of the d-day landings in her book, d-day girls. you can join the conversation with your phone calls, facebook comments, textbook messages and tweets. washington journal is next. ♪ host: good morning. vice president harris leaving later today for mexico and guatemala, a two day visit to assess the border situation and immigration. president biden taking his first international trip since taking office, heading to great britain for the g7 summit. the visit with queen elizabeth is sunday, june 5, marking the anniversary of the d-day invasion. we are getting your comments on the covid-19 vaccine.

is getting vaccinated a partisan act? our phone lines are divided between democrats, republicans and independents. if you are republican, your number is (202) 748-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. independents, (202) 748-8002. you can send text messages with your first name and where you are texting from at (202) 748-8003. on twitter at c-spanwj and facebook on facebook.com/c-span. the president saying it is not partisan to get vaccinated and giving president trump credit for the vaccine development in operation warp speed. something the former president talked about yesterday in north carolina. here are the states with the highest vaccination rates -- vermont, 71%, hawaii, 67%, same

for massachusetts, connecticut, maine, 63%, rhode island 61%, new hampshire 60%, pennsylvania 59%, new mexico, 58%. the states with the lowest rates are mainly in the south. louisiana, 36%, alabama, 36%, wyoming, 37%, idaho, 38%. our question this morning -- is getting vaccinated a partisan act? our numbers are (202) 748-8000 for republicans. -- (202) 748-8001 for republicans. (202) 748-8000 for democrats. just this last week, president biden addressing this issue. [video clip] >> we were elected to be

president and vice president for all americans. i don't want to see a country that it is already too divided to become divided in a new way, between places where people live free of fear of covid and places where, when fall arrives, the disease returns. the vaccine is free, safe and effective. getting the vaccine is not a partisan act. the science was done under democratic and republican administrations. the first vaccines were authorized under a republican president, widely developed by a democratic president, deployed by a democratic president. every american can get a shot at their neighborhood drugstore at no cost with no weight. every american over 12 years of age, no matter where you live, what you believe, who you voted for, has the right to get vaccinated. it is your choice, so please,

exercise your freedom, live without fear. we need to be one america united, free from fear this fall. host: that was president joe biden this past wednesday addressing the vaccine issue. this is a headline this morning from politico.com. the partisan divide in vaccinations is starker than you realize. some of the details courtesy of political. "the effort to reach the end has become the latest little fault line in the covid response. the partisan divide in vaccinations is becoming starker as the nation inches towards joe biden's goal of providing at least one shot to 70% of adults by july 4. all but one of the 39 congressional districts where at least 60% of residents have received a covid shot are represented by democrats.

that according to harvard university. by contrast, republicans represent all but two of the 30 districts where fewer than one third of residents have received a shot, the data underscoring how under vaccination in those holdouts has become the latest political fault line in a nation that has been divided since the beginning over mask wearing and even the severity of the virus that has killed nearly 600,000 americans." that story on politico.com. is getting vaccinated a partisan act? we will go to andy in virginia. good morning. caller: i cannot understand why c-span feels it has to carry the entire trump speech in north carolina. this president is probably the biggest insurrectionist president we have ever had, who basically called on an

insurrection, an attack on our democracy, and is continuing to spread the lie that the election was stolen. this guy is the biggest danger to our country, our democracy, our way of life that we have ever seen in all of our 70 years. as far as whether the vaccine is partisan, it is only partisan to republicans and those trump morand's who can -- trump morons who continue to believe in the big lie. over 40% of republicans say they will not get the vaccine, yet they claim to be such patriots. if those young men on december 6, 1945 stormed the beaches of normandy, gave up their lives at the ages of 18, 19, gunned down in their youth, gave up their lives readily to protect this country and this democracy,

and yet these republicans cannot even bring themselves to protect this country, go out and get a vaccine, is incredible. you are not patriots. you are basically anti-american. you are the first this thing -- you are the furthest thing from a patriot. host: it is 1944. we will talk to the author sarah rose. she will talk about one aspect of the day -- of d-day in her book d-day girls. sarah rose joining us at 9:00 a.m. eastern this is a message from matt and ohio. "it is a personal decision. i am 71 and will not take it." on facebook -- "it doesn't have to be. those in power seem to be intent on making it one though."

fred on the independent line, good morning. caller: i was just thinking, everything was pushing the science. "we follow the science." science this. i don't think there has ever been a flu vaccine more than 65% effective. every once in a while, there's a tidbit. the way they sell this, it is almost like a commercial. it is almost 100% effective. what's that? 99%? 80%? 70%? it gives you an edge, but they are selling it like the commercial. where is the science? do they have the percentage? how did they get such an effective vaccine so quick when, after decades, the most effective flu vaccine was 65%? host: we will leave it there. thank you for the call. james in tennessee, on airline for independents -- on our line

for independents, is getting the vaccine a partisan act? caller: yes. the last caller talks like we haven't moved in time. back then, everything was different. times have changed. why was trump on tv? you know? i don't need to see him. he is the worst thing to ever happen to this country. thank you. host: let me address that issue because you are the second one to talk about it. since this network began, our goal has been to provide you with coverage of events as they happen, whether former president trump or president biden or others on the political spectrum. you have the decision of whether or not to watch, but the fundamental mission of this network is to give you a view of the democratic process, which is why we carried the speech. it is your choice to watch it or

not. all of our content is available on c-span.org. bruce in cleveland, good morning. caller: good morning. host: how are you, sir? good to hear you. caller: it is partisan on the behalf of the republicans. i saw on the internet where republican lawmakers asked trump if he would get vaccinated. he said yes. they asked him would you go on national television and get your supporters to get vaccinated? and he changed the subject. this is totally partisan. the man played golf every weekend last year, but during the worst international pandemic, 400,000 people died because of his incompetence, the riot in washington, deciding to

kill his own vice president. i don't understand it. republicans have to wake up. i reckon that not one of them rejected that $1400 stimulus check that came from biden, ok? i don't think one of them did. i don't think one of them donated that to the nearest homeless shelter or home for pregnant women or whatever. trump lost the election. he refused to wear a mask for just about all of last year. look at what is going on now. host: final point. go ahead. caller: my final point is these republican lawmakers need to start protecting the american citizen and not their own selfish greed. host: bruce, thank you. from cynthia on twitter, who sent us a tweet. for some people, unfortunately, it is a partisan issue. for others, it is due to

ignorance. reuters has this headline -- getting a vaccine is not a partisan act. again, that statement from president biden. politico with more on the story -- headline, the partisan divide in vaccinations, explaining why the partisan gap is widening. republicans are roughly more than six times more likely than democrats to say they have no interest in being vaccinated according to recent polls. democratic districts are vaccinating at a faster clip as organizations redouble efforts to reach holdouts with a focus on minority groups. data collected by the cdc and outside researchers finding racial disparities in the vaccination ever are narrowing, particularly for hispanics. the biden administration this week announcing new efforts to get americans vaccinated in the month leading up to independence day, rolling out new programs,

offering free childcare, transportation, expanding pharmacy hours, and other measures, including anheuser-busch offering free beer. andrew joining us on our democrats line on an army reserve base in california. good morning. caller: good morning. host: we can hear you, eric. caller: referencing the speech from former president trump, one, and i have, i didn't i appreciate -- i did not appreciate him referring to native americans as indians receiving money to vote against him. the second comment, number one, i am a retired police officer in the state of california and retired military. the vaccine is politicized but everyone irregardless of political affiliation should get vaccinated. i appreciate you hearing my

comments. thank you, sir. host: thank you. we go to bea in texas. republican line. caller: good morning. host: how are you? caller: i am fine. thank you. thank you for making this broadcast possible. i enjoy it a lot. i just wanted to say that i have been vaccinated. i am an 85-year-old veteran and the widow of a veteran and a great-grandmother but i have been vaccinated and i think it is advisable to be vaccinated but i don't think that people who have chosen not to be vaccinated should be disparaged for that. there are lots of reasons why one might not decide to be vaccinated and that should be their choice. host: bea, thank you, from

texas. this is dickie in wichita, kansas, saying getting the vaccine is a personal choice. remember those? we make them every day. and we take responsibility for them. another forgotten concept. on the washington post -- actually, getting the vaccine is a partisan act even if it shouldn't be. tom joining us from rutland, vermont on the independent line. good morning. caller: good morning. i would like to challenge bruce to go to frankspeak.com and watch the 90 video. that will clear up his election woes. also, trump didn't want to go and promote the vaccine because he was worried, like when he promoted the hydrochloroquine, people backed away from it, so

he didn't want -- he was worried people were going to back away from the vaccination if he went out and promoted that. he thought getting in himself was proof enough that it was safe. host: thank you. we will go to brian delphi, indiana, republican line. -- brian in delphi, indiana, republican line. good morning. caller: good morning. i don't know why we have to have all these mandates on this stuff. i cannot hear you. host: brian, we will leave it there. thank you for the call. the issue of emails coming up with dr. anthony fauci, some made available through the freedom of information act, published by the washington post, the washington examiner, among others. he was asked about those emails,

what was in them and what they revealed. here is part of that exchange courtesy of cnn. [video clip] >> i want to get you on the record addressing some of them. there was an email sent to you from an executive at eco-health alliance, one of the companies they funded some of the research at the wuhan lab, and it thank you for basically saying you believed that the origins of the coronavirus were natural. they said i want to send a personal thank you for publicly standing up and saying that the scientific evidence supports a natural origin for covid-19, not a lab release from the wuhan institute of virology. that email was april 18. some of your critics say this means you have too cozy of a relationship with the people behind the wuhan lab research. what do you say? >> nonsense. that was sent to me from them. i have always said and will say

today to you that i still believe the most likely origin is from an animal species to a human, but i keep an absolutely open mind that there may be other origins of that. there may be another reason. it could have been a lab league. i believe if you look historically, what happens in the animal-human interface, that in fact the more likelihood is that you are dealing with a jump of species, but i keep an open mind all the time and that's the reason why i have been public that we should continue to look for the origin. that email in no way -- you can mix construe it -- you can misconstrue it anyway you want. that email was sent from the person saying thank you for whatever i said. i said the most likely origin is jumping of species. i still think it is. at the same time, as i am keeping an open mind, it might be a lab leak. host: that courtesy of cnn.

john berman with dr. anthony fauci of nih, the director of infectious disease. back to phone calls. maurice in florida, good morning. is getting vaccinated a partisan act? caller: the vaccination -- what we need to do as a duty as a citizen of the united states. this is a very curable disease and i see people in and out every day dying from this, so we have to do what is right for the american citizen. host: thank you for the call. rich on twitter with this comment. "is life and death partisan? i guess. many republicans are willing to sacrifice their lives and those of their children to make it a partisan act." send us a tweet. we are @cspanwj.

barry in california. good morning. caller: i am doing very good. i seem to remember the first person to make this issue partisan was kamala harris, who prior to taking office, mentioned that she would not take the vaccine because donald trump had started this process. thank you. host: thank you for the call. the issue came up this past week at the white house press briefing with jen psaki, the press secretary, the issue of dr. fauci's emails, what is in them, what they tell us about covid-19 in its early stages, february-march of last year. here's what she says. [video clip] >> let me say on dr. fauci and his emails, he has talked us many times over the course of the last few days. we will let him speak for himself. he has been an undeniable asset in our pandemic response, but it

is not advantageous for me to relitigate the subject of emails from 17 months ago. we have launched an entire internal review process to use all of the resources across government to get to the bottom of the origins and that's a 100 day process and -- 90 days, sorry, when it is included. host: that's jen psaki. if you go to the washington post, you will see the trend in terms of the vaccination rate, where we are. the huge drop-off from february-march of this year as more americans get vaccinated. the administration having a goal of at least 70% of adult americans with at least one vaccine by july. caller from nevada, good morning. caller: good morning, steve. i always wanted to ask you, do you remember, during the impeachment, how nancy had her impeachment -- and you gave us

the training on that? you told us about that? do you know how many times she wore that impeachment pin? host: it was an article in the washington post i was referring to. caller: you told us about that. you know how may times she has worn it? host: i don't. caller: a couple times a week. on fox, a democratic strategist was wearing the same pin. i am wondering if they are just passing that around. thank you for that information. i am stumped on it. anyway, i am a republican. i have gotten my vaccine. i could talk to my brother and some of my friends and my brother never gets vaccines. it doesn't matter if it is for covid or anything else. he ain't getting that vaccine. i don't care how much debt she don't care how much you talk to

them -- he don't care how much you talk to him. remember autism? terence had problems with autism and vaccines because we had a big spike in autism. they had the combination shot the children get to autism, they attributed it to that. that is when we started getting this resistance to vaccines. it put a stigma in people. the thing that i think is fauci and this administration, they have not been very good about passing this vaccine along, and they've taken too much credit. it is all on them. so thank you for listening to my little gripes and a little bit of reminiscence. host: thank you. following up on kamala harris. she said "if the public health professionals, if dr. fauci, if

the doctors tell us to take it, i will be first in line, absolutely, but i donald trump tells us to take it, i am not taking it." that from yahoo! news. in the debate, kamala harris says she wil not -- she will not take the vaccine just on from's say so. -- on trump's say so. caller: i am concerned not enough people are going to get it. i believe some of the things that mr. trump said. i don't like him, but actually, we do need to check into this election fraud. i don't even trust my own party no more. we have a problem with trust right now. but i really believe in -- and i'm going to have to look into it. i am not accepting that there

might be a lot of things wrong with this election, and what are we going to do if we find out that we lost instead of won, then? are we going to change the seeds to republicans and let them run the country down again? host: that issue will come up this week and month as the senate returns. democratic leader chuck schumer says that s1, dealing with election laws, will be front and center of the debate. live coverage on c-span two. the house returns june 14, flag day. john in florence, massachusetts. god -- good morning, john. welcome to the conversation. caller: i will never get the vaccine. dr. fauci lied and told everyone it was a 1% death rate, which

was a total ride. -- total lie. it was .16%, just like you said last year, that it would be like a bad flu season, which is what donald trump repeated and got eviscerated for. host: thank you for the call. this is from a viewer in columbus -- "republicans whine and complain that taking vaccines and wearing a mask encroaches on their freedom. they will soon complain that not wearing a seatbelt and not driving drunk also encroaches on their freedom." a headline on partisan differences on the pandemic response growing. trust in medical scientists has increased but only among democrats while optimism about a vaccine is broadly shared. on the democrats line, west jefferson, north carolina, linda. good morning. caller: i am a retired pediatric

nurse so i went to give you a list. smallpox, diphtheria, measles, mumps, rubella, pertussis, flu. we are so lucky that we have such wonderful scientists who prevent us from getting those diseases. i don't understand why people have isolated the coronavirus and it said they won't get vaccinated against it. host: thanks for the call. 7:30 and washington -- almost to the bottom of the hour. 7:30 in washington, d.c. we are talking about whether getting the vaccine is a partisan act. this came up last wednesday. president biden addressed that, also giving credit to president trump and republicans for operation warp speed, talking about the goal of getting 70% of american adults with at least one vaccine, either moderna,

pfizer or johnson & johnson by the fourth of july. (202) 748-8001 our line for republicans. (202) 748-8000 for democrats. getting your tweets at @cspanwj. john in medford, oregon, of early, good morning -- oregon, up early, good morning. caller: i am a veteran and i am republican and i got the vaccine. i have friends who are not republican but they won't get the vaccine because they said not enough science has gone into it and they don't know what it does to the human body. host: so what do you tell them since you have had the vaccine? what is your response? caller: well, i got the vaccine because i don't want to get covid. host: and which vaccine did you get? j&j, moderna, pfizer?

caller: i got the j&j. host: thank you. thank you, by the way, for your service on this d-day, an important moment in american history and the history of the world, the day of the invasion, operation overlord. we will have an author on talking about her book, sarah rose, the book d-day girls. andy, good morning. caller: i got the moderna vaccine. happy to do so for myself and others around me and such. i am really amazed on how people call in and want to talk about fauci and biden as liars. i really find that amusing.

i mean, does that because they are so used to the last four years of being lied to constantly? is that just a -- you know, just a question now? it is just a joke. but yeah. i would encourage everyone to take a vaccine so thank you. host: andy, thank you. this is from facebook -- "definitely should not be" on the question of whether getting the vaccination is a partisan act. bonnie saying "it should not be has become for many." this question -- am i entitled to ask coworkers if they have had the vaccine? as many americans head back to the workplace. betty in albany, louisiana, republican line, good morning. caller: good morning to you too.

i wanted to ask a few questions. this thing has been politicized long before we got the vaccine. do you remember the hydroxychloroquine? immediately, because trump supported it, they came out and said it would kill you. a recent study said the hydroxychloroquine was very effective and might have saved the lives early on. another thing, they said -- what about those who have had it? they want everyone to get the vaccine, but some people have had it, they said it might be more harmful for them to take the vaccine than not. there's no indication -- they say follow the science, but they didn't answer that question. another thing, over 3000 people have died by taking one of the vaccines. now i realize that's perhaps one of the detriments to every vaccine, that some people won't

accept it, but still, that's another question. are you at risk? then they want to give it to children, young children. what will that do to those young children? they haven't answered any of these questions and yet they want everyone to go right along and take the vaccine. you know, you do have to give some signs for this. host: betty from louisiana, thank you for the call. in the national review -- the national review -- the fall of saint anthony fauci. this is scott saying "i know people on both sides who are hesitant. with people, it is not about politics. it is about the mixed messages we have received from dr. fauci for the beginning -- from the beginning." caller, good morning. caller: good morning. i had the moderna.

i did not feel the needle. i was happy to get it. when trump said get it, because, you know, he played too much. he was the president. i was hesitant. but when our president got in there and said get it, i went right on. i don't trust what he says because he gives mixed emotions. i just want to say one thing. i was in a depressed mood when that man was president. how did he become president? get russia to help him become president? i worked at the polls. there's no way you can do fraud at the polls. once those tickets go in that ballot box, they are in there

and we cannot even touch the tickets. host: thanks for the call. this is the headline inside the washington post -- vice president harris heading to guatemala and mexico. the vice president departing sunday, today, to those countries on a two day trip to highlight president biden's efforts to remedy the causes of immigration from these countries to the u.s. is getting the vaccine a partisan act? caller: no. it should be a personal choice. i just want to double down on the woman from louisiana. she is spot on. the way our medical community has treated covid, from the leadership, from people in the government, and, you know, now

what we are getting for these pharmaceutical companies, it is an outrage. science -- i mean, we have ignored the science, the science of using masks, the particle size of covid, being able to get it and what use the mask has, the shutting down the entire country, the hydroxychloroquine, a proven virus-killer, very safe drug. it was a who-approved, affordable, safe drug. the cdc recommended taking it if you were going to any areas in africa to prevent getting malaria. very, very safe drug. so covid-19 has been completely politicized. host: we will leave it there. catherine byrd has this -- "not getting the vaccine is a

partisan act." you can share your comments on facebook or send us a text or on twitter, @cspanwj. ray donovan, labor secretary and early supporter of ronald reagan, became their labor secretary in 1981 and faced a series of investigations in which he was acquitted, passed away at the age of 90. he died at home in new jersey. ray donovan famously said which office do i go to to get my reputation back when he was acquitted in 1987. president reagan at the time saying he had full trust in donovan as labor secretary ad as a friend. the obituary from the washington post. he passed away at the age of 90. john joining us from california. good morning, john. caller: i don't have much to say fewer going to play putin's

speech yesterday at the st. petersburg international economic forum. if you are not going to have him on, i will tell you what he said. these six countries are getting ready to produce the sputnik v. 3.2 billion people. there's going to be a tourism, food and said, where you can fly to russia -- tourism, p utin said, where you can fly to russia, get a tour and get the vaccine. it is just as good as the american vaccines. this is funded by the russian fund. it is state-funded. putin, i am not speaking for russia, but a lot of people might say i will take a tour. you don't need fancy

refrigerators and dry ice to carry it into the backwoods. it is the cheapest to manufacture. i think russia has won this one because -- pharmaceuticals, we have good vaccines, but they are for us rich folks. it is a nato vaccine. host: first page below the fold in the new york times, gop leaders reaching a deal to curb offshore tax havens, requiring corporations to have a 15% minimum tax, laying ground for a summit that will take place in great britain this week. president biden departing wednesday. we will have a summary of his remarks, including a meeting with queen elizabeth. bernie, republican line, good morning. guest: -- caller: good morning. host: good morning. good to hear from you. caller: my two minute spiel. i have to say this. you are the best.

you are being too cautious these days. i hope they did not tell you that in order for you to be back on the air. i want you to be yourself. host: no. caller: let's get into this. host: sure. caller: a lot of politicized medicine going around. why would any institution or government to arrive to take the vaccine? they are offering fear, passes -- offering beer, passes, all kinds of incentive to dupe the public into getting the vaccine. informed consent, without it. people are injecting gullible victims to get the vaccine. do they even know how many ingredients, let alone what

ingredients, are in the vaccine they are injecting? they are not giving you and need information -- you any information about informed consent. they are telling you to sign off. you are at your own risk. the whole thing explodes. your god-given immune system. that will take care of you. if you nourish your immune system properly, it will protect you against 99% of all pathogens. poison, toxins, radiation. other than that, god gave you a perfectly healthy body. so all these mechanical and these political and draconian measures -- we have to do this,

we have to do that -- we became robotic. it's nonsense. host: ernie, i will leave it there, but thank you for the call. keep watching. thank you. this is from 10 -- from tim -- it shows you the responsible rhetoric. we got vaccines as kids. this pandemic was easy compared history. the new york times sunday review looking at one aspect of the pandemic and its implications for the medical profession. as the coronavirus toured through new york -- coronavirus tore through new york, some found courage they didn't know they had. it is titled "the making of a doctor." on the democrats line, carol

joins us from maryland. good morning. caller: hi. this whole thing has been so ridiculous. the reason you are getting the vaccine is to protect other people as well as yourself and it is definitely political. it is tied with trump and all the nonsense with hydroxychloroquine for the treatment of malaria. then he wanted to inject some lysol or something into your body. and he was serious. you know, they had to make it so stupid. the people didn't want to wear a mask. why not? it is probably an improvement on your looks. and they make everything -- if it were me, i would have mandated a vaccine for the

country. host: carol, thank you. anne in dallas. 63, a widow. "i take medical advice from my doctor, not politicians. i took it." states with the highest vaccination rate -- vermont at 71%, exceeding the national goal by the biden administration, followed by hawaii, massachusetts and connecticut, maine, rhode island, new jersey and new hampshire, and the low to mid 60's. pennsylvania, 59%. new mexico, 58% vaccination rate. those states with the lowest -- mississippi, 34%, louisiana, 36%, also alabama, followed by wyoming and idaho. rob at joining us from grand junction, colorado, republican line, good morning.

caller: i want to let you know that i live in a county where there are absolutely no elected democrats in any political office. 62% of the county voted for donald trump and almost 60% voted for lauren boebert. we have the second lowest vaccination rate by urban counties in the state of colorado. we are the second worst county in the united states for those under 250 thousand people for covid cases and hospitalizations. and it is -- and also, it is an education thing. our top percentage of those 25 and older, 40% less than the average for the state of colorado. for those people who are over 60, a little over 60% of them have been totally vaccinated

compared to over 80% in the state of colorado. our beloved county commissioners on april 15 decided to get rid of mask mandates. may was the second most deadly month from covid-19 in 2020. our daily case rate is about equal to that of orange county, california, and their population rate is almost 21 times hours. host: rob, you have done your homework. you know your facts. caller: my background is in market research and statistical analysis. my partner and i did the initial research for the irs on the use of credit cards to pay taxes in the late 1990's, so i am strictly a numbers guy, and it is partisan. people ignore the scientists. please wear a mask. and people decided -- i was concerned, i thought how many people are illiterate and cannot read science? this is the information we have.

i am a republican. i got vaccinated as soon i could because i took the advice of my doctor and also my background and research in statistical analysis. i live in a world of facts. i don't live in a fantasy world. have a wonderful day, sir. host: thank you for adding your voice to the conversation. sue has this on our text line from new jersey. "i consider myself a conservative republican and i got the vaccine. not a partisan act." speaking of new jersey, new jersey's governor -- this is a headline -- why the governor started memorializing covid victims and will not stop. governor phil murphy has used his covid-19 briefing to eulogize residents who died from the virus, a practice he says is necessary to remember the humanity behind the data. independent line from newark, ohio, good morning, keith.

caller: it is a personal thing. one of the first people that died was someone who took medication. they did not really do any medication thing with the stuff because i am taking so much medication that -- i told my doctor i wasn't going to take the shot because, you know, they didn't really test the medication, test the shot against medication, because i don't care who sees me wearing a mask. i am just not going to take it because i am not going to be nobody's guinea pig for taking a shot. i would rather see somebody saying that they know i didn't take the virus because i am not

going to take the chance to be like the first person who died. someone took the medicine and died from it. host: have you had the flu vaccine in the past or the shingles vaccine? caller: i have not taken anything because i take medicine for epilepsy. i am not going to take any shot because -- even -- everybody wants everybody to take the shot . there is no way that this shot was tested against all medications because, around the first time they put this shot out, there wasn't no way they tested this against a whole bunch of medications that's out in the world. they are -- there is just no way they tested this against all this medicine that people take. i would just rather see people with, you know, like me, i am

not going to go out -- i am going to go out and i don't care who sees me with a mask and tells me, yeah, this guy he didn't get no shot. sure. i ain't taking no shot. host: keith, we will leave it there. this is from kathy in fairhaven, massachusetts. a lot of text messages coming in. "is it partisan to ask if someone has natural immunity and doesn't need a vaccine? we checked for natural immunity to chickenpox before the shingles vaccine. why is this different?" former fed, now treasury secretary, janet yellen says that inflation could climb as high as 3% this year as the economy recovers, though

temporary. we are seeing higher prices at the gas pump. materials going up. is getting vaccinated a bipartisan -- a partisan act? what is your view on the democrats line. caller: great to see you. everything is so politicized and divided by the media. it is not really a partisan act, but it is being made out by the media, ok? what i think is a partisan act was that they didn't announce we had a vaccine until the very week after the election. and we couldn't get any kind of leak or anything saying, hey, the vaccine is coming. we will have an announcement next week. that probably would have put trump over the top there. so that's my comment. i have a comment and a suggestion.

so i want to send out to the, you know, the family of the -- k sicknics, because that is my town. they have been put through the political ringer. he has been used as a political pawn. it is not partisan. it is dividing us. we will not get any statement from president biden that trump did ok, they did something, yeah. he called it a hoax and has a confused look on his face. my suggestion is, not even with the vaccine or anything, you have tens of millions of people, like me, who received mail in ballots for dead people and their families and biden really wanted to unite the country -- and if biden really wanted to

unite the country, he would debunk that by having all the election, these ballots, voting machines, bypassing state legislatures, he would have a commission on that so we could say, finally, we have it. but it is not debunked. people still believe it. everybody is distrusting the government and it is mostly because of the media, but not c-span. host: sorry? your last word? caller: steve, you are not the media. you are doing a great job. host: anthony, from florida, thank you. i headline -- a headline -- my body, my choice. resistance to the vaccine may be slowing the florida campaign. from texas, joe, independent line. good morning. caller: doctors and nurses have died taking care of covid

patients. if there was any justice, than the people that refused to get a shot -- justice, then the people that refused to get a shot, a vaccination, would not give medical care. obviously that will not happen. host: thank you. a photograph from the new york times. one person with a sign that says "no vaccine." anton is joining us from florida, republican line. good morning. caller: good morning. welcome back, steve. i am 78 years old. i have never been sick a single day in my life. never will be. what i am afraid of about this vaccine business -- they will probably force me to take this vaccine. i have a feeling i will die within two weeks or something. i don't believe in it. i have lived a normal life.

i am not afraid. i am not a scientist, obviously, but they forced or at least encouraged young people to take the vaccine. i have a feeling it is going to be bad to her they will be sick the rest of their lives -- going to be bad. they will be sick the rest of their lives pretty much. host: a headline -- america's partisan divide over the pandemic responses played out in the states. it has widened the partisan divide between democrats and republicans on health care. bill is joining us on the republican line from virginia beach, virginia. good morning, bill. caller: good morning. good to talk with you. i will try to be brief. in september of 1999, i had a quadruple bypass surgery due to a major heart attack. i had a second heart attack in 2013. in my case, i didn't have a choice of whether or not to get the vaccine. in my opinion, it was a life or

death situation, so i got the pfizer vaccine, the one i had the greatest confidence in. i am glad i did it. i feel great. their reactions were almost nothing. just a sore arm. i recommend you have a guest -- dr. mark siegel. i have seen him on other shows and i put more faith and confidence in him than any other physician i have seen on television. one last comment. i have learned to trust my doctor more than i do politicians. have a good day. host: how are you feeling today, though, after the two heart attacks? bill? caller: i am sorry. i didn't understand your question. host: how are you feeling today? caller: i feel great. host: good luck to you. thank you for phoning in. a tweet saying "stupid divisive subject? i have known republicans and democrats who have gotten the vaccine."

nancy in altoona, pennsylvania on the democrats line. good morning. caller: good morning. i do think, in some cases, it is a partisan debate. so many things have become that. what i want to say is let's just use our heads a little bit and get out of this, democrats, republicans, the race thing. let's get out of that. let's get into thinking about what happened years ago -- about what happened. years ago, when asked by my husband, he was a child. what happened to that boy? that boy had polio. his dad answered him, he probably did not get the vaccine. and it was available. in our era. i was just a child and i got it.

you were to get it. we didn't think about what party . we did it because it was the right thing to do. and that's -- that was an innocent child asking why does that boy walk like that? i mean, this is -- we pick at everything, and the answer was a very good answer by his father. "they may not have gotten the vaccine." and it did not help them in the future. host: nancy, thanks for the call from altoona, pennsylvania. this headline from the washington post -- president and vice president hitting the road. vice president harris will heading to mexico and guatemala, first trip to the border to look at some of the root causes of the immigration issue.

biden is leaving wednesday for great britain for a meeting of the g summit -- of the g7 summit leaders. highland, california, good morning. caller: good morning. i just wanted to make a statement. have you ever heard of operation warp speed? that was signed by president -- former president john trump -- don trump. that had to do with covid. i have not heard anybody mention that article. and also, i wanted to say, you know, i did get my vaccine and i am 83 years old. and also, all these people that are coming in from the border, why doesn't, sheet -- why doesn't kamala visit that border? host: thank you for the call.

we continue the conversation on our social media pages, including facebook.com/c-span, and your text messages as well as on twitter, @cspanwj. it is sunday, the sixth of june. later, we look at data. next, though, author and conservative columnist cal thomas and the nation's john nichols on trump's speech last night in north carolina. later, sarah rose. her book entitled d-day girls on this anniversary of the landings on omaha beach. your -- you are watching washington journal. back in a moment. stay with those. ♪

♪ >> my objectives were to understand the process. it was important, so i've reportedly processed. i eventually began to recognize that i liked two things -- i liked very much finding out what the story is, and i liked very much figuring out how to share it. >> tonight on "q&a," peter osnos

sharing insight about his family's escape from poland during world war ii, reporting on the vietnam war for the "washington post," and working for barack obama -- working under barack obama and president trump. the night at -- tonight at 8:00 on "q&a." listen to "q&a" where you get your podcasts. >> "washington journal" continues. host: for the next hour, two perspectives on the bidens presidency and the state of the republican party. joining me from miami is author and conservative columnist cap cal thomas, and john nichols, correspondent for "the nation" magazine. his latest book is "expiration date." thanks to both of you for being with us.

the state of the biden presidency at this point is white? -- what? guest: i think it is kind of confused, as you have kamala harris going down to mexico and guatemala supposedly to find the root cause of immigration. the title wave, the root causes that we no longer control the border. you have the secretary of homeland security mallorca saying recently that the border is closed. saying that there were no u.s. troops in iraq even as the tanks and soldiers from the u.s. were parading behind him. look, the biden administration is acting as if they have a mandate, when the election was very close, and they are proceeding with progressive policies that huge numbers of people in the country don't agree with. this in spite of the president's

promise during the campaign to bring us together. i do not think that is working too well at the moment. guest: john nichols -- host: john nichols, same question to you. guest 2: it is good, but it is challenged. president biden came in and a very unstable moment. he is dealing with covid and a bunch of other challenges. biden's great task is to stabilize that situation, get the vaccines out, get us back toward some level of normalcy, and by that measure, he has done very well. i mean, you look at the process of vaccinations going across the country, it is quite successful. you look at the number of covid cases, the number of covid deaths reducing in almost all parts of the country. united states now at a point where it can actually take a

leadership role in the world at fighting covid. so you see a lot of successes there. you see the american leave act and some other initial legislation. but what i think is challenged, i think now you are into the reality of government and at this point, you recognize -- and i will differ with my friend cal a little bit, i think joe biden got a pretty decent mandate. he won a majority of the vote. democrats took the house and very merrily the senate. at this point, biden needs to govern, and it is very challenging, because there are a lot of bills stacked up in the senate, and there is a real pull in the democratic party between progressives who say, look, you have got the ability to govern. do it. in the more moderate in the democratic party was a no, -- who say, no, we want to keep

negotiating, looking to avoid the filibuster, things of that nature. i do think this summer, as we move into it, we are going to come to a clash, and it is going to be one of the challenging moments of jill biden's presidency, perhaps the defining moment, one where he will have to decide if you will go with his narrow majority, passed legislation like the american jobs and, american families plan , a number of other things, or whether he wants to keep negotiating with the republicans who, at this point, say, as mitch mcconnell said recently, that they are united in trying to stop joe biden from succeeding. host: which allows us to talk about the state of the republican party. cal thomas, let me follow up upon what cal nichols said, because we know there will be another conversation tomorrow with a west virginia senator and joe biden. she tries to put together a plan

that republicans might support. my question to you is -- are republicans interested in a bipartisan infrastructure bill? guest 2: guest 1: i think that's guest 1: i think they are, infrastructure as we understood it -- bridges, roads, airports. dwight eisenhower built the interstate highway system that everybody benefits from. i think most republicans, most democrats, most americans would be very much in favor of fixing potholes and airports and these other things, but the democrats are selling this on the basis of infrastructure, but it is of an awful lot of other stuff. this is what both parties do all the time. they load things up, we call it christmas tree ornaments, that have nothing to do with the title armaments.

i think they are better off saying yes, we are for infrastructure, but are you, the american people, really for all this other stuff that has nothing to do with infrastructure, contributes to a debt that is approaching $30 trillion. as i wrote in my book, no superpower has been able to sustain itself over the year with massive national debt. we cannot go on spending as if there is no tomorrow, or there may not be. host: do both parties bear responsibility? because democrats point to the republican tax cuts. republicans talk to the democrats about their spending. guest 1: yes, they do, but the tax cuts do work. john kennedy cut taxes, and the economy took off. ronald reagan cut taxes, and the economy took off. to his great credit, bill clinton balance the budget. whoever heard of that? that is in the distant past. the problem is not the revenue. the united states

government takes in more revenue every quarter. the problem is spending -- republicans and democrats. it is democrat light for the republicans. we will do this, but we want to spend a little less than you do. that does not work for republican voters. host: cal thomas' latest book is "american expiration date." john nichols, his book, "the fight for the soul of the democratic party." i want to get your comments about former vice president mike pence, we hosted the first in the nation primary, vice president mike pence looking for a possible run in 202014 he had this to say about january 6 and president trump. [video clip] mr. pence: you know, we have all been through a lot over the past year -- a global pandemic, civil unrest, a divisive election, and

tragedy at our nations capital. as i said that day, january 6 was a dark day in the history of the united states capital. but thanks to the swift action of the capitol police and federal law enforcement, violence was quelled, capital was secured, and that same day, we reconvened th congress and did our duty under the constitution of the law and the united states. you know, president trump and i have spoken many times since we left office, and i do not know if we will ever ci to eye on everything, but i will always be proud of what we accomplished for the american people over the last four years. host: that with former vice president mike pence, and, john nichols, part of his prepared

speech, so we have given thoughts to that line. when you heard that, when you hear it again, what is your reaction? guest 2: i was oddly struck by it. remember, it is very rare for a former vice president to differ with the president he served. there are so may traditions we have when we come out of office, and that is one of them, and yet, at this point, mike pence felt it was very clear that it was a necessity, not the opportunity for an offhand remark, but a necessity to clarify that he did not agree with donald trump, with trump's interpretation of january 6, essentially with a great deal of what has played out as a result of that. remember, we are now in a situation where polling suggests that there is a deep divide among the american people literally on what happened on january 6 and what happened in the run-up to that. we had a president of the united states who had been defeated in

an election, clearly defeated, in fact had lost many of the states that had been his victory for years earlier, it was a comfortable margin in the electoral, comfortable margin in the ocular vote, and yet that president was trying to unsettle, upset, overturned that election result. and when pentz calls out january 6, i think in many senses he is calling out a lot more of what goes on around it, what is going on within the republican party. to this day, we look at states across the country, texas, georgia, including my state of wisconsin, where there is this ongoing challenging of not just the result but our election processes themselves. i am rarely agreed with michael pence on any issue over the years, and yet at this point, i see him as actually, in a mild way, making a courageous

statement, and i would hope that will republicans do. because until we settle out the issues of january 6 and until we settle at the issues that lead into that it played out from ed, as a country, we are not going to be able to have the deeper debate. we can have different issues as republicans and democrats, but we cannot do it if there is a disagreement about whether or not we had a legitimate election in 2020 and whether the attempts to overturn it were indeed not just troublesome but damaging to the republic. host: cal thomas, your reaction to what the former vice president said? again, the setting was those grow county, new hampshire, that is manchester, new hampshire, the largest county in the state, in terms of vote. he had the venue with an eye on 2024. what did you think? guest 1: i have been there many times. i am sure you and john have been there as well die agree with much of what john says. john pence was a very loyal vice

president to donald trump. some people would claim that he was even sycophantic. but he is a man of great integrity. i have known him since he was in the congress. remember, he was mocked for what has been called the billy graham rule, never meet with a woman without his wife being present, and that was just before the harvey weinstein and other scandals came out, so he was looking good ever since. i think it is fruitless to focus on the last election. i mean, what can happen? even if arizona was overturned, even if a couple of other states, joe biden is not going to leave the white house. he is not going to be "unpresident." it is a waste of time to focus on the past. we need to be focusing, for my republican and conservative perspective, on the election next year, the very sound possibility that the republicans will retake the house, and less of a possibility but still likely that they might take the senate, too. that is where the focus ought to

be. and if trump's endorsements help produce those results, he will be in a very strong position to run again, presuming that nothing happens with the new york district attorney and the is indictments that look like a possibility coming down because of his business interests in the past. host: our guest is cal thomas, author and syndicated columnist. he is joining us from miami. and john nichols, national correspondent for "the nation" magazine, and author himself. (202) 748-8001 is the line for republicans. (202) 748-8000 for democrats. we have a line for independents, also a text message line, or send us a tweet @cspanwj. cal thomas, you talk about don't focus on 20/20, but last night in north carolina, former president trump did just that. here is a portion of his speech that we carry live. [video clip] mr. trump: you look at what happened on that evening when the election was won, and all

the sudden, vast amounts of those were taken in, just in certain states, swing states, swing states that i was leading by a lot, and all of a sudden, oh, something happened. it was a disgrace to our country, and if you think people don't see it, people see it. people have seen it. the 2020 presidential election, that election, 2020 presidential election was by far the most corrupt election in the history of our country. there has never been anything like this. they used covid and they use the mail-in ballots to steal an election. it was the third world country election like we have never seen before. look at what took place. i want to congratulate, by the way, republican state senators in arizona and other places for their great work. [applause]

that they are doing in exposing this fraud. and maybe, again, i have nothing to do with the arizona situation, there are so many discrepancies, so many problems, and they have heard from so many people about the corruption, what took place, so let's see what happens. they will be finished in three or four weeks. it will be very interesting. maybe they will find nothing. maybe they will say oh, it was a wonderful, perfect election, but i think not. now they are looking at it in pennsylvania, and they are looking at it in georgia, and they are looking at it in many other states, because they are saying, you know, the same thing is happening to us. that election will go down as the crime of the century, and our country is being destroyed by people who perhaps have no right to destroy it. host: president trump in north carolina last night. john nichols, your reaction. guest 2: i did listen to it.

it was a troubling speech, on a lot of levels. first off, i was intrigued by how lacking the former president seem to be in energy. he was going through his former talking points, he was going through before the 20 election and afterwords. -- 2020 election and afterwords. what was fascinating about it was he was re-purchasing of his remarks to the current moment, and i give him credit for this. he follows the news, he engages, you know, at the moment in which he is speaking. he is very sharp in attacking the biden administration, and, frankly, i think, in many ways, from a political standpoint, it might be a successful speech. the segment you just played, that section there is a deeply

troubling segment. first off, he is wrong. the 2020 election, by the analyses of people who were under his own purview, was a very successful election, an election with fewer problems than most. in addition to that, it certainly was not the most corrupt election of the united states. as somebody who has written a lot of american history, i can tell you 1876, 2000, it looks incredibly good. but the final thing is what former president trump is doing here is so very dangerous to the republic. he is casting doubt on election processes in a way that will create an ongoing push and pull as regards to whether elections are legitimate. and my daughter, who is, you know, finishing high school, was a poll worker, as many young people were around the country, and i cannot begin to tell you the seriousness with which she

took that, the instruction she was given on how to do it right, how, you know, you put yourself on a side, you don't call people, you don't wear anything inappropriate -- you do all these things to make it right, and he work with people who are having challenges get their votes cast. the fact of the matter is we have a fabric in this country of electoral commitment by grassroots people who get nothing out of it but who seek to make sure that it works, and it did work in 2020. and for donald trump to go around and do this, to continue to do this, i am reminded of why i personally believe that he needed to be impeached because of what he said ended on january 6 but also because of what he said and did to create this distrust and this sense of disarray as regards to our election. i think what he said was shameful, and i think that what

he said was damaging. host: let's bring in our viewers and listeners for our two guests. we will start with bill in orange park, florida, republican line. we thank you for waiting. go ahead with her question. caller: i appreciate you letting me talk. i was going to ask mr. nichols a question for die wonder when was the last time he swore on the oath with perjury, and what about all the people who swore under oath and found fraud! another thing is how many of these states will have people in jail, because in 2022 and 2024, they will have to come up with about 20 million votes that were a fraud! they will have to come up with it again, and they ain't gonna do it. 30 million people ain't gonna die in two years. host: cal thomas, do you want to weigh in on some of those

points? guest 1: first, to some of the things that john said, i think the former president was right when he talked about voter integrity, the expansion of the number of days before election day, the drop boxes, and these other things. the most important thing about an election is not just who wins but whether the people on the losing side believe it was fair. and i think there are some serious issues that need to be addressed in that regard. with respect to the caller talking about all the people who swore under oath, threat of perjury, that they saw fraud, no judge, including many judges named by former president trump, has signed off on that. i want to see the evidence. i hear a lot of gossip. i hear a lot of statements that somebody snuck in ballot boxes at 3:00 in the morning, after everybody had gone home, that there were double counts, and

all these other things you read on the internet. but i want to see hard evidence, and no judge has said, to my knowledge, that, yeah, that is true, we are going to throw these votes out, because they were fraudulent. show me the evidence. don't just show me websites that indulge in conspiracy theories. host: john, i want to get your reaction to this article in the "charlotte, virginia gazette mail." why i am voting against the for the people act. it has become overly politicized. if today's debate to vote is not about finding common ground but seeking a partisan advantage. i could be the death knell without any republican support. your reaction? guest 2: well, it is troubling, and i will tell you why.

the act has been designed not just in the moment but actually over a number of years, pulling together a host of ideas for how to make our election more efficient and more fair. the interesting thing in the act, it goes all the way back to a time when republicans and democrats actually agreed, on things like campaign-finance reform, making it easier to vote, not harder to vote, having district lines drawn in a way that they were not gerrymandered radically to favor one party over the other. and i, you know, we could spend the day talking about joe manchin, but i think it is much more important to talk about the genuine challenge that we have as regard to a sort of shared agreement on how we hold elections and a set of standards, particularly for not just the election, not just putting a ballot in a box, which

is very important, but also all the money that flows income all the pressure on the process. i am disappointed by those who have tried to make it so hard to make it, again, to a point that i will emphasize -- and cal will remember this -- it was not far back in our history when democrats and republicans would come together on the basic premise that if we had fair elections with a reasonable amount of money spent on both sides and not unreasonable amounts coming from all sorts of hidden sources, and, you know, we, as a country, could have a real debate, we could have a debate between left and right, between democrats and republicans. it does not have to be about all of the uncertainty and backbiting.

there are those who are opposed to i at this point,, i think for reasons that i would disagree with. and i would hope that joe manchin will continue to try and get toward some sort of election reform and campaign-finance reform that we need in this country very desperately. host: again, the headline from the charleston, west virginia "gazette," "why i am voting against the for the people act." an issue that chuck schumer had hoped to bring to the senate floor. gloria is with us on the democrats line from meridian, mississippi. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i continue to watch the news, i continue to watch all aspects of the news, whether it be c-span,

cnn, msnbc. i don't understand why we have to continue to debate that donald trump lost. there were 80 million something people who said "enough is enough," and they went out to vote. i don't understand why we continue to debate. he lost! guest 1: his asset was his greatest problem -- yes, he turned out more than any other sitting president, but he also turned out more of the opposition because they were united in their dislike of him. i want to get something victoria suggested, why we can't move on,

why trump lost in all of this, in washington these days, nobody actually wants to solve a problem, because if you solve the problem, you lose the issue. everybody knows what needs to be done to solve on many, many problems. trump, frankly, was on his way to doing many of those things. but actually solving a problem loses the issue. it damages your fundraising, which is what this is really all about. the politicians want to perpetuate themselves in office, so they raise all of this money and promise they are going to do all of these things and never get around to doing them and blame the other party. of course, bob and i, my longtime friend who was manager of the walter mondale 1984 campaign, we wrote a book together, we became friends, and

nobody knows each other, we belong to groups in which we belong, and the groups fight with each other, and nobody sits down and has dinner anymore and works out something that will actually promote the general welfare. while we have always had that partisan divide, going back to many years, including during the lincoln years -- i'm reading carl sandberg's four-volume book set on lincoln, the war years -- back then, many people regarded him as the devil. nothing really changes, because human nature does not change. but it is not to solve problems but just to perpetuate these politicians in office. host: one of our regular viewers is joining us from upstate new york in ithaca. austin, it is good to hear from you again. go ahead with your comment. caller: thank you very much. this is pastor michael vincent

cres. i can be found on facebook. i take offense first at mr. trump using the term third world. it is derogative, and our democratic republican stands for a beacon of hope. but i'm afraid that that lighthouse is going to go out. these two gentlemen, mr. nichols and mr. thomas, thank you very much. it is coherent. we are seeing what conversation can do, and all of politics is compromised. before i make the point, because you both already made it, i work from solutions. i want to honor my father and all the people on this d-day. my father was head of logistics for troop movement in london.

he was recalled again for the berlin crisis, and 22 years in the army reserves. we have got to get to where we are going, and we are dwelling too much on the past, but i would like to talk about my in reference to individual, one, paper moon, former president donald trump, is how we get here. and part of it is what we are entangled with right now, the 24-hour news cycle, instead of looking back where it started, 47the number one reason that we are here today, and my -- i was grown up on staten island, a republican family, and even worked with jesse jackson in 1988 in d.c. -- but he pardoned nixon, and he made the president above the law.

what i would suggest, and this would -- you know you are wrong if everyone is happy. no one is happy with this, but we have all the information at our hands already, and you gentlemen know more than me. let's have the election on june 14 every year. why? it is flag day. host: pastor, i will leave it there. good to hear from you. you put a lot on the table, including watergate, something we all remember. cal thomas, is that the root cause of where we are today in terms of our partisanship? guest 1: i don't think so, steve. the president's pardon powers, absolutely in the consultation, and he can pardon whoever he wishes. bill clinton pardoned some unsavory people. i think gerald ford was right, the american people, by and large, i would even say some of the nixon haters, did not want

to see a former president of the united states go to prison. i can guarantee joe biden will not artan president trump for anything. [laughs] look, it is social media, it is driving up fundraising by letters. saying so-and-so ruined the country. then the other says, no, no, send me $25, because he ruined the country. they are like cheap hookers. they were very money for both sides, get a big commission for themselves, and laugh as they go out to drinks together. one of the problems is we put too much faith in washington and not enough they and ourselves. when was the last time we heard a politician say you know we cannot do more for you then you can do for yourself. the government is not your savior, not your keeper. your first line of defense in your own life is inspiration followed by motivation followed by respiration. now we have envy, greed, and entitlement.

we have income inequality. steve, you probably make more than i do. i don't care! as long as i can make enough to take care of myself and my family. we are in this envy, greed, and entitlement, victimization. you cannot do anything, certain racial and ethnic groups, without the government's help. my goodness, we spent $20 trillion on anti-poverty problems, yet there are as many today if there were when lyndon johnson began the great society in 1964, so clearly something is not working. as tromp said during the 2016 campaign to an american audience in north carolina, you voted for these people for 40 years -- what have they done for you? why don't you try something different? i think that is a great question. host: let's go to rick in randall's town, maryland, democrats line. good morning. caller: go ahead. mr. thomas, why don't you just admit that donald trump is a deranged, habitual liar, a guy

who cannot seem to accept reality? for four to five months, he lied to the american people about covid. the only reason we found out about it was because of one f woodward's book. tali. let's talk about the national deficit. he accumulated the highest national deficit and the highest trade deficit of any president in the history of the united states. ok? and let's talk about the riots from january 6. we all know why -- because a lot of people are going to be indicted. donald trump is in so much trouble, he is going to be indicted anyway.

tell the truth. stop acting like donald trump is this guy that we all know is a habitual liar, who is mentally deranged, and let's be honest with each other about it. guest 1: what you have got is undecided, sir, killington, chicago, murder rate up by double, triple digits in new york city, all these democrat-run cities and states like illinois. you can put the blame everywhere, but, look, we would not have the vaccine, and even joe biden, to his credit, did say the previous administration deserved credit for its operation warp speed, and we would not have the vaccine if trump had push the manufacturers to create it. i give biden credit for the distribution. this is the kind of agreement we use to agree on, one party gets credit for one thing, the other party and the other president

gets credit for the other. i think this promotes unity more than this constant back and forth is a liar, you are a liar, you are ruining america, no, you are ruining america. let's agree on what we can agree on, and let's have a real debate instead of the name calling and the diminution of other people. i don't like it when trump does it. i do not like it when anybody does it. it does not solve anything. host: john nichols, let me get your reaction to our other story that we have been talking about today, that from west virginia senator joe manchin, and victor has this tweet, "first it was joe lieberman, now it is joe manchin. the democratic party keeps harboring these lone wolves that end up eating the children from within its walls when power is given to them. this is your generational fight, and you cannot give up," some of that sentiment we are seeing on social media with the announcement that senator joe manchin will not import the for the people's act. guest 2: i am glad to talk about it.

one thing that was brought up by the pastor a moment ago in his call, and i will lead into this. they talk about a lot of things, including the failure of gerald ford. the fact is that richard nixon should have been impeached and the process completed. and it went on similarly with donald trump. we don't have accountability for presidents who do damaging things. as a result, i think that feeds into the division, and i do think that social media and a lot of other forces now amplify that. put out the core of it, at the heart of it all, we need to get to some sort of accountability in regards to doing the right thing, and the failure to hold

trump to account will be a failure, a stain of the senate, for a long time. in regards to joe manchin and the so-called lone wolf in the democratic party, i would say both parties have this situation, and both parties get very angry with their individual members who step out and vote in conflict with the party. you see john mccain do that, lisa murkowski do that, the republican party. in the democratic party, now you have joe manchin doing that. here is what i would suggest about it. i think that you can talk and talk and talk about joe manchin. what we need to do is talk about joe biden. joe biden sold himself as a candidate for president as someone who knew these senate and who knew how to get some things done. 36 years in the senate, another eight years as vice president. he spent a lot of time recently

sitting down and negotiating with republicans, including the republican from west virginia. my sense is that joe biden's mistake at this point is that he is not negotiating with democrats, and i think that joe biden really ought to be spending a lot more time trying to figure out how to get joe manchin back into that circle, because i do not have any problems -- i have no problems with the senate using reconciliation to pass major pieces of legislation, and also other pieces of legislation drive before the for the people act, i have no problem with the senate doing that, because that is what happens in a democracy. that is what happens in most countries around the world, when you elect a government, and when they have a majority, obviously they have to pull their majority together, but then they have to govern. i think this is a real problem for joe biden in that, you know, the republicans will seem to

say, oh, yeah, we love to talk, but it does not go anywhere pit i think he needs to spend more time getting democrats together and passing pieces of legislation rather than, you know, doing a back and forth. with so-called moderate republicans. host: joe manchin will be on two programs, fox news sunday and cbs' "face the nation." be sure to get the free c-span radio app. bonnie has decorated this to you, cal thomas. "we the people need to send you to the floor of the senate as well as the house and give them a lecture to get them back on track." guest 1: i would probably be arrested if i trespassed on the property, but somebody asked me if i ever thought of running for public office, and i said it crossed my mind once, but i took two aspirin, laid down for a

while, and it went away. host: kathleen is joining us, republican line, in los angeles. go ahead. good morning. caller: good morning. i am a black american woman. i graduated from ucla and uc berkeley's law school. and the most, the best education i ever received was from the free online courses offered by hillsdale college, which i am very much involved with and taking all their courses. one of the courses i took was on the constitution. now, the progressives -- which are actually regressive -- have been in power since theodore roosevelt and woodrow wilson. they have established -- for 120 years, they have established bureaucrats in charge.

we see that with fauci. you see the emails that are coming out now, right? and in this and is it if -- in this innovative state, the elite in d.c., in politics, this is what the founding fathers have talked about, the elite in d.c. have been in control, and they are not working for the best interest of the american people, which the founding fathers wanted them to do. that is the only interest that the constitution requires, that the constitution wires that the government works for the people, the american people come up with their consent. host: kathleen, thanks for your call. john nichols, we will get your response. guest 2: i agree with a lot of what she is saying. we do have a situation where the elites have immense power. i do not think most of the

elites are in government. i think the elites tend to be in places with money, to support particular candidates, and hiring lobbyists and really influencing politics, and also really influencing the focus of where the media is on issues. i do think we have a great challenge in the united states. i was intrigued that the caller mentioned the progressives of a century ago, and i think there is a lot to criticize as regards to woodrow wilson, and particular. but it is also important to understand that progressives -- i come from wisconsin. progressives don't agree on all these issues. there was a great fight. the argument was you had to have more democracy in order to solve the problems of the republic. the answer to any problem with democracy is more democracy, and

i tend to hold that view very strongly. my sense is that we have tremendous elite influence on our government, and then within government, we have some very good people who try to do their job and i think often do a very good job of it. we also have some very good people who go to the house and the senate, as democrats and republicans. but there is so much pressure on them, and that pressure comes, you know, again, from money in politics, it come from lobbying, it also comes from a very dysfunctional system. we draw our congressional district in a way that makes most of them noncompetitive. as a result, those district are decided in a primary, and you end up in a situation where the most extreme person is often -- not always -- in a primary comes through and then goes up to washington. and so if you want to deal with the challenge of elite power,

and if you want to deal with some of the dysfunction of our country, i would take us back to the for the people act, which seeks to address money and politics, which seeks to address the influence of lobbying, and, frankly, seeks to address the issue of gerrymandering. i agree we have a lot of challenges with elite influence on our government, which is greater now, perhaps, than at any time in history, and it does need to be addressed. unfortunately, senator manchin suggests he is not prepared to do that. host: the work of john nichols is available at thenation.com, and cal thomas has his own website. guest 1: kathleen, i do not think you will be invited to any ucla dinners, but hillsdale college. that is great. i have never seen a journey like that. i have a strong proposal to fix a lot of this stuff in washington.

every government agency has been created by an act of congress or a charter or. . a piece of legislation in that charter or legislation is it statement or its purpose. any head of those organizations should come before congress every two years to five years and justify not just its budget but its existence. if it isn't fulfilling the charter or legislation that it was designed or and created to do and cannot be done better by the private sector, we keep it, whether liberal, conservative, republican, or democrat. if it fails, we get rid of it. as reagan used to say, the only proof of eternal life in washington is a government program. host: this is the headline from cbsnews.com, from former house speaker paul ryan, slamming trump in a speech about the future of the republican party cannot event that we carried live.

it is available on the c-span public library, at c-span.org. [video clip] mr. ryan: we are used to big in american politics. 2020 left republicans powerless in washington. even worse, it was horrifying to see a president come to such a dishonorable and disgraceful end. so, once again, we conservatives find ourselves at a crossroads. and here is the reality that we have to face. if the conservative because depends on the population of one personality or second-rate imitations, then we are not going anywhere. voters looking for republican leaders want to see independence and mettle. they will not be influenced by people flocking to mar-a-lago. we when respect by staying

faithful to conservative principles that unite us. this was true even when the person leading our movement was as impressive, polished, and agreeable as they come. maybe you recall ronald reagan's proper words in the proper farewell address of a successful two-term president. here is how he acknowledged his reputation as a great communicator. he said, thought it was my style or the words i used that made -- and it came from the heart of a great nation , from our experience, our wisdom, and our belief in the wisdom that have guided us for two centuries." now, president reagan may have been underwriting his talent just a bit, but he was right.

leaders come and go. it is only the cause that indoors. -- endures. that is critical right now. host: former house speaker paul ryan. we will get some reaction. john nichols, we will start with you. guest 2: paul ryan come from my state of wisconsin. he was my mother's congressman for many years. my mother being much more liberal than he. he was always very gracious. my mother turned 90 the other day. host: happy birthday to your mother. that is wonderful. guest 2: thanks. i think paul ryan showed his great speech, that speech was a classic paul ryan speech, but i will say i would have preferred he gave that speech four years ago. we had a call a little while ago from a pastor up in ithaca, i believe, and i will suggest you

that one of the root causes of many of the challenges we have today is that the conservative movement, and cal will speak to this much more wisely than i, but the conservative movement did have it set of core principles, got so enthralled of donald trump, particularly in his first couple of years when he was in office, that they facilitated trump to such an extent that i think they did a tremendous amount of damage to, frankly, to the clarity of the movement and the clarity of the party. and i would wish that paul ryan had spoken out much more forcefully back in 2017, 2018. with that said, i will commend his remarks i think much of what he said the other day was quite useful. host: cal thomas, a couple of tweets. "paul ryan is the head rino and

never trump." and this from michael who says speakers ryan and boehner are favorites of the mainstream media, two that ran away from congress when things got difficult for them, the emphasis on "warmer" for both of them. guest 1: he attracted voters to the cause. i wrote in a column myself to understand the anger of this country, people are, a lot of people are very upset that the government to which they pay much in taxes, a government that regulates everything from their ability to gather together, wear a mask, and do all of these other things. the pandemic, often conflicting

information, doesn't really speak to them. they want the government to go back by the boundaries established by the founders of the constitution. government is a last resort, not a first resource. it is not about getting along. getting along is good. john and i get along. i get along with a lot of people on the other side of myself politically, but it is about solving problems. i think this constant name calling back and forth does not solve anything. and i do think paul ryan was right, it is not about personality. it should be. personality can be helpful, and certainly reagan has a great house analogy, but trump -- a great personality, but trump's personality is corrosive. i know nancy pelosi, steny hoyer -- i am a native washingtonian. these are people i have had meals with, socialize with.

we need to promote the general welfare. that is what we used to do in america. we don't consider any idea coming from somebody else, whether it is trump or biden, and a consideration. that is the source of a lot of angst and anger in this country. host: cal thomas doing is from miami. john nichols joining us for madison, wisconsin. this tweet, "at least paul ryan was not a clown like trump or a wannabe clown like ted cruz or matt gaetz." getting back to your cause, allen in east chicago, indiana, good morning. democrats line. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. a longtime viewer of "washington journal." best show on television. mr. thomas is getting involved

in a little bit of gas lighting, or he might've lived in an alternate universe there . i remember two weeks after president obama was elected, a guy named mitch mcconnell, who i had never heard of, came and said "we will never do anything to help this president succeed." i kind of brushed it off, i did not know who he was. i said that is ridiculous, we have two wars going on, we had the greatest recession since the depression, what american would not want the president to succeed? and then i found out, the next eight years, the republican party was the party of "no." a did not matter what president obama did -- he bent over backwards, he went to their enclave in baltimore talk to them, what can we do to work together, and john boehner says it is not up to the president to tell us how to do our job, and they just said no.

and now we are right back at the same situation with president biden. i hope president biden -- well, some people are aware. republicans never want to work with him on anything bipartisan. it is just not going to happen. host: alan, thanks for the call. let me bring in susan is welcome a republican caller from seminole, florida. what is on your mind today? caller: i would like people across the country to know that what was cast in 2020, donald trump, jr. led the calls, not once, not twice, all republicans across the country to go and obtain an absentee ballot from their tax collector's office and vote for his father because it was the safest way to vote. while his father's rallies across the country,

spreading covid, said they were fraudulent. there is no reason why they should be recounting these votes over and over again, because we republicans, democrats, and independents obtained the absentee ballots and voted for joe biden, because we were tired of the lion, the cheating, and that -- lying, the cheating, and the leader, ruler that is all about himself and not about we the people. host: susan, i will leave it there. john nichols, let's begin with you. guest 2: sure. i will come up with our first caller a little bit. look, i do think we are at a point where there is a desire on the part, frankly,, frankly, of donald trump, who we talked about probably more than joe biden today, a desire on the

part of trump in his efforts to try and relitigate the 2020 election, which they have a right to do so. to go back to the first caller, joe biden and the democratswon 2020 election. they have a control of the white house, the house of representatives, and a narrow majority in the senate. as a result, they can govern. the answer to the old relitigation is to govern in 2021, 2020 two, and beyond. i commend the president for trying to find some common ground with the republicans. at this point, biden needs to start governing, and what that recovers us to look to issues or tools like reconciliation, look to reform the senate will, if possible and necessary, and move forward with major programs. it is important to remember that franklin roosevelt, the most effective president, i would

argue, of the 20th century, franklin roosevelt had many people calling him out from the left and right, but he chose to govern decisively. biden has a majority in the house and senate, but i would still argue that that is the answer for all of the debates right now. host: and a couple of tweaks, from lindsay, "joe biden did not receive 85 million legitimate votes. the caller has been misled." one of the comments from lawrence and, "until you can have a postelection audit of mail-in ballots that can match each ballot with a voter, no one will trust the outcome of any election." cal thomas. guest 1: i think that gets back to what we were talking about earlier in the hour, steve, ballot integrity, the credibility and the mind of most americans. the caller in the last segment had never heard of mitch mcconnell. i am kind of shocked at that. it sounds like an educated gentleman.

harry reid was an opponent of virtually everything republicans were doing. this is what democrats do when republicans are in power, and it is what republicans do when democrats are in power. this is the normal course of political life in america. one side tries to thwart the agenda of the other. whether it is good or not is something that we debate. but i am hopeful that we can get away from the personality. i think reagan was absolutely right, his policies, less than his personality -- although personality help advance the policy -- and self-deprecating humor. my goodness, when have you heard a word of civility from donald trump? i must say, i was sickened last night by some of the language that i will not repeat here that trump used. i think a very strongly religious state like north carolina, that is going to offend some people, using the "s" word, referring to hell over

and over again, "damn" and all these others, this is not the language that is energizing to particularly religious voters. i think an alternative is offered in 2024, there is a chance that somebody with a different personality, a different lifestyle, and a different set of >> cal thomas joining us from florida. john nichols who is in with constant and his new book. gentlemen, to both of you, thank you for being with us. host: we remember d-day at 77 years ago as our fathers and grandfathers played a key role.

also a look at another aspect of d-day. it is called "d-day girls." the author of that book, sarah rose, joining us in just a moment. back in a moment. ♪ >> originally, i saw technology as neutral. i thought of it as just a tool and we used it as a tool. yet when i saw it visited upon people of certain ideologies, the flow of information, viable information constricted, when i

saw the profession of these big tap -- tech companies and i saw them turn their back on that after saying explicitly that was something they wanted to do and that is why they created the platform, to me it became a conservative issue. >> the conservative policy and how some view big tech censorship. watch "the communicators" on c-span2. >> washington journal continues. host: the book is called "d-day girls: the spies who armed the resistance, sabotaged the nazis, and helped win world war ii." the author is joining us from new york, sarah rose. thank you for joining us. guest: thank you for having me.

host: how did you come across the story of these re-women. guest: i was interested in women in war. i was looking for a story about women in warfare. . there was always a feeling for the first person crossing the finish line. i thought i would get someone in iraq or in iran and i thought it was the story behind it and the book open up to me these are the first women in organized combat who were given the answered the command and they were soldiers and we have not heard about them.

host: the invasion took place 77 years ago today and we see the images but what role did these three women play in terms of that operation? guest: france was occupied and there was not an allied soldier on the continent fighting back. at dunkirk, we take everyone away and we don't return for four years. churchill had the idea and it was a vague idea that even if we couldn't go face-to-face against hitler's, the anger is something that could be militarized.

what did he have to lose? why not term a force -- why not arm a force that would weaken the enemy and on that day rise up and really attack the enemy, and it worked. we don't hear about that. we hear about the beaches and landings and they are dramatic. to all of these units underground. this is what we have been training you for and organizing. in the morning, this was isolated. this matters.

we hear a lot about the push off of the beaches to get into the cities. it took three weeks because the french resistance had thoroughly damaged the infrastructure that they needed to get to the beaches. it wasn't the critical determining factor, but it did help. host: i am reminded what dwight eisenhower said in his address, saying they were part of a great crusade. the letter is available through the world war ii museum that we are showing on our screen area and did these three -- screen. did these three women understand what it was all about? guest: they did. let's get some background into these three women. they were recruited in 1942. this was the lowest moment of the war. it is the height of the japanese

empire. no one had won about they were getting bound in britain. everybody who can be put to war has been put to war. they need native french speakers, because you have to send in people. they are going to drop in and they need to be deeply under cover. and they also have to be able to fully french. there is a manpower shortage, so they start recruiting women in each of these women were affected by the war. the mother of three girls, her husband is away. she has a british passport and

she is called. and they said you have a skill we need. she says yes. she is not enjoying her life. she says, what happens to my girls, my daughter's if written falls -- if britain falls? if that happens, what life do these little girls have die will do everything to protect them and their future. a woman was young and had worked getting pilots out of france, a kind of underground railroad. she was good at it and an asset to the allies until someone blew her network. she got out and then said let me

go back to war. she did not think she had done enough for france and could be useful to france. a british colonial, a french speaking colony captured in the napoleonic wars. she is french speaking with a british passport. she is a fashionable, smart. the date hitler's roles in she becomes an enemy alien. each has a personal motivation for joining the war and they were intensely patriotic. nobody liked what was happening in france. host: you tell incredible stories about how they were literally able to get past the nazi soldiers. explain. guest: one thing that was fascinating was the demographics of occupation territory are almost entirely female. none had been killed in the

battle. in world war ii, they were working in histories fact -- hitler's factories. all of the officers were kept throughout the war. french officers were not allowed to repatriate. the men are gone. when you send a woman behind enemy lines in an occupation, it draws attention. what are you doing here? all the men are gone. they had a natural advantage from being female. they became really good at their jobs. they were the first female paratroopers, sanitize -- sabotage agents. they are also building networks that will be on the normandy coast for the day, whenever it comes, the allied armies return.

every single one of those pockets of resistance were armed and trained by these women and their colleagues. host: we are dividing our phone lines for this segment. if you are a world war ii veteran or had a family member who fought in world war ii, (202) 748-8000 for all others, (202) 748-8001. it began in june and continued to august. here are details on exactly what happened 77 years ago as the allied troops landed. 156 thousand total, 73,000 american soldiers. the ramada had landing ships and aircraft. just over 11,000 planes. the casualties on d-day alone were 10,000 injured in the death toll was 4000. from june to august, those

killed or missing among the allies, nearly 73,000. among the french civilian deaths, nearly 20,000. sarah rose, how did you go about researching this book and where did you travel? guest: there were different phases. the first thing i had to do was learn how to get around. i can get around and archive but not good at speaking. these women were all ordinary women. they were ordinary women who happen to be french. they were recruited. there was a span of womanhood considered. there one skill was french. they were mothers, one was about to become a grandmother. they were nothing special in terms of the other skills they brought. i thought, i'm an ordinary

woman. if they were picked off the street and taught to be a paramilitary, i could. i jumped out of a plane. i tried to learn worse code. i built a radio -- i tried to learn morse code. i built a radio. it gave me respect for how they lived. i wanted to walk there footsteps. there was a commander in normandy throughout the summer of 1944. she was commander on d-day of the french resistance in normandy behind the lines. she bicycled everywhere. i knew where she lived. i bicycled the entire part of normandy to see what she felt. i spent a lot of time in the archives. host: as you travel through normandy, you really do get a sense of going back. it so much of it remains today.

you can still see, every day someone has yet another of exploded parts were found. host: are there descendants of these three women? were you able to talk to any of them in researching this book? guest: some were receptive and some weren't. i talked to families of other members. there was an organization that had 400 behind enemy lines. there is always a balance when you are researching, the feeling that if you are doing it on behalf of someone, where you can have a more 360 view. very few normandy veterans are alive.

i didn't have the opportunity to really build up relationships, but i could. i found that an advantage as well. host: from your perspective, why do you think so often those from this generation do not talk about -- did not talk about their experiences when they came back home? guest: one family member said we are english paired we don't talk about these things. all countries were traumatized after the war and were in bad shape. so it was traumatic.

everyone just wanted a job and to move forward. host: charles in white plains, maryland calling on our line for familymembers of world war ii veterans. caller: good morning, steve, and to your guest. i wanted to commend and praise and salute to the women who were the backstop and acted with great valor and contributions to the soldiers and the nation in world war ii. but i also would like to offer an addendum. my father was african-american and he was killed at the battle of the bulge in patton's third army during world war ii. as an african-american, i often

read women reminiscing about the things of how the black soldiers were treated in world war ii and how they had to go through heinous things and all kinds of derogatory names, inflammatory statements that were passed on from there fellow white american soldiers. i also want to mention that he fought for the so-called freedoms for all americans, including myself, his son, and his other children to have the freedoms here in america to vote and to express themselves and to

ensure democracy. these promises were not delivered and have not been delivered to this day as we have confederates fighting against those tenets we all love and treasure. host: thank you for sharing the story of your father and for his ultimate sacrifice for this country. sarah rose, your reaction and comment? guest: i am with you. one part of the way we talk about war and tell war stories needs to take into account that nations aren't getting their needs met. so charles de gaulle did not give credit to women and certainly didn't give credit to black african soldiers are african-american soldiers from the west. he wouldn't allow himself to be

filmed beside black soldiers who did a lot of the work in beating back hitler's. that is -- beating back hitler's. . 75,000 of its own citizens sent to concentration camps to die. that is not the nation that charles de gaulle wants to build after the war. he is trying to build a strong nation. he thought they only met the cookie-cutter definition and it was white and male. so in part, because of the needs of the winners, we don't get a full picture. they are telling a story they need to tell to cast the narrative of where they want to go in the future. i think you are right. it continues to shock me how we

hear so many of the same refrains that we heard in the nazi era right now that we aren't talking about this as history but it is current events. host: you can follow the work of our guest at sarah rose.com. this is from communist dog saying, did any of these women receive any metals of honor for their work -- medals for their work? guest: one woman who was incredibly hard-core said i don't want the queen to order me in a civil way. what i did was not civil. nothing i did behind enemy lines was civil. they were converted to military honors 50 years after the war. so they created a brand-new medal for civilians.

the young mother of three who was among the first women to receive the highest medal for valor available to any citizen. they were on her but not given the same as men. host: the book is titled "d-day girls: the spies who armed the resistance, sabotaged the nazis, and helped win world war ii." our guest is sarah rose. this is from eric and menlo park, california. he says, my mother was a linguist for general eisenhower during world war ii. she spoke nine languages and spoke about women in uniform and their ability to ignore the male criticism. it still amazes me that we have so much sexual abuse in the military today and adding thank you for highlighting the history of both sexes serving in world war ii. guest: that is extraordinary. the women were hard-core.

there was a lot of objections to sending women behind enemy lines. the argument was the enemy will rate them and use it as a -- will rape them and used it as against us. we want to send women into battle? every military has taboo about keeping women and children out of war. what we have learned is that women will be much more likely to be raped by their own military. jim in -- host: jim is the next caller. caller: back to one of the callers who called about the promises broken p there is a great quote is that those who can make you leave in absurdities can also make you

commit atrocities. it is sad that we as athe knowu >> i read a book that was -- but the same thing. it was a great book and i'm going to read your book. it's that a lot of them. how she smuggled the jewish children out of the warsaw ghetto.

that was after world war ii when the russians came in. how she was beaten and abused by them. i think she died when she was about 94. i appreciate what you've done. i will go ahead and definitely read your book. host: thank you for the comment. sarah rose. guest: there are number of good fiction books. a number of great fiction books that are out there right now. the nightingale, other things that touch on these moments. having spent a couple of years in archives, i have to say the things that went on behind enemy lines. the stuff that happened is so much more interesting. i read nonfiction when it comes to world war ii and i write it. host: here's another tweet. thank you for honoring the spies of world war ii. without them the were would have

-- the war would have different. did these three women communicate often? how did they get their information? what was it like? guest: these three women were part of networks that communicated with london daily. they were communicating back and forth. we need these many canisters of weapons on this field on this night. or send us more agents. whatever it was, they are having a conversation back and forth. at the same time, the germans are hunting for them by triangulating. it's a real cat and mouse game between these networks and learner and london. getting the information, getting the supplies behind enemy lines

and not getting caught. host: if you go to the website, they have a broadcast. how they got the information the night before the invasion and why they didn't tip off nazi germany? guest: part of the propaganda efforts was every night there would be a broadcast on the bbc to all of the people who sympathized with hitler's and people who were against. they delivered the news. they had poetry are little skits and place. it was a little pr efforts every night. there will be these fortune cookie gibberish. the rainbow gives rise to hope. things like that. it in these -- of these

networks, one would say i heard this corsica. that would mean let's strike this railroad on this night. you're going to go after the trains here. you're going to blow up that communications cable over there. it was also a general poem that was written and the nazis knew. lurking on the radio they knew this was the night -- working on the radio they knew this was the night. there have been so many false calls that anybody thought they just cried wolf. one was at his wife's birthday party. one said you kidding me. there's no way general eisenhower would announce his attack over the radio. they weren't prepared. they weren't ready. they've gotten a ton of flak. host: is very important, and

world war ii. our guest is sarah rose. this is a tweet from diane lake talking about her own experiences. my mom was a kid then, but she told us stories about her town being under nazi control read she would hear her parents discussing escape plans if anyone ever told on my grandfather. more of your calls. our line for world war ii veterans and family members. caller: i just wanted to make a comment. my father was a platoon sergeant . survived the war without a scratch and i just want to confirm he did not want to talk about the horrors that he must've seen. he just would not talk about the war.

on his papers it said three stars. he said three stars is three stars. that's just the way they were. they did not want to discuss it. to this day, i still don't know. three stars means three major battles, but i don't know what three major battles. the woman on the bicycle and the wax and how important they were to the war effort. thank. can't wait to read your book. guest: this brings up something interesting. war stories get told by men. war stories get told by men about men. if you censor the women, if they look at it with a woman's eye you start to see certain

patterns. if i were to pick one pivotal thing that changed the course of the war, it is obvious i might actually pick operational draft. more than anything, that allows our convoys to cross the ocean. it allows us to attack on d-day. i would go for the code, cracking that as the most important thing that allows us to win. that was worked on i women. 80% by women. overwhelmingly women. we have the same kind of thing in the u.s.. again, a female workforce. if you look at it that way, women won the war. women were the most important contributing decided. and i don't think it's a competition. i don't think anyone should play this game. i want to remind everyone that

those hidden figures are there. women are the hidden of d-day. women are the hidden figures of world war ii. host: the headline is the female who that's the female spies who helped liberate world war ii. -- the female spies who helped liberate world war ii. if you could ask them a question, what would it be? guest: wow. what would it be? that's a good question. i mean, i'm always interested in that moment of decision. she knew when she was being recruited that she would go to france. if she was even the opportunity, she was going to do it. i would want her to tell me that story again. it's a story she told her whole life. she is kind of the designated representative and i would still want to hear the moment she went from being a mother who protected her chosen in the

countryside to a mother who loved her children in the convent school and went off to war. i would want to hear that story again. host: diane is joining us from fayetteville, new york. caller: good morning. i would like to talk about both my parents and my mother was a young woman. her and her best friend in munitions and weapons warehouse in the current air force base. there were very proud. they did not get a lot of recognition. a lot of women did this because their husbands were at war and my dad was an airman. he was from oklahoma, one room schoolhouse. with the war and get tested. it was found that he had high intelligence for morse code. he was dropped with fellow

airmen behind enemy lines in philippines to set up radar so the rest of our wonderful veterans and fighting men could be safe. couldn't be more proud of him. also my dad, his parents. host: thank you for sharing your story. guest: they are all moving. at that moment in history where every single day we lose more and more of the veterans and survivors and memories. if you have the chance, if someone is still around i learned so much just by talking to my own mother who was a kid on d-day. she told me that what she remembers is a bunch of people surrounding her father's car with the doors open.

it didn't quite make sense to me, but she remembers listening to the radio. everyone huddled around the radio. everyone wondering what happened next. host: this is a tweet they came in. i sat down with my dad and recorded several hours of tapes. he was a premed student when we declared war. he joined the navy, served as an aircraft carrier, you talked about carolina training. caller: good morning. i would like to mention about my father-in-law, robert o'connell. he had two girls and was drafted and went to europe. he had the grim task of burying the dead. they did not have, or understand

what was going on with the scores of war the didn't necessarily come from bullets. it affected them greatly. after the war, he was a hard-working guy. he was a weekend warrior and eventually that took him down. that's my greatest recollection of my bride's father who suffered the scars of war from the battle and burying the dead at that time. host: thank you. guest: we've learned so much more about ptsd and battle feed fatigue -- battlefield fatigue. we need to pay more attention to what people ring back from war and the scars that we don't see. in the jewish community we hear

about what happens to the children of survivors and how they inherit that children. i think there's something to be said for that. host: you mentioned that you parachuted, hopped on a bike and tried to relive the path of some of these women. what did you see and what did you hear? guest: that's a wonderful question. i wanted to see it through their eyes. i knew where these women lived. i knew where their enemies lived. i wanted to walk in the area. she second-in-command in normandy on d-day. she set up next to the nazi headquarters. her reasoning was they were my neighbors. i said hi. it they said hi. they didn't think of me as anything special. i was just the lady next door. she thought if it was a lot of coming and going, they wouldn't

notice when an agent would come to town and leave and never be heard from again. i wanted to see the headquarters. i wanted to see where she lived. i wanted to imagine that exchange. i wanted to have this book which is 100% fact read like you were immersed in the story. host: as you know there were more defeats from 1941 until 1943. 1940 four did prove to be a turning point, -- 1944 did prove to be a turning point for the u.s. and her allies. guest: this is why the pr effort was such a big deal. it was a way of speaking to the people and saying we remember

you. remember the ideals of liberty. if you are -- if you were in a neighborhood where the bridge went down, that means a few days before getting equipment to the front. you would hear that explosion. that would keep you going. those were ways in which they tried to raise the spirits of the occupied people until we could come back and have a decisive victory. host: your book came out two years ago. what kind of reaction has received? host: we have -- guest: we have crossed the 100,000 copy mark but you should still keep buying. my favorite thing is when a 12-year-old girl says i couldn't put it down because that is the ballgame for me. host: before we returned to calls, you are wearing a poppy which symbolizes what?

guest: remembrance. it comes from the world war i, but growing up in the midwest all veterans would hand these out on memorial day and veterans day. if you gave -- it symbolizes remembrance of the fallen. i have spent my entire life recognizing that so it seems like an appropriate thing to where. host: we enjoy hearing from those veterans. it thinking you for your service. ron is joining us on that line. caller: hello. my dad was in world war ii and korea. he fought for macarthur and the specific. he was already aboard a ship several weeks in pearl harbor

when pearl harbor got hit. he was on the way to australia. besides his brothers being in the navy, they, it's hard to say what they really tell you about what happened. the invasion of the philippines. the guards toward the korean war. his intelligence he was getting they were cia, but the fellow in charge was britt. he did not know what was going on. obviously, he wasn't giving them, the guards had a lot of yes-men working for them in japan. that's what caused a lot of fiascoes.

he wanted to get home and be elected president so he sold his hat and shipped it home early. dad never stop -- dad never talked about stuff like that. i know he saw a lot of things because the refugees were storming down out of north korea. he went up to the border. he was one of the people that had to go up and he saw no chinese. he went clear up and they came back and it had been two days earlier he would not have made it. he would have been killed with everyone that was wiped out at the chosen reservoir. host: again, some compelling stories. guest: i encourage everybody not just to speak to your family and

friends who lived through this, but a really great exercise is to say i know my debt was here on these three days at this battle and then go back and read the newspaper for every single one of those days. you get a real feel for not just what happened there but how it would have felt from this side with the information that was available at that time. i read every single newspaper from the summer of 1944 reporting from france. it was great. the international newspaper tells the story and it's exciting. the thing about living history is no one knows how it ends. every single one of the people in that first draft, they too don't know if the allies make it. it's an exercise of a fun time.

they are available online. it's fun. host: let me give you a moment to think about the answer. one fun or interesting fact about the three d-day girls reading can think about that. we go to tim and asheboro, north carolina. caller: good morning. i have recommendations for people who want to read about breaking of the code, particularly the ladies. code girls and fancy dabs -- d ebs. and between silk and cyanide. another book by circo -- another book, piercing of the right. and out shut up and let you answer. guest: our fascinating unknown

facts. the maps and codes would get printed on silk. paper dissolves, but silk you can so into the lining of your clothing. everyone is given their personal codes. they could rip off a little bit of the code and burn it. there will be no trace if they were to find you. in the middle of the war, silk was valuable and hard to get because it was being used for parachutes and other equipment. when this young coal breaker says i'm going to need silk to print these secret codes so that our agents stop dying because the codes are too easy to break. he is told no. he says to the man in charge, whether or not these people live or die is the choice between

silk and cyanide. taking a tablet that every agent was given crushing between your teeth so that they couldn't tortured information out of you. they went with silk. host: women where the hidden fingers on d-day. 80% of the encrypted code breaking were done by women in world war ii. this from david who says my uncle was a lead navigator and desk and a b 24 liberator. he didn't talk much about the war -- navigator and i'll be 24 liberator. he didn't talk much about the war. book become a movie? guest: i wish. if there are producers out there, come on and talk. so far, no movie deals but i'm quite open to it. host: fun facts about the three women. let's go through each one. what intrigued you the most? guest: the real aha moment, and

i think every historian has it. the moment where things come together. it was lisa. when i realized it's not, she helped -- she held the dinner parties. her second mission, she did not like the circuit she was assigned to. she went north where her brother was in command and she became his second in command. a woman was the commanding officer in normandy on d-day. she had rank, uniform, answered the command and control. that to me was mind blowing. that was the day the book just completely changed. we had not heard that story. it's still fascinating to me. we have not heard that story because men tell that story.

also because guys -- spies stories aren't supposed to be told. spies don't leave trace to reconstruct the story. they weren't just there. i had a lot of historians say things to me like women were just messengers. they didn't really do anything. they were in command of man. there were also there behind the beaches at that critical moment in the summer of host: i want to go back to the issue of communication. the bbc would provide codewords at the end of their evening broadcast. in the case of these three women, how did they know what to listen to, or what to look for and how to decipher what information they were given? guest: this is a conversation

going on back and forth between london and france. france is sending information. the details of any mission are being worked out between radio operators on both side of the channel. each woman has different lives in france. she wasn't much of an agent. she did not receive many in -- and she did not get much done. the paris was a hub for all of the networks and her job was to plant that tree so that the branches would be covering the whole normandy coast when d-day came. her communication would be people coming back in and out of paris he did -- she was a unit of one so she starts recruiting

frenchmen and did very little communication. she did not have a radio operator. she got to work independently. d-day of course was june 6. it was much more than a day. it was operation continued into the summer. what role do these women play after the initial invasion as nazi germany was beginning to fall? guest: as hitler's pullback on the beaches, they went back to a territory where the resistance was thick. the troops are looking at the end of the war and they are being -- and it is all losing -- using equipment. he's not just fighting in french -- in france. they've got so many weapons behind enemy lines.

the july 20 assassination plot against hitler's, that used british weaponry. it was in german hands. host: what about nazi sympathizers in france and how do they spot them or be aware that was a real threat? guest: it was a genuine threat. the first years of the war, nazi sympathizers meant you were french. nobody was super happy about hitler's coming through between occupied france and free france. nobody wanted to fight a losing war. hiller was there and he wasn't going anywhere. there was no hope -- hitler's was there and wasn't going anywhere. there was no hope. his right wing catholic government was something that a

lot of people supported. i think it's important to remember. france doesn't turn until stalingrad. once stalin beats back eastern france decisively, it becomes clear that hitler's armies aren't just, they are going to get stop somewhere. in 1942, the las went into north africa and american soldiers weren't -- they went into north africa and american soldiers were not trained. you start to see people actively accepted the state of affairs turn against the state of affairs and join resistance because there was the first moment that it was conceivable that anybody might win, that the allies might win. host: julia child's, probably

best known for bringing french cuisine into america's mainstream, few knew she had a dynamic career as an intelligence officer before she became a cooking icon. guest: it's critical to make clear these were not primarily intelligence officers. we think about spies, cloak and dagger. these were sabotage agents, paratroopers, people bear to low stuff up. they were doing -- people there to blow stuff up. host: he says my father was born in 1910. he never talked about world war ii read my mother told me he taught people how to sabotage machinery during the war. this is how he would tinker with vehicles and fuel tanks and then cut off the switches. let's go to martha. caller: this is such a wonderful topic.

i like your amazing guest. i'm the daughter of a world war ii hero. my father was army lieutenant joseph gould who was in the oss. office of strategic services which was the precursor of the cia. he was in something called the labor desk in london working under arthur goldberg who became supreme court justice. my father organized the tool missions. what he did come of the video you are showing is so awesome. exactly what he did. he recruited german communist ex-pats who come to london and he ousted them with parachutes and walkie-talkies. the original two-way

transmission walkie-talkies, and airdropped them back into germany. one was able to go in and tell his parents he was there as a spy. the story goes on and on. it's absolutely fascinating. there is a double agent involved named ruth warner a.k.a. sonja. it goes on and on. my father met with ruth warner after she wrote her biography. when he went back to berlin to meet the family members, later on my brother wrote up of monograph. the oss published and available on amazon.

it's so awesome that we are having this second generation of people who live this stuff with their parents. one more thing, i want to put in the plug for the new museum. it's being funded by lockheed. the whole history of intelligence and -- intelligence in our government. i can't member what it's called, but if our guests know please do that. mr. charles pink is the former president of the oss society and he will do a wonderful segment on this new museum which i'm helping -- hoping to participate. host: so good to hear from you, barbara. we will look into all of that. sarah rose, what do you hear in barbara's story?

guest: it's exciting that she was so talkative. as we've learned from some of the children of that's, these stories get lost. it's exciting that you have so many and they are going to be commemorated in the museum because the stories are great. host: another story from steve. caller: i didn't have to wait for long. i'm just so happy to get in. the poppy seeds, i can remember in the 50's my grandfather. i can see him selling buddy poppies. i can remember. my story has to do with my roses. my father-in-law, uncles were all at the same time. none of them were hurt except my father. he has several funny stories he loves to tell. he was coming off the ship. things are exploding.

he's coming off the ship, looks down and there's blood all over his leg. he never felt the thing, but he said he probably have been hit by shrapnel. he said he just turned around and walked back to the ship. that's how he got his purple heart. the interesting story is that my father-in-law and dad were on the same island at the same time 800 miles apart, half a world apart. they never met, but they were probably within. my father, he tracked macarthur from australia to japan. my father finished the war two months after they dropped the bomb in hiroshima. the one thing he knew no

japanese, but the one thing he remembered and felt good about was people were bowing to him. this is two months after the bomb. he said that the one thing that he was so happy about was the word for hello in japanese is old pio -- in japanese is ohio. host: i'm going to jump in because we are short on time. thank you for sharing your insight. we have time for one more color. izzo world war ii -- this is out world war ii veteran. caller: fort payne, alabama. my dad was. his name is tommy the quentin lloyd -- tommy lloyd.

he taught me -- he told me quite a few stories. ever since they come up with the memorial for the world war ii vets, off had -- i have had a great desire to go there where he landed in place for him. it breaks my heart to see most of them are about gone. host: vincent, thank you. what are you hearing from those two callers? guest: i would encourage everybody as soon as it's safe to go visit normandy and the beaches and exams because it really does make history come to life. i think that's the whole point. for any documentary, any movie we watched. these are the sights and sounds that will preserve this important moment in time.

prevent another uprising of fascist movements. i think that the loss of living memories is part of why we are seeing so much. that's for at least while the survivors and veterans were around. it was not socially ok to think hitler's was all right. we are losing more and more day by day. that is why we rca this return. -- that is why we are seeing this return. host: based on your research, if we were in normandy years ago, what would we be seeing? guest: there would be higher were, the fire mark -- there

would be fireworks, the fireworks being ordinance. we would be indoors. it would be a terrifying night. now you are the battleground. your home is the place of the biggest fight the world will ever know. host: 77 years since the d-day invasion, chronicled by our guest, sarah rose. the book is titled " d-day girls" joining us from new york, thank you for being with us. we are back tomorrow morning at 7:00 a.m. eastern tomorrow morning. book tv on c-span two, merrick

-- thank you for joining us on this sunday, the 77th anniversary of d-day. we are wishing you a great week ahead. ♪ [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> this week antony blinken comes to capitol hill to testify on the president's 2022 budget. he will appear before a house foreign affairs committee and monday at 2:30 he testifies at the subcommittee on foreign operations. you will answer questions from a

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