host: kevin mccarthy gaining substantial ground over the course of those two votes. joining us on the phone to talk about it now, a washington senior reporter. jennifer has been covering it all. good afternoon to you. thanks for joining us, jennifer. guest: thanks so much for having me. host: 15 votes flipped, the

majority coming in that 12th round of voting. one additional coming in that 13th round of voting. how did kevin mccarthy do it? guest: kevin mccarthy got these votes to him through a number of ways and really ongoing negotiations that are still being sort of worked out on the margins of these house votes that we've been watching. one of the things we've heard but of course we haven't seen any public official changes to house republican rules package or any sort of agreement that kevin mccarthy has signed or anything like that, but what we're hear something that the house appropriations bills, when they come to the floor, will have open rules. which is a really interesting process, where any house member can offer an amendment to that spending bill when it's on the floor. this has not been sean on the house floor -- seen on the house floor in years. mostly because the majority party doesn't want to have to have their members vote on the sort of gotcha amendments that can be offered from the minority

party. we're also hearing that some of the more conservative members of the house republican conference are going to get seats on the rules committee and the rules committee is where all major legislation has to stop off before it heads to the house floor. and the house rules committee is also in charge of sort of determining how house floor debate on these major bills goes. and whether or not you have an open rule or you sort of filter amendment debate through the floor or you have a closed rule where no one can offer amendments on the floor. and then there's a lot of other promises that we're hearing about potentially cutting the federal spending level and making some possible changes to how the appropriations committee works. but we haven't sn ose in writing yet. host: and who took theeaon these negotiations? was it kevin mccarthy himlf speaking directly to the holdouts? guest: we've seen a lot of members of the house republican adership team working on these

negoatns on kevin mccarthy's behalf. we've definitely seen him having coertions on the house floor and going into the cloakrooms off the housflr to talk to members. there's also been a lot of huddling with scalise and stefanik as well as the incoming whip, emmer. host: 432 members voting. take us through the math here and what kevin mccarthy thinks he might be able to do in a 14th round to achieve the speakership. guest: yeah. the mh is really interesting here. and i know thatepters don't like to do math that often. but one of the things thate saw on this 13th ballot is mccarthy having 214 votes. we know there's two republicans ading back to d.c. now who will be here later tonighthen the house comes into session around 10:00 p.m.. and that will bring mccarthy up to 216. but if all members of the house are here right now, the 434 membs at we have at this

moment, the tresh hold for -- threshold for him becoming speaker should be 218. so think a lot of us are watching to see if there's addional negotiations going on or what might happen on t floor later tonight in order to get mccarthy the number that he needs to become speaker. host: finally, among the remaining holdouts, is there a sense of who seems most likely to flip at this point or who is most likely to never flip on any one of these votes? guest: i don't really have a good sense right now of which one of these repubca might flip. i dohink there are hard noes on mccarthy and they won't switch to backing him at any point. but i can't say that foth rest of the members just yet. ho: we'll all find out together, 10:00 p.m. eastern is when the house is set to reconvene. i know there's plenty reporters and members toat up with. appreciate you stoppinby and taking the time. for u

stateses news oms the news organization, washington senior rainstormer jennifer shu it, t tharntion for the time -- shu it, t, thanks for the time -- shutt, thanks for having me. host: we want to get your reaction to today's 12th and 13th votes. to do that here's the phone numbers for you to call in on, 202-748-8920 is the number for democrats. 202-748-8921 for republicans to call in. all others, it's 202-748-8922. you can also send us a tweet @c-span and also looking for your facebook posts as well. facebook.com/c-span is where you can go to join that conversation. again, your phone calls here for about the next half hour or so. want to get your reaction to the 12th and 13th votes for speaker. we're heading toward a 14th vote, this would be the fifth most votes at this point for a speaker in the history of the house of representatives. what do you think about it, what

do you think about the movement towards kevin mccarthy today? we're going to begin on the republican line. this is debbie in texas. debbie, good morning. caller: i've been listening to the comments being said through the democratic party and what they're not understanding that this is, this is democracy at work. can you hear me? host: yes, ma'am. caller: ok. this is democracy at work. there are things that conservatives are concerned about with kevin mccarthy. he's partly responsible for why we don't have a larger majority. in the republican side, you know, and he spends a lot of time talking with biden and also it's hard to trust him

certainly. he's not a conservative. but i would like to say that the comments by the democrats, thinking that this is set to, you know, that the party isn't united, they are united. they have to understand that these people that are holding out are holding out because they -- there are things that they want to see done and they're fighting for it. and i think tonight, i think we'll seeing is change. but -- i'd also like to add, they haven't worked this hard in four years. actually having to be there and do something. and i'm happy because, you know, this is what they were elected to do. and they stand united. but there's one thing different between republicans and the democrats. democrats stand together because they're like puppets. i know there are democrats that have left the democrat party for

the same reason, that they are threatened if they don't fall in line with the democrats and what they want. host: that's debbie in clyde, texas. greg in south st. paul, minnesota. line for democrats. greg, good afternoon to you. caller: thank you and i'd like to thank you for having me on. i've been watching this thing from the beginning. and it's really irritating me and it's both sides. they act like children, they act like the kids that i went to school with in first, second and third grade. and also they're always talking about, well, we have this job to do and that job to do and when they call their names, they're not even there. i understand that there are people that have doctors appointments, that have to go to the toilet or whatever. but all this talking and back slapping that's going on is a bunch of nonsense.

and arguing back and forth. i mean, it's just chaos. that's what it is really. it's chaos and that's what people are tired of in this nation. host: scott is on line for all others out of novelty, ohio, in the buckeye state. good morning. caller: good morning. i'd just like to say that one reason the republicans have control of the majority is from allowing the states to have districts so jerry mandered that's why they have -- gerry manneddered that's why they have the majority. and number two, i think the democrats, i would like to see, getting is done. they should all pulling together and nominate someone like liz cheney, the lady a couple days ago said this. and get behind her because she wouldn't let none of the conspiracy theorists, the election deniers or any of them

get away with anything. otherwise you got five hard noes, nothing is ever going to get done. host: to iowa, des moines, iowa. this is jailen, democrat. good morning. caller: can you hear me? host: yes, sir. caller: hey, yeah, i've just been watching this. i think it's really interesting to see this group of republican holdouts use this strategy to withhold their votes. they're getting concessions and they're weakening power through their party leadership. and this is the same strategy that people on the left were asking members of the squad to partake in a couple years ago with nancy pelosi, with the force to vote argument. people were trying to get them to foarls the vote on medicare for all. we're seeing that this strategy seems to be working pretty well for what these republicans are asking for. getting a vote forced on they said the border, looks like they're now getting some cuts to

military spending and they're also stopping party leadership with interfering with some of these primaries around the country. so things like people on the left were asking the squad and the progressive caucus to take up this strategy a couple years ago were correct. host: that's jalen in iowa. kenny in massachusetts, republican. go ahead. caller: yes, glad to be on, finally. i've been calling quite a few days now. i'm a republican. i'm kind of discouraged with them not getting this business going. they had two years to get done what they want to get done and nothing's ever done. now they're going to side with the democrats, they're going to let them be chairmen almost on a republican platform. that's unbelievable. and then pelosi, the democrat before, and put this new chairman they want in there two years ago. then they made -- hadding is

going good if he's as good as they say he is. host: as a republican, can i ask you, who do you see as the leader of the republican party right now? caller: i'd like to say jim jordan. he's a heck of a nice guy. he's honest, straight. hard to find honest people in all the parties. and it's really disgusting. but jim jordan, he's a good leader. i think he can turn this around to fix everybody. host: that's kenny in massachusetts. malik is waiting in new york, line for democrats. malik, good afternoon to you. caller: yes, thank you for having me. this is really a shame because this guy, kevin mccarthy, how

long has it been, 15 times, 15 times this man has not been nominated. why is the republican party not getting somebody else? i don't think he's going to get nominated at all. why are they holding the people getting sworn in, can't do no kind of business, you know, veterans can't get paid or whatever, you know. nothing's getting done. you might as well go with jeffries. you might as well go with jeffries. host: today was the first day that hakeem jeffries didn't achieve more votes than kevin mccarthy on that 12th and 13th ballot. kevin mccarthy earning more votes for speaker, a significant movement today in favor of kevin mccarthy from some of the holdouts in his party. if you want to join the

conversation this morning in the wake of those two rounds of voting for speaker, democrats, 202-748-8920. republicans, 202-748-8921. all others, 202-748-8922. a couple of tweets from congressional reporters. host: tonight being 10:00 p.m. eastern. that's when the house is

expected to return. taking your phone calls, getting your thoughts on two roundses of voting for speaker. it was the 12th and 13th rounds today. eric is in the pal meto state, in simpsonville, a republican. eric, good morning. caller: good morning, sir. i am active in my precinct. i want to tell you, sir, you know, obviously we have seen a lot transpire in the last three years in our country. but the political apathy is now coming to a head. in my view, our elected representatives, not since 1776 have we seen, and i heard the earlier caller, a woman spoke about democracy, you hear that word over and over. we're a constitutional republic, right, if we can keep it. let us not forget that unless these representatives are focused not on the

trillion-dollar spending bill for things that really, number one, it should be border. you don't have a border, you don't have a country. it should be about election fraud, because we know it exists and it was a problem. of course when democrats said it, they were allowed to say it in 2016. when republicans say it in 2020, they're conspiracy theorists. and lastly, the wuhan china virus or covid, however you want to refer to it. so me, when we see a justice department on the 6th of january, where we have american citizens in prison for two years, all of the things that we see going on that we now see with twitter, that we see going on with our energy tax, gas prices, a war on energy, the american people see kevin mccarthy for what he is. when he was caught on tape. a traitor to the former president, and even if you're

not a trump supporter, did we not learn, the republican party is working hard, much of my family were democrats when democrats were 11:00 a.m. and republicans were 1:00 p.m., today they're polarized. i think the democrats have been taken over, far radicalized and are anti-american and not for this country. and the republicans are sellings. host: who is the leader of the republican party right now? caller: in my opinion, i heard the earlier caller, the gentleman, i think in my opinion you look at -- i'm still a trump supporter. even though i don't think he was a conservative or a liberal. i think he did -- he made a lot of mistakes but i think he did more right if you look at his sheet. you don't have time, i could give you 25 things he did right. after trump, i would say desantis, jordan, people that stand up. i look for people, look, i admire the democrats for their

conviction and corruption, they stick together. republicans, if you don't stand for something, you'll fall for anything. host: that's herric in south carolina -- that's eric in south carolina. back in new york, this is edwin, independent. go ahead. caller: yeah. so as an independent who was formally part of bernie's campaign team -- formerly part of bernie's campaign team, one of the reasons i and so many others left the democratic party is because we voted for progressives like a.o.c. on the promise that she was going to bring the ruckus to the democratic party but what ended up happening is last year, you can see that her voting record aligned with the majority and nancy pelosi up to 94% of the votes. and you can hear, i have this clip of her on my computer here, saying that the democratic party couldn't even get a florida vote for medicare for all. listen here.

host: edward, we want to -- edwin, we want to hear from you and our callers. we've been hearing from members all morning long or all afternoon long, since noon. and plenty of callers want to talk about it. this is bernard in california. a democrat. good morning. caller: good morning. thanks for taking my call. host: go ahead, sir. caller: i'd like to speak to the fact that no one is really talking about the results of what this particular -- [indiscernible] -- we have a minority group who are anarchists calling sides in our congress. we can look forward to the next two years of chaos and a whole lot of confusion and the rest of the world look at us like we've lost our minds. i think that unless we want to be hounded about this going on and understand this is a process

and this is democracy and all these things hearing all these other folks talking about, what is going to be the result? unless things are settled, nothing will get done. there are calls for this guy to be replaced for no reason. host: thanks, bernard in california. line for democrats. speaking of democrats, the total number of votes on the floor in the 13th round was 432. it was 431 in that 12th round of voting. what changed? congressman david trone of maryland, the democrat, came back for that 13th vote. a tweet from the congressman -- time to vote for hakeem jeffries. david trone sending that out earlier today, he was on the

floor for the 13th round and is expected to be back on the floor for a 14th round, that's what we're expecting at 10:00 p.m. eastern tonight. we're asking you your thoughts on two rounds of voting, the fifth most speaker votes in history at this point. carol in the natural state, republican, good morning, you're next. caller: good morning. i just wan to say that i got to take my hat off to the guy who had surgery and showed up. this -- it is ridiculous and i do not stand with mccarthy. you can forget that. anybody who wears an american flag and then has a great big ukraine flag on their lapel is definitely out of here as far as i'm concerned. i want to see my crawford and hill and womack and westerman, what i'd like to see is harriet hagman nominated, the lady who beat the socks of liz cheney. if everyone would look her

speech up, democrat and republican, it's called "we're fed up" and just listen to this woman. now she definitely is conservative but i tell you, she will -- she would be a -- an awesome speaker of the house. harriet hagman. you know. i have called, i know at least 50 republicans and told them about her. but everybody is stuck mccarthy and he's not going to quit. he's hardheaded and he want i. host: have you called member's offices to say to vote for hagman? caller: yes. i call them all the time. they're probably -- they probably got me blocked about half of them. host: what sort of response did you get when you called those offices? caller: well, really it's like trying to get ahold of a movie star. they're not going to answer the phone. i don't know if you could get any of them.

to i have belittled them, i have cussed them, i have stormed, and none of them has ever called back. but that doesn't mean i still don't call. i leave a message or i do get their secretaries a lot. but yes. i do call and if i had -- if i had the money, i would be on their doorstep in washington. i can promise you. host: carol in arkansas. back to south carolina. sue in charleston, a democrat. good morning. caller: good afternoon. for us. host: good afternoon, apologize. used to the morning show around here. caller: i want to compliment the lady from arkansas, good job. my observation after watching this almost all of it for the last couple of days is that the tale is wagging the dog. even if mccarthy manages to get the speakership, we really don't

know what he has given away. what we do know is he has moved his whole caucus way to the right. he has changed the rules in a way which will probably damage his own speakership and maybe even -- thank you. host: this is lee, independent. go ahead. caller: a leader should not bribe people for votes. usually a leader reluctantly step into a position. and i'm seeing this whole thing where kevin mccarthy insists on taking the speakership and keeping on voting and voting instead of putting somebody else out there that's palatable for everyone. the democrats will stick together. i even heard that they were willing to negotiate with the democrats if they don't get their way.

these people that are -- they need to stick to their guns. if kevin mccarthy called the people that were in washington on january 6 terrorists. how is that going to help him get the support that he needs? he needs to come out and apologize to all those people who went out there, most of -- 99.9% of whom were not violent at all. he also is funding democrats in republican districts that he didn't like the candidate. so how is -- i don't know how he's going to be -- get a consensus from those six still remaining. i hope he -- they continue to stick to their guns and yeah. i'm looking at them and they're doing their job for once. this is the kind of discourse we need on every single vote. we don't need, you know, to be just nodding our heads every time. i'm not neither a democrat nor a republican. i haven't been. but i look at somebody like jim

trafigant, from ohio, and that's the last time i've seen republicans do their job. host: to elora in granberry, texas, good afternoon. caller: i've been watching what's going on. i was excited when we had the majority in the house. and i feel like the five that won't change their minds are holding everything up because we need to get -- take over the house, the majority. we need to get in and get to work. and i think that they will do that if they can get in. and i just wanted to express my thoughts and thank you. have a great evening. host: before you go, same question to you, as a republican, who is the leader of the republican party right now? caller: well, you know, it shows right now the majority, you

know, just the five that are staying out and not bending any. right now they are trying to control the whole party. host: do you think the holdouts are the leaders? caller: it seems like it. at the time. because they're trying to hold everybody up. they're not trying to come over and agree, it looks like they already had a lot to say, a lot of changes made. that he made with them. and yet they're not willing to change their minds. host: deerfield beach, florida. scott, independent. good afternoon. caller: it seems the congress is moving to a unicameral system running from a single state in an overthrow of the constitution

and -- they're doing sleepovers, preventing outside input, especially from former executives above the president on issues facing our nation and the world. host: ok. that's scott in florida. this is jeanie in penfield, new york. democrat. good morning. caller: hi. i was just going to say happy new year. and i want to say the definition of insanity is watching something happen over and over and over again expecting different results. and so far i am seeing insanity from the republicans. because it's exactly what they're doing. they keep throwing kevin mccarthy in and they don't want him. he's sold his soul to the devil and he still not getting enough votes.

host: some different results today. we saw the movement of 15 votes into the mccarthy column today, some significant movement today. so does that fit into your definition of insanity at this point? caller: yeah, because he sold his soul to the devil promising everybody stuff and -- but they said, still didn't stop. he still didn't win. so it's still insanity. and i don't know, it could be funny, if you ask me if enough -- and i would hope nancy pelosi would get people from the other side and try to get their votes and watch jeffries actually win. that would really be funny to watch. host: jeanie in new york. to the cornhusker state. rick in humble. republic. go ahead. caller: i was reading on the internet earlier that

representative from florida, matt gaetz, said he would resign if mccarthy got speaker of the house. i'm just curious to see if he's really going to stick to his guns and do that. host: according to some of the tweets we're seeing from congressional reporters, matt gaetz at least seeming to indicate that kevin mccarthy might be moving toward the votes. talking about the rules change, that the holdouts have forced on the conference. that's the latest from the congressional reporters on capitol hill. would you like to see him resign? caller: i really don't care. right now there's no leader of the republican party. i think mccarthy -- i'm not a religious person but i think mccarthy would sell his soul to become speaker of the house. host: rick in nebraska. this is richard in chesapeake, virginia.

republican. go ahead. caller: i think this is a great thing going on, thanks to c-span for covering it. from gavel-to-gavel. it's great. you guys are doing a great job. host: appreciate that, richard. caller: what i think is -- this is a good thing going on in the sense that there's a lot of horse trading going on. that's how you get things done in congress, you get voices. not like on the democratic side, we had the last four years. everybody gets in line and boom, boom, boom. you don't get to seal this. if everybody remembers back, and i'm a pretty old fellow, i remember back in hi civics class, going through the constitution and going through all the debates and all that. reading about the continental congress and seeing those specials on tv and this is what happens. this is -- democracy is not easy. it's great to see it's open to

where we'll get back to where we have separate appropriations bills. they're in their committee which is great. this is a great thing we get to participate to in that. haven't done that the last few years, because these big anonymous trillion dollar bills that you don't know what's in it until you read it. you know. you don't know what's in obamacare until you pass it. i think this is a great thing. host: got your point. just a few minutes left of your phone calls. did want to show you a couple of minutes after the house adjourned, kevin mccarthy coming to that stakeout position where cameras and reporters had gatted for the statuary hall just off the house floor. here's what he told reporters

then. mr. mccarthy: i think we made some good progress. we'll come back tonight and i think at that time we'll have the votes to finish this once and for all. it reminds me of what my father always told me, it's not how you start, it's how you finish. reporter: what was the breaking point in the negotiations? mr. mccarthy: i think getting together, finding the ability to how are we all going to work together. it's new for us, being in the majority but being in a tight majority. i think at the opened they have day we'll be more effective, more efficient, and definitely government will be more accountable. reporter: how worried -- reporter: how do you explain it taking this long. mr. mccarthy: because it took this long we have learned how to govern. now we'll be able to get the job done. thank you all very much. see you later. host: kevin mccarthy speaking to reports for the statuary hall just off the house chamber there

in the united states capitol. a few minutes left here to take your phone calls after we watch the 12th and 13th rounds of voting, it's going to a 14th round tonight. that expected to start at 10:00 p.m. eastern when the house reconvenes. john has been waiting in richland, washington. democrat. john. go ahead. your thoughts on what happened today on the house floor. caller: are you talking to don or john? host: are you in richland, washington? then i'm talking to you. caller: if you remember when jim jordan first nominated kevin mccarthy for the speakership earlier this week he hit the mail on the head. he hit the whole problem right up front. me and kevin mccarthy have been here for 16 years, ok. 16 years is too long to be in

politics in this country. ok. you can't get nothing done if you're there for 16 years. all these new folks coming. in i don't understand it. they're going to do -- kevin is going to do the same thing that happened to paul ryan. and newt gingrich. newt gingrich shut the country down. that's what this gentleman is going to do. host: you talk about them being here too long, one of the issues that the holdouts in the republican conference have pushed for is the idea of term limits. do you think there should be term limits on members of congress? and if so, how long is long enough to serve in congress? caller: yes, i do think there should be term limits. i think maybe two terms, max. host: four years total? caller: and then they should be gone. these folks, they -- i realize

it takes a while to get things going, up and gone, but if they can't -- if they're going to operate then like they do now, like they do this past week, they're in trouble. you know. it's going to be just like the same old, same old. host: don in washington. one more call. jess in the wolverine state in portage. good morning. caller: good afternoon. host: it's a morning show we usually do around here, used to morning calls. caller: i like c-span, you're not like the other talking heads that try to tell you what to think so -- anyway. here we go. i am really impressed with what's going on, the american people have been lulled into middle school, high school politics where go along to get along and the founding fathers

have got to be high fiving each other seeing this go on. because this is the way it's supposed to work. it's ugly, dirty, slow, but things are moving. and i just -- i'm happy. it took trump to come in like a bull in a china shop and shake things up but this is where we're at. and it's good. it's good. the american people have to realize, the short attention spans are not going to work anymore. we're in it for the long haul. the original founders wanted volunteer citizens to represent their constituents. the resolve -- the revolving k street door of, well, i could go

on and on and on but you get the idea. i think this is just fantastic. host: we'll end it there. that's jeff in michigan, our last caller for now. our coverage of the speakers election continues tonight when the house comes in, gaveling in at 10:00 p.m. eastern. you can watch on c-span, c-span.org, and ose the free c-span now video app. [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2023] [captioning performed by the national captioning institute, which is responsible for its caption content and accuracy. visit ncicap.org] >> c span is your unfiltered view of government, we're funded by these companies and more, including media come. >> at mediacom, we believe if you live here or here or in the middle of anywhere you should have access to high speed internet. >> mediacom supports c-span as a public service