♪ host: is mass shooting and is

added further proof to the fact america's gun violence problem is getting worse. gun ownership continues to rise. some 30% of americans own a firearm. even though congress passed the safer communities act this year in response to previous mass shootings, american support for further gun restrictions are showing signs of waning. good morning and welcome to washington journal for this tuesday, november 22nd, 2022. our first question, what do you think about the state of gun laws in the u.s.. if you think that fewer laws are needed, fewer restrictions, the line to call is 202-748-8000. if you would like to see more gun laws, 202-748-8001. if you think things are just about right in your state and across the country, the line is 202-748-8002. you can text us your thoughts at 202-748-8003.

tell us your name, where you are texting from or on facebook you can post their and post your thoughts on twitter and instagram at c-span wj. interested for the perspective of gun owners, a 30% of americans owning guns now. 40% of households in the u.s. have at least one gun in the household. and the survey from the gallup organization released yesterday taken in advance of the recent killings at the university of virginia, the uva shootings and of course over the weekend the shootings in colorado springs. here is the headline on the gallup report. support for stricter non-laws slips going to gallup. in that rvey of americans this is a regular survey that gallup does. they say 57% of americans want stricter u.s. gun laws down from 66% in june, they also say 86%

of democrats, a 60 percent of independents and 27% of republicans want stricter laws. about 46% of u.s. adults say there is a firearm in their household. your thoughts on this. do we need fewer gun laws, fewer restrictions. 202-748-8000. more gun laws, 202-748-8001. 202-748-8002 if you woo -- if you think things are about right where they are. in particular gun owners we would like to hear from you and also some specific areas what you would like to see is fars gun laws go. a good statistic reported here by nbc for the third straight year, america hits grim milestone. 600 plus multiple victim shootings. when the shooting was over in

five bodies were removed from a colorado gay bar that a gunman had turned into a killing zone, yet another stat -- sad statistic into the books. the third straight year that there have been 600 multiple victim shootings in america. the figure was reported by the gun violence archive, nonprofit the tracks the spread of what's been called an american disease in which defines a mass shooting as a single incident in which at least four people other than the person wielding the gun are shot. the deadly attack saturday in colorado springs was the 600 first incident in 2022. according to the group the gba includes any type of shooting and its analysis including domestic violence shootings and private homes, gang violence among others. your thoughts on gun laws in the u.s.. we go to the line for those who want more restrictions, allen is in queens new york. good morning. caller: hello.

i want to say that the lack of gun legislation, gun control legislation is an absolute shame. it's a no-brainer that people get guns. it's crazy. people act like nstitution is some divine thing, it's like the american torah. this says e two you have a right to have guns and they are going to town with that. it is insane and everything the republicans are talking about is insane. with so many challenges we have, a change, the economy, they are worried about transgender bathrooms, some utterly stupid things. >> mike in tennessee is next up. what's your view. >> less laws.

the criminals going to get the guns no matter what. so why should a law-abiding citizen but wants to protect themselves with a firearm be restricted in what they can obtain. >> should there be a restriction on the size of a gun or the amount of ammunition one can buy? caller: anything that our military can use overseas i don't see any reason firearm related obviously you don't need a bazooka or something like that, but it's typical firearm than any human being can use i don't see the reason there should be a restriction. >> richard in chestnut hill, good morning. go ahead. caller: good morning, can you hear me? let me just say that for many years it was sort of conventional wisdom inside the

beltway that immigration would be intractable. but as someone who tends to favor stronger gun control, myself, i feel that i'm very disappointed in the voters on the left side of the spectrum broadly speaking because just like before, roe v. wade was overturned all the years the christian right that voted on those issues and the supreme court, why are people staying home on guns. when there's so many, the nra and the gun lobby is so strong and whether or not, whichever party the republicans controlling the house, i don't see anything really massive but this is actually a uniquely american problem we have. up north of the border of canada

we have very strict gun laws. so i mean i just do not see why why we can track down why we can't have national background check for example. host: what are the state gun laws in effect in massachusetts? caller: they are pretty strong. they are pretty strong. the assault weapons ban, that has been. and i believe the legislature, the legislature since certainly this current supreme court, the last several decisions on this issue. to shore up our gun laws. i believe they are some of the toughest in the country. >> thanks for the call. you mention comparing the u.s. to canada, of bbc has a look at

the top gun ownership rates in the countries across the world. this is from the bbc, the top 10 civilian gun owning countries. the estimated number of firearms per 100 residents. the u.s. far outpacing yemen. 120 firearms per 100 residents in the united states and 53, just about 53 in the country of yemen. the suspect in the shootings in colorado springs was charged yesterday, here is the gazette, the local newspaper in colorado springs. anderson lee faces 10 charges including hate crimes in fatal shooting's in colorado springs. here's the colorado springs mayor. >> as mayor of colorado springs and frankly on behalf of all the citizens of colorado springs, i want to again express our heartfelt condolences and

unwavering support to the victims, their families, the lgbtq+ community and everyone affected by this tragedy. i had the opportunity before i came here today to talk to richard fierro identified as one of the two heroes that subdued the suspect in this case and in my opinion and i think the opinion of everyone involved has saved a lot of lives. i won't talk about the nature of what he told me about the incident, i will simply talk about i have never encountered a person who is engaged in such heroic actions that was so humble about it. he simply said to me i was trying to protect my family. i would also like to thank our community, of whole colorado springs community. the outpouring of support they have shown. i cannot tell you how may people reached out from the city, our

region and frankly from across the country expressing their love and support for colorado springs and the club q community. a lot of people want to know how they can help. we know that the victims and their families need our immediate and long-term support. and i want to tell you about the colorado ceiling fund, that's been in existence for some time. it was utilized during the boulder tragedy were several people were killed in boulder. some time ago. it is set up to provide a secure way to donate to victims and family members and incidents such as this and they are ready and able, they've already talked about appropriating money existing in the fund to the club q shooting victims. and what i want to emphasize to the public is if you choose to donate through the colorado ceiling fund at colorado healing

funds.com, you can be absolutely sure your donations are going to the right place. host: the colorado springs mayor in his comments he mentioned one of those who helped subdue the alleged shooter in that mass shooting at club q. this is richard fierro, army veteran who says he went into combat mode to disarm the gunmen. he said he was at a table at club q with his wife, daughter and friends watching a drag show when the sudden flash of gun fire ripped across the nightclub. his instincts from four combat deployments as an army officer in iraq and afghanistan instantly kicked in, a flight back he told himself. in interview at his house where his wife and daughter still recovering from injuries, mr. fierro who left the army in 2014 as a major describes charging through the chaos of the club tackling the gunmen and beating him bloody with the gunmen's own gun.

president biden after the shooting released a statement saying this in part yet another communityamerica has been torn apart by guniolence. families lef with an empty chair, a table and holes in their lives that cannot be filled but when will we decide we had enough. we must address the public health epidemic of gun violence in all of its forms. i signed the most siant gun safety law and nearly three decades in addition to takin other historic actions, but we must do more. we need to enact and assault weapons ban to get weapons of war off america's streets. our question is about america's gun laws. if you feel that fewer restrictions are needed, that line is 202 -- is 202-748-8000. more restrictions, 202-748-8001. if you feel things are right where they are, 202-748-8002. doug in san jose, california.

good morning. caller: whenever a mass shooting like this happens, of reaction is always to go after law-abiding citizens. in many of these mass shootings when the background of the shooter is reported upon, we find that over and over again, they have been previously arrested or previously reported in one way or another. if you want to look at a nation that has very tight restrictions, look at mexico. there's only one or two places in mexico where you can legally buy a gun and they're both run by the government. but mexico as we all know is a bloodbath. the problem in the united states isn't gun violence paid the gun didn't do anything. it's a public morality problem. that we have experienced over a

fairly recent amount of time. when i was a child this sort of thing did not happen on a regular basis. it's only been the past two decades but we've seen this problem and it is because we have allowed morals and ethics in our society to deteriorate. people need to be able to protect themselves and that's why there need to be fewer restrictions on the ownership of all types of firearms by law-abiding citizens. host: do you think that access -- easier access to firearms makes it easier for this kind of large-scale shooting? to occur? caller: no. this particular person, my understanding is had been previously arrested and yet somehow they got their hands on firearms. people who want to do this will find a way to do it.

and the only way you can stop it is to do what this gentleman in the nightclub did, fight back. the other issue needs to be a nationwide effort, a nationwide propaganda if you will to tell people, to teach people that violence is not the answer. anybody who's ever been in the military knows that because they've seen it firsthand. this gentleman who stopped the shooter, who is absolutely a hero reacted the way he reacted because he was trained properly. you have to train people to react properly and we see that more and more. there's a lot of cases where potential mass shootings have been stopped by people with firearms or people who simply stood up and did what needed to be done. host: a little bit more on the background as doug mentioned,

the alleged shooter anderson lee , the headline here in the wall street journal murder hate crime charges for alleged nightclub gunmen. they righted one year ago police confiscated firearms after he held his family hostage at gunpoint. according the official during the 2021 incident, his mother told police her son was threatening to hurt her with a homemade bomb, weapons and ammunition according to an el paso county sheriffs office account of the incident at the time, the wall street journal further rights law enforcement officials said mr. aldrich used an ar-15 style gun to carry out the attack at the nightclub and under colorado's red flag law he could have been barred from possessing or buying guns for lease 360 four days after the bomb threat incident. the wall allows both family members and police to ask a judge to bar an individual from possessing firearms if they poses a giving and risk of harming others or themselves with a gun. judges have an option to extend

the order or cut it short. wall street journal says the guns were seized from the suspect pursuant to search warrant and authorities did not use the states red flag law a law-enforcement official said. let's hear from zona in maple falls, washington who would like to see more gun laws. maple falls, washington you are on the air. it just mute your television. in washington, you are on the air, go ahead. one more time here. we will go to lance in fort lauderdale, florida. good morning. caller: good morning. i think there should be less because it now affects only law-abiding citizens. i grew up in a household with weapons, we never hurt people. and it is so easy to buy a gun on the street. if i want to buy a gun legally

in the state of florida i have to go for an application background check which takes a week which is ridiculous in a computer rage it should take an hour. you want me to wait a few days, that's ok. although it needs updating. the question on the form is are you an escaped felon which gives you an idea of how effective. i wonder how many people actually fill that out and say yes i'm an escaped felon. but i could go out tomorrow on the street and if i wanted to buy one within hours i could buy what i want. also the idea of the ar-15's aren't an assault weapon, take a look at 94. this is the most famous most popular rifle in history. it carries a 3030 cartridge which is far more lethal than ar-15. it's a lever action rifle you can pull off eight rounds in a

matter of seconds. the other thing, one, the idea that was bounded possession of firearms and they did nothing about. should be a mandatory sentence of your call with a firearm in the commission of any crime. years in jail, minimum. perhaps maybe more. the other thing in the last thing i'll mention is something that doug mentioned about the hero that stopped this guy and the reason we stopped him and this is something we used to do in this country that we don't, when i was a young man, when a boy reached 11, girls weren't included which should be changed, but when i was 11 i was taken by my father who was an avid hunter and gun collector down to the local high school

where there was a rifle range and we were taught how to safely fire and handle firearms. we used 22 rifles and if you walked on the range with the rifle barrel pointing straight out, you were accosted by two or three grown men who would push up against the wall and yell at you for 20 minutes telling you what kind of idiot are you you're going to hurt somebody. you were taught just how dangerous they were. and you learn how to use them safely. we abandoned this in the 70's unfortunately because of the way people look about guns. and i think if there were strong penalties for gun use. half as strong as we went with the people who buy them legally and we went back, training young men and women, just how dangerous this is. it's a useful tool like the screwdriver.

this is what you don't do with it, we would see this kind of madness stop quickly. >> we go to bill in big spring, texas. good morning. >> good morning. i have a slight different take on it. and my take is that i believe everybody in their home has a right to bear and keep a weapon safely. if that individual is of sound mind and his own home, he has the right to protect his family members. i don't care if that individual is convicted of a felony, tax evasion or what, he has the right to protect his family. outside the home it may be a different story because we do rely on law enforcement to protect us. but i think the individual has a right to bear arms in his own house and a side note one of my

neighbor -- he was bringing out all of his -- and i was amazed he brought up about 200 firearms and i said why do you need so many weapons, he said it's my constitutional right. comedy weapons do you own. he said have -- i set i've got one to protect my family. i said what if somebody steals those weapons and put them out on the street. it's mostly stolen guns and whatnot. and so i think there should be a limit. if somebody else would come back on and ask that question. his children in his home. i thank you for taking my call. >> here's a statistic according to gallup. they asked about a gun law and they asked about gun ownership in their latest survey that was published yesterday.

household gun ownership in the u.s., their question, do you have a gun in your home. in the green, a 46% have a gun in the home or elsewhere on the property. 33% of those surveyed personally own a gun. john is in liverpool new york and would like to see more gun restrictions, go ahead. caller: absolutely. this country, it's a shame, it's a national disgrace. the second amendment, there's no mention of a gun in there. you could be armed with a machete. let me say my father served in world war ii and japan. he was a hero. my four brothers we never had a gun in our house. the kids i played around the neighborhood with, they never had guns. we never had guns back then. it's mostly white guys, let's be honest. mostly white guys that have this love affair with guns. as far as i'm concerned, you all

have blood on your hands. you're feeling guilty about these mass shootings and you come up with these lame excuses about morality and legal owners. how many legal owners commit these crimes. tons of them. you are guilty, you have blood on your hands. you don't have support with any other demographic other than white males. white female support gun control. minority support gun control. and most white male support gun control. the problem is white males control every government agency from state to federal, if you look at its most whiteley -- mostly white males. if we had any other demographic like white females and minorities there would be gun control. it's a shame what's happening in this country. you people that don't want restrictions, you have blood on your hands per you are responsible. >> to jean in atlanta who would

like to see fewer restrictions on guns. >> good morning, things were taking my call. i'm to disagree with your prior caller and a couple of callers ago who was talking about morality and i think that's accurate. i think he has a point. also that last caller, that's just downright discriminant art -- discriminatory against white people. the morality issue, we are in the middle of a population explosion, we hit a billion people on the planet. i remember in the 90's it was 6 billion. so the population explosion of cash is occurring is a challenge to us to instruct our youth. i'm to go back to defunding the police because i think we need to spend a lot more money on

schooling and that sort of thing as opposed to buying tanks for the police and things like that. i prefer less law and more freedom and liberty, but we have to instruct our children about the association between the responsibility for these freedoms and liberties and i think that's not occurring, i think that's the root of the problem. and i don't think i've blood on my hands because this nation was founded on freedom and liberties and we need to protect that, but it's a failure of our government for not making that association for our children. in the current -- and the current republicans are right about gun laws but there law and order position tends dangerously to me towards fascism. so i think we have a lot of

challenges on her hands. and i hope our congress can debate these issues and talk about these things and make it so that we can have a balanced population. it's a huge challenge. we are funding the police so much. all kinds of stuff. were not doing anything for education. i think that's criminal honestly. host: this is from the washington post, a red flag laws and spotlight after the shooting. what to know. they write the shooting in colorado springs nightclub the left five dead raised questions about colorado's red flag law and weather is implement it properly. the town's mayor said we don't know whether the gun law would apply in the case and possibly prevented the bloody incident. speaking at a news conference colorado springs officials did not confirm that the suspect of the shooting at club q was the same man threatened his mother with a bomb last year's bite sharing the same age and name.

they were sick -- they declined to say whether a red flag law should have been applied because of such an incident, comment on twitter about red flag laws from one of our viewers says while being completely unconstitutional they are totally ineffective for their stated goal. the real goal, disarm law-abiding americans which is the obstacle for the totalitarian great reset. airborne ranger says make criminals know their target is not an easy target and violence may be met with defensive violence of equal measure. criminals don't follow laws because criminals are criminals. self defense. robert responds turn all venues into war zones. let's hear from john in telford, pennsylvania. good morning, go ahead. caller: thank you for having me on. you just said about the red flag

law when you read it. you answered your own question. they had laws to prevent this. this gentleman had threatened mother and to blow up the house with explosives, there was a standoff, there was no reason for this man to go back into a store and to buy these guns, but was able to because the fbi let him. because the fbi wants this to happen. just like the insurrection. just like the guy from new york said it's all about white men in their love of guns. no it isn't. if you're here in pennsylvania you watch the news you will see the black people are shooting up the city of philadelphia. today passenger got shot on a bus. yesterday temple students got robbed at gunpoint. these temple students are getting robbed. so what you want to do is disarm the whites and the law-abiding

so you can let blacks run all over people and this guy you don't know it might be a gaze spat but you're not letting people know about that. as far as paul pickle head pelosi goes that's another thing nancy pelosi let these people come across the border so you get what you sow bill. thank you very much. host: go ahead. caller: i'm a first time caller and i can't believe that got through. but anything -- but anyway, i think there should be a total assault weapons ban with ar-15's or ak-47, i think there was a ban on those type of weapons being in possession of american citizens when after ronald reagan was almost killed on an

assassination attempt. unfortunately that went out of effect and we went back to assault rifles flooding our streets. so that's all i have to say today, thank you. host: the gun law that passed this summer and signed back in june is called bipartisan fe communities act. among its provision it would expand background checks for prospective gun buyers between 1821 and it set the stage to provide access to previously sealed juvenile records. it funds a grant they can apply to red flag laws. it includes a federal criminal statute banning gun trafficking. it clarifies who needs to register and it closes what was called the boyfriend loophole. it also allows one time non-repeat offenders who are

restricted from gun access to have gun rights restored under certain conditions and provide the money to expand access to mental health, school safety and training. we are talking this morning largely out of a poll that came out of gallup on gun ownership and gun laws in the u.s.. 202-748-8000 is the line to call if you think fewer restrictions are needed, gun restrictions. if you would like to see more gun laws. 202-748-8002 if you think -- if you think things are about right. biden sees a surgeon democratic support, he's backing to run for reelection has been significant boosted in the wake of a better-than-expected midterm election results. the new usa today poll finds while former president trump's standing among republicans has been dented. usa today poll says the number

of democratic voters who believe biden could win the 2024 race for the white house jumped to 71% up by double digits from 60% who felt that way in august. 75% of republicans say trump could win the next election. still higher than biden among partisans but that's a seven percentage point lower than the 82% who held that view of the former president. just before the midterms. jim in hudson florida, good morning. caller: it's been said many times on your program already, protect your family. what would you rather have in your hand. a phone where you call 911 for it how long will that take. a social worker, how long is back in it take or would you rather have a gun in your hand to protect your family. whether you're at home, at church, a restaurant or theater,

just a handgun. you don't need a high-powered rifle. if you just have a handgun to protect your family, that's the whole secretive anything is to protect your family or people around you. if they have the security guard at that gathering and he pulled out and took that guy out, just like when they had the baseball game a few years ago were republicans got hurt there was a least somebody who had a gun and they took the guy out who was shooting them. a gun -- there are times when a gun is needed. you can call 911 or call a social worker. that guy would take two days to get there. your house went down, your family wiped out. a gun is just common sense at times. it should be used legally. thanks for taking my call.

host: here is matt in dallas, texas. go ahead. caller: thank you for taking my call. it has been interesting to hear some of the comments, i heard race invoke, i heard morality invoke. but the way i see it and the reason i support more restrictions is because we have a gun irresponsibility problem in this country. it's very obvious you see these mass shootings. we are not responsible with guns and i think some of the callers are harkening back to a simpler time when they remember hunting with their grandfather were teaching their son how to use a gun, that is fine. in this state, i worry because we took away the requirement that people have to train to own a firearm. you had to have a concealed gun license for the governor signed that out of law. host: when did that come into effect? caller: two years ago.

it was in the last legislative session two i suspect appease a certain part of his base, greg abbott's republican base who just hold on their purity of the second amendment as if there should be no restriction on owning a gun. i agree with the last caller if you want to own a handgun to protect your family i have no problem with that. but the issue seems to be with the automatic rifles. and until you address that, how many more of these shootings are we going to withstand? the analogy i would use is like there's an arsonist going around burning down people's houses and the solution is give more people flamethrowers. more houses again a burn down. so until we learn to be more responsible with how we use weapons and specifically automatic rifles, you have to do things and make sure they are licensed and check for mental

health. if you want to add morality in their until he can show were responsible how we use guns in this country there has to be more restrictions. host: the focus on states where gun violence is high. people can debate that, the need for more few in schools, the use of active shooter drills, the wisdom the idea that may be even teacher should be packing. in the available data on gun violence. the federal government was effectively barred from gathering. the indisputable fact is where there are more guns there are more gun deaths. from cnn, they write that by far there are indeed horrific gun deaths in chicago each year and cnn has covered the problem but they write their more gun deaths in texas by far than in any other state according to data

from the u.s. centers for disease control and prevention. texas, the most recent year for which the cdc has published data. that's 14.2 deaths per 100,000 texans. california by comparison saw 3449 deaths, gun death rate of 8.5. texas does not have the highest gun death rate, far from it. the top states by gun death rates are mississippi, a 28 .6, louisiana 26 .3, wyoming 25.9. and alabama 23.6. alaska 23.5. marston mills massachusetts, good morning to mark. caller: good morning. it is a slippery slope i think. here in massachusetts we have pretty tough gun laws. but you have to take a firearm

course and that has to be reviewed by the chief of police and then which can take up to six months and then you have to get a license. so just north in new hampshire, you just have to show a license to buy a gun. you don't need a license, like a driving license that is. so you need a gun license here. here in new york i think the strictest, the most strict licenses in debt for gun ownership in the country and you have to renew it every four years or something like that. but one thing that stands out to me is all these mass shootings, not all of them but maybe 80% or 90% are people who commit the crimes are all legally or -- this guy who just shut up the place in colorado. the grandfather of some

california assemblyman and there were bomb threats thrown around between him and the sun i guess. the whole family is a nightmare. the maniac up in buffalo, new york, he was legally at the right to have them. i'm not sure about the one in orlando, but i bet -- he killed 49 people there. i think it's a high capacity, it's as simple as that. i agree with what bill was saying from texas. everybody has the right to protect themselves. and when you've got every buddy running around with guns and whatever, you can take that away from them in this -- but in the same sense you have all these maniacs with guns so i don't know. host: we will go to oklahoma city next. bill says more restrictions are in order. tell us why. caller: oh, city, you're on the air.

mute your volume, go ahead with your comment if you are still there. we will go to jeff in ohio. caller: good morning and thank you for taking my call. i would like to just first of all, the gentleman who called previously several call back. automatic rifles are illegal and have been illegal for many years. having said that, i would just like to make the point that we have several different cultures in the united states, we have a rural culture and in inner-city culture. and never the twain shall meet. i can tell you being raised in a rural culture i never thought that a weapon made me a bigger stronger man or more powerful man or better man. i've always looked at it in such a way that it was something that was was to be respected, i am a sportsman and -- but at the same

time, knowing full well that if you ever use a gun to hurt or harm another individual, you better be right. so i've always been in fear of ever having to use a weapon. but having said that you can eliminate all the ar-15 style weapons that you want but you will never impact this because if you look back at the mass shootings, they were done with handguns and i think the most important thing to do right now is put an emphasis on mental health, and start to enforce these gun laws that we currently have in place. a lot of these gun laws, once these individuals get into court where the use of these handguns and rifles and things of that nature, they are plead down. so we can start to employee the laws we have in place. we are coming up on the holiday season. i love my fellow man, i hate this.

anybody who is a good sportsman are good human being out there, i hate this. and i do hope somehow we can get back on the right track. thank you for taking my call. host: a couple of states had gun measures on their ballots on election day couple weeks ago. let's go to iowa first, the des moines register. islands approve the right to keep and bear arms in the state constitution or they adopted an amendment to the iowa constitution to add the right to keep and bear arms adding language that goes beyond the protections in the u.s. constitutions second amendment according to unofficial results. the des moines register writes that iowa will become the fourth state with a strict scrutiny language. achieving a longtime goal for republicans in the iowa legislature. taking a look at another state, oregon passed a gun measure as well. this is from oregon live. what does the measure requires gun owners.

the measure passed narrowly in the november election and it will be one of the nation's strictest when and if it goes into effect. they say the measure is a so-called permit to purchase done laws. under the measure, anyone wants to buy a gun will have to obtain a permit, a an anticipated fee of $65, complete and approved firearm safety course of their own expense, submit a photo id, be fingerprinted and pass a background check. the measure bans the sale or transfer of magazines that hold more than 10 rounds of ammunition. let's hear from john in st. louis in missouri. >> first time caller, a longtime listener. if guns -- pencils misspell words, cars drive drunk. it's just ridiculous. why not protect yourself. i live in the city of st. louis.

we had more killing last night. what would be if other people had a weapon. you have to protect your family, that's all it is. host: we will hear from danny in boston. caller: good morning. i feel like i'm bringing younger voice of the conversation as some and in their mid-20's. just a couple of points. i think the biggest take away from what i'm hearing this morning is we are hearing the exact same talking points again and again and again. i listen to the show every morning and i have for many months, i read on the news, you see it everywhere. the way things are right now are now working so having more guns is not helping people and i know my argument is knocking to change any minds, so i really just wanted to put my

exasperation out of their and i'm really sick of hearing all of these either/or statements. someone just said you can get rid of the ar-15's but you're still good have this problem. that's not necessarily true. we should limit the number of assault weapons and we should take steps to restrict these kinds of things from happening because they are increasing at an expense or rate. how many times has ceased and donna show on gun violence and on a show on gun violence right after mass shooting in the past number of months. it's very exhausting. thank you for hearing my voice. host: if the action in addition to the measure the past by the congress earlier this year the signed -- the safer, unities acted there needs to be further federal action in the area for

example of what kind of firearm people can own? >> yes, very much prayed i would like to see some of these laws actually go fully into effect and to see how they work and behind the fact restrictions are effective, i also fully support people's right to own a firearm or multiple firearms, but it doesn't mean you as a gun owner are free from the responsibility in our society. i work in a grocery store and frequently have the thought would my life be at risk today with somebody coming into our grocery store. it's happened multiple times in the past year. i can protect myself from the weapon that you have, it's a two-way street with the responsibility. host: thank you for calling in.

let's go to michelle in louisiana. says fewer restrictions are needed. caller: good morning. i think there need to be fewer restrictions. the laws that keep passing really affect law-abiding citizens, if someone like to call her previous to me doesn't want a gun, don't buy a gun. it's quite simple. we have too many laws on the books that aren't being enforced. we need to enforce the laws that we have and reconsider the ones that aren't working and just take those off the books. but we don't need any more gun laws, that's ridiculous. host: do you think one of the laws that should be enforced in this case the perhaps the red flag law and colorado that that type of law whether in colorado or elsewhere ought to be used more forcefully, more

effectively and on more occasions. caller: well that's a great question and i'm glad you asked because i'm against red flag laws and this is exactly why. they clearly don't work. they can be used maliciously against people who have done absolutely nothing wrong by let's say a spouse, someone who is divorced or someone with a grudge, so i'm 100% against red flag laws, they don't work, this is a typical example of how the laws on the books aren't being enforced and crime continues to happen. it's crystal clear to me. i'm really surprised all the people wanting more restrictions can see this. host: the story here on the continuing aftermath of the violence and death at january 6. this is from abc seven news in washington, the death of the u.s. capitol police officer who

took his life after january 6 is classified as in the line of duty after more than a year of asking the officer be considered in the line of duty, of the family member's of a u.s. capitol police officer said that the department of justice public safety officers benefit program classified his passing is a line of duty death. he took his own life on january 9, 2021 three days after rioters stormed the u.s. capitol building and launched a violent attack. official said he was serving on the front lines during the insurrection. he served with the capitol police since 2005, the agency released the following statement on monday. we are pleased the department of justice's public safety officers benefits program has determined the death of our late friend and colleague within the line of duty death. the u.s. capitol police supports this decision of the department of justice. next up is eric in columbus, georgia. go ahead. caller: thank you.

i want to say a couple of things. we wouldn't be having this debate until i guess till jesus comes back in america anyway because we are a gun culture. i believe, i truly believe that congress is going to do something to make it where they take all the weapons away. that's one point. the other point is you have two different kinds of people out here using these guns and i'm not mentioning -- not to mention the ones that are law-abiding. you have the kinds there in one of two categories. there something wrong with them upstairs. and this goes out to the guy who was saying there's all the shootings in chicago, your those one-on-one crime that have to do with people using guns.

but they both use guns and those two groups are the reasoning that everyone like myself. i own a pistol, i carry one, you wouldn't even know i had it on me. i've had to draw my gun before and followed up with the police. i did not have to shoot it, but it was to stop a crime. and i was the target of the crime. but as far as guns ever going away in the united states, that's not can happen. that's just not can i happen. thank you. >> to larry in lancaster california. >> there are more than enough gun laws if they were enforced. but i think the topic on gun control is missing the big picture.

if you look at all the mass shootings that happened, it's been in the last 20 years? i think there should be a debate on the violent video games that has been -- that have -- i heard they use, they are murder simulators. i tried to play one of those games and they were too messed up even for me. if you look at the age of these mass shooters, i think they are all under 30. these games have to have an effect on these young people's psyche. in world war ii they did a study where 80% of the beach invasions , only 20% of the soldiers were doing the fighting and it changed the training from round targets to silhouette targets

and the next beach invasions went to 80% of the soldiers were fighting. so that had an effect on the human mind, these violent video games, these kids have been above bartered with for the last 20 or 30 years has to have an effect. and it makes these murder simulators teach these underdeveloped mines that murderers and killings is fun. and these games if you've ever seen them, the reality of these things are amazing. host: do you think those games numb the players to that kind of violence? or do they sort of encourage that kind of violence even though it is fantastical, it's a fictional scenario. that kind of violence as being an option or accepted as a way out of one's problems if you

will. caller: i listen to a guy speak years ago who trained special forces and they use those video games. i think at the time it was doom or dune or something like that. and they used that to train special forces to engage one target and to move to the next target without seeing the first target react. that's how they got high scores. i think one of the first mass shootings, a kid who had never shot a real firearm in his life went into a school and i think he engaged multiple targets, plenty of them with a success rate that was exceptional. >> an opinion piece in the washington post also gets into potential reasons why shooters,

mass shooters do what they do. colorado massacre fueled by hate, not mental illness is the headline. he writes you know who will get the blame for colorado springs, each time these things happen the right-wing is going to blame mental illness. that's what some thought drove robert bowers to the tree of life synagogue in pittsburgh to kill 11 human beings. that's where others believe may dylan roof stroll into a black church in charleston, south carolina. and sooner or later conservatives will say was mental illness who the newest killer of the marginalized to commit the latest atrocity. are we are going to ask why supposedly mentally ill people seem to carry right-wing talking points along with her ar-15's. before we go to joe were asking the question about how the gun laws you feel are too restrictive. you want fewer stricter gun

laws, so far in our twitter pole at 67% or so say more restrictive laws are needed and 25% or so with fewer restrictions. joe is on that line in west virginia. fewer restrictions, go ahead with your comment. >> i live in west virginia. the only restriction we have here in relation to getting a gun is no felonies. i carry a gun and i love it. i would not feel comfortable. i'm from new york originally and you can have a gun in new york. when i take my granddaughter shopping or whatever, some guy spaz is out, has a bad day or whatever his problem is i can protect myself and others around me. i understand, i might miss and hit an innocent person but the same time i might hit the perp and put them down. now that recent killing in

colorado, if the bar owner had a gun, probably could've prevented a lot of murders. so i'm all for having guns and i would never live in a state that doesn't allow me to carry a gun because it makes me feel safe. i don't want to be at a convenience store, someone's having a bad day and all i can do is throw a can at him. most of these people, at the end of the day they have issues per day may not be mentally ill but they have obviously serious issues. so you're knocking to stop that and carrying a pistol, i'm not for these assault rifles prayed i think they should be banned. as far as pistols are concerned i can buy a cartridge that holds 10 or 15 shots and terry two guns so i can still kill 30 people in a short period of time using pistols. the argument of ar-15's and so forth it really doesn't hold salt. if everybody had a gun, here in west virginia grandma carries a

38. no one's going to jump up. we have zero carjackings in west virginia. most of your house intrusions are people who know you. host: we will go to virginia, midlothian virginia. go ahead with your comment. >> i want to say i think the gun laws in place are sufficient already if they are enforced. i do believe that there's a bigger problem with especially among the younger people that are so influenced, the mental -- there's a mental health issue in the country that needs to be addressed more importantly. it can be preyed upon by people online and they get played with. it starts a chain of events. i think there is a mental health crisis. i do not leave -- i come from a law enforcement background. retired law enforcement.

i can tell you seriously the age levels between 17 and 25 are much higher for those suicide rates, that can translate into murder. there is a question, the intervention teams need to be in place as far as that goes. the intervention teams need to be in place, there is not funding for that stuff. host: code red flag laws, could that kind of intervention be increased and improved in a state like yours? caller: yes, it could be. the problem is, you have laws. i have worked in the health-care industry. you have hit the laws that are supposed to protect people's rights -- hippo laws -- hcfa -- hippa laws that are supposed to protect people's rights. these are restrictive and what

law enforcement can get. host: appreciate your perspective. more ahead on "washington journal." next as we prepare to gather for thanksgiving on thursday, a discussion about food insecurity in the united states. we talk to billy sure, founder and executive director of -- executive chair of the group share our strength. later, joined by columbia university professor peter leman who is author of the way out, how to overcome toxic polarization. we talk about how to bridge the political divide in society and perhaps our own families at the thanksgiving table. president biden pardoned two turkeys named chocolate and chip. here is a portion of that ceremony from the white house. [video clip] >> votes rn. they have been counted, verified. there is no foul play. he only red wave this season is if commander knocks over the

cranberry sauce on our table. they are big turkeys. my fellow americans, please welcome the 2022 national thanksgiving turkeys, chocolate and chip. >> [applause] >> they go wherever they want. of course, chocolate is my favorite. chocolate is my favorite ice cream. we could have named them chips and science. what have been good names, as well. chocolate chip ways 46 pounds. i am told he loves catching sun. chip ways 47, he loves barbecue and basketball. after receiving the presidential pardon today, chocolate and chip are going to head to one of the nation's great ascot ball schools and research universities, north carolina state.

when we talk about joining the wolfpack, they got scared. we explained it was a mascot for the school as one of the nations best poultry science departments into country. based on their temperament and commitment to being productive members of society, i hereby pardon -- >> [turkey gobble] >> i hereby pardon chocolate and chip. which one is chocolate and chip? chocolate, you are pardoned. chip, so are you. he is like, i didn't have to be told. can we do that? we can do that. that is a big bird, man. we have more chickens than anybody in the nation in delaware, but we do not have turkeys. look at this. god love it.

this is chocolate, right? chocolate, you are pardoned. you have to tell me that? >> [applause] >> yeah, you are. yeah. i am serious. he said, i do not know. you didn't have to pardon me, i knew i was pardoned. thank you both, very much. thanks you very much. appreciate it. how many turkeys you got down there? god love you. 9.5 million turkeys. i tell you what, looks like some of the countries i have been to. anyway. you want to talk? folks, in all seriousness, let me close with this. we cannot forget the reason for thanksgiving. the pilgrims thought it was important in tough times to come together and thank god to be

grateful for what we have. that is what the thanksgiving tradition is about. being grateful for what we have. grateful for fellow americans who we may never meet, but -- >> [turkey gobbles] >> they are grateful. >> "washington journal" continues. host: join next by billy sure, founder and executive chair of the group share our strength to talk about the state of hunger, food insecurity in the u.s. your group, share our strength, what is its mission? guest: it's focus is on hunger and poverty in the united states and around the world. are our priority for the last 15 years, chihood hunger in the united states, which bas on every thing we understand we know about it, is a solvable problem. we have no shortage of food in this country, we have no

shortage of food programs, either. our focus has been on eradicating childhood hunger. we believe we can get to the point where we may still have poverty in this country, we may still have food insecurity, we do not have to have childhood hunger. host: help us to find the two terms used in this discussion. childhood hunger, the statistics are on food insecurity. is there a difference between those? guest: great question. there is an important difference. food insecurity is specific as an economic measure, based on a battery of questions that families are asked about financial stresses on their family and the degree in which they worry or the anxiety they may not be able to feed their kids healthy meals. when we think of hunger at share our strength, we think specifically in the physiological sense. our children getting the three meals a day at they need to

survive? the government has one other measure that they use of food insecurity called very low food security, which is based on questions about whether your kids have actually missed a meal. unfortunately, before the pandemic, that number was driven to the lowest level it had been in over 50 years. when i say this is a solvable problem, we've got good evidence that we have been pretty close to solving this. our first goal as an organization is to make sure all kids in this country are getting the three meals a day that they need to thrive. host: on the food insecurity data, you can look at the data image from the department of agriculture and see this big pie chart with a big green of nearly 90% of the country is food secure. tell us about the 10% that is not, the numbers who have some level of food insecurity. is that -- has that number

gotten worse in the united states? guest: it certainly got worse during the pandemic. before the pandemic, the numbers were heading in the right direction. today, we've got about 9 million kids who live in families that are food insecure. it is probably helpful to think about food insecurity in correlation to poverty. we ask why kids and families are hungry in this country, it is not because of the shortage of food. there is no shortage of food programs, either. we have really effective programs we have seen make a huge difference over the years. we have the national school lunch and breakfast program, a summer meals program when the schools are closed. we have efforts like stop, the supplemental -- snap, the supplemental nutrition assistance program. this creates a battery of support for families who need these types of food assistance,

they have been very effective at driving down food insecurity. during the pandemic, this all changed. so many jobs were lost, so many businesses and other enterprises were closed. we have seen stories of as many as 40% of all of the families who were in line for food assistance during the pandemic, you will remember some of the images of thousands of cars in line at the san antonio food bank or the atlanta food bank. 40% of those families were seeking who'd assistance for the first time ever. you get a sense of how close to the margin people were living at. we may not the able to have all the answers to solve poverty or food insecurity, we can solve hunger. host: billy shores with us with share our strength. we welcome your calls about food insecurity and hunger in the united states, particularly childhood hunger. (202) 748-8000 for those of you in the eastern and central time

zones. for mountain and pacific, it is (202) 748-8001. if you are suffering or dealing with food insecurity or lack of food availability, welcome your calls and comments at (202) 748-8002. billy, i think it is helpful to put perspective on that 10% data. you touched on this a moment ago. nearly 34 million people total in the united states have some level of food insecurity. 8.6 million adults in households with very low food security. 5 million children in food and secure households in which children and adults were food insecure. over half a million children, .7% of the nation's children in households in which one or more of the children experienced very low food security. how do we measure that data? guest: we get that data during survey research and census data that asks families these

questions. i'm glad you pointed out the .7% of kids who live in families that have very low food security. as tragic as that is, think about that. that is a manageable number in a country with our resources. again and again, we have seen programs that work. a year ago in the biden administration, there was a child tax credit that gave families support as much as $3000 and in some cases $3600 per child. less than 4 million kids above the poverty line, the greatest increase in moving kids above the poverty line instead of living in poverty we have seen in this country. tragically, we have let it expire. hopefully, legislators will reenact it. we are so close on some of these issues. the pandemic taught us things about how to feed families and more effective ways.

congress passed a law to flexibilities and waivers in the early days of the pandemic that took some of the most burdensome regulations off of the efforts to feed hungry families. we have learned a tremendous amount. fortunately as you point out, these tools, these surveys exist. the census and usda data exist that tells us, families and different types of demographics are dealing with hunger. to me, what it adds up to is a very solvable problem. host: in addition to the end of the child tax care credit, what new needs have arisen post-covid in the area of food insecurity? guest: one of the things in the antihunger community that has always been a challenge is feeding children in the summertime when schools are closed. about 22 million children in this country get free and reduced price lunches. they are all eligible for

breakfast, as well. unfortunately, only 12 million get it because lunch, kids are there and school has logistical challenges to getting kids there early. in the summertime, only 3 million kids are getting summer meals. one of the things that happened during the pandemic which was instructive was our country scaled up something called a pandemic ebt, electronic benefits transfer. basically, being on snap or food stamps benefits. it gave them the opportunity to go out and do what we all want to do, purchase the meals we think are appropriate and healthiest for our family. we saw the impact that had. there were so many things that congress did during the pandemic, including as it relates to summer meals, letting us feed kids on what is called a non-congregant basis. it used to be all kids had to come to one place to get a summer meal that was reimbursable. pre-pandemic, we said no. he have to take food to where

the kids are, take them to their coup -- take them to their homes, drop the meals off, let families pick up the meals and take them home. we found out these flexibilities , far from being in any way abused, actually create a much more efficient way of kids and families. host: billy shores, our guest. (202) 748-8000 is the line for eastern and central time zones. (202) 748-8001, mountain and pacific. for those of you with some level of food insecurity and want to get guidance on that, share your thoughts, (202) 748-8002. first off is trish in seattle. good morning. caller: good morning, happy thanksgiving. i have a comment and question. first off, i am retired. i belong to a senior citizen group. every monday, we get vegetables that are not pretty enough for

the higher rent grocery stores, which is such a help. i went to the grocery store couple weeks ago to get my three pack of romaine lettuce. nine dollars for three, small heads of romaine lettuce. a month ago, two months ago, that was four dollars or five dollars. i went to the grocery door to buy a pack of egg noodles to finish up my cosco chicken and make some soup. six dollars for a pack of egg noodles. in the meantime, here in seattle, kroger's -- i think this is something, billy, i would like you to address -- kroger once to buy up albertsons, safeway, a couple different stores that are not in the seattle area. now, it becomes a monopoly. fortunately, our attorney

general, bob ferguson -- this was right before. albertsons once to give up $4 million worth of dividends before the sale goes through to their shareholders. he stopped that. -- paul is in on this. it is not fair, this is not right. once again, this is corporate america taking the american people to the bank, taking their money. i do not know how people with children afford this. host: all right, trish. billy, your thoughts. guest: appreciate you calling in and sharing your personal experience of what inflation is doing to individuals and families across this country, whether it is children or seniors. there are so many who are not in a position to be able to adjust

to the inflationary pressures that we are seeing when it comes to grocery shopping. as you point out, there is so much excess produce and food in this country. you talked about benefiting from produce and vegetables that may be misshapen, but still completely healthy. about 40% of food in this country gets wasted. there are a lot of food organizations working to distribute it to people who need it. in terms of kroger's and albertsons, monopoly is almost never good for the consumer. i do not know the particulars of what is happening in seattle in your region. the good news is, i can tell you kroger's, albertsons and many grocery chains have been very generous. not just input -- providing food, but financial resources to antihunger organizations. i think many of these countries -- companies do recognize they've got a corporate, social

responsibility. i know kroger's and albertsons have been very good on that score. fundamentally at the end of the day, competition is important for the consumer. host: she mentioned inflation. how has the inflation affected the operations of providers like here in the nation's capital area, capital area food bank, or those volunteer efforts to gather food for those organizations nationally such as scouting for food and other national food drives? how has inflation hurt those efforts or affected those efforts? guest: it has created a tremendous increase in demand. feeding america has done some reports on this. i do not have the statistics in front of me. they do a great job in making sure emergency food assistance providers, food banks and others, are getting the food they need. it has been hard to keep up. with grocery prices where they are, so many families are trying

to supplement their grocery shopping with types of foods these organizations provide. it has created a tremendous crunch. i know we have seen as an organization trying to help fund many of these organizations, we have provided $23 million in grants over the last year to school districts and food providers you have described. we have seen demand increased tremendously. host: let's hear from james, matthews, north carolina. good morning. caller: good morning, how are you? i wanted to first commend billy sure and share our strength for all their hard work and dedication to fighting and alleviating poverty and congress throughout not only the united states, but the country -- but, outside the country. my question to billy is, are there any food banks or places

that people can go here that are affiliated with in the charlotte area? guest: there are some great food banks in the charlotte area. if you go to our website, no kid hungry.org, we describe our impact on the grants we have made. you might see some of them listed there on the map. we booked work with the charlotte restaurant community and chefs and restaurants groups to raise money over the years and directly fund the food banks there. i do not have the name of the food bank nearest you right at hand. there are some terrific ones. they really have done -- the quality of the food in food banks has improved over the years. there has been a dedicated effort to make sure it is nutritious and healthy. there is a much wider selection available. host: a couple questions via

text. we will see if we can get to a couple of them in our conversation. one from cam in new jersey. with so many children charities for hunger, how do you determine the legitimate ones and what is the rating of your agency? guest: we are rated very high by some of the organizations that you ratings like guide star and others. they may have a star system, we have either been three or four stars, based on a combination of analysis of finances, how much of your work is devoted to a program and so forth. we literally see thousands of applications every year. it is important to understand that although we are talking about hunger in this country during this thanksgiving week, it is not a seasonal issue. this is something we deal with all year-round. i mentioned making grants $23

million over the pandemic. we made grants of over $120 million, more than 2000 school districts and community organizations. sometimes, that means ymcas or boys and girls clubs. sometimes, that means the food banks and emergency assistance providers. we have been doing this now for 38 years. to your question of, how do we know which organizations are the best and most effective, we have strong and direct relationships with them. like any organization that files a grant proposal, they will explain the work they do and the impact they have had. we go beyond that, most of our team has a relationship with these organizations. we do a lot of on-site visiting. to directly answer the question, one of the most important things an organization like ours can do is be out in the community to listen to what the community needs, to be community centered in terms of our strategies.

we spend a lot of time on site at these different facilities. the leadership is the ballgame. when you add confidence in it, you get a good result. host: we will go to cleveland next and hear from jane. good morning. caller: hi. i first want to thank you for your work. i do not mean what i am going to say as a sarcastic or anything about your work, because i think we need the kind of work you are doing. but, we also need to remember what i want to talk about. i have done writing a lot the past 30 years. i have come across a statistic recently that i want to share. back in 2013, every ceo to pay worker ratios were to pan, 11 to one. germany, 12 to one. canada, 20 to one. u.k., 22 to one.

mexico, 47 to one. u.s., 475 to one. if you let that sink in, it is hard to let that sink in. that is extremely elite. we have in our domestic and foreign policies, reflect our welfare to the wealthy. that is how we get to 475 to one. we extremely favor the wealthy and always have. while we provide surety and we seem to -- charity and seem to assume poverty will always be with us, it need not always be with us when we can support that much wealth in this country. it is absurd. we need to change -- while we are doing these charity things globally and domestically, we also need to work on changing the policies that promote

elitism and extreme wealth injustice and make people poor. poverty does not need to be with us, it is created. we need to look at those policies. that is what i called to say. host: ok. guest: i think that is one of the most important messages of this entire conversation this morning. our tagline at share our strength, our philosophy in the early days was that it takes more than food to fight hunger. i say that because hunger is a symptom of a set of deeper problems. it is a problem in of itself, but a symptom of other problems. those problems have to do with poverty, and equity, lack of opportunity. at the end of the day, to truly understand it takes more than food to fight hunger, no one is against feeding a hungry child.

the most important thing we can be doing is ensuring that child's caregivers, whether it is a parent or grandparent or family member or friend, has to resources they need to be able to support themselves. this gets into issues of affordable housing, health care, educational opportunity. some communities now are looking at basic, guaranteed income assistance. at the end of the day, we cannot out food bank hunger. we cannot out school breakfast hunger. we have got to do these processes. you pointed to what i think is the next challenge. we've got to make sure kids are fed, that is what i think our organization at share our strength. host: what about your bait ground -- your background gave you this passion about hunger,

and tell us about your podcast which you interviewed chefs and talk about the issue. guest: my previous background was political. i worked in the senate for about 14 or 15 years. i was the chief of staff senator for nebraska in the early 1990's. before that, i was legislative director for gary hart of colorado. i was involved. i had these basic, community organizing and fundraising and policy and political skills. one of the things that struck me after my time in politics was, as important as it is, our politics in this country tends to leave a lot of people out. it is too narrow. there are so many talented

people in this country with something to give, with talent, a strength, an asset, a story of their own that can make a difference. this whole idea of share our strength, everybody has got a strength to share to create a vehicle and do that. that is what my background had to do with it. what was the other part of your question? host: it was about your podcast. guest: the idea of the podcast was to create almost like we are doing this morning, and opportunity to have a longer conversation about these issues. particularly, to show the intersection of food with so many other things we care about. food and climate change are directly related. food and our health and nutrition are directly related. our ability, children's ability to learn. on the podcast, we almost we have a chef, restaurant tour or someone in the culinary community and pair them up with policymakers.

our podcast comes out every other wednesday. you can find it on the usual podcast platforms or go to add passion and stir.com. host: let's go to dennis in northeastern pennsylvania. go ahead. caller: hi. my question is about corporations. what the amount of money they are making. it seems to me we have set up the system where some of the americans are part of the corporation and are benefiting from all of this inflation and stuff. it is a nuisance to a good part of americans. as long as they are benefiting from it, more and more americans are benefiting from it, it is not going to change because it

doesn't bother them that the inflation is hurting so many people in this country and around the world. guest: as you are pointing out, there is a big gap. in some cases, those who have wealth get more of it and others don't. that is the situation we have faced for a long, long time. at the end of the day, we've got to find ways to help average americans, hard-working americans --i know many people in my community work more than one job, in some cases, more than two to make ends meet. we have to make sure they have the resources they need, whether it is education, loans for education, other types of workforce development or job training. one of the things we're starting to think about at share our strength is single moms. a very large number of kids who live in poverty in this country,

probably more than 60% are kids in families with single moms. we have 10 million single moms in this country of low income. until we find ways to even the playing field for them, it doesn't mean we have to take money away from corporations as they have a lot to do with growing our economy, but we've got enough resources we've got to be able to share some of it with others. host: 15 more minutes with our guest, billy shores. we are talking about food insecurity, hunger into u.s. (202) 748-8000 is the line for eastern and central time zones. for mountain and pacific time zones, (202) 748-8001. for those of you who have some level of food insecurity, it is (202) 748-8002. you used to be called food stamps, now called supplemental nutrition assistance program. what do those benefits provide? guest: snap benefits provide a

monthly allowance. it is not particularly generous, it doesn't usually last a whole month. depending on the size of your family, between $120 to a couple hundred dollars so you can go to the grocery store and buy the foods that are right for your family. there is almost nothing except for tobacco and alcohol that is off limits, so families have a choices to make. we've got 41 million americans. if you can imagine, a big number. 46 million american numbers, 10 years ago. 41 million americans who are still on the snap program. a very large percent of them with children. also important to understand, a very large percent of them, a majority of them, our families who are working but are not able to make ends meet.

there has always been some mythology that families who get these snap benefits, it gives them incentive not to work. nothing could be farther from the truth. these are hard-working families who need a little extra to make sure their kids are healthy. one of the things that is important to understand is, there is a national security implication to this. we cannot have a strong country if we do not have strong kids. i was talking earlier about the school lunch and school breakfast programs. those started after world war ii after the generals came to president truman, to say our troops were not strong enough by the end of the war. whether it is the snap program you're asking about or any of these other efforts, these had to do with making our country stronger. host: let's hear from alan from south hill, virginia. though ahead. caller: hello, my name is aaron from south hill, virginia.

i do not understand the hypocrisy. we support war, we can spend billions of dollars to support war but cannot feed our poor. i do not understand our government. billions of dollars can feed these poor. we have people begging for food when we can support war. if the president writes a bill, to spend money to ukraine. i do not have anything against ukraine or any other nationality as far as fighting war. as far as for us to beg to feed our own people in america, i think that is hypocrisy. it would not take all of this money. you have people begging for money when the government will sign a bill and send billions of dollars to another country. i do not understand how this works. i wish someone could please explain that to the american people, explained to america. host: thanks, billy sure with your capital background, your thoughts on the caller's comments. guest: it is the moral dilemma

we face, how are we going to spend our dollars, which voices get heard when it comes to doing this. i think the good news is, we have consistently over the years increased the resources that are going to families and children for hunger. we spend over $100 billion between all of these food assistance programs, it is still not enough. or is still a disproportionate share. some of the things the caller was calling about, we are moving in the right direction. hunger is getting lower. we are starting to reach people who have not been reached before. one of the hardest part of this, i think it gets to the caller's point -- when you think about why we still have childhood hunger in this country when it is such a solvable problem, children do not have the lobbyists that defense contractors or corporations have.

children's do not make campaign contributions. they do not have lobbyists. there are folks in the community we worked in, share our strength and others, other great organizations. we are the ones that go out and try to make the case, whether it is members of congress, governors or mayors, these kids may not be on their radar, but they've got legitimate needs. i think it is getting better, but this -- at the end of the day, this is a political issue. there is a congressman that has been a great leader on this issue, the congressman from massachusetts. he says hunger in the united states is a political condition. it is in terms of whose voices are heard and whose are not. host: sometimes been called a guns versus butter argument. you pointed out the world war ii story of president truman saying the military generals going to congress saying, we need stronger troops, better

nutrition for our troops at a young age when they are children. the current state of the military, they have issues with people showing up who are obese. there is a fair amount of public policy in the area of food and nutrition that does come into play in national security. guest: that is exactly right. i should point out, i am glad you raised this again. the military has continued to this day to be a strong advocate of these programs. there was a remark that came out a few years ago called not to fight, which made the case for nutritional assistant. it does not have to be a guns versus butter bait, they do not have to be in opposition of each other. think of it holistically, they could be supportive of each other. host: let's hear from mary -- harry in northcross, virginia. caller: thank you, c-span. i have a solution. for 45 years, the republican

party and even the democrat party at times, have been on a terror against labor unions and collective bargaining. for a time, we had good pay for the average man. that happened in the 1940's and 1950's. ever since 1975, there has been a war. we need to get rid of the right to work laws and make labor unions popular again. that is really my solution. it worked or me all my life. thank you very much, c-span. host: we have had wage increases across the country after covid. has that improve the situation at all? guest: yes, it has. before covid, we saw -- i mentioned right before covid in

2019, early 2020, childhood insecurity were at the lowest levels ever. there was a direct correlation between that and employment statistics. unemployment was down to 3.4%, it has kicked up a little bit since then. that is the correlation we see. the caller makes a good point. as we talked about hunger being a symptom of a deeper problem, and a lot of this correlates to people who both have jobs and do they have good paying jobs. in terms of labor unions, i grew up in pittsburgh originally. i lived there for the first 20 years of my life, very strong labor town. it was a different time, very different era economically. that was a very strong union town, a steel industry town. you saw what happened when the voices of working people were heard and were at the bargaining table. host: diane is calling from minnesota. she says on our food insecurity

line, tell us about that. caller: yes, i am. i am an advocate in my community in minnesota. i look at state law in minneapolis. i went to talk about, how should we let kids -- the food that comes into our neighborhoods, the inner cities, are vastly different from the ones that come in the suburbs. you want quality food, you go -- the vegetables do not deteriorate in a day. outdated cans are not the out there. out aided cans are here in our city. outdated, all kinds of cereal. the rice, everything. we get the stuff that has bugs in them. how can people select where they send their food to? that happened to me in february. we live on an island in the

city, if we do not get transportation, we do not get good quality food. guest: in terms of the way we were, there are about 200 every large food banks in this country. many are affiliated with feeding america, a partner of ours. those 200 food banks in turn supply about 50,000, may be on average, 400 or five hundred each, smaller soup kitchens, church basements, pantries. our organization has to work through those 200 food banks. there has been a real attention to improving the quality of food in a lot of challenges. many cases, food banks get food that is donated and have months where they can purchase nutritious food. i would say a lot of people who work in this sector are attentive to what you are describing. there has been a disparity between the quality of food and suburbs and the quality of food

in inner cities. there has been disparity in the quality of food that gets to communities of color. there are many of us trying to work to eliminate that. host: a question on twitter from you -- for you. please ask the to talk about food deserts. family might be food insecure, but have access to food -- bad food. is that problem still in existence? guest: it is a really big problem. i just went last month to visit a community in south dallas. there is an organization which was created in response to the fact it is a food desert there. when we visited there, the folks who ran it told us it is not just a food desert, but an opportunity desert, a hope desert. we saw there is an urban garden that is a significant sized urban garden, there are goats,

chickens, all kinds of produce. folks who would maybe have to take two or three buses or go 10 or 15 miles to find food and particularly healthy food, now are able to get food in their own community. there are responses to these food desert issues. in a city the size of dallas, you wouldn't think there would be that -- vast neighborhoods completely underserved. there is also rural areas in this country which struggle with this problem. host: let's hear from carol in wisconsin. hi there. go ahead with your comment, mute your volume and go ahead. caller: just put it down. thank you. i was wondering if you would talk a little bit about all of the people, all of the illegal aliens that are here and

everybody is worried about feeding, clothing, taking care of all these people and not worrying about what american citizens are doing to pay their bills. food is at a premium. rent, everything. i think our government sucks. host: ok. billy shores. guest: obviously, emigration is a problem. both parties have been almost paralyzed on it, it has not improved much under democrats or republicans. i think we've got to find ways. i was in a hotel in boston the other day where they told me they work 30 staffed short. they knew what the solution was, the democrats in this country were willing to work but they didn't have the proper papers to do that. we depend on immigrants to make this economy grow.

there are lots of service jobs that desperately depend on them. politicians are going to have to get over some of their fear and find a sensible way to make sure immigrants can come into this country. not everybody, not open the floodgates, but to the extent that we need emigrants to make our economy work. that is going to benefit everybody. right now, many of the food assistance programs we have described are not available to immigrants. there are private efforts that are. we've got people in this country , the better they are going to do, the better they will contribute. host: let's hear from seymour in arizona. caller: good morning. years ago, i used to show my title i students a show that was called the story of stuff where a country 30% of the usage of

the world's materials were 5% of the population. the real thing is the management. when i was in hud neu years ago in the markets at the end of the day, they get to take the vegetables and the fruits back to the farm. they gave it away to the poor people. we need to manage the situation because we are just not doing it well. when you go in and see the kids eating in the school, a slice of pepperoni pizza and french fries and a juice drink, that is not healthy. the poor people have not learned how to eat successfully. they just want sugar and salt. host: let's get final comments, billy sure, on -- shore. guest: one of the reasons low income families often make some of the decisions our caller was talking about, calories are

inexpensive and protein nutrition is expensive. that is one of the reasons why we have to help families deal with the choices that will be healthy for their kids. i will wrap up by saying, really grateful that c-span has put attention on this issue. we have found without fail whenever there is more awareness to this issue, so many generous americans step up, share our strength, find a way to give back and contribute. that contributes to the solving of this problem. thanks for doing that. the collars have been tremendous, many good ideas have come from this. folks can find out more about our work at no kid hungry.org or share our strength.org. host: billy shores is the executive chair of share our strength. happy thanksgiving to you and your family. there is more ahead on the program.

later, we are joined by columa university professor peter t coleman, the author of the way out, how to overcome toxic polarization. we talk about bridging the political divide in society, our families, and may be thanksgiving table. next, open forum and the chance to give your opinion, your thoughts on any political issue or news item we have talked about or you are following in the is. it is (202) 748-8000 for democrats. (202) 748-8001 for republicans. (202) 748-8002 for independents and all others. we will be right back. ♪ >> are you a nonfiction book lover looking for a new podcast? this holiday season, try listening to one of the many podcasts c-span has to offer. on cue --, you will listen to interesting interviews of people and authors writing books on history.

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through sunday at c-span shot.org -- c-span shop.org. ♪ >> live sunday summer four on in-depth -- december 4 on in-depth. peter baker and susan glasser will be our guests to talk about russia, the trump administration and u.s. foreign policy. the husband and wife team have written books together. kremlin rising, the man who ran washington about james baker and the divider, trumpnd the white house 2017 to 2021. join in the conversation with your phone calls, facebook comments,ext and tweets. in depth with peter baker and susan glasser live on sunday, december 4 on -- at noon eastern on book tv on c-span two. ♪ >> "washington journal" continues. host: it is open forum, a chance

for you to weigh in on issues you are following in the news or we have talked about this morning on the program. lines to call, (202) 748-8000 for democrats. (202) 748-8001 for republicans. for independents and all others, (202) 748-8002. touching on hunger from a broader scale, this is from the new york times this morning. warfare and drought halls somalia towards famine. in the article today, the ceo of -- that spreads in every direction from the hungry and battled city in southern somalia gives way to sprawling planes of militants. over 165 thousand refugees have streamed into window well since last year. fleeing the ravages of somalia's peer cyst route in 40 years. among them was miriam, a

two-year-old girl whose family had lost everything. they write that calamity beckons in somalia where conversations of extremism is driving the country towards its most serious humanitarian disaster in over a decade. five seasons of failed range and climate change have hit 3 million somalis, 300,000 who are experiencing severe starvation. your thoughts and comments an open forum. first to daniel in philadelphia, democrats line. caller: hello. host: go ahead caller:. caller:this is my first time calling in. i am in my late 20's. i have a couple comments. the first comment was, you were talking about gun control. i think you guys should read the second amendment before you guys

do the whole gun thing. there is going to be another school shooting in a couple of months. when that happens, you should probably read the second amendment so people have an understanding of what the second amendment is. i want to comment on what that guy said about playing video games. it is crazy to me to think that when you play video games, you think about -- i have been playing video games for more than half my life. i just go in and think, oh, i cannot wait to go and relax and get a kill streak. this guys like, i cannot stop thinking about murder. super strange. also, another thing i have realized listening to c-span for so long, you guys are the og twitter. it is interesting that all these people on here --[laughter] --these guys are like bots. i cannot tell the difference between which ones are real,

which ones are fake. they call in and say the craziest stuff, which is amazing. i love c-span for that reason. also, the things in somalia happening is crazy. i cannot believe that is happening. i think that is it. host: glad you got through, lad to have a younger voice. independent line. caller: i am happy to get in before thanksgiving and glad you guys are talking about hunger and insecurity this morning. just wanted to touch on a couple of things starting with somalia and the countries that are pretty much suffering from what we happened dealing with with all of the toxics things we do with energy that is causing this climate change and food insecurity in developing countries and bringing it back here to companies like monsanto

and things like that. that is the reason why we have such a toxic system here. and then bringing it back to how we just throw away the majority of the food we have in this country instead of actually having a system where it is getting to people who are food insecure. there are so many different issues when we talk about food insecurity from climate change to how toxic our energy system is and how toxic our food system is. wanted to touch base on those. i know they are very long issues, but really happy you guys are talking about food insecurity this morning. in reference to inflation and those things that are eating families so hard, i wanted to shout out to all the c-span listeners listening right now. our politicians and our congress are not fighting for us, and a matter what party you are in this thing for.

the two-party system has been failing us for a long time. i was a democrat for a long time, i am an independent now. i could never stand behind the republican, that is not going to happen. as an african-american that has seen the vitriol in a lot of this speech, it is unacceptable. host: what is your view of how the election shook out across the country? i know maryland is a democratic state. across the country as independent, how do you think it went? caller: to be honest, i was surprised the democrats made so many gains. i guess a lot of people -- to their hearts with the vitriol from the republican party, they were trying to stand behind trump because they didn't want to lose their elections. at the same time, still worried about desantis and other people like him winning. i think people like that are more dangerous than trump because they act saying and people believe they are people with christian based values win,

to me, it is a facade that is dangerous. to your listeners, listen to your heart. really, really think about the people you are voting for. look at their record and see how they actually help people in their communities, the constituents they serve. host: to the republican line, in michigan, it is frank. caller: first time caller. i just start calling about all these democrats that keep calling in and griping about prices so high and all this. go back four years ago. donald trump, we could go to the store, buy food. we could have gas to go on a little trip. now, we cannot afford to walk out of the house. thank you. host: coming up on c-span networks at 10:00 this morning, live coverage of the former

president of tunisia. we talk about the future of democracy in the era of the world, hosted by the study of -- democracy at the washington center for -- studies. 10:00 a.m. eastern. on c-span.org, streamed on our mobile app span now. in the afternoon, the afternoon, the justice department challenging r court decision after a special master was appointed to review documents sees that former president trump's mar-a-lago home by the fbi in august the court of appeals will hear from the parmer -- president's attorney as well as the assistant to the u.s. solicitor general live today at 2:00 p.m. eastern on c-span and on our mobile app (202) 748-8000 democrats, (202) 748-8001 for republicans, and for independents and others it is (202) 748-8002.

caller: good morning. i want to comment on the gentleman that mentioned the hunger in america, they should not be a reason for that. we are sending billions of dollars to other countries, ammunition and all of that. i called because i am a widow, my husband died years ago. i was a homemaker. to discover he had filed her income tax, i fall for it. they told me the statute of limitations ran out, i cannot get the money. statute of limitation on money that he put in for working, paying his taxes, how can this be remedied? god bless america. host: the independent line, this is michael. caller: good morning.

thank you for c-span for your service. quickly on the hunger in america , quickly, a caller called in and asked, why can't we -- why do we have poor and hungry people? basically, it is a capitalist system. we come in america -- the concept of socialist concepts are anathema in this country. anytime you suggest you have to pay more in taxes, no. we do not want to pay taxes, we want this, that. we do not seem to want to pay for it. that is the capitalist system. thank you very much, enjoy your day. host: up next is david on the

republican line. hello. caller: thanks for having me. one of the things we had recently in the supreme court is the affirmative action case. what i want to understand, as someone who has read henry louis gates the harvard historian, he made it very clear that virtually every african body sold into slavery to the europeans were previously enslaved by the empire in africa. so why -- if affirmative action on the one hand us about diversity, why are we allowing former nigerian and kenyan slaveowners whose ancestors have emigrated, why are we giving affirmative action to them versus making sure we are only promoting the descendants of enslaved persons on american soil?

if it is about reparations, why aren't americans or african-americans of the united states seeking reparations against those who sold them into slavery in the west congo, senegal, all those places? host: next is michael in new jersey, democrat line. caller: good morning. i just want to say that i would like every democrat politician, whatever he has television time, to remind everyone that trump put together to democrats and two republicans and said, quote, whatever immigration policy you guys come up with, bring it to my desk, i am going to sign it. the day that they showed up at his desk, he did not sign it. he could have signed and would have had an immigration policy.

i know he likes to talk about his accomplishments, he could have said. he did not sign it because of miller and another right-winger that was there. i do not know if you member that event, but i remember. the u.s. could have had an immigration policy. host: a lot of you are probably watching the world cup, maybe even today. the story in the washington post about yesterday's game versus iran and the british team, in the spotlight, iran's world cup team silently nods to protests at home as their country national anthem was played at the world cup on monday. the players appeared silent and stonefaced, declining to sing and what was widely saying as an acknowledgment of or even a show of solidarity with a popular uprising upholding at home.

-- unfolding at home. it appears they are being closely watched, and not just for our performs in stadiums. what began with the death of a young woman in police custody, iranian sports figures, including revered figures for the soccer team, have assumed a central role. a chance for me to do some sports of my own in the world cup this morning, earlier today, saudi arabia's stunned argentina, one of the biggest shocks. it is open forum on washington journal, we go next to rebecca in memphis. caller: yes, thank you. i wanted to make a statement about how i think we are all just in a big mess in this country in the whole world, i wanted to say something about

desantis running for president. the only thing i could think about him is him standing up their and bullying those kids that were wearing masks during covid, when he was making some kind of speech. the one little boy did not want to take it off, but he took it off anyway. he is a bully, just like trump. host: colorado is next, republican line. caller: i just want to talk to you guys about the two-tier justice system, especially on your channel. you guys seem uninterested in the whole biden story when we have a president that sold out to china, sold out to russia. 140 nine bank records being hidden, and nobody is interested. it is a two-tier justice system for the democrats. ftx is laundering money for the democrats, there is so much corruption in that little queue behind you. the whole place needs a tsunami

to go through it and take the place down. you guys aren't interested in these stories. i watch you guys all the time. host: to be fair, we arity that entire news conference with congressman comber last week, we aired it live and replayed it several times. when those hearings come up, those oversight hearings coming up in the u.s. house, they will be covered live on the c-span networks. we also did a full programmer to on hunter biden's issue, within recent weeks, on c-span on washington journal. i do not think your criticism is accurate. north carolina, democrats. go ahead. caller: good morning. i want you to bear with me for a minute. in order to understand hunger, go back to the residual effects

of slavery. how the black performance were disadvantaged, how black people have everything they needed during the winter. we were a family, a village, that fed one another. you go back to black wall street , everything they needed. then the white people said they are getting too uppity, they are giving competition. then, you had the red line. i know i am jumping around. the red line for black people cannot buy a house in a white neighborhood. after world war ii, black soldiers cannot buy a house. just to mention a few things, then the fair housing act. it is a two-edged sword, because

when you do fair housing, it seems like that is a good thing. it is, but it is a two-sided sword. whenever you do fair housing, it should be fair apartments, not housing. i thought it was a place for a black person could buy a house at a reasonable price, it is not. white people can come in and put a $600,000 house next to a $100,000 house and price you out. you have to go back. not just recently, but to the residual effects of slavery and every bit of legislation is discriminatory of black people. i could go on and on. you cannot just go through recent stuff. the guy that called in about the slavery thing, you cannot just

say they did it over there, so we can do the same thing. white people have enriched their enormous wealth off of slave labor. host: this is from the washington examiner, federal task force indicts dark web fentanyl kingpin. a federal task force brought down the largest drug lab in history by using undercover agents who found the operator selling on the dark web through his home in los angeles. the drug enforcement agency and others described how they work to bring down christopher hampson, who created his own manufacturing and distribution business, selling more than one million pills. he was indicted friday on 11 counts of manufacturing and distribution and one of legal weapons count the can result in

life in prison if convicted. in arizona, we will hear from jared. republican. caller: my name is jarrod, prior servicemen. i am probably getting deployed to somalia next year, so i will be able to go over and see what is up. the democrat party stuff they keep going on about, i pledge allegiance to the flag, then the republic. it does not say anything about democrats. they seem like they've been trying to divide, our country has created a formula to divide each other and constantly combat each other. it clearly says it stands for the republic kick -- republic. it doesn't say anything about democrats. it seems like we are having a

huge divide, i've had people try to physically assault and attack me because i start stating my preferences to trump and the republican party. i am not sure if you are supposed to be able to talk back on this. host: when did that happen, what was the scenario? caller: it is a guy here, he was running for either senator or congress -- some position. he had a security guard, i said trump is this and he kept referring back to all the stuff bidens problems are because of trump. i said no, trump is not in power, nothing is because of trump. he is still the guy making the decisions. there is no way trump can affect him in his current position because trump is no longer in power. his henchmen followed me, his

private security guard. host: still some follow-up results from the election, speaking of the former president , california republican who voted to impeach trump wins reelection. he was one of 10 house republicans who voted to impeach trump over the january 6 capital insurrection on monday became only the second one to be reelected. he held a 3% edge over the democratic challenger when the race was called in his favor. let us hear from susan on the independent line. caller: hi. i am so grateful for your show. i wanted to say something about maybe some unintended consequences of what has happened digitally with covid.

the trust we are putting in private companies for our identities and verifying information. is that ok? host: go ahead. caller: i have come all the way to d.c., i discovered identity theft three years ago. i worked in film and l.a. -- in l.a., i am well-informed. i discovered my software less custom private software. but i am a freelance person. i have not been to higher education. for three years, who is giving me this software? it is not my union, etc. the only way to verify our identities is through private companies. i will not go naming them.

these are contracts with the federal and state governments for a very identities, i cannot get them to respond to fraud and theft. i cannot get them to respond. host: what is taking so long for them to respond to your claim? what is taking them so long to respond? caller: i've been given reasons so very. they show -- varying. they show a transparency report. it won't list anything due to national security risks. i am a set decorator, i do not have anything to do with anything other than furniture and wallpaper. so that is not really fly. can you elaborate?

i discovered, it is painful because it is hard to talk about these subjects without sounding like a lunatic. but i've just uncovered more and more fraud. host: i hope you get it resolved. north carolina, democrats line. good morning. caller: good morning. i wanted to make a couple of points. i'd consider every president inherits the past president's agenda, economics, whatever. trump inherited one of the best economies in history. he was running on that, he did not do very much. biden has inherited trump's messed, because he was a covid denier. ron desantis -- how dare

republicans insult that man like that. he is the most belligerent president i've ever seen. he decided he was going to be president only for republicans, not president for the whole united states. that is divisive in itself. host: that will do it for this segment of open forum, thanks for your calls. still to come, we will be joined by columbia university professor peter coleman, author of "the way out: how to ovcome toxic polarization." we will talk about bridging the political divide with society and our families. that is ahead. ♪ >> american history tv, saturdays on c-span two, exploring the people and events that tell the american story. at 2:45 p.m. on the 60th

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meanwhile, the outgoing 117th congress uses its final weeks to tackle unfinished business such as defense spending, judicial nominations and funding for the federal government. follow it all live on the c-span networks and c-span now, our free mobile video app, or anytime on demand at c-span.org. >> preorder your copy of the congressional directory for the 118th congress. it is your access to the federal government with bio and contact information for every house and senate member. important information for committees, federal agencies and governors. skim the code at the right to preorder your copy. -- scan the code at the right to preorder your copy. >> washington journal continues. host: our guest is peter

coleman, the author of "the way out: how to overcome toxic polarization." he is also director of the columbia university international center for cooperation and conflict resolution. in light of your book published last year and the recent election, how do you think things came out in terms of polarization across the country? what do the results of the election tell us? guest: many of them were heartening. like any major election like this, the results were mixed in different directions. but it seemed like some of the challenges to our democracy, disinformation, seem to be mitigated. many of the candidates that denied the last election lost. not all of them, but many of them. so i do think it was a good time

for democracy. our democracy seems to be holding. i do not think it means the threat of continued polarization, disinformation campaigns are gone. but i think this was -- given the trend we are in, which is something that started in the mid-1970's of increasing disinformation and challenges to institutions, i will take the midterm results. they were promising. host: a previous caller mentioned the phrase that the election seemed like a formula to divide us, maybe referring perhaps to some of the rhetoric and advertising that accompanied the campaigns. guest: that is very common. we see this all over the world. in any place where there is an election cycle, there is a two-party system, and voters who are struggling or forced into a

choice between two candidates and often times, people are voting against the other side, not for their own side. things tend to get much more vitriolic, hostile, exaggerated and emotional. people become very emotional at these times. it is heartening that even though people were forced to make a dichotomous choice, generally speaking, even though the country is razor thin split in many of the precincts, the vote held. the candidates that lost, they agreed to step away. there were promising elements of democracy that showed up. host: there was the headlines --

a story in the new york times that talked about the political divide in family and among friends. the latest poll by the new york times, nearly one in five voters say politics for their friendships or family relationships. you come to this as a certified mediator in new york, your book is a how-to book. "the way out: how to overcome toxic polarization." in practical terms, especially the aftermath of the election, what is your best how to advice for people dealing with friends and family who may have completely opposite political views? guest: again, i think you are right. the political divide and rhetoric that has gotten contentious now trickle down into families, relationships in

workplaces. it has contributed to high levels of anxiety and depression , people feel more alone. when there are people they used to be able to talk to and spend time with that they feel they can't anymore, that contributes to that. it is a more toxic time in terms of that. but this book does is offer with sides tells us helps, it tries to boil it down to some simple things. one of the things i recommend as people headed to thanksgiving, for example, we are finding that people are spending much less time together as that at thanksgiving. they are getting out of there as soon as they can. a lot of us are anxious about it, anxious about getting into things that get out of control, conversations turn ugly. my first recommendation is all

of us need to stop before we go to our thanksgiving dinner and reflect, what do we want to have happen? do we want to get in there and get triggered and escalate, attack, or do we want to try to take a different path? try to engage in a different way? simply asking yourself that question and not blindly wandering into conversations that trigger us and others is one way to head office door. i have other recommendations. host: we will touch on those, i want to make sure we open up our phone lines to viewers. (202) 748-8000 is the line for democrats. republicans, (202) 748-8001 and independents and others, (202)

748-8002. the house will be coming in for a session, it should be brief and we will be coming back. you say this goes back, the polarization goes back to the 1970's. it seems like more than ever, people where there politics on their sleeve. it used to be not so much in social situations such as thanksgiving. guest: i think that is true. particularly national politics. local politics could be intense and people could argue about things really affecting our lives locally. now, it is the national discourse. that -- then national caricatures we have of one another that are coming in and affecting our conversations. issues like immigration, health care that are very complex, and

we simplify them. there is a right site in the wrong side, our site is right, their site is wrong. -- side is wrong. it really is a debate game play that often times escalates and becomes personal. my recommendation going into thanksgiving is to be somewhat mindful of what you hope to do. if you have an experience with your family or friend group in the past we you go to these meals and you get into difficult conversations, headed off by reaching out to the individual that tends to do that and talk to them beforehand. give them a call, invite them to go for a walk with you. have a conversation and kind of connect and get in sync a little bit, but also just say it has

been a hard time for all of us, any chance we could keep the respect up and keep the climate cool? not get into heated debates over thanksgiving? if you want to have that conversation, let's do it and talk about it now. perhaps not at thanksgiving, when it could have an impact on everybody at the table. host: it seems likely come in with our defenses up, uncle eddie is the fox news watcher or my cousin lisa listens to npr. we seem to come into situations like that with defenses up. guest: this is a very emotional time, people are carrying a lot of anxiety and dread around this. i think just understanding that, doing your best to take some breaths and get yourself in a better place to be more responsive.

we do go in and loaded for bear, we have our talking points, they have their talking points. these things get easily triggered by often times monday and topics that do not seem to have any political value, but do trigger them. you can expect that is likely and, given that, you do not want that to happen, you want a different connection, how can you do that? one way to do that is for whoever is the convene or, whoever's gathering this is, they can set the tone. start a meal by saying i love you all, i am happy you are here . in the past, we have stumbled on difficult topics, it has been an exhausting few years. i'm sure there's plenty to talk about. if we can, respect each other. let us agree to do the best we can to listen to each other and respect each other. if you can get people to buy

into that, that as leverage for you. if things get the rail, you can go back. say ok, we agreed we would not do this. can we agree to take in a different direction? that gives you some sense of control or efficacy over the conversation. host: have a couple of calls waiting, let us do this. if you are on the line, hang on for a minute or two. the u.s. house is coming in for a session, our conversation with peter coleman will continue momentarily. we'll go to the house floor to do the session with the house and be back on washington journal.