of government, funded by these television companies and more, including comcast. >> you think this is just a community center? it is way more. comcast is partnering with 1000 community centers to create wi-fi spots so students can get ready for anything. >> c-span is giving you a front row seat to the sea. >> coming up live today on the c-span networks, president biden speaks about covid-19 responses in the vaccination program at 1:15 p.m. eastern on c-span. at 3:00 p.m., nasa administrator bill nelson gives an update on space operations with a news conference to follow. on c-span2 at 3:00 p.m., look at

the future of conservative foreign policy, hosted by the american enterprise institute. >> coming up in one hour, kaitlynn glover of the national cattlemen's beef association on animal agriculture. at 8 a.m., dedrick asante-muhammed from the racial coalition on the racial wealth gap in the u.s. and his proposal to close that gap. ♪ host: good morning. it is wednesday, june 2, 2021. resident biden brought a national spotlight on tulsa, oklahoma, being the first president to visit the city on the 1921 race massacre. in the wake of that remembrance, we are spending our first hour reflecting on race relations in this country.

how do you think race relations have changed and have not changed over the past 100 years? lines are split regionally. eastern or central time zones, (202)-748-8000. mountain or pacific time zones, (202)-748-8001. you can also send a text, (202)-748-8003. if you do, include your name and where you are from. otherwise, catch up with us on social media. on twitter, it is --@cspanwj. on facebook, it is facebook.com/c-span. good wednesday morning. you can start calling it now. the wording for this morning's question comes from a question raised by oklahoma senator james lankford on the floor of the senate last week as he reflected on the legacy of the 1921 tulsa race massacre what it means today. this was the senator last tuesday on the senate floor. [video clip] senator: because when i started

speaking to individuals around the state about the tulsa race massacre, i start the conversation the same way. may the 31st and june the first of 2021, about six years ago, the entire country is going to pause. i do not know how long. they may pause for one hour, day or weekend, but the entire country will pause and look at tulsa and oklahoma and ask themselves one question, what has changed in america in race relations in the last 100 years? i said six years ago, that is a fair question for someone to ask. we'd better be able to answer it on may the 31st of 2021. little did i know six years ago when i started asking that question and continue to ask that question at five years, four years, two years and the next year, little did i know the events with race that would happen in the last 12 months.

in the awakening the nation has had and to what is still left undone in the issue of race in america. host: the senator james lankford reflecting. five city blocks robe learned, we are talking about -- five city blocks burned, we are talking about the legacy and how you think race relations have changed and have not changed. duncan is up first out of florida. duncan come good morning to. caller: good morning. good morning. i feel bad for what happened in tulsa in 1921, but today, i

cannot explain it exactly, but i am a white person. i am 36 years old. offhand, i know the white population is very poor, and when it comes to race relations, i think what is happening is why people are suddenly being less privileged and less treated fairly, and i think that is a mistake. unfortunately, i do not have much time. host: what do you mean when you say less privileged? that was dunking out of florida this morning. having this conversation with you, our viewers. phone lines split regionally. it is a conversation that has also happened on the senate floor and house floor, as well, in recent weeks and in tulsa, oklahoma yesterday. this from the house for last week. this is congressman richard torres, the democrat from new york, reflecting on the 1921 race massacre.

[video clip] congressman: it is a scandal in america that most americans have never heard of the tulsa race massacre, and as congressman johnson noted earlier, it has been referred to as a race riot, which is an attempt to whitewash the white supremacist, domestic terrorism at the heart of the massacre. so, we are here to tell the truth about the tolls agree with massacre -- about the tulsa massacre because we see a proper revision of history away from whitewashing as part of our national recognition -- reckoning with race in america. [end video clip] host: that was congressman torres on the floor last week we will show you more from. , oklahoma, yesterday, from congress -- we will show you

more from tulsa, oklahoma, yesterday, from congress, but most of you would like to hear from you. jerry in detroit, michigan, you are next. caller: good morning, john, and greetings from motown, yet again. i did watch president biden's speech regarding the tulsa race massacre, and race relations in america really have not changed all that much. i am a 56-year-old black man, and, you know, i have been watching "washington journal" for quite some time, and i think whenever the issue comes up regarding race relations, you will hear racist white people calling on the republican line, telling african-americans like me to "get over it," "forget the past," "move forward." i think the real way of moving forward is they want us to

pretend the past has never happened. well, the tulsa race massacre did indeed happen, and i would like to make another point, if i may, john, a lot of racist white people on the conservative side, you know, like to try to deny and whitewash things, and the thing they tried to do is pretend as if white people never ever hated black people. i would like to ask many of the white people calling on the republican line when in your entire life as a white person have you personally seen with your own eyes black people and white people interacting together and getting along with each other in perfect harmony? and if it wasn't, how is it the fault of people like barack obama? because often times during his

presidency, i have heard racist whites constantly blame him, accusing him of dividing blacks and whites as if it never happened before. i think what joe biden is doing is reminding them that something like the tulsa race massacre should never ever happen again. i think white people should remember that. that is all i have to say. host: that is jerry in michigan. olivia out of tara alter, west virginia, good morning. caller: good morning. host: go ahead, olivia. caller: hello? host: go ahead, ma'am. caller: yes, i do not believe there is a lot of racists in this country. i believe our politicians are stirring a lot of this stuff. i deal with colored people every day. don't have a bit of problems

with them. i think it is more the politicians in the news media that stirs this more than anything else. host: olivia, the question we asked is how have things changed the past 100 years? caller: i think it has changed, you know? before, whites cannot marry coloreds. you see children born every day, and they have been accepted into the world. i think a lot of things have changed. but i think it is because of the politicians and the news media especially that just keeps this going. host: do you think it was a good idea or president biden to go to tulsa yesterday on the 100th anniversary of the race massacre there? caller: i did not see nothing wrong with it. i did not see a thing wrong with that, but i am just saying that president biden, vice president

harris, president obama and them, the news media, they are a big problem. there are not as many racists as people would like to think there are, but they want the colored people against the white people. all you have to go back and do is read history. we have gotten over that. they need to get over that. they need to stop this stuff. you cannot change history. host: you use the term colored people, that is not a term much in use these days. caller: well, it is not a term that is much in use, you know, and i agree with that, but i am just saying i deal with them every day i don't have a bit of problems with them. love the ones i work with and stuff. get along good with them. host: pat is olivia i u.s. --n that is olivia and west

virginia. this was president biden yesterday in tulsa, oklahoma. [video clip] president biden: what happened in greenwood was hate and terrorism with a line that exists today still. close your eyes and remember what you saw in charlottesville four years ago on television. neo-nazis, white supremacists, the kkk, coming out of those fields at night with lighted torches, veins bulging as they were screaming, close your eyes and picture what it was. well, mother fletcher said when she saw the insurrection at the capitol on january 9, it broke her heart. a mob of a violent white extremists, thugs, reminded her of what happened here in greenwood hundred years ago. look around to various eight crimes against asian americans and jewish americans. hate that -- to asian americans

and jewish americans. hate that never goes away. jesse, i mentioned this to you after you pushed the voting rights act through with dr. king in the civil rights act, i thought we had moved. well, i did not realize, i thought we made enormous progress and i was so proud to be a little part of it. you know what, rev? i did not realize hate is never defeated. it only hides. it hides. >> tell the truth! president biden: i given a little bit of oxygen, just a little oxygen by its leaders, it comes out from under the rock like it was happening again, as if it never went away. folks, we cannot. we must not give hate a safe harbor. [end video clip] host: president biden yesterday in tulsa, oklahoma, having this conversation this morning, the question of how race relations has changed the past 100 years.

what has changed and what hasn't? phone lines split regionally or send us a tweet or text. bcvenice saying, "i don't think race relations are much different 100 years later. the face keeps changing but the substance is still there." deliver tony and saying, "well, it is true that things are slightly better. the difference between saying a police kneeling on some buddies that because they have been trained that black and are inherently more violent and stronger and just lynching and judicially is not that big of a step." this from jim, what has changed? the government forces a racial breakdown in every statistic they collect. for what purpose? those statistics serve to divide us, not unitas, and it needs to stop. this from bestia, "what has changed? apparently not much." from the opinion pages of "the wall street journal," the headline "the brutal stews racial catharsis over progress

for blacks." he writes, "the biden administration would much rather discuss white criminal behavior in tulsa 100 years ago the black criminal behavior it chicago or st. louis today. likewise in his selma address, president obama invoked high-profile police shootings, voter suppression, giving the impression that little had changed the past 50 years. his own election and reelection notwithstanding. liberals focus on this history of lack suffering rather than success because it helps democrats get elected and activists raise money. what is less clear is how any of this helps the black underclass improve its situation." jason riley, his column today in "the wall street journal." taking your phone calls, jeffrey out of parkersburg, west virginia, good morning. caller: yes sir. i do not think race relations have changed that much, but i really was calling to respond to the older lady from west

virginia who referred to "coloreds." to hear her from west virginia, racism is alive and well. that is all i have to say, have a good day. host: brian in michigan, you are next. good morning. caller: yeah, it is a funny thing, i don't think she should be calling people "colored," but let's look at colored, we try to get rid of some of that verbiage , probably in the 1970's, but now it is more pronounced. you cited that goal for saying "colored," well, that is the way she was brought up. we talk lack, white -- black, white while i hear brown, and i never hear yellow. you don't call the chinese yellow. what color are you going to put out for middle eastern people? my point is, we divide each other up like this.

it serves no useful purpose. host: do you think that color you were roof -- that caller you are referring to says it was the media and politicians that serves to divide us up for their purposes, do you think that is where it stems from? caller: definitely. you see it every day. they use it as a tool to divide us. let's go to math. i want you or any journalist to quantify us in math. how many so-called white people do you think are prejudice? how many? host: what do you think, brian? caller: i think it is far lower than you would ever dream. i have traveled all over the country, a lot of the world. people are good people. you are going to have some jerks, no doubt. i think the percentage is far lower than what the media is trying to put out. i think they make money off of it. i think it is getting very

tiresome and hurtful. i think it has always hurt the country. you have got jerks out there. marginalize them. host: do you think people are good people today? do you think people were not good people 100 years ago? how did this tulsa race massacre happen, and what does it say about people in 1921 and people today? caller: well, so, you want to go back 100 years. i would never dream of going back and judging my grandfather's time. i just cannot do it. there is no way. i was not there. you were not there. we can go by history books, i suppose, if you want to dredge something up from 100 years ago. to what useful purpose? i've got my brother here right now, 10 years older than me. i do not judge him that way, all right? i account for my own life. he accounts for his. now you want us to go back 100

years or 50 years and act like we are living in that time and we can change it? and then what is going on today? whatever he taking care of today? you cannot fix 100 -- what are we taking care of today? you cannot fix 100 years, it is gone. we have to fix it now. host: somebody who was there was ms. fletcher, 107 years old, testified on capitol hill about her memories of that day in 1921 and this is her testimony from two weeks ago and capitol hill. [video clip] ms. fletcher: on may 31 1921, i went to bed and my family some in greenwood. i felt asleep in that neighborhood that night and it was rich, not just in terms of wealth but culture, heritage, and my family had a beautiful home. we had great neighbors, and i had friends to play with. i felt safe.

i had everything a child could need. i had a bright future ahead of me. greenwood -- excuse me. yeah. still, greenwood had given me the chance to truly make it in this country. in a few hours, all of that was gone. the night of the massacre, i was awakened by my family. my parents and five siblings were there. i was told we had to leave, and that was it. i will never forget the violence of the white mob when we left our home. i still see black men being shot, black bodies lying in the street. i still smoke smoke and see fire. i still see black businesses being burned. i still hear airplanes flying overhead. i hear the screams.

i have lived through the massacre every day. our country may forget this history, but i cannot. i will not. and other survivors do not. our descendants do not. when my family was forced to leave tulsa, i lost my chance of an education. i never finished school past the fourth grade. i have never made much money in my country, state, and city took a lot for me. despite this, i spent time supporting the war effort in the shipyards at california, but most of my life, i was a domestic worker serving white families. i never made much money, but to this day, i can barely afford my everyday needs. all the while, the city of this tulsa have adjusted the used the

names and stories of victims, like me, to enrich myself and with my allies through the 30's, while i continue to live in poverty. i have a 107-year-old and have never seen justice. i pray that one day i will. [end video clip] host: 107-year-old viola fletcher two weeks ago on capitol hill. this was yesterday in tulsa in the picture on "new york times." viola fletcher watching joe biden speak his remarks on the 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre. one of the front pages focusing on this issue today, "usa today." their headline, "biden needs survivors of 1921 racist

atrocity." from "the washington times, "biden honors black victims of 1921 tulsa massacre." a wrap up there in "the washington times." members of congress tweeting their thoughts the past couple of days about this 100th anniversary. this is steve cohen, democrat from tennessee. "before the 100th anniversary of the tulsa greenwood massacre, i held a hearing to highlight the issue any justice. tulsa is a microcosm of what has happened to african-americans in the south, justice man's operations." suzanne bonamici, "it has been 100 years since the horrific tulsa massacre. the truth of this event was long denied, and we must reckon with our country's racist past. i encourage everyone to listen to the powerful words of survivors viola fletcher, and the others testified on capitol hill." this from congressman david

scott, the democrats saying, "as we reconcile with our nation struggling past and work toward a future free from racial violence, we commemorate the courageous survivors of the tulsa race massacre and recommit to our shared fight for social justice, peace, and prosperity for all americans." those tweets and more yesterday and in recent days about this, and we are asking you this question, reflecting on 100 years ago. 100 years of american history, what has changed through race relations in what has not? this is mark and lily, kentucky, good morning. caller: good morning. you know, it says in the bible, "god is made of one blood, all nations of men." i kind of felt that way. i hope people use this opportunity on the program to bring us together because we need -- the country needs to

come together, all people. there is getting ready to be a hard totalitarian turn in the place. we have been bombing the middle east for 20 years, and with little pushback from the american people. host: mark, so, what exist together on the issue of race in this country? -- what brings us together on the issue of race in this country? caller: i am not sure. we have to be good to each other and show our love for one another. that is what predominantly, as far as race relations, i think there is more love than hate. i am disappointed in issues like our former president and things. they do very little. they retire and they go to 40-acre estate on martha's vineyard.

they are not interested in doing anything. we have got to do this or -- afghanistan, like half of the people are not even literate. that is a race issue to me. we have got to come together. we are privileging this country. in love, let's come together and stop some of this stuff happening. we have more of us locked up then china or russia. more americans have other americans locked up than china and russia. we can make some things happen, and the power of our love together can do this. host: that is mark in lily, kentucky. paris, california, this is vicki. good morning. caller: good morning. the question is, has anything changed? no. it is actually worse. i have felt it and experienced it myself the day barack obama won, racism was up.

white people were hateful and disrespectful beginning that day, and now you see how many years later? a white policeman kills, literally kills on the air, how could it possibly be getting better? yes, i know about this massacre. my mother was born in 1914, so she knew about it. she was seven years old when it happened. all black people in oklahoma knew about it. you had john hope franklin on the air. i talked to him. he was four years old. his father was a lawyer. he went to selma. a few days later, his mother, and himself, and other siblings were supposed to go to tulsa and start a new life. he never saw his father again for a whole year. his father survived, you know? they went and they lived and you

had him on c-span. i interviewed him what about, 10, 15 years ago? host: you say it is getting worse, worse since 1921? what do you say to the callers -- you bring up the election of barack obama, but we elected a black president in this country. they will point to kamala harris in this country and the civil rights movement. why do you say none of that is making it better this country? caller: because it did not make it better! look, people are being killed! they are making up laws to keep us from voting, everything. everything in this country has been against black people. white people do not think black people are human. that is why they treat us this. host: you feel that way, you feel that way about all white people in this country?

caller: of course not! of course not, but the problem is the mitch mcconnell's, and that man who called from west virginia -- listen to him. i, i, i, the white race, the white ideology is about selfishness. it is about oppressing others, and they do not want to share. they feel their power is being taken away. why people think they should be powerful over everybody else forever. host: that is vicki in california. this is derek in bloomfield, new york, good morning. caller: good morning. appreciate you. i am speaking on behalf of all the africans, african-americans, or any type of race from africa. we all are one. when we talk about racism in the united states of america, and if you listen to me, you can hear i

have an accent. i was raised in africa and moved here 13 years ago. racism in america, there is, this is true. there is racism. but i will tell you something, the same african-americans complained about white oppression. they do not know what to do for the african. do they know what to do to africans when they come over here? i don't do it to them, they do it to us. but then how come all this goose brutality -- this police brutality? why isn't it i have seen one african pulled aside by the police? because we don't believe in that freedom of speech. we respect it. if a cop pulls you over, for example, your hands where you can see them, you cannot be a bully if you want to walk away.

host: that is derek in new york. in savannah, georgia, good morning. caller: good morning, how are you? god bless you. host: go ahead, solana. caller: i am concerned because this is still going on, racism. i am 103, and i have been in the struggle. i know it it is about. -- i know what it is about. born in south carolina, never went to school, always worked on the farm, picking cotton, chasing pigs, doing everything but getting an education, being a child, and i do not see too much of a change.

today i have 87 grandchildren and great-grandchildren. host: congratulations. caller: so we fought for everything we got. i sympathize with this country america because we have got to do better because god is watching us. all of us want to be loved, and all of us want to have the best that we can get, but the majority of us do not have it, and that is my problem. i am concerned about it, and i would love to see a day where people, people forget color. people. people all over the world. host: 103 years old. did you think we would be farther in race relations in this country by 2021? caller: i did. i did. i thought things would be much, much better. my mother worked all of her life. she died poor.

we are still poor and don't see no way out. i am not the only one. so, i do not know what we can do except love like god told us to do and change from what we are thinking. love is the key. host: can i draw on your 103 years of memories on this earth? what is the first time, the first memory you have about this issue of race in this country where it was apparent or discussed? do you have an early memory of that issue? caller: yes, i do. everyone i remember when we were at the plantation we lived on, the boss asked me to get him milk from the cow. i do not know how to milk a cow, but i had to go get some milk for the master because that is

what he wanted for his coffee, fresh milk. things happen when you are young, you do not forget. it is a memory, and i tried to not dwell on that because i have wanted my children to be successful in their life, to live life to the fullest, and do what they feel that is right because all of my children felt loved, loved, loved. love is the key to success. love is the key to happiness. everybody wants to love, if you do not give it, how can you get it? host: are you hopeful for the next 100 years for this country? caller: i pray that we do see a change in this country because all of my children want to be successful. they do not want to be poor.

they do not want to have to go work in the kitchen and make three dollars a day. they don't want that. they want to go to school, get an education and be successful and make life livable for their family and their children to come. host: 103-year-old solana out of savannah, georgia, thank you for the phone call. caller: you are welcome. god bless you and have a wonderful day. remember, god is love. love is the key to success. thank you! host: about 25 minutes left in this segment of "washington journal." you can keep calling in on this question, how have race relations change the past 100 years in this country? we did want to note some news that impacts that building over my shoulder, a special election that was held yesterday in new mexico. this is the story from "the

washington post." "democrats held onto a suburban house seat in new mexico yesterday with state rep melanie stansberry, easily winning the alb area district filled until this spring by now interior secretary deb haaland. stansberry defeated state senator mark moores." our victory will give a 220 seat advantage in the house, 220 for democrats and 211 for republicans, i should say a nine seat advantage. it is ahead of an expected summer push on infrastructure spending. two republicans supposed to run off in a vacant house seat in texas on july 27 two open seats in ohio split between the parties will not be filled until november, and a stately democratic seat in florida remains vacant until the january 2022 special election. that story on the house and the

majority and the democratic majority in the house impacts. this story on the front page of "austria journal," that ransom -- of "the wall street journal," that ransomware attack striking u.s. meat operations at jbs, the meatpacker hit by a ransomware attack and it took a big chunk of u.s. beef and pork processing off-line, sending buyers scrambling and raising pressures on meat supplies. the company said they were making progress towards restoring that systems, and the majority of the meat plants would be operational by today. coming up in 25 minute, we will focus more on the meat industry from the national cattlemen's beef association, joined by kaitlynn glover, to continue our conversation about the animal agriculture industry, its impact on climate issues, so stick around that discussion in 25 minutes. until then, we continue this

discussion. the question of how race relations have changed in the past 100 years? the wording for this question comes from a floor speech by senator james lankford, the republican from oklahoma, last tuesday. he was talking about the upcoming 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre, and he said the question he has been asking people in recent years leading up to this anniversary is this issue of race relations in this country. this is him on the senate floor last tuesday. [video clip] senator: because when i started speaking six years ago to individuals around tulsa and the state about the tulsa race massacre, i usually started the conversation the same way, it may 31 and june 1 of 2021, i would say about six years ago, the entire country is going to pause. i do not know how long, maybe a minute, one hour, a day, or a weekend, but the entire country

will pause and look at tulsa and oklahoma and will ask themselves one question, what has changed in america in race relations in the last 100 years? i said six years ago, that is a fair question for someone to ask. we do better be able to answer it when may 31 of 2021 comes. little did i know six years ago when i started asking the question and continue to ask the question when it was five years, four years, two years, and the next year, little did i know the events dealing with race that would happen in the last 12 months. in the awakening the nation has had, to what is still left undone in the issue of race in america. [end video clip] host: oklahoma senator james lankford last week on the senate floor ahead of yesterday's 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre. and today's front pages from

around the country focus on that issue. we will show you a few as we hear from more of your calls. this is kathleen out of new york. . good morning what has changed when it comes to race relations in this country the past 100 years? caller: well, umm, it is so sad. this segment, you know, is turning my stomach. [laughter] but, it just disgusts me to say this, but it is true, probably public display of lynching, right? they would take pictures, and, no, it has not really gotten better, better, no. one caller said 100 years ago, i am not going back 100 years.

well, why do we have history in school, you know what i mean? host: did you listen to that 103-year-old caller a few minutes ago? caller: yes, i love her! i love her, and i agree! host: she said she was hopeful, are you hopeful for the future? caller: yes. i have a beautiful grandson. of course, i am hopeful. without hope, we might as well just hang it up, right? but, you know, this whole planet earth, our country -- not just our country, but the whole planet, yeah, we look different on the outside, but, you know, we are the same on the inside. both of us put our feet on the ground in the morning and try to get through every day. is that what everybody tries to do? host: that is kathleen in new

york. this is matt in michigan. good morning. caller: good morning. i think this is a good question, and, you know, there is a lot that has changed and there's a lot that has not changed, you know? i think when it comes down to it, of course, this country has racist people in it, but then you have a majority of people who go about their day, and i don't think racism or the color of somebody's skin even crosses their mind until they hear it on the media or some politician like this hack in oklahoma who is out there lying in front of the camera. this guy is a fake politician, ok, that republican from oklahoma. the only reason he was even up there saying what he was saying

is because he was in front of a camera, and he had to say that because it is the 100 year anniversary of this incident that happened. and he is the oklahoma representative. but i can tell you -- host: matt? caller: yes? host: one of the things james lankford has been trying to do in his efforts in the state and leading up to this 100th anniversary is trying to get families to invite a family of a different race into their home and have a meal together and have conversations about race between families and at a dinner or lunch table. it is an effort he says will help with understanding in this country. is that a good idea caller: i think it is a good idea, but i think that happens

every day around the country nobody talks about or cares about it. for instance, where i live -- host: he talked about it on the senate floor. he asked that question. have you had a family of a different race at your dinner table? have you invited them into your home and talked about race at your table? has that happened? caller: i mean we have never talked about race. i have definitely had different colors of skin people in my house many times. just the other day, my neighbors, they are white, she likes black men, and her kids are half next -- who cares -- half mixed, who cares? i don't care fake it is mixed with black, asian or hispanic or whatever it is. if these people want to do what they want to do, that is their choice. we live in america, but i think that what i was just talking

about, interracial marriages and relationships, that has increased, which i think is fine. if two people from a different ethnicity love each other and want to have a family together, that is fine. 100 years ago, i don't think that was even possible, and today it is. there is still a lot of work and things that need to be done in this country, and i think you should show how racist our criminal justice system is because that is where a lot of racism stems from. host: thanks for the suggestion. a topic we have discussed before and i promise we will discuss again. a little bit more from senator james lankford from the senate floor last tuesday on what we were just talking about, his effort to invite other families

of different races into their homes for meals. this is senator langford. [video clip] senator: a national conversation about race is not something that happens on television. a national conversation on race happens at our dinner tables with our families. we should not expect that the nation will speak our race when our families are not. the best way for our families and to show our kids that this is normal conversation is to have a family over of another race to sit around the table. what i like to say to people is, we will never get all the issues of race on the table until we get our feet under the same table and just talk. i just get to know each other as friends. the nation will not shift on race relations until each of our families shift on race relations.

i continue to challenge this simple concept of solution sundays. by the way, if you would like to pick a different day, that is fine with me. it could be a good day to just invite someone over for dinner or lunch [end video clip] -- lunch. [end video clip] host: the junior senator on the floor one week ahead of the 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre. talking to you this morning about race relations in this country. how do you think they have gone the past 100 years? lauren, brandon, florida, good morning you are next. caller: i am on? host: yes sir. caller: first of all, i just want to say tulsa is not the only place this happened to. people are focusing on just one thing, that is part of the problem. you focus on one thing and you just gnaw at that until there is no meat on the bone. tulsa is not the only place. jacksonville, florida,

wilmington, north carolina, and there are countless other places that massacres, this kind of massacre, has happened. but, but, i mean, there are countless others. i take issue with those who want to say, let's just move on. let's just get past this. you really want me to disrespect my forbearers like that? would you? you really want to disrespect those americans who had to suffer through that? really? i do not see that in america, but i see you want to put that on a certain group. you want to put it on black folk, we don't do that. how can this country get better if you're going to deny this history? people say to me, thank you for your service, but then they state of florida want to stifle

my voting rights. i used to be able to take my wife' is valid along with mine, mail-in ballots, down to the polling place, box, put in there and she does not have to go, whatever. now, a law is stopping me from doing that. to make that a crime. now if i do it, i will go to jail, get fined or lose my voting rights. and you're trying to tell me there is no racial component to that? you know what? [laughter] listen, i am not a firebrand kind of person that thinks that everything is about race. matter of fact, i really do not care if you are racist or not. what i care about is the law. that is what i care about. i did not write the law. matter of fact, most people who do not look like me wrote that law and now you do not want to

honor it? are we crazy or what? that constitution was written by people who really do not look like me! but you don't want to honor it when it comes to me? and you want to talk about, well, let's just move on. no. we are not going to move on. host: this is ron out of west chesterfield, new hampshire. good morning, you are next. caller: good morning. "washington journal," i love the show. the 103-year-old lady from georgia, just what an asset. i could listen to her all day. wonderful person. god bless her. i guess i am in a little bit of a quandary. the fact is as long as we compartmentalize people, black americans, african --

italian americans, it does not matter your background, you are an american and at the. war -- you are an american and that the more. if you are white, nationalist, you have absolutely no more rights in this country than anybody else unless you are native american. you have no more right in this country than anyone else does. i have got to say, you had a guest on two weeks ago, and i really enjoyed him. he writes down the facts and everything, but somebody called and asked him, they said, listen, my grandparents, i don't think they have ever owned slaves, i certainly have not. why should i feel responsible? why am i to blame for all of this that went on 200 years ago? and then he came back and said, just because you do not own any slaves throughout your life does

not mean you have not benefited from being white all of this time. i have got to tell you, that struck me a little bit because i am poor. i bust my butt every day and bring home as much money as i can, like everybody else, but i am poor. it seems like they always have been. i have not got much of an education because i cannot afford it. i really have not seen where i have benefited from being white. i am a democrat. i love all of my fellow americans, black, white, green, does not matter. if you are an american, you are my partner in life because we are in this together. but, you know, it is just, if we do not look at the past, we are doomed to repeat it. we had to look at the past and recognize it. when it comes to the gentleman you just had on, he said, listen, you just want to move on? i am not up for moving on. what else is there?

if you go back to the past, that is what we are going to be doing, relieving the past -- reliving the past. we need to recognize the past and move on because otherwise we moved back forward -- we move backwards. black folks want reparations, i can understand that, they have been wronged through history. so have native americans, the chinese, just about everybody after the white people took over this country from the native americans. we would have to pay reparations to everybody. i'm sorry, go ahead. host: do you think we have properly recognize the past when it comes to the 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre? do you think president biden struck the right tone yesterday? caller: it is a beginning. you know, we have to recognize it and teach it in schools. it is what happened in this country, but we cannot change the past. we have to move on from it and

we have to find a way to move on from it. i do not see. if we start reparations for black folks, we will have to do it for native americans, the chinese to work on the railroads , the hispanics we brought over to work in everything else. many of them were not slaves but they were treated like slaves back then. we have to learn but we have to move on. we have to find a way past this. and further white nationals around here, you have no more internecine in this country than anyone else. you need to drop your pitchforks and burning crosses and join the rest of the country. we should just be americans, not white or black americans, just americans. host: that is ron, west chesterfield, new hampshire on eddie glotten, most -- eddie glaude, most recent appearance

on february 28, to talk about his book "begin again," but you can watch any of his videos at any time on our website at c-span.org. and to that caller's comment about our 103-year-old caller earlier, jeff might agree with you, saying that there should be a segment with 103-year-olds only calling in. terry is next out of texas. good morning. terry, you with us? one more time for terry, go ahead, sir. caller: hello? host: go ahead, ma'am. caller: i am here. listen, i am a 74-year-old veteran of vietnam. lived in texas all of my life. when i was in the 11th grade and younger, i had to go to the back

door, drink out of certain water fountains, and i did not even know that i was being mistreated until i joined the military. the first time that i ever felt like a true american is when i joined the military. i know white people like to say they don't see color, and my question to them is, would you like to live 100 years as a black man for 50 years as a white man? the majority would choose the 50 years. you cannot get rid of racism

because it is instilled in a lot of white people, trumpers, you cannot go to them and tell them, stop hating blacks because it is inner. racism will be here until the lord comes back. thank you so much. host: that is terry in texas. this is delouise in sun city, california. good morning. caller: can you hear me? host: yes ma'am. caller: i think things are changing, and the reason why i think things are changing -- i am going to try to get through this without crying -- when i watched george floyd being murdered, and when i looked at the expression on the officer's face he was murdering him and you cameras was all around him, and he still did it, but what helped me heal was seen people

of all colors, white, mexican, hispanic, asian, wise up and protest with the blacks against it. i have heard pastors say that there is systemic racism in this country, acknowledgment of the truth about what has happened to us in this country helps us heal. we have had some awful experiences, all of us, and to deny that racism no longer exists, all you are saying is my life experiences never existed. and you are doing the same thing. you are canceling me out. you are making me feel like i am nothing when you tell me my experiences no longer exist in america, so what helps me heal -- and i know seen people rise up with this is not the end, but it is the start and it gives us

hope that one day we will all unite and see people as human beings. one day. that is what has helped me heal the pain. host: how far away are we from that one day you think, years, 100 years? caller: you know what, i look at the millennium and their generation, it looks like every generation gets closer and closer. that is when i hear nationalists believe this is their country, no, it belongs to one generation after another because that is what brings about change. this next generation is going to be a bit closer than we were. the next generation is going to be a little bit closer than they were, and one day, one day, we will not see the color of a man's skin, but what is in his heart, his integrity, his character. one day we will get there, and i

believe it. i really believe it. thank you for allowing me to speak. host: time for just one or two more calls, gary, atlanta, georgia, go ahead. caller: yes, good morning, america. yeah, i just wanted to say to the white gentleman who called and said he don't see how he benefits from being white, let me tell you how. when you go to a grocery store, no one is following you around. when you spend two dollars and they say thank you, sir, please come again, and to the black guy who just spent $200, they throw him his change. when you see the police at 2:00 in the morning, you feel relieved. when i see the police at 2:00 in the morning, i feel anxiety. they had a survey, john, that took place a few years ago. they said if you put children in a room, white, black, asian, red man and leave them alone and let them race themselves, the least

form of dissemination they come up with his race. it is the most endless form of discrimination. they started way back when the -- we should have eradicated white supremacy after the civil war. but we didn't. we should have eradicated white supremacy after world war ii but we didn't. we allowed it to go. to most black people i say this, we are going to have to appeal to what's called spiritual justice. we are going to have to wait for the time to come where we can testify, in heaven, against white people according to their book of life they should not be in heaven. i told somebody this once and i mean it. if i die and go to heaven and they have white folks up there i want to tell god, to his face that it's not fair. host: why do you feel that way about all white folks? guest: who is innocent in a

lynch mob? nobody. how many innocent white people were in tulsa? nobody stopped. does not the first time that happened. new york city we had the draft riots were they got mad when lincoln changed the rules about why the civil war was being fought. this happened in atlanta, louisiana, florida, all over america. the reason that's important, that we have to go back and do that, now we have to adjust. host: that scary in atlanta, georgia. mimi is our last call from rocky top, tennessee. caller: --caller: first we need

to get the story straight. if you read the times reported the day after this happened, it's totally different from what hannibal johnson wrote about. they said there was 350 something bodies. there was a commission they had to investigate the whole thing. there was only 36 bodies. so --host: so historians have gone back and they believe that the count is closer to that 300 number. that it was intentionally undercounted afterwards. caller: historians were the 6019 project true and they know that's not true. they've been looking for the bodies were 100 years and haven't found them. people need to go back and read the true story. host: the question we asked, how have race relations changed in the past 100 years. caller: the thing you want to get is the truth, first appeared that ought to concern you.

get the true story and not what was written in this book and was made up. host: that's mimi, rocky top, tennessee. hannibal johnson was on this program back on monday to talk about the tulsa race massacre. his book, lack wall street, 100 american city grapples with historical racial trauma. program, it's all focused on the 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre. that's going to do it for the first segment of the washington journal. we will return this question to end the program. but we turn now to the issue of animal agriculture. we will be joined next by the national cattlemen's beef association's caitlin glover to talk about the impact of present biden's environmental agenda on the beef industry. we will talk about the racial wealth gap in the united states.

we had the national community reinvestment coalition who will join us with that discussion. stick with us. we will be right back. ♪ [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2021] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> book tv on c-span two has top nonfiction books and authors every weekend. saturday at 10:00 eastern on afterwards, in her book insanity defense, former congresswoman and security insider jane harman looks at pressing national security issues. she's interviewed by janet napolitano, the obama station. live at noon eastern on in-depth, a conversation with max hastings on his more than two dozen books on wars in the 20th century. including operation pedestal. in his book really good schools,

james tooley, the vice chancellor and president of the university of king him in england talks about private schools in poor countries, elevating their educational standards and setting an example that other countries can learn from. watch book tv this weekend on c-span two. coming up live today on the c-span network. president biden speaks about the covid-19 response and the vaccination program. that's at 1:15 eastern on c-span. bill nelson gives an update on space operations with the news conference to follow. on c-span two, a look at the future of conservative foreign-policy hosted by the american enterprise institute. >> washington journal continues.

host: to focus on animal agriculture with caitlin glover, the national resources executive director at the national cattlemen's beef association. first on the association itself, explain who you represent and what your group does here in washington and around the country. guest: good morning. thank you for having me. as you said, i'm from the national cattlemen's beef association, it's the largest trade organization and we represent members through beef and cattle production in the united states. we are a member driven organization from the grassroots and our communities all the way to washington. we represent a cot -- approximately 25,000 individual members but have more than 175,000 members in total across the country. we have affiliates and each state who deals with state focused issues. but they bring the tissues to us in washington, not only for things like nutrition, but land

policy. and really telling their story on a very national stage. host: how many members are cattle farmers themselves out there with cows? guest: this is a member driven organization, so we represent hundreds of thousands of cattle producers across the country. of that hundred 75, we have cattle producers, feeders, members involved in the processing site. so it's really a full sector representation from, as marketers like to call it, this farm to market. so it is a full sector representation. the vast majority which are local producers. we call them cow-calf producers. the mother cows have whole production on the ground on pastor who relieves -- you really -- who really are

environmental champions. host: i know you are focused on resources, what can you tell us about the story making front pages, the ransomware attack on meat operations and what that means for the industry? i know early in the investigation into that -- i know you're early into the investigation. guest: it is in the important thing is that we are monitoring the situation closely as we represent our members and are involved in a lot of the policy in these discussions, not only making sure they are a sustainable business environment for producers, but also for consumers. we continue to monitor the situation. but we don't have any additional information that has been released at this time. host: i know you are on the west the capitol building behind you and your background. your focus on capitol hill, what are you pushing congress on now? guest: there's a variety of

priorities. as we look at the work that the organization does with capitol hill, with the administration. our focus is to make sure that as we are looking at environmental regulations and things that congress and the administration want to do, that the entire scenario that legislative and let regulatory scenario not only recognizes the facts on the ground but also creates an environment for growth and innovation. and really puts our producers but also the consumers in the best place to succeed and have accessible and highly nutritious beef, beef products for them to choose from. but also to continue to be environmental caretakers, the stewards of landscapes in a way that is perhaps not always the easiest or most visible story to tell. we work with congress on things from endangered species, to

taxes, to transportation. on the natural expert. i have the grass in the species and the soil and the carbon type discussions on my plate. as i'm in california this morning, at the top of that list on my list of the morning is the concept of soil health and forage health. all of those questions in respect to catastrophic wildfires that we have seen increase in both number and size over the last several decades. host: if viewers have questions about the beef industry or these issues that we have been talking about yesterday and today, the phone lines are open and caitlin glover from the national cattlemen's beef association is here to answer your phone calls. for republicans (202) 748-8001. for democrats (202) 748-8000. for independents (202) 748-8002.

yesterday, was cory waterman with friends of the earth who was on to talk about these issues. this question came up. his cattle farming bad for the environment? how much of u.s. greenhouse gas emissions does cattle farming account for? guest: the estimates are not counting some really important sources of admission -- emiss ion. they've not counted the carbon opportunity cost, the land that goes into corn and soy, what would be the alternative use? it could be bringing carbon into the soil instead of being a net admit or -- emitter. the number the cattlemen for two is undercounting the impacted methane.

that's a potent greenhouse gas and livestock production is the greatest source of methane pollution in the country right now which is just a greenhouse gas that we have to control in short order if we are going to be successful in addressing climate. host: that was clary waterman yesterday from friends of the earth. guest: i will begin a little this morning with a bit of a fact-check. when we look at the united states be production scenario, what we see from the epa data that has repeatedly shown where the emissions profile is overlaid, we see that beef production, cattle production in the united states is responsible for about 2% of our entire portfolio. when we look at beef production in comparison to things like transportation or electricity generation, which have her at that 30%, what we see is not only a compared -- hover at 30% we see a comparative benefit

because it is so efficient and environmentally friendly at 2%. but i think there is the opportunity as well to talk about what was not captured in the 2%. she makes an interesting point about what's not measured in the 2%. what's not measured are all of the other associated benefits from cattle production. what's not quantified are the different land cultivation and management on landscapes that cannot be used to grow food for humans. it's not an opportunity cost where we are choosing between cattle production and beef production and corn or soy or other grains. by and large, cattle are on land that are marginal. that cannot be used for production of human food. what they do is take the forage,

in a really highly efficient way and turn it into something that's highly nutritious for humans while providing environmental benefits. chloe talked about this yesterday but i think there's an opportunity to have a more holistic conversation about what cattle and beef production interact with the environment. this happens on marginal landscapes. land that would not otherwise be cultivated. these are the range lands. these are pasture based systems that really depend -- to get a little technical, but really depend on huff compaction -- hoof compaction. as cows want they integrate organic matter into the soil and that increases opportunity first soil carbon retention. integrating the organic matter, improving the carbon soil health

and that storage potential across these landscapes that are not or cannot be used for other production is really quite amazing. when we look at the emissions profile, you see the 2%, a highly efficient low emissions industry with all of these other benefits that are not represented in that number. host: present biden has announced a goal of cutting greenhouse gas emissions in half by 2030. what does that mean by your into it -- for your industry and your farmers? guest: what that means for our industry, and our farmers and ranchers is that they need to be able to do and continue doing what they do. when the president set the goal of cutting emissions, at the same time there's all these other climate conversations are happening and are associated but maybe not directly related to

the emissions reductions discussions. as i said earlier, and certainly as americans but also his cattle and beef producers, there's an incredible relationship between transportation and infrastructure and energy production. but really when we look at emissions and the reduction potential of that time period, it's not cattle and beef production that's going to get us to those reduction targets because our producers, our system is so highly efficient already. our producers look for opportunities to improve their efficiency to reduce emissions. to be more climate friendly or environmentally friendly. but it's not going to be the tipping point. because our baseline is already so good. host: this is the bookend on our today discussion on animal agriculture. caitlin glover is joining us

from the national cattlemen's beef association. we have plenty of calls free already for the next third -- for you already. we will take as many phone calls as we can. this is kim, colorado, republican, good morning. caller: good morning. i work in the cattle feeding sector, the cattle feeder i work for is committed to producing cattle in a way that we get to be good stewards of the environment and we care for those animals and obviously a big can serve as air quality and public perception of feed yards. we do a yacht -- we do a lot here to help us recollect water and have dust control and we do everything we can through some new and improved technologies to do this in the best way we can. what would you say to someone who is concerned about air quality. particularly related to the feed yard sector or cattle production? host: that's an excellent question. miss glover?

guest: thank you. i live in washington, d.c.. i am previously your neighbor to the north from wyoming. we have these big open skies, these very clean skies with fresh air outside. when i talk to someone about production either in the west or around feed yard or really anything through sector, what i tell them is that we are concerned about air quality teedo below -- too. just like a lot of other groups are. the story that i'm able to tell is because of the good work that you and your organization, your company do in order to make those demonstrable benefits. whether you are talking about reducing dust pollution which is prevalent in the west, or whether you are talking about applying grazing into scenarios

where you are reducing these fine fuels, grasses and shrubs that are dead that make catastrophic wildfire move so quickly and so much more intensely. what we are really doing is trying to control, and very successfully controlling those particular matters. also through reducing the risk and intensity of the fires. those are big polluters that put a lot of carbon and particulate matter into the atmosphere. because of the good work that our producers do across the country there's a lot of different stories to tell like this, whether you're in florida or oregon. that's the story i tell because it's a good one to tell. host: to the lone star state, this is tyler, in brackett mill, texas. independent. caller: thank you for doing this

segment. i grew up in the cattle industry and i believe in the benefits of eating beef but many of my friends do not. i was wondering if you could hand on should americans eat beef? and you've shown the environmental impact, maybe that's why some of my friends are afraid to eat beef. could you expand on that? guest: that's a great question. i think depending upon the age bracket i think we are seeing this increasing or this return to wanting to know where our food comes from. to being very concerned and wanting to know more about what that production scenario looks like. there's two things that i would say to someone concerned about the environmental impact of beef . but also who would maybe have questions about the nutritional component as well. when we look at the dietary guidelines, and we look at independent science and university science and

government science through the usda and dietary guidelines pre-we see recommendation for nutrient dense, highly efficient healthy food that we put into our bodies. nourishing ourselves with the most nutrient dense food we have. one of those is beef. nutritionally people should feel very good about what they are into their body. it is safe, healthy, nutritious, available. consumers are going to make their choices. some are going to make different choices. but they can be confident in the nutritional components of beef in the united states. it's exactly what we've been talking about this morning. people should feel very good about the environmental component. not only are they consuming a product that's healthy and good for them. but it's during an environmental service across the landscape and

in some unexpected ways. host: on the nutritional aspect, aubrey on twitter asked that when will all american beef producers stop using hormones in production and not just organic beef producers? guest: it's an interesting question. when we talk about consumer preference there's also the production difference. when we're talking about hormones or antibiotics what producers are looking for is the opportunity to have highly efficient, very healthy cattle on their operations. we had a few cattle producers call in this morning. when we look at the conversion to organic beef, or we talk about what pasture raised beef is. there's a couple of things that lead me to the answer of this question. first, when we talk about how cattle are produced, all cattle regardless of where they are spend at least some time in

their life, usually that first year of their life on pasture. on grass, eating this green wrasse -- green grass in open pastures. they really began in the grass fed scenario. whether they are grass finished or organic or finish in a feed yard, that production scenario is not only highly regulated but is carefully managed. to make sure that cows and livestock are as healthy as possible. when we are talking about the feed opportunities, not only to make beef production more efficient but to maintain the standard not only for animal welfare but production expectations, there are differ in options. not everyone production scenario will fit for every producer across the country.

but what's important i think is the end product. the good environmental benefits, those affordable, nutritious food supplies. you go to the grocery store and you expect high quality american beef on the shelves. and really that consumer confidence is built through additional knowledge and how cattle are produced. whether you're in florida or where it's a more swampy -- in florida, where it's a more swampy scenario. or place like montana which is high desert and mountain grazing. host: we have about 15 to 20 minutes left. lorraine, a democrat, from pennsylvania. go ahead. caller: cows are capable of forming relationships. they are able to predict the weather. they eat appropriate plants when they are sick.

how do you morally justify eating sentient beings, not to mention the horrific factory farming conditions that most conduct a brief and sad lives in? guest: go back to the second part of your question first when we talk about factory farming. when people talk about factory farming and beef duction -- and beef production, that's not an accurate term. cattle, when they are in the first stage of production, they live on grass. they are on pastures. there are fee yard -- feed yard finished which is more environmentally friendly way to finish cattle. but there's a variety of different production scenarios. none of which include the factory farming.

this visual of cattle coming out of the warehouse. they are exchange and. -- x stringent -- they are very stringent and there's a lot of pride in holding up production standards for animal welfare, health, and animal husbandry and quality. we make sure that not only, organizationally, but from a compete -- community that we uphold those standards. returning to the moral question, and there are some perhaps who may ask this question of themselves and certainly consumers have the ability to make choices based on their own scenario. but they can be very confident that when they are looking at american beef, it is a happy cow who has been humanely raised and responsibly raised. and then make decisions based on fact rather than emotion.

we have in this country the ability and wonderful opportunity to have very nutrient dense, efficient food. in being able to make those choices, that's really the heart of what we do. we provide a high-quality product. and consumers make those choices. host: what are your thoughts on plant-based beef alternatives? how much of a bite, as it were, has it taken out of the beef industry? guest: i like the pun, this morning, john. it's probably not even a nibble rather than a bite this morning. when we look at plant-based alternatives, there are certainly a lot of different products on the market. if you go to the store you could see a new product almost every day. but the turnover is incredible

pdc products coming in and out really based on consumer preference or lack of consumer preference. but what we have seen is a continually growing demand for high-quality nutritious beef. consumers are going to choose what they will. that when we are talking nutritionally and in terms of a stable, predictable supply, beef has it in every corner. your plant-based proteins, your alternative products are going to come and go. but when we talk about protein and sodium content and what's going to fill bellies in the most efficient, enjoyable and healthy way, it's going to be beef every time. host: in white city, kansas, debbie, a republican. good morning. caller: as a mom, wife, and a rancher, i'm incredibly proud of

the work that my family does to conserve the land that we raise cattle on. but i often hear about folks that have concerns and they are regarding environmental sustainability and cattle production. can you guess talk about how cattle producers are a climate solution in regards to land management and carbon sequestration, specifically. host: sure, how many head of cattle do you raise before you go? caller: around 500. host: how long have you been doing it? caller: our ranch was founded in 1890. we've been taking care of it since the 1980's. so for 130 years of the same family taking care of the same land. it is family owned. i'm waiting on my son to come over so we can talk about what chores are today. so we work directly, handing it down to the next generation. host: is your son planning to take it over at some point? caller: he is.

he's doing a great job. we call him the ranch manager today and i'm really proud that we've done a good job incorporating him, learning, making decisions, he really cares about the land and the cows and that's what matters. host: thanks for the call. kaitlynn question mark guest: -- kaitlynn? guest: you used an important word where people continue to make policy but also how we conceive of cattle production in the country. debbie called them climate solutions or climate innovative practices. when looking from a policy perspective about how to talk about cattle as a climate solution within federal policy, what we see is a real desire to quantify those benefits. u.s. grazing land is the subject

of many discussions across the halls of congress, but also in the administration and agent as well. when we look at cattle being used as a tool to achieve certain environmental outcomes, what we sees that it's really effective. debbie talked about her more than 100 year history of her family on this landscape. because their livestock has been on this landscape, that's prevented encroachment from other development. that has prevented encroachment from other croplands or agriculture lands where we would have seen a permanent loss in the potential for things like carbon storage. u.s. grazing lands are estimated to hold between 10% and 30%, depending on the year in the scenario, 10% to 30% of the

world's soil carbon. that means that the soil holds the carbon in and takes it from the atmosphere and it holds it. that means it's healthy. but also not in the atmosphere. we talk about forests and swamps and these wetlands as carbon safes. when we talk about livestock production and we have this long history of presence on landscape that presents loss -- prevents loss and helps it, we are seeing this direct link between cow production and a climate friendly but also protective role for producers. simply put, whether congress or the administration are able to quantify it without cattle producers and these people and their livestock, the climate goals would not be achievable. host: we talked about the bite

-- we talked about the biden administration. this is the agriculture secretary's second run. are you glad that he's back in that role? what's your issue with him from the obama ministration? guest: regardless of who is in the chair, that individual is going to be important. we were pleased to see secretary vilsack reprise the role. when we talk about the department of agriculture were not just talking about producer regulations. we are talking about plants, school nutrition programs, the full-featured conversation about how americans feed themselves and how we make sure that that food is available for them in the healthiest and most efficient way. sec. vilsack has experience.

he was able to hit the ground running in a way that a new secretary may not have been able to do some wood because of his experience. through the obama administration , we dealt with the obama administration and sec. vilsack on a variety of issues. i think what we hate -- what we have seen from sec. vilsack and the biden administration is the recognition that the president has set environmental goals. and sec. vilsack acknowledges and supports the good work that agriculture's purdue -- agriculture's due in pursuit of those climate goals and healthy environments. there's a clear recognition because of his experience, because he knows what happens on the ground, that without cattle producers the biden administration would have a difficult time meeting these climate goals.

not because we are looking at an emissions reduction, but because there is a potential for conservation across landscapes, for improving carbon storage and soil health and keeping these landscapes open and healthy and productive for wildlife and for these multiple uses. sec. vilsack has been able to hit the ground running and we have been able to appreciate the work he has done so far. we continue to have a lot of issues on our plate, quite literally, that we share with usda. so we continue working with him to make sure that cattle and beef producers have what they need and are not unnecessarily burden simply because there is a regulatory or a desire to move forward in a way that's maybe not the best step. host: to kevin, in new york, i democrat. caller: my name is kevin.

my telephone number -- host: do you want to get out your telephone number on air? caller: i want to speak on how the populace is being affected by the messaging system as with cryptology and how that integrates with how -- host: tell you what, we will stick to animal agriculture as our topic as we have less than 10 minutes left with kaitlynn glover. let's go to max, in washington, d.c.. caller: my question is about water and water consumption from the beef industry. how much research is going into how much water it takes to produce a certain amount of beef growing from not just the cow but the food -- the water it

takes to make the food as well? guest: this is a great question. i'm gonna pull it back not just from water research but to all research. the cattle producers not only through ncba but through a lot of other institutions as well do a lot of different research on plant material, feed, on a variety of inputs like water and land. they have a lot of different research that's ongoing. weather -- we started at the baseline of a very good environmental practice. but i producers have shown that they have a dedication to doing more and being better and going further in this scenario. i will return to watering just a moment. but for example, in the last 30

to 37 years we have seen cattle production, the emissions reduced by 40%. some to by virtue of applied work and increasing efficiency. going forward into the future are producers are looking for ways to be more efficient. to use less water or to use it more strategically entity do the same with feed -- and to do the same with feed and timing. when we look at water, i'm in california so i think it's appropriate to talk about watersheds and the other water issues happening across the wet -- the west. we are seeing an immense drought. possibly one of the worst in the last decade. water is potentially going to be scarce. it comes from snowpack in the west. the runoff has to be used strategically as it moves

downstream. what we see is that the water is more efficiently and better lay stored, stays in the aquifers, those water tables much better when soil is healthy. when you have the high organic matter and the high forage density on lands. the best example i can give is when you look at a forest scenario, you have healthy trees we have the spine and the -- the pine and the spruce. and you look across the mountain because these trees are dead and have been burned. the water moves more quickly through those soils that have been burned and don't have live organic matter than those healthy forests. the water stays and is more productive and is more efficient

as it moves downstream. cow have a direct relationship, maybe not like the bark beetle, but the direct relationship to make sure that they don't burn as intensely which compromises the water moving through the water table. and the watershed. so when we talk about water, research is ongoing. it is something where ncba is investing and certainly where producers are investing and it's -- it's concentrated in those areas where the resource dedication and interest is highest. host: we are running we have a couple of callers, they are both from the garden state. pat, on the republican line, go ahead. caller: we have beef products, it also goes to the dairy industry. what's the policies, is there

any difference between farming for beef and dairy? host: and this is john in trenton, new jersey, democrat. caller: thanks for having me. it's more of a question, how is this ransom deal going down? and how does this affect the beef intake question i don't understand what this is about. and ask your guest how we can prevent it from happening. host: thank you for that. kaitlynn glover, which one you want to take first? caller: let's talk a bit about the -- beef and dairy. we represent cattle and beef producers. there's no question that there's a clear relationship between dairy and beef production. what we do at the local level, when you have farms next to each

other but also in organizational level, we work with our partners with other proteins and other act spaces to make sure that we have this full sector response. this full sector position on a lot of different issues. we talk about beef production in this country and it's highly efficient. while we have immense opportunities to work with other proteins and other groups as well, the primary focus will always be beef producers, cattle producers with the best business environment but also the best climate and ecosystem environment to raise their product. in new york, and especially the northeast, we do see some overlap between dairy and beef,

particularly entering the supply chain at the end for those dairy cows. so we do work together to make sure that the economic environment, but also that business environment is still a verbal in their opportunities. and i think the transition moves into the second question, the economic scenario. this question of what happened with the ransomware? what is it going to mean for me producers but also beef consumers. the people who want to go to the grocery store and purchase these really quality products. like i said, there are experts working on this. there are a number of folks working with the affected company to determine what happened and how to keep it from happening again. ncba is not involved, is not affiliated with that company, we

are monitoring the situation for our producers and for the consumers as well. but i am the grass and soil expert. not the cybersecurity. i will leave it to the experts to make sure that we have a full picture of what happens. i think it's the consumer confidence that regardless of some of these other issues that are happening, the constant is this high quality product where they could have great confidence because they know these producers are protecting these open spaces. they are keeping the things that make this country so great, these open spaces, the wildlife, the very high quality production , cattle producers are the ones who are caretaking and protecting that legacy into the future.

as we are talking about some of these very hard issues moving forward, i appreciate the opportunity to join you today to talk a little bit about why these producers are leading the way in these climate, environment, and conservation conversations. host: book ending are today panel on animal agriculture. we appreciate your time this morning. guest: thank you. host: up next on the washington journal, we turn to the issue of the racial wealth gap in the united states. our guest joins us from the national community reinvestment coalition. stick around for that. we will be back. ♪

>> c-span's landmark cases explores the stories and constitutional drama behind significant supreme court decisions. you can watch key episodes from our series sunday at 10:00 on c-span. schenck the united states allows the government, particularly in times of war to limit freedom of speech. the court upheld the conviction of charles shank, who had leaflets to discourage young men from joining the draft during world war i. you can watch online, or listen with the c-span radio app. >> on sunday, a military historian will be our guest on in-depth. >> the 1975 fall of saigon inflicted humiliation on the planet's powerful nation. revolutionaries prevailed over

western wealth and hard work. on the evening of the 29th of april, fugitives ascended to a rooftop helicopter to secure the place among the symbolic images. for me, and all of my generation of war correspondence, the struggle was among the most foremost experiences of our careers. i was one of those flown out of the u.s. embassy on that terrifying day. >> his most recent book is the same operation pedestal. other books include catastrophe 1914: europe goes to war, chastise, the dam buster story from 1943, and overlord: dj and the battle for normandy. you can join in on in-depth, live at noon eastern on sunday with max hastings on book tv on c-span two be sure to visit c-span shop.org to get copies of

books from our featured offers -- authors. >> washington journal continues. host: dedrick asante-muhammed joins us now with the national community reinvestment coalition who serves as a fellow for the institution of policy studies. " from the 2020 federal reserve report on this issue of the racial wealth gap in america, this is what it said, long-standing and substantial wealth disparities between families in different racial and ethnic groups were little changed since the last survey in 2016 p the typical white family has eight times the wealth of the typical black family and five times the wealth of the typical hispanic family. how did we get here that the typical white family has eight times the wealth of the typical black family? guest: the question is more what did we not do to remain with

this great disparity. i was like to say, i heard the conversation earlier this morning about racial inequality. the foundation of racial inequality is racial economic inequality. the foundation of racial economic inequality is the racial wealth divide. we have had this deep wealth and equality in our country since its beginning. it sounded -- it is founded on racialized wealth and equality where african people made the wealth of whites. where indigenous lands were taken to be utilized for private wealth by a white immigrant. so the racial wealth is part of the foundation of the country in the great sadness is how little the country is done to bridge the deep inequality. host: what about the past year? what did the pandemic mean to the issue of the racial wealth gap? guest: what it means is pretty much what it means for every crisis. when you have low levels of wealth, estimates not including

depreciating assets, african-americans have about $9,000 in median wealth. any type of economic pump -- bump or international pandemic will have more severe consequences because you don't have much money to fall back on. that's what we saw with covid, the great recession, with small recessions, it just multiplies the deep economic instability of african-americans and latinos. host: dedrick asante-muhammed is our guest, you can go ahead and start calling in. you mention -- we mentioned your work with the national community reinvestment coalition and the institute for policy studies. will you give a one-on-one on they do? guest: they are different organizations read institute for policy studies was a think tank founded in the 60's with a wide breadth of analysis. it has a great website page,

inequality.org that looks at different aspects of economic inequality. i am employed at the national community reinvestment coalition which was founded in 91 by john taylor. it's focused on advancing community economic development across the country and being a major advocate around the community reinvestment act. host: you mentioned the conversation at the top of our show. based on president biden's visit to tulsa for the 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre, as part of his remarks at that event he announced a couple of initiatives aimed at black communities and this issue of the racial wealth gap. here's about two minutes of president biden from yesterday. [video clip] president biden: we are announcing two expanded as thirds -- efforts targeted towards black wealth creation will help the entire community. the first is that my ministration is launching an aggressive effort to combat

dissemination and housing. everything from redlining to the cruel fact that a home owned by a black family is too often appraised at lower value than a similar home owned by a white family. [no audio] -- [applause] present biden: and i might add i can't figure this one out congressman, if you live in a black community and there's another one on the other cited the highway that the white community built by the same builder. and you have a better driving record and the guy with the same car in a white community, you can pay more for your auto insurance. shockingly the percentage of black american homeownership is lower today in america then when the fair housing act was passed 50 years ago. lower today. that's wrong. we are committed to changing that. just imagine, building

generational wealth. we made it impossible to buy a home and build equity and provide for families. and small businesses are the engine of our economy that move our communities. as president, my administration oversees hundreds of billions of dollars in federal contracts for everything from refurbishing aircraft carriers to installing railings and federal billings to professional services. i won't go into it all because there's not enough time but i am determined to use every taxpayer dollar assigned to me to spend going to american companies, and american workers to build american products. and part of that is increasing the share of the dollars the federal government spends to small disadvantaged businesses, including black and brown small

businesses. we are close to 10%, we are moving to 15% of every dollar spent. host: dedrick asante-muhammed, that was president obama it down that was president biden announcing those initiatives, will they make a difference? guest: homeownership is very important. it's important that he recognizes that african-american homeownership is at about 44% to 45% whereas homeownership rates amongst whites are at 73%. i don't think the primary problem is the evaluation of value of homes, though that should be investigated and looked at. i think the problem is when the median wealth of african-americans is 9000 and the medium house income is 45,000. that's not much money to purchase a home. we will have to have a serious investment to help with downpayments and increase that

affordable housing supplies so we can have a boom in african-american homeownership, hopefully latino homeownership. whites became majority homeowners through massive government investments and restructuring mortgage programs allowed whites to move from minority homeowners at 40% to majority homeowners at over 50%. i think the same thing will have to occur in the 21st century for the first time being racially inclusive. it will require more of the homeownership front. in the small business space, i've read that he's talking about a next or $20 billion a year for small disadvantaged businesses. that's a positive step. we need more clear analysis of what percentage of that money is going to latino businesses, african-american businesses, and other businesses that might fit under that rubric. obviously we will need more than that. host: for the visual learners,

this chart from inequality.org, look at these three columns. this is black homeownership in 2016. in the low 40 percentages, this has not changed much at all since 1983. to the left is white homeownership. that's the 70 some percentile from 1983. latino homeownership is the far right column in the low 40's as well. but up significantly from 1983. are there any lessons they are? what caused that jump in latino homeownership? can they be applied to black homeownership? guest: i think we are still learning. latino homeownership was -- and latino wealth was lower than black wealth until sometime in the 2000s. and one challenge with latino numbers is that we are often looking at new populations.

the population in 1983 is very different than the population in 2003 in terms of immigrants and what they represent. i think one of the big differences is where latinos live. often times, african-americans are still more in urban areas. particularly in the northeast, south, suburbs, while latinos are more likely to be in suburban and rural areas where there is higher level of homeownership. there are things to learn and investigate, but also different situations and scenarios. host: a racial wealth gap in this country, that's our topic. we have this conversation until the bottom of the hour. we start with wilma, out of florida. you're up first with dedrick asante-muhammed. are you with us? caller: yes. host: go ahead. caller: i'm fine.

host: turned on your television and go ahead with your question. we will let you figure that out as we go to darnell, in san jose, california. good morning. caller: how are you doing? what's up dedrick? i was wondering, i wonder where you guys always talk about -- are always comparing blacks to whites and owning this and owning that. did you guys forget about the asians? are the asian people invisible? i live in the san fernando valley and it's overpriced. we owned the house but we get paying -- but we are paying $14,000 a year in property tax. we basically never on the house

and we are white. host: dedrick asante-muhammed? guest: i did miss some of that. for asian americans i would check out the asian american wealth divide snapshot which you can find on the ncrc website. i focus on blacks, latinos, and native americans because those of the ethnic groups with the usually the greatest economic disparity. asian americans have much closer homeownership rates to whites, i think in the high 60%. not quite what whites have that much closer. host: to baltimore city, maryland, this is leroy. caller: we were talking about homeownership. this is what i've noticed. the asian, the spanish, african,

anybody that comes to this country, they are coming here with -- look, i've been living here my whole life. my credit score is good but a lot of us don't have good credit. but-- when these other people ce here, they give us a leg up. getting a leg up there whole life to help them get out. so, by then good -- getting a leg up, that is why they seem to prosper a little bit more. it's held against us, they pull the credit record and say this, this, this, this. the guy coming into the country with a clean slate, let's give him a leg up. host: dedrick asante-muhammed, you want to take that? caller: we did a snapshot -- guest: we did a snapshot called immigrants and the racial

divide. the basic analysis that i put forward is that immigrants who come here with highly skilled, highly trained with income, they do well, they have good income and high owner -- high homeownership rates. those who come without it don't do as well in part of the challenge is we are in a very regressive economy. it's been a big challenge for african-americans in those who experienced racism in this country because as the country bifurcated more and more, over the last 40 years we have seen a regressive economy keep lacked progress from moving forward in what we similarly see his immigrant communities, if they come in lower income, they stay lower income and are given the negative consequences of a regressive economy but with a high income they do much better and i think that's what you are seeing in terms of different immigrant groups and how some are doing much better than those, black, white, or latino,

who have been here for a long time because they may have come with high skills into their regressive, elite part of the economy. host: going back to your charts, one thing that african-americans have in this country is a larger student debt burden. these charts here, african-american men and women, the debt ridden is above $35,000 for either and you can see how that compares to whites, closer to the 30,000 dollar range, asian americans more in the $20,000 range for men and women. why is that? guest: of course, why that would be is if african-americans have such lower wealth, they have to borrow more just to get into higher education as african-americans borrow a low -- larger proportion for their mortgage. it's very similar, african-americans and latinos borrow more to get to be a part

of these wealth building vehicles and have less equity in their home. there is also less value given to blacks with a college degree or black homes compared to whites. it's a challenging situation and it is something that we need to address, particularly at looking at colleges being made more affordable and particularly free. host: you mentioned wealth building vehicles. what's a baby bond? guest: there are two economists that really helped bring this to the public like. cory booker put forth a bill to give i think all americans $1000 of a baby bond, any americans born get about $1000, depending on their household income level. then they would get maybe another 2000 or less each year. the idea is that when people become 18 or 25, become a

certain age, they would have capital to help them move forward in their lives, whether it is to go to college or buy a home. you have her jet -- jesse jackson say it's challenging to be a capitalist economy without capital and a baby bond would be an important instrument for the 21st century to give all americans a greater opportunity to move forward and particularly help those in deep asset poverty to help bridge the inequality we have been talking about today. host: new baltimore, michigan, holly, good morning. caller: yes, i have a lot to say. first and foremost, how can somebody control how somebody else spends the money? why not call it what it is. i think sometimes people have poor spending habits. they spend their money on hair, nails, eating out and food choices. you can't control that.

you talk about have an have-nots . because i spend fiscally responsibly doesn't mean somebody else is going to do that and we need to start teaching kids in school economic responsibility, fiscal responsibility, not to spend what you don't have with credit card debt. host: you think poor spending habits are the reason for the racial wealth gap in this country? caller: it can be. yes, yes i do. i don't tickets or racial wealth gap, i think it's a gap. guest: but it is a racial wealth gap. there are other wealth gaps. gender wealth gaps. concentration of wealth in high income versus low income whites. i do not believe, it is not about financial literacy. we can look at the history of the country and understand that discrimination and disenfranchisement through policy, corporate and individual

practice that has created the situation. i do not believe financial education will solve the problem but i do think that part of it should be understanding the reality of inequality and what it will take to help bridge that and i think anyone could use better understandings of our increasingly complex economy but part of that is understanding the structural inequality that has been proliferating over the past 50 years. host: we began this conversation talking about the gap in 2020 and the federal reserve report upon -- report said it hadn't changed much but can you sort of expand the view backwards and perhaps for words as well? is this something that you expect to grow in the years to come? how much has it grown until now? guest: that's the most upsetting aspect, most people if they talk about race and acknowledge and equality they might not take -- they might say that we are not bridging it as fast as we want

but we are going in the right direction. wealth inequality, looking at it, it's increasing, particularly racial wealth inequality and we are on board to kind of continuing economic apartheid in this country. using depreciating or non-depreciating assets, not using depreciating assets we see the wealth gap is over $140,000 between african-americans and white americans by estimates for 2019, it seems to have been growing since 1983, when we started getting good, strong data and we have seen growth in terms of pure numbers of wealth inequality between latino americans and white americans. this is a national crisis as the country becomes majority minority, the country will not if it's $15,000 to around $150,000 or if you use

depreciating assets, $170,000. this is a national crisis that must be addressed. host: stockton, california, mike, good morning. caller: there's a lot of facets. i'm a construction worker, in the union since 1978. the different times that i was told on the job, i had a good paying job, but you have so many racist people in charge of these jobs. any high paying job, just about. they don't want you to have a good paying job. they hire the black college

graduates, the h 12 v visas, they pay all that money to go to college and the next thing you know you can't edit job in your chosen field. they get you on the lower level with the labor. they hire immigrants over blacks and then you've got that lady who called in. like what are you talking about? black people have a very superhard time and if you want to job, you got the best of the best that can't keep their job. host: let's take up that issue of hiring. guest: this is why it is so important for any of the programs being put forward that we have the data on the spending on infrastructure and we will be hiring or construction and we make sure that government dollars are not reinforcing unemployment inequality and we make sure that when dollars are

being spent, what percentage is going to cover african-american, latino laborers. making sure that there is equity in the amount of money we are spending on infrastructure development. it's true that in pretty much any sector, out right labor, middle management, senior management, that you see strong racial ethnic disparities in terms of who has the position and who is being hired. this is something we should also address dealing with economic inequality. host: we talked about the proposals in tulsa. if you had the ear of the president, what would you put forward to fix the issues that we are talking about? guest: you mentioned one, i did a report called 10 policy solutions to bridge the racial wealth divide. it's so big, it's not one policy

that will address it. you have to deal with the whole structure of our economy. baby bonds would be an important thing, providing for young people who often times become adults and have no wealth to have assets that they can use to help move forward their lives. we talked about things like full employment. right? african-americans, talking about the economy bouncing back, it's near 10% and that's at the height of what white unemployment was during the great recession. these great issues and challenges. there needs to be a new strong goal around homeownership. you put out a report called 60% back homeownership with a route towards development and we need an idea of how to ensure that all americans are majority homeowners and what types of investments and subsidies we will put forward to make that a

reality. host: this from twitter, talk about the credit score, how it rises, falls, and this important aspect of money lending and borrowing. guest: i would think in the context of racial economic inequality, the reality is that when you have low road -- low wealth and lower income and greater job instability as a whole, you are going to have lower credit scores. this is also true for african-americans and latinos with similar income levels but different levels of wealth. again, your income doesn't magically produce wealth. it's oftentimes something that comes from generations of work, of being in a community with strong assets that allowed you to build your assets off of that . having even stronger incomes but lower wealth leads you to weaker credit scores, making it more expensive to do the basic loaning you might need to have a car to get to work or to try to

get a mortgage loan. so, again, this idea of audit scores highlights the challenges of how expensive it is to be wealth poor in our society. host: rochester, michigan, good morning. nancy. caller: i'm just here to say that i think anybody can better themselves. my husband and i were married when we were 19 and he was going to university of michigan on a scholarship and he lost it because he got married, won't go into that. we had a small child. he was working and going to school full-time driving one hour each day, every day i was working with a child. we did this for six years. we didn't own a home until after he graduated. we had government loans. we were in debt. then we pay those off and 10 years later i went to school. we did the same thing.

you can do this. today i give workshops, i'm in the mental health field. i give workshops trying to help people saying about owning the responsibility of your life because when you own it, you take power. i'm just trying to tell everybody, they can do this. they can do this. that's all i want to say. guest: thank you for that. it is important to own responsibility. and cruz does auntie of workshops on how to buy a home and strengthen your financial literacy. those things are important. but how we got here today is not just a failing of responsibility. it was a government structure that created an unequal system, creating a place where over the last 40 years as the national gdp rises, most of that income went to the highest income earners or in the past issues like redlining or there wasn't

there -- the ability for african-americans to get loans to buy homes. there are structural issues to deal with as you try to deal with your own personal finance and responsibility issues. i'm glad you have unable to move forward in your life and i think many african-americans have, but we are not bridging the wealth divide and we need policy to address it. host: motor city, mos, good morning. caller: good morning. i was listening to the gentleman who said a lot of people come over here with skills. when i was working, they brought under ronald reagan, they brought the greeks in with seven year federal tax, don't take out federal tax for seven years. none of them was experienced. i worked with them. that's how these people get ahead from abroad. they give them federal tax breaks.

when they find out they are going to take out the federal taxes, they moved to another state. it's the same thing when they move. that's how they get ahead. host: dedrick asante-muhammed, on the issue of immigrants in this country? guest: i'm not familiar with the program around greek immigrants he's referring to, but since the great recession we have seen overall at decline in immigrants from this country. i think immigration can be a positive thing and i think we need to figure out, you know, again, the primary issue isn't immigrant. immigrants didn't cause the racial wealth divide. we had much less immigrants coming to the country. there was a refusal to invest in committee -- communities of color, including immigrants.

that's my perspective on the focus of bridging inequality, bringing immigrants into a country where there is greater prosperity and more equity for all. not an economy increasingly bifurcated. host: you mentioned redlining not long ago. you talked about the unfair government policies and programs that contributed, but she talks about the private industry as well, saying that there should be no such thing as a bat -- black-and-white part of town in american cities and that what was once government sanctioned redlining still exists in all sorts of ways and is perpetuated by realtors both black and white. guest: that's true. it's also perpetuated by homebuyers. used to be a black person would move into a neighborhood, it could create white light and scare homeowners out. now we see that it's when a

neighborhood is 20% black, we start seeing white flight. individually people have to be less scared of living in diverse neighborhoods. but we also have to create a system that allows communities like african-americans and latinos that don't have that much wealth to become homeowners and allow for there to be greater integrated communities of homeowners instead of cities that are bifurcated between a small amount of homeowners and a bunch of renters that still we see great racial divisions. we should be holding private companies accountable, real estate agents accountable to not build upon the segregation of the country that we still live in, which is amazing that we are in the 21st century and still dealing with the fact oh segregation throughout the country. host: west virginia, greg, good morning. caller: there's a lot of

frustrating comments, you must be pulling your hair out during some of these. it's hard for people to understand the benefit of generational wealth. they keep bringing up stories that are pull yourself up by the bull -- bootstraps kind of stories but they don't consider the fact that they take risks that may black folks can't take because they don't have a community around them that will pick them up if they take a risk that goes bad, family and friends with extended wealth. it's got to be really frustrating hearing these stories over and over again but i wanted to this out, you keep pointing to how we need to create more opportunities for folks to own houses. i would caution against that. it seems like we have a disproportionate benefit in this country owning houses and all the benefits and tax breaks that go along with it, it seems like

they try too hard to force people into homeownership simply because it is a way of wealth building. it seems like we ought to decrease the benefits of homeownership to begin with. guest: where i partially agree with you is we should decrease the tax benefits of homeownership are high income people. i think it's ridiculous. i would increase the benefits of homeownership for the first time homeowners of certain income levels. it is ridiculous that we give, the more expensive the house up to a point, the more tax benefits we give households and i see no reason to give tax subsidies to higher income people so that they can have a bigger and more expensive home. i do think that particularly in communities like african-american, latinos who are not majority homeownership communities, we need to strengthen it for those communities, but also strengthen

affordable rentals as well, that is a crisis throughout the country. host: back up to baltimore, good morning. kind of to expand on what you have been talking about in dollars to spend, is it another factor that, you know, events in tulsa and other communities that were terrorized during jim crow, we know for a fact that the federal government denied home loans to the black community and basically trapped them in the inner city while, you know, white communities escaped quote on quote to the suburbs -- quote unquote to the suburbs. if we know about all this hiring discrimination information, how can we move forward without reparations? there's a debt that needs to be paid and an issue that needs to be addressed before we can move

forward. generational wealth has been denied to far too many people of color. i don't see us moving forward until we address that. guest: i'm in agreement with you. people talk about race relations like we discussed earlier, sundays, sitting at your dining room table and talking about race. we don't just need to talk about race, we need to invest in bridging economic inequality. reparations mean investments for african-americans for what they have gone through and maybe native americans, for what they have gone through, being necessary. we need to repair our increasingly unequal economy where things are concentrated at the highest end and it will take a redistribution of investments spending 700 and $50 billion per year and wealth development but it goes to the already wealthy. we don't have to read eight new

money. we can take $750 billion per year and make sure it goes to those who are asset poor and that could have a positive effect. host: jack, davenport. caller: good morning. guest: morning. caller: do you think african-american kids overinvest their time and effort in things like sports, with these overpaid athletes and the black music culture? and the same kids under invest in things like the math and science culture or medical science culture? and that's a bigger part of the african-american lack of success? in other words, it's currently a values crisis? guest: yeah, no i don't believe the crisis is values. again, tulsa didn't come out of a lack of values of african-americans. redlining wasn't because of a lack of values.

neither was jim crow, enslavement, or the fact more into graham parents who dealt with those issues. i haven't seen studies that say that african-american children invest too much in sports. i have african-american children who do sports with hunting of white teammates, i'm not clear where you are getting that analysis from. host: what aspect of the racial wealth gap have we not talk about in this segment as much that you would like to talk about? guest: a point brought up that joe biden said during his speech that i thought was important, he talked a lot about tulsa and its horrific impact and everyone can look and say it's horrible, but he also mentioned that within a few years there was an attempt to rebuild and there were things like redlining where they couldn't get government investment into rebuilding these homes and getting government loans to do these things. there was a highway built on top of that black community.

it wasn't just a white riot that weekend of the community. it was generations upon generations later of ongoing discriminatory policies and practices that kept tulsa and i mentioned derek hammond several times, he just put out a paper on the racial wealth divide in tulsa and i think you will see the depth of the deep inequality that still exist there today and it's not just because of what happened 100 years ago. it's 80 years ago, 60 years ago, and what's happening now. my biggest concern again is that , while i'm happy talking about racial wealth inequality, i'm concerned they are not willing to invest the dollars and have the metrics to see if we are bridging the inequality. 20 to 40 years from now i don't want to talk about how we are going in the wrong direction with the racial wealth divide. host: what parts of the american families plan, the

infrastructure proposal, what aspects of that do you see helping guest: with how much of those funds are going to ensure an increase in black employment or infrastructure in black neighborhoods, even recording where the money goes. the government will say that they will do these big things and they do these big things and we are not really clear how the money is spent and we find that actually five years later it did very little to address racial wealth and. clear and quantitative goals to make sure you are collecting clear data on how the money is spent will be essential. host: time for maybe one or two more phone calls. larry has been waiting. good morning. caller: good morning. mr. mohammed, horrific, horrific is anytime you've got a full

percent of the population committing 70% of the crime. what's horrific is what is happening to the black community. congratulations to the democrat party. what you guys have done is brilliant. you have managed to turn the police force into the bad guys. i think the black community needs to look within before you come raising taxes on every single person in this country because you guys can't get it together. guest: i agree with the gentleman in that what has happened to african-americans and native americans is horrific and i think it is sad that people still have these stereotypes. at the reason african-americans, native americans, and latinos to a certain extent are where they are because of their and 40 airily because of the clear structural -- inferiority,

rather than the clear structural inequality put in place throughout american history. host: dedrick asante-muhammed is an associate fellow with the institute for policy studies and works at the national institute of reinvestment coalition and has been with us for the last 45 minutes. before you go, you said you watched the first hour of our program today and heard some of it. the question that we asked in the wake of president biden going to tulsa and all the remembrances of the race massacre, we asked how race relations have changed in the past 100 years. it will be what we talked about in the last segment of this program, but how would you answer that russian? guest: race relations clearly has changed. between african-americans and white americans things have changed more intermarriage and personal friendship, but that doesn't radically change the economics of the situation and we haven't gotten to the point

with race relations where the country as a whole is united in saying that this inequality is wrong and we are going to invest to end the inequality. i think that's the point of race relations i'm looking forward to this country getting to, working to advocate that we allow. it's really hard to have great race relations when we have great economic inequality. it's hard to sit down with your neighbor of another race when most of your neighbors are all of one race. dealing with racial economic inequality and the racial wealth divide will be the important next step to bridging this in the future. host: if you want to read more of his work, a good place to go is ncrc.org and you can find dedrick asante-muhammed on twitter. we appreciate your time. guest: thanks for having me. host: back to this question we begin with and will end with, how has race relations changed

in the last 100 years? phone lines are split regionally. if you are in the eastern or central united states, it's (202) 748-8000. if you are in the mountain or pacific regions, it's (202) 748-8001. as you are calling in, from her recent testimony on capitol hill, the oldest known living survivor of the tulsa race massacre, viola fletcher, was on capitol hill talking about her remembrances of the 1921 tulsa race massacre and this is what she told congress. [video clip] >> may 21, 1921, i went to bed in my neighborhood with my family. i fell asleep let -- that night and felt the sleep was rich. not just in terms of wealth but culture, heritage, and my family had a beautiful home. we had great neighbors and i had

friends to play with. i felt safe and had everything a child could need. i had a bright future ahead of me. excuse me. still, they had given me the chance to truly make it in this country and in a few hours, it was all gone. the night of the massacre, i was awakened by my family, my parents in the five siblings who were there. i was told that we had to leave and that was it. i will never forget the violence of the white mob when we left our home. i still see black men being shot , black bodies lying in the street. i still smell smoke and see fire. i still see black businesses being burned. i still hear airplanes flying

overhead. i hear the screams. i have lived through the massacre every day. our country may forget this history, but i cannot and i will not and other survivors do not and our descendants do not. when my family was forced to leave, i lost my chance at education. i never finished school past the fourth grade. i have never made much money in my country, my state and city took a lot for me. despite this, i spent time supporting the war effort in the ship -- shipyards of california. but most of my life, i was a domestic worker serving white families. i never made much money, but to this day i can barely afford my everyday needs. all the while, the city of this

tulsa has unjustly used the names and stories of victims like me to enrich myself in its white -- and its white allies through the 30's. tulsa sent in a commissioner while i continue to live in poverty. i'm 107 years old and have never seen justice. i pray that one day i will. host: viola fletcher on capitol hill, testifying. the oldest known living survivor, that was just from two weeks ago talking about her experiences during the tulsa race massacre of 1921. here's a picture of her on the front page of the new york times, watching president drive -- president biden give his

address yesterday memorializing the massacre. the question today, looking back, how have race relations changed in this country? what has changed and what hasn't? let us know on phone lines regionally. (202) 748-8000 eastern and central time zones, (202) 748-8001 if you are in the mountain and pacific time zones. first, herbert, virginia, good morning. your thoughts? caller: yeah, i would like to say something about the race relations you were talking about. i didn't know about the 1921. but a lot of the reasons black people are so disgruntled, some of them, is because of the oppression of not being able to have a good job. a good example, the last talk

you had about the racial wealth gap, a lady came on before that and said that her family had left her so much land. back then, black people couldn't even own land. land is wealth. the redlining and all this stuff, it has a lot to do with it. thank you, that's all i had to say about it. host: john, laguna hills, california, good morning. caller: i just want to say that a lot of people don't know, there is a study from notre dame university, there will -- there were well over one million white slaves as well. we always talk about black slaves. there were plenty of white slaves as well. people need to really look into history and you know, as far as

income inequality, every fireman, policeman, nurse, they get the same money. you know, you've got these guys like jack on twitter and facebook, they are actually taking their income and putting it into the median, as far as the white income. as far as the united states is concerned, the leading income for asians is the highest amongst whites, blacks, hispanics. your last guest, i just want to say that the reinvestment act of 1977, i had a mortgage, i was a mortgage banker for about 23 years. we did more loans for the hispanic community because bill clinton reinforced to the act

and we had andrew cuomo being the head of the fed at the time. actually we were doing loans and they had false social security numbers and they took over anaheim, california, fullerton, downey. all the high schools now in anaheim are all hispanic now. host: that's john in laguna hills, california. how have race relations changed in the last 100 years? packing off the race relations in tulsa, the wording of our question, it comes from oklahoma's junior senator on the senate floor, bringing up race relations in this country under

james lankford. [video clip] >> when i started speaking to individuals around tulsa and the state, i started at the same way. may 31 for june 31, six years ago the entire country paused for a minute. it might be a minute or an hour. pausing for a day or a weekend. the entire country pauses to look at tulsa and oklahoma and ask themselves one question, what has changed in america in the last 100 years? six years ago i said that is a fair question for someone to ask . we had better be able to answer when may the 31st of 2021 comes. little did i know six years ago when i started asking that

question every few years, litter -- little did i know the events dealing with a race that would happen in the last 12 months. and the awakening that the nation really has had to what is still left undone on the issue of race in america. host: senator james lankford last week on the senate floor. taking your phone calls this morning on phone lines split regionally. rufus, orlando, florida, you are next. caller: the question, and i really appreciate the question. i listened to the senator's presentation. it has been a bittersweet change in my opinion. i'm a former police officer in the state of maryland and i currently reside in florida. and while there have been superficial changes of a positive nature, such as a black

president, black female vice president, head coaches, etc., those are superficial and needed changes. a real substantive change in the form of policies as they pertain to monetary policies, as pertains to policies for how infrastructure in communities and supplements with farm aid, those changes have not really occurred as they should. it's you talk about policing and law enforcement, those are other changes that have lagged far behind while there have been

black -- behind. there have been black chiefs of police, val demings was the chief of police in florida, but other changes filtered down through how communities are policed, those changes have not significantly changed. and i am not talking defunding the police. that's ludicrous. however, there are real grassroot changes that have not taken place that langford, though i'm not a republican, he sees. you cannot not continue seeing this and dealing with it. host: those changes you are talking about involving policing, are they addressed in the george floyd justice in policing act?

guest: to be quite honest -- caller: to be honest with you, i haven't gone through the entire act to give you a cogent response. host: what changes do you need to see, then, when it comes to policing? caller: i think that how the police end of the community relate to each other, in other words you have to have police in the community that are a part of and work with the community. not stand in opposition to the community. not just show up in the community when there's problems. but our partners in the community, for the community, with the community, actually empowering the community to be its own police, if you will.

host: you said you have seen superficial changes, but not the substantive changes when it comes to race relations in this country. those substantive changes, do you think they are close or at hand? caller: they are close and i will give you an example. i listened to some farmers talking about farm aid and i was encouraged when i heard a white farmer acknowledge that he benefited from the farm aid packages that have been doled out over the years. but he also admitted that black farmers have not. he said that needs to change. this was an older gentleman. my point is, until, and i appreciate what you are doing with having this conversation,

but until we make it safe and ok to have real conversations, and hot there is finger-pointing, that where there is re-victimizing of the victim, but being able to just talk about this is what the deal is, that to me will be how we make substantive changes where we can collaborate on you know what, this is the deal, these are the facts. then we can move forward, in my opinion. host: thank you for joining the conversation this morning. gerry out of rogers, minnesota, you are next. caller: i have to disagree with the last caller, over 100 years, getting rid of segregation in schools, all of the aid that we have given to help black people is meaningless over 100 years,

that's not a realistic comment. host: his term was that it was a superficial change but not a substantive change. caller: you agree with him? you think that superficial? electing a president, electing senators, that's superficial? that's the foundation of our society. we look at it and we change laws . that's very, that's a very fundamental stuff. you know, i would say with the last guy, skin color determining economic outcomes for hispanics, asians, and middle eastern people, they are doing so much better. soon hispanics will be the majority and i wonder, you know, i wonder what they will think about the black race issues. i think that if it breaks out down still to this day, the major problem is the black community itself. until it takes control of itself

and starts addressing the violence in their streets and putting more emphasis on education, it's never going to change. a white guy farmer from the middle of nowhere has nothing to do with a black guy in the inner-city. that's just a fact. host: here's jason riley from the opinion pages of the wall street journal. "they would rather discuss 100 years ago rather than today. in his selma address, mr. obama invoked voter suppression, giving the impression that little had changed in the past 50 years, his own election and reelection notwithstanding. liberals focus on the history of black suffering rather than success because it helps democrats get elected and activists raise money. would you agree? caller: i do think that's true.

there's no absolute truth to anything. this is complicated. it's people. it was an injustice. but at some point, my point is this, to say that we haven't gotten light years better is completely wrong, that's unfair. to say that we are all the way there is not true either. it's not. racism exists on both sides, to. and when they say the housing deal? listen, a lot of people in the black community, i know, i'm there, they like to be in the black community. you know? if you are saying they are blocked out, they don't want to go there. is it just that realtors don't want to sell them houses? host: what do you mean when you say i know, i'm there? caller: i interact with them, i live there, i interact with a lot of black folks and have dealt with the black community for a long, long time. there are a lot of good people

like any other community and there are a lot of bad people. the one thing i will say different is that in suburban areas, they just won't allow young people to have the violence in the streets that we have in the cities. host: that is jerry and rogers, minnesota. this conversation on race relations in america, how have they changed since the tulsa race massacre and how haven't they changed? to santa maria, california, hairy, good morning. caller: yes, how's it going? i live in santa maria, california for 50 years and it just has gotten continuously worse. from the top down. from the police department to the city streets. we just lost two more young men to gun violence. the neighborhoods are in a shambles.

everybody is unplugged and it has just gotten worse. i have lived here for 50 years. farming is one of our biggest businesses. we try to do everything we can to support community and it just keeps getting worse. corruption is off the hook. we really do need help here. maybe president biden can come in here and clean this mess up. host: president biden was in tulsa yesterday, recognizing the 100th anniversary of the tulsa race massacre. this is a bit of what president biden had to say in his address yesterday. [video clip] >> what happened in greenwood was an act of domestic terrorism with a through line that exists today still. just close your eyes and remember what you saw in

charlottesville four years ago on television. neo-nazis. white supremacist's. the kkk coming out of those fields at night in virginia with lighted torches. remember, they were screaming. close your eyes and picture what it was. mother fletcher said, when she saw the insurrection at the capital on january the ninth, it broke her heart. a mob of violent white extremists, thugs, reminding her of what happened here in greenwood 100 years ago. look around at the various hate crimes against asian americans and jewish americans. a hate that never goes away. it only hides. jesse, i mentioned this to you, i thought that after you guys with dr. king pushed through the voting rights act and civil rights act, i thought we were moved. what i didn't realize, i thought

we had made in norman's progress and i was so proud to be a little part of it. -- we made enormous progress and i was so proud to be a little part of it. what i didn't realize is that hate is never defeated, it hides, it only hides. >> so true. >> give it a little bit of oxygen to the leaders, it comes out from under the rock like it was happening again as if it never went away. so, folks, we can't, we must not hate a safe harbor. host: president biden in tulsa, oklahoma yesterday. this was the front page of yesterday's "tulsa world," biden acknowledges massacre in the city. there is also a story about the city resuming its search four masked great -- mass graves from 19 to anyone. 100 years to the day since they burned the thriving black wood neighborhood and the effort to identify those mass graves

resumed, crews focusing on better defining the boundaries of mass graves identified during a test excavation late last year. if you want more on that story, it is tulsa world.com. a few minutes left, taking phone calls with this question, how have race relations changed in the past 100 years? also looking for your texts and tweets as well, headley has a picture along with his tweet, saying that this is the eight mall -- eight mile wall from detroit, the redline wall, a bank required it to be built before they would loan money to white folks who would put up new homes on the other of the wall. headley westerfield on twitter, one of those joining us this morning. kenneth is another out of california. good morning. host: good morning, sir.

good morning, america. we have to realize how 100 years ago it was the democratic party who were lynching, burning, inventing these special rules to vote that our president now is blowing out his pie hole. when i arrived in california in 85, it was beautiful. community colleges were free. the colleges were beautiful. it was great. the cities were clean. now it is a dirty mess that they can't fix. everyone there is racist, ok? host: the question we are asking is how have race relations changed in the past 100 years, has it gotten better? caller: definitely it's gotten

better. 100 years ago the democrats would burn your house down. they invented redlining. they invented all this crazy stuff. it was not the republicans. host: that was kenneth out of california. maryland, good morning. caller: good morning to you. like use -- as you said, have things have gotten better? things have gotten somewhat better, but a lot of things are being cloaked. a lot of times when black people take a step forward and a bill is passed to help black people, there is -- there can be a scheme that changes the bill so that the black people go right back to where they were before. but let me say this, black people, when they have to compete against whites, latinos, all immigrants coming here, i was in the home improvement business. you can't underbid them, you know what i mean?

it's people working for chief -- cheap labor. you have the africans, it such as mexicans, you say in the world how did they get these houses and all these businesses? it's not just hurting black americans, inserting white americans. the white guys i have worked alongside doing drywall and stuff like that, they are suffering and nobody is listening. a lot of the things that donald trump said was true. i'm saying this is a black man. a lot of the things he said was true. you got to put americans first. i don't believe in everything he said or did, but you have to put americans first. that means the people that been here already. host: one thing that two of the colors earlier disagreed on was the significance of the election of barack obama as president. , harris as vice president. one caller calling it a superficial change when it came

to race relations in this country. another caller calling into say it was a very significant moment. what would you say? caller: i would say this. i would say we were here, when hillary clinton was running for president, dennis kucinich, who i would have voted for, when it came down to reparations for blacks, hillary clinton said no. obama, he couldn't even answer the question. dennis kucinich, a white man, he stuck his chest out and took a step forward and said yes and set it on the bible. as far as obama is concerned i'm still waiting for a black president and i'm still waiting for one now. skin color don't make you black. there is white people. white people more proactive in helping black people than these people. what did but barack obama actually really do? look at this man, he spent eight

years in the presidency, you understand what i'm saying, we still haven't gotten reparations. obama wouldn't even bring it up. he's scared. dennis kucinich brought it up. i tell you something else, if i sat down at a table with donald trump, you know what, i don't think he would be afraid to bring it up. host: if donald trump were to run again against a joe biden running for a second term, who would you vote for? caller: neither one of them. i wouldn't vote for neither one of them. because you know, he was at tulsa, joe biden, he never even mentioned reparations. if that was jewish people, if that was narrowed -- native american people or japanese people or any other people where something was done wrong, you know, they would get reparations. with black people, you know, they say they going to do it,

they live, we wait and wait and don't get it. what's the problem? what's wrong with us? what's wrong with black people to make us so hated? why do people hate us so badly? we didn't ask to come here. host: randall's town, maryland this morning. time for two more phone calls. vicki, good morning. caller: thank you for taking my call this morning. have things changed in the last 100 years? i would say yes and no because of the simple fact that we still have what you call gentrification. we still have farms and farm aid given mostly to the european and not the african descendant. we have infrastructure in the black communities that are poorly constructed. black businesses and black

bodies being slaughtered in the streets of this country. poor schools that are c, d, f schools. law enforcement becoming militia entities. there are good officers and bad ones. i have had law enforcement officers in my family, but we need to say -- don't take this job serious enough to know that you are sworn to serve and protect all people. and then not to show her respect to a person? when you look at the governors, you don't have enough african-american governors in this nation. you don't have enough governors to represent every ethnic group. it should be even. 50 states, you should have 10 african-american, 10 asian, 10 native american, 10 caucasian and 10 latino governors. it should be the same in the senate and in the congress. then you look at the landowners, they are being pressed to sell their land due to big corporate

coming in. if you look at the state of the carolinas, helena island. my family are the [indiscernible] people who are disenfranchised and to -- take over, let's get the poor and in these communities, the black communities, the urban communities, and then when you protest, protest in this nation is considered violent. you see the african-american go out and take to the street for injustice -- against injustice. to going protest is considered hoodlums and violent. that's not right. dir. georgieva: -- host: that's vicki, we will be back here tomorrow morning, it is 7:00 eastern, 4:00 pacific area in the meantime, have a

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