political and intelligence experts revisit the 1962 confrontation between the u.s. and soviet nuclear powers, focused on crisis leadership and political and military intelligence. at 6 p.m. eastern, a conversation regarding challenges educators face teaching colonialism and the first thanksgiving. exploring the american story, watch american history tv, saturdays on c-span two final schedule on your program ide or watch online anytime at c-span.org/history. >> there are a lot of places to get political information, but only at c-span do you get it straight from the source. no matter where you are from or where you stand on the issues, c-span is america's network. unfiltered, unbiased, word for

word. if it happens here or here or here or anywhere that matters, america is watching on c-span, powered by cable. continues. host: william rinehart is here. he joins us now for a conversation about americans attitudes on economic abundance and what the future looks like. before we get to that conversation, what is the center for growth and opportunity. what is your mission? guest: it is a academic research based out of utah state. i work primarily in tech innovation. i got a couple of research students. we work primarily on tech innovation, figuring out how to get people back to work. that is something that is really important and critical right now.

we work in a whole bunch of issues, including environmental stewardship. we are concerned about what is going on in the deserts and water and all of that. we also have a pretty big component involved in immigration and thinking through those critical areas. there is a lot for us to do. we are a pretty small group. it is one of the more interesting things we are trying to do and come together some interesting views. we are trying to come together research views on how people think about it and understand abundance and the future and how tech innovation. host: if viewers want to follow along. what is abundance and how do you poll on it? guest: it is a relatively new one. supply chains are having serious

problems. i was in target a couple of days ago. there is a these tags that say we no longer have these. i was looking for some advil. there was a tag saying our supplier can i get this right now. i think what we have seen is within our poll, researchers and economists thinking about, how do we solve this problem. how do we ensure that the world of the future is a world map where we have the critical problems, not where people can't get the things that they need. how do we create a world in which there is actually abundance. that is an interesting framing. it is pulling people from all over appeared that is a really critical -- all over. that is critical.

i think that is where i find a lot of interest in it. trying to create a agenda that a lot people agree with and something we can strive for. host: the first question on that survey, one should someone be going to have a thriving and fulfilling life? your options are 200 years ago, right now, 200 years ago in the future for not sure. why start with that question? guest: there are a couple of things we're trying to figure out. general optimism of the world. i think there is this notion with the younger generation is that they are not as optimistic about th prospects of the future. that is not the case. a quarter of all people said they think it is probably the best time to be born today.

15 or so percent said 200 years ago in the future. another 15% said 200 years in the past. half of all individuals really are unsure about this. with that suggest is, not to say that people aren't thinking about the future, this is not how they necessarily think about public policy issues. that means that there's this possibility really to help people think about what can we do better for the future. i think it really suggest that there is a big openness to it. another critical thing, they found that generally speaking younger people are far more optimistic about the future and about the current state of the world, at least ask this question suggests. host: 18 to 29-year-olds, 31% say that right now is the best time to be born to have a

fulfilling life. another quarter saying it is the future. how does that answer lead us to finding out about abundance in this country? guest: those two things are connected. thinking about the future means we will be making investments today that are not going to necessarily pay off until 15 to 20 years down the line. the younger generation is well-positioned for that. they have been thinking about that. they are thinking today is the best time to ever to be born. that means that there is that underlined -- and not talked about sentiment on young younger cohorts to actually do more to invest in the future. the connections here timmy -- -- to me -- they would suggest the individuals -- at least younger

individuals are actually thinking today is a great time to be born and there's a lot of optimism for the future. host: we're talking about investments for the future. some of the topics he focused on in the survey are energy investments, infrastructure investments and innovation and safety. explain that part. guest: this is one of the critical questions we often ask people. if you have been in the past in polls, whether or not the government should be more focused on innovation or safety. i was surprised by this. i thought there would be a bigger concern for innovation -- generally for folks to be more concerning and the government has policies that we are innovative. the united states would probably come out ahead.

most people are very focused on innovation. this is a general dichotomy that we often see. should the government be focused on safety or innovation? i would say that, as someone who does work as public policy, i think the most interesting part of all of this is you can do both. the search for better ways of doing things is also the search for safety. of those two things for me are intertwined. -- those two things for me are intertwined. we are trying to get people's opinions on this. should the government be focused on safety or innovation? host: william rinehart is our guest involved in that paul and having this conversation about abundance and america's future this thanksgiving weekend. you can join the conversation. democrats, (202) 748-8000.

republicans, (202) 748-8001. independents, (202) 748-8002. ghost dance do you want the pole in? -- whose hands do you want the polls in? guest: it is for a number of different audiences. we are hoping that policymakers, people in congress and the local level start thinking critically about innovation and about abundance. it is our big components. we really hope that this is to get a sense of where people are. get a sense of innovation, where people fit in with innovation and safety at all of the other questions we ask today -- asked

today. we are trying to get to see how people feel. there is a lot we have done. these later questions are on new affordable infrastructure and some other related stuff to oil and energy at all of that. we're trying to get the broader sense of how people feel towards innovation and abundance. that to me is a really critical component that some policymakers should be focused on. i think of all levels of government. i think it is going to be critically important for those who are running for local, state governments to try to understand how to create an agenda to try to work from both sides and crosses the aisle and bring people together. host: how likely isn't that energy will be produced for free -- is it that energy will be

produced for free? 15% saying likely. 31 percent saying if not very likely. guest: i think what we are to understand is the idea that the energy should be metered. the u.s. is a very different position today than it was 20 years ago, we are far -- there are some elements to it. we are largely a oil exporter in the u.s. the energy security has come about in the last 15 years because of a whole range of different things happening in the u.s. we're trying to get the temperature check on individuals to see how they feel towards a broad problem of not just energy independence, but how cheap is energy going to be in the future.

we were thinking about what is happening in russia and ukraine and the energy crisis that the europeans are also going through. also, crisis at the pump are still very high in places. we are trying to figure out how people feel towards those. what is interesting for me, i was expected to see the republicans would be more positive about this. it seems that the democrats generally have a much better since that energy is getting more cheaper or going to be more plentiful in the future. host: the members to cover that 19% of democrats saying it is very likely that energy will be free in the next 50 years. that is somewhat likely compared to 15% of republicans saying it is very likely. between 1% saying it is somewhat likely. how many people did you paul?

how --poll? guest: with every single poll, there are some flexibility with how things turn out. if very common tactic to see how people feel towards public policy issues. i like to think about polls in this way. what is really fascinating about all of this, i think it gives a sense of where we are on public policy issues. they could go into the new congressional agenda and also into state and local infrastructure in the future. i think there's a key component

of understanding where people are, but also where public policymakers have flexibility and could be doing more work in the future. host: let's chat with the callers. you are on with william rinehart . caller: this is an important question. i sent 10 letters to the wall street journal talking about the potential for marginal utility setting in for the world economy, modern economy based on growth. there was a book in 2011 by richard heinberg that said that pollution is going to build up, we are going to run out of supplies and the use of credit is going to cost growth to collapse. the wall street journal will not publish my letters. you put so much fertilizer on the grass and you get good

growth, but you keep putting fertilizer on the grass you are going to kill the grass. all of these inputs. is there not going to be a point at which growth cannot occur? why is that not debated? i just want a debate started. guest: this idea has been around quite some time. there's a book called limited growth. there is a lot that is involved in this conversation. i would try to suggest that we would probably need to -- it out as different topic areas. there has been a decline in productivity growth rate. that is generally what we are looking at when we are looking for more productive economies. in the 1970's things have decreased about half.

about an average household today makes about $70,000. if you're only higher trajectory , it should have been about 100 and thousand dollars per american household. it should have been about doubled. this to me is a bigger problem. as long as there are issues in environmental degradation and bigger problems with productivity and the agricultural space, we really do not know why things are slowing down. we do know things are slowing down. as far as a cultural wide collapse, i think that is very unlikely, giving the fact that we have already seen population growth have already stalled and are likely to basically flat line, the next 50 or 60 years. there are other things to me that are worrying with these trends, particularly that we do not know why we are not as productive as we used to be.

through the 1940's and 70's, we were quite productive. my hope is to reinvigorate that conversation and to figure out how we can do better. obviously, there are environmental problems we need to deal with. the resource is the resource in the human mind. i want to give everybody the possibility to do the best for themselves. that obviously means that some of those minds are going to be dedicated to dealing with environmental degradation here and we have done a lot of cleanup. there is a lot of positive things to think about when we look at the changes that have been made since the 1970's in some of the areas in limiting in growth crowds. there is 11 positive stories today about how we are doing much better -- there is a

positive stories today about how we are doing much better. how we are decoupling growth from carbon emissions. there is a lot that goes into this. think through how we can do better and give people those -- the best possible life that they can live. host: this is eric, an independent. good morning. caller: i look to see the republicans and democrats work together to establish supply chains that do not run through china. guest: yes. supply chains are something i have been following. i have been following for a couple of years now. i am fascinated about how these things have become critical inputs to the u.s. ecosystem.

the interesting thing about the united states, despite the fact that we do still get a lot of implicit from china, -- get a lot of input from china come our supply chain is actually the shortest ones in the world. we do not have the critical problems in china. congress really has been -- this has been one of the spots that congress works together. we seen the chips act earlier that fast and that was a big amount of money that went through, specifically to the supply chain issues related to chips and some conductors. i expect in the upcoming congress, this will be the exact area that they will be focused on. supply chains specifically with the concern that some of these things may be destructed by china if china takes a more stronger posture on this in the future. host: economic abundance and

what the pandemic taught us. we had economic abundance before the pandemic, but since then we need to rethink the policies that provide economic abundance. we cannot return to pre-pandemic policies because another pandemic is waiting to happen. guest: the pandemic changed a lot. it was destructive in a number of different lives. my family was affected by it like many other families. i do see that there has been some positive things that come from this. there is now a bigger more interesting conversation about remote work, to allow people to have those -- that possibility of having more flexibility. that is now a very in front conversation going on. people do a lot of switching. we know that a lot of people left jobs, found new jobs and now they are making a higher

wage, higher in overall incomes. we have seen positive things that have come from covid, despite the fact that there has been a lot of negatives. then ensures that there is a lot of possibility. there is a lot of things that we can be focused on. for government institutions -- the pandemic showed that governments, when they do have -- when there is a fire behind them, they can act pretty quickly and move quickly. that is something i would like to see created and solidified within government institutions. the really central concern that we need to get things out and do things quickly. ensure that there are cp protocols in place. make sure that we are working as quickly and diligently as we can. that is good to be the focus of my research and work in the next couple of years.

host: this is pearl, and independents. good morning. caller: earlier in the gentleman who called in about the wall street journal. he mentioned a time and mileage terminology. finite. the oil situation is not infinite, it has a finite amount. even why america goes overseas or deal with china and others is because america is a capitalistic government. like when richard nixon thought about selling products to china, that is how we end up in china because they convinced people that we got product that we can sell to one billion people. these products have to be produced.

americans do not control all of the materials needed to produce or to be independent. to the people who called here, you made a statement earlier that went over their head. america produces oil, they do not produce the moral -- oil here. it is used overseas because it is a rural market based on the american dollar. that sets its value. guest: that is why i was trying to qualify that. i am sorry that that did not come across. the united states is connected to world market. that has a pretty big determinate effect on the price of gas. and a price of a lot of these article inputs. i do not think that we should shy away from the fact that the united states over the last couple of years has been a energy exporter. we need to do more. and there's a big transition to

electric vehicles. that is currently underway. it is a massive change we will see in our economy. i think everyone is woken up to the idea that, we would do really need to transition away from fossil fuels, toward something that is more energy dense. there is a lot of research that is going on right now in hydrogen. there is a lot of research going on with advanced geothermal. there's a lotta research in vision technology. . there is likely a finite amount of oil. we are trying to research and find ways to get away from that and to ensure people have the ability to have people transport and their formal way of life without having the cost coming from carbon emissions.

that is the key thing we have seen over the last 10 years that has been pretty dramatic. so much you have this pretty strong case and energy that we are in a better situation from quite some time. we have seen these transitional waves from these things, from carbon sources and trying to integrate these newer technologies into our lives in a way that makes sense. host: it brings me back to that question that you asked, how likely is that energy will be produced for free in the next 50 years? it is one of your polling questions. why ask for free? how do we get to that in a free market? how do we get two free energy? you are talking about research

and innovation. how do we get there for free? guest: we are just trying to ask the most extreme version of this question in order to understand people's temperature. one way to pick about it, if these things are so cheap and are so easy to access that it becomes much more like a netflix service, or becomes closer to a cable service that you pay a single price. it is basically -- as we say too cheap to meter. there are some interesting technology that can get up there. one of the things we're positive about is the advancement of geothermal. this is a new series of technologies that have been developed because of fracking and what is happening in oil in the states that allows us to dig incredibly deep into the earth's

crust. therefore you are able to use the energy that exist in the earth's crust in order to power a whole range of technologies we are to think this is the most interesting one out of the whole group. . it will allow us to upgrade resources. it will allow us to upgrade technologies. the benefit of these things, they do truly work in the way that some are imagining that they work. you basically would be paying for this service. this service will be close to a cable service or netflix or something along those lines. we are asking questions on how people think about the future. we are trying to ask the most bold questions possible. that way we get a sense of where

people sentiments life. host: in portland, oregon. this is tom. republicans. good morning. caller: thank you for taking my call. i am listening to mr. william rinehart. for policies promoting growth. they are then he talks about getting away from fossil fuels. then he just got through talking about fracking, where it has all kinds of the assist. we have to get away from -- all kinds of uses. we have about two or 300 years worth of energy. his not indefinite. it is another 200 plus years. the united states doesn't the best and -- does it the best.

we already have a carbon footprint at home anyway. i must be just one of the worlds brightest morand's. -- morans. what is this guy talking about? guest: we have a very range of different energy sources currently. there's a whole bunch of different ways we get energy. it is obviously for varying aspects of our lives. we get some for industry. there's obviously some that goes into homes and transportation. what i'm suggesting that we are trying to do, trying to think through those policies that allow us to get to the next better stage of an economy.

currently when it comes to energy independence and oil expiration in the state continues and that those continue through technologies. fusion and division. geothermal also. there is a lot going on here. it is not a easy and simple solution for one thing or the other. as we look at the problems in the critical issues of the states in the near term, we are going to be thinking of the speed of different technologies and policy changes that go on and try to make those possibilities in actual reality. host: this is steve in tucson. good morning. caller: i am very interested in this talk about moving away from world dependency. electric vehicles seems to be a

major part of that. you are going to be replacing oil with electricity. my question is, where does this electricity come from? where does the infrastructure come from? who is going to pay for it? do i just drive up to charging stations and it does not charge me anything? how does this work? host: none of these things are going to be easy. guest: what we are looking at -- i do not think we are looking for an easy transition by any means. as you mentioned, the actual charging stations are being put in by some states. some states are developing in that way. there's is obviously a lot of money that came through over the last couple of years on upgrading infrastructure. some states are trying to upgrade infrastructure. there is a lot that is coming

down the pipeline as it relates to solar and wind. a lot of those projects are actually being held up by various problems that exist in the environmental laws. there is a general sense that we need to clean up and make smoother and quicker. i do not think any of this is going to be easy or cheap. individuals are switching away. they are choosing. in part we will see critical investments in this infrastructure. we are seeing investments in really new technology by the department of energy and a whole range of government entities to try to bring these things to the finish line. the real big assessment of the reason why we are in a place where we are -- have important sources of energy independence,

in the 1970's during the oil prices, there was a lot put on finding new places for energy, the united states, but also on innovation and trying to do better with airplanes. that technology sit into the new technologies that switched over from these older power plants. what i'm trying to say here, the story -- it is going to be a long story. it may take us a 40 or 50 years to make the transition. we are already seeing these things happen. especially with ingenuity that we have in the states, i think that we really can make a very significant change in the next couple of decades that will allow people to have cheaper energy and will allow us to do much better.

and allow us to enjoy a high quality of life. host: citizens of the united states live in a economy of abundance. how does the u.s. stock up against other countries when it comes to the poor and their level of abundance? how are u.s. citizens poor in relations to other countries? guest: that is a big question. it is highly debated. we do see that the u.s. does have some poor areas. i come from illinois. there is a lot that needs to be done in illinois in order to ensure that people have better opportunities. the united states does have a lot of critical assets. we do have some of the highest household incomes for the entire world. that is a positive thing.

there are some areas in places where people struggle. i think that is where we need to ensure that all of these possibilities really kind of come together. we need to make sure that children are well educated. we need to ensure that people have the ability to go to a job where they have transportation and all of these related possibilities set up. they are becoming more productive for themselves and family. when you look at the united states, there is a lot to be said about this. we are a complex society. there is a lot of differences depending on the region. the northeast has a very different source of income issues that compares to the southwest. when you look at the united

states as a singular hole, it is hiding the fact that there's a lot of variety. a lot of this is going to have to be considerate and bawled through at the local level. that is a difficult past. i am not trying to simplify this by any means. it really is the act of the next 20 or 30 years of us getting our act together and make sure more income households are getting the technologies that will allow them to succeed in this current tech -- economy. one of the things that was positive that came out of covid, now we are giving low income households money to get connected to the internet through a program that i have been speaking through and working on and releasing data with for quite some time.

i think there is a lot of positive that has come out of covid. this is one of them. we need to think critically about how we give people the tools to succeed in this modern and growing economy. host: andrew, a republican. caller: thanks for mentioning giving people the tools to be successful. i am in the information technology business for four years. started in silicon valley. our goal was to not have millions of automobiles on the road. what i find amazing is that people are not allowed to work remote. in certain places we do not have that. what concerns me is that, they

invested heavily in the downtown towers. they need the automobile on the road to break down so other companies can be investing. having these electric vehicles are not the answer. hybrid vehicles are already approved for technology. why not mandate that? why not mandate it and doubled the fuel efficiency? they will not do that. it is just amazing how we keep making bad decisions. you do have to create the fuel, you have to save the fuel. guest: there have been some of these efforts. california is trying to basically go no gasoline powered vehicles in the next 10 years if i recall.

hybrid are a very common resource. the mandating part of this is interesting. typically those standards have been advanced or pressed forward by california. if they really tend to be the leader of this. i think people are thinking about going to hybrid vehicles for the reason you are suggesting. a fuel mandate? i am far more focused on the innovation and technology space. obviously, i keep up-to-date with what is going on and energy issues. how you mandate and make the possibility, i am not agreeing with those two. i just do not know how that would be done or work. you are suggesting remote work is a key component of all of this. i am very much in agreement.

there are some industries that can work well with remote work. are there are others who cannot. being in the same area does have a pretty positive effect on the outcomes of a company. what we have been seeing is, lots of different places and organizations are trying to figure out what works for them. elon musk has made a big splash that says everyone has to work locally. he is not the only one. he is not just the only person in the information technology space that is working. i think there has been a lot of stress, especially for my generation. there has been a lot of interest in working for those companies and places that do give flexibility that allow you to go in maybe twice a week or i like you to work from home or have some flexibility for time. all of these things are

beneficial outcomes of covid. there are a lot of horrible things that came from covid. this idea that maybe people need to be flexible with their time. they need to have the flex ability that comes with remote work is a positive outlook on one. caller: good morning. everything plastic is made out of oil. the farmers say they have to use 200 pounds of nitrogen for every eighth of land. the nitrogen is paid out of oil. this winter, the heating bills are going through the roof. policies up bidens were causing this way before the russian war. let's get that straight. i maintain that biden is going

to be -- people out of the house. they are going to be forced to heat their homes or by medication or by food. it is probably going to kill some of them. guest: i am not -- i do not think that biden has the ability to determine how the temperature is going to be. i do know that in california there was a program that allowed for local utilities to turn down the heat. i believe it was in texas. i forget. i do know there was a lot of incentive that was connected to that. the issue you are noting with fertilizers is a critical issue.

a lot of fertilizer comes from russia and has been -- has a very serious issues with supply chains with everything happening in russia. of those two things are going to be an issue. i am not going to say that it is a easy or simple thing that we can do for that in the near term . in the long term, what you will likely see is -- trying to ensure that fertilizer especially some of the input for phosphates, in the united states there is a big key component in florida and california if i remember correctly. as much as things are happening, i would not deny the fact that there are supply chain issues everywhere. not everywhere, but key critical industries that in the long-term , ics in the united states trying to adapt to those problems.

i think i have mentioned this in other context. there is a lot of positive things. we have the most solar power possible because of the -- where we are located. near the equator, we have the most wind energy that can be produced. we have a very young population in -- educated population. we have a lot of problems that we are going to deal with in the near future. caller: good morning. my thought is that, i am hearing a lot of conversation -- at least for people. they are concerned talking about the policies that have been created to go against the

country because the oil is the main steak. from my understanding is, the reality is, the policies are basically taking us in a way of offering incentives or making some companies accountable. it is the companies that determine where their investments go. the policy just divides resources so that these companies can have incentives in terms of whether they are going to do drilling or whatever. most of these companies are in other places doing business. the way that it is presented to people, the reason why prices

are so high, we do not have certain things for the supply chain. i do not see that is true. no one is sure to correct that. they are just leaving it up to that kind of -- type of advertisement. it is the companies that a lot of the stuff needs to be directed to. host: let me stop you there. guest: there are a lot of things that are positive happening with companies. there is a lot of companies in the tech industry are committing to zero omissions by ten-year. a lot of them are actually paying more for their energy in order to bring down certain kinds of technology. there is a group i have been following pretty closely called

spring climate that is trying to invest in new technologies related to carbon capturing and technologies at large. there are companies who are interested in that. i think we need to have patience. we have only seen the interest in the desire to have changes like last 10 to 15 years. we seen a lot of companies wake up to this problem. it is going to take time to switch over our economy to something that is more -- that makes less carbon that has the energy needs for individuals. it is going to take time for these things to work themselves out. i am very positive for the fact that we have come so far in so few years. we are at emissions level per capita. it is declining. a lot of other countries are at this place as well.

we are going to need to make important investments, particularly in fusion and in new energy sources in other -- order for this to come about in the near term. there's a lot of interest in doing this and doing it well, in the sense that people do have productive lives. i think there is a broad recognition in the united states. we have problems. there's a lot of positive things happening in the united states. i hope the politicians and leaders take upon themselves to continue developing this. there are a lot of resources in the united states. when we bring ingenuity to these problems, we succeed in big ways. host: let me end with asking you a question from your abundance poll? when do you think someone should be born to have a thriving life? 200 years ago? right now?

or 200 years in the future? guest: i would hope to hundred years in the future. i am positive. i am incredibly happy to be born and working at this moment in the world. i think there is a lot of positives that exists. i think there's a lot that we can do to make the world better. my work really in the next decade and decades to come really be focused on this to ensure that people are having fulfilling enriched lives that is abundant and positive. host: william rinehart is a senior researcher >> tonight, we will show you remarks by former governor chris christie and ambassador nikki haley. you can watch their remarks at 8 p.m. eastern here on c-span.

you can also watch on c-span now, our free mobile video app, or online at c-span.org. >> fridays at 8 p.m. eastern, c-span brings you afterwards from burke t -- from book tv. a program where nonfiction authors are interviewed by journalists and more on their latest books. this week, dallas mavericks ceo sid marshall shares her memoir about her life and career as the first black female ceo in the nba. she's interviewed by michael lee of the washington post. watch afterwords every friday on c-span. >> book tv, every sunday on c-span two features leading authors discussing their latest nonfiction books. at 2 p.m. eastern, a disssion of the qualities that make great

military and civilian leaders with retired lieutenant general robert bully. raond james raymond, author of elite souls. then former penn state president provides his account of the penn state child-abuse sex scandal. watch book tv every sunday on c-span two and find the full schedule on your program guide or watch online anytime at book tv.org. >> c-span now is a free mobile app featuring your unfiltered view of what's happening in washington, live and on-demand. keep up with the day's biggest events with live streams of floor proceedings from the u.s. congress, white house events, campaigns and more from the world of politics all at your

fingertips. stay current with the latest episodes of washington journal and find scheduling information for the c-span tv network and c-span radio. c-span now is available at the apple store and google play. downloaded for free today. c-span now, your front row seat to washington anytime, anywhere. >> up next, congresswoman suzan delbene he talking about the need for privacy standards. she's interviewed by anna palmer, founder and ceo of punch bowl noose. the event includes remarks from represented of's of trusted future, a nonprofit organization focused on digital policy.