sunday morning, and be sure to join the discussion with your phone calls to facebook comments , text messages, and tweets. [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2021] announcer: republican representatives paul gosar and texas attorney general ken paxton discussed u.s. immigration policy at the conservative political action conference. this is 20 minutes. political action conference. this is 20 minutes. [cheers and applause] >> well, i have an impressive guest joining us today. we really wanted to talk about something that is important to all of us, which is valuing our american citizenship. i know as a daughter of immigrants -- my father came from cuba. my mother also came from cuba. they fled political persecution,

and they came legally to our country, and we treasure that. we treasure those who get in line, follow the process to be able to come and live here in america and seek that opportunity. but in certain states like arizona, like texas, we find that there is chaos at the border, especially now as we see a new administration come in and in a bullhorn basically say, "come on in. it's an open border system." so what we want to address today is why it is so important that we stand for illegal immigration, that we stand for fixing our immigration system, something that i think policy has failed for way too long. i would like to start with congressman gosar.

i understand there was a big ruling as well. rep. gosar: absolutely. first of all, i denounce when we talk about white racism. that's not appropriate. i believe in an immigration system but a legal immigration system. we have to look for those programs not authorized by congress and don't have checks and balances. there were indices of fraud out in arizona and yesterday, a federal district court judge allowed the state legislature to access the dominion machines and the ballots. [cheers and applause] >> i think one of the tweets you had put out as well was the fact that you are going to pose these

america last policies, talk about not supporting criminals over citizens. the criminals are really running this process at the border. rep. gosar: absolutely. when you start to talk about the catch and release that's going on at the border, there's a 95% chance they came from the yuma area. they are releasing 50 undocumented aliens through to the streets and hoping they will come back or their court appearance, but over 99% do not do that. >> explained catch and release. there's always a sense people do not understand what it is. walk us through a little bit of what that means and what the biden administration did to allow catch and release to happen. rep. gosar: during the trump

administration, so many people were coming to the border for asylum. with the trump administration did is held those individuals in mexico while their case was being looked at and adjudicated, so that there was more compliance. most people don't realize that the asylum-seekers, most of them did not qualify under those statutes and the biden administration actually reversed that, and now, they are catching the undocumenteds and releasing them into the interior or wherever they want to go. it puts a huge resource strain on the county, the sheriff there, and the state. ms. schlapp: one of the things we talked about yesterday -- ambassador landau is our former u.s. ambassador to mexico, was front and center in working with mexicans on the border crisis.

what did you find in working with mexico, and especially planning the mitigation detection protocol president trump put in place when he was president? >> absolutely, mercy. one of the things tribes are fire does not get enough credit for is our administration worked closely with mexico to stop and dis-incentivize these immigrant flows because these out-of-control caravans we were seeing were in violation of u.s. law and also mexican law. what drives me bananas is that the narrative in this country is that president trump, his immigration policies work mean to the immigrant people. to the contrary -- the people who are really cruel in this are the people who are luring poor people from all over the world to the united states saying if you get here, we will give you free education, we will give you free health care, we will give

you a new life. these people that come have to live in the shadows in this country, so it is not in our interest or in mexico's interest to do that. we had great cooperation with mexico to try to stop and reduce these flows, and i'm afraid that's been lost already. ms. schlapp: we were having this discussion about when president trump made that discussion about we are going to put tariffs on mexico and put a little bit of economic squeeze on mexico to help us in the border crisis and provide resources and help stop this flow of illegal immigrants, we found that it worked. it's when the mexicans came to the table and president trump had a very good relationship with the president of mexico. mr. landau: they had a great relationship, and again, this helps protect the migrants

themselves. one thing the media in this country misses out on is that a lot of times, these people themselves are victims. this is a big is in us, smuggling people into this country, human trafficking. that's never reported that way, but these people are often desperately poor, they spent whatever savings they had trying to get to the united states, and they are often crammed into tractor-trailers. as many asked 230 people have been found in tractor-trailers. they are sometimes abandoned on the side of the road. the people encouraging immigration are encouraging a humanitarian crisis. it's the most perverse thing ever they are regarded as great champions of human dignity. it is the complete opposite. ms. schlapp: and it is the drug cartels and human traffickers who are the ones profiting off these families. mr. landau: absolutely. ms. schlapp: attorney general paxton, it's great to have you here as well. [cheers and applause]

ok, who is from texas? [cheers and applause] ok, you have a fan club. biden, first few days of the administration, obviously, he made a decision to sign record numbers of executive orders, right? in spades. but one of the things he focused on was telling the department of homeland security, let's halt deportations. what actions did texas take immediately? mr. paxton: within days, we filed a lawsuit, which we do in texas against presidents who go beyond their constitutional abilities. [cheers and applause] we had an agreement with homeland security that if they made major changes to immigration that they would give us time to adjust to it. they completely ignored that agreement. second, they violated federal law because it is not his job to change federal law. his job is to implement the laws and execute on it. third, his constitutional role

is not to make new law. that was the lawsuit. we filed for a temporary injunction, which we received very quickly, and just this week, we got a permanent injunction, which means we stopped his illegal action. [cheers and applause] ms. schlapp: just a follow-up to that question -- what does it mean when you say you cannot halt these deportations? what is the impact it is having on resources in texas and across the country? mr. paxton: that's a great question because the media does not really deal with that. first of all, we have been dealing with this health-care crisis, and transmission of covid, and suddenly, that does not matter. we don't know the health status of these people coming across the border. we have all these restrictions in our country. there's no restrictions on the border. we are just opening the door to all that, which creates

tremendous risks for my citizens and really, the citizens of the entire country, and the additional cost we have to incur -- education, law enforcement, health care and other costs -- it's just ignored by the media and ignored by biden as he opens the border and tells people to come on in. ms. schlapp: i think one of the things we are seeing even early on with the biden administration is that they are moving forward with their version of immigration reform legislation. i can tell you, being on the others with president trump, we tried several times to work and get things done in terms of immigration reform, including securing the border, which is a huge priority, obviously, for the president. [applause] how -- where will this legislation go? obviously they have the support.

democrats are going to push this forward. what does this mean in terms of what they were -- what they would consider a broken immigration system? rep. gosar: i don't think they are fixing it in any way, shape, or form. they are blowing it up. we need to look at programs where we incentivize big techs that are running all over our freedom of speech and assembly where they get workers that do not have to pay pfizer withholding tax. once again, you see the benefit being given to foreigners over our citizens. -- do not have to pay fi essay --fisa withholding tax. it's sad to say that they don't understand it, but in some ways they do.

the system they have created is totally unfair. ms. schlapp: one of the things president biden has done, one of the first things he did as well was stop the funding of the border wall, something that we work really hard to do in the trump administration, ensure that we were building a wall, something that was a priority for the president. do walls work? rep. gosar: well, they actually do. ms. schlapp: again, going back to the border issue, how do you think the biden administration will perform in terms of working with these latin american countries? mr. landau: i'm very worried with the findings we have seen so far. president trump had a lot of agreements with a number of countries. let's remember, folks, we are

still in a pandemic here, and the idea that you are going to incentivize people to come into our country illegally during a pandemic is just beyond. i don't understand why the american people are not more up in arms about this. [cheers and applause] you know? it's not as if these people are socially distancing on their way through mexico. a lot of times, i think it is important to understand these people are being prayed on. -- preyed on. they are being lured here by coyotes promising them a better life, and the violence against these people in mexico is horrifying. the levels of rape on these journeys. the thought that anybody in this country would be incentivizing and luring people to try to make this very dangerous journey is abhorrent. i think as a country, we should do everything we can to

discourage that and encourage people to follow our laws, which very clearly set forth a process to come here legally. these people are jumping in line ahead of the people waiting their term. we are a country of immigrants. there's a way to do it, and that is what is so frustrating, is that we are incentivizing people to skirt the very system that our own laws provide. ms. schlapp: in times of the asylum system, what does that also mean? what would be the impact on these states? mr. paxton: i do want to answer your wall question. we had a border -- we have a border wall partly along where

el paso is. before that occurred, el paso was one of the highest crime areas in the country. when we put that up, they became one of the safest areas, so it really worked. we have been a place where people escape persecution, and i think that is great, but everybody has been taught now that you claim it -- that you claim asylum, and you come here and stay. to claim asylum and get a hearing set, and those hearings can be years later. it is a loophole that hurts people who are legitimately coming here for asylum. we need to find a way to fix that because it's not working anymore. ms. schlapp: let me ask about ms 13 gang members. you hear these stories. what i find interesting is that what they've done, i know

president trump spent a lot of time combating ms 13 combating these gang members. they have a huge network with several of these latin american countries. what is your concern in terms of how we stop the crime from happening here that impacts so many of these communities? delighted impact latino community, the african-american community. mr. paxton: we have seen a lawlessness from democrats already. you got a super cell that they feel they are empowered to be able to do their will against innocent people, and that is what is really sad. the rule of law is for everybody . not anybody should be above it, and these are people that actually look at entrance into a

gang. there's been machete license on the east coast and west coast, and our citizens fear for their lives. it's all about what the ms 13 and the gangs and the cartels what to do. ms. schlapp: biden or you have seen many democrats talk about the abolish ice component. how would that impact or hurt our state? rep. gosar: when ice is not able to do their job, it comes down to the county or state level. they are releasing over 50 undocumented people into the yuma area. that is a notification or hardship on the sheriff's office as well as the state, and those are the resources that they actually have, but you are seeing states like texas

utilizing it to force the narrative, use the courts, the smart, and make sure you are in power. ms. schlapp: ambassador, i think you have worked so hard with mexico, working with these latin american countries as well. what do you think they are thinking in their minds right now and how they are going to feel with caravans coming, the fact that they feel there is an open border policy in the country? mr. landau: it creates a huge problem because mexico does not want to be the doormat for the united states for all these people from all over the world. this is something i think many people don't realize, that a lot of this illegal migration is coming from all corners of the globe. when i was ambassador to mexico, there would be people in mexico from bangladesh, congo, haiti. we are not just talking about mexico and guatemala.

it becomes a magnet now with plane travel, you get people who fly into brazil and walk up there. the effect is very destabilizing on these countries. during the pandemic, they don't want people just crossing their borders in mass numbers through a disorganize process particularly. i think they are very concerned about what the ripple effects on them could be of these biden administration policies. ms. schlapp: attorney general, you have dealt with sanctuary cities in terms of seeing what other states have done. how has texas dealt with sanctuary cities in terms of many of these mayors deciding, "we are going to make this happen and this is the way we are going to deal with it? mr. paxton: our state wisely passed sanctuary city laws, so if they are violating federal law and not cooperating with

customs and immigration, they could potentially be fine, so we have already filed a suit against the city of san antonio -- [applause] and the sheriff who released illegals without cooperating with ice. that has been an effective tool for us to stop and really shut that down in texas. ms. schlapp: now we are going to go into our final thoughts. rep. gosar: we are a country of immigrants, but it was legal application. so far, too much of what we have seen is there's no application to that rule of law. that's what made us great, what made us special, and i think we are at a crisis point, but i will also tell you, i think it is a point where we can be involved and we can be a solution instead of the problem. where there's the greatest chaos, there's the greatest opportunity for change. [applause] ms. schlapp: ambassador?

mr. landau: i just think as americans, we need to go back to civics 101. the president's job is to execute the law. the president does not get to make the law. the president does not get to pick and choose which law to enforce. all the law. all the law. [cheers and applause] ms. schlapp: all right, attorney general, i don't know how you're going to be that, but you can try. mr. paxton: you have nailed it. fundamentally, if we have a president overstepping his constitutional role, we don't have a constitution anymore, and that's what we really need to focus on. ms. schlapp: well, we know one thing, that biden is going to sell us out. he has no interest in fixing this immigration system. it is, for him, open border and

continuing to pursue this radical immigration policy, the broken system. so many people have suffered in the process, and at the end of the day, we want to keep supporting legal immigration, and we want to thank all of you for this discussion. thank you so much. [cheers and applause] >> cohost of the history checks podcasts talk about the podcast origins and growing popularity over the years covering women in u.s. history. >> women and girls are hungry for role models. we keep hearing representation is important. that really is so true. the amount that females and other messages that we get from very, very young girls and/or their mothers sang -- saying

that the subjects we cover our very fact that they hear two women speaking in that format, how it has really affected them. >> throughout history, women have typically been behind the man. let me get to do here is talk about the men behind the woman, but focus on her life and tell the story from her point of view. the fact that we get to do that, like she said, hope inspires people to do the same, and we know it does. >> the history chicks. >> monday night on the communicators. jerry mcinerney talks about legislation on data privacy and social media regulation. >> the american people feel like their privacy has been invaded,

and they are not wrong about that. not just the big tech companies but a lot of people have access to your data, and that means they know what sort of activities you do when you are not working, where you might frequent, what sort of things you buy at the stores. that is a lot of very private information that should not be in the hands of whoever wants to buy it. i think that is the reason we need to look at privacy. >> watch the communicators, monday night at 8:00 is on c-span2.