>> the house taking another break to allow the rule committees to complete their work. once they're done the house will gavel back in to consider debate rules for two bills, one dealing with election changes, and another on police reform. we expect a vote on those rules at 6:30 p.m. eastern and we'll have live coverage here on c-span. we welcome back to the program josh kraushaar from "national journal." we have seen a lot of versions of the former president come through with speeches. from his speech last night, what version emerged this time around? guest: the thing i was watching was whether he was going to declare a civil war within the republican party and try to punish his enemies that voted for impeachment or whether he was going to try to unify the

party, which he said in his speech at the outset. the news to me of that lengthy stem liner with that he named individually every republican, everyone of the 70 lawmakers who either voted to impeach our voted to convict. he essentially threatened to challenge them in primaries. we already have one race where trump is actually involved against one of the republican lawmakers that voted for impeachment. i expect to see a lot more based on his speech. that would be anthony gonzalez that is facing a former aide in the trump white house. it is going to be one of many proxy battles of trumpism versus the establishment going on in the republican party. host: you saw the response -- results of the straw poll. is there something to be taken

seriously looking at that potentially as far as the president considers another run for the party's top spot? guest: you could look at the straw poll results two different ways. i believe it was 97% of attendees supported the president's agenda which was even higher when the same question last year. he only got 51% support if he ran again, which is a good number, but maybe not quite where he would have liked to have seen things. i think about 65% of attendees so they wanted to run for another term. maybe not quite at the universal level he would have hoped for. but whatever they think of trump himself, this is a party that has been taken over by trumpism. i have been to nini -- many cpac's in the past, these trump holes elicited results.

rand paul would frequently win these straw polls. it was not necessarily representative of a lot of the republican party i think cpac is now the republican party. a lot of the speaking engagements represent where the heart of the republican party is in 2021. host: what does that mean for the everybody else in the party who are not trump supporters? guest: based on the senators and politicians who are looking to make a presidential run in 2024, they are betting on trumpism and betting that he is not ultimately going to decide to run again. they are trying to create their own lane and run in the space, but there is not much room for a skeptical politician. even nikki haley put out a statement saying she thought trump speech was great after

condemning him for january 6. it is not easy to see much of an anti-trump lane and the republican party anymore. host: josh kraushaar, our guest from "washington -- national journal." you can call in or text us or post on our social media site as well. let me play for you representative adam can zinger -- adam kinzinger talking about the role of the former president, current state of the party. [video clip] >> to win a narrative in a party, you have to present a competing alternative narrative. when you only hear from donald trump. and when people walk around in fear of his tweets or comments or use his fear to pedal win reelection, of course, he is going to motivate people.

that is where i launched the website, all about fighting for the narrative in the republican party for an optimistic, brighter future again, one we can be proud of and one where we talk about where we teach young people how to be politics in a way we used to remember and appreciate. host: that resulted in the headline from "the chicago tribune." go ahead. guest: you have got to give some like can zinger for not just voting the way he did, voting for impeachment, but also backing it up with this political action committee and really taking the fight to the former president and his supporters. i think it is a tough fight. if you look at the polling within the republican party, the highest number you can come up with among people who might be receptive to kinsinger's message right now, about one quarter of the party, 25%.

that is not a winning faction. that is why mitch mcconnell even, who was also very critical of the former president on the senate floor, condemning his behavior, has tiptoed away from that position as polling has come out showing the vast majority of republicans still have no problem with what the former president did and how he has behaved. good for kinsinger. everyone should stand by their principles and he is taking the fight to the voters, but he is going to have a tough reelection. he managed to stem the divide. he was critical of trump when he was in office, but he did not have a primary challenge in the 2020 election. now, by going full bore against the former president, he has actively alienated a lot of republicans who may not look too kindly. host: liz cheney one of those called out yesterday by the former president. giving her comments on the state

of what she sees. [video clip] >> it is very important, especially for us as republicans, to make clear that we are not the party of white supremacy. >> will you make that clear now? >> 100%. we have kept a resolution reading animus from the members three years ago saying we condemn white supremacy, anti-semitism, kkk. i'm going to add qanon to that. i have not seen democrats do that with a man who calls the jewish people termites. >> people who seized the capital -- see aged the capital were wearing -- were carrying trump flags. >> the democrats have created a safe haven for antifa. nancy pelosi said people will do what they do. you can't hold republicans to one standard and not democrats.

that creates unrest as well. host: i will apologize, that started off with ronna mcdaniel of the rnc. guest: it is a what about ism at its worst. i've long said the issue of trump is a demand side problem within the republican party. it is not a supply-side problem. if you saw the vote in private about liz cheney keeping her leadership position a few weeks ago, and she won overwhelmingly. privately, a lot of republicans in both the house and senate would like nothing to do with donald trump, but then they see polls about where their voters are, that people who vote for them in primaries and it is 75% plus of republicans still believe in and still support the former president. i think there are a lot of republican lawmakers that in their private moments, would not only agree with liz cheney, they

may go further in their unguarded moments. if they want to survive politically in today's republican party and today's washington, they can't speak out and they have to muddle around kind of like the way mitch mcconnell has giving the tough speech against trump on the senate floor, but then saying he was report him a couple of weeks later if he was the nominee in 2024. host: our guest is the senior columnist for "national journal." our first call comes from john in washington. caller: good morning. i would like to say that i did see excerpts of trump's speech yesterday. i watched as much as i could. what impressed me was it was like a rerun. he could have played golf and just went ahead and ran one of his tapes from previous meetings. i saw the golden calf that they brought in in the form of donald

trump. i was really surprised they didn't carry it into the hallway, into the conference room. what can i say? what i can say is this. he is living a big lie about the election. 50 governors, 50 secretaries of state, tens of thousands of poll workers observed the process. the courts ruled on his claims. no one in authority back to his claims. what are we going to do to bring the reality of what happened in the last four years to some of these people that frankly seem to be logic free? host: that is john in oregon. "the new york times those quotes has photos of that statute that appeared at the convention.

you can find those online. go ahead. guest: this is the challenge for the republican party. they can't live with trump, they can't live without him. they need his voters. they can't afford him to divide the party in a civil war style divide. they need to figure out a way to get the enthusiasm of his voters to win elections, but they also need to distance themselves enough to win over those swing voters that turned away from him in the last president election. it is not an easy task. the mcconnell hope is that bidens administration overreaches on a whole other front, and we are not talking about trump in three months, we are talking about the state of the economy, trying to focus on bills that biden is championing rather than the trump brand that is not going to be easy. we are still a month in an trump is still on the present. trump is still taking center

stage. don't think he is going to be going away. host: what is the likelihood that the former president and his followers will speak of is election fraud, does not remain a constant or does that seem to be dying or go away? guest: it could go away yesterday. republicans were hoping he wouldn't talk about him claiming fraud and claiming he won the election, but he did. in fact, it was sort of the flow of the trump speech. he started off reading off the tele-after spending half an hour reading the lines his speechwriters wanted to, but he really got energized towards the middle and the end when he was expounding his grievances talking about the republican targets, the folks who were disloyal to him and going off script and really being the attack dog that he enjoyed so much as president. that is a problem. that is what gives republicans in washington heartburn. don't let him -- they will let

him talk about whatever he wants, but when he tries to go after lawmakers that are up for reelection or governors or senators that have important races coming up, that is what threatens to split the party apart and do immense damage. caller: i admired the speech of the former president yesterday. speaking from a simpleton with no political paul, where to we go from here? what's next? we need to get this election fraud taken care of. host: ok, that is gary in pennsylvania. as far as specifics, what is going forward as far as looking as making corrections for the next election. guest: you look at the straw poll, the number one issue on

the minds of the attendees, by far, was election integrity. trump has redefined his party, that is one of the most significant ways, by convincing a lot of republican voters that there is something wrong with elections. you also see on the democratic side, there are two poles on the same issue. obviously, the selection to nihilism coming from trump. the more mainstream republicans are talking about cutting back on votes by mail, absentee voting, doing things totally legitimate, but in the vein of trying to reform elections and how they are duck. house democrats taking up hr one -- how they are done. house democrats are taking up hr 1. both parties are considering election reform but having

totally different views on how to conduct elections effectively and responsibly. host: you brought up hr 1 on the house side, what is the bipartisan nature of support for the bill as it stands? guest: zero. maybe a house republican are two, but it would pass the house on a partyline vote two years ago and has very little chance of passing the divided senate. this is the third rail of politics. republicans are not even acknowledging the election results of 2020. and yet, democrats have their own issues. they want more access, they want to make sure there are certain reforms in place. there is little chance in this congress of getting that bill passed unless there were serious compromises. host: another bill, when it comes to the american relief act, it passed in the house last week, now, it goes to the senate. what happens to this bill now?

guest: senate democrats have to rewrite it. the minimum wage provision is not going to be in it, and the senate version, which i don't think makes much of a political difference given the unified republican opposition to it. i thought it was notable on the friday night vote in the house, it was pretty much a partisan vote, but republicans stayed together. even adam kinzinger, even more of the moderate republicans voted against biden's first big bill, the stimulus package. there were two democrats in the house, jared golden of maine and kurt schrader of oregon that voted against the stimulus bill. when i look at the politics of a lot of these issues, the party that is divided is typically the party that does not have the political upperhand, that may be losing on this issue. i know democrats in the white house point to polls showing a lot of these provisions in the bill being very popular, but republicans hung together and voted against it. you had to democrats, one and

abide in district, voting against their president. i think that suggests you are going to see a partyline vote on this side when it comes up, but also, this may not be quite as a political slamdunk as a lot of folks in the white house have you to believe. host: rob portman made the case for a bipartisan bill yesterday on the sunday shows. [video clip] >> covid relief has never been a partisan issue. over the last year, we have passed five bills with overwhelming bipartisan margins. there are a bunch of us republicans who went to see the president a few weeks ago and said, let's negotiate. we have done this five times before, we can do it again. this is not like texas or health care, this is covid relief. it does not fit in reconciliation because it has to be directly related to the budget, to revenues or spending, which is why the minimum wage got knocked out. i have not figured it out yet,

but i think what he should do is what you did in the clinton administration is to start off with more bipartisan measures so that we don't poison the well's and we can continue to work together. in this case, it would be very easy to get republican support for a covid relief package. host: there is the ideal. what is the reality? guest: if you talk to folks in the white house, they would say that they don't think they can get the 10 republican senators for any kind of bipartisan package for it to pass. the best they could do was kick off a few republican senators take mitt romney or lisa murkowski. ultimately, they would still have to go through reconciliation, it would delay the passage of the bill that it needs to go out to help some of the most disadvantaged, hard-hit workers and americans because of coronavirus. that is the white house argument. that said, biden's campaign message and inauguration message was all about unity and bipartisanship.

this is about as bipartisan an opportunity as you can get in trying to get benefits and assistance to people who have been hard-hit by the pandemic. there was a lot of room for a bipartisan package if that is what biden wanted to do. he had a meeting with 10 republican senators, but ultimately, did not offer any compromises. ultimately, he went fully partisan on this thing. i think that it is going to pass. i think ultimately, the politics of this are going to be determined by the state of the economy in 2022. if the economy is good, if it is rolling along, i think biden is fine. i think for some reason, if we had a hiccup whether it is pandemic relief or schools reopening or the economy not meeting expectations, it is going to be biden that gets the blame because he did not get republican buy-in. host: rachel in texas. caller: i checked it out with

the labor department, they give obama credit for the job. the fact that he created 1.5 million more jobs than trump. i can just imagine fox news if the riot was under obama. then building this golden statue of trump -- you see trump's spiritual advisor praying over trump's statue. crazy. we talk about keystone pipeline. there were those thousand jobs that were lost. those were temporary jobs. they were not permanent. also, the gas prices. it does not matter who is in office. it has nothing to do with the gas prices. that is a fact and anybody can check it out if they want to. a lot of people don't like to read. host: rachel in texas. to that last couple of points, the president did bring up

energy issues criticizing the first 30 days or so of it. guest: i am a little surprised how green early on president biden has gone. he has catered to the environmental activists within the party by overturning the keystone pipeline, which weather that has a huge economic impact or not, those are real jobs taken away. i've talked to a lot of democrats that believe that all biden should be focused on in these first few months is the economy and the pandemic. any other issue, whether the environment or immigration, that is a distraction from the message that he should be wanting to get out which is recovery from the pandemic. i think that politically speaking, it was a bit of a misstep to try to get john kerry as his climate czar and environmental advisor to sort of tout issues to what the real focus is of this administration.

those are issues that are more divisive. you have a lot of energy workers in states like texas, pennsylvania, ohio, big swing states that are going to turn off a lot of middle-of-the-road voters that voted for biden, but may not be enthralled with some of these environmental policies. host: tempe, arizona, horace. caller: good morning. i was listening to him earlier when he said it is legitimate to have suppression. i don't think so. everybody is talking about how trump is going to run again in 2024. i think he is going to be in jail. he is going to have to many cases against him in order for him to run for president. i can't believe how many people would have such a closed mind

and a narrow mind about this guy. that cpac thing was a big joke. they just got up there and show how ignorant they are. guest: as far as the election rules go, obviously, everything trump was saying about denying the results of the election, incorrectly alleging voter fraud is absurd and should be condemned. even some of the live streams of cpac had to break away from some of these panels about making these unfounded allegations because they are not true and could subject themselves to legal charges. on the other hand, what republicans are trying to do is make the issue of election integrity more of a mainstream issue. they are talking about should there be unlimited absentee voting, early voting? weeks of early voting rather than just one we can before the election? there are a whole lot of rules

surrounding election administration that have been argued for years and years, part of the political football we live in. that is the area i think republicans are going to hone in on, try to on trump -- un-trump ify these claims the former president has been making. host: focusing on the current administration for just a bit, what is the status of president biden's pick for the office? guest: it comes down to whether or lisa murkowski, who has not made up her mind how she will vote on confirmation, whether the biden white house can convince her to cast a supportive vote. i don't think it is very likely. murkowski was one of the senators that over the many tweets that were sent out and controversial, murkowski was one of the targets. maybe murkowski cuts a last-minute deal to help her own

state of alaska in exchange for voting, but i think it is pretty unlikely and tandem -- stand is much more likely than not to be the next director. she has not -- tandon's confirmation is not dead yet because murkowski could ultimately vote yes. and she is meeting with tanden. i think it is more likely than not that she is going to stick with her party. host: and another one, merrick garland. guest: that was a bipartisan pick. i think people were surprised that mitch mcconnell announced his support and endorsed garland given that he blocked him when he was nominated as obama's supreme court nominee. it does go to show the stakes were a lot higher for republicans when it came to the future balance of the supreme court. there is a lot of republican support for merrick garland.

host: and just to let you know, the senate judiciary committee is set to vote today to move his boat out of committee. this is virginia in sarasota, florida. caller: good morning. there are two subjects i wanted to mention real quick. first, about the covid. i never got any information on what is in the covid vaccine. did anybody? i noticed we got mail-in ballots in the mail, but i never got any information. i don't know what is in that vaccine. i don't put anything in my body until i know exactly what is in it. another thing, donald trump may not speak like joe biden because he is telling us the truth. and also, actions speak louder

than words. trump is a man of action. he accomplished much despite the democrats. i will vote for him again if he runs. host: ok. guest: i think the caller probably reflects a large part of the republican party, the district -- distrust of the establishment, the democratic party and support for donald trump if he runs again. for years is a long way away. three years is a long way away, but trump chose to run and i think he would be the heavy favorite to win the republican nomination in three years. three years is a long time. trump is going to be 78 years old and i think he wants to show that he is in charge, but i don't think he wants to go through the efforts to run for office again and put himself up. host: waldorf, maryland, robert.

good morning. caller: good morning. i wonder if anyone has noticed that per the cdc's website, flu deaths are down at 100 year low. now, everything is just covid. pneumonia deaths are magically at a 100 year low. does anybody find any coincidence in that that these bee stings have gone down to a level of 1895, the lowest level, but yet covid is up at 500,000? but nobody seems to comment on how that has been done. i noticed your guest seems to think this election has not been stolen. i just point out to you, anyone listening, go to gateway pendant. any other election we have ever had in history, have they ever stopped counting votes at 10:30? have we ever had a van pull into detroit where they were counting

all of the votes and unload 130,000 votes and magically, the next morning, joe is in the lead? have we ever had that happen? host: ok, you posed the questions, we will let our gues answer then? guest: those are a lot of unfounded accusations. the reason why the count looked favorable to the president in certain states on election night and more democratic votes got counted the night after is because of the unique circumstances in which the election was held where a lot of republicans voted the day of the election. they voted on election day and those votes were counted. they were processed first. democrats decided to predominately vote early or vote absentee, and those early votes were counted later per the rules of a lot of those individual state. just because voting had become such a partisan issue that republicans decided they wanted to vote almost all republicans

on the day of the election, they didn't like voting early because the president was criticizing voting early and democrats did the opposite, that is why you saw the election count in certain states. it had nothing to do with anything suspicious, it had to do with a partisan breakout and how those were being cast in the 2020 election. host: when it comes to the american rescue plan, we talked about the fate of the minimum wage. what about the $1400? it is still in there, but what are the potential changes for who gets that money? host: -- guest: biden has been committed to making sure those checks are in the final bill. where it could be changed in the senate is maybe testing who is eligible for the $1400 or maybe roll it back based on your income level. i believe in the house version, if you are a family that makes $200,000 or less, you still would get a $1400 check.

that is where the political blowback might start for people who are upper middle class living comfortably, saving money during the pandemic, do they really need that much money for the ash from the government at a time when the budget is already being busted with a lot of government spending? there may be some slight curtailing of the levels which are eligible to get the $1400 check. ultimate, it looks like that check will be in there. host: let's hear from steve in noblesville, indiana. democrats line. caller: i tell you, the republican party, the people who are supporting donald trump, it is a colts. -- cult. you know where the other cult was? the nazi party. these guys have never told the

truth, donald trump has never told the truth. host: aside from those parallels you are trying to make, what would you like to ask our guest, specifically? caller: i can't understand why people support the man because he is hateful. this country don't need hate. host: ok, that is stephen indiana. -- steve in indiana. guest: i think the phenomenon of trauma has to they with a lot of things. one is pure partisanship. it is kind of an ironic finding at a time when we see more and more people not identifying with either republican or democratic party, partisanship is as big as a pressure point as it has ever been in modern history. there are republicans who often will say january 6, i may want to re-think my allegiance to trump but then the partisan

instinct kicks in. trump lost a lot of support, but then got it back. the partisan instinct kicks back in. that is just the reality of our time. there is not a whole lot of room for independence, for critical thinking within those two parties. social media, in particular, has been a very -- has had a deferent -- detrimental impact on how people make their political judgments. host: angelina's in wake forest. caller: i just wanted to say that i do believe this election was taken by fraud, why else would they not allow people to watch the votes being tallied and going through the machines unblocking the windows and not even letting them in yucca pulling out suitcases at night and running those ballots through. i do believe president trump won this election. this is just a fraud situation

going on. but what he said yesterday about america first and biden tearing got the plan, we were dependent cut -- independent from foreign oil and gas prices were below two dollars a gallon. we were even selling our fuel now. it's over. it's done. also, the borders. i think the borders are being opened. it hurts americans physically with the covid coming in and with the gangs coming in. host: that is angelina in north carolina. you have covered some of those themes before. give our viewers a sense of what to watch out for as the week goes on politically. guest: the big drama is going to both come with whether tanden survives or whether makowski votes to not confirm her and scuttles her nomination.

number two, the status of the stimulus bill in the senate and how much gets changed and whether joe manchin and kyrsten sinema, the two most modern democratic senators are fully on board. those are the two senators we will be hearing a lot about in a divided washington. they both represent either a trump stay or a swing state. they are very independent minded and are not going to be rubberstamps for the biden agenda. everything he wants to get done has to get through at least those two senators. host: josh kraushaar serves as the senior national columnist for "national journal." >> tuesday, f.b.i. director testified before the senate judiciary committee regarding the f.b.i.'s security and planning and during the attack on the capitol. watch our live coverage on c-span 3 and c-span.org or