television providers, giving you a front row seat to democracy. announcer: this morning on washington journal, washington univsi st. louis professor shanti parikh joineds r a discussion on new ap courses in african-american studies and the teachi oblack history in the classroom. then paul start heiser on the democratic national committee musing -- meetg. also the latest to the presidenalomination calendar. theniriam vogel and kay firth-butterfield, head of ai and machine learning for the world economic forum, discussed their podcast "in ai we trust". they also talk about developments in the world of artificial intelligence. washingtonournal starts now. host: good morning. it is saturday, february 4,

2023. the pentagon is tracking a high altitude surveillance balloon floating over the u.s.. there are currently no plans to shut it down. secretary blinken has called off a trip to china over the discovery. what is your reaction and how should the u.s. was on? give us a call based on party affiliation. republicans, (202) 748-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. independents, (202) 748-8002. you can send us a text at (202) 748-8003. be surety centric first name and city and state. or on social media, facebook.com/c-span and twitter and east of ram -- and instagram @cspanwj. i'm going to show you a few things and we will have a

reporter talk about the latest developments and then will show you your call. the associated press headline says balloon soars across the u.s., blinken scraps chinese trip. a hot altitude balloon sailed across the u.s. on friday, drawing severe accusations on china. despite china's firm denial, after of state antony blinken cancel a high state trip aimed at easing u.s.-china tensions. aside from government response, fuzzy videos. a social media and people with binoculars try to find the quote spy balloon in the sky as it headed southeastward over kansas and missouri at 60,000 feet. it was spotted earlier over montana which is home to one of america's three nuclear missile silo fields at an air force base. let this take a look at part of

the pentagon spokespersons -- brigadier general writer who talked to reporters yesterday about the possibility of shooting it down. [video clip] >> you said several times the u.s. is reviewing its options, i would like some clarity of is the option of shooting down the balloon as it goes over more popular areas off the table? if so, under what conditions would it do so? >> at this stage, what i can tell you is we are reviewing options. i will not go into more specifics than that. it's are any updates, i will let you know. we are monitoring and reviewing options. >> a senior defense official said yesterday that similar incidents happened under the previous administration yet some of those administration officials came forward and said they are not familiar. is there anyway you can give us more details over when it happened and whether it was over

less or u.s. -- over u.s. or u.s. territories? is that something you can tell us about when these things happened? >> what i can tell you right now is that information is classified. i am not able to provide it other than i can can firm that there have been other incidents when balloons came close to or crossed over u.s. territory. >> i want to reiterate something said earlier, given that it is not classified and the public can see it, i asked that we get more specifics of where it is, given there is no security clearance by your own estimation. >> again, we are not going to get into an hour-by-hour of where the balloon is. we will do our best to keep you and the public informed in general terms of where the balloon is in try to be helpful in that regard. host: that was the pentagon

press secretary yesterday. are taking your call this morning about how you think the u.s. should respond to the chinese spy balloon. threading us now is tara cox with the associated press. guest: thank you for having me. host: you were at the pentagon press briefing yesterday. as the pentagon 100% sure this is a spy balloon? guest: there are 100% sure. talk to officials and any assertions that this was just a weather balloon that actively veered off course was discounted completely. the balloon, where it was headed, and where it loitered over montana, which has 150 nuclear warheads over -- underground in silos created a love concern from them. one of our main questions in the briefing is where was the balloon heading next and what happens if it lingers?

the national weather service put out a pretty helpful chart last night showing if wind patterns hold and it does not loiter like it did over montana, it could go over the carolinas and into the atlantic as soon as midday today. this story could be wrapping up as far as the balloon's existence over the u.s. but the fact the balloon has shown it is maneuverable and can pointer, we do not know how long it will be over our skies. host: i was going to ask about the maneuverability. this was not a mistake because they could have clearly maneuvered it off u.s. airspace. guest: that is the pentagon's point that this was not a mistake. they clearly crossed into u.s. airspace. it is not approved of chinese can do that and leads to questions about why would they do that? a gigantic white balloon is not something that would stay secret for long. was it more of a statement to ensure that they can?

now the u.s. has something else they may need to defend against. while this seems to be a surveillance balloon with just sensor payload to detect what we have on the ground and detect omissions, the next one can have a weapon. that was a point made by several people yesterday that this creates a lot of uncertainty. host: my understanding is this has happened before but was not made public. guest: correct. there has been similar occurrences over the pacific but balloons in general have been used widely since world war i. they were used as surveillance balloons and to be able to drop leaflets and information, warfare campaigns. in world war ii, we actually had a balloon -- the japanese used hundreds of balloons and one cross into the u.s. and had ammunition on it which exploded in may 1940 five, killing six civilians. host: i am curious as to why the

chinese would use a balloon. they have spy satellites in space, assess the americans. what is it they can gain from a balloon that they cannot from their satellite? guest: the pentagon has been pressing they did not think the balloon was as much of a threat because it did not provide, as far as they were willing to say, any additional capabilities china could already get from their spy satellites. but experts i spoke to said the lower altitude at which this balloon is traveling, about 60,000 feet, and got as low as 53,000 feet, can enable it to detect different types of low-frequency omissions we might used to have on our network systems talking to each other. host: i just want to close with, what are you going to be watching? what do you think some reactions are going to be? they have said they will not

shoot it down right now. is it possible it can be captured? and some of the equipment useful for american intelligence agencies? guest: there are a lot of people out there that would like to capture it, especially after it departs u.s. airspace. we will be walking -- watching to see when it departs u.s. airspace but also wanting for the second balloon that the pentagon conversed last night is currently crossing south america and they believe might be heading to the u.s. as well. this may not be the end of the balloon story. host: thank you very much. pentagon associate for the associated press. we are taking your calls this morning until 8:00 eastern time about the chinese spy balloon incursion. and how the u.s. should respond. we are going to start with diane from connecticut, independent line. good morning. c-span.org -- caller: good

morning. i think if they just -- slow, it will not blow up. if you put a lot of bullet holes in it, it could explode. do not know what is in it. if you just put a small hole in it, it will bring it down. host: how do you do that? it is at 60,000. caller: they could cheat it with one bullet instead of blowing -- shoot it with one bullet instead of blowing it up. even a small hole in a balloon will bring it down. host: robert next in maryland. independent line. hello. caller: good morning. they had an opportunity to take this out before it ever got over

our airspace. everybody is talking about covid and worried about covid but this thing to be full of all kinds of biological weapons. they can have a nuclear warhead inside that could be dropped. but our military, joe biden, did nothing. they allow this over our country. it did not act at all. it goes to show you that joe biden is completely bought and paid for by china. watch where it goes next. it will go to georgia where the submarine bases are and will take pictures of these cases. as it takes pictures, it will get exact gps coordinates on these bases as it goes all across the country. joe biden has put the u.s. and the american people at risk. this should have been shot down over the pacific ocean before it ever got to alaska but this country has failed.

the biden leadership is to concerned with offending the chinese but they do not have problems offending us. but if you look at the track of where this thing has gone, all over our missile bases and is heading to georgia over our submarine base this. joe biden is bought and paid for by china. host: michelle, democrat, staten island, new york. hello michelle. caller: i feel the same way as a gentleman that was just speaking. we are letting china get away with so much. the first war, they came in the back door with a virus. they did not even have to issue us with a gun. that is of believable. now we have a balloon. i do not understand why we are not standing up to china. host: what you want to see? caller: exactly what the gentleman said. shoot that down.

that is in our space. what are we doing? can we do that to china? can we send a balloon over there? it would not get close to china. host: you want it shot down now? the pentagon is saying that can hurt people on the ground. caller: i understand that. didn't the gentleman say the pacific ocean? do it out there where it will not land on people and civilians . i understand that point of view. that is an other like how dare you hold us hostage with the balloon? i feel this shows weakness to the united states that we are not standing up. but then again, there are a lot of things going on. who knows why the biden administration is not reacting to this? host: let's hear from secretary of state antony blinken. he talked about his postponed trip to china.

[video clip] >> i spoke this morning with the social affairs officer that in light of china's actions, i am postponing my trouble this china. as you know, president biden and president xi jinping agreed during their meeting together to follow up on discussions. we have been discussing issues that matter to the american people and people around the world. we have been engaging for some time with our counterparts in beijing to prepare for these meetings. yesterday, the department of defense announced we are detecting and tracking a high-altitude surveillance balloon that remains over the continental united eight. continue to track and monitor the balloon closely. this is a surveillance balloon. once we detect in the balloon, the government acted immediately

to protect against the collection of sensitive information. we communicated with the pcr government directly. members of my team and other agencies and in congress, also close allies and partners, or talk to to inform them of the presence of the surveillance balloon in our airspace. we concluded the situation was not conducive for a visit at this time. in my call, i made it clear that the presence of this balloon is a clear violation of sovereignty and international law, is a irresponsible act and the pcr taking this action is not good. i'd heard the director -- i told the director the u.s. remains committed to diplomatic action with china and a plan to visit beijing when conditions allow. in the meantime, the u.s. will

continue to maintain open lines of community visual china including to address this ongoing incident. this is why we need direct communication in the first place and that is why it is nickel such lines remain open -- critical such lines remain open at all times to avoid conflict. one final but important note. the world expects the u.s. and china to manage our relationship responsibly. indeed, addressing many of today's challenges, which affect the lives of our people and people around the world need us to find a way to work together as well. the u.s. will continue to act in a way that reflects that responsibility. we look to our p.r.c. counterparts to do the same. host: that was secretary of state antony blinken talking about the chinese spy balloon over u.s. airspace. we are asking you how the u.s. should respond. i want to show a couple tweets from congress.

first is kevin mccarthy, speaker of the house. "china's brazen disregard for u.s. sovereignty is a destabilizing action that must be addressed and president biden cannot be silent. i am requesting a briefing". here is mark warner of virginia who said "there is no way the ccp would allow a balloon like this to fly over chinese heartland. china's aggressive behavior is a violation of international norms and shows a reckless disregard for the safety of u.s. citizens". -- a set "the chinese communist party spy balloon is a violation of international law. we need answers and accountability". we are taking your calls on how the u.s. should respond. robert in indiana, republican line. morning. caller: good morning. i would just like to know where is it going to end? if we give them an answer, they

are going a mile. the next time, they are going to more aggressive. if we do not put a stop to it right now somehow, then it could lead to -- china could do anything. they just want to get their foot in the door to see exactly how far they can push joe biden and the administration. host: what do you think as far as the reaction? caller: i think it is too late now. they knew about this two months ago. they should have done something about this then. if they are not going to do anything now, just to go ahead and let it go its course. host: they knew about what two months ago? caller: they knew that this

thing was on his way over here two months ago is my understanding about this. host: are you saying it takes two months for it to go from china to cross into u.s. airspace? that seems like a long time. caller: when they first found out about it, they should have done it when it was out in the ocean, that way -- host: you were saying that if you give them an inch, they will take a mile. what do you think the diplomatic response should be? caller: it is pretty much common knowledge that china owns us here in the united states. host: owns us in what way? caller: they do just about

anything they want to do here in the u.s. there are binding of our farmland, they are buying farmland near our military facilities. that should not ever be allowed. they should have never allowed china to come to the u.s. and buy land near militaries facilities. they just keep easing in until eventually they are just going to take over the united states. it is pretty obvious. host: tom, independent in new jersey. caller: good morning. it is barnegat, new jersey. this is a really crazy situation. it is all over the news channels , spreading fear and drama.

the thing should be shut down, recovered, and studied. if they wanted to enter our airspace, they could have shot it down over the pacific. but they let in -- it in. they could be collecting data. now they should just wait for it to cross the country so we can recover all the information that they may have entered in its database. i just do not like the fear and drama it is causing. i believe this is the biden administration just pushing us closer to war with china, which we really do not need. host: do you think there has been an overreaction? is that what you are saying? caller: no, i do not think there

has been an overreaction. i think this situation is really kind of minuscule. it should have been either recovered over alaska oh -- or over canada because these are very remote areas. i think this is a ploy from the media, spreading the fear and drama, to just put another notch in another fuse. china did this and china did that. taiwan, if we go into that war, that will be a bad situation for america. all of the parents at all the grandparents of america, call your representatives and tell them we do not want to go to war with china. host: got it. james, florida, democrat line.

caller: good morning. how are you doing? host: i'm doing ok. what do you think? caller: everybody says shooting down the balloon in the pacific. that is international water and cannot do that. once it went across alaska, congress said do not shoot it down because if it falls, the chances of hitting someone or some things could create a bigger problem. so they are letting it slide through here. the u.s. is probably using their jamming devices and all of that if it is so-called data recording. the military knows what they are doing. host: i am curious about

shooting it down over the pacific and international waters . what you think the chinese response would have been at that point? if we would have said, this is getting too close to the american mainland and we are shooting it down the it can? caller: the chinese play their games. they claimed it was a weather balloon. if it is really a weather balloon, they would probably have a device in the balloon that would have brought it down into the pacific, under their control. our military -- if it is recording our military areas and all this, i think our military

is pretty smart about what they are doing. the chinese are playing a stupid game. host: let's take a look at pentagon spokesperson brigadier ryder. he was talking about china's explanation. [video clip] >> we are aware of the p.r.c. statement but the fact is we know it is a surveillance balloon inside not be able to be more -- and i will not be able to be more specific than that. we know the balloon has violated international airspace loss ovi said this to the p.r.c.. in terms of specific locations, i will not go into pacific -- specifics other than it is going east. >> as people start to see the balloon, do you have any guidance? should they try not to interfere or photograph? >> the balloon is assessed to be

around 60,000 feet so well above the range of civilian air traffic. you are certainly aware that there are cameras and civilian owned commercial cameras that can spot this balloon in terms of guidance, this is something no red is closely -- norad is closely monitoring. at this time, it does not pose a physical threat to people on the ground. host: the pentagon press secretary talking about the chinese balloon. we are asking you about u.s. reaction to that. what do you think it should be? next, chris, arizona, republican line. hello chris. caller: good morning. i am a retired military officer and i look at the this as a

naval aviator. there is a bigger picture in the message this sends. our government looks infotech in the sense that they do not look like they are making a decision in an abcd type of situation. in the early 2000's, the chinese took an american intelligence gathering airplane and for all intents and purposes, forced it down so they could look at the technology. they kept the aircrew for 11 days. we have this balloon and it looks like an impotent decision by our president, chairman's and joint chiefs happened everything else. they can say a lot of things. look at the brigadier general giving his press conference. from my perspective as a formal military officer aviator, i just look at an empty suit. host: chris, i want to know how

to you shoot that down without completely destroying it? there is also the other issue of debris and harming people on the ground. is there a way to get it down gently? caller: what i am saying is there is a decision-making process that goes there. where was the decision-making process as this thing was coming towards the united states? was there something said to the effect of, if this comes within united states territory, it will be taken care of? then you go and select the location of where it could be taken down with minimum implications for entry and everything else. supposedly it was over alaska and in montana. i am sure that is something that should be asked of the pentagon and $.80, have we anything that

comes to practicing against an aerial ship like this and into our airspace? what have we done? either preplanned -- are there preplanned responses to this or are we winging this? host: i would assume that is classified but you were a military officer. are there war plans? do you know? caller: i have been retired since 1995. are there things that are wargames? the answer is yes. host: jackie in trenton, missouri, independent line. hello. caller: hello. how are you this morning? host: i am ok. caller: i have a different perspective on this. i do not think it should be shot down. the reason why is it did not take much for koger to spread all over the world. what if they have chemical or biological vials on that and they shoot it down and people are killed again?

wasn't there enough people lost with covid? cooler heads need to prevail here. host: you like the response of just kind of tracking it is waiting until it passes over airspace? caller: yes, definitely. it is too risky to do anything, not knowing what could be on there. like i said, it did not take much to get covid spread all around the world. if they shoot that down, what if there is something on their? than a large amount of people could die again. host: let's go to the line for democrats, tennessee, wanda. hello, good morning. caller: the morning. my thought is it seems like china is buying of a loss of the foreign land, that we would be

able to know how much of our land does belong to china. that is probably one of the reasons why we continue -- why they continue to build things in the ocean and do all kinds of things that suggest there should be a war somewhere. maybe they are trying to figure out how do they get over here and just buy of a loveland? -- up a lot of land? but if you do not want them to buy the land, do not sell to them. but if they already own the land , we have to think about things. if we can see china putting people in ditches during the first part of covid from the satellites, what is to say that china cannot see these cases before they sent these balloons. the balloon to me is some type of bait and switch. something is going on. i think that people who have a

whole lot of money you get together and help us in finding out where senses of lands and people. host: let's check in on twitter. one person says, "if trump was president, we would have taken those out two days ago. you know what a row president would do". this is a text from bobby in texas, "these i-frame should be destroyed since all government comments indicate this is a violation of our laws". and "the president could have and should have responded as this inter-u.s. airspace. clearly someone dropped the ball or there is more to the story we are not aware of". tim in brownstone, republican line. caller: the last call her hit

the nail pretty good on the head. we mentioned the trojan horse but china has bought and played -- and paid a big part of our government. it is about the power and money. china donates millions if not billions to our universities, they still our intellectual properties, they own hollywood. it is all about the money. they are buying in brazil. the election down there is similar to what happened to us in 2020. this balloon is literally -- if it is going to wake people up than good. but the balloon means nothing to me. china has already made their move and we have to weed out politicians. china donated $40 million to a

university a couple months after they opened up the biden shop. our politicians are being bought and paid for on our dollar in the chinese are playing a totally different game here. if we do not get out and do not get rid of these people that are running our country, 545 of them , and there are some good ones. the last caller was a democrat and almost has things right. but we better wake up. americans better wake up. we need to get to the voting booth and vote these people out of office. host: lawrence in clementon, new jersey. independent line. caller: the morning. how are you today? host: i am dead. caller: it seems pretty funny

that everybody is calling but if you google, you get the same reaction. you can find any place in the world from google. i'm trying to figure out why everybody is panicking over this balloon. host: why do you think china sent a surveillance balloon then? caller: i think the balloon it so probably is a distraction. i am former military also and i heard that officer or whoever he was talking about how the u.s. is not prepared. that is ridiculous. host: let's take a look at a reaction from montana democratic senator jon tester. this is from friday at a local tv nation. [video clip] >> china has been doing their level best to become a leader in the world.

this is not surprising. they are doing stuff all the time. most of it is up in space but this time it is a balloon. it is very disturbing and we need to treat it seriously. our military leaders looked at these options in the threats and made a decision. i will get briefed on this because i happen to be chairman of the defense committee that funds the military. i will get briefed on this early next week and exactly why they did what they did. in the end, it is very disturbing and one of the reasons that i carry rounds and do not allow china to buy farmland in the u.s.. it is why we need to make sure we are prepared militarily, on the ground, on the sea, in the air and in space, to deal with the threat of china because they are our most significant threat in the world right now. the balloon yesterday is a sign that we need to really handle these.

and we happen to you for many decades handle life dash cam of the mucky threat they are. -- for many decades, handle them at the threat they are. host: many questions about the suspected spy in the sky. it says there is a massive light orbs sweeping across u.s. airspace that triggered a diplomatic mile storm and is going up of social media. china says this is a airship used mainly for meteorological resource that was of course due to waves with only limited self steering capability. china says it is a spy balloon without a doubt. this caused secretary blinken to cancel a trip to china that was aimed at dialing down tensions that were already high between the countries. eddie, democrat, georgia. hello. in morning. caller: good morning.

people need to calm down. we have intelligence well enough to handle this matter, instead of people just spreading aries all -- theories all over. we are not going to let it get back to china. we need to go ahead and let them keep investigations going on this balloon. do not shoot it down. do not know what kind of -- we do not need another covid spread . our former president trump did not handle it is over a million and something people died. we do not need to shoot it down.

even knows what he is doing. that is why they did not shoot it down because we need to know what is going on. we have a lots of people in china now. we have been having people come in from china for millions of years. i think that we do need to stop just putting out all our business on socialedia with people and get along. host: don in florida. republican line. caller: i think everybody needs to chill out. i have not heard any smart responses all morning. why worry? why don't we just send somebody up to the balloon? this is a joke. and right graffiti on it. maybe some four letter words.

host: you think this is just an overreaction? caller: i think this is an overreaction and this is china's effort to generate discussion all over the world to see how great they are and how weak we are. it is just nonsense. chill out. it is just a bunch of stupid nonsense in the sky. host: romans in detroit, michigan, independent line. good morning. caller: grand rising to you. i remember hearing social scientists almost 20 years ago saying china could take over the u.s. at any moment because we owe china so much. we depend on china for every crumb of our daily bread. look at walmart. there are literally headquarters in china. host: if that is the case and what should the response be? caller: i think the principles

in the u.s. know exactly what is going on. they will not tell us. i think that china literally has adopted a -- adopted the u.s. as one of their states. that is a bold statement. they have set up someole stations in america. you have hbouthat, right? china says that they are not police stations and we are actually checking in on our citizens who have left and abandoned their indigenous culture. i think the u.s. government knows what is going on but will not tell us. i think it is speculative that china is closer to having the u.s. as one of their states. that's is a bold reality, isn't it? host: take a look. farther down on the same article

from the associated press that i started reading a little while ago, "u.s. officials said the biden administration was aware of it, even before it crossed into american airspace in alaska early this week. a number of officials spoke on anonymity to discuss the sensitive topic. the white house says president joe biden was first briefed on the balloon tuesday and blinken and deputy secretary wendy sherman spoke with china's senior washington officials on wednesday evening about the matter. in the first public u.s. statement, brigadier reiter said thursday evening that the balloon was not a military or physical threat, and acknowledged it was not carrying weapons. he said once the balloon was detected, the u.s. government acted immediately to protect against the collection of sensitive information". liam on the line for democrats, inglewood, new jersey.

caller: good morning. my response to this is that china, for years, has been building an army. and we are standing back. what we do is do not realize that most of the products are made in china in stores. we are financing china's army. instead of complaining to your congressman or senator, be conscious of how you shop. the biggest thing you have going ensure votes and the second biggest thing is how you spend your money. if you cannot find a product made in the u.s., complained to the company. when your politicians say we are going to make a deal with china, that is a sign to get rid of them. if we do write like i am saying, we can bring the industry to america and put those jobs into south america. america is america to me.

both sides, south and north. if you get jobs down in south america, we kill two birds with one stone. we get rid of the immigration problem and we get rid of china. if we had never got to china in the first place, and republicans always click republicans are so smart -- host: i think that sounds great except chinese products are always much cheaper. caller: that does not matter. the same companies said 50 china can do these products. any company who says they are american but 50% of their products are made in another country, than it is not an american company. the biggest thing is how you spend money. host: fred on the republican line worchester, massachusetts. caller: hello. i just wanted to let you know that we send china $300 billion a day in order to pay off our

debt because they own like $5 trillion of our debt. i am thinking, just send them a huge bill and tell them we are going to charge you $5 trillion for sending this balloon over us. then, it will hold our national debt at least. host: ok. george in whitehall, new york. independent line. hello george. caller: i am not so panicked about it. i am kind of curious though. i am observing it because balloons have limited steering power and i would like to figure out how they got the air brakes in their deposit. [laughter] that's is about it. host: all right. rochelle in california, democrat

line. hello. caller: good morning. first, i want to say all these people have different respective -- different perspectives and i am going to respect that. but my husband retired after 25 years in the marine corps and there are very intelligent people running this country. i am not necessarily talking about congress. but there are men and women out there fighting. my husband went to iraq twice, 11 months one time my daughter was first born, that he came back was fine. some people did not. we have to understand that when we say, i will -- i want it shot down, to be really want that? when bush said there was going to be a war, my husband had to stand up for our country. i respect him for that. another thing, let me try to answer the question, i think

there is a lot of other intelligent and i do not think joe biden should be on tv's telling everything. i would just say get him out of there, something is wrong with him. who does that? who gets on tv and tells the whole plan? there was a guy saying he was an officer. thank you for your service, but you cannot sit there and let that be in a public meeting. who does that? i have never been in the military but there is no way anybody would do that and tell our game plan. i think we have enough experience people to handle it. as far as shooting it down, i think we should escort it somewhere and get the information some kind of way. maybe even follow it back to their part of the town. thank you so much. host: charlie, republican in warren, massachusetts. caller: good morning. how are you today? host: i am good.

caller: i would like to suggest to viewers out there that unfortunately, joe biden is brain-dead and they are trying to read this country by committee. all of the big shots are trying to take charge, not by caveat but five trying to do think -- but by trying to do things right. they have a great big committee trying to decide what to do. host: what do you think the response should be? caller: -- seven installation in history. what is your question? host: how do you think this should be handled? caller: we should have shot it down before it even got to the u.s. host: but now what do you think

we should do militarily and diplomatically? caller: it can be taken down. i have been watching the television shows. there are ways to lasso it and to poke a hole in it and slowly bring it down. we have to get the intelligence. hopefully it is not providing any intelligence, so they say that it is not. but they have to be -- china has to be held responsible. but, of course, china does not want to destroy us. they just want to slowly infiltrate us, if it takes 1000 years. host: michael, independent line, in stamford, connecticut. caller: this is a great opportunity to break out those

space lasers and set it out of the sky. marjorie taylor greene should be behind this one. that would be the best thing i could see her doing. as for people who are brain-dead, joe biden, look at trump. host: what you think the solution is here? caller: blue space lasers. she it out of the sky. i think they should take it down and get whatever is inside but that would probably be the safest way because they can pick the place it will fall and have it drop into an unpopulated area. host: pennsylvania, line for, chris. caller: can you hear me? host: yes. caller: i agree with the gentleman who just set i think it should be taken down.

we should look into whatever technology. if it enters our airspace, and it has for the whole width of the u.s., we have a responsibility to look into exactly what happened. we can take it down in international waters where it made think but we should definitely explore. host: jason, independent line, tennessee. caller: it was great talking to you. i want to say that first of all. i watch every saturday morning that you are on and it is awesome. i have a really simple plan. this is a new age of warfare. we just walk you through this -- let's be just walk you through this. if the u.s. gets a hold of macy's and gets like 15-20 of their big balloons and sell them over china, let us make sure they inflate the hands so it

looks that we are waving at them, and it will strike the same fear into them like they did with us. my second solution is i amoing out today to get spray paint. i have a big lawn. i am going to write my chinese order of chicken and dumplings. host: secretary blinken was going over there because the tensions were actually getting high. are you ok with making it even higher? caller: our relationships are not that bad of china. we do too much business with china to have all of these incidences. you get what i am saying? we need a better economy to support them. if we have a bad economy, we do not buy product. i am not a trump supporter but he understood that. that is why you have to have balance.

democrats need additional balance. as our economy is weak, nobody makes money. this country is a retail country. we buy more than we make. if we have relations with china, yes there are discrepancies over borders, but a full out war and all of these things, no. we have been with china since world war ii. you have to remember that we help china fight the japanese then. there is a lot of history between the two countries too. host: i'm going to move on. shelley in massachusetts, republican. hello. caller: hello. i am calling about the balloon. i am really worried because how come we cannot blow it down?

because when they were in montana, they were hovering over our nuclear spot. doesn't that take precedent? just to blow it down? host: you mean they were flying over it to gather intelligence about that? caller: yes, in montana. now they are moving to ido know south carolina. they are going to be there a couple days. host: karl in new york, new york on the line free democrats. caller: i would like to say this to america. that balloon is nothing. we have satellites 150 miles above the earth and they can see through that, just like they can see.

what the balloon did was show china that to take americans to turn onto their own president. that is all that it is. and we went for it. every white american is crying blow it down. for what? host: you think this is a chinese trick to turn us against each other? caller: it is not a trick. donald trump said we need our agency but now china has just sent a balloon and all of the traitor republicans are in an uproar. saying blow it up and of donald trump was there but this happened on donald trump's watch and they did not say anything. what i am trying to say, i do not mean to sound angry but i am just upset listening to these tricks. host: i want to fit in a few more colors -- callers.

com, pennsylvania, good morning. caller: good morning. the u.s. government should not respond to china and this spy balloon. president biden personally should call china and tell them he is going to shoot it out the sky. that is all i have to say. thank you, have a good day. host: buzz in san diego, california. independent line. caller: good morning. i think that we spy on russia, china, and north korea constantly. if they send a balloon over, they can spy wherever they want and they will not get much. they can send a satellite if they will. if we start cheating then china will start shooting at something of hours. i think the whole thing host:

you think that if we shoot down the balloon, they will shoot down a american spy satellite in space? caller: it is possible if they got mad enough but wide do we want to start anything if they are not doing us any harm? i understand they are in international airspace where anybody can fly in or out. host: but they are in american airspace. caller: yes, but america has certain airspace that any foreigner can fly in. if somebody is flying over from japan or taiwan, they can fly and they have certain airways they can fly on.

if they are in the neighborhood, they are not really violating anything. there are not hurting us. everybody is getting a big uproar. host: ramsey, line free democrats, -- for democrats. caller: a couple quick points and then i will let it go. in 1967, i was in the u.s. air force, stationed in anchorage, alaska for 2.5 years. then, there were millions of square miles that we could have shot that thing down and that is what we should have done. i now live in the middle of missouri and i know kansas and missouri quite well. there is hundreds of thousands of square miles that we could

have shot that thing down. it needed to be shot down. we are a sovereign country and we should not be interacting with china in that manner. thank you for your time and have a good day. host: tony in goldsboro, north carolina. can you be kind of quick yet caller: absolutely. just one thing i would like to say. what's would china do if we had a building of this type over their country? host: what do you think they would do? caller: that is all i have to say. i know exactly what they would do. i am retired from the air force and i feel assured that they were not waste any time remove it from there airspace. host: that is going to be the last call for this segment. you will have more time later if you would like to continue to talk about this during open forum. but up next on washington journal is shanti parikh, the

chair of the department of african and african-american studies at washington university in st. louis. she will discuss the college board curriculum for the new ap african-american studies course and how black history is taught in the classroom. then later, our spotlight on a podcast series. miriam vogel and kay firth-butterfield talked was about the applications of emerging artificial intelligence technology. their show is called "in ai we trust". announcer: there are a lot of places to get political information but only at c-span no matter where you are on more where use and on the issues -- you stand on the issue, span is america's network. whether it happens here, here, or near, or anywhere - or-- or

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watch on these been now or online at -- c-span now or online at span.org --1 host: my guess is shanti parikh. welcome to the program. guest: thank you for having me. host: you can call if you have a question or our guest. students, the phone number is host: -- student, the phone number is (202) 748-8000.

caters, -- educators, the phone number is (202) 748-8001. parents, the phone number is (202) 748-8002. guest: the roast thing they do is gather -- first thing they do is rather experts in this field, get them together, do a lot of focus roop discussion. -- a lot of focus group discussion. i assist did without heart -- i

assist did with that par. unlike some of the sciences, the list of subjects and reading is x and sieve. -- is extensive. our curriculum was area brought area i am not on the committee. i got it all the follow when one -- fall of 21. i was part of a team of educators who went look at the first draft of the curriculum. it was everybody's. it wa -- it was everybody's wish list. al --it was wonderful. we thought about what was

necessary. (202) 748-8000 how do you make -- host: how do you make that decision? (202) 748-8001 the general -- guest: a lot of times they do, d more hiso oracle and less contemporary -- do more store all and less contemporary. we let do didn'ts die -- educators are given access to online portals. that is correct. that is where some of controversy is coming from.

many of us would like the more contemporary. that is how a lot of classes are set up. host: we have a clip of governor ron desantis up barda. this was before the release of the new wave the framework. he was asked waning why his state board rejected a proposal or the court. [video clip] >> this was a effort course on top of that or advance twice credit and the issue is we have five minds and standards in florida. the one edge patient not induct in. if it is edge it tatian we will -- this or when i heard it did not meet this dander -- it is way more than that. this worse on black history,

what is one of the less's about? we are theory. who would they and art of black has areas we are? that is someone itching and it and on their. when you look and see they have stuff about inter-analogy, abolished prison, that political that is the wrong side of the line florida dander that. when you try to use black history horn in we are. -- history to shoehorn in queer theory -- host: what do you think about that? guest: i wonder if he has

looked at the curriculum. i did not see anything on your theory in -- queer theory in it. i think what he is doing is take varies small -- taking very small bites and trying blow it up for political gain. wqe go -- we go into the

professoriate to discover new knowledge. by him trying to they this -- say this is indoctrination he is basically saying we need to job -- stop new knowledge production. our kids are x posed -- exposed a lot on to talk -- on tiktok. host: i want to show you something. they said this -- "the times are use the changes were made in rits to or dead this five at the collegerd has time damecords from december

they ignore that the core revi were complete weeks fo florida's decisions were shared. not one, not ever has required a list of secondary sources in their framework. secondary sources no matter how brilliant our not a part of the ap -- are not a part of the ap curriculum." guest: we have designated black history week in 1926 because of

the way black history, the lives of black people were not covered within the american curriculum. . we know we are living in a day where race is a highly charged issue. from the start, i think many of us knew, many of us who study african-american studies, knew this would be a curriculum that was rolled out that people were opposed to it would find something wrong with it. it is a topic because it is from a group of people who are marginalized trying to understand a perspective not talked about in school -- when we were in those meetings

though, i did not feel political pressure. i did not feel political pressure to have things omitted. we wanted way too much in their. we felt there was so much. people come into college and they do not know particular things. in the room we did not feel like there was political pressure. in this day and age it is hard to look at the high school level without seeing the meddling of politicians. the reality is that this is the first time the college board has taken on a topic they did not realize was so politically charged. most of what they do does not get the global scrutiny. chinese culture and language didn't get this level of

scrutiny! i'm not surprised there is this political backlash on both sides. host: i will just remind our viewers, that if you would like to call in and make a question or comment for our guest, you can do that. students can call us on (202) 748-8000. educators can call us on (202) 748-8001. parents and everyone else can call us on (202) 748-8002. i wanted to share an excerpt from axios one thing it mentions is the. black lives matter movement. that was taken out. what were your thoughts on that? guest: that is one of the more

controversial ones. a recent new yorker article -- it is a brilliant article. black studies is a field that emerged out of struggle. it emerged out of student protest. it emerged out of the desire fo r the lives of formerly enslaved people to be represented. the black lives matter movement is suddenly part of that struggle, and part of a very important struggle. i have confidence though that as this debate continues there will be ways we can find it back into the curriculum. what the college board is saying

is students can choose this as one of their research topic.s once you get to contemporary you can do a deep dive into that. it would be nice to have it back in their. ferguson was a very important site for the black lives matter movement. we have two types of schools in the st. louis region. i can imagine it will be one of those optional things probably included. we are at the heart of the black lives matter movement. host: one more question before i go to callers, and that is about mass incarceration. that was also taken out. guest: also another topic. the college board -- those who

are black studies scholars know that the topics we study -- america has a very difficult time grappling with how recent slavery was, the legacy of structural racism. we have the highest rate of incarceration of any country in the world, not just developed country. it traces its legacy tightly back to jim crow, back to slavery. it is a topic that within the next few years once we figure out a way to put it back into the curriculum, another topic that is important to cover. for now, it is one of those optional topics.

some of these are part of a large debate about how do you introduce these topics to high school students in such a short amount of time, and how do you do it in such a way that we are equipping a high school teacher with the tools to be able to talk about these topics that are so current, that are being politically debated? like gun control how does one introduce that into a classroom and teach teachers to respond to what students are saying? i am imagining that would be the next reiteration. what is the type of framework? host: let's start talking to where viewers now. first, indianapolis, indiana on their line for other -- our line

for others. go ahead, jeff. caller: i am an african-american man. i have fought in the served for -- and served this country. great countries do not run from their past. even germany, they faced it. they realized their mistakes. even south africa postapartheid. ron desantis -- i suggest a book he needs to read. that book is ray bradbury's " fahrenheit 451." book burning serves no one. these are the hallmarks of fascism. as the old saying goes, those who forget the past are doomed to repeat it. ron desantis is a disgrace and

the gop are always reaching out to people of color. this is not a good way to start out on that. that is how we grow as a society, whether it is the native americans -- host: let's get a response. guest: first, jeff, thank you for your service to the united states. i commend you. i do not think you could have said it better. every country has an ugly history. by s not telling young people about it does not mean -- us not telling young people about it, does not mean it does not exist. i. -- i agree with jeff. i think what desantis is doing is politics.

if he had not politicized, it it would not be a political issue. kids are hungry for this knowledge. history is uncomfortable. history is not perfect. society has made mistakes, united states -- mistakes, not just the united states. only in the united states is it considered that we are attacking the united states. we have to move on. the example of native americans, that atrocity, i agree with him. it is politics. we have to keep producing knowledge. host: let's talk to an educator in new jersey. eugene? caller: we all learn history.

by the high school level, we see the warts and all. i do not think that is the issue there. i think this is promulgating feelings. as a scientist i see a difference between a feeling and a series of facts. a theory is being promulgated. it is almost like a religious class, which is something they would allow public school students to go to after school for an hour a day. i one to make sure i am capable of teaching complete history. it is almost like singing the national anthem day after day.

it is so bad. i do not think this is the alternative to that bad history. sneaking in all the stuff about gay and so on which are categories are different from -- some sort of normalization process -- host: ok, let's get a response. guest: i would invite eugene to take a look at the curriculum. what i hear and what eugene is saying is that the messages doing what it is supposed to do. santos is trying to convince the american public that they are

being taught fictional ways of seeing the world. that is not what it it is. it is firsthand material and evidence such as a photograph or a song or a painting or a novel and it is using that source material to try and understand the time at which it emerged. the idea of theory has a very different understanding than a dozen the humanities. in the humanities a theory means way of understanding and a perspective as opposed to a hypothetical. i would challenge him to take a look at it. i am looking at the dry the -- at the gi bill.

that is not a theory. a lot of evidences written into the gi bill. these are not theories. these are ways kids are currently learning about the gi bill. the gi bill might have benefited certain people, but african-americans were purposefully excluded. it was written in that black people are those who live in a certain area. they were -- host: let's go to dayton, ohio next. lenora, you are on. caller: i am a straight, married grandmother, and i have lived through the watering down of american history.

i m a descendant of grandville woods, and i have never read anything about him once. the only thing they gave us was mary macleod the thune and more heroes mentioned briefly in our history books. i challenge everyone to take a deeper dive into american history. that was one point. .2 is i think there is -- point two is i think there is a a problem with homosexuality in black history. the proliferation of homosexuality in the prisons you cannot separate men from women for years and not expect something to happen there. i would challenge everybody to

open your minds because there is a connection between the proliferation of homosexuality in our community and to slavery. host: ok, lenora. guest: i think you are right. we only learn about certain heroes in black history. black history is not just black people. it is about a bunch of men and women on the ground who were advancing society, who were struggling, who were inventing. that is one of the purposes of the course. i think that is what this is supposed to do, not just for black students but for white students.

her second point about clear and gay --about gay identities, i think that is something in high school they are grappling with how to teach it. i have two young kids. kids are using the vocabulary. they do -- to them being gay, being gender non-binary is not a big deal. in our -- it is our generation having a hard time grappling with how to teach about it. the big architect of martha washington was openly gay. he is still in there. i think that is one of the

topics that as educators at a college level we deal with it but we have to figure out how to insert it into our high school curriculum. host: let's talk to michael in broward county, florida. he is an educator there. caller: we are in the activist county. they are continuing a massive disinformation program because it is over race. it is a matter of the eugenics bias. herbert spencer tried to use evolution as a means to justify slavery and we still have that same sensibility carried through to this very day. our school district has a thing

we are looking at. we're looking at challenging the ap and insist that they teach the original ap course. most people want the freedom to have their kids learn real history and that means the original ap needs to be taught and we will ask for them. the march for our lives students, they are talking about marching on state capitals and the possibility of a 10 minute daily student walkout. this needs to be dealt with. when you grab an infant, the weakest part of your tribe and break all the rules, you are the strongest. you grab the weakest, the children, the elderly. our own scientists are telling us we have committed genocide,

and we are still doing it. host: let's stay on topic. guest: michael, i commend you. it this -- it sounds to me like you are in a state where this has become highly politicized. when you mentioned herbert spencer, there has been a fascist censoring. students would be able to read herbert spencer's racist theory and they would not be encouraged or bammed - -- angela davis would be banned because she was in the communist party. in terms of who gets banned in a state like florida or missouri where african-americans -- you

read the original text. i appreciate the efforts that are going on down there. host: can you put this in historical perspective for us as far as this debate goes? has this kind of thing been debated before in history? guest: you mean in terms of african-american studies and how to teach it? host: yes. guest: yes. one thing -- you have the ron desantis using this as a political thing. the idea -- that is why carter g woods wanted to start the first black week -- black history week. he and others wanted certain knowledge about african-americans to be out there and at that time it was

threatening and it was seen as anti-american and anti-patriotic . it helps that rhetoric. the struggle to get perspectives of african-americans, native americans, their perspectives, not just their struggles. people like me were expecting it. getting knowledge out there has always been a struggle because america has not grappled with its past. we blow up the miss of the -- there is another thing going on with black scholars. there is an expansive amount of knowledge we are generating and we are trying to decide, "what

do we put in?" it is a debate going on within the field. how do you cover something? what topics need to go in there ? when do they need to go in there? it is a debate between people who want to silence this and people who do not. it is coming from debates from revisionist history of the south . i think of this sort of debate around race, what is emerging is very clearly not just about race. it is about race, gender, and sexuality. host: let's talk to antoinette in pennsylvania. caller: good morning. i am calling as a black american.

all of these nuances, it just perpetuates the problem of cause and effect that has happened to black americans through the persecution of slavery and if america was really sincere they would not have jumped from point a to point b. point a is rectifying. all of the native americans everyone got their reparations. i am living history. you can go to a person of my age and older and you will get the complete story not outside of our heroes, but you will get a history that needs to be rectified because there was

persecution. under the law, persecution has to be rectified. things will never change until the united states owns up to justice. then we can have more buildings that black folks can come to an talk about things. we used to have that. community centers, churches, leadership forums. host: antoinette and sh she dida mentionnti, -- and shanti, she mentioned reparations. that was another thing that got taken out. guest: native americans still

have not gotten their reparations. tulsa, the rape of enslaved weapon, the property that was stolen. reparations were taken out. that is another one that hopefully will go back in. doing a deep dive into shadow -- chatel. this course is about to be about the history, the past and giving critical thinking skills. hopefully every ap course is supposed to be preparing young people to help us solve some of our problems in the future. this is a very difficult topic. there is a generation no one high school who will have to grapple with it.

black lives matter and reparations were ones that were taken out that hopefully students will hope to do their final research projects on them. in the next two years we will be able to figure out how we get those back in their. host: let's talk to joanna next, germantown, maryland. caller: i am a 75-year-old white lady, straight. i am in a book club. a few years ago we read mr. coates book. white people need to learn as well as lack people. =- -- as well as black people. i cannot walk in your shoes, but i can walk beside you and i can

learn with you and from you. i do not like what is happening in florida. i think it does our children a disservice. we all need to learn from one another. i have to tell you that book stays with me even today. it is important that we learn all of this. it is the only way we will go forward. i want to say something about the sexuality thing too. i know who i am. i am a straight woman. i am a widow. i and very secure in my own sexuality. if they are secure in their own sexuality, why do they care what someone else's is? we are all human beings. it is important that we all learn together. host: ok, joanna. guest: joanna, beautiful example. bookclub, books, reading books

outside of your own cultural milieu is how we become civic, compassionate humans. banned books are what scares us. we are trying to limit people's exposure to topics that are difficult. her bookclub is what we need. we need people to be able to rethink from other perspectives, read about other people's experiences. by trying to cleanse u.s. history and distill it into one thing is dangerous. we will not be able to move forward.

we will not be able to realize the potential of our country, but it is also a violence on the people who we are denying that there experience should be shared with others. i think coates was in the original curriculum. they did a lot of cutting of people. the second part of what joanna said -- host: about the lgbtq. guest: i agree. kids are getting exposed to it. i would rather have it in the curriculum. i don't think we could find any junior high school or high school student who is not on tiktok who does not know already much more about sexuality and

adults are not willing to get into that conversation with them. i agree. it is not a threat. host: let's talk to ryan in -- allen in rhinelander, wisconsin. caller: >> black americans -- caller: black american history should be covered as well, the good, the bad, and the ugly. i and concerned about the role of academia in this process. first of all, half of americans are ruined by federal student loan debt. that has been true for many years. i have seen firsthand over the past 10 years the colleges, including most recently the h bcu's go to great lengths to maintain this bond of indenture

in place. i will give you one quick example. there was a bill last session that would return bankruptcy to student loans. what killed this bill was the hbcu's standing up and actively opposing this legislation. i saw something very similar 10 years ago. i would just like to get your thoughts. host: let's get shanti's thoughts. guest: i'm not sure i know much about what he is referring to. are you referring to the recent student loans forgiveness program? host: he has gone. guest: i don't know if i know enough about the topic he is asking about. i do know that hbcu's were worried about not getting payments back, but i don't know

enough about that topic, host: ron is calling us from tuscaloosam alabama and educator -- tuscaloosa, alabama, and educator. caller: i don't mean to be ugly but i want to make an observation. this lady on my right her complexion is lighter than yours. that started about the 17th century. your skin is darker than hers! you have less melanin in your skin. african-americans -- the roman empire went into egypt and stole the people of their resources. desantis is from the roman empire. he is italian. he is not white. my father was black.

his skin was black. you cannot be white with blood in your veins! guest: it is interesting what you are saying. race is a recent construction. at the university we are about to do in our black studies department, a course called the introduction to race. the whole concept of black and white, that is a recent construction. it comes out of a historic moment like the earlier caller said. they were justifying that whites were superior. they put them in hierarchies. at the bottom was the negroid.

that is a construction. the whole fact that we are using the word black is a social construction. it has real social implications. it might have been an invention, but there are people for whom there is still discrimination based on their skin color, including my family. host: one more call from derek in chicago, illinois. caller: good morning, c-span. i don't use this word -- you have had some great colors. -- great callers. i was sitting on the phone debating on whether i should hang out or not. when desantis first ran for governor, he ran against a black man who said, "i i'm not calling you a racist, but the racists

think you are racist." when donald trump came into office, he talked about walk. -- about woke. donald trump is implicated in that because he woke up all the bigotry in this country. guest: i think a lot of the callers signaled this. if you make the electors afraid and you pull out certain soundbites from things to make it sound like there is another side that if you do not come out and vote they will take what you have, i think that is what ron desantis is doing. look at the curriculum. it is not dismantling anything! there is racism, there is white supremacy in the world, and calling it is not going to

threaten anything. it will make things better. it will allow people to, allow african-americans to live more freely. in terms of the politicize asian, this is what that -- politicization, that is what this is. he is squelching knowledge production. i agree with the caller who said it looks like fascism. ir i -- it is trying to control. i have confidence that this curriculum is now opening up the public dialogue. it is exposing the threat that teaching about a well-rounded

history has for this country and for people like desantis and trump. at the end of the day we will move on and we will learn how to teach young people about it so we can move forward. host: i want to close with this tweet from mlb. "the holocaust has been preserved in no small part from survivors. shouldn't black americans have their own opportunity? record black oral histories before we lose their experience of being black in jim crow america." shanti parikh, i want to thank you so much. thank you for joining us today. guest: thank you and thank you to the callers. host: thank you for everyone who called in. if you did not get the chance, there is open forum.

later in the program we will discuss artificial intelligence. first, it is open forum so you can start calling and now -- in now. ♪ >> book tv, every sunday on c-span two featureing authors discussing their latest noicon books. at noon eastern live on in-depth lance morrow joins us to talk and take you calls on american culture, politics, and history. he is the author of several books, "the chief, " and "god

and mammon." he is interviewed by senior policy institute -- find a full schedule on your program guide our watch online anytime at book tv.org. ♪ >> the state of the union is strong because you, the american people, are strong. >> president biden delivers the annual state of the union address, outlining priorities to congress on tuesday, his first state of the union speech since emma kratz won back control of the house. -- democrats won back control of the house. sarah huckabee sanders will deliver the republican reply. watch online at c-span.org.

♪ >> c-span now is a free mobile app featuring your unfiltered view of what is going on in washington live and on-demand. watch livestreams, white house events, campaigns and more from the world of politics all at your fingertips. stay current with the latest episodes of washington journal and find scheduling information on c-span radio. c-span now is available on the apple store and google play. download it for free today. c-span now, your -- >> american history tv, exploring the people and events

that tell the american story. the association of black women historians celebrate the legacies of paula getting's, evelyn brooks higginbotham on lectures in history. peter talks about state of the union addresses. he details how george washington delivered his first address in person. he also explores how the state of the union speeches of all and have been used to bolster platforms. exploring the american story. find a full schedule on your program guide our watch online anytime at c-span.org. >> washington journal continues. host: welcome back to washington journal. it is open forum. i am interested to hear what your thoughts are on the news of the day. you can give us a a call. the numbers are republicans,

(202) 748-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. independents, (202) 748-8002. "the unemployment level falls to its lowest since 1959. the labor market is soaring. employers unleashed an unexpected burst of hiring in january. according to the labor department, the increase was the largest since july and it drew exclamations from economists who had been expecting another month of gradual cooling. so much for moderation!

we certainly did not see it in this report. underscoring the labor market's vibrancy was the unemployment rate, which fell to 3.4%, the lowest level since 1969." here is the washington post, also on the front page. " robust growth shocks economists with challenges on inflation." we are also talking earlier about that chinese spy balloon. here is the washington post. " balloon ties up lincoln visit. device in u.s. airspace no threat, pentagon says." interested to hear what your thoughts are on that or on any other topic related to politics and public policy. elroy is first in texas, line

for democrats. caller: good morning, young lady. let's put them on a six-year term, get rid of their pension, they would fix medicare overnight. let's do that! thank you so much. host: brenda in robbinsville, republican line. caller: hello? host: hello, brenda. caller: hey. i wanted to make a comment about the chinese spy balloon. i do not think they should shoot it down right now. there may be some kind of virus released. or anything. i would wait until it is out over the ocean. host: mike is next in napa,

california, independent line. caller: it is curious that this is coinciding, the chinese balloon is coinciding with the chinese new year. curious if they are going to drop their payload of fortune cookies. host: you don't think it is a big deal, mike? caller: pardon me? host: do not think the spy balloon is a big deal? caller: no. host: all right. joseph and compton, california, line for democrats. caller: good morning. host: good morning. caller: i would like to speak about the new black history we are experiencing. old black history -- we all know we have come up in an upside down world.

everyone knows black history being out of the will of god in dark times, the last 400 years. my proposal is simply we will turn the world right side up as originally intended. we will see south africa on tap. the land where nelson mandella brought people together. we need to see people as light not as color. look at the world with snowboarders. we all know black history when the romans came over and they did what they did, they took this land. compton should have a treaty like panama. i am claiming this land back, the holy land god blessed us with as an american.

host: i want to ring up that the dnc is meeting currently right now and i wanted to play you a clip of president biden from last night speaking at the dnc. [video clip] >> we are just getting started. people wouldn't believe me when i said we would get a lot done after the first year. i don't think some of you really believe that we will do as well as we did but we'd have a lot more to do. by the way, we paid for everything we did. [applause] >> unlike the republicans. $1.7 trillion in 2 years!

you know how we did it? we said, " maybe we should pay a little bit." it is not even close yet. let me ask you a simple question -- are you with me? [applause] >> 4 more years! host: that was president biden speaking at the dnc. we will talk to paul steinhauser. he is a reporter for fox news. guest: last week it was new hampshire. this week it is philadelphia. now here we are at the winter meeting. host: what is going on? who is there? guest: the president and the vice president where the big

speakers last night. one was a fundraising event and then they spoke to the larger crowd. as we just heard in that clip you played, president biden has not yet announced what we all expect him to announce but coming in the coming weeks, his 2024 reelection. they will be running on their accomplishments so far in the white house. the president has a number of times received a chance of 4 -- chants of 4 more years. maybe soon after next week's state of the union, you got it here in philadelphia last night. host: speaking of the state of the union, everyone should watch that on c-span. we will have live coverage of that. one of the things they will be

voting on it about potential changes to the calendar. guest: this is a very big deal. it will change the way -- for half a century now it has been the iowa caucus's. a week later the presidential primary. the last two years it has been nevada and south carolina. they are making no changes whatsoever. a lot of democrats have complained that iowa and new hampshire hold up the process. they are easy states to campaign in. you can be a wealthy candidate, or a candidate without a lot of money and you get a fair shake in those small states in those small state.

there has been a push from democrats that the party has become more diverse. after many cycles of possibly doing this, the president put out a proposal that upends the calendar. it would start with south carolina. on the democratic side, black americans play an outsized role. later it would been of ada -- be nevada and new hampshire on that same day. michigan at the end of february 2024 and then the rest of the country would vote. initial rules apply. the only opposing votes were iowa and new hampshire.

they are not going to be able to change their laws. there is going to be a democratic primary that goes rogue. host: what happens if that does happen? it's strange that would be in their constitution that they have to be firstguest: also chao allow early voting in new hampshire. new hampshire has a pumpkin governor and nominated

legislator. democrats to not have a shot of doing this. they have set their proposals are dead on arrival. democrats and republicans -- president vita will not come up you will win the campaign obviously. that can allow chaos. think about far left democrats running in new hampshire without fighting grabbing headlines. it is not a storyline them across one. he is also saying by doing this you hurry democrats in the general election and new hampshire is one of the crucial election battleground states. they are saying this is going to help -- hurt democrats when it comes to winning presidencies and other elective offices in 2024. host: in other council committee

meeting set to happen? guest: in new hampshire? host: here at the dnc? guest: this is the big vote today, the final vote of a three-day meeting. this is the one provision that is grabbing national attention. it is democrats versus democrats and republican's are enjoying every moment of this. they think this will help them down the road. even though the vote happens today this is far from over. it is one chapter and we have many more to come as they struggle to figure out the primary calendar. host: we cannot wait. thank you so much. it is nice to talk to you.

i reminded to our viewers that we are going to be starting the live coverage of the dnc meetings, that is coming up right after washington journal at 100 a.m. eastern. do not go away. you can al watch it on c-span now, our free mobile video of an old line at c-span.org. it is open forum and i am taking your calls about anything you would like to talk about. sophia is next in new york new york. caller: good morning. how did i get lucky? i was pall would be listening for the question i have. thank you for taking my call. i changed my conservative republican. i talked to the person who

answered the phone to independent for must ago. the line was too busy and i waited my 30 days plus. host: what is you want to say? caller: you have daughter's name, she's an architect. she lives in alexandria, virginia. my comment, i cannot believe they're going to put sanders on 10 say to their public inside -- tuesday to the republican side. she made the comment was she was working at the white house. intelligent majority. you know she said, it is in the record. she said, we should try that way

. she did except the trump lie. i was not shocked. for her to come, i cannot believe they're burning it down. i am praying. we are going to be ok. they are wrong. host: edward in collinsville, illinois. caller: i want to talk to congress. the ones that did not get everything they wanted but they voted for bipartisan stuff. i want to say thank you. that is it. host: a reminder we will have

coverage of the state of the union next tuesday on the seventh. weav our live coverage starting at 8:00 p.m eastern. be sure to tune in on c-span and c-span.org and the free app c-span now. liz is next, georgia on the democrats line. caller: good morning. i tried to call in early because i really enjoy the presentation and i have a couple, is about it. i do not think we should allow ron desantis to hijack the subject by interjecting facts. he said black history has no added value. i want to tell black people do not go to florida. . no conventions. no conferences. no disney world. i want to applaud the white collar for maryland who talked

about not being able to walk in the shoes but a walk beside us and she mentioned a book i missed the name of but she felt so alighted after reading the book. our history is different. i just buried my 100-year-old on who was an educator. a one room schoolhouse with no inside plumbing, no inside water, with one heater and the heater could not heat the classroom because there were so many holes in the wall. this is our history. this was back in the 1940's and it did not change until 1954. these are things people do not know and they question what we want to talk about our history but we think these are things people should know, just like the trail of tears.

we do have an ugly past. we need to accept that and acknowledge it. host: gina is in mississippi, republican line. hey. caller: hi. thank you for taking my call. i want to say no regarding the lady about critical race theory. i want to point out as america worries about the past and history and the racism, all the other countries in the world, their children are succeeding and advancing in mathematics and sciences and things that really matter. our children in america are further -- falling further behind. host: you think that is related? can we not learn about our history and succeed in math and size? the germans do it. caller: not really.

that is that is not what is happening. look at the stats about far behind our children are from other children in the world and you will see why we cannot spend our time in school learning about gays, black history, or anything. how about just the facts of history. not all of the facts are pretty for the blacks either. especially when you go back to the fact that there people in africa sold them and started this nightmare. they were involved in it. let's get over the racism crap and move forward. host: michael in tennessee, independent line. hi. caller: good morning. i want to voice my opinion on a few things and i agree with the young lady that said get away from the race and things --

racism things. what to talk about pension, social security -- i want to talk about pension and social security. what is going to happen when they do away with this? crime rate is going to go sky high. people work all their life for this money. the need to leave it at the table where it belongs. let people have their social security. they spend these billions of dollars to other countries and billions to military equipment to other countries. help home births. -- help home first. host: mariam in texas. caller: history repeats itself. democrats are coming in and fixing all of the mess

republicans created. i am a teacher and this week we were covering the gettysburg address. i learned of the kids as we studied the speech abraham lincoln wanted to preserve the union, but he implicated the founders in the constitution and he says everybody has equal rights. it turned out at that time not everybody had equal rights. it turned from preserving the union into freeing the slaves. in that class i have a couple of kids who are african-american and we are all hispanic and those two african-american students probably interested in their history and will we teach and cover the subject i see their eyes brightened up please

read discussing something that relates to them -- because we are discussing something that relates to them. it is nothing wrong with covering the history as long as it is balanced and reasonable and objective and relates the facts. host: right. water in florida, republican line. caller: good morning. my periods were refugees -- my parents were refugees. as i was growing up i watch my peers gets cremated against, blacklisted -- my parents get terminated against, blacklisted, it happens to everyone who ever tries to come to america like this. it is regular history and i want to say thank you to my comments. host: joe and skin of carolina,

independent line. caller: hello. it is part of humanity to want to tell your story even before we had a written language and it is messed up people think that you should not be able to tell your story just because they think it will hurt them some kind of way. if you give your money to the politicians and give your money to anybody you want to, that is not buying them. it just means you gave them some money. all the stuff with citizens united, it is like vladimir putin trying to pay ukrainians to turn over to the russians. you give people money that is not mean they have to do what you say. that is all i got to say. host: in douglas, georgia on the line for democrats, rudy. host: yes.

i'm a graduate of hbcu, through and cook him diversity in florida -- bethune cookman university. there is a lot there interested to learn. i think that is what we have lost a sense of humanity. republicans use the campaign on the moral majority. we have lost our sense of humanity and i think that is where we need to try to get back in focus. host: let's take a look at foxnews.com. it says democrats and tripathi

democrats and tripathi feud -- it tripathi feud. the headline says democrat versus democrat as the party pushes forward with a new presidential nomination calendar proposer president biden -- proposed by president biden. andy in tennessee. good morning. andy is gone. gary in indiana on the independent line. caller: good morning. just a crew -- quick few things. a lot of this stuff biden was playing out there doing the speech, that can serve as a -- somebody put in their best feel-good rhetoric out there. maybe there's more legitimacy to that stuff all i know is this war in ukraine would not be going on if trump was so the

president because trump within a hard line stand against vladimir putin and he knew it. he knew better than to test trump. we would not have these recent high gas prices in the food prices are still out of control. issa called the democrats line all of the time. -- i used to call the democrats line all the time but i do not anymore. i'm done with all of the confusion. one last thing, i succumb down hard on the people who did not vote but the way things are going they're not going to -- it is obvious to them they're not going to get nothing out of it.

during a piece of paper it into a box, what good has that done? host: that's all the time we ha for open forum. up next is our spotlight on podcast segment. we talked to miriam vogel and kay firth-butterfield talk about the implications of emerging artificial technology there podcast is called "in ai we trust?" ♪ >> in two years since january 6 2021 and close to 1000 people have been charged with federal crimes relating to the attack on the u.s. capitol. the legal process used by the federal justice system to build these cases is, located and out of sight to the american people. roger an attorney and journalists has been live tweeting some of the high-profile trials of the oath keepers and prop boys over the past several weeks.

we ask him to his claim to us in detail -- explained to us in detail how it works. >> on this episode of bookot plus. it is available on c-span now at or every you get your podcast. >> american history tv exploring the people and events that tell the american story. the association of black women historians celebrate historians evelyn brooks and her white on lectures in history professor peter talks about the history and state of the union addresses and how george washington delivered his first address in person and subsequent parents written statements until we do ricin -- woodrow wilson in 1913.

export of the american story. watch american history tv every weekend and find a full schedule on your program guide or watch online anytime at cspan.org/history. >> live sunday on end of author and journalist lance morrow will be our guest talk and take your calls on american culture, politics, and history. he is author of many books including the soon-to-be published the noisef typewriters about his career in journalism and te on the profession. join in the conversation with your phone calls, texts, and tweets. live this sundayt on eastern on book tv on c-span 2. >> the say of the year you the

american -- state of the union is strong because you american people a strong. >> president biden outlines his priorities on tuesday. following the speech arkansas governor sarah huckabee sanders will get the republican response. watch live coverage beginning tuesday at 8:00 p.m. eastern on c-span, c-span now, or online at c-span.org. host: welcome back to washington journal. it is our weekly spotlight on podcast segment. i'm joined by miriam vogel. and kay firth-butterfield, what economic forum ahead of ai machine learning. they are both cohost of the

podcast "in ai we trust?". good morning and welcome to the good morning and welcome to the program. host: merriam about the podcast, what is it about and how to structured? guest: it is a show that is a passion project. we are really excited about the future of responsible ai and we want to share the conversation and our enthusiasm with others and want people to understand what it is and why it is something they should care about. we have a conversation with different people who we think our leading voices in ai who we think have a step towards making sure our artificial intelligence economy and future is more equitable and more effective, and work more inclusively with broader cross-section of our society and we do that with bringing on leaders in

government and academia and industry who share our understanding about why this is a pivotal moment and breakdown perspective and journeys. host: our mind our viewers they can give us a call if they would like to make a comment or question for our guests. the lines party affiliation. democrats, 202-748-8000. republicans, 202-748-8001. independents, 202-748-8002. host: before we talk about that idea of response will ai, talk about what ai is and what it does. guest: ai is not the terminator. we are a long way from what we call artificial general intelligence when the computer can think as we do. it can across different ideas

and concepts. at the moment what we have a sophisticated machinery learning and we talk about some of the new things like chat gp we have unstructured learning which is the computer is able to understand matters of data. go into the internet, pull out data, and what it is doing is predicting word by word based upon the training it has done across the internet, what the right word is that comes next. what we got is a smart prediction machine, but not intelligent machine. chat gpt for example can do a number of things but it cannot do a whole lot of things and at the moment we have to do with

artificial intelligence is train it to do particular task. then it is much smarter than we are doing that task. host: to me about the particular task. where is ai being used now? guest: let's look at radiology. ai is good at image matching. therefore it is very good at looking at x-rays and finding problems on x-rays. it is better than we are. that is a good use. if we're talking about image recognition and look at the other side we have facial recognition technology being used by law enforcement, for example. there's a lot of consideration

around response will use of artificial intelligence in that sector. because when it does get it wrong, it gets it wrong in the wrong people get arrested. we also know is the number of images for one category of people more than the number of images. it simply gets it wrong because it is not -- it is bringing in biases to the actual decision-making. host: chat gpt, can you give us an idea of what it does in the big deal around it? guest: it is a prediction machine. it predicts what you want to be saying. it is an amazing job synthesizing data. it has been trained on more data

than any other machine we know of. it can predict what you are looking for to and say next. it is a masterful job of that. it is artificial. it is not a thoughtful answer. it is an answer that is based on the coding to understand the models historic trends. the stork trends in the data to help it come up with -- historic trends in the data to help it come up with useful institute -- answers. the challenges we are talking about responsible, you're looking at what has been said in the past. you're also looking at what data, will conversation our informing chat gpt or any other ai program. ai is being used in important

and impactful ways in radiology and it is exciting that it can identify cancers even better than humans in some situations, but for whom is added to find cancers more effectively and for whom is it failing? it turns out people with skin colored that is darker, it is not as effective. it is important anyone relying on ai, in this life or death situation, that they know they could get a false negative of the patient is a patient of color. host: ai is only as good as the data used to train it. i want to show you a clip from the house floor from last month. massachusetts representative jake read a chat gpt generated speech that would create u.s.

israel artificial intelligence center. it is believed to be the first time this because been read on the floor. [video clip] >> are sent here today because i wanted to reintroduce united states israel artificial center act. a mutually beneficial partnership between the not a state and israel and artificial intelligence research. as a critical step forward. we must collaborate with international partners to ensure the united states maintain a leadership role in ai research and development in response explores possibilities evolving technologies provided. 90 states -- the act will allow us to tap into the expertise of both countries and develop an export cutting edge ai advancements. host: what you think about that? chat gpt creating speeches,

problems, all caught -- poems all kinds of different content including student papers? guest: that was great. what we do know is that chat gpt, creates persuasive things that are not appropriate. we know sometimes that can be racist or unbiased in other ways. we also know that it matters what prompt you put into chat gpt or any of the other systems. we also know that is a potentially a problem and could find students do not write their own papers anymore and it is

hard to know whether the chat gpt has created it or the student has created it. host: it is interesting that the company that created chat gpt, opened ai, has released a detection tool but they are saying again, it is not 100%. it could tell you the student cheated and in fact they did not. guest: absolutely but there are more issues on -- and whether students are using it to write their papers because the machine is still exacting -- working in the exact same way as the other machines are out there we have been worrying about in terms of bias and accountability and expandability.

we do not know how the machine works because it works through will be called the black box -- what we call the black box. it is hard to understand with facial recognition machine, why it is making particular decisions or any other tool using this particular type of learning. it is exactly the same with chat gpt. there are numerous concerns we have around responsible use. beyond that, if your data is not reflected in the internet. my beat you do not have as much data about your community

because you do not community because you do not have -- you might be a country somewhere else in the world that is not have access to the internet, then i information is not -- that information is not on the web and this machine and similar ones like it, is not going to be reflecting your culture at all. what the worry is, this will increase the divide between the global north and global south because these tools will not be searching other people's culture at all. host: there's a headline from geek wire saying microsoft looks to tighten ties with open ai through potential $10 billion investment in new integration. what is that level of investment telling you and what impact did it have? guest: it is tell you ai is our future and we are in the future. people are thinking about what

our world will look like when ai is imbues in our daily life 10 years from now. and it is a reflection of where we are today. it is important because let's make sure -- was to make sure more of us are seen in our systems. because ai at its core is a reflection of us in our society. because it is trained on data that is graded by conversations and functions of our society and because it is trained by humans, it will have our biases embedded in it. we say bias is embedded in human touch points. as we see companies investing more and more an understanding ai is our future, it is important for us to understand how we need to play a role in that. host: trent in monroe,

louisiana, independent line. host: hi. i was going to have champagne with my coffee about talking with the word of that -- economic forum. i've a lot to learn here. i will be turning in to "in ai we trust?" i play the last four years i been listening to four hours of c-span netflix a graduate of school in government and spirituality. bennett has made a big deal about how chinese and is him and ai -- trans-humanism is a big

deal and ai. metaphysical side of it, there's a lot to say. this is a big issue for millions of people around the world. where the spiritual and metaphysical applications of ai ? guest: the title of the podcast is an eight we try -- "in ai we trust?" with a question mark. we believe it has to be at every step of the process. if we are talking about

something that may happen in the future and it is not possible at the moment, trans-humanism, we would still be saying we need to think about this responsibly. we need to think about this as a response -- was possible way and think about how i see is self -- biases itself thinks about ai. it is what we do the podcast because it is important everybody with you are a user or a consumer of things ai produces, think carefully about your reaction to artificial intelligence and how you can use it for your benefit and not to propagate things we should not be having in our society whether that is from companies, governments, or as individual. host: let's talk to danny in

maryland on the republican line. caller: thank you for c-span. ai is already with us. nfl uses ai. the coaches use it to make certain calls. i guess a coach a weakness because the other coach can do it to -- it gives the coach a weakness because the other coach can use it too. i wonder if ai is going to pick the super bowl winner coming up. i want to use ai. i think it is fun. eskew maryland, sports betting is legal now. a lot of people that emotionally but i think ai is a good way to bet too. how is ai helping us solve cancer and diseases? thank you for your time and your podcast. host: what do you think? guest: i'm so glass the colored

race that point. there's no end to the uses of how ai is being used and especially more uses, six months from now, five years from now. it's interesting to think about the fun uses an important uses. if you got the your day, you probably use gps or waves or another app to find the most effective path to get where you want to go. if you drive to your job, there may be ai that was used in hiring or hr team. as helping identify efficiencies, and ways to do your job better. if you are a lawyer you can use artificial intelligence to help you review contracts, do your due diligence. i have memories of paper cuts on my hand from going through thousands of pages of documents.

an ai program can do that same review in seconds now. ways big and small, whether it is predictive betting functionality or cancer cure and it is why i'm glad the caller made that point demonstrated the specter of that spectrum of future uses in ways for using it today. his instinct to think how ai can help with telemedicine. we can use technology to help transport the conversation across geographical barriers, across the world, and help with the predictive modeling to help understand what could a situation be, what could the patient be suffering from. i navigate -- i know we get back to the potential risk because we

are laser focused on a while ai is a huge investment and being used with great enthusiasm by so many people and companies, it's important to think who is not being seen and for whom could info. -- and for whom could it fail. host: a tweet ask when ai speed up processes what you anticipate miss place workers will shift towards? the impact of the labor market. guest: this is a huge question. the work we have been doing shows there be more jobs created by ai coming out into the world that will be loss. there is what we are losing jobs and their not be replaced as fast as we would want and that

is something we have to think about. let me give you some examples. we have been worried about truckers losing their jobs to autonomous trucks. we have seen a slowdown in development for autonomic vehicles. we always thought it would be manual labor. we have seen robot chicken over in manufacturing and things -- robots taking over in manufacturing and things. we see a risk of crate of work we have not foreseen before. with chat gpt and others like it, you are seeing potential for white-collar workers also to be displaced, but all the signs are

this will create new jobs than we lose. that is great news. host: joel in indiana, independent line. hello. caller: good morning c-span. i am to what you are promoting. i would like to write a story never trust a robot. i think that ai is a dangerous technology. the day we have the time this vehicle in trucks or cars or anywhere is the day i will retreat to the desert. i am sorry. revenue breed of fuming -- we have a new breed of human beings being called techno man. watch out for techno man. host: let's get a response.

pretty concerned, what do you think? guest: it is fair to be concerned. we just talked about jobs and the huge number of people that will be displaced. it is fair and appropriate us to think about the risk that will come for not intentional at this moment. with any other innovation, we set up regulation to keep it safe and make sure no place in our food. make sure you have to wear a seatbelt and there is safety laws when you are driving. another innovation that was game changing that just ported us faster and opened up -- transported us and opened up our world. with ai, it is important we think about how could this go wrong but we are fortunate we are at this moment where we can put the guardrails in place and

you will hear on our podcast several lawmakers who have this top of mind whether it is secretary commerce donna gray who was talking about the loss of our economy because we are thoughtful enough by being diverse about illuminated racism. estimate to be in a chilean dollar opportunity -- $8 trillion opportunity if you're more mindful is more inclusive. eoc commissioner points out we are at a critical point where we could work with the community, developers, regulators to establish guardrails and get it right. donna bier on the jobs issue and thinking about students and are we preparing them. perhaps we are not specially preparing for an ai feature at the moment but that is white the more reason to be looking at that risk and hazard we get it

right right now. what if we trade a whole generation of people to use data meaningfully, it will be poured for the quality of life of all mankind cash forward for the quality of life for all mankind. it is exciting where in a moment to change the directory -- trajectory and ensure we are better for ai use. host: last year the white house released a blueprint for an ai bill of rights. what is in it? what was not in it? guest: they do talk about where ai can go wrong. they talk about -- the ai discussion the next platform and civil rights movement because years of progress can be undone in lines of code. and what is scary is the perpetrator of the violation,

when not necessarily even know they are discriminating and harming somebody. the blueprint the white house does outlining to be thoughtful and intentional. there was an important development in the space a week ago when the commerce department national institute of standards and technology released an ai framework. it is a thoughtful job of a counterpoint to support the ai bill of rights and give them perspective on what someone should do they want to establish a framework. the company is using ai, i argued most companies are ai companies whether or not they realize it because they are using it in pivotal ways. so much a cybersecurity were most companies did not realize 15 years ago they need to have cybersecurity plan and those that did not felt the pain of

that and it is hard temperament cybersecurity plan after you have had an incident. we are at a moment where a company can be intentional. company's we work with in our day jobs while we are not having fun on the podcasts are being thoughtful of his possible ai governance -- what responsible ai governance looks like. outlining best practices. host: let's talk to tammy in michigan. caller: hi. i'm calling because the first thing that struck me was the title of the podcasts. argue the gentleman who called earlier -- i agree with the gentleman who called earlier. the title "in ai we trust?" i do

not agree with thy name because it is a spinoff of god we trust. anyhow, i think it is interesting. i know my children that are 25 years old and a 32 years old. my son is a computer engineer. these are topics that are going to inform their lives. home work, it was the stay-at-home and work from home. i know these are topics that are going to help them. another issue i thought was interesting was the medical, the telehealth medicine could be used. do not know if you will be charged with the insurance in the same way or if it would not

be. there are interesting concepts and i have an open mind of what it can do. host: again is the ai we trust, another? another issue is copyright. if ai crates of the for you and it is a image or a screenplay, can you cooperate that? who gets the copyright? guest: it depends on where you are in the world. in south africa the answer will be yes. in other countries, no. i'm an english lawyer in mariam is a american lawyer. in england, no. the question is the answer is no. the bigger question is as these devices are on the internet they

are pulling from copyrighted material. so if you are an artist, and your material is used, you might not reckon eyes your material because it has been reused -- recognize your material because it has been reused but your copyright will be violated and what we are seeing is the getty images has now taken out a lawsuit in u.k. around that and are similar lawsuits popping up in united states. the ip issue is huge and recently being debated in the house of laws in england because it is the ballots between innovation -- balance between innovation and other peoples's rights to their own data and copyright information. host: charlie in new york,

independent line. good morning. caller: what i am concerned about is the democratic use of this. i think we need to get the idea about what we are talking about. is ai here to serve human beings or some people to serve ai? you were speaking on the ai bill of rights, what it pertains to ai, but in of the show, but you got to it at the end of the show and i think this is important. letter sister not to hurt people -- we want to use this to help people not to hurt people. guest: it is important to think about what is underway as to government across the world to ensure we have this guardrail. this also equally important to think about what is already on

the books we can look to to help us understand the rights as possibilities with citizens when it comes to ownership a ship and into actual property. the squashes are being decided -- some of those questions are being decided but some are rooted in the laws of the books. we saw a joint statement by the equal opportunity commission and department of justice last june when they said there on the lookout for how ai is being used in hr systems and hiring within their purview and how it affects civil rights. the laws including the americans disability act. if you use artificial intelligence that is included budget recognition or voice relation, is it inclusive? can it hear the people that are using it? can it see the people that are relying it -- on the system?

it's important to think about what is underway, what is currently in discussion for ai got roasted in place, but also hopeful to know there are many laws on the book that applicable that has a clarify that they are huggable or that it is a ai determination or supported termination because it is human that created this program. we are both ai related by law. the challenging part on the property rights is that ai does not have borders and boundaries bar laws do -- but our laws do. as you create new laws thinking about where there is conflict because we need to make sure there is consistency in how ai program will be regulated and

how someone will be liable for their use of ai in different ways. host: charles is next in maryland, democrats line. caller: as a person of colors cape am concerned about the inherent biases reflected in ai. a lady in georgia was arrested by louisiana state police through ai facial recognition. she had never been to louisiana. who put in the inherent biases in the ai system? is that through point of view, the white technician, how do we do with that? host: how does bias get introduced into ai? guest: two ways. the people who are doing the

coating. they may not look or sound like you are like everybody. they're not many very old, white women doing coding like me. secondly in the data that is used, there's a lot of bias in data because we humans have been biased and all the data they used as historic. what you have to do is alter the terms of the training of the algorithm so that you do not -- so that you litigate the biases because otherwise you get all of the problems the caller is talking about. that is one of the pieces of responsible ai we are so keen to get right. we talk at the world economic

forum about thinking about why are we creating it and does it serve human people on the planet. host: shawna in colorado on their in line. caller: the road economic forum, does that serve everybody in the world? no just after global releases power. john kerry said we are all superhumans and we are going to save the race and now we are in an economic situation in america because of the world economic forum in ai is going to destroy 80 million jobs in middle-class beware anything the road economic forum has to say is a disaster for america. host: could you give us information about how the world economic forum interacts with

ai? guest: i was appointed to think about all of the problems we see with ai. try to help the world navigate a future with ai that enables all as a result of an ai economy. and for us all to succeed. people all around the world, which is why i come back to a point i made earlier, we need to take global south with us in this journey for ai and make sure it's proper us as a result of our ai journey and people are not harmed by it. that is the work i do day in and day out and it that is the work

i impassioned about doing. host: let's talk to ray calling us from indiana. hi. caller: good afternoon or good morning. and ai would not be perfect no matter what because humans are not perfect. we created the ai. an ai would never have emotions or feelings that will come into answers for anything. police arrest to deciding how much money you get. when we create something that is host -- supposed to be in place for us we are just replacing each human being. thank you. host: would you to think that one? guest: i think it's really

important we are mindful that ai is meant to support us. it is helpful to align ourselves that artificial intelligence was named appropriately. it is not intended to replace humans but support humans. we bring the rail to the intelligence. the good news is humans will not go into business here. we have a critical role to play in development of the ai system and deployment. the more we can be aware of the potential hazards and pitfalls the better off we are. if we are mindful of the fact that what his limitations are, i think that it is a great job of reducing the spam in my box. not having email messages that are junked or otherwise not what i want to be reading.

however artificial intelligence will not understand why i want to remove it. it would do the function and the test we give it effectively and in my grow in his capacity to be mindful and thoughtful a better understanding by understanding my pass used to be more predictive in how i want to use it but it will not understand the core values i'm using it for or how i'm going about my day. why i'm driving to the destination. as we are building the ai systems, it is helpful to have the concerns in mind but comfort in the fact that it cannot exist without us. our judgment and use of ai will remain key variable and should be part of how we build it and how we we as consumers and

citizens set up the guardrail. host: good morning, bill. caller: you are on the air. i wanted to ask about a must. i was wondering if he has done it or how you can sign up for something like that? elon musk, chip implants. host: have you heard of anything like that? guest: no.