conversation about hardship on the u.s. today and falling property levels. later, washington times reporter alex swoyer talks about the supreme court and legal issues in the news. we look forward to joining the conversation with your calls, text messages and ♪ tweets. ♪ host: the economy added 263,000 jobs last month, the on employment rate fell to 3.57% but most americans are living paycheck-to-paycheck, including higher income earners. are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? what is your experience? the lines are split up by income. if you earn less then $50,000,

the number is (202)-748-8000. if you earn between 50000 and $100,000, call us on (202)-748-8001. if you earn over $100,000, (202)-748-8002. you can also send a text at (202)-748-8003. be sure to let us know your name and city and state. we are also on facebook at facebook.com/she spent in twitter and instagram @cspanwj. welcome to. "washington journal." i want to show you an article from cnbc and numbers. cnbc says, unrelenting inflation is driving up costs leaving more americans living paycheck-to-paycheck. with the no break in sight

nearly two thirds of all americans are living paycheck-to-paycheck, even top earners say they are stretched thin. it is a 61% current rate which is up from 2021 living paycheck-to-paycheck. that is 33.5 million americans say they spend more than they earned the past six months. 45% of those making more than six figures are living paycheck-to-paycheck. we also wanted to show you here is the front page of "the wall street journal." it says, data shows cooling signs. the u.s. labor market lost momentum in september but remains strong as high inflation

and rising interest rates weigh on the economy. courtney brown is an economic reporter for axios. welcome to the program. guest: thank you for having me. host: over these numbers in line with expectations? guest: they were. economists expected the economy to add 250,000 jobs less above. it was a little bit to the upside. i think economists were pretty pleased with the reports. jobs growth is slowing. that would normally be bad, but right now it is a good thing because the fed and biden administration want to be in a labor market cool down to take the pressure off. host: the fed has recently raised interest rates several

times. is that bringing down inflation? is that cooling the economy as intended? guest: right, the federal reserve is raising rates at a pace that has not been seen in a long time. they have raised interest rates five times since march, including three back to back to back 75 basis point rate hikes. which does not sound like a lot but that is a huge move for the fed. at the same time, we have seen inflation in the most recent report keep rising. why is that happening? wanted, interest rates take a while to filter through to the economy. while we have seen the effects of the fed's actions in the housing market, for instance, i am sure you have noticed mortgage rates have gone up. but inflation has remained stubbornly high.

what we are looking for for the rest of the year is, how does the fed handle that? do the hit the brakes on the economy even harder to try to tackle inflation? or do they slow down and see what affects the moves may have already had on the economy? right now, it looks like a lot of people expect the fed to raise rates by that supersized amount, 75 basis points, after meeting in november. host: in your article for axios you said fed chair jerome powell warned there would be, quote, "paying for household." what kind of pain are we looking at? guest: i wish i knew. we did get a hint in the federal reserve's projections at the last policy meeting.

they wrote of expectations for where they expect unemployment to be. that they forecast maybe a million people will have to do lose their jobs. that assumes what they think will happen will happen. but the fear is if we keep getting labor market numbers like the ones we got yesterday for the september jobs report, it is clear jobs growth is slowing down but is it slowing down enough? the fed may think it is not and for that reason they may feel the need to be more aggressive. the higher the odds will then be there will be pay for household and that could be more painful. host: how is the labor participation last month and the average hourly earnings?

when did those look like? guest: the labor force participation rate, which sounds dirty but it is the share of people who have a job or actively looking for work, that ticked down a little bit. which is not particularly reassuring for the fed when you have 57,000 people exiting the labor force. in august, we saw a huge amount of people entering the labor force. what happened in september a racist those gains it -- erases those gains a little bit but a lot of people are reentering the labor force. there are so many stories about how companies cannot find workers and that is putting pressure on wage growth. we saw another month of average

hourly earnings rise 0.3% month over month. that is roughly the same pace in august. it is slowing down from the breakneck pace we saw earlier this year, but that is a pretty strong level. something that is concerning to the fed that thinks the inflation pressure is coming from the labor market and this intense competition for workers. host: regarding the jobs lost during the pandemic, have all those been added and are we beyond that? guest: right, yeah, we have surpassed the pre-pandemic level of payroll. we fully recovered but it is interesting. where these jobs are is not the same as where they were before the pandemic. for instance, there has been this head scratching development

in the public sector where government jobs are stubbornly remaining below pre-pandemic levels. it is curious because governments were given scrutiny and i think the question is, when our states and local governments going to use the relief money to help the employment front? we have sectors where employment has fully recovered and then some, helping bring the overall level of jobs up. but then there are local and government employment where jobs growth has not returned to pre-pandemic level at all. host: courtney, how would you rate the overall health of the labor market right now? guest: the labor market is really strong for better or worse. it is slowing from the rapid

pace of job gains we saw earlier this year. while that may be interpreted as a bad thing, it is welcome development for the federal reserve. what we are experiencing earlier this year is not normal. a lot of demand for not enough workers and what the fed wants to see is that come more imbalanced. they hope that helps the inflation front and gets them closer to their goals of 2% inflation, which we are very far away from. host: corrine brown, axios reporter -- courtney brown, axios reporter, thank you for joining me. guest: thank you for having me.

host: are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? we are going to take your calls by income level. if you are under $50,000, it is (202)-748-8000. if you are between $50,000 and $100,000, it is (202)-748-8001. for those over $100,000, it is (202)-748-8002. let's hear first from marissa in montana for those under $50,000. caller: good morning, c-span. thank you so much. shout out to brian. i never see him anymore but thank you for being a light in the dark. hello to america. i am grateful to say hello to america and yes, i do not live paycheck-to-paycheck. i live way underneath. my 500 square-foot shack and i live way underneath.

i am blessed to live in america. i would like to say something to the whole country for a moment if you give me the chance. now we are talking about the issues. we are talking about inflation, the economy, climate change, we are talking about all the issues that are so important. we can build a bright new future if we keep an open dialogue so we can speak to each other. i am so grateful we are not just trump and trump and nothing but trump. i am so grateful to president biden for focusing on the issues and leaving the american people with open dialogue. we need our migrant workers. look what is going on in florida. they need help to rebuild. host: marissa, i am curious about how you are living. you said you are under paycheck-to-paycheck. what are you doing? how are you making it? guest: i worked really hard all my life and bought four rentals and i live in a 500 square-foot

shack. my shack is a shack but i live way underneath my means. i do not have to live paycheck-to-paycheck and save money is much as i can. i think i am 67 now but i keep myself in shape and try to contribute to the community. i really appreciate c-span. thank you so much for this time to address the nation. thank you. host: jeff is in indianapolis between $50,000 and $100,000. guest: i do not have to work paycheck-to-paycheck because i work in a high demand industry. caller: i work in the pharmaceutical industry. because of staffing shortages i can work more and save money and

deal with inflation. inflation is not an issue for me. gas prices are not an issue. i purchased a home in 202 and i have affixed0 interest rate of 2.5%. when i moved into my home, my energy costs dropped. i have been able to save a lot of money and put money in the bank. my economic situation is great. other folks may be complaining but my situation is great. one of the things i also want to tell the american people is quit listening to the media. they tell you the economy is so bad. i remember in 1979 when people had to pay 12%, 10%, 11% for a 30 year mortgage. today people are complaining about 6%. i don't understand. host: ralph is next in manoa,

new york under $50,000. caller: i am from upstate new york. i do not live paycheck-to-paycheck but when i vote in november i will keep those workers in mind. during the 2021 tax year, under the american rescue plan, we had the enhanced child tax credit and earning income tax credit. that really was two antipoverty fighters. people are able to use that money to buy a home and things like that. i hope during this midterm election voters vote with their heads and not emotions. if they do elect republicans and control the house and senate, these workers we are talking about, paycheck-to-paycheck, they will not see any gains. thank you. host: let's take a look at what

president biden said yesterday. he was in pennsylvania and he talked about the jobs report. [video clip] >> all across america, this is reality. we are proving our best days are ahead of us, not behind us. look at today's jobs report. our economy created 263,000 jobs last month. that is 10 million jobs since i have come into office. that is the fastest of any president in all of american history. historic progress. the unemployment rate remains at 3.5% unemployment. that includes the lowest unemployment among hispanic americans ever in the history of this country, the second lowest on black teenagers ever. this recovery has been the fastest increase of people reentering the workforce of any modern economic recovery. but there is something else. our job market continues to show resilience as we navigate

through this economic transition. for some time i have been saying what we need to do in this transition is move from historically strong economic recovery to a steady, stable recovery. we need to bring inflation down without giving up historic progress that working-class and middle-class people have made. that is exactly what we are seeing. over the past four months, we have created an average of 350,000 jobs a month. that is down from the 450,000 from the previous months in the 650,000 from the months before that. wage growth for workers remain solid, down from the high pace months ago, but still growing for workers who deserve a raise. this is the progress we need to see. in the short term, the transition to a more stable growth that delivers for workers

and families while bringing inflation down. host: that was president biden about the jobs numbers that came out yesterday. we are asking you this morning, are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? one reports that 61% of americans are living paycheck-to-paycheck, even higher income earners. let's talk to terry in cleveland, tennessee under $50,000. caller: this is terry and my wife. we are making $20,000 a year and barely hanging on by a spider web. it is unreal. we had it better when trump was in. host: are you working? are you and your wife working? caller: yes, but we also

retired. she is pushing 65 and i am already 67 and it is unbelievably hard on us. we worry about buying food, eg gs, and paying rent. is unbelievable. host: how are you managing? are you buying less food? caller: we are borrowing money and the high interest rate is like suicide. host: do you have enough to eat, you and your wife? caller: yes, we have enough to eat, but we cannot go out and but steaks or anything like that. we have to watch every penny and

counted twice before we spend it. host: i hear you. rod is next in brown city, michigan, under $50,000. how are things going for you? caller: i'm good. well, i had to quit my job because i could not afford the gas going to work. that was $100 a week in my insulin, they raised that to $500 a month. if i did not have insurance, i would get it for $50. but i have insurance so i have to pay $500. host: what insurance do you have given that you do not have a job? caller: blue cross blue shield and medicare. host: how are you managing? are you still able to get your insulin?

caller: barely. week by week if i got enough money. as far as groceries, me and my wife just eat beans. cannot even get chicken anymore. host: are you looking for a job? does your wife work? caller: well, i am blind in my wife, she works odd end jobs. host: good luck. eddie is in lawrenceville, georgia under $50,000. caller: how are you doing? host: good. caller: i am under $50,000 but on disability. i am blind but when trump was in office, when he first got into office, i did not make no money. it seemed it was higher grocery

shopping and bills were going up higher. when biden got into office in 2 021, i got all my stimulus. i used my stimulus to fight the inflation. i have insurance through united health and they added $240 something back to my social security. i put money away. host: so, you're doing ok? caller: yes, i am doing very good with biden in office. trump did not do nothing for nobody. when they raised the social security they raised it, like, 2%. on social security? that was an insult giving

somebody $1.25 on their social security. biden now in office, they still raising the interest rate on our social security. host: let's hear from arlington, virginia. eric is over $100,000. good morning. caller: good morning. yeah, we are doing just fine. i work for the federal government and my wife works for local government. all the stimulus that was sent to families like mine, frankly, we did not need it. i think it was bad policy and a bad move on the part of the government to just throw money away to people like me. that did allow us to be more helpful in our community, but also to the economists' point from a couple of minutes ago,

when you start looking, or hopefully looking at what happened in local government and why there are not more jobs happening, my wife works with the local government. they are all getting bonuses, retention bonuses, that they do not need. i think it is wasteful. host: you said you work for the federal government and there is a lot of open jobs in the federal government. are you seeing that your agency? that they are trying to hire and not able to find people? caller: in my part where our i work i would say no. i work outside the d.c. area so job hopping happens all the time. but i think people have been

used to teleworking and they are trying to find jobs, even within the federal government, that allow for the more remote work. host: virginia is in waldorf, maryland, $50,000 to $100,000. how are you doing? caller: good and how are you? host: good. caller: i am having a difficult time. i am retired and the grocery bills have soared. i was in the process of buying a home in the interest rates knocked me out of the market. it is overbearing. i have coffee filters, salad, and creamer and it cost me $54. it is ludicrous. why they are raising interest rate makes no sense. host: how are you adjusting? are you buying less food? i know you're not going to buy a

house now because you said you got knocked out of the market. caller: right. i am living on hamburger and things on sale, hotdogs, anything i can get a coupon on. it is ridiculous. host: are you thinking about going back into the labor market? you said you are retired. caller: well, i am trying. unfortunately, i am 71 and people look at that and say, forget it. i am very energetic and yet, i cannot get a job. although it is hard at this age. host: let's hear from -- there was a debate for the virginia 10th congressional district. inflation was a topic and this is an exchange between democratic incumbent jennifer

wexton and the republican challenger. [video clip] >> inflation is on the rise, impacting americans. what you believe caused the increase and what can congress do to address it? candidate wexton? >> there are a number of reasons. the main one being the pandemic economy. there was a shift in terms of supply and demand. people were not going on vacation, they wanted to buy more goods. at the same time, they wanted to fix their houses. the supply chain was shut down around the world making it harder to get products. we have the disconnect between supply and demand with higher prices. another part is putin's war in ukraine, cutting down global oil and gas. we worked very hard in the congressional delegation to

lower feud and fuel costs. the inflation reduction act will cut the cost of health care premiums and allowing medicare to negotiate drug prices and helping increase, or decrease, energy going forward. thank you. >> inflation began on day one of the biden administration when he put on all the regulations through executive order on the oil, chemical and gas industry. instead of relying on american workers who have clean practices we are now going to saudi arabia, venezuela, and even iran, iran, who are murdering women in the streets for protesting against morality. we can be energy independent. that is what caused inflation,

relying on other countries. host: we are talking about living paycheck-to-paycheck. are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? what has been your experience? the numbers are on your screen. diane in jacksonville, florida, $50,000 to $100,000. caller: good morning. i am blessed that i am living comfortable. i do not live paycheck-to-paycheck. i definitely live within my means. i am so sorry for the people who are struggling. fortunately, my husband and i are both retired and we retired with quite a large pension as well as social security. i will not say smart enough but

wise enough to have a savings over $100,000. i pray for all those who are struggling because i know there are families that are struggling. i would suggest everyone tried their best to live within their means. if you have two cars, sell one and live off of the one until you can afford two. whatever you can to cut costs and pray you will be able to adjust accordingly. i pray for everyone that is suffering. host: mike is in las vegas, nevada, $50,000 to $100,000. caller: good morning. how are you? host: good. caller: i am doing ok. i am 67 years old. i am going to have a pension.

i am going to work until lance 70 to put more into social security. we are dishing out more money including for food and gas than we ever did before. i don't see how these people who are living on $20,000 to $50,000 can survive. when you hear that inflation is a percent and eggs are 13%, honestly, i do not know where these people shop. if i was able to get a dozen eggs for $1.99 in january and in kroger yesterday it was $4.39, when you go to get coffee and the new price is $10.99, i do not know where these people shop and only see this small increase.

i am lucky. i do not live paycheck-to-paycheck. i am able to help my kids less and less because the costs keep going up. yes, it is a drain on everybody. host: sorry, mike. i thought you were done. lou making $50,000 to $100,000. caller: thank you for taking my call. i am doing ok but i have noticed since biden got into the white house he is beating the drum on how he created so many jobs. i remember donald trump saying he wanted more products made in america. i believe some of his plans have come to flourish. since biden got into office gas

up here is between $4.50 and five dollars a gallon. insurance has gone up, groceries have gone up. it is just me and my wife. she has not worked because she was in a car accident 20 years ago. it has been solely on me. groceries up here are $200 a week and that is not buying lobster tails. taxes have gone up, property taxes for me are $7,000 a year. my cars are 25 years old. host: how are you adjusting? caller: i have always been conservative. i worked two jobs when i was younger. now that i am older i have one job. my kids are grown and out of the house. i am very conservative, watch where i spend my money.

i buy what i need, not what i want. that is what my parents always told me. heating costs, let's see, electricity has gone up 20%, water 10% and my oil is $4.50 a gallon. it is going to be a rough winter. i want to retire but i'm having second thoughts. i hear these people are doing ok or getting subsidies and this and that. i do see a lot of illegals that drive nicer cars than me and have manicured fingernails, the latest iphone, decent clothing. i don't see them really working too hard. i know how they scam the system. host: let's check in on tweets from congress. take a look at some republican tweets. this is senator marsha blackburn saying, don't be full by biden's words today. the reality is inflation is

crushing americans. real wages are plummeting and gas prices are going up again. this is, sorry, a tweet from somebody. catherine says, the proper terminology is following a budget. my budget has been broken since a few weeks into 2021. i had an emergency fund of $1500, gone, without any emergency spent for gas and food as prices are skyrocketing. i ate outlast on my birthday in march. let's talk to javier next in racing, wisconsin next, under $50,000. caller: good morning. i think the prices have been noticeably impacted in our area. you can notice it at the gas pump and you can see where the

gas used to be $2.50, now it is at four dollars and five dollars. it is the recurring bill that happens every week. $60 to $100 to fill your tank. groceries as well. you can usually get away with doing $50 $200 by yourself but now it is going up to $150 or $200. it gets to be a major issue living paycheck-to-paycheck. it is the kind of thing you don't really want to see, especially when two years ago it was different circumstances. host: rosemary is next in new jersey, also under $50,000. caller: yes, and i want to say i don't believe inflation is our

problem only. this is a world issue. they are suffering in england, they are suffering everywhere. i am doing ok. i am 75. i get subsidies from the government. a rich country can give a 75-year-old woman disabled and make her comfortable. use your brains. if you know who to talk to and where to get the help you need, i am fine. i have food stamps, i get subsidies for my heat and my housing and i am ok. i think that blaming the democrats -- i am a democrat -- but blaming democrats in the midterms for inflation is ridiculous. it is not going to change anything unfortunately.

right now, we have everybody working and that makes wages higher and that adds to inflation. that is my take on it as a democrat. thank you. host: let's take a look at a few more tweets from congress. this is the house and education labor republicans. they said, yesterday potus attempted wins as americans heather 401ks wiped out by #bidenflation. andy biggs of arizona said, total propaganda. the biden administration took away millions of jobs during covid and these are just folks returning to the same jobs. millions more also have to work multiple jobs to offset the administration's raging inflation. some democratic tweets, all of

these acts, 10 million jobs have been created. democrats are putting people over politics and delivering. senator chris van hollen, this latest jobs report shows our economic recovery remains on track. while we still have more work ahead to ease rising costs and build an economy that works for everyone, it is clear -- the american rescue plan put us on the right path. joint economic committee democrat says, months of history making job gains enabled the united states to recover more jobs then were lost during the pandemic. america is back to work #jobsdata. we are asking about your experience. are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? cassandra's in charlotte, north carolina under $50,000.

caller: good morning. how are you? host: good. caller: i would like to say that i have served my country in the u.s. army reserves for eight years. i graduated college with a bachelor's degree in business management. and and also a single-parent. would like to say that, right now, affordable housing for me is not affordable. i am living paycheck-to-paycheck because of that. the rent in charlotte is extremely high and it is like, i cannot even make my rent sometimes. right now, i am working two jobs just to make ends meat for me and my son. even when medical care, they offer it at work but the prices alone of the plans are so high. host: are you getting any

support from the government? caller: well, i had applied and according to the criteria, you have to be almost at the poverty line. i am listening to people on the telephone speaking about their experience. but for me, every time i try to apply, i get turned away and they say i am making too much money. that is ridiculous. it is like the man was saying before, a couple of callers talking about the price of eggs. it is the same here. host: what are you doing? are you buying less food? how are you adjusting? caller: buying less food in order to pay rent and i have been to a couple of food pantries and the lines are ridiculous here.

it is just really hard. host: good luck. jeff is calling from nebraska, over $100,000. caller: thank you for having me on the show. host: good morning. caller: good morning. first of all, look at the corporate profits. corporate profits are helping create a large portion of this inflation. at the same time, we gave them ppe money to stay in business. they are double dipping. the corporations -- me personally, i am doing ok. i do not live paycheck-to-paycheck but i am not living exorbitantly by any means. i drive a 10-year-old car, living within your means. but i go back to what created this as well. if you looked at the global

pandemic we had and people like trump who knew about this january 30, and told a reporter in february and did not say anything to the people until march. how much time went by that they knew about the pandemic? they created a deeper problem. it is things like this they turn around and say, it is biden's fall. i'm sorry. trump helped create the problem by ignoring the bigger problem which was the pandemic. oh, it will go away. oh, it will be fine. just take an injection of bleach. forgive me but people have to look at what is happening around them and biden better start paying attention and pulling oil leases away from oil companies that demand more money and

reaping record profits. host: take a look at this quote from cnbc who says, although real average hourly earnings rose 0.2% for the month they remain down 2.8% from a year ago. which means those paychecks do not stretch as far as they used to. a separate report by bank of america found 71% of workers feel their pay is not keeping up with the cost of living, bringing the number of people who feel financially secure to a five-year low. we are asking about your experience. are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? how are you doing? melissa turns over $100,000 and is in greenville, south carolina. caller: hello, how are you? host: good, thanks. caller: great. i am reaching out because i do not work for a company, i work for myself. i have owned a restaurant for

six years and what people are not talking about is the cost of doing business and being a small business owner. i say $100,000 that is based off of 2021. but the rising food costs is a lot higher than what people are stating. last year, i can go by looking at the cost of goods that i was paying for things, such as frying oil and it was $17. today it is $65 for a three gallon drum. or things like french fries that were $20 for 10 pounds is costing a restaurant $55. a 20 pound bag of potatoes was $19. it is $70 now. host: that is considerable,

melissa. that is several times more expensive. caller: that's right and people do not see that. as a business owner, we cannot raise our prices to keep up with inflation. i used to have summer teenagers work for us for $11 to work the cash register. they are now asking for $17, $18. right down to the cooks in the back these to work for $15 and now asking for $25 to $30 an hour. i project if it continues down this path, i will close in a year. we can no longer keep up with the inflation across-the-board. my electricity for my restaurant was the same every month. it was $1400. host: i actually have a question. you own a restaurant.

are people eating out as much as they used to? do you have the same amount of customers wanting to eat out? caller: to be honest, 2021 was a very good year. 2022 it is not. i can see a decline about 50%, 20% -- 15%, 20%. i find the demographic that continues to eat out is 18 to 35. older than that it is maybe once every two weeks. but there is an age demographic that continues to eat out. when i speak to them as an owner to customer i would love to know what the generation is doing. they seem to be doing a lot better than my generation and i

am 48 years old. i have three children. things have changed and people are not talking about that. i know the grocery store has jumped but it has jumped 35%. i don't know where they are getting a percent. maybe in the supermarket, but it is sometimes 150% higher. host: i hear you. chris is in new york, sorry, cindy in connecticut, $50,000 to $100,000. caller: good morning. thank you for taking by call. we are ok. the only reason we are ok, barely ok, is we were blessed to have generational wealth. our parents passed away in the last several years and they grew

up in tenements in new york city. they were able to, you know, work their way up and buy a home. that is going to be going by the wayside because the current powers that be do not care for generational wealth. the gentleman that called and said this is trump's fault, he did let us know at the end of january. he closed the borders and things but forget about trump. this is not about trump and i am so tired of hearing of trump. another girl said the inflation is across-the-board and it is. it is partly because of russia and the pandemic but a lot of it is because of the climate change. look at what is going on in sri lanka and the dutch farmers. a lot of it is climate change

and trying to force people off of their farms. the infrastructure is not there and our president is in davos and so were republicans. they are the real culprits. we have had many food plants burn down and the culling with the bird flu. there have been almost 100 food plants that have been destroyed. i think people better wake up. there is more to it than just our president. is the whole davos, whatever they are doing. host: chris in new york, under $50,000. good morning. caller: hello? host: yes, can you mute your tv? caller: yes. i just wanted to say i am

actually not living in new york right now. host: ok. that's fine, bella head. -- go ahead. caller: all the policies put in place by biden -- i hate to say it because i do appreciate having a president like that in this country -- but he is an imposter. and he is doing a good job of it. if you want to do anything smart, vote him out. host: how are you doing? are you living paycheck-to-paycheck? caller: i am doing lousy. i am conservative. my four ok, at least i have that. i've think about going back to work and that will happen. you cannot retire in a country like this with no freedom. host: how old are you? caller: i call him a president

because that is his label. he is not a president. host: how old are you, chris? caller: i am 68. host: and what line of work are you think he about going back to? caller: probably going back to maintenance. host: ok. daniel is in stanford, texas, under $50,000. caller: how are you doing? host: good. how is it going with you? caller: actually, i get under $15,000. but the thing is rent is $8400 a year. that gives me $5600 to live on. i am on disability.

since i am on disability you cannot go back to work. they will not let me go to work. i pay $700 a month in rent. i get $5,000 a year to live off of and i pay $8,000 in rent. [laughs] the thing is the, what you call it, the increase -- host: in inflation? caller: they have not increased social security in quite some time. it makes it really difficult, unless you grow your own garden because groceries, have tripled. gasoline went up from $1.89 for

four years and it is up to almost -- it is up to $3.50 again. now we shut down our pipeline. we are importing oil instead of making our own. i live in texas. we have plenty of oil in texas and they have oil wells. all they have to do is produce. but they would rather import and have america pay somebody else for the oil instead of paying america for the oil. host: all right, daniel. cleveland, ohio under $50,000, clarence, caller: good morning. thank you for letting me call. we have to stop the trump thing.

since biden has been in office -- the midterms are coming. the republicans are going to take it all back. we need to straighten this out because i am living paycheck-to-paycheck. i used to work five days a week. i don't anymore. i take a pay cut and they got a pay raise. host: why are you working four days instead of five? caller: because all the customers -- i am in the metal business. i am 64 years old. i cannot retire. most of my savings are gone. i need money from other people to help me out. it is crazy. we need to get back on track for us, not everybody else. close the border. thank you. host: daniel is in sioux falls,

south dakota between $50,000 and $100,000. how are things going for you? caller: thank you for taking my call. i have been listening for a little bit and i think a lot of people out there have the right idea of what is going on. we do not go out to eat a lot. we are very frugal. also, i think it is not just a biden thing. i have listened to a lot of people blaming it is worldwide. i think that is what we have to look at to say, it is not us. we have a lot of issues around the world that are hurting as well as we are. we need to not blame biden but the last five presidents have not taken control of what we

need to do. infrastructure, pay raises and people that need to get by day to day. we should go to a flat tax that is fair for everybody. look at the money the oil companies are making. everything else is so high. i am sure why it is so high. they could come up with some reason even if republicans came back into the office, which they might, what are they going to do to bring everything down and even things out? i am not sure they are going to be able to do that but we have to sit together and be united as one. trump is gone. quit doing that. biden is doing the best he can. we may not agree with everything he does but we have to stick together as the united states and be one and support each

other. host: carol, north palm beach, florida under $50,000. how are things? caller: good morning. eggy gave her the opportunity to be here. i think the american public is ignorant. i think people don't understand enough about history and how this country got into deep debt in the first place. clinton handed bush basically no deficits. we got into the iraq war on a lie. we spent $5 trillion or more there. i think obama did a pretty good job getting people health care that was affordable. and i think biden is building on that. and trump dumped $5 trillion

during the pandemic, mostly to rich people and corporations and there was a lot of fraud that should have been prevented. if the pandemic was not caused by politics, the profit gouging is encouraged by republicans. republicans do not care about the average person in this country. republicans have gotten middle-class and sent jobs overseas for corporate profit. they have done nothing for the middle-class person in this country and there are very few benefits. the border is a long-term issue. for 30 years congress refused to do anything about it. meanwhile, we need workers in this country. farming, hospitality, and the

immigration policy needs to be reformed. congress is failing us. it is not president biden. he does not control prices. host: we are almost out of time. thank you you to everybody that called in during the segment of phones. next on "washington journalhe iy solutions initiative at the university of chicken and he will discuss poverty in the u.s. recent poverty levels. later on alex passed -- as bank -- swoyer discusses her pod and eagle issues in the news. we will be right back. >> booktv every sunday teachers authors discussing their latest books. on noon, tim scott talks about "

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shaefer. welcome. caller: i am glad to be host: we will be talking about poverty in america and if you want to call in to do that. i lines are by party legation so republic in, -- republican, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. pew research said that child poverty rate of fallen. what happened, why did it go down so sharply? guest: i think this is most remarkable story that people are unaware of. people have studied poverty and

when covid christ hit, -- right it, i miss judge the about a public right but i was -- i about poverty. the federal government a different approach to the hdnet. in the last two years and started the framework with a bipartisan framework of cash train for more broadly available. -- usually we were like we would do this thing for middle-class emily and report families. no there was a mansion of child credit. that was a broad-based program that provided a moderate cash sight. and what happened was remarkable.

and people say we have trouble putting food on the table. poverty goes, and not down. the child poverty rate have plummeted. child poverty in particular has dropped the percent and we are down to a 5.2% of children in poverty, 3.8 million children. that is out of 73 million in united is remarkable and the unprecedented in any year and in a year where we have had right and this is as money 21 -- is in 2021. host: the decline was in and to make a -- pandemic aid, so are

you acting poverty rate back up? guest: we are at a crossroads. overall appointment and we are getting many strong job we are at, the unemployment rate we have and 2021, the year that we had safety net is in place and in the -- full-time workers, 11 people so they we had increases. so those two things together and

show he can do and we are to go back to buy things right. next year if you had me on again, i am certain that without any change the a big increase in poverty across the board. right now we are being in the data is government provision -- government provision have dried up. one of the interesting things my plans were -- start putting about benson's. when went into brian we could see both things improve. but crossroads. host: i want to ask you about benson's check to our right. when the short property

management and the other the supplemental poverty measure. it is on the screen and we can kind of see both two graphs. what is there different? guest: property manager in play in the night when johnson plan on poverty. we happened testing the threshold for years and many thanks it is to allow. and we reported income, supplemental poverty measure, are many things not included because of -- and, so panic that and tax credits. lots of hourly debate we should

both things. people think that both our batch went to standing experience poverty not i taking into account government transplants. it is to adjust my geographic cost of living and we can have battery debate forever. you can see bottom right but pretty stable from 20 five 2019 from 2017 capital right. we have went back about whether. but in any one of we are making progress 2019 as we are ending

our economic expansion. in 2019 we have an employment right 3.7% poverty rate 5%. and by taking into account child tax credit host: we are talking about the child property right and we arrived there about about poverty way. guest: that we could have improvement. overly and because we have a robot customer program and using

poverty and health insurance universal among any information the placement implant that's impacting people this was a year that social security benefit many people, not above the poverty line and they are struggling. caller: you not talking about makeover being an impact right

guest: information we impact chains and 95 and a person challenge we have a huge impact on some that might happen inflation. find not impact information in

my what we see is a modest amount of money and that families spend it on necessities. and economists have come together to say this is the type of program that does not impace inflation. the most important thing to remember is that we have a perfect storm with inflation. federal goverment is moving to adresss it. people think they should have been acting earlier. we have some evidence that things are stabilizing.

host: you mentioned the tax credit. can you explain it? guest: it is based on a policy used in other countries that says kids are expensive and soecity comes along parents. all tax credits were things implimented during the tax code and families might get an added supliment. this says people a program where said hey, we have bills every month, so if we want to help people with food, with shelter, we are going to provide this modest stipend. we have seen worst in country after country, where child poverty fell dramatically. this was implement it for one year, for 2021, so july of 20

21, in december, we saw these small pavements of $250 per older child, $300 per month for children under six. the irs did an incredible job. we did not get all kids, but we got a huge chunk of them, and you can see all of these outcomes and proofs. one of the fascinating things is that people have more gave in their back account. we have evidence from tens of millions of bank accounts. credit scores improved, and then when that policy goes away, you can see a lot of those trends start to reverse, and families have a little bit less give. host: all right, let's talk to flora next, who is an independent in ohio. caller: good morning. hi. i'd like to know -- i'm a senior first of all.

there's weeks that i feel better than others, and i could work a couple more hours at work, because they really need people, but i have to worry that my check is going to get cut if i do care what can you say about that? guest: i totally agree with you. i think that is something we should look very closely at. i think you are on, perhaps, two different programs, so under old age social security, this should not impact you, but under disability, that would. and you should be able to work on those days when you feel better.

work requirements might get imposed, but there has to be a way to do it where you would be able to go out and work, especially during a time when we need workers, and actually one of the biggest impacts in the labor market, as i understand it, is people in their 60's who are retiring early, right? and those are a lot of workers that are losing, they might have stayed for a few more years, but they decided to leave or exit earlier. we should be looking at a lot of policies that make that easier, especially for someone like yourself, so i am in total agreement. host: ed is in pennsylvania. caller: ed o'donnell. one of the main causes of inflation and poverty is obscene ceo salaries, $67 million a year, and not just ceo's salaries, but professional athletes taking obscene

salaries, movie stars but i run a charity. there are many churches and charities that serve free meals, give free clothing, free medical care. people should call their mayor's office and get those places. host: all right, ed. guest: one of the things that brings up the biggest debate as you have poverty, which is really the number and fraction of the population that falls below a certain threshold, and then you have the divider between those who have the most and those who have the least. you can imagine why people would have both. high levels of inequality are dragging our levels of poverty. there are a range of opinions on that. and ed is right, you know, there

are a remarkable set of people, like him, who are out there providing services, and i think anyone who is in that space will know or will say, hey, we still have a lot of kids and families experiencing a lot of need, they have a lot of crises, a lot of it has to do with work, where families are working, but because of instability in their jobs or in their lives, transportation, it is hard to maintain. so that was one of the great things to see in 2021 was this big increase in full-time, year-round workers. and finally putting a balance where we could see increases in employment and a robust safety net. host: all right, let's call talk to jim next, pittsburgh, pennsylvania, independent line. caller: yeah, jim in pennsylvania. i have one question for mr. sullivan -- guest: shaefer. caller: is america the only

country in the world that has a poverty population that is obese? host: he is asking you about the connection between poverty and obesity. guest: yeah, i -- that is a good question. i don't think so could one of the challenges in american poverty is access to what kinds of food, right? there's incredible literature on food and beverages, where a family cannot afford healthy food, they may have other options that are not as healthy, and not as reliable, and that is a big part of the driver of what we see today. as a nation, we have made a decision to say, you know, we are going to make unhealthy foods, high calorie foods available on a wide level and make it more difficult to get more fresh fruits and vegetables. i really believe in efforts that

try to reverse that, and it sounds like he had ir and that together, right? where we want to be able to see, can we make more of these fresh foods available across the population and not just for higher income families. host: behind the poverty rate is hunger in america. have you seen similar drops? guest: great question. we were talking about the supplemental poverty measure. there's lots of assumptions based then. there's a range of views, what should really count as a resource, and what should the threshold be? it is lower than it is. i like to look at these other indicators, and food insecurity is something that the federal government, the usda has been tracking for about 20 years now, and it asks a range of questions about whether or not families are able to access healthy foods that empower them to live active

lives. and in the great recession, years ago, when we took a different safety net approach, because there was sort of a different set of options that were on the table, and people were thinking about that crisis friendly, we really solve a fraction of families with children who said that they were having trouble getting enough food, skyrocket, right? it really goes up. that is one of the differences that we see with the current example, last year, the fraction of families that had trouble putting food on the table, you know, this range of questions that usda has validated, also dropped to its lowest level. now it is at about 12%. so that is higher than the poverty rate. people should be thinking about whether or not the child poverty rate really aligns with the idea that 12% of families really are telling us they have trouble putting food on the table.

but it drops, and that is what we like to see, making progress there are other indicators going in the same direction. people might be familiar with the survey question the federal reserve asked, can you afford a $400 prices? that also proves the highest mark since we have been keeping records, since 2013. and people's credit scores went up, and this was driven by fewer people have a very poor credit, because they were paying their bills. host: plus talk to mary on the democrats line in philadelphia. hello, mary. caller: yes, good morning. i would like to tell your person that we have more poverty in this country than ever, where we turn everything over to nonprofits. all our government programs have been turned over to nonprofits now.

we have had the earned income tax credit in place since the 1970's, and we have businesses and employees that have refused to pay into the system, social security. you know, we have to look at basically we are bankrupting this country by not adhering to the laws that we have in place. it is mandatory that you pay into social security, because when you become 65, it's no way in the world that you are going to be able to work two and three jobs. but we have people that work off the books, and we have major corporate -- corporations that refuse to pay the taxes, not only for their employee but also subsidize the tax burden on their employee, so this is the

problem that we have in this country. we have migrants that we give valid social security numbers too. they don't pay taxes. you have to look at the taxes -- because we cannot run a country where people are not paying taxes. thank you. have a good day. host: ok, mary. luke, what do you think? guest: i think mary raises a lot really important points. so the labor law violations that she was mentioning, you have some labor law violations where people are not paying into the tax system. there are other things, like some employers that are paying sub-minimum wages, requiring people to work overtime without paying the overtime pay. so these are all things that we have a regulatory system that should address, but they are a place that we have under invested in over the years.

and so that us something that it is tough for employers who want to do right by their employees, to deal with that, because if you have gotten a competitor who is trying to do things it shouldn't be. i would like to see that regulatory arm do better when we look at these lost wages that go into the billions of dollars, and i agree with mary on some counts, on the safety net. so we have seen a decline of the safety net for the very poor. that is something i think she was talking about, we have seen, you know, families actually going in, and they have a crisis, and they get a small tax. stipend. . that is much less common that it was, but in 21, we corrected that. we did not solve all of the problems come about for a year,

we had a program, and they expanded the child tax credit. they did not just help middle-class kids, they did not just help the working poor kids, it helped the very poor kids. said basically a kid is a kid, and for this year, we are going to treat them all the same, and the results were remarkable. they were not perfect, by any measure. as mary said, some people are not paying into the tax system, they would not have gotten that benefit. but when you look at the numbers, we have never reached so many kids in such a short amount of time, and i think if we gave it a chance to continue, we could increase that as well. the only thing i want to mention, where i would disagree with mary, you know, my biggest disagreement with mary would be around migrant workers. we actually see a lot of folks who are coming across the border, are here legally or undocumented, and they do pay taxes, but they don't actually have access to the systems that

we have. and, actually, one of our biggest challenges with the labor market right now is we have this big cutoff of immigration. so if you are someone who wants to support employers, because we have the aging of the population, there are just fewer workers right now, immigration is something we have to look at seriously. i agree withthat is a system weo reform. host: let's talk to don in california. republican line. caller: good morning. inflation is a simple thing. inflation means eggs cost more. when things cost more your cost of living goes up. when the cost of your living goes up, the poverty line rises, because the line is not where it was before. the line is up here. so, more people fall into poverty. the simple answer to this is lower the cost of living.

instead we have, like your guest there, we have an administration that wants to tax and spend its way into lowering costs, which is really ridiculous. like, we have this inflation reduction act. you cannot point at anything in there that is going to lower the cost of living. we thing in it is going to raise the cost of living. the cost of our energy, the cost of buying goods, because your taxing corporations. they seem to think the more money they suck out of people the cheaper everything is going to be. so, people like me are going cross eyed listening to all of this stuff, of, oh, we need to give poor people fresh fruit. you know, poor people used to get fresh food. what happened to that? it went away because fresh food got so expensive because of all of these regulations and taxes and everything going into it.

host: let's give our guest a chance to respond. go ahead, luke. guest: i think we are in agreement that inflation is a challenge, but you have to put that in a worldwide perspective. the entire world is experiencing inflation, and we have had a huge number of things that impact it. the war in ukraine, the breakdown of supply chains. i think the guest is right, that we have to balance the things we do. we should be doing things to reduce inflation. some of that is regulatory, right? we have the federal government that is taking an aggressive stance on interest rates, right? and then i think the infrastructure bill should have some measures in their that are going to impact our ability to have stronger supply chains in the country. and i think that the inflation reduction act does have quite a

few measures that will help with health care inflation, it is a really big thing we have to address. that is a longer-term question. we have had many years of low inflation, and this is a period where, basically, we had a perfect storm, right? i imagine a caller called a year or two ago, or even during the obama administration thought president obama was incredibly good, because inflation stayed low over that whole time, right? he had a blip in the great recession, and this period where inflation has been low. then we had a perfect storm of things that meant inflation was going to go up. so, you know, i think it is something we should be thinking a lot about, and i totally agree we should be looking at policies that do's the cost of living. -- that reduce the cost of living. some of those are regulatory. we should be thinking about what is the redtape we can strip away that will reduce costs?

to blame it all on a cash transfer that means fewer kids went to bed in houses that could not put enough food on the table , that credit scores improved, right? that is something i think any policies should take credit for, that people have a little more give in their bank accounts, and the economy is experiencing months of strong job growth. i think that is a mistake. host: tony is next in spring, texas. democrats line. caller: good morning. this thing has me baffled, big time. this poverty thing. i give an example, where opec is talking about raising the price of fuel for this winter. and a barrel of oil is hovering around $92. but we are paying more at the

pump, and we are going to pay more for heating oil for the winter. i just don't get it. but also if they raise the price of gasoline you are talking poverty, there are poor people trying to get to work, they cannot afford to get to work because of gas. because of child credit, my family received $3000. that money went away within a month. that was not a big deal for my family. host: bud, tony, what did you use the thousand dollars for, you said it went away? caller: to pay bills and the best i could, and just went on from there. host: ok. luke? guest: yeah, you know, inflation is a huge deal, i think tony hit

the nail on the head. i think we all wish there had not been a war in ukraine, and i think we all wish that we had more ability to produce energy in the united states, that we should be looking at things. we want to balance that with climate change. another thing i know people are really struggling with is the increased experience of natural disasters that happen. floods and hurricanes. of course, fires out west. so i believe an approach that says we want to bring those costs down, and i believe in an approach where we have had a perfect storm, supply chains breaking down -- breaking down during a pandemic, and they were in ukraine that had an impact on energy costs, and we want to look for short-term and long-term solutions.

it was a bit of a gift, right? that is that thing we have had during this time that has helped people during this period. i agree with him. i am sad it went away. ringing that back is the single thing -- if you want to see outcomes improved, the single best thing we can do right now in my view is to bring this modest cash transfer back. host: georgia, kimberly is on the independent line. kimberly? caller: can morning. i'm calling. my daughter and i were close to covid-19 in 2019. we are living under the poverty level. we are not getting any type of assistance or anything. i want to know, does professor schaefer -- shaefer have any

resources or assistance we can get? we are having problems trying to get health care, and we tried to work, but get sick. so, i guess i want to know, what are the hirers of the most vulnerable? host: are you still living with the effects of covid you got years ago? caller: we both are still sick, yes. it seems like everything has been swept under the rug. host: go ahead, luke. guest: i'm really sorry to hear about you and your daughter. i know you speak for a lot of people. that you are not the only one out there who is struggling right now. from a structural standpoint i think this is why action is so important. the program we have where we can see the biggest difference in people's lives is the extended child tax credit.

and congress let it expire. it is something that could help you immediately. congress could act tomorrow and bring more give for our caller right now. besides that, i think finding those social safety nets -- we had another caller talking about what they provided, finding those social safety services in the area that treat you with dignity and respect. that is going to take some work. it is going to be harder than it should be. i wish i had better options for you now, but finding those agencies that could provide more support as you sugar with this, as so many other people are, and also calling your congressperson and saying, we want to bring back the policies that rot food insecurity among families down to a low level, that helped people shore up their credit scores for a longer period. also that happening during a

period of more people going to work, full-time, full year. host: let's talk to independence -- to chip in independence, missouri. caller: i want to say there are three more problems with our economy. first, a lot of our jobs are going overseas to other countries to mexico or canada. second, we have chemically-addicted human beings who smoke tobacco or marijuana or other drugs, and some of them are mentally ill, and some of them carelessly drop their marijuana joints and cigarettes on the ground that start wildfires. third, we have technology that is taking away jobs such as robots or software that drives the three trucks or other vehicles, and there is no human beings in them to take over whenever these trucks or other vehicles get hit by electromagnetic pulses from terrorism or solar flares.

thank you. host: any comment there, luke? guest: i actually agree with this argument that we need to figure out how to bring our supply chain's home. i think that should be a -- should be a priority for us. we have had a few decades were expanding trade has been our primary goal and there is lots of great economic arguments for why we should do that. i personally, as someone who has gotten to know especially a lot of very poor rural communities, i know how they have been hurt by that. they have not in adequately helped through that period. i think the best way to help them through is to make sure we bring some jobs back. i am in full support of that. i think there has got to be some debate and there has to be discussion about the right way to do that. but i think that is something that should be a priority for

our policymakers going forward. host: jamie is in springfield, south carolina. caller: hello, c-span. i want to speak to luke about -- and the people in the country -- is that i was born in the 1950's. this is not the first time that we have faced this, you know? people in those days when we faced inflation before and high cost of living, you know, we all tighten up. we buy what we need, we spend what we need, we travel less, we buy less gas, and the notion of one party not doing what it is supposed to do, it has happened in the republican, it has happened in the democrat side, and these are issues. back then what we did was we bought off-brand. it might not taste that great,

but, you know, it might taste like -- but you can live on it. host: all right, jamie. go ahead, luke. guest: jamie makes a good point. we look back over time many of the same callers would have been calling under the early ronald reagan administration when we had inflation, much like what we had today, then in the nixon inflation. my good friend marina whitman was on the council of economic advisers in the nixon administration. the biggest thing they were challenged with was bringing down even higher rates of inflation then we have now. one of the things about the current period is that it is such a shock from what we have had recently. under the trump administration and obama administration, really from multiple administrations we have had extremely low inflation. when prices go up it surprises us, it shocks us. i know that is difficult.

but understanding that we have been through this before and with sound policymaking it can pass. but we should have both short-term solutions and longer-term. let's invest in bringing more jobs back to the united states. i think those are all things that we have to be -- we cannot just have sort of a short-term gain plan on this. as the caller mentions, i think it is shortsighted to blame it on any one or policy, right? if you are going to do that you have to say, you know, ronald reagan was also one of the worst presidents we have ever had. host: all right. let's go to bob in oxford, pennsylvania. hi, bob. caller: good morning. thank you for c-span. everybody appreciates it, i think. you have poverty in america, poverty in the world.

i think jesus said, we are always going to have poverty, and it is because of the system. you have people making $169 billion because they pay somebody $20 an hour. you have advertisers on television where veterans have to be dependent on charity. you see those poor, starving children with no skin on their bones dying every day, and people spending $1 million to fly around the world. until the system changes and there starts to be consideration not only for the top people, for the people below them -- and of course they want those people, because that is where they make their money at and where they have to depend. one people poor, working every day, 50 hours a week and more, not getting vacation or holidays. that is the system. until the system changes and people have consideration for other people we are always going to have poverty and poor people,

as long as those people at the top do not give a damn. host: luke, you had talked about inequality. anything you want to add? guest: i guess the only thing i want to add is that it is easy to believe that these things can't change. if you look at these numbers from 2021, we did it, right? we did not make poverty go away. there is still a lot of hurting people out there, but we brought numbers down dramatically. 5.5 million fewer children in poverty in 2021 1020 19. and 2019 was a pretty good year. food insecurity has fallen to its lowest level we have ever measured in the 20 years we have been measuring it. the fraction of people who cannot afford a $400 crisis goes to its lowest level. bank account balances have more give, right?

so, we have a framework, right? we have a blueprint. the child tax credit is designed to be one of these programs that has the least impact on inflation. so, the question is one of, what kind of country do we want to live in? i guess where i would disagree with the caller is that with a policy like this we can make substantial progress. 5.5 million fewer children in poverty, for me that is transformational. that is not to say we do not have a long way to go, that if we miss it, if we missed that window to actually do something that would fit in with the christian ethic. host: thank you so much for being on the program. luke shaefer, university of michigan social justice and social poverty professor. thanks so much for being on the program. guest: really nice talking with you. host: still ahead is washington

times' legal affairs reporter alex swoyer. she discusses her podcast about the supreme court and legal issues in the news. but first, more of your calls. you can start calling now. ♪ >> mark twain, back in the late 19th century, had a lot to say about financier and railroad owner jay gould, who was a rich man. he was the mightiest disaster that has ever befallen the country, commented twain. people had desired money before his day, he taught them to fall down and worship it. greg steinmetz, a partner at the money management firm -- included the twain quotes and many others in his book "

american rascal: how jay gould built wall street's biggest fortune." >> greg steinman on this episode of book notes plus. book notes plus is available on the c-span now mobile app or wherever you get your podcasts. ♪ >> c-span's campaign 2022 coverage continues this month with live debates on c-span, including thursday at 7:00 p.m. eastern wisconsin senator ron johnson meets his challenger, and della barnes, or a second debate. georgia congresswoman marjorie taylor greene and her challenger margaret flowered debate on sunday, october 16. from indiana, incumbent senator todd young debates thomas mcdermitt and james's eniac. on october 17 through cup of -- republican governor brian kemp takes on stacey abrams.

do not miss a single election moment on c-span, and take us with you on the go on c-span now, our free video app. visit c-span.org/campaign2022, our website for midterm election coverage on demand. c-span, your unfiltered view of politics. >> there are a lot of places to get political information. but only at c-span do you get it straight from the source. no matter where you are from or where you stand on the issues, c-span is america's network. unfiltered, unbiased, word for word. if it happens here, or here, or here, or anywhere that matters, erica is watching on c-span -- america is watching on c-span. powered by cable.

>> shop.org is c-span's online store. browse through apparel, books, home decor, and accessories. there is something for every c-span fan. every purchase helps support our nonprofit operation. shop now or any time at c-spanshop.org. ♪>> it'll in high school students, it is your time to shine. you are invited to participate in this years studentcam documentary competition. in light of the midterm elections, picture yourself as a newly-elected member of congress. he asked this year's competitors, what is your top priority, and why? make a five to six minute video that shows the importance of your issue from opposing and supporting perspectives. don't be afraid to take risks with your documentary. people. among the prizes is a $5,000 grand prize.

submissions must be submitted by january 20, 2023. is it studentcam.org for resources and a step-by-step guide. >> "washington journal" continues. host: welcome back. it is open form, so if you did not get in on any of our previous segments, feel free to call in and share your thoughts with me. he talked about living paycheck-to-paycheck. talked about poverty and child poverty rates in america. want to start by sharing some news that just happened in ukraine. the situation there in crimea. this is the associated press. it says that crimea bridge blocked damages key russian supply route. three dead. the article says an explosion

caused the partial collapse of a bridge linking the crimean peninsula with russia on saturday. that is today. damaging a key supply artery for the kremlin's faltering war effort in southern ukraine. russian authorities said a truck on caused the blast and three people were killed. you can see some video of it there on your screen. the article continues, the speaker of criminal -- the conlon's parliament accused ukraine of being behind the explosion, the moscow did not apportion blame. ukrainian officials have repeatedly threatened to strike the bridge. some lauded the destruction, but key stopped short of claiming responsibility. -- kia stopped short of claiming responsibility. came today after president vladimir putin turned 70, dealing him a humiliating blow that could lead him to up the ante in his war on ukraine. this is an article from the "washington post," saying, putin

decider to dissent. the official raised questions about war management. it says a member of putin's inner circle has voiced disagreement directly to the russian president in recent weeks over his handling of the war in ukraine, according to information obtained by u.s. intelligence. it is open form. i wonder what you think about what is happening in the news, public policy, politics, anything you want to talk about. let's start with james in spartanburg, south carolina. republican. caller: good morning. host: good morning. caller: your guest last time you have mentioned three key things over and over. there would have been a lot more talking from collars if he would not have repeated those things over and over. one thing he said was the reagan administration was engulfed in inflation.

when he came in we had 10 years before that of inflation. he came in and it lasted a year because he appointed paul voelker, which obama thought about appointing too in the midst of his difficult situation. and that brought inflation down. he cannot act like reagan dealt with inflation or reagan did not heal inflation. i don't like some things about reagan, but he stood in the gap and allowed voelker to hurt the economy, the ugly medicine ticket inflation under control. in his first year. you cannot say he was the president of inflation or lived with it long, with inflation. one other quick point. sadly, when biden came into office and he announced that, i'm going to change policy for the united states and what we produce, that gave more power to opec. therefore we, along with europe,

were buying more from opec. opec has more control and they are raising prices. oil filters through every facet of our buying, costs, purchase, and it drives inflation. he said this is an international thing, yes, in them a way partly. no one can define how much. but the biden policy caused international demand for oil to be higher with less supply, and our purchasing from their place where they mainly purchase, and opec, has more power, can drive up the cost, and that leads to inflation. i don't know why people cannot follow this, i will not ever know and no one can ever know how much energy costs because inflation and whether it is government spending. it is interesting to listen to your show and i appreciate it. the older i get the more moderate i get, believe it or not. i'm wishing we could get a moderate president.

truly moderate. biden used to be moderate, i suppose, and bill clinton. the older i get the more moderate, but our parties are being torn asunder, you know? host: tonya is next in north carolina. caller: independent. caller:yes. host: go ahead. caller: hi, how are you today? the speaker before talking about poverty, i don't see much happening with the government helping with poverty. i see so many homeless people, and i would be homeless if it was not for my mother and my boyfriend. i worked 40 years, all my life, and then i got disabled. i tried four times to get disability and still have not gotten it. without them i would not be

existing. i would be in a box downtown. but my mother, she is 80 years old, and she has a hard time living off of her social security, and she worked for ever, two or three jobs, therese saul. i hear nothing, absolutely nothing. i think they got the $80 increase or $40 increase this last time. they were supposed to get a $75, $80 increase again. that should be up in the 300s. these older people cannot keep up with this expensive world, usa. host: jess is in virginia, republican line. caller: yes, i would like to speak about biden's reference to the crisis we are going through

in ukraine right now with nuclear weapons. he had spoken at a fundraiser wednesday, i can't remember exactly, saying this was another cuban missile crisis and would lead to armageddon. let me qualify myself before i say what i want to say. i am a republican. i vote for who i believe is the best person. i voted for biden. so, i cross over. i was only four years old when the cuban missile crisis happened. but i do remember some things that i saw. i did not understand why it happens, i remember my dad watching kennedy's address, and the other news that went on that day. also took in my brother into our

beds -- talked me and my brother into our beds. he never did that. i ask him some years later why he did that, and he said, i did not think we would live to see the sunrise. that's all i have to say. host: jeff, there is an article here from the hill related to what you are talking about. the white house says no change in nuclear posture after biden armageddon remark. it says the white house has not seen any new intelligence to indicate there is an imminent threat of russia using nuclear weapons, even as president biden warned the rhetoric coming from moscow put the world at its greatest nuclear risk since the cuban missile crisis. here is the quote from the press secretary. we have not seen any reason to adjust our nuclear posture, nor do we have indications russia is preparing to imminently use nuclear weapons. next up is norman in california.

independent line. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i was going to talk about something else, however we are talking about, you mentioned ukraine a few moments ago, and i wanted toi am 31 years old, i ha bachelors degree in art history and regarding a big part of my studies of learning about the cold war, even though i was born in 1991, i look back with nostalgia at the time kennedy could sit down with former president -- sorry, former president nixon could sit down with carter and ronald reagan sat down with gorbachev. i wish we could get back to that

in our politics. i guess we are not there today. i hope we get there soon because, yeah. thank you for taking my call. host: donna is next, new orleans, louisiana, independent line. caller: good morning. host: morning. caller: i am just curious of using the birds of prey. our bird is the bald eagle but the federal reserve is hawkish, even though the military is hawkish. the military is dovish. but the eagle represents the united states. second only to height to the california condor. why do we allow the fed to be

hawkish in a country represented by the eagle? when we talk about economics and poverty, you know, being from new orleans and going to public high school, over half of my fellow classmates not only participated in sports, band, we had jobs while still living with our parents. it was called group economics, family economics. my family did not have to worry about buying me clothes or paying my fees. if i want to go to the movies or take a girl out to eat, i have my own resources. at that time, we did not have access to what they have today with the 401(k)s, ira's and these fabulous investment instruments. we had the savings account, christmas club, and inherit a

small business. there is more opportunity today. i think our educational system has not kept up with the changing and opportunities of our country. so, i hope people understand community economics and the purchasing power -- the dollar has lost so much of its value since the 1950's. i think it has lost 90% of its value. inflation is not new. the purchasing power is not a new phenomenon. i hear parents say, you are 18. you have to go to college or the military. i think we threw our children to

the wolves instead of raising them to understand their part in their role in our families and community. i think that is the destruction of our communities. host: thank you. gwen is next in fayetteville, democrat line. caller: good morning. host: good morning. caller: i am talking about seniors and poverty. my husband and i worked 30 years and we combined our incomes and when we retired we started getting social security. then he passed away last year and social security cut one of our checks. but i still have the same amount of bills and food and grants. i would like to know if there should be something done about, when a spouse passes away, the checks still come until the other passes away so they will not go into poverty. thank you so much and i love

your show. host: jonathan next in ohio, democrat line. caller: good morning. i hope everyone is doing well today. host: wait, can you mute your tv? caller: my faultcaller:, my fault, thank you, dear. host: go ahead. caller: i would like to talk about ketanji brown jackson and the discussion about the voting rights act that is being presented to the supreme court. i thought it was very fabulous how she brought it up about the 14th amendment was written for the free man, because she stated when she was debating

with whatever his name is that it was implemented for the disparity of blacks to be equally with whites. i can understand this type of system they have of how they try to do something without putting color in when the object of the 14th amendment is for voting rights. with that being said, i think this should be on the forefront of what we are talking about. everything people are talking about about poverty and all these things come from the rules that were made from that. everyone on the supreme court, i am sure they are knowledgeable of what ketanji brown jackson brought up. however, it is the language

ketanji brown jackson brought up. it was a refreshing part of the news that i think everyone should be more aware of and be more understanding of why things are critical. things have been spaced for us to be the way we are. host: jonathan, stay with us in the next segment. we will talk about the supreme court. appreciate you bringing that up. here is the front page of "the washington post" with the picture of the supreme court. you will notice the newest justice, judge jackson, is in the picture. let's talk to carl in texas, republican. caller: good morning, america, and washington, d.c. two years ago there was a man in

the presidential house that brought us peace in the middle east, energy independence, a lot of good things. we could not stand him no more. now we face nuclear armageddon, gas prices were you cannot even heat your home, but let's thank god donald trump is no longer in office. i hope everybody is happy and god bless america. host: gerard in lawrenceville, georgia, republican line. good morning. caller: how are you doing? host: good. caller: i am 80 years old and i was here when that crap went on. sonny perdue was for trump. he is their first republican to ever be governor in georgia since the civil war where the

military appointed republicans. he was a democrat up to the day the election started. tom murphy told him he could not run, he already had somebody else picked out. that is the only reason we got a republican governor in 2000. all this trash talk about republicans, they are all lies. we are nothing like these people say we are. i was of republican long before donald trump showed up. thank you very much. host: harry in georgia, independent line. caller: good morning, c-span. i am just calling to straighten out one little thing and give credit where credit is due. the gal that called from spartanburg talked about how your previous guest mentioned ronald reagan being one of the

worst presidents. he said, no, ronald reagan appointed paul voelker to the federal reserve and stopped inflation. well, it was not ronald reagan who appointed paul voelker, it was jimmy carter before him. but he was correct about the fact in what we call stagflation . it started under richard nixon but went through gerald ford and jimmy carter's term in office. and that is how stagflation really started. host: i was going to say, thank you for the correction. and i wanted to show people this is from gallup. it says, americans' economic pessimism eases slightly in september. it says the economic confidence index is -35, which is up from

-39 in august. in the index score is significantly improved from -58 in june and the democrats' index score is still negative. that will be all we have time for for the open forum. coming up on "washington journal ," washington times legal affairs reporter alex swoyer will talk about her podcast "court watch." we will be right back. ♪ announcer: book tv, every sunday on c-span2 features leading

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twain. the people desired money before his day but he taught them to fall down and worship him. the partner at the money management firm included these quotes and many others in his just published book "american rascal." announcer: greg and his book on this episode of book notes plus. book notes plus is available on the c-span knauf mobile app or wherever you get podcasts. ♪ ♪ announcer: c-span now is a free mobile app featuring your unfiltered view of what is happening in washington, live and on-demand. keep up with the day's biggest events with hearings from the u.s. congress, the courts, campaigns and more.

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studentcam documentary opportunity. picture yourself as the newly elected member of congress. we ask competitors, what is your top priority and why? make a five to six minute video to show the importance of your issue from opposing and supporting perspectives. don't be afraid to take risks. be bold. amongst the $100,000 in cash prizes is a $5,000 grand prize. videos must be submitted by january 20, 2023. visit studentcam.org for rules, tips,, resources and a step-by-step guide. announcer: "washington journal" continues. host: welcome back. alex swoyer is my guest.

-- guest: the format i am hoping to accomplish is to get both sides of the aisle, the conservative wing, the liberal wing, they can weigh in on the interesting cases. the first episode had a former clerk for justice thomas. she went through the major cases she is keeping an eye on an insight into what it was like to clerk for justice thomas. my next guest for the upcoming episode will be carolyn shapiro, former solicitor general of illinois. she clerked for justice breyer and she is now a professor at chicago-kent college of law. we will talk about the past arguments this last week.

there is a major voting rights case and also, she will preview the upcoming affirmative action cases later this month. host: let's talk about those cases coming up. what are you watching? what should we be expecting? guest: one of the major cases this term is going to be the one on october 31. . there are two cases brought by students for fair admission. harvard and the university of north carolina over affirmative action. they say they have admissions policies that discriminate against asian americans. that is one of the big cases because we will see if the court will overturn previous precedent as they have in the past in terms of if there is any diversity goals or racial quotas for school admission. host: let's talk about affirmative action. there are two cases. guest: right. host: they seem very similar. guest: pickets vary in the weeds

over the 14th amendment. but the basis is the same. it is whether these schools can look at race as part of their admissions factors. we will see how far they go. i did interview the president of students for fair admissions who brought these cases and he said what he would like to see the court do is do away -- go beyond admissions, do away with the idea we have to check a racial box when it comes to job applications or the mortgage application. host: justice jackson has recused herself. guest: from the one case. host: why that one? guest: i should've mentioned that. she sat on the board of governors for harvard. of course, there is conflict of interest. she even spoke about it when she was asked during her confirmation hearing. she said she would need to recuse from that. she does not have a conflict

with the north carolina case she will. be sitting in on that one. court watchers do not expect it to affect the outcome. i am glad you brought her up. i have seen my fourth new justice, it is pretty impressive. some people cover the court and don't have any new justice over 10 years. in the past several years four new justices have, on and usually -- i don't want to say timid. i saw justice jackson and she was the most vocal.

she is definitely not holding back. host: will there be any pressure applied? guest: the way recusal's work is there is no law or guideline. they usually have her recognizing sitting on the board of governors at a time when they had such policies and that would be a conflict of interest. there has been criticism in the past justices should have been recused if they had a financial conflict and that is one of the things you see a lot of advocacy groups pushing for. to ensure there is no conflict of interest on the court. lower courts have guidelines they are set to impose. each circuit that governs when a judge needs to be recused, and so, speaking of recusal there has been pressures put on justice thomas with his wife in

terms of the january 6 committee and whether he should be recused from any elections related cases. but there are no set guidelines. host: can you talk about the ginni thomas situation? guest: i believe she has been in communication with the january 6 committee. i do not cover the committee as closely as the court. but she had exchanged texts and emails with trump allies during the junior sixth event. she was at the rally. she put out a statement she did not participate and she left before the rally became violent. she has distanced herself from that. we have not heard anything from justice thomas on the issue. guest: if you would like to call in and talk to our guest, alex swoyer, our lines are party affiliation. republicans (202)-748-8001, democrats (202)-748-8000, an

independents (202)-748-8002. this session is the first time there are four women. guest: historic. host: it is. guest: as justice ginsburg said, we will have to wait until there is nine. [laughter] host: what do you think is going to happen? guest: interesting you brought that up. our immigration reporter covers immigration closely and he will be covering a case in december. i am not as caught up on that as the affirmative action case but it looks at the guidelines put out by the biden administration in 2021 that say we need to prioritize certain illegal immigrants and get them out of the country, once suspected of terrorism, criminals, over those here illegally. that has been challenged by states and that will be heard. it was put on hold that policy by the supreme court in the injunction stage. the four women dissented.

they said they would have let the demonstration implement the policy. that was one example you saw justice barrett, republican appointee, swing and side with the three democratic appointees. host: in your podcast, it was mentioned the court has an originalist majority. what does that mean? guest: one of the stories i did recently with stephen, the expert on immigration, we looked at justice thomas. he was really what many people -- they say him and justice alito are the most conservative. how he was not always in the majority. now it looks like with this court in his approach to the law, the originalist approach looking at the original meaning of the constitution, what did the founders intent, he has a lot of allies on the court. what is interesting is he has not stopped writing.

a perfect example is the ruling in dobbs they did away with the right to the national abortion nationwide and set the issue back to the states. he continued even though he was in the majority to write, he things the court needs to go further and look at other examples of precedent, gay marriage, for example. host: do you think that is going to happen? guest: i do not think there is an appetite for a majority of the court to do that. but if you were to ask me my prediction in the dobbs case, i would have thought justice roberts, we are not overturning roe but allowing the 15 week ban would stand. they went further than i expected. host: let's take some calls. mary is first in maryland on the democrat line. caller: women should be absolutely terrified that they will end up like me. i reluctantly worked for many years at the pro-life washington

times and was brutally mocked and fired because i grew up disfigured by the anti-birth control catholic church. women should be terrified that the catholic church gets away with forcing disfigurement, disability and false imprisonment on girls as abstinence enforcement. clarence thomas himself denied me equal pay when he headed the eoc because he was disgusted by my face. host: mary, how did you get disfigured? caller: a priest in baltimore, a playboy having affairs with the wives of the baltimore orioles, he was their chaplain. he ordered my mother, ruined by childbirth, to disfigure me rather than use birth control. when i later as a teenager mentioned my own support for contraception and family was ordered to make sure i never got plastic surgery. my life has been hell trying to

come up with the money for plastic surgery. i have had a horrible time trying to find work and i was brutally treated by your colleagues at "the washington times." several people there mobbed me for being too old and too ugly even though i was excellent at my job. host: sorry that happened to you. guest: i will apologize. i know my colleagues in my experience has been positive. i am not sure the people you are referencing still work there. of course, i apologize. it sounds like you have had a difficult life. i wish you the best. i think it would be smart to use your voice where you can. i believe you referenced baltimore local papers. share your story. host: albert is next in chicago, illinois, democrat line. caller: good morning. you know, regarding this anti- affirmative action suit coming up before the court, i just

wanted to really, well, interesting that the group for fairness and admissions that brought this on behalf of asians is headed by some white guy from michigan. why is that not surprising? that is my comment. guest: i will say i believe he may have asian background. i would have to double check, but my understanding is he might have traveled all over the u.s. i think he grew up in houston, very diverse city. of course, these different advocacy groups are led by different people. they all have their own goals and of course, i do not think there is any shyness that his goal has been, for many years, to do away with affirmative action. he has gotten his chance as we discussed october 31 when the court will hear these cases. something to note in prior

precedent, upholding affirmative action, justice o'connor mentioned -- she referenced 25 years from now maybe affirmative action will not be needed in america. what is surprising about that is we are five years away from that goal and i don't see there being any sort of universities wanting to do away with that. you hear more universities speaking about diversity. host: greg is next in texas on the democrat line. caller: good morning. i want to comment. give me some time. all of this with affirmative action and now you want to bring the asian people in that abuse black people every day? how they treat us and how they hit us and then they get mad?

it is putting a shield up to keep black people in their place. they are going to use asian people as an excuse because white people are mad because they are behind. we are surviving in this country. now they behind. what women getting more lawsuits and now they are going over the military for sexual harassment. what women, they sue. host: let's get a response. guest: i think there are many passionate arguments about this because, for example, you have the argument that because of these policies there is less asian americans admitted to the schools. at the same time, those policies are put in place to allow hispanic students, black students. you are seeing not only this -- what we are dealing with in the

supreme court has to do with college. but you also see that in high school context. there are some cases pending in lower courts dealing with genre thomas jefferson high school locally. it is also discussing how it might discriminate against a different group. this is a theme not only at the supreme court level but in lower court cases too. i predict whatever opinion we get from the supreme court it will impact lower court cases that could influence how secondary education is done. host: let's talk to richard next on the republican line, divine, texas. caller: good morning. thank you. affirmative action to me is no clear simple example of racism. to diverge a little bit, you

mentioned ginni thomas in january 6. i wondered if any of those cases of the convictions of the people are there, if they will be appealed to the supreme court? furthermore, have you done any research or followed up on where is ray epps? it seems like he was involved in leading people too. guest: are you talking about -- sorry. i am not as familiar with the name but i believe there were some stories out there there was some government official who would be partaking? that might be who you are referencing? caller: yes. guest: go ahead. caller: he was rallying the crowd and he was a former marine. and he got called out by the crowd and they were calling him "fed." he seems to have disappeared off the face of the map and no one can find out anything about him.

it is a mystery to me of why a simple fact like that and anyone should be tried and put in jail would be ray epps. thank you for your time. i enjoy your program. you're doing a very good job. thank you for your time. guest: on january 6 cases, everyone has the right to appeal. i would not be surprised if we could potentially see some go up the ladder to the higher court. i had referenced that one government official because i recall seeing viral videos shared on social media and some stories. i have not followed up on this. i do not necessarily cover the generous six committee. we have a house reporter that covers the developments. i will reach out to her because i think there has been confusion after that video went viral and no follow-up. i will speak to my colleague on that. host: alex, a caller in the

previous segment was talking about voting rights. guest: yes. host: anything going on with that? guest: the court heard a very major case this past week over the voting rights act, section 2 specifically. it has to do with alabama. after the senses in 2020 they did redistricting. alabama always had seven districts -- not always desperate in recent years and one majority black district. a lower court, there is a district court but also a three-judge panel. but on these type of cases it was the district court. they actually, with trump appointees, said, alabama, you have to have two districts geordie black. the state challenged that. to the supreme court one of the arguments is the district lines, how far voters would be. it was interesting hearing

justice jackson because she brought up one of the state attorneys mentioned if they were to do two black majority districts it would be a detriment to other voters in the area. it is similar to affirmative action. she said this is not discrimination, this is equal protection. we will have to see what her voice says in the voting rights case and the affirmative action. host: let's talk to bob, democrat line, whitman, massachusetts. caller: hello, everybody. number one, the supreme court is supposed to represent truth. what do we have? conservative judges k avanaugh, gorsuch, barrett. they lied to get on their as well as brett kavanaugh. they need to be impeached.

number two, look what terrorist trump is trying to do. host: why do you think brett kavanaugh needs to be impeached? caller: he lied. he lied about what went on and he got away with it through a corrupt conservative court. all these conservatives have been appointed -- they came up because of terrorist trump. trump is a terrorist. he caused that january -- host: let's go back to the courts. guest: there has been calls to impeach some of the justices. brett kavanaugh has been one of the most contentious battles i have ever covered. i was lucky to not only be in the room when he testified before the senate but also went forward did. -- ford did.

there was a lot of contention on both sides. democrats control the senate and the house. the leaders wanted to bring impeachment articles against the justices. they have the majority to do so. they have not yet. there has been pressure not only to reference justice kavanaugh but other appointees in terms of them saying they would not overturn precedent. that is one of the main points from court watchers. of course, they testified under oath they would not overturn precedent and there has been anger over the overturning of roe v. wade. that is where i have seen calls for impeachment. host: let's look at chief justice john roberts. he made remarks about the court and the legitimacy of the court. [video clip] >> you know, the court has always decided controversial cases. the decisions have always been subject to intense criticism and

that is entirely appropriate. feel free to criticize our opinions and how we do our work. but lately the criticism is phrased in terms of because of these opinions, it calls into question the legitimacy of the court. i think it is a mistake to view those criticisms in that light. the legitimacy of the court rests on the fact it satisfies the requirements of the statute and that the constitution, as john marshall put it, needs somebody to say what the law is. the role does not change just because people disagree with this or that opinion or the mode of jurisprudence. people can say what they want and feel free to criticize the supreme court.

if they want to say legitimacy is in question, they are free to do so. but i do not understand the connection between the disagreement and the legitimacy of the court. i am not sure who would take up the mantle. you do not want the political branches telling you what the law is and you don't want public opinion to be the guide of what the appropriate decision is. yes, all of our opinions are open to criticism. our members do a great job of criticizing. [laughter] but simply because people disagree with the is not a basis for questioning the legitimacy of the court. host: we are talking about the supreme court and we have our guest, host of the podcast "court watch."

last month justice elena kagan spoke about the proper role of the supreme court. [video clip] >> the court protects the sphere of democracy. the first amendment is one of those things. everybody has political speech opportunities. the 14th and 15th amendment, ensuring everybody has the voting rights that the constitution and congress has given to it. in those areas, the court needs to operate in a way that will make the democratic system work. once that system is working, once the rules are in place to ensure the democratic system is working, then usually, not always, but often the court can

allow that democratic system to operate. because the democratic system has worked so as to produce outcomes you would think, given their prominence, is himself legitimate. sometimes that is not the case. sometimes a piece of legislation transgresses a constitutional boundary and then the court has to act. but the court should think twice and then twice again before doing so. in particular, the court should not be wandering around inserting itself into every hot button issue in america. it especially should not be doing that in the way that

reflects one ideology or one set of political views over another. host: that was justice elena kagan and we are talking about the supreme court. alex, as the politics in america start to get more polarized you are seeing even with the calls, people feel passionately about the supreme court. guest:guest: there is a lot of emotion. i have covered the political and presidential campaigns before covering the courts. i think as we are seeing politicians who are elected be either on the more progressive wing or more conservative, maybe the trump sphere somewhat talk about, you are seeing that within the cases brought before the court. there are a lot more political cases that have partisan

ramifications. you're seeing that with judicial appointments and i think that could be this image and what people feel when they look at the supreme court now. at the same time, being inside the court you see the nine justices are extremely friendly with each other. they whisper to ♪ r one another. one another. just as gorsuch was sitting next to justice sotomayor and they spoke and at times would giggle. i think it was justice sotomayor pinched just gorsuch during her question. they get along on the court well. there is civility and i think there has been pushed back about

having cameras in the court since that has not been the case. there would be some positive results if people could see that side of the court. host: c-span has been trying to get cameras into the court. [laughter] if you're interested in the supreme court, we have a lot of coverage on our website, c-span.org/supremecourt. you can listen to the oral arguments and watch recent appearances with justices in d.c. and around the country. that is c-span.org/supremecourt. we are taking your calls. gilbert is in raleigh, north carolina, republican line. caller: hi. alex, you mentioned earlier that justice ketanji brown jackson recused herself from the case of race-based admissions policy. she sat on the board at harvard but not for unc.

that is the final decision she has made. but you also shared when it comes to justice clarence thomas that there is pushback for him to recuse himself from any election related cases based on the potential investigation into his wife's role in january 6. don't you see a double standard there that the republicans are not asking brown to recuse herself from the unc case, which is extremely similar to the harvard case, and that is before the court. now they are asking or the democrats are pushing for thomas to recuse himself from any election related cases. what is your thought on the double standard? guest: i think there is questions about whenever a justice chooses not to recuse or recuse on both sides. like we were talking about,

there is a lot of passion right now with the supreme court. more than there has been the past decade. at the same time, when we are talking about reforms like having cameras in the courtroom, there has been the push to have a set standard of recusal guidelines to show where a conflict of interest crosses the line. i think there is a possibility if the public did see something like that, that could give some sort of faith to the process where there are questions of double standards on either side eliminated. i think 1.i will make is there has been talk about -- i think there is one point i will make it is important to note that the court had many challenges, legal challenges come toward it with the 2020 election and did nlved. when we look at politics at play

, ideology, i think there are some places where you see them drawing the line on what type of partisan cases they are going to take. host: wilbert is next in culpeper, virginia. caller: good morning, ladies. you talked on my topic i have been calling on for years and that is i hear people calling in to c-span to voice an opinion about the supreme court. but my opinion always has been forced congress to put tv cameras inside the supreme court. we the people want to see exactly what is going on inside our court. we have some justices talking about we don't want tv cameras but we have the right to force congress to bring the bill up to put tv cameras inside that supreme court. the african-american justice was

speaking and we were hearing her voice but we could not see her. the american people have to wake up. this is 2022 but we have to start putting tv cameras inside our supreme court. guest: i hear this from a lot of people and there is legislation that is supported by both parties. it is bipartisan legislation, but it has not gone -- it has not gotten a vote or gotten the president to sign it. but there is -- i don't want to say it is party based -- there is bipartisan effort. i am wondering if we are going in that direction. for the longest time before covid you did not have the live streaming of the audio. you would have to wait until the end of the week to hear the audio. now it is in real time since the covid era and now the post-covid

era. i am wondering if we are going in the direction that video will accompany that. it could be a benefit to see how the justices interact with one another. at the same time, covering the remarks over the past years the pushback from the justices themselves seems to be if they have cameras in the courtroom, it become like what you see across the street with the capitol when you politicians using their time to make sure they have soundbites they can use for campaign ads. i do not think that would be equal to what we are seeing with the court but that is one of the reasons they have pushed back against cameras. host: you talked about keeping the audience up-to-date on the abortion draft ruling elite. is there anything happening with that? guest: that is what our audience has asked about. i have gone many questions about

the document. is it illegal to have leaked that document? it depends who you ask. there are some legal scholars who said it could be government property or obstruction of justice. the intent to persuade justices to change their vote. some national security experts have said there is no law that makes these documents confidential such as you see in other areas of the capitol. with the leaker once discovered be charged? i think an important note to make is because we do not know who it is or the court knows and has not disclosed it, the clerks serve under the justices for the term. all the clerks from the

prior term heavily left. if they were an employee, this could happen again. host: john is next in new york, independent. caller: i have a question about affirmative action and where does it come to a point where it is considered racist? president biden before he was elected came out with two statements. as a vice president he said he would pick a woman and a woman of color. not the most qualified person, a woman of color. as far as the supreme court justice he said i will pick a woman and i will pick a woman of color. in my opinion, being black takes away many qualifications we have in saying we got the position because of our color. if you look at kamala harris, it is not doing very well. as far as i know it was based on she is a woman and a woman of

color. and yet, i don't hear any statements from ketanji brown jackson complaining about the fact the two qualifications she was picked, per the president, that she was black, a woman of color. where do you draw the line? why is that not considered being racist? if it was reversed and he was picking a woman or a white woman , people would be going nuts. guest: i hear a lot from conservatives about wanting to end the racial identities and politics. the same thing could be said with the affirmative action case, that the application for colleges should be blind. we should not be looking at race. at the same time, colleges have a goal of diversity and that is what president biden has spoken about. to your point, there has been

criticism of him setting standards for the justice he would appoint. when i can also recall during the trump administration there was criticism in terms of what justices he would appoint. he set out a different standard. he said he wanted to appoint pro-life justices and of course, that was something a lot of people jumped on. justices are not supposed to disclose how they are going to rule on a particular matter. for the most part, they do not talk about that. but we did see the justices he appointed were pro-life. there has been criticism on both sides. host: tony is next, fort lauderdale, florida, independent line. caller: good morning. i called to excoriate your guest and i will to do so as gently as i can. none of the justices lied to their confirmation hearing. you need to look at the

analysis. they gave loyal answers. amy coney barrett says, we are talking about roe v. wade right now. this guest is supposed to be a court observer and does not grasp the simple things. she does not know who ray apps is? i am going to give you the benefit of the doubt, charitably, that you are just ignorant. guest: i do not cover the january 6 event. i am aware of the viral video but i will have to leave it to the reporter who covers that. in terms of the court, i have not said whether a just a slide during their confirmation hearings -- whether a justice

lied during their confirmation hearing. i have not given an opinion on that. host: anne in new york, democrat line. are you there? caller: hello? host: go ahead? caller: thank you. i don't believe this is a legitimate court. i think it is a reactionary conservative court. it is an extension of the republican party at mitch mcconnell and the republicans stole two seats. we definitely need ethics rules and term limits. clarence thomas should have recused himself and he said he and his wife never discussed the january 6 riots. she in her emails refers to her best friend.

he is obviously lying. this court, to me, is the worst i have seen in my lifetime and i am old. host: ok, anne. guest: there seems to be the question of how legitimate this court is reflected in polling. recent polling shows the faith of the court is at a historic low. it is almost split 50-50. i think that is something the court, at least under justice robert, keeps in mind on what cases they take. wanting to draw the line at trump brought election lawsuits. there was the appetite to look at a case out of pennsylvania that had to do with when procedures had been changed and who was in charge of that. is that the legislature or secretary of state?

this was prior to the voting in 2020 with the covid pandemic. the majority decided not to wait in on that. there is not much passion from either side of the aisle. host: are there other cases the supreme court could take up and is it common to add cases? guest: yes, it is common. this monday is a holiday so orders will be issued tuesday. that is when they decide what cases they will add to the docket or which appeals or petitions they are going to deny. we have been talking about affirmative action but there other interesting ones. they added a case over section 230. that is part of the federal law that protects google, tech

companies, facebook, twitter from having legal liability when we talk about defamation lawsuits from third-party people. people who post. they are not liable about what is on the platform. it looks like the court is going to revisit that. the cases they decided to take up are interesting. they are brought by families of terrorist attack victims. they say

who is a christian and says that she doesn't want to have to produce wedding websites. she doesn't want to put in a context or words that runs against her beliefs on websites that she designs. that's another hot button issue that the court will touch on.

as the court correct, is it legal? it is kind of a silly question because, these people are not chosen by popular vote like the congress or the president. they are very special people. the highest of the high lawyer types. you can expect them to say, we will not change this clear mistake. even ginsberg declared it was a mistake. you either have to have smart people who will be moral and their jobs or people that answer to the population which is what the congress is all about. host: quick response? guest: i would say that you mentioned justice ginsburg.

there was a question of how long it stands. they looked at history and said it was up to the states in the past. they came to the conclusion it did. and like, you just mentioned, congress has the ability to pass legislation codifying road. there has been a push in congress whether it makes to president biden stats will be a different story. host: alex feuer, legal reporter for the washington times. thank you for coming in. thanks for everyone who called in during washington journal. that is it for today's edition but we will be back again tomorrow morning. in the meantime, have a great saturday.

every day we take your calls live on the air and we discussed policy issues that impact you. coming up, inside elections nathan gonzalez talks about campaign 2020. in some of the political news of the day. then they talk about the women by protest and ran and the challenges they represented the islamic republic. watch it live on 7:00 eastern on c-span or c-span now. join the discussion with your phone calls, facebook comments, text and tweets.

>> sunday night on q&a, college president shows his book the depth of learning that looks at the state of liberal arts education in the united states. he talks about liberal correctness on campus. in the importance of western civilization courses. >> is should be taught in colleges yeah, even in high schools. the 1619 project, gap. have them also read thomas payne, jefferson, martin luther king. abraham lincoln, not that i believe that everything is up for debate. i do believe, multiculturalism of ideas is crucial.