst nonsense i've ever heard. this guy wants to get along. he doesn't care if they lie. showed on the screen

again a decent conservative republican calling out two democrats who lied. they did lie. there is no doubt about that they lied. who calls them out, and this coward here that we have for a republican, and that's the problem with the republican party, he turns out and says, can't we all just get along? host: tom davis, chance to respond? guest: first of all, i've been called a rhino before by people, but i shared the house republican committee two cycles and have been a republican all my life, and anything but a rhino. --ave asked the president they are welcome and their leadership holds today, but i don't find being nasty to people has ever gotten us anywhere in terms of accomplishing goals of the american people. sure, i got along with democrats

even when i was campaign chairman trying to beat their brains out in election. i think treating people decently is a great way to start if you want to get things done. legislators who think it is my way or the highway get nothing done for anybody. why would you want a congress just you come to block things? there are a lot of members who are fed up with the polarization that we see. it is hard to get a bill through. 60 votes in the senate and you are have to -- will have to get this on a bipartisan basis or nothing gets done. the house, both parties have their distant groups. you are going to need members of both parties. that's a good thing. it gets people talking and is the spirit of america. we are americans first, republicans and democrats second. this polarization has gone too long and is destructive and is hurting our status in the world. if that makes me a rhino, that

makes me a rhino, but i have been a republican for my whole life from being a pageboy in the 1960's to being the last republican to hold the government in fairfax, and when i lost a seat and went back to bidding the democrats. you can call me a rhino, but i put my record up against anybody's. you put -- treat people decently, you are more likely to get things done. host: denver, colorado, keith, democrat. caller: good morning. civil andrt by being bringing stability to the conversation as a democrat. very -- on a few things you said and would like to make a couple of points. yes,/urban divide, yes, yes. one thing the republican base does not consider is urban areas

are great american cities of rural people from earl america. not everyone stays on the farm, right? that is urban people's insight into the world experience. 85% of americans live in the city. areas is the urban self-destructive. debates. urban/ruralat divide, blacks were locked out, as you recall. the government had to settle with black farmers for discrimination. they wouldn't give them loans, wouldn't give them assistance of any kind. you know this to be a fact in your lifetime. that's one thing. -- can, my big question

the gop survive? -- survive as a white identity and eightural party, 20th century -- a 20th-century party in a diverse and dynamic american tableau? i will listen off-line. guest: i appreciate the question. i don't think the republican party is a white rural party. they have a base in rural america and they are highly competitive in the suburbs. when you talk about the suburbs, you are from colorado, they are rapidly urbanizing. what we called suburbs are actually cities in their makeup, in their density and the like. what we find -- and we could have a lengthy discussion about this -- as areas where you have bigger density tend to vote more democratic, but the suburbs are

republicans picked up a number of seats and they did it with candidates of color in dade county, florida, orange county, california, and women in other counties. they didn't really identify with the suburbs. his temperament and the like, i think that turned off suburban voters who would otherwise align with the republican party on economic issues. he did well the further you got away from the cities. i think the republican is alive. they control the senate. about 100,000 votes, they would have won the presidency again. the democrats also have a problem with their coalition which was united around one thing, defeating president trump. now they have to govern.

my experience has been parties are not great at governing, they are just great at being critical, and trying to govern -- we havey not have a very small margin in the house and it becomes very difficult to reach across the aisle. that will, i think, create some turmoil in the democratic party as some members who are progressives don't think what they came to do is being accomplished fast enough. parties are having these conversations. coalitions are not static, they are constantly rotating. republicans increased their vote among hispanics, among asians, and as they are running more diverse candidates to break into some of these areas, they have a couple new african-american house republicans coming in. i don't think the republican party is the image of being a white party. that is changing and has to

change with demographics. we go back to running on issues instead of the identity of politics. host: you ran the campaign arm of the national republican committee when you were on the hill. what role should that group play in recruiting some diversity that you are talking about, and playing in primaries to try to get their preferred candidate along to the general election, how do you see that role in 2022? thet: look, the main thing campaign chairman does is raise money to recruit candidates and help them run the campaign with the money you have raised, and give them the appropriate guidance. one thing you can't control is what the white house does or what congressional leadership does. the campaign arm is very important. if you look at tom emerick, who will do it again and is even more experienced the second time. i was a much more -- a much better campaign chairman the

second time. you make mistakes and the second time around, it goes smoother. it is a redistricting year and republicans will likely pick up seats in redistricting, if it is handled correctly. they have every reason to be optimistic at this point going into the 20 -- 2022 midterms given the small margin in the house. candidates,cus on how the districts are going in states where you control the map, and just raising money. raising money as democrats have been spending more money than republicans. the wealthiest areas tend to be voting heavily democratic and the poorest areas are voting heavily republican. the old adage that the republicans are the party of the rich, it was gone even into thousand but over the last 20 years, that has devolved.

host: i wonder if you think tom emmer set himself up for disappointment just because expectations were so high for democrats in 2020 and solo for republicans and look how it turned -- so low for republicans and look how it turned off -- out. guest: he just lost being governor of minnesota which is a competitive state. i think he understands not just how to drive the car, but how to put it together. the republican is in good hands with him as campaign chairman. the question is, how does joe biden perform? 36 of the last 39 midterm elections, the president's party has lost. there were three exceptions to that, one of them 2002 when i was a republican campaign chairman. the reasons for that are threefold. number one, when a president wins, they usually bring people in on their coattails.

in the midterm, coattails or not there and the members cannot survive on their own. we call them obama centric voters who did not show up in the midterms. biden does not have quite the same. his coalition was not as much pro biden as anti-trump. he has ample opportunity to prove has ample opportunity to prove himself. on donaldwas more trump than joe biden. the second issue is that the party out of power is more intense in their feelings. we see this in turn outs that the out party has a better turnout model. history is am, if guide, republicans are likely to turn out stronger than democrats, one of their main turnout generators was their dislike of donald trump and he is gone now. with biden in the white house there is a tendency to relax and you do not see the same intensity on the ground if history is our guide.

the third issue which is often look -- often overlooked, there is not a huge group in the country, there is a group under 10% of voters that do not like either party. they do not trust either party and they generally do not participate in the nomination process. so, they are stuck with the nominees that they are given. they use these midterm elections put a check on the president rather the giving -- then giving the president a blank check. they might return and vote for a different party, but in the midterms they like to keep government balanced, because they do not like the excesses of either party. we saw this with president obama where in 2010 and 2014 where one of the worst midterms that the democrats has had but he was able to win reelection. whichphenomena, traditionally hold for midterm elections, hold for republicans going into 2022.

there are things that can overcome that. you do not know any national emergency or any rally around the president. population --s popularity numbers have been the biggest variable. if president biden has a chance to unite the country, and keep his favorable tide to save the democrats. historically, that will be tough. i do give republicans the emmer edge because tom has been through this before and running campaigns that were this close. balance government a different way of saying preferring divided government? guest: yes. host: ron out of oregon. a republican. good morning. caller: thank you for having me. i have to get this off my chest. the election was stolen. we have seen the suitcases. they are not listening to anybody that witnessed this.

it is ridiculous. joe is in the pocket of china. i mean, come on. host: so, how do you feel about casesre than 40 court that have been turned away. caller: they were not listens to, the whistleblowers. that is what i think. i think it was wrong that they were not listens to. you know what is going to happen? people will burn down restaurants like the democrats dead, i do not know. guest: let me just make a point on this, and i share your disappointment in the outcome of the presidential race. but, the margins in pennsylvania and michigan were large. overcoming that with cheating is something that even if cheating occurred, what you have to show in court was that there was enough cheating to overturn the results and the margins are too large, i think.

let us go back to 2020 -- to 2000. a very close election where you had florida decided one state that would carry the majority of the electoral college on less than 500 votes. once the supreme court spoke there was no rioting or accusation that it was stolen. al gore conceded and the country came together and we put the country first. evidencehard nixon, shows of some election fraud in some states, particularly illinois, missouri, and taxes that could have overturned things. nixon decided to walk away and move on. he came back in the game eight years later. i am always reminded of my friend, the senator from south dakota who i think i had a senate race stolen from him on an indian reservation. this was with a huge off your

yearut, but instead -- off turnout, but instead of pressing, he walked away and put the country first. he came back and was a u.s. senator two years later. and, i think he is an outstanding senator. history treats good losers well. they treat bad losers badly. sometimes, in this business, for the good of the country you look ahead and say this thing is over, congratulations let us work together. and you stop trying to not continue the fight. partisan icam paint -- i chaired the campaign committee. we ripped the skins off of democrats in election time. once the voters make their choice we have an obligation to honor those choices, to work together, and try to get this done for all of the american people, and that is not a philosophy that all of my colleagues shared then or now. and a lot of people do not, but

i think that is the way that wears -- that works best for the country. and then people say that is a rhino. we have hard beliefs, that is why we belong to certain parties, but i think at some time we have to look at the country first. we are in a global situation where americans need to stay united. we have competitors that are looking to eat our lunch. host: line for independents, james out of maryland. good morning. caller: good morning. my name is james, i am an independent now. i had been a republican all of my life. my father was a republican. there is a story that goes through my family that if hitler was a republican, he would have voted for him. i had in a republican for 60 years, i am 79 in about 10 months. i have been a republican all of my life, i have been sort of

centrist, but a republican. unlessly vote republican there is somebody pretty good or the republican is bad. so, i usually vote the party. but, i am not a rhino. i have never been called a rhino , because all the people i work with are kind of centrists whether they are democrats and report -- or republicans. host: what made you become an independent? caller: donald trump. he was just too much. there were a number of people in the party that i would've voted for. by the way, my governor, this is a solidly democratic state. maybe 70% or better. but, our governor now is a man named hogan, who is a good governor.

he pulled maryland out of the real throws of the pandemic. we have had some stuff going on, that we are better than most states out there. he went out and fought and got his own wife to help. she is korean, and she called the koreans in government and said we need help. equipmentped get this and materials that we needed to free the people from the real throws of this pandemic. and the problem is that mr. trump, and i have heard him say dozens of times myself, that it is going away, and that it is just like a flu. and he stopped saying that because he got so ghastly. host: i will let tom davis jump in because we are running out of time. guest: i know larry hogan well and i did a fundraiser in

northern virginia and i think he has been an outstanding governor. was a disrupter, but we are seeing that around the globe. when you get the rapidity of change, the wealth disparity, climate change, globalization, migration patterns, it is very unsettling to the political process. i tell my friends who do not like donald trump, i say that trump is a symptom of a larger problem. we can see that with the calls coming in. we have very strong opinions on either side, i am right and the other side is wrong, and that makes it difficult to govern. larrying i like about hogan, maryland is one of the most heavily democratic states and he was not only elected governor once, but was reelected and he has high approval ratings. the same goes for the governors in vermont and massachusetts

because they approach the government not as republicans, but trying to govern in earnest. they put a check on the excesses of the democratic party, and voters appreciate politicians like that. the difficulty is that you do not win nominations without philosophy. but voters at large are yearning for somebody who wants to govern without games being played, just trying to be earnest about it and being transparent about what they do instead of some political interests. and larry hogan epitomizes that. host: do you think larry hogan could beat donald trump in a republican primary in four years? guest: i think today he could not. i think donald trump probably owns the republican party today. he has really changed the party. he has brought a lot of voters in and driven the previous

speaker out, but he has brought a lot of new blood into the party and has revitalized it. look at states like arkansas and heavilyginia that were democratic and other legislators are overwhelmed in -- by republicans. donald trump has a responsibility for speaking to americans that had been voting democratic by tradition. so, he has opened it up. like in any coalition, there are trade-offs. the republican party will be arguing within our party over the next four years what do we want to become. right now i think donald trump is still the head of the party and why they acknowledge that way. in most republican convention goers and primary goes like donald trump. host: time for one or two more calls with tom davis. this is evelyn from chicago, a democrat. good morning.

caller: good morning. i am in early childhood teacher. i think what i am hearing is people who were never taught to share, and care, the things that you learn in head start. and other programs for young children. teachhere is a way to young children to care and share it and to collaborate. it is very easy if you know how, if you are trained to help children learn to get along. and, i will submit to you that the children who are in early -- who were in early childhood programs from age three to five, if you do statistics and look at statistics, they do better in life. they know how to get along, they know how to share. that are there any lessons

you think we can translate up to congress? to learn to share and get along? caller: you need to make sure that they get there early childhood programs funded -- these early childhood programs funded. all children need to start at least by age four. myould really say, in experience, late age three. they should be in school two years, in a good program before they hit kindergarten. because i taught kindergarten and other subjects too, but the bottom line is that, i know that when i have kindergartners i can just bought who had early childhood. host: thank you for what you do. do you want to jump in? guest: i want to thank her for what she does. early childhood education is important. the kids coming in the school system, and from different backgrounds, some value

education and have their kids doing numbers and reading at three or four and some have illiterate parents and they come into school systems and on an unequal basis in terms of what they are getting at home. and the public school system tries to even that out and give people those opportunities. early childhood education is one way to do that. when you look at wealth disparity, education is one of the key levers that people tend to have more education tend to do better on average in life, and everybody ought to have those same opportunities and early childhood education is a great way to equalize that. i appreciate what you are doing, and as someone who headed a large county government in fairfax county government, we understood that and invested heavily. host: one more call. diane in jacksonville, florida. a republican. diane, you are on. caller: good morning, how are you? guest: i am good, how are you?

caller: i am great because -- i am great, and i favor you because my father's name was tom davis. guest: i will have to send you a bumper sticker or something. republicanten, as a and as a black republican, i wish people would understand, this election was not stolen. the reason why trump lost, as you said, is because of his own personality. he turned me off to the end. i could not vote for him. i have been a republican for 30 years and i could not bring myself to vote for that man. election, he the lost it because there were plenty of bernie sanders motors who refused to -- voters who refuse to vote the last time around or who did a protest vote. this time they had enough sense

to vote for biden. they did a protest vote against hillary and that helps trump to weigh in. home, which helps trump to win. out, and, blacks got bernie sanders motors decided to have sense -- voters decided to have sense and voted the proper way and that is why he lost. he lost because of his own self. i republican -- i voted republican down ballot but i did not vote for my president. county,he largest jacksonville city. jacksonville was the 12th largest city in the country and the largest city to vote for romney and trump. that was in 2016. and, this time around it flipped to the democratic side, so maybe your caller is an indication of what was happening.

host: tom davis, former representative and republican from virginia. "the partisan does not -- the partisan divide: congress and crisis" is the book that he co-authored. thank you for having me -- thank you for being on. guest: thank you for having me. host: up next we will be joined by the news literacy project's alan miller to discuss his recommendations on how to combat misinformation. take around, we will be right back. ♪ thesaturday on " communicators" josh on the videoconference company's growth during the pandemic. >> it has been an utterly transformational year. we have gone from something on the order of 10 million daily meeting participants in december

to something north of 300 million in april, and prior to the pandemic, we were focused almost entirely on business customers and all of that changed. when the pandemic arrived, we understood we had the opportunity to connect not just people, families, faith institutions, schools, and health care institutions. it has been extraordinary. we worked to scale up quickly to avoid disruptions and to be there for people. more --s josh kaul kallmer. podcast. c-span's this week zach smith, reporter with the iowa "press citizen" discusses the race in the second congressional district called for marionette miller meeks by six votes.

the contest will be decided by the house of representatives. find "the weekly" where you get your podcasts. journal"ngton continues. host: a conversation on media and misinformation. alan miller is the founder and ceo of the news literacy project. do, andxplain what you how is your group funded? is a national nonpartisan educational organization that creates programs and resources to teach, share, and learn how to discern credible information, and it gives students and the general public the tools to be informed and engaged participants and democracy. we are funded by a range of foundations, corporations, and individuals that help make us the leading provider of news literacy education today. host: newslit.org.

by alan miller talks about this idea of finding credible information and the emerging world of alternative realities. alan miller, is it getting worse? guest: yes. there is no question. i think this is one of the great existential challenges of our times. it is a question of whether facts will continue to matter. thatear 2000 is a year conspiratorial thinking went mainstream, whether we are talking about pandemic deniers or the rise of qanon, or the widespread belief that the election was fraudulent and not legitimate. we are seeing a level of anger and alienation, and mistrust in institutions, whether it be the government, science, or the media that has left people prone to believing things that are not

fact or reality-based. i think this is really the greatest challenge for democracy moving forward is whether we can find common ground based on the evidence, and fact-based information to move forward as a country. host: why do you think it has gotten so bad? who do you blame for it? guest: i think this has been a long time coming, and as i mentioned, i think there has been a level of disconnection to government and institutions that has left people prone to looking for easy answers. it gives them a sense of belonging, and a sense of the enemy being the other. and then, a reinforcing mechanism through social media where people are able to plug into others who have similar beliefs. didously, president trump not create the circumstances, they were there previously.

but he has exploited them and accelerated them. think,int now where, i this represents a crisis in the country's civic rights. host: alternative realities is what you talk about on the piece , is this another word for news bubbles or media kerchief -- medial echo chamber, or something worse? guest: the ability for people to look for information that will confirm their beliefs for confirmation rather than information that they educate or challenge their beliefs on social media has really amplified this phenomenon. i think that the education system there is some responsibility. we need to bring back teaching civics, and at the heart of that, critical thinking to know what information to discern and

to create. and i think that this is continuing to be -- it is going to continue to be a very serious problem until we take responsibility for what we consume and share, and be mindful about it. and, responsible. host: if you want to join this conversation this morning with alan miller, founder and ceo of the news literacy problem -- project. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independent, 202-748-8002. withll been -- he will be us until about 9:30 eastern. you talk about taking responsibility. when you talk to members of the media, how should they take responsibility and what can they do to address the problem that you are bringing up? guest: so, i think that

downalists need to double on verification, accuracy, transparency, and accountability. they need to tell the truth, and call out lies, and avoid false balance. they should cover the biden willistration, and they need to wean themselves off president trump. storyl clearly remain a in terms of his political influence, his legal challenges, his future in terms of the media , but i would recommend that reporters turn off their notifications of his tweets. as margaret sullivan writes, " not treat him as a president in mar-a-lago."up in host: do you think the news media was tough but fair on the trump administration?

you talk about the president's tweets. he would argue that the media was too tough and very much unfair. i am very know, cautious about talking about the media, because it encompasses a broad array of partisan outlets and online sources as well as what we think of as the mainstream media. that arall, yes, i think ,ot of the coverage was tough and was appropriate. not agree.ainly do obviously, president trump characterized coverage that he felt was critical as fake news and accused journalists of making things up and i do not think that that happened. host: a question from one of the folks following along on twitter. canyon asking "how

accurate are the fact checkers?" guest: i think the independent fact checkers play an important and by andhat is -- large they are credible forces for people to look to when things are in dispute. one of the things about them is that they do not simply ask them to trust what you -- do not ask you to trust what they are sharing. they show their findings and the basis for their determinations and are transparent on where their funding comes from. host: who are the fact checkers you are referring to? who are some examples? guest: factchecked out org, ofact,cal fact -- polit and first draft does well as well. host: plenty that c-span viewers

see on this program. i want to get to the phone calls. buffalo, a democrat. good morning. caller: good morning. guest: good morning. caller: how are you? host: doing well. caller: i have a question of mainstream media. today, and i try to keep an open mind, and they are still talking about the state election and all of this stuff. abouto me a favor, speak stations that we have in this country. democrats do not have nothing. we have tom hartman, and he is trying to help us, but this is getting way out of hand. thank you. guest: so, i think that the

right wing media chamber -- media echo chamber is a significant force as we look at the postelection. seen the attorney general say that he has seen no widespread examples of fraud that could change the election. headdministration's former of cybersecurity says that it is the most secure election and over 50 lawsuits that have been dismissed including one that went to the supreme court with a conservative majority. so, i think there is no question that this continued questioning and challenging of the outcome is helping to fuel a level of distrust that is unhealthy for democracy and is threatening. we have seen 77% of trump supporters believe the election was fraudulent and stolen, 65

million people, and i think that the notion of a haydn administration seen coming in as legitimate by such a large proportion is corrosive to the heart of democracy. host: do you think there is a liberal echo chamber? guest: sure. i think it is less pronounced in some ways, but we have got the opportunity for people to go to sources that they will likely agree with, including those with strong political viewpoints or slams. by, that is reinforced algorithms, what people get on their social media feeds. and, you see it in terms of trust. there is a decline in trust of the media, but a real bifurcation in what people trust based on their political beliefs. host: michelle, out of new is,er: my question to you

do you feel that the hunter biden -- take away trump, take away joe biden, that the hunter biden connection with russia -- with china should have been suppressed? that everybelieve voter in the united states should have been aware of the situation? this is about our future. you guys keep the echo chambers in the right wing media. if you guys did your job and we would have to believe your side of it and that you are wrong. you have maxine waters and everyone else telling people to go out and hurt people. do you cover that? no. host: mr. miller? guest: i am no longer in the

news media. , i coveredlist critical stories on the clinton administration and bush administration and the newsletter a project is nonpartisan. in terms of the hunter biden story, major news organizations looked into that story. .hey certainly did pieces on it when the emails. , that was explored and discussed. certainly on conservative media, attention.en i don't believe that is a story that was suppressed. it is obviously an ongoing story now. of new jersey, democrat. good morning. caller: good morning. on c-span ever since

it has been on but i have never got to say what i want to say. 2000 election being settled in 29 days, the judge was an appointee. he was the one man who got the supreme court swing vote to stop the recount of the 2000 election which was a difference of 512 votes in florida which by the law of florida, should have recounted the whole state. instead the democrats wanted to recount dade county and the dade miami cubans have fixed the vote so it looked like gore lost. the whole county in north dakota, 25,000 black voters were locked out of the poll. someone did a proxy and those

voters never were counted. a supremelabeled as court vote to stop the recount. when they did recount it the way gore wanted, bush lost. host: do you think you will ever get over the 2000 election? caller: first of all, it was never settled fairly. it was never a majority vote. it was just a one man vote. the judge stopped the recount. number two -- host: alan miller, let's pick up here. there were a lot of calls after the 2000 election for democrats to get over the election, to accept george w. bush. here we are in 2020. a lot of calls by democrats to republicans to get over the 2020 election, to accept joe biden. caller'sthink that the point was important.

four of the five last elections were closer than the 2020 election. in every case, including florida which did hang on a small number of votes, there were irregularities. it went to the supreme court which was settled along partisan lines. in all of those cases, including the one involving al gore, the loser graciously acknowledged defeat and we had a smooth and peaceful transition from one administration to another. this also included mitt romney lost to president obama in 2012. it does underscored that this election was not that close when you look at either the popular vote or electoral college. we are now at six weeks of disputing it every which way including georgia overseen by republicans who support president trump. it does seem to me that on that

basis there is certainly no question about the outcome. host: a caller brought up hunter biden and this question of what the media chooses to cover, what the media does not choose to cover. the white subject of house press secretary in the white house press room. i just want to play two minutes of that and get your reaction. [video clip] >> it is unfortunate that it does not get much coverage in the media. we should not be surprised in the last 24-48 hours there have been quite a few stories in the mainstream media. as former white house press secretary ari fleischer said, the press does not cover. last week we found that the mccracken congress may eric swalwell was in full traded by an allegedly chinese spy. his 2014 funds for

campaign and even planted an intern in his office. that relationship continued until the fbi briefed him in 2015 and that was good reporting done by axios. the new york times website as of this morning had not one result for eric swalwell's ties to chinese spies. when the story broke, guess how many minutes of coverage it got on msnbc and cbs? zero. cnn devoted three minutes and 16 seconds, however it was covered on fox. interesting pre-election and postelection coverage on the hunter biden scandal which was not covered at all by many .utlets in the lead up to the election, on october 15, you had a new york times headline that said trump said to be warned that he was being given russian disinformation over hunter biden. now december 10, the new york

times headline, investigation of hunter biden is likely to hang over biden as he takes office. washington post on october 16, the headline, the truth behind the hunter biden non-scandal. now we have the headline that says this, hunter biden tax probe advising -- investigating business deals. russian different summation, that is a favorite -- disinformation. december 2, political reads, justice department interest in hunter biden covered more than taxes. a really interesting turn of events and good for those who covered what was the story all along. ofdo you accuse others disinformation when you spread it every day? host: kayleigh mcenany in the white house press room. alan miller, your thoughts on her comments. reflect, themments media is not a monolith. it is a highly competitive

number of organizations and journalists and her comments cited reporting by axios and politico and the washington post that were breaking elements of the story as they unfolded including what is news and recent news about the investigation of hunter biden that is now being reported and widely covered. say toonsumer, i would follow a wide range of outlets, not just those that you agree with, and follow stories over time. truth often takes time to emerge. there are in normal sleep competitive forces at play -- enormously competitive forces at play.

i don't believe that these decisions as a whole are being driven by some collective widespread bias. jeff r kind california, inependent -- jeff california. something,ave to do it drives me crazy. i believe in civics, i believe in classical western literature and everything and it is just .eing destroyed not going to flip the channel and watch fox news. thank god for c-span, thank god for david land, the economist, the atlantic. whenever i begin to scratch the , do you even know what

you were talking about when you read this supreme court decision? people just fly off the handle. i hear kayleigh mcenany, what is the point? when do we get back to political ideology? when do we get back to, but was it, justice o'connor for her unfortunate dementia was really -- she had a program of civic. civics has to be a national mandate. it is like an epidemic. it drives me crazy. host: mr. miller? guest: i completely agree about the need to bring back civics. to give the next generation a grounding in american government. at the core of that should be critical thinking skills to know -- how to sort fact and fiction

and what information to trust and share. our democracy depends on an electorate that is informed and engaged, not misinformed and enraged. everybody has a responsibility to look at anything we encounter, any piece of news and ask ourselves, who created this, for what purpose? is it intended to inform or divide? what are the sources, what is the documentation? is there bias? what about the bias i bring to what i'm looking at? step back and ask yourself is this something i should trust, share, act on. i think we need to begin to become part of the solution instead of the misinformation problem and say false information stops with me. host: when you start teaching kids that? guest: we start middle school

and we focus on middle school and high school. we have a virtual classroom technology that is being used in every state in the country in history, social studies, english, and journalism classes. we have created resources for the general public because we realize that misinformation cuts across generations and we have a version of the classroom and are newsletter that anyone can access and use. host: did you say check-ologiy? guest: it is an engaging journalists and experts. host: what is an example of one of those lessons? guest: the foundational lesson is how to sort information based on primary focus. we are looking at news opinion

and information and that is before you get to making things up, false context as a separate lesson on misinformation. we launched a timely lesson on conspiracy theory. we have lessons about personal information according to the first amendment, the washington role of journalism and how to sort everything from arguments to determine what is credible. host: newslit.org is a good place to start for that? guest: yes. .org.it.org and checkology host: mike is in houston. good morning. caller: good morning. god help our kids. the media stories on donald trump were 93% negative. 67%, but 93% negative. the russian collusion store was on tv every day in every segment on cnn. .hey talked about impeachment

67 house democrats did not even show up at the and i grayson in 2017. in 2017. inauguration you don't have to fact-check that. fact-check is a liberal organization. joe biden could not even fill the circles at his rally and got 80 million votes? do you think we should look at mail-in ballot? should we look at ballot harvesting? if you cannot match the signature, where is the ballot, i think there could be a problem. host: when you say the media coverage was 93% negative, who do you include in the media? guest: let's start with chuck todd and peter alexander at nbc news. they omit stories, it is very common. they don't talk about the good things trump did like building the wall he said he would build or the embassy going to jerusalem for the nafta reform

that barack obama said he would do. they don't talk about those things. they don't talk about the midwest. i am from youngstown ohio -- youngstown, ohio. youngstown, ohio had a separate tracking industry in that region. 60 miles east, north, south. it does not get talked about. do you think alexander is going to go there and talk about the revitalization of the steel industry? that never happened. and you wonder why the county flipped to donald trump for the first time since 1928, it went republican. do you think mr. miller is going to know about this stuff? host: mr. miller? guest: first of all, i would like to see that survey of 93% whether it would include fox news and so on and what the basis for determining positive or negative coverage was. think that int i

some respects the coverage of president trump himself and stories related to him including the russian investigation was overplayed particularly by cable news outlets. i think we have seen at two elections where there is the press that has been surprised by support and the acknowledgment of not understanding exactly what is going on in the american heartland and rural areas as the caller suggests that there is a need to get out there more. i think there is some basis for that. as far as the election, in a pandemic with all of the --cerns, the election hit played out smoothly. the postelection and the vote

counting itself, to the greatest scrutiny we have ever seen. we had a national civics lesson during this period. much of it was overseen by republican officials, state officials, secretaries of state and certified by legislatures. i think there has been ample opportunity for president trump's attorneys to present any evidence that they have in multiple state and federal courts, many of them overseen by judges appointed by president trump for republicans. beenery instance, it has found to have no basis. -- i was an investigative reporter for many years. it did not matter what the -- ime, the subject was wanted to nail that story, to break it first. there are lots of reporters out

there, investigative reporters who would pursue those stories and probably have pursued them and found that they are groundless, baseless at this point. -- notit is part of this fact-based thinking to suggest that these things have not gotten an airing. host: you were an investigative reporter at the l.a. times. what is one of the stories you are most proud of? i broke the campaign-finance scandal in 1996 showing illegal money coming from asia to support president clinton's reelection, helping introduce the world to johnny chung in the buddhist temple that led to many investigations and subsequent convictions.

in 2000 i did work on both george w. bush and al gore. in 2004 i spent a year investigating environments a policy of george w. bush it also led to investigations and hearings. i spent a year investigating the marine corps aviation program working with a colleague, focused on the most dangerous plane in the military over decades -- killed 45 with the best pilots and those planes were never used for the purpose it was sought initially. this was part of a broader program for which they paid a great price in blood and treasure. host: alan miller, the founder of news literacy project, newslit.org. he is with us for just about 10 minutes more this morning as we take your calls about the media and misinformation. this is mark in west virginia,

independent. caller: good morning. you all know that stimulus check, $600 per month, that don't sound normal for a poor person. -- $500, $700. host: stick around for our last 30 minutes of washington journal because we will return to those stimulus checks, now very likely to be part of the deal happening on capitol hill. we hear that deal is coming together. it is not complete yet. congress could be working through the weekend according to the latest reporting. we will talk more about stimulus checks in our last half hour. we want to get the callers who want to chat with mr. miller. built in pennsylvania, democrat. in pennsylvania. caller: you are old school. you are the kind of guy who would get out there and get a

story. i will tell you they are too few of you guys around today. let me give you a couple of examples. the debates -- i did not see any cbs, any ofon nbc, the big news organizations calling for more debates. they let biden sit in his bunker, wherever he was at in delaware. you would think that journalists that want to find out what this guy is all about would be saying i'm a let's have some more debates. they did not do that. that tells me the media did not want more debates because they did not think joe could stand up there. another store that blew my mind was this michael guy. i could turn on every news organization, i can slip through -- i could flip through there.

fell off my barstool when i heard that. .t goes on and on i am a democrat. -- i not vote for drop, did not vote for trump. i could go through the tv. c-span, they had that guy scully , he was supposed to be a moderator for the third debate. then they found that he was in collusion with somebody over there at the trump organization or somebody that hated trump like 80% of these so-called journalists in america today hate his guts. let me tell you one thing, when he is gone you will see nbc, cbs, abc, all of them inviting him in because they know he is good for their ratings and that is exactly what happened when he was running for the president. they all had him in. every other day, trump was on morning joe and they were asking

him and laughing. they helped that guy get elected. you watch what happens. when he is out of office, they will be inviting him back because they want their ratings to go up. i don't hate the guy. i will be glad that he is gone for one thing. i want to see if the so-called journalists start actually following the sky, this new candidate and we know absolutely nothing about his vice president pig. we knowat was -- nothing about his vice president pick. i want to let alan miller jump in on those statements. guest: first of all, the number of debates set by the debate commission, -- is set by the

debate mission, not the news media. we did not need debates for the media to cover joe biden. debates are one important way for the public to select a candidate. i think the caller makes a very important point about president trump's if yes, the love-hate relationship with much of the media. attackedhe attached -- the fake news, he helped to drive ratings and profits for television and circulation for many newspapers. he enabled many of those who covered him to become best-selling book authors and media celebrities. i do take this will be a major ofllenge given the contract president-elect biden who will be a source of much less drama and division when he is in

office. for the news media to ween itself off of the daily coverage of the former president that it has become accustomed to. virginia juste in across the river. independent. comment was to something mr. miller said. the only thing that i would point out is, cannot speak in terms of absolutes like always and not a single case. -- most of cases them have not even been allowed to go forward which may be right or wrong. it is not that fraud does not exist and that illegal actions did not exist, it is just that the judges or whoever was hearing it did not think it was

substantial enough to overturn the election in that area. there are several cases that are still proceeding through the courts and some have been granted a few have been granted relief based on what was brought forward. think beau biden will be sworn in as president on january 20 -- joe biden will be sworn in as president? caller: i do. there was not necessarily sufficient numbers of fraud to overturn the election in those areas. but fraud is fraud. my desire would be out of this whole process and all the things exposed, we will have a much stronger system that absolutely validates the signatures and the voters and can provide results every single time and it was squash a lot of

the doubt and help us going forward. host: mr. miller? guest: the caller makes some good points. there have been some examples and we have seen the attorney general expresses, there is no real evidence or credible allegations of fraud that was widespread enough to produce a different outcome. you look at the battleground states and the numbers for were muchelect biden higher in places like michigan and pennsylvania. we have seen recounts, numbers have changed, but they have changed in very small matters and in one case, to the benefit of president-elect joe biden. absolutely the cases should go forward and where there is evidence, it should be heard. i think that is where the process has unfolded.

we have seen a very clear outcome at this point. host: one last call, dave in california, good morning. caller: first of all, if you will live -- allow me to give a whereshout out to c-span conservative viewpoints are not being canceled by cancel culture. a great exchange of ideological viewpoints has always been the bedrock of our democracy and it is unfortunate whether it is on college campuses or social media that we have a generation that does not seem to have the same appreciation for the values and ideals and principles our country has stood for. noticed the election, i the media was suppressing stories that were damaging to biden. the story that the new york post broke regarding hunter biden and

his association with a ukrainian gas company. even though there were verifiable sources and evidence, the signature -- hunter biden's ,ignature, his computer confirmation of emails were on that computer, media would not report that. stories that were damaging to trump, they had no problem. for example, the story in the atlantic magazine that trump had referred to our world war ii vets who died in europe as losers and suckers when there was no verifiable source for that. that allegation was refuted by multiple sources including john bolton who said he would have written an entire chapter in his book is that had been true. it goes to confirm how biased and dishonest and corrupt the mainstream media has become.

host: mr. miller? story,the hunter biden it is not true to say that the media has not -- it has gotten tremendous attention on fox news and from other conservative sources and the new york post. they looked into the story and basically refuted that allegation. so, other outlets looked into it and explored it as well and did reporting and found there were all kinds of holes in the initial allegation. i would disagree that the media is corrupt. again, media covers a very broad journalists and news outlets. it is imperfect in its nature, but i think ultimately journalists, quality journalists

are trying to get to the truth as best they can at the time and present the public with information upon which they can make their decisions in a vibrant democracy. newslit.org is the website of the news literacy project. alan miller is the founder and ceo of that group. in our0 minutes left program this morning. in that time we will return to this question about how you would use another stimulus check. congressional leaders say they are close to an agreement on a 900 billion dollars stimulus bill, and it is expected to include a new round of direct stimulus checks for millions of americans. let us know how you would use it. you can start calling in now. we will be right back. the food and drug

administration meets in open session to approve moderna's vaccine for covid-19. live coverage today at 9:00 a.m. eastern on c-span. stream live and on-demand at c-span.org or listen on the free c-span radio app. 2 has top on c-span nonfiction books and authors every weekend. this weekend the recent virtual miami book fair. saturday at 1:00 p.m. eastern. and then former new york times latin american correspondent anthony depalma. at 1:00 p.m. eastern with pj o'rourke and dave barry and with journalist nicholas griffin. at 7:55 p.m. eastern, "congress overwhelmed" with the authors. afterwords, on

"strong: mussolini to the president." a collegeerviewed by university professor. watch book tv on c-span 2. "washington journal" continues. host: negotiators on capitol hill are in the final efforts to wrap up a $900 billion stimulus bill. expected to be included is another round of direct stimulus checks somewhere in the area of $600 to $700. we are waiting on the final details. if that is included, we are asking how you would spend that stimulus check. phone lines are split up by region. in the eastern or central time .one, it is (202) 748-8000 mountain or pacific, (202) 748-8001. we want to hear from you to end

our program. we will end at 10:00 a.m. eastern. here is the latest from politico posted less than an hour ago on the state of negotiation. totten desktop congressional aides say it is possible they will need to pass a short-term spending measure to avoid a government shutdown friday night as negotiations continue. the weekend session and congress is becoming increasingly likely, they write. a bill to keep the government funded until perhaps sunday to allow the government funding bill to be tied together as a vehicle to move this, perhaps, 900 billion dollar package. here is the breakdown of what is expected to be in it from the same story. the coronavirus package will include a new round of roughly $600 stimulus checks, beefed up unemployment checks of $300 a week, money for small businesses

and transportation, money for vaccine distribution and schools. leaders are hopeful it will be married with a $1.4 trillion omnibus spending bill that would fund the government through september. the government funding deadline midnight tomorrow night unless congressional leaders take action. the latest on unemployment in this country, unemployment being included, additional unemployment insurance included package. this is from one of the scholars at the economic policy institute, a tweet. another 1.3 million people in this country applied for unemployment insurance last week, including 885,000 people who applied to regular state unemployment and 455,000 people who applied for pandemic unemployment assistance. asking you this morning, if you get another stimulus check in the area of $600 to 700 dollars how would you spend it?

buford, georgia, you are up first. caller: hi. the first check that i got i had to pay property taxes that were based on the previous year's rise in property values, which is ridiculous. i am an old lady and have been here for 21 years -- but anyway. i paid my property taxes. this one i hope to get my light fixed. i have been driving that for about a year. isave one spark plug which $20. when i called the mechanics they becauseng $400 to $500, they won't just do one spark plug, they have to do all of the spark plugs and move this and that. i just go to the walmart one mile away to buy food, because i can't afford to get the spark plugs fixed because i don't have

the money for that. host: how long can you wait? caller: as long as i can get to walmart for food i can wait, but if it breaks down on me i have absolutely no way to go to the grocery store, and i don't have family. i don't have anybody. i tried to do the meals on wheels, but i haven't heard back from them. it has been over a month or two. host: thanks for telling us about your situation and buford, georgia. good luck to you. denise in summerville, south carolina. good morning. caller: good morning to you. i think i would try to save it. that is what i would like to do. son, daughter and son-in-law in california and i don't know if they would lose their jobs soon. unemployment.on

he is in the restaurant business. i am lucky enough that i may be able to save it and catch up on a few bills. that is what i would do. try to save it in case they need help. host: how did you use the $1200 check from earlier? that away.ut when i didn't have enough money coming in, i used it to pay bills. it helped me in that way. extra food, whatever. that is what i would do. try to save it. i am just one of the lucky ones that might be able to do that and not worry about things too much. host: forbes with a story from earlier last week with this idea of another stimulus check that came into the discussion of the latest rescue package. taking a look at some of the numbers from the new york federal reserve on how people used the $1200 stimulus check,

the one that was part of the cares package, the $2.2 trillion package, passed at the end of march. that survey run by the new york federal reserve of several hundred american households found 29% spent on consumption goods, 36% put the check into savings. 35% of households spent it on debt repayment. itper into those who spent in on consumption goods, the spentis 18% of that 29% it on necessary living expenses. 8% spent it on hobbies, leisure activities, nonessential spending. 3% donated the money to charity. new york federal reserve survey took a look at how people might spend a second stimulus check. a survey of several hundred american households, if there

was another check coming, 24% said they would spend it on consumption this time. 45% said they would put it into savings. 31% would spend it on debt repayment. on federalbased reserve data. richmond, virginia, you are next. caller: good morning. i want to preface this by saying i am one of the lucky ones who the had, considering position. i've been able to work full-time during the pandemic. i would spend $600 for credit card debt from medical surgery i had last year. i would say it seems out of touch -- it has been nine months since we had the $1200 last time. that wouldn't even cover one month's rent for me. i would gladly opt out of receiving a check for the people to need it to get enough just for their rent. host: logan in richmond.

sandra,. caller: how are you? fine. how are you? caller: fine. fine. i would pay my property tax which i'm always late on, and i would buy something other than ramen noodles.i have been eating so many noodles it is coming out of my ears. fyi, tell one of those journalists who love to do investigative reporting so much to find out why lindsey graham won't tell the american public he's gay. host: we will go to sean in california. caller: good morning. i actually received the last stimulus check. i paid some bills off, i put money back into the economy, and the rest was more for my car

maintenance. for the new stimulus check, i am the same as the young man in virginia. i have been fortunate to still work full-time. if i had to opt out as well as him for someone to receive that check to pay their bills and their rent i will. , live in an area of california 1200 dollars is nothing when it comes to paying someone's rent. host: out of new mexico, good morning. caller: good morning. thank you to this program. i am looking forward to this check. i am way behind on my property tax and behind on my utility bills. gosh, $600 is not much, but it would bring a little bit of relief. i don't know, the whole idea,

the whole covid shutdown is so depressing. would $600 get you, joan? i am 700 dollars behind on my property tax, so i would probably give half to them and get caught up on my electric and gas bill and pay off my firewood. seconds be gone in 2.5 host:. host there are a lot of utility companies that have pandemic emergency programs for folks if they find themselves behind. have you tried to make use of any of those? caller: i am on social security and i make $78 a month more than i can to qualify for any of those programs. that didn't work. w heat my house with fire ood.

my neighbor provides the firewood for me and i still owe him $100 for firewood. this has been just a really hard time for everybody. that would be a little bit of help. it would certainly give me a little relief. host: are you hopeful things will get better? caller: yes. i can't wait. i talked to my doctor a couple of days ago -- i just got out of the hospital. i think as soon as we start getting the vaccine some of the depression and sadness that has been pervading every part of our society will start to lift. i am hopeful. i think that the vaccine is going to be a real blessing for all of us. mike debonis at the washington post trying to keep track of the latest with the coronavirus relief bill, here's what he writes on twitter from a few minutes ago. the latest on the talks, new

details on how checks and unemployment insurance are likely to be structured. we are waiting for that information. plus several more things in the washington post story, including democrats are trying to take the sting out of no new state and local aid. that seems to be cut from the final deal. there extending the deadline for jurisdictions to apply for the $150 billion in the cares act passed in march as well as fema aid. replicants are pushing back on that. republicans are pushing for senator toomey of pennsylvania, the republican senator, his language explicitly shutting down the emergency lending facilities next month. democrats are firmly against that idea believing it will and his pick for the treasury. there is that information out of "the washington post." a lot to keep track of. we are hearing the negotiations could go through the weekend.

it does seem like in some final version of this bill the additional stimulus check is likely to make it. if you get one of those checks in lebanon, virginia, how would you spend it? caller: i would spend it on these high-priced groceries and pay up my bills. my heat pump broke down. to help supplement and keep my power bill going so high. just to help pay bills. me and my husband are on disability. in southwest virginia we don't get the help like other people. people in washington do not understand what it is like live on a fixed income in these rural areas. host: how did you spin the $1200? did you get one of those in the spring? caller: yes, we paid it on our bills to help us keep going.

call fromks for the lebanon, virginia. oregon, good morning. .o ahead, ann caller: our situation has been a little different. as retirees we have been a little more fortunate in the fact that the pandemic has not affected us as directly as a lot of less fortunate people. normally i would save the check, but i guess we have made a conscious decision to try to not only pump it back into our local economy by ordering take-out from local restaurants or outdoor dining where it is available, to take advantage of that, but also to search the web and order made in america products to help local businesses in different parts of the country, like north dakota and illinois. help those businesses survive. we are trying to do our part

that way. we appreciate the stimulus check , because we feel we can use it to help others. host: thank you for the call from oregon. indiana, good morning. caller: i think it is a day late and a dollar short. nancy pelosi didn't want to pass it until she gets her way. she can take my $600 and buy her a freezer full of ice cream because she can't get enough money. i don't want it, keep it. host: wayne in indiana. you are next. caller: good morning, sir. host: go ahead. caller: i took my check and i had to pay a little insurance on my car and stuff like that. it helped. gladlad to finally -- i am they're finally giving something back to the people, because we own this country. this is the greatest country in the world. we own it.

it is supposed to be run for us. they are not doing it. they are running it for themselves. this needs to stop. we gave them a job, we can take it away from them. they have to realize that the people are getting fed up with this. it will have to come to a stop or we will take it all the way and do it all again. we took the british and everything. i had family who fought, were the minutemen and everything. i have been here since 1630, my family. if i don't have say so, none of us have say so. host: we talked about how the bill is coming together and looks at this point. state,e, -- liability, and local aid may fall away. there could be other things cut as well. "the washington post" looks at one of those issues. the addition of direct stimulus

checks is expected to come in part by reducing the amount of unemployment aid that could be in the final bill. congressional leaders have told lawmakers they are planning to reduce the length of unemployment benefits by one month from the final bipartisan bill, according to those who post"to "the washington in their reporting. that could mean that extended benefits could expire at the end of march. senator murphy with some tweets about this issue. he tweeted yesterday afternoon, "i support the stimulus checks. if this deal skims on unemployment benefits to fund stimulus checks for folks who have not lost any income, that doesn't sound like great policy." one of senator murphy streets from yesterday. brookfield, missouri. you are next. go ahead, sir. caller: my stimulus check was spent mainly for bills, which

2 and a approximately partial bill. better thanto us is nothing, i guess, but i think they should practice what they ofach and try to live off $600 like that themselves. that is about all i've got to say on that. host: sun city, california. good morning. caller: good morning. i have a story about the stimulus. i received a letter from the treasury department saying i wasn't going to get one because of an old case of back child support. my ex-wife called my daughter. she tells her to tell me to come up -- because i knew where she lived -- and she gave me the $1200 cash, because she said she didn't think that it was right

that she should get another stimulus check. i wasn't expecting one anyway because i knew -- like i said. it is an old child support case and stuff. so i did up getting a stimulus check. a shout out to my ex-wife. we are on good terms. i just have to share that story about the stimulus. host: what were you able to do with the $1200? caller: i did like anybody else. i needed it. it was better than a sharp stick in the eye. i put it back into the economy. like a lot of people are saying, paying bills and stuff like that. the little bit that it was, it did help. host: how are you doing today? caller: i am on social security and don't have a penny in the bank, but we are making it

through. like i said, i want to give another shout out to my ex-wife for being up and up. i wasn't expecting it, but it did help. int: thanks for calling california. patrick in south carolina. good morning. caller: good morning. the stimulus check -- i am basically against any checks the government is basically robbing peter to pay paul. who is going to have to pay the bill? what the dial in on federal reserve has been doing with the 2% inflation target. they have a mandate from congress when we turned over the regulating our currency to the federal reserve in 1913. that was maximum employment and price stability. the federal reserve said, we want to have a target of 2% inflation. a tax.ly inflation is

what they are saying is we are going to tax americans next year at 2%, wink, wink. you won't see it. we will adjust it. it is benefiting, the stock market is at an all-time high and people on the lower rungs are getting squeezed out. rather than the fed shooting for 2% inflation target, how about we go back to the constitution at a 2% excise tax that will allow congress to distribute the funds and it would be in line with our constitution. how about we get back to the constitution? host: this is allie from rochester, minnesota. caller: good morning. host: go ahead, sir. $600 would definitely help my family .ousehold

gone withinbably be a day. folks,s listening to most of the people it looks like don't need the check, or will save it or pay debt. that shows that people are not in the same situation. it would be better if they surveyed the people before they theyhe checks, or maybe if would only send stimulus checks to the people who were unemployed at this time. goingen that $600 is not to do that much. it would give those folks a little bit more. more, becaused be

of extended unemployment is as much as $300 a week for 14 weeks. that seems to be part of the package. you are saying take that $600 per millions of americans and roll that into more money or more time for the unemployment insurance? caller: that definitely would help if that would be the case. finished your comment. caller: that would help, but also arect payments is becausea also, unemployment would sustain for the next 13 weeks or whatever, that is there is always bills coming in. up on thewould catch old bills that you are neglecting and stuff you need to take care of that, because that

employment has been cut off for a long time. omar this is congresswoman of minnesota, a tweet from yesterday evening. "every member of congress should be ashamed. one time $600 checks and $300 in afteroyment i eight months is embarrassing. countries around the world are doing right by their constituents providing $2000 to $3000 a month. we should act urgently and accordingly in addressing the economic pain of our constituents." help put $1200 in march and a $600 check nine months later doesn't match the scale of relief americans need. i've been fighting since may for the direct cash assistance people deserved and i won't stop until families get the payments necessary to save and change

lives." edison, new jersey, good morning. caller: hello? hello? should i talk? host: you can talk, alan. we only have a couple of minutes left. caller: i want to say whatever -- not they are saying getting that check will cause disappointment and despair. some people don't have the money to afford things. it helps us, it really does. the money that comes in is always better than nothing. maybe you can send it and everyone does their part with the mask and what they are supposed to do. makes want you to know it us cheerful and happy to get something special. that's all. host: joseph, new york city. caller: this is quite the question at a great time. i will give you a quick answer.

i would take this money, whatever, this stimulus money comes to me would be going towards my income tax. because, as a result of getting all of this unemployment, they only take 10% out of your check. when income taxes are due it is about 30% -- somewhere around there including new york state as well. i will be saving what i can to pay my income tax. that leads to a question for you. the -- did they do anything about the income tax as far as alleviating that burden from us? host: in the negotiations that are happening today? caller: at all. i am concerned about paying my taxes. we had gotten lots of untaxed income here. i am worried when income tax time comes, do i have enough money in the bank to pay it? you only get about 10% taken out

of the check. that is what i am actually going to use the excess stimulus -- aside from paying my bills -- to do. to pay for that. whatever is left, i have been living very conservatively. i don't know when my business is going to come back. i am just trying to hold onto things and not go into debt. host: host: joseph there was a caller earlier who was shaking his head over the fope at the idea of getting a stimulus check only to turn it back over to the government to pay taxes. is that sort of where you are on this? caller: sort of, yes. it is sort of. it's also unemployment. if i was working they would take the taxes out. at the end of the year sometimes you get money back or close. but when -- host: joseph in new york city. our last caller in today's

program. one last tweet today from the president of the united states, just about 10 minutes ago. with a note about stimulus talks. he said, all time stock market high, the vaccine, and vaccine rollout are getting the best of reviews, moving along really well. get the shots. stimulus talks looking very good. we'll see what happens with those talks throughout the day and in the days to come. stick with us here on c-span for that. and you can head over to c-span3 right now if you want to see what's going on when it comes to the f.d.a.'s vaccine advisory committee. the hearing on the emergency use authorization for the moderna vaccine happening now. we are carrying it live on c-span3. let's going to do it for us this morning on the "washington journal." we'll be back here tomorrow morning, 7:00 a.m. eastern. 4:00 a.m. pacific. in the meantime, have a great thursday. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2020] [captioning performed by the

national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. isit ncicap.org] >> both the house and senate are in session today. off the floor negotiators have been busy working on deals for 2021 federal spending and covid-19 relief. current government funding expires tomorrow at midnight. both chambers need to pass a bill to avoid a government shutdown. it's also been reported that the house and senate are close to a $900 billion covid package, and that includes small business help, vaccine distribution money, and extended unemployment benefits and tax rebate checks. follow the house live on c-span nd the senate live on c-span2. >> state with c-span for our continuing coverage of the transition of power as president-elect joe biden moves closer to the presidency. with the