host: this is the washington journal for february 15.

later today, nikki haley officially announces her bid to become president in 2024. ambassador haley becomes the first to take on president donald trump, with several other republicans reportedly eyeing the white house as well. with that in mind, the first hour will be for publicans only. we want to hear from you about who should lead the republican party in in 2024 and why they should be in the white house. if you are in the eastern time zones and a republican, you can call (202) 748-8000, central amount time zones, (202) 748-8001, and pacific time zones (202) 748-8002. you can also text us at (202) 748-8003.

this is out of charleston. the headline announces nikki haley's run for president challenging trump. if you go to the pages of the news out of greenville, several more gop hopefuls could join nikki haley in the 2024 race. nikki haley announces run for president, challenging trump. that is how state newspapers are playing out. her foalnnouncement is today in south carolina. you can see that live at 110 this morning. you can watch a couple o different ways. our main channel on c-span, our app c-span now, or c-span.org. we want to hear from you. perhaps you are a fan of nikki haley or other republicans that could be running in 2024.

nikki haley putting out and tweeting out a video yesterday announcing her intentions for the white house. here is part of that video from yesterday. the railroad track divided the town i race. i was the proud daughter of indians. not black, not white, just difference -- just different. my mother reminded me and my siblings every day how blessed we were to live in america. some look at our past as evidence that america's founding principles are bad. they say the promise of freedom is just made up. some think our ideas are not just wrong, but racist and evil. nothing could be further from the truth.

i have seen people. in china, they commit genocide. in iran, they murder their own people for challenging the government. and when a woman tells you about watching soldiers throw her baby into a fire, it puts things into perspective. even on our worst day, we are blessed to live in america. i was born and raised in south carolina, so i have seen the very best of our country. people here throughout the old, tired political establishment and demanded accountability for their tax dollars. industry reports call us the beast of the southeast, which i love. people came by the thousands for a fresh start. moms and dads held their heads up high. children learned that it's always a great day in south carolina. a great day, a great day, a

great day in south carolina. we were strong, we were proud. and when people did come -- police in south carolina are looking for a shooter. >> we turned away from fear toward god and the values that still make our country the freest and greatest in the world. host: that's just a portion of the video that was tweeted out yesterday, announcing the ambassadors intentions to run for the white house. that formal announcement later on at 11:00. in the "washington times this morning, it takes a look at the republicans who could run in the race for 2024, highlighting former president donald trump as one of them, florida governor

ron desantis, been a below that. even below that, other republicans that could be considered for the race as well, including maryland's former republican governor, former vice president mike pence, former secretary of state mike pompeo, tim scott from south carolina, and glenn youngkin. for today, republicans only -- for this first hour, republicans only. you can call in or text us, if you wish. this is michelle. you are first up. caller: i would vote for haley. host: you are on. caller: i would vote for haley because i think she would do a much better job. we have had a lot of shootings in the last several years if she

is able to be a strong leader and put forth positive gun-control measures, i think she would be the one i would vote for. all of the rest of the men that are lined up on that article that you have, have been in the programs of the republican party and we are still killing kids off, and our future generations are going to be gone. no young kid, a young child, is going to be able to take care of us. i don't care what the debt is. i don't care what party you are from. but something, some action must be done. host: ok, that is michelle in

florida. in new york, in syracuse, ray, hello. caller: hello, pedro. no reservations whatsoever on my part. donald trump, number one by far, best president ever. he's the only one with actions tested in office and the best president ever. just like when we had 17 starters, they disappeared so fast. host: would you want a second term of donald trump, as far as his approach to be the same, or should he change things up if he would run for a second time? caller: no changes whatsoever. he has done at once. if he thinks there is a change necessary, he knows what to do, why, what to change.

after all, he did it for four years. he did it better than anybody in our history. i would trust him and the people he brings in. i would never put myself over him. i really don't see anything he should change. the best thing he did was he drove the democrats crazy. host: the "wall street journal" taking a look at nikki haley's bid for the presidency also includes a statement from president trump when it comes to her candidacy. this is a reported statement shared by his campaign. "even though nikki haley said i would never run against my president, the best president in my lifetime, i told her she should follow her heart and do what she wants to do. i wish her luck." let's go to jason in wake forest, north carolina. good morning, you are next up. caller: donald trump today,

donald trump forever. i wouldn't care if they may donald trump king of this country because at least i would know my family is safe. this country would have a little morality and dignity. we would not be like these democrats. if we could get rid of them, that will be the best thing to ever happen to this country. host: what would you like a second term of donald trump to look like specifically? caller: i would like them to outlaw the democratic party. i would like him to arrest our media that committed treason against him. but can i tell you why i would never vote for nikki haley? i think you people in the media might want to worry about that a little bit. donald trump won't care if you want to impeach him again. you all are talking about russia. host: your criticism of nikki haley, what is that? caller: for one, she took down the confederate fact --

confederate flag. she's done in the south. she said two months ago that she would never even consider running against donald trump. now look at her. donald trump supporters don't like turncoats. host: ok, that's jason in north carolina. the "washington journal," in its editorial, taking a look at nikki haley and her career. saying that is haley's finest moment came from when she removed the confederate flag from the grounds of the capitol steakhouse. this is after the murder of three black americans by a white supremacist. the removal of the flight was not the result of her effort when her opponent in the gubernatorial race proposed moving the flag a year earlier, she dismissed the idea. as you in ambassador, nikki haley performed well enough.

she also resigned after less than two years. those in government have been critical. her biggest challenge is identifying rationale for canada see beyond a winning persona. -- for candidacy be on a winning persona. republicans only in this hour. (202) 748-8000 for the eastern and central time zones, (202) 748-8001 for the mountain and pacific time zones. this is from 10. ken is in oregon. good morning. caller: good morning, c-span. yes, i voted for trump twice. but you know what, i think his time has passed. i like nikki haley.

i have always liked her. i have been following her for years. right now, as it stands, she has more experience they donald trump had when he became president. i think it's maybe time to break that glass ceiling. host: i fully support nikki haley. host:when you say former president trump's time has passed, ken, what do you mean by that specifically? caller: i think it's time for a new face in there. i really do like donald trump, that he has got problems. i don't know if he could overcome that. i don't know if he could beat a democrat in the next election, speaking abide in. -- speaking of biden. i think nikki haley has a really

good shot at it. i think democrats would vote for her. that is just how i feel. host: ok. that is 10 in oregon. republicans only, taking a look at who you want to see at the top of the ballot. the governor's announcement came in the form of a twitter video put out yesterday. we showed you a part of it. here is another part, particularly where nikki haley talks about perspectives when it comes to the democratic party. [video clip] >> republicans have lost the popular vote in seven out of the last eight presidential elections. that has to change. joe biden's record is abysmal, but that shouldn't come as a surprise. the washington establishment has failed us over and over and over again. it's time for a new generation of leadership, to rediscover fiscal responsibility, secure our border, and strengthen our country, pride, and process.

♪ some people look at america and see vulnerability. the socialist left sees an opportunity to rewrite history. china and russia are on the march. they all think we can be bullied. kicked around. you should know this about me, i don't put up with bullies. and when you kick back, it hurts them more if you are wearing heels. i am nikki haley and i am running for president. ♪ host: that video put out yesterday. again, her formal announcement at 11:00 today. this will be from south carolina. you can watch on c-span, our c-span now apple, or on our website at c-span.org. those republicans out in the audience, thinking about who should lead the party in 2024, ryan in maryland.

hello. caller: good morning, c-span. i just put a plug-in for governor hogan. he actively avoids getting tangled up in social issues, he's a businessman, and he gets work done and he does it quietly. thanks. host: before you go, what do you think is his key as being governor of maryland and working in a primarily democratic state? caller: i don't know. that's a good mystery. if somebody else knows, i would like to hear more about it. but he got the job done. that's all i know. host: what do you think are his accomplishments, at least his key accomplishments? caller: the state has a balanced budget and he is focused on infrastructure. he stays out of the social issues that's what i liked about them. host: that's maryland's former governor, larry hogan, who is now one of those people who are reported considering taking a run at the white house in 2024.

tom in new jersey. good morning, you are next. tom, you are on. go ahead. ok, let's go to tim in pennsylvania. viewers, before we go on, remember that while you're waiting, go ahead and turn down or mute your television set, so when it is your time to talk, you can chime right in. tim in pennsylvania, hi. caller: i am a trump supporter. trump all the way. i like his policies, both internationally and domestically. i think his policies are right for america. i think america is going to be in such a miserable state at the end of biden's term that it is going to take a tough old bird to straighten it out. as far as all the political flakka and all the noise that

trump manages to kick up, that's not going to go away, no matter who it is, with the democrats. what they throw at the republicans is like the little cart that you put on the back of your car to run errands with. no matter who the nominee is, they are just going to point those guns at the nominee and you are going to have to have somebody who can withstand that withering fire to get what's right for america, rather than buckle at the knees and have them pushed around. i don't see anybody, including desantis, anybody on the republican stage other than trump that is going to be able to hold up under that and get their policies right for america, push those through. host: all right, tim in pennsylvania. next up, oscar in atlanta, georgia. hello. caller: good morning. let's all remember who president

trump is and what he did for america. this guy was a genius. he has his faults, but at the same time, he was a very good president. he did so much for this country, for the black community, for hispanics. he did so much for christians. this guy was one of the best presidents. i think that all of us who knew him and respected him, when he did that for us, we need to do something for him and give him another four years. he deserves it. i believe he will make america great again. host: what about the others on the list of those potentially running. nobody picture interest besides president trump? caller: i'm sure some of them that will run will have good qualities. but if you really think about it, president trump did such a great job for this country. i know that some people don't

believe that the election was stolen. but i saw the movie "2000 meals" and it was right in front of you. you cannot watch that movie and walk out and say that everything was fair. i encourage people to watch the movie. it will tell you that this election was not run properly. that's all i'm saying. i think there are other candidates that are decent people that probably will follow in donald trump's footsteps and probably copy a lot of his policy, because we all know that donald trump had the backbone and he represented america like no other president. outside of ronald reagan, i would say donald trump is probably one of the best presidents in our modern history, that did so much for so many people all around the world, not just here in america. he did so much for everybody. host: ok, that is oscar in georgia. for their part, the make america great again pack associated with

donald trump put out a statement regarding nikki haley day. they were saying nikki haley is nother career poan. she decided to serve in the trump administration, then resigned early to go make money on corporate boards. it looks like more of the same, a career politician whose only commitment is to herself. that is from the pack associated with donald trump. this is from ohio, david is next up. caller: yeah, hi. host: you are on, sir. go ahead. caller: ok. i would vote for pentz. --pence. and i would vote for trump again if i had to. i would like to see rubio in their for vice president. host: why mike pence? caller: he was the backbone behind trump.

people would really, really like him if he ever got in there. i can guarantee that. and rubio would be the best vice president. host: why is that? caller: his morals, respect, everything. he is just a great person. believe me, american people, those two people would be the best. host: that's david in ohio. he brings up mike pence. mike pence also in the news for a strategy regarding that inquiry from the justice department for january 6. this is from "the hill," reporting that mike pence is planning to fight the subpoena and the drawn out legal fight of the justice department ramps up its probe. it is consistent with his previous reluctance to testify.

more immediately, it could throw a wrench in the special counsel's efforts to investigate trump's efforts to overturn the 2020 election. as the presiding officer of the senate, his team is expected argued that under his former position as president, his work technically falls under the legislative branch. more of that if you want to read that. if you want to talk about mike pence as a candidate, you can do so in this first hour, this first 40 minutes or so of the program. (202) 748-8000 for the eastern and central time zones, (202) 748-8001 for the mountain and specific time zones. republicans only in this hour. walter is next in silver spring, maryland. caller: thanks to c-span. just to reiterate what the previous caller called about,

trump being there. i am indian-asian. i'm really happy nikki haley put her hat into the ring. but i don't think she can do it. the only reason she did is because she can ride on the coattails of trump. i just wanted to say that. host: what led you to that conclusion? caller: she cannot raise enough money and she does not have enough votes in the country to do it. her efforts in south carolina were great, but she doesn't have the fortitude or strength to do anything as fall -- as far as foreign policy or even dem at -- domestic policy. i think you'll reason she did this was to keep her name in the ring. i am indian-asian and i am a supporter of trump. host: ok, walter in maryland. this is lee in georgia. you are next, hi. caller: hi, this is lee nicholson. i just wanted to let you know

that i think some of the earlier callers that were extreme relative to trump do not represent the middle of the republican and they certainly don't represent the swing voters. we cannot win this thing if we don't get the swing voters. all the diehards on the trump side need to give it up a little bit for the sake of the country and pick somebody who can actually win this thing. not just when the republican nomination, but the election. i voted for trump twice. but he has alienated so many people that he is not going to win the people who push him over the middle. that's all i'm going to say about that. host: lee, if i may ask, those motor and swing voters, do you think there is a candidate out there that drawls some appeal when it comes to 2024? caller: i think a lot of these people. desantis, pompeo, haley, pence.

as long as they don't all beat each other up too badly out there, they could possibly bring some of the middle over. they don't have to do much, they just can't make fun of every other person, call everyone who runs against them an enemy, and have a bunch of baggage they have to carry around. they don't have to do much. that's all it to say. host: being that swing voter, is about the tone of the candidate or the policy? for you specifically, what policy would you like to see the next candidate advocate for? caller: personally, and i will step in it a little bit here, thanks to the republican stance on the abortion, it is to extreme to get the swing voters. they just need to tailor that a little bit. i also think that republican stance on background checks on the guns is a little too

extreme. maybe not a red flag law, but a yellow flag law. i think we would probably be in pretty good shape if we just took those two things and brought that middle over to us. i like fiscal policy, defense, those kinds of things. republicans have a much, much stronger method. host: lee there in georgia, giving us a call. talking about 2024, who would you like to see in the party? jerry in kansas. hello. caller: yes, "washington journal" and c-span, we appreciate very much having the freedom of speech and getting our questions answered. i would say that, concerning mike pence, our section of the country would not ever vote for michael pence because the media, not c-span, but mike said he was

not going to be certified because he would call the election. that's not what it was about. it was about the country, the government being able to investigate the fraud that occurred in 2016. that has been proven true, because the hunter laptop information, the fbi, that departments of government, had their thumb on the scale. host: for mike pence as a presidential candidate, this is something you would approve or not approve of? caller: he can run, but mike can't -- my section of kansas would never vote for him. had he decertified, that would not have put biden in power, it would have allowed us to investigate the election.

host: sure, sure. he made that point. but if it is not mike pence, who is it going to be? caller: it would be for donald trump, because look at the position he put our country in. he made us strong. the last caller called in and sound like he was driving a vehicle. does he appreciate buying the expensive gasoline? when donald trump was in gas -- was in power, we could buy gas for $1.14 in northeast kansas. the anti-trumper's, they talk about biden running in 2024. he has dementia. i have seen this in my family. he will never finish out his term because of his medical problems. host: let's go to tim in tennessee. hi. caller: hi. one thing i can say is i was a trump supporter through and through for the first term, for

sure. but as somebody that has lived in texas, lived in an area that has had a lot of people crossing the border, immigrants, actually serving on the border in texas, i believe either the governor from florida, desantis, or greg abbott would probably be the best pick for the republican party. somebody who is actually dealt with immigration. a lot of policies trump had, i did like. i think they were great policies for the time. but i believe as he gets back in the white house now, the media and too many people are going to be coming after him and pull him off the agenda that we actually need to be focusing on now. host: tim in lansing, tennessee, talking about work -- florida governor ron desantis and who should lead the party in 2024.

maybe it is somebody else that was mentioned. maybe it is nobody on the list that was mentioned. you can let us know in the next half-hour. (202) 748-8000 in the eastern and central time zones. (202) 748-8001 in the mountain and specific time zones. text us if you wish at (202) 748-8003. if you want, you can post regardless of your party on our social media sites. we have been telling you about nikki haley entering the presidential race. that formal announcement set to take place today. joining us on the phone to give a little more background on what to expect is caitlin byrd. she is the senior poster. thank you for joining us. guest: i hope you can hear me ok pair we are all standing outside nikki haley's launch location,

waiting to get in. it is definitely a day where a presidential candidate is announcing in downtown charleston and the media has dissented. host: the location is nicknamed "the shed" or something along that line. can you give us an idea of what to expect on the actual announcement? guest: it is called "the shed." it doesn't sound glamorous, but it is actually quite beautiful. it is an open air venue. the flags and banners are already up. the south carolina flag, the american flag overhead, and the nikki haley banner is quite prominent. you can see it from the street here. like i said, a lot of media are waiting to get in. i'm expecting a good number of people. i am hesitant to put any sort of body count on it yet, but i can tell you that the weather here today is beautiful. the rain will be people -- will be keeping people away.

that is something the nikki haley team can breathe a sigh of relief about. i am curious if we are going to be hearing echoes from her campaign launch video, which she posted online yesterday, where she calls for a new generation of leadership. that seems to be a rear -- a real contrast point she seems to draw early as a candidate. i wonder if she is going to dip into the culture wars, especially on issues like education. that is also going to be probably a real big motivator for republican primary voters and republican voters in general. it's a great day here in south carolina. that is a phrase nikki haley has made her own and made it a required greeting on phone calls and state agencies. i am kind of joking and also not , wondering if she will say it is a great day in america.

host: dan announcement, how is it registering amongst the residents of the state? guest: i'm not sure how may people are watching closely on twitter. twitter is never a great barometer for what voters think and feel. but leading up to haley's announcement, i was at walmart of all places, and someone asked what i did. i said i was a reporter. the gemma behind the register said he was excited about nikki haley because she's a true conservative. i wasn't even working. it was just a knee-jerk reaction from a sales associate when i was getting a gallon of milk. people are excited that nikki haley is a household name in south carolina. it's a huge advantage for her to have such high name id in a voting state like this. tomorrow, she's going to be in

new hampshire. host: one of the people offering some support was senator lindsey graham. guest: yes. he and nikki have a really affable relationship. they have worked together through the years, i think even back in 2015 when the confederate flag came down. nikki haley was meeting with federal and state officials. lindsey graham has already pledged his loyalty. he sat alongside former president trump. i think that isn't have also said something, don't quote me, but he said something like a lot of people are saying they want trump's policies, but blessed person who can do that is the man himself. he took a really hard stance there, but he went on twitter

and talk fondly of nikki haley's time. even though he is going to be wearing a different jersey for a different candidate, so to speak. host: do you expect any reference, even alluding to the fact that at one time the candidate said she would never run against president trump, and now here she is running against him. do you expect any reasoning why within the speech itself? guest: i don't know if we will get a reason why, in terms of the walk back on saying she is going -- she wouldn't run if trump ran again. but also, she did not do this without talking to him first. she did call trump before she made her announcement. she made good on her first promise and went through with the p's of the quote, which does not get brought up as much.

i think what she will do is probably, as the first one out of the gate after trump, the first to really start drawing contrast points within a republican primary, her job today is to pitch wide. what vision can she bring? some people are going to have a strong idea of what trump is going to bring to the table. the pressure is now on nikki haley this morning, saying this is what i can offer, here is what i learned on the international stage at the united nations, and here's what i bring as someone who grew up as a brown girl in a black-and-white world in south carolina. host: we heard her reference to the work on the confederate flag, but as far as her record in the state, what are positives that would maybe assist her in this campaign and some drawbacks that could impact her campaign?

guest: certainly, some of the positives you can hear she already highlighted in that campaign video. i'm thinking about major places, like bmw and boeing. she says in that campaign launch video about how under her leadership, south carolina was named the beast of the southeast. at a time when economic policy and timing in general was such a top of mind issue, every time they go and pay for gas or go to the grocery store, i am sure she is going to be leaning into that heavily. she does have a little bit of a business background experience. she did accounting at clemson university and worked as an accountant in her family's business. she will also more broadly speak to her ability to make deals, work across the aisle, while at

the same time always doubling down when it matters. i am really curious about this vision she is going to have to outline here today and how much of that is going to sound, in many ways, like an echo of the things she has been saying when she hit for other candidates. in the last midterm cycle, she was all over the country. that is a good opportunity to test the message. they are going to see what all those speeches come together as in this first introduction. host: you can see our guest reporting on the candidacy, the announcement, and related stories when you go to "the post and courier" website. she is our senior politics reporter, talking about this. thank for your time. we will have you close -- we will have you back when we get closer to election time. guest: thank you so much for the opportunity have a great day. host: if you want to see tha announcement today, it is

expected at 11:00. you can see that on c-span, c-span now, or c-span.org. dear calls on who you would like to see leave the party in 2024. tommy in rhode island, thanks for waiting. go ahead, you are on. caller: good morning, how are you doing? as far as the upcoming presidential election, i believe that the republican party, there has been a gentle shift when kevin mccarthy was voted in as head of the house of representatives. i think that the shift began, and it was at that point that president biden saw that he had to sit down, he had to talk to kevin mccarthy, and he had to

recognize that the republican party was not going to just sit there and be stepped upon. now, here we are going into 2024 with the presidential elections, with president trump running again to be president of the united states. i believe that between president trump and president biden, there really isn't any contest, as far as one person being older than the other person. i believe the contest is going to come down to the extreme background in business and economics that president trump

has had. host: let's go to john in iowa. hello. caller: the thing that most people don't realize about what happened with donald trump that going back into the early 90's -- 1990's, america was looking to break the wheel that exists in washington, d.c. with politicians simply going there to climb the ladder. that is what we are seeing again today with a lot of these people. we have been talking about nikki haley, mike pence being the individuals who are looking to be president. but donald trump tapped into that "break the wheel" and we want someone from the other side to run this country. he did it very well and his actions show that. i think that that's overlooked.

when that happened with donald trump, we had a lot of people out there who are in that wheel who freaked out, because all of a sudden politics was changed. american people spoke and said, "we are done with your games." i think the only person who can continue that is donald trump. there are people who can follow him, not mike pence, but may be what's his name from florida. host: you mean ron desantis. ok, that is john in iowa. some of you are texting in. this is an in new york. her choices, it would be aidan hutchinson, former governor of arkansas. or former governor of maryland, hogan.

another says senator romney would be her choice. from candy in california, "i voted for trump in 2016. that was enough he made enough trouble and we don't need that again. this time, i would vote for nikki haley." nikki haley was talked about in the press conference with -- in the press conference yesterday. [video clip] >> what i think we are going to have is a vigorous primary, with a number of candidates making their case. they registered americans, republicans, are going to have to decide who to nominate. i think it is going to be very,

very competitive in these primaries. we will hope for the best. obviously, i'm going to support whoever the nominee ultimately is. host: again, who should be top of ticket in 2024, in light of the announcement from nikki haley? you can talk about her and others within the republican party. republicans only for this first hour. in missouri, hello. caller: hello. i am a republican and i want to see mike pence for president and liz cheney for vice president. they understand the election and will not overturn anybody's election. i will leave it at that. you all have a wonderful day. have a good day. host: let's go to lou in tampa, florida. hi, there. caller: hi, pedro, good morning.

good morning, america. i like the candidate from south dakota. i think he's going to work across party lines. i think he is articulate and i think he would be great for america. that is all i have got to say. thank you for letting me speak. host: would you mind explaining why you're governor is not on your radar? caller: i like to santos. i voted for him. -- i like to santos -- desantis. i voted for him. but i don't know. i would vote for d santos if he wins the nomination, but i like this other guy as a leader. i think he will stand up to china. i think ron desantis will, too, of course.

but john knows what's going on. host: that is lou in florida. in nevada, don, hello. caller: good morning. host: good morning. you are on, sir. caller: it's either tipi or tv. even though the marxists are trying to destroy donald trump, i think pompeo or desantis would be excellent vice presidents. they served our country with honor. i don't think people realize how important the vice president is

for national security. trump is a duel or -- doer. he has completed more things than anyone in the presidency has done in four years. i think he deserves another shot at it. like i say, they are trying to destroy him. but he will withstand it and he will be our next president. host: sarah is next, in north carolina. hi. caller: yes, good morning. i like trump, but the problem with putting trump in their, we are going to be in trial every day, trying to impeach the man. that is not good for our country. that's the way i feel about trump. he was a good man while he was there. we don't need mike pence, we

don't need biden. we need somebody who would stand up for us. trump was one of them, but our country cannot afford to sit in the courtroom all day long on national tv, the fbi, all of that. i feel bad for the man. he doesn't need to even run. host: before you leave, sarah, who do you believe that person is? caller: i think ron desantis or nikki haley. host: would you like to tell us why either of those are in your mind? caller: i think ron desantis, a man who would stand up to disney, is a good man, standing up to people like that. and stand up for our children. nikki haley would be good for vice president and desantis would be good for president. i like donald trump, but his time is over. our country cannot sit in a courtroom all the time, trying

him and trying to get him out of there. our country doesn't need that. host: ok, sarah into north carolina. when it comes to former president trump and governor desantis, that is been cited as a dream team for 2024. from lee in florida, nikki haley is wonderful, ron desantis is great, but when it comes to former president trump, never again. this is timbo from arkansas. i'd like to see eight hutchinson, maybe we can get a handle on this fentanyl. second choice would be ron desantis. speaking of hutchinson, he was asked just last week about potential to run for the office of president on an interview with cbs. here's a portion of it. [video clip] >> you were recently in iowa. you have been to new hampshire,

south carolina, distributing the leaves -- just reading the tea leaves. last year, you said pretty definitively that you expect to make a decision in the first part of next year as to whether or not you would run for president. now that we are officially in that window, i wonder, do you have anything to announce? >> certainly, wherever you see nikki haley jumping in there, ec donald trump already in their, and you know we are going to have to make some decisions. obviously, the fact that i am in some of the early states, also going to arizona to talk about ideas and solutions for our border crisis and immigration issues that we face, this is an important time for me to get that consistent, conservative, common sense message out there. that is what i'm doing first and foremost. last year, i did believe a candidate would need to get in

and make a decision the first part of the year, january or february. i think because of the slowness and how this has developed, we have a little bit more time. >> why do you say there is slowness in how this has developed? >> trump has gotten in, but he was quiet for a month or so. also, people know there are going to be some options to former president trump. the important thing for me is to be out there and talk about the border security issues. but also the support for ukraine that i think is important. people need to hear that message. we need to look for solutions when it comes to the crime in the streets, and make sure that we enforce our law. and of course, inflation is still hurting america. we want to develop these solutions. if that message carries out that i can make a decision at the right time as to the role that i

will play in 2024 and continue to look at presidential campaign. host: that is asa hutchinson from last week. when it comes to the democratic party, they put out a statement, taking a look at nikki haley, saying nikki haley served in donald trump's administration and has embraced most extreme elements of his agenda. they could not identify acing a policy difference between trump and herself. south carolina banned abortion with no exceptions for race and in -- rape and incest. refusing to expand medicaid, to provide for bill health care access for hundreds of thousands of south carolinians. she officially kicks off a messy 2024 race that has long been brewing. everyone get your popcorn.

that is a statement from the democratic national committee. this is david. caller: it is clearly donald trump. i tell you what would be interesting and shocking. [indiscernible] you have two strong, strong people. two people stand up to this craziness. host: it got muted a bit. who should be his vice presidential candidate? caller: josie gatherers. host: why her? caller: because she will stand with him. she will not go for the craziness happening. everyone knows it is craziness. it needs to be two strong individuals that are not scared to take them on. host: jerry in new jersey, up

next. 2020 four, who do you want to see the head of the ticket? jerry, hello. caller: i think the color before me. that is what i have been saying all along. chelsea gatherers. but she is out there. definitely donald trump. i don't see anybody else taking it, i really don't. as far as c-span goes, i notice you are reading more negative responses. there has got to be positive responses. if you think any republican, including desantis, is not going to get the same treatment from the media, once they get nominated, think again. they don't want any republicans. please, get a grip. if trump wins the nomination,

please just say you're going to support him. that's all i want to hear. i don't want to hear about how the news media is going after him. that's crazy. host: guillermo in philadelphia. you are next up. hello. caller: good morning. eleanor roosevelt once said there are two kinds of people. one that talks about actions, one that talks about people, and one that talks about issues. today, i would like to talk about issues. i would like to see somebody run the republican party who believes in god, not only that, but acts like he does. second, i want somebody who wants to fight for life. life. third, i want somebody to keep us armed, in case anybody tries to take over this country. may peace be with you. host: who is that person who captures those ideals? caller: well, it is a choice

between donald trump and desantis. i think desantis said he was sent from god. everyone is sent from god, really. you, too, pedro. you are sent from god and you have unique qualities that nobody else has. i think it is a good idea for both of them to run. may peace be with you. host: ok. one more call on this topic. this is steve from texas. you are last call. no ahead. caller: listen, i think the republican party has got to change. they have all these conspiracy theories stuff, and even moderate republicans are voting both sides and they don't have a chance to win. if trump wins, we will probably be done for years. host: who is that moderate, do

you think? caller: i don't know. it's hard to find one now. they had them in the past, but they called them woke and rhinos. it's crazy. i don't get it. host: as far as the current mix of people, only two of them running, but the others reportedly going to run, none of them strike you so far? caller: no, i haven't seen any. the loudest squeak gets the grease, i guess. and they have been drowned out. host: steve in texas. the last call. this is a text finishing up the segment. this is steve from south carolina. nikki was on boeings board until she resigned and protested, trying to get $60 billion. we have the largest b&w plant in the world here due to her efforts. john in michigan saying christie

knoll should be in the mix somewhere for vice president or candidate. for 2024, as we look toward caaign coverage, including today's announcement at 11:00, including nikki haley entering e race for president of the united states. you can see that at 11:00 live today. on our main channel, on our app, or you can follow along on your computer at c-span.org. a couple of guests joining us. up first, you are going to hear from toni preckwkle. also discussg a new coalition of counties pushing for a growth in guaranteed income program. we will have a conversation with her next. now the president for the center

of renewing america. being coached by more watts by elizabeth priya all things i like about the senate. there is one thing i do not like about the senate and that is which is brought me here is that a being at home by my wife on valentine's day, mr. president my wife and i have been married 36 years at our first two babies were born in atlanta, georgia,

your great estate. my wife susan has been my valentine for 36 years and i'm away from her once again. it says i love my wife and i wish her happy valentine's day but that is against the rules so i will not do that. instead mr. president i'm going to say susan i love you and 13 -- thank you for 36 great years. thank you mr. president. >> washington journal continues. host: our first guest of the morning's toni preckwinkle. she is also the president of cook county board of commissioners. thank you for joining us on the program today. guest: thank you for inviting me. host: on both of those fronts you are advocating for basic income. can we talk about the place for both of the titles you hold?

guest: i think it is important for us to remember the decision on a new idea. martin luther king in the 1960's talk about the importance of providing an economic forum for people, guaranteed basic income and the black panthers talk about guaranteed income for residence in the united states. this is an old idea that has gotten currency recently and a lot of pilots on the city level and very organize it at the county level, those engaged in this work and where do i get here cook county, they are doing it in los angeles. at the events earlier this week we heard from people in minnesota priya all over the country counties and municipalities are modeling guaranteed income programs. host: cook county. talk about the experience of getting that thing started on what has been the reaction to

it. guest: when the american rescue plan came to us we spent a year trying to figure out what was the best investment we can make without money. we said let's be thoughtful about this. one of the ideas was guaranteed income. i want to thank former mayor in california in 2019 had the first guaranteeing and compiling program in the country. it was a year-long pilot investing by lottery in the residence. they did academic evaluation of participants and valid people invested in their own education and support for their children. it took some time to reflect on where they wanted to go at the

end of participants in the program were more likely to be employed more likely to pursue their education, more likely to pursue education for their children. all the positive outcomes you would hope and expect from a program like this. our program was authorized by our board of commissioners, a legislator in the fall. we got the first checks out in january. $1200 a month for two years. were going to continue the program with our own resources from the american rescue plan act. we have had a long-term commitment to this. it is the largest sponsor program in country. host: if i read this, 230,000 plus people applied to be on cook county program. what were the requirements you offered going into it and want

to get the money, do they have requirement as what they do with it? guest: 250% of poverty was either showed. 233,000 people applied in about a quarter of our residents in cook county were eligible for the program. 233,000 individuals and families applied and unfortunately were only able to support 3250. it is a great need for this kind of support. both of us at the local level where the cities or counties are going to make the case -- i try to make the case that the federal government has to step up to do the work because they have more resources than we do. in the meantime, we approve the concept by engaging in our models. host: once i get the money, are they required to do anything with it or spend it on different things? guest: no. the government gives social security payments to senior citizens. nobody tells us how to spend the

money. we have confidence that people in our country they're going to spend it wisely. host: do you think there should be some means for these funds? guest: in our program you have to have 250% of poverty as family income or less. that was a means test. it is easier politically to support programs for which everyone is eligible. any senior citizen, get social security payments and they do not ask you what your present income is. in my view, -- at the moment, our threshold was 250% of poverty. 2.5 times the poverty level. host: our guest with us until 8:45 a.m. if you want to ask her

about could counties experience in illinois and the larger idea about guaranteed income. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. you can text us at 202-748-8003. tell us about county for guaranteed income. how many counties are involved with this in far the challenges county space versus other localities when approaching these programs? guest: we have more than a dozen folks with us when we announce the program in washington on monday. i'm grateful that they came from all over the country. the two cochairs are from los angeles and chicago. county leaders from all over the country were represented. this is an idea percolating for a while and we are grateful we have the resources thanks to joe

biden and congress to explore some of these investments. host: some of this money is coming from the american rescue plan, what authorizes you to use the money in that way? within the requirements of the american rescue plan? guest: one of the blessings of the american rescue plan there were not restrictions. you could use it to pay -- you cannot use it to pay debt but other than that you can use it for any other project or activity you felt at the local level was critical to your residence. that's one of the beauties of the program. individual cities, towns, villages, states can make decisions about how they want to invest the money. different choices were made in different places based on medical needs. host: you were the topic of a column in the new york post aboulaun of your program. she said this, county board

presiden preckwinkle empoweringe to quote take care of their families pursue education and find better employment. these are the same goals working people have only they in people working two jobs and not making in -- meet need help or not people who choose to live in the rough. how do you react to that? guest: i've never heard of this person. let me just say, this is not a journal skew of our people in this country. we never said you are not working. the people receiving our work artwork e. two or three jobs. this gives them a financial cushion. for people who are not working, some are looking for employment, some are disabled. this is a real lifeline.

i do not know about you, but when i was growing up we did not have very much and it would have been helpful to my family, to have this, support. both my parents were hurting. -- both my parents were working. let's look out for each other in this country and not look for opportunities to disparage or diminish folks who may not bear the same opportunities or good fortune we have had. host: of your awful twitter ask -- if your awful twitter ask that you verify the income of those getting the money. guest: we have access to social security numbers and we can get information about their employment. they tell us what their income is we move ahead in that way. we have an academic partner which is looking at a control group and how they fare.

help us with analyzing results, reviewing progress, telling the stories of the people who are involved. it is important you just -- it is important for us to look at the data about what happens with people who participate in the program. host: toni preckwinkle joining us, the cochair. our first call is from jim on that this -- our first call is from jim from the pennsylvania. caller: red guards into social engineering -- where getting into social engineering to control them. what gives government the right to take the fruits of one man's labor and give it to somebody

else? where does that basic concept come from? host: that is jim in pennsylvania. guest: we do this in government all the time. in some of the states which are so opposed to government control or manipulation or intervention, they get several dollars back the federal government for every one that they contribute the governor of arkansas, regards get these federal bureaucrats off your backs but it turns out arkansas contributes to dollars back in a variety of programs and activities. getting the federal government off your back from you do not want your two or three dollars for every dollar that you spend? there are lots of ways in which government supports people. we provide farmers with subsidies. there is an

agricultural bill coming up for reauthorization and it provides support to rural communities.. i think we should support rural america. that makes it very hard for role areas. the federal government ought to be involved in supporting them. the federal government invest in senior citizens like me to social security programs. for medicare programs. the federal government invest in our military. see very few of those programs that we have lots of barriers to participation. this program that provides people with support and assistance and does not have a lot of barriers. we have a reauthorization

process and you get the check and you figure out what to do what makes sense for you and your family. this is what we do with social security payments. no one ever suggested that we check on seniors. host: to that point, and other viewers says social security money is returning money to the taxpayer. big difference, it is their money. guest: yes. the federal government when they initiated social security program life expense he worked considerably less than they are now. many people were able to utilize the social security benefits ber five or maybe 10 years and we are at a place now with life expectancy, any of us gets a lot more out of social security that we put in. we, younger workers to continue to support the system to make that possible. the example i gave about farm

subsidies. farmers do not put any money to support farm subsidies. the federal government decides it is important to our economy to support agricultural workers and owners. there are lots of ways in which some programs people put money and get money back but there are many programs we decide what is important and to support it. host: from augusta, georgia, richard. caller: good morning. i firmly believe that a living wage for americans should be $25 an hour and i tell you why. i was able to pay for my car note, my mortgage, my 401(k), health insurance, and also i work overtime, as much as i could in order to build my social security account so i could benefit the fruits of my labor as i never tire is a chemical operator -- as i now

retire as a chemical operator with a foreign company that paid as well. and i believe -- see this out the cost of living is cheaper than it is -- in the south the cost of living is cheaper than it is of north. i'm also a veteran but i'm not retired veteran. $25 an hour so you can pay for all the things i mentioned, and that is as a single man in. can you imagine how it could be for a young couple with two or three children? a living wage, $25 an hour. guest: this is not the discussion about living wages but i believe the gentleman is correct. west a the minimum wage in this country? $7.25 an hour.

there is no place in the country where you can support yourself. he is absolutely correct. that's a different discussion. we need to waste of minimum wage considerably. we are moving towards $50 an hour minimum wage that makes --15 dollar an hour minimum wage. at the moment we are talking about currency basic income. host: the 3250 people in the program, how did you break down as far as families versus single people? guest: i know that -- i'm getting a little help here. janet demographics, 71% are women. 28% are men. 5% are asian. 2% are native. 12% are multiracial.

24% on what -- latino. 50% in the city. we skewed our program for suburb. there are no other support people in suburb. most of our participants are suburban. 56% are working. 31% delayed medical care because of the calls. the majority are working or have a disability which prevents them from working. host: michael eskin of carolina on the independent line. caller: i was calling because a couple of times the lady brought up the income for people receiving social security. then she said more people are

outliving their term of the social security. i want to bring it to our attention that a lot of people are waiting to sign up for social security at a later age. like my wife did not sign up until she was 72 years old. the other issue i have is, there's too many handouts. wewe have 60 million people in this country getting disability help. another 70 million people getting welfare help. if people had jobs, which we have plenty of jobs, if they were told to go do those jobs and stop taking the handouts, one thing i think should be done as a people are working and they are not receiving enough money so the government giving the money to not work, they should give them an extra bonus for working. host: michael in north carolina.

guest: i believe in the importance of work. for a lot of us as a part of our sense of ourselves. but there are people who are a difficult place either because of their health or the opportunities in their area, work is not readily available they do not have the skills for the jobs available. one of the things people with they participants in guaranteed income programs as get more education so they can better participate in the workforce, there are more opportunities for them. this is a little bit extra money to help that in pursuit of that enables them to work. 15% of the people in our program are disabled. we in this country -- providing

people who are struggling with opportunities, will be more productive citizens at the end. more young people working and contributing to social security programs. maureen people are to support their families -- more young people are able to support their families. many young people postpone the decision to have children because they know they cannot afford it. we do not want that. we want a living wage that supports their families. how parental leave, and excessive childcare. we have a lot of challenges in this country in terms of family support. the democratic party has always supported things like childcare, family leave, and we want to continue to do that. all of us in this country should be supporting our younger workers and younger families who

are the future of our nation. host: for her current position as president of the cook county board she served as an ottoman of the fourth ward for 19 years. as part of that you introduce living wage ordinances during that time. what was it like as far support for these programs back then and what you are seeing now? guest: here in illinois previously passed a measure to wage -- to raise the net amount wage to $15 an hour. the environment is much more family for these initiatives at least here. for most of us, the minimum wage is $7.25 an hour and nobody can support themselves let alone their families. even in places for cost of living is low. with so many of our people who have two or three jobs to support themselves and their families. as pointed to my suggested if we

could raise the minimum wage provide better support to families, inexpensive childcare, parental leave, those would be helpful to help family supported. host: here in kansas, roger, democrats line. caller: yes, i was calling about -- i do feel like we need to give more free benefits out there, especially one like this. i think it would increase people not doing as much. you mentioned earlier the farm bill and i happened to be a farmer. our farm bill is coming up and it is almost 80% giveaway programs to welfare and food programs, children's school

programs, that the majority of our farm bill. that's where the money on the farm bill goes. i thought i would clarify that for your listeners. guest: i can speak to the specifics of the farm bill went to the extent that the farm bill supports school lunches, supports food security for our families, i think it is money well spent. i'm not an expert on the farm bill so i cannot tell you how the money is spent. to the extent we are supporting school lunches for kids and food security for families, it is money well spent. host: in florida, margate, republican line. caller: you mentioned the means testing at 250% of poverty level and he had more people than -- you had more people that you will have money for. why did you not just do the

poverty level? why did you offer the people above rather than cover more of the poor people? guest: we wanted to be more expensive and who was eligible for the program. we have to break it somewhere and that's where we chose. at thought level a quarter of the population in the county would have been eligible. i wish we had a lot more resources for yet have a lots of the demand for their american rescue plan act and we devoted 42 million which is the largest amount in the country for these pilots. we made a commitment to continue the program when the federal resources are exhausted. host: how are these programs remain sustainable? guest: fries, we have created an equity fund. repping our revenue into the

fund and identify other that we use to support the program on ongoing basis. host: as far as other programs you have along with other counties involved, is sustainability an issue? guest: yes. we have an equity fund we created in the midst of the pandemic to figure out how we can better target resources. we are putting our cannabis revenue into that pond and figure out other revenue streams we can dedicate to it. we have the resources to get our program like this one. host: gary in connecticut, independent line. caller: good morning. i wanted to bring up an idea that was proposed in the 1960's and i'm going to have to speak

-- a moderate republican group for michigan, what they propose was, resolve minimum cash income be provided to all american citizens. the way the program worked then was families living under the poverty line, which is $4000, will be brought up to $5,000 but it is not in there. all americans making that first $4000 would not be taxed on the amount of money. for those living in the poverty line, but what happened is they went to work, instead of losing the benefit, they would get 50% of the difference between what they earned and a top number

that was set then, $10,000. if an impoverished family got their first $5,000 and went out and earned $3000, they get another $1500 from the government without taxes. host: would you like our guest elaborate on? caller: she's familiar with the bridget fonda society plan? guest: i'm not familiar with the plan. i do know richard nixon, republican president of the united states, was contemplating a guarantee neck on program at one point. this is not an idea limited to the democratic party, in the past, richard nixon supported and considering some of the

mentation of a guaranteed income program. host: it's a bipartisan issue or a largely partisan issue? guest: at the moment, a partisan issue. it was more bipartisan in the past and we hope it will be in the future. it is one of the reasons we are doing these policy models to build the way -- case is a good way to invest in our residents. host: what other areas of the country did you look to as far as examples or models to base this on? guest: i credited mayor tubs from stockton, california who put a plan in place a number of years ago. we had the benefits of the research bill associated with that program. that is the most recent national model. there have been other efforts

that provided people with socials but in terms of government investments, it is mayor tubs in stockton we turn to. i am a teacher. you take a teacher out of the classroom. when i was teaching geography, i would ask my students, was the most important resource in the country has? the kiss was a oil -- the students with a oil or gold or water. we would talk for a while and it would get to the point where, hopefully, somebody would say, the most important resource in any country has is people. if we invest in our own residence where making the best investment we possibly can. that is what guarantee basic income is. host: democrats line, we hear from harold in texas. caller: good morning. i wanted to say that i support

the program and i think it is a wonderful thing. there are lots of people in low pay range making less than $30,000 and it affects everybody, a whole races of people. and it helps those that are single and wants you might have kids and below the poverty line, it would help them. as far as what gives us the right, we as a christian nation, it is a christian thing to do. that is the good thing. i wanted to let the lady know i've been talking to my family for something like that. people make and $15,000 a year

on social security and other things and less than 30,000. they need at least $50 more a week, $100 more or something like that. and might cut down on a lot of crime. lots of the crime, knowing they are getting something in every week or something like that, maybe that would help that. some people might think that is about think, throwing money at crime, but it can be a good thing. host: thanks. guest: i think if you provide people with modest resource, there are some people who might commit crimes as desperation and with resource, they might not feel so desperate. the adjustment is correct -- he is correct. host: 20 from florida saying it has consideration been giving to the inflationary effects?

guest: this is an opportunity for people to invest in themselves, invest in their own education, invest in their kids, and those kinds of investments, most of us with resources make all of this time. invest in college education for our kids. we invest in ourselves, continuing education for ourselves. those are great investments in the body spending that money on education is inflationary, by spending the money keeping up, make sure your kids are fed. nobody talks about that being inflationary. i'm not worried about the inflationary impacts. i am worried about academic partners making the best review analysis of the program that they can and sharing the stories and transforming their lives by

these investments. host: you talk about academic partnership. we have a viewer who makes a statement another program that could be used with no oversight. just academic partner in your case provide oversight or is there another means of oversight of how these funds are used? guest: it is not oversight. it is analysis and review. i think we have to trust our citizens to make good investments. how can i say this? there are a lot of programs in this country that i focus on helping people with modest means as if there is something the matter with them. a lot of our employment programs and poverty programs will show

the better the individual. we have not talked about structural reasons for poverty in this country. they are not talked about enough of the impacts of racism on the communities of colors. there are all kinds of impediments folks have to no fault of their own to succeed in life and we need to do what we can to help them so they can be more successful, which is good for all of us. if we could take a young family, provide resources to them so they get more education, support their kids better, that is an investment that helps all of us, because it will be more productive over the lifetime. that is good for our country. investing in all people is a great thing for us to do as a country. host: here in new york, michelle, republican line. caller: good morning.

i'm sitting here and i'm watching. it is all about programs which i'm poor -- i am poor but we are watching in east palestine ohio and the entire government is being nuked and where is our federal government? all of our programs we invest in, it seems to me we are picking who are the winners and losers. no one is doing anything about ohio. then we have train wrecks in south carolina, texas. arizona had a chemical spill yesterday. nobody cares about those people right now in ohio who are struggling to get by. it's constantly pushing this ethnic -- host: ok, thanks.

guest: i do not think those two things are mutually exclusive. i agree. we have had these train accidents, fires in oil refineries. those are man-made disasters. we are quick to respond to natural disasters, tornadoes, wildfires, but sometimes we are not quick enough to man-made disasters. that is not what we are talking about today. we are talking about guarantee basic income. i'm not prepared to defend the federal response to the train accident in ohio. i think that is a nightmare. it is a man-made disaster. i cannot respond because i do not know the ways in which the government has stepped up or failed to step up. the federal government response in our behalf to disasters. here in chicago, host respond --

host response to a hurricane in chicago. the federal government spends money to help people who are the victims of tornadoes. that is a good investment. people in the west struggling with wildfires, the federal government ought to help those people. we do not have wildfires in illinois, but the federal government should help those people. host: kim in iowa, independent line. caller: good morning. i was reading the constitution about corporations. 75 corporations, 80% -- it seems

like it has been twisted. it seems like we are paying the 80% and they're paying 20% or less. that is why each state has become of the commission like you guys to sit here and she with the money to the poor. even though the majority of the taxes are paid by them if you are telling the big oil ticket subsidies, paying big oil for sabotaging what is happening with the train and all these chemical spills. if you go to the state of each state i noticed, we are paying 80% of the taxes and 20% federal is paying. it should be the opposite end we would not have poverty. we would not have the commission you are having with everyone doing it the right way instead of choosing who gets what. host: thank you, kim.

guest: where doing this pilot program and others are doing models as well in the hope that we will prove that this is a good idea the federal government should take up. the federal government has to lion share the resources. we have to get the federal government to support our folks and people across the country. i'm not sure about the tax policy issues you rose but i will say, in the long run, fertilizer have guaranteed income program, -- in the long run, if we will have a guaranteed income program, we need the federal government. caller: good morning, i support the program. just the other day i had to send my sister $200 in georgia. i sent her money every month. she works six days a week sometimes 10 hours a day and barely making enough to cover

her rent. at the beginning of the program you stated that, you are to use the money because there were no rules. if desantis is using the same money to ship immigrants across the country, we talk about social security, social security gets called to, why can we not do that also with the minimum wage? this is needed. there are lots of families out there struggling. six dollars for eggs. corporations final all of the apartments. i commend you for you are doing because you are helping a lot of families and they should be spread across the country. host: go ahead. guest: i am very grateful to have the opportunity to be with you this morning. and to talk about guarantee basic income.

the most important and best investments we can make our own people and it is a way we can invest in our own. i hope other cities and counties will consider this kind of initiative and we can make the case to persuade the federal government this is something we ought to do. host: at the end of the pilot, what would you like to see happen? what results would you like to see? guest: i want to be able to share with as much of the people of cook county and the state of illinois and across the country the results of the program and figure out how we can invest in more of our residents, 3250 folks out of 233,000 applicants, how we can invest in more of our residents and make these programs larger. host: our guest is the cochair of counties for guaranteed income and the president of cook county board of commissioners in illinois. toni preckwinkle joining us for

this conversation. thank you for your time. guest: thank you. host: coming up we hear in a discussion looking at spending and the incoming debt ceiling debate. ♪ >> there are lots of places to get political information, but only c-span the you get it straight from the source. no matter where you are from, or where you stand on the issues, c-span is america's network, unfiltered, unbiased, word for word. if it happens here, here, or anywhere that matters, america's

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>> historian robert has been writing about foreign affairs for most of his 64 years. the first book in his plan trilogy on the american foreign policy was published in 2000 six and focus on u.s. history before the founding of the spanish-american war. a senior fellow at the barking institution i just completed the second book titled the ghost at the feast. america and the collapse of world order 1900-1941. he writes in conclusion america's have complex attitudes towards power and morality. they have a sense of distinctiveness and remoteness in a highly contested ecosystem. >> robert kagan on this episode of book notes plus. book notes plus is available c-span now app over every you

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centered even though this town is not focus on these issues. we are funded privately from people across this country who care passionately about the direction of the country. host: close the approach to debt limit discussions? guest: debt limits for something the last administration needs to get across the finish line. and we are dealing with a divided government, how do you do -- get through to put those things back? host: where in a divided government now. we offer a rock -- an op-ed. guest: i'm looking at the last 30 years and i think we have been in a strategic cul-de-sac for people like me who call themselves for school and we have not gotten any spending cuts, no savings since 1997

balanced budget act. and that's what i want to change. i want to change the paradigms of people like me who wake up in the morning concerned about the debt. all they care about our two programs, social security and medicare. if you do not have a cut in one of those programs, you have not done anything for fiscal responsibility yet there is choice of dollars in non-discretionary spending weaponize democracy that i can talk about that i think is far easier to cut because congress votes on it every year and it is the kind of stuff the american people see in their lives. it is not something as hard to tackle as mandatory spending. we need to tackle mandatory spending as well and have -- 6 trillion in savings based on changes we had in trump budget that are not social security and medicare retirement benefits. there is a way a way to tackle .

start with nondefense discretionary and go after the easier wealth or types -- welfare types and you be on the road to balance. the debt ceiling is historically ready debt limits conversations occur. whether that is the bca, it is an opportunity. if you increase the nation's credit limit, you have to have a conversation about how your spending the money so you do not go on as you have before. host: some agreement cannot be reached, what is your level of concern? guest: overblown. there is no scenario and the treasury department would not admit this but no scenario where the ball is an option. no secretary of treasury will allow it to happen. unlike a government shutdown, debt limit you have revenue coming in. you have revenue, you do not have enough obligations for that particular month. you can pay the current revenues coming in, all the interest and

principal needed, to satisfy what is required for those who about u.s. treasuries. this ib eight extends to every single -- does that mean it extends every single payment the nih has made, no. that's not the same thing. that is not default. dennis was -- that is what is critical for congress to put it on the treasury department to say, let's be clear, you are never going to allow it to the ball and we know you have plans in place you have developed to make sure payments are prioritized, to make sure things are getting paid. host: why are you comfortable going to the defense department budget where public would not share that same sentiment? guest: we have had healthy increases over the last several years. president trump was a part of the spending increases they had a massive increase in the last

year and there are waste at the apartment of the fence. there's an overblown level of commitment that are based on overseas requirements that i think we need to have a conversation about. we are spending an inordinate amount of money in the war in ukraine. there is all sorts of things we can cycle within the department of defense, woke spending, lgbtq inclusion, diversity training is heat department of defense, not focus on the key things like naval modularization, space force. we put out a budget that funds all the capabilities we need and we would have shown a 2% cut compared to where it last year spending came in. i think you can more than pay for legality is gone national

security and yet either be pulled back or some ways of constructing the cap. host: our guest is with us until about 9:30 a.m. if you want to ask questions about issues of spending. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. you can text us at 202-748-8003. host: you said this a couple of times, woke. what does that mean to you? guest: any effort by the american bureaucracy to divide america on the base of identity, race, anything that is not unite them on a shared base as american. a says that the american founding is flawed -- it is a sense that the american founding is flawed that we are unequal

opposed to being equal. it is not something that is just burning in our schools and universities. it is being funded by the federal government. you have this for you are having foreign aid going to spit on lgbtq activist in senegal, gay pride events in prague, crt funded by the department of education so university of texas get $1.5 million for teachers, not improve how they teach math, but crt. nonprofits in illinois and rhode island being constructed on how to center their classrooms around equity. that's what i mean by woke. it is not just about the department of education. it is everywhere. the department of agriculture talking about food justice and systemic inequities in food system. as you start to delve into the details of these agencies, you realize it is not just big

government, like i was say the bill clinton administration was is possible for. this is a new type of government that is woke. the dollars are being spent not just the have environmental cleanup. we see that in the situation in ohio, but talk about environments of justice and it is also weaponize. these are the same agency is going after american people. the epa that puts 75-year-old veteran in jail for 18 months for building ponds on his ranch to fight wildfires. you go agency by agency and uc more of a track record by woke at weaponize bureaucracy. host: as far as the basis, where you finding this information and why should people trust you? guest: track record, program by program, find what they're spending money on. these are all out in public

spear and he put them altogether and you have a very coherent incredible case for the american people. host: if you're interested binding our guest work, their website where they have a listing of the budget of these programs that he talks about. you asked him about it as well. let's start with jim in vegas built -- your own, go ahead. caller: good morning. i want to ask you two questions. one deals with your website for the center for renewed america. you make the claim that voter fraud, a permanent feature of elections, i was curious, for you have information a substantial voter fraud that has influence an election whether presidential or down to a dogcatcher? the other thing that i have for

you, i was curious as to why you think, kevin mccarthy has the votes and the skills to raise the debt ceiling when everyone including rumored former congressman bill thomas does not believe he has the votes and skills to do so and that we are destined for the first default in this nation's history. guest: great questions. as you may know, i was a strong critic against speaker mccarthy. i called for a board paradigm shifting speaker and if we did not get that a board paradigm result and we got that. as a result because of the way kevin mccarthy has decentralized the house towards broader scope of his members, we have a chance to have him be a historic speaker. i have high hopes for him. i think the reason why mccarthy and previous leaders have failed as they have tried shiny object

and manage the members away from what they came to do as opposed to saying, what are strategic policy objectives? how do we accomplish that and how do we manage the risk to do that? that's what i see them doing right now. you've heard them say what is not the ask on the debt limit which is social security and medicare. you have a president say that is not true. which you have not heard them say what we are fighting for. they will do that and that will help define the next five years -- five months. my hope is they would do that on the base of battling the bureaucracy, woke at weaponize bureaucracy, and i think he was see that in the coming weeks and months. as it pertains to voter integrity and election fraud, i'm looking at election after election for you have what i will call systemic voter fraud in this is that the structures in place at the state level and

local level is designed to have voter fraud. mail-in voting, you have noticed -- judges who have the ability to throw out the laws in that area and make things up and override the states and statues put in place. the last two elections, we had massive amount of private spending that went to privatize into the hands of one party how the elections were being run. we would never allow the referees to be paid by one particular football team yet that's what we had in the run-up to the last presidential election. systemic voter fraud at that level is something we have drawn attention to. host: democrats line from vermont, this is timothy. caller: good morning.

first of all, these acronyms, the wilkes -- wokes that is bollix. crt, i guess it means critical race theory, it is nothing except that of which is taught in law school. law school. you use these things to manipulate and to adjust and endeavor your view. first of all

we into them. now, regarding voter fraud, the fact of the matter is that first of all, you have 10 voter fraud with biden with 7 million votes. but guess what, clinton won by 3 million votes. therefore, is that voter fraud? guest: i want to start by agreeing with you in one aspect. entitlements are a different order of magnitude in people's expectation that they should exist, and one of the problems is that politicians, which we call a cartel have basically spent down the surplus in such a way that we don't have those trust funds solvent in those

ways. we are dealing with -- and to be clear, no one on the republican side right now is saying to cut those benefits. no one as part of the debt limit negotiation, so that is important to say. that pertains to critical race theory -- i would say there are extensive examples throughout the country, and i want to give you one example from california, san jose. third-graders are being taught how to rank themselves according to power and privilege and then to be able to plot themselves on a classroom board according to power and privilege. that is a third grader -- one of my daughter's age. they are being taught with crt looks like. will they ever hear the words crt? they will not. but they will know that there is something wrong with them based on the color of their skin. that is what is wrong in this country. that is un-american.

that gets to the heart of what it means to be woke. host: in maryland, john, independent. caller: going back to the woke is him -- wokeness. working with the environment, the amount of time that is spent on woke training, if it even comes up might be 30 to 40 minutes of powerpoint. the rest of the time is focused on mission and legality. it is a small and insignificant portion, if anything, that takes place. and to further it, just to say that if anyone bring something to the table in terms of their diversity and background, the level of variety in their ideas that they're using. at the end of the day, if someone's race or gender -- it is not defined their job. but having a shared

understanding of someone's background or beliefs and whatnot, that certainly doesn't hurt, and is -- if it is only 30 minutes out of the day out of eight or 10 hours, it does make a difference. guest: i disagree. who is doing the training who is funding the training. if this was just about the word diversity and ensuring that americans of all different backgrounds and creeds were coming to work at the department of defense, you would have no issue from me. the issue is that diversity, inclusion and equity are technical terms that mean crt. my job at the office of management and budget was to root out these types of crt trainings, and you had to focus on the technical terms that would be used by the bureaucracy. i think if there is a 30 minute. , that is a 30 minute. that is not focused on defeating our enemies and dealing with the

strategic threats to our country. for the office of management and budget, i would ask for them to send plans to the extent that is needed to combat china, and you know what? i did not get those plans. i got bureaucracy. bureaucracy has lost focus by focusing on things that are not where the threat is in this country. we are a great country. we have as much opportunity, and we are able to grow and get better each and every year. i find these trainings lead us in the opposite direction. host: we will look at the justice department, and one of the things you called your change in is the office of justice itself. tell what the purposes and why? guest: they have a lot of spending programs.

most people think justice is predominantly the fbi. there are grant programs to state and locality. there is a lot of waste, but there are things that are worse than waste. there are a community relations services that really do a grassroots activity with some of the hotspots of individuals who are carrying -- caring about racism and turning that into the types of things we see in ferguson and other places. you have the federal government actually funding the grassroot tension in the country. that is an example to get rid of. host: you also have the s aae p program. guest: that is a transfer to states that are often sanctuary states to give them funding for dealing with illegal immigration. they are not doing anything for

illegal immigration. they are taking the money and applying that to general services, even though cities have acted in a position against the federal government to say they are going to ignore the law and act as sanctuary cities. host: diane in jacksonville, republican. caller: good morning. i just want to ask the gentleman -- i live here in florida, where mike governor has made me as a black person feel like i don't belong. even though i am a republican. i'd like to know why they keep saying critical race theory is being taught in the schools. it is not. i worked and retired from the school board for 20 some years, and not once did we teach anything resembling critical

race theory in the schools. to me, i respect your guests, but he is putting out so much negativity about what is going on, in our government. this government makes people more divided. everything he is saying went on in every administration. this is nothing new under the biden administration. host: thank you, caller. guest: i love the spirit of the caller. an individual in schools for 20 years may not see what we are seeing currently. the mother was a first-rate schoolteacher for many years. she taught kids how to read. the notion of crt would be totally foreign to her. that is something that is new and has come from the law school

, but what we are seeing, in an example i told you about in the san jose elementary school, it is not meant to divide people on race. it is to say let's stop dividing people on the basis of race. that is not the america we want. that is not the america that was set forth in our founding documents. people should not say, she is talking about crt. as a result, i don't feel welcome and in the republican party. it is the opposite. we are trying to stand on the basis of what is american and what is not, and we will not stand for federal tax dollars being used to divide people based on race and identity. host: overall, what would you say the trump administration's record was with budget matters and fiscal matters? guest: i want to remind people, we put forward more spending cuts and reforms -- trillions of dollars every year, with the exception of one. we put those to congress and they were largely ignored by the

cartel in congress. i wish our record was better. i wish it was better. but we were putting forward on behalf of the president, spending cuts necessary to get our house in balance. we had to deal with the pandemic, a once in the century shock to the system. i don't recall democrats voting against the bills needed to address the fact that bureaucrats were logging down the country. we were putting forward plans to deal with that and deficit. i wish we made more progress, but part of the reason we didn't make more progress was the paradigm i was addressing and the budget we put forward. there is a lack of desire to go after the low hanging fruit that is easiest to cut. host: the president mentioned deficit increases during the state of the union. i want to play portion of that. pres. biden: the last two years,

my administration cut the deficit by $1.7 trillion. the largest deficit reduction in america. under the previous administration, the american deficit went up four years in a row. those record deficits -- no president added more to the national debt and any for years then my predecessor. nearly 25% of the entire national debt that took over 200 years to accumulate was added by one administration alone -- the last one. that is a fact. check it out. check it out. how did congress respond to that debt? they did the right thing. they lifted the debt ceiling three times without crisis. they paid american bills. they prevented an economic disaster in the country. i am asking this congress to follow suit.

commit here to the full faith and credit of the united states so that it will never be questioned. guest: largely divorced of any context. in misses the fact that a pandemic occurred, and the fact that once you have a higher level of spending to deal with that, when you come down from that high, you are going to reduce the deficit, but that is not a result of anything the biden administration it done. they worsened it to the tune of $4 trillion of additional spending, so if you look at where we were baseline deficits, going the next 10 years we left office, they were actually dollars every year. that is why we had a plan to balance intent. this administration has turned that into 1.4 or 1.5 trillion every year. they have added to the problem and they have put themselves on a trajectory that is totally unsustainable. largely, lacking in the contacts

from major real-world examples that is covid. it would be like not accounting for award to determine the fiscal record. they are worsening the deficit, they are worsening debt, and they are coming to congress very early already to have another hike in the debt limit. all were saying is that there was a republican congress that was elected to deal with inflation. there going to have a tested way to deal with that using the debt limit. host: democrats say that tax cuts contribute to deficits. guest: you cannot balance the budget and deal with the deficit if the economy is not growing. you have to have a short-term hit to be able to have the investments to grow. before the pandemic, tax cuts would have paid for themselves, and if they are extended, they will pay for themselves. that is not the issue. the issue is the pandemic and the fact that congress would not accept the spending cuts. host: andy is in indiana,

republican line. go ahead. caller: i want to make a comment , and i think he's doing a great job and to keep going. god, family, country. i am a veteran and i think biden has divided this country more than any president we've ever had. guest: great comment. thank you. one of the things he did, the biden administration, the first thing they did was take my office which had a hand in every regulatory spending decision and say that every decision had to be done through the filter of equity. that is what we are talking about crt. that is what we are getting at. it's not about equality under the law. it's about making sure there is an equality of outcome. that was one of the first decisions the biden demonstration did, and that was the point you made in providing the evidence for how he intends to divide americans, and it is

so crucial for us to go after that bureaucracy that is engaged on a day in and day out basis. host: keith, toledo, ohio, independent. go ahead. caller: we are on a couple different things here. first, the history part. there's only so much time you can teach history. they are going to teach that, but maybe add an extra class. i don't know. but the spending and revenue are simple. revenue spending, they should get more revenue, and less spending at the same time. they give about $500 billion because we are financing a thousand billion for the last 25 years. there you go. guest: i love the notion that the american people bring to our spending conversations. if we had more of a sense of how families do their budget, which is look at revenue, look what they are spending, and a line

that, we would be in a better situation. one of the things we have not had, with the family looking at the budget, we look at discretionary spending, entertainment, and going out to eat. and make progress and they go after what i would call the immovable. their version of entitlements -- mortgage, the 529, the kids college account. the government needs to act on the basis of common sense with progress. that is for another 30 years of inflation. host: numbers coming out recently. in addition of 6% overall. that is an overall change of 0.5. what do you think of those numbers in light of inflation, as far as the united states, fiscally. guest: inflation continues to endure, for those who allow the fed to pivot. i don't if they are getting that.

another aspect is the ongoing nature of how long housing increases are going to lag into the numbers we are seeing. inflation will continue to be a problem throughout the year. what is necessary is to stop adding to the federal reserve's and combat it. policymakers on the hill have an opportunity to pump the brakes when it comes to spending. they can make the job less steep than it is. host: i don't know if you run in the same circles, but there is news that bill brainard will head to the national economic council. guest: i'm not sure that means too much. you have ideological commitment to a certain set of policies. the difference between those is not that persuasive. it is more churn at the fed. we just went through a confirmation, so i'll be interested to see if there is an

inflation hawk that gets nominated for her position to replace her. but in terms of moving the chairs, i don't think it will make difference. host: calm -- conrad, democrat. hello. caller: first of all, critical race theory -- all that is is teaching the history of how race and racism was at the beginning of this country. the fact of the matter is, it has nothing to do with making white kids feel bad or making black kids feel bad. what it is, race theory played a part in making this country, and if you don't believe that, you have your head in the sand. now, on the issue of equity, it just means that everyone has the opportunity to move forward. when you come on television,

saying critical race theory is trying to make children feel bad, that is a caricature of what it is about. it is just teaching about the history of this country. does this country have a beautiful pass? yes. the declaration of independence, the constitution, but it also is an ugly past as well. people like myself at the founding of the country were only considered three fits of a person. what happen with the native americans, the trail of tears, this has to do with the founding of this country, it has to do with this country. it is about addressing that. as far as spending goes, the former administration, like president biden said, did more spending and it's four years than the previous 44 presidents put together. thank you. host: thank you. guest: thank you for the comment. this has nothing to do with not

teaching the history of racism and the structure we had at times in this country. that needs to continue. if you look at the bills being passed in states, it doesn't do any of those things. all they do is say certain concepts of treating individuals differently on the color of their skin -- it nothing to do with saying that history cannot be taught accurately. my mother participated in the civil rights movement. that is part of who i am and who my family is. but our impartial of that civil rights movement is to recognize that -- what that they were fighting for. it was to ensure that we didn't treat people on the basis of the color of their skin, and crt is a movement in reaction to the civil rights movement saying that we don't like the direction

of that movement. we want a different approach that allows us to entrench these policies in a particular way. that is why we fight so much against critical race theory and will continue to do so. host: as far as spending proposals, the root -- proposals from republicans about discretiony ograms -- when it comes to social security and medicare is upsetting. what do you think of the concept? guest: no one is talking about suspending social security and medicare. the president has taken the smallest aspect and implication of a general notion of something to check into programs, but no one is talking about that at all. it is an example of the strategic incoherence of the biden administration. they do not understand the moment we are, and we have to twist proposals in conjunction with senate republicans to say that it would have an impact and

it did. host: like rick scott. it's his proposal. guest: it is not mentioned in his proposal about sun setting in general. he's not talking about sunsetting social security and medicare. no one in the debt limit construct is looking at limiting or changing or reforming social security and medicare. i think what you will see is people fighting on discretionary spending, putting in new caps that force this conversation each and every year, and learning from the last 10 years where you are allowed defense and nondefense to compete with each other, which is what they should do, but to just be on autopilot for each other's projections. you will see changes from what we've seen in the past, but largely, there will be a fight on discretionary spending. >> with social security and medicare, there is also a possibility of reform efforts

for these programs, or at least if you believe that's the case. guest: you don't need to reform social security and medicare benefits to be able to get the balance. to those programs need long-term reform? yes they do. but it is important to think strategically about the budget and what is necessary for balance to be able to get some wins. the budget we put forward allows $9 trillion in cut savings without touching the benefits. my hope, and the parameters for what they agreed and the powers and the powers in agreement envision a serious budget which they would put on the floor. a 10 year balanced budget that does not go after those beneficiaries of those programs. host: patricia, republican, arkansas. go ahead. caller: i wanted to say that the most pervasive influence in our politics is money. so many shady figures were

permitted to spend money on those causes, which does not have your best interest in mind. it never does. especially a union buster who is on a board and shouldn't be. host: that argument doesn't affect anything we do on the toil board read will leave it at that. then in illinois -- in in illinois. caller: the world doesn't turn on what i think. unfortunately, you have to ask yourself, how the heck did we get here? you made a comment about florida. the document we live by, it is almost 300 years old. others refer to as being a gospel. in fact, it was never implied to be and never will be. the comment by that lady, it shows proof about where we are

and have been. you're talking to somebody who's never been in debt of any kind and never had credit card debt. came from an upper whittle class mexican family in the 50's and 1960's when they were confined to doing gardening work. i understand the system. i am a former soldier and retired police officer. i've done my time. you need to get out of your office and start seeing how people live in your so-called reform of social security. go ahead. west virginia, alabama, arkansas, you tell me how many you get from those states. guest: thank you for your service. i am not pushing for republicans or the current officeholder to reform social security. i am pushing them to go after the bureaucracy that is aimed at you. i look at the environmental protection agency. i look at the fact that they have the ability to just go into

a community and declare that there has been an improper conversion of wetlands, and to put $75,000 on a daily rate and say you have not been able to build a house, and not give them the ability to appeal that decision and say they can't go to court. that is not fair in america. the and of labor has a consignment business. the business model you have created to allow volunteers to come up and do a little bit of work and to be able to earn certain discounts is bill included under the labor and standards act. we are going to put your business model out of business. that is against the american people. every single agency, one after another, you see what i call weaponized behavior that is not just them enforcing the law or executing the law, but has an intent to it to be able to put

these individuals and families out of business, and that is the bureaucracy. that is what needs to be defunded. host: america renewing.com. the center for renewing america. you also served in the trump administration. thank you for your time. we will finish the program with open forum, and if you want to call and participate, (202) 748-8001 for republicans. (202) 748-8002 for democrats. (202) 748-8000 for independents. we will take those calls. ♪ >> c-span now, the free mobile app, providing an unfiltered view of what is happening in washington. live and on demand. keep up to date with floor proceedings and hearings from u.s. congress. white house events, campaigns,

and more from the world of politics. all at your fingertips. stay current with the latest episodes of washington journal and with scheduling information on c-span radio with a variety of compelling comments. download for free today from apple store or google play. a front row seat to washington, anytime, anywhere. robert kagan has been writing about foreign affairs for 64 years. the first book in a planned trilogy on american foreign policy was published in 2006 and focused on u.s. history before the founding of the spanish-american war. kagan, a senior fellow at the brookings institute has for -- completed his second book of the trilogy. america and the collapse of

world order, 1900 to 1941. robert kagan, in conclusion, writes that americans have complex attitudes to power, reality. they have a sense of distinctiveness and remoteness, and a tumultuous and highly contested political system. >> robert kagan on book notes. book notes plus is available on the podcast. >> all this week on 7:00 p.m., c-span is featuring an encore presentation of q and a, are hour-long interview with nonfiction writers, journalists and historians. an author talks about a 3000 mile journey made when he was nine years old. he reunite with his parents.

tonight at seven eastern on c-span q and a. you can listen to q&a on all of our podcast at the free c-span now app. >> washington journal continues. host: if you want to text us during open forum, you can do so at this number. you can also visit c-span on twitter or facebook. the san diego union tribune and other papers from california are highlighting yesterday's announcement that california senator dianne feinstein is making it official that she will retire at the end of her current term of congress which kicks off . chuck schumer talked about the announcement, and her impact on the senate. >> she is a legend. a legend in california and the first woman senator. a legend in the senate.

she was a leader on so many different issues. environment, women's rights and so much else. she approached everything studiously and carefully. she had passion that accompanied her knowledge of the facts. she was able to convince people on both sides of the aisle to go along with her on issues after issues. i first got to know her when she carried in assault weapons bill in the senate. i was a congress member and they carried in the house. the guidance she gave of how to get it through the house and the help and lobbying was just incredible. she is an amazing person. she spoke at our caucus. she gave a very heartwarming cheery address because she talked about her husband and how she still regretted his loss. he was her true partner. we all knew them and loved him as well. she got a standing ovation that

lasted minutes and minutes. that shows the love art country and caucus has for this wonderful leader and legend. host: more of that at our website, c-span.org, and you can watch on our app at c-span now. the new york times this morning -- when it comes to recent object being shot down, the spokesman for the national security council says that investing years have not found any evidence that these objects were connect did the chinese balloon surveillance efforts similar to the blue shutdown earlier this month. there is nothing to suggest that these objects were part of an intelligence collection effort. there is no indication that points to the idea that these objects were part of a spy

program or they were definitively involved in a external intelligence collection effort. starting us off on open forum is david, democrat from new york. caller: i would like to say, critical race theory is not taught in schools. my brother's wife is a teacher. host: ok. we'll move on to alan in wisconsin, republican. caller: hello. thank you, c-span. your informing americans -- i want to comment on the train because my father was a locomotive engineer. they come with black boxes and recorders in the history of maintenance.

axles, wearing on the wheels, track expections -- inspections. i want to comment on the influx of immigrants. pedro, we only have so much resources for food. i want to thank you sincerely. you have changed over the years, and god bless you. host: in florida, independent. good morning. amelia. caller: with medicare and social security, we have to remember how much to protect american safety for existential threats. [indiscernible] this makes c-span look bad by association. host: this doesn't affect our editorial content for this network. we'll go to woodbridge, hello.

caller: i was just going to say on the topic of crt, a previous guess was saying how crt -- he wants to change history and they are not going to exclude history, and i want to say how that is incorrect. banning books for children that have to do with any mention of race or mention of the civil rights movement, anything like that. they are banning those books. there is an example of, i believe there was a high school in alabama where students for black history month, they were doing -- they were forbidden from doing anything that talks about -- prior to 1970. slavery and civil rights. they are forbidden from doing anything like that. that is what i want to point out in contrast to what people are trying to say. host: dallas texas, republican, harvey. caller: thank you for taking my

call. my question is for you. as far c-span c-span is concerned, are the calls on the respective lines recorded? host: not as far as i know, aside from recording the program. that is how they get recorded. you can look at the calls later on on our website or app. caller: the reason i am asking is because we talk about division in the country. this format creates that division. you: as republican, democrat or independent, but there are other issues and things like that. so instead of putting identity on there, creating that format, i wish you would go to neutral because what is going on in the country, the weaponization, these questions could be gathered and used for government intake -- interrogation to a party or affiliated with. host: that is not going to be the case, and if you watch this

program for any length of time, the only put a clinician's -- bottom-line, political, nestle political, and sometimes we go regional or have specialized lines depending on the segment. if you watch the long. of this program, you will know that by party, that is something we do for many years. let's go to pat in colorado, independent. caller: good morning. how are you? host: i am well. caller: i have a couple of issues i want to talk about. they are interrelated. the gentleman you just had on took great exception to the concept of equity. my view is that the equity we all share is the right to vote. voter fraud that takes place in this country is in fact voter suppression.

living in colorado, we have about 25% of the people registered as democrat, about 25% of the people registered as republican. and 45% of the people are registered as independent. for the last 20 years, [indiscernible] we have had drop boxes. when you take a look at how many people actually voted in that might reelection, it turns out that the majority of people, the highest percentage of registered voters was in colorado. those are the two states. blue states. if you look at how many people are actually registered, by state, you will note that the blue states have more registered voters. host: richard in california,

democrat. hello. caller: i just wanted to comment about your last guest and how he was speaking about representing the republican administration with crt, etc.. i would comment that i heard him used award many times. i never heard him use the word negotiate. i believe that is what is wrong with the republican party. i used to vote republican and i voted for ronald reagan and richard nixon. i am 75 years old and i live across the street from cap pendleton in southern california. those guys know how to fight. some of my friends, many of them are marines former or still. 15 to 20 different kinds of greens. they never say fight. they always say kind things.

they don't talk about fighting. the sky only talks about fighting. we need to start negotiating. host: richard in california. politico reports that the biden administration unveiled moves wednesday with an examination of vehicle chargers, including opening up proprietary stations for cars and trucks. the upgrade will allow tesla to build a national network of 5000 chargers, despite two years of on and off tension between jan lum mosque -- elon musk and joe biden. the white house is aiming to hundreds of new chargers on the road. if you go to the detroit free press, the ford f-150 lightning was not being built at a site near dearborn because production has stopped while engineers are trying to figure out what is

causing a battery problem. a spokeswoman confirmed to the destroyed -- to the detroit free press that the high-profile vehicle has been out of production for a week as they try to figure out the issue. she declined to discuss the battery matter in detail. the vehicle has stopped its shipping. also, if you go to the website, it also reports that the european union, formerly deciding to ban gas sales as they try to make a transition to electrical vehicles. this year from steven in illinois, republican. -- let's hear from stephen in illinois. caller: i want to make a comment on the train accident in ohio. our transportation secretary should be fired immediately. our president should come out and make a statement, instead of

hiding in the midst of the white house. every time something happens, he goes and hides. that's all i wanted to say. thank you for giving me the time. host: rhode island, independent line. mary. caller: hello. following the january 6 insurrection, there was someone being sent to jail, and i think our justice system was holding those people accountable. we also need to hold others accountable who felt sympathy for the instruction. alan blocks to be removed from the board of directors for trying to him for it -- influence the newspapers covering this event. host: richard is next in missouri. democrat. caller: two things. the one i missed on medicare, we paid for medicare. [indiscernible]

they pay pretty good prices. we pay $600 a month. about banning books. why don't we and guns. guns kill people. no one has been shot by a book. that's a matter of freedom of speech. thank you. host: that is richard in missouri. usa today reports that one in 10 new drugs were cleared by regulators based on studies that didn't achieve their main goals. that is according to a new study from harvard and yale researchers. 210 new therapies approved by the fda from 2018 to 2021, 21 drugs were based on studies that had one or more goals or endpoints that weren't achieved it those drugs were approved to treat cancer, alzheimer's and other diseases. researchers said the findings were a reflection of whether the drug approval lacked transparency about some product

safety and effectiveness. more on that if you want to visit usa today's website and read that for yourself. charlie in new castle, pennsylvania, republican. caller: how are you? i want to talk about the republican party. [indiscernible] senior party officials need to step up. there is division in the organization, and that can only be blamed on the lack of leadership at the top. just like in pittsburgh, where allen block sits on the c-span board of directors, and he is making his newspaper workers sit on strike. he should be removed based on judges orders. host: maryland, south carolina, republican line. caller: i want to talk about journalistic integrity, and how c-span is one of the loan trustworthy sources in the media right now. i listen and hear so many

different points of view. it is a beacon on the hill. why is allen block firing his own journalists? that's all i have. host: let's go back to this idea that what many of you as far as this: campaign are concerned. as far as mr. bloch is concerned, it does not affect our editorial programming, and the fact that you hear from a lot of different viewpoints on this network and on this program goes to that end. i will go to zach in san francisco. democrat. hello. caller: how's it going? i want to talk about the 2024 election. it is a competitive election. i really appreciate senator feinstein's work. [indiscernible] i think he's brilliant and he did a fine job during the

impeachments. i think he will be fine. i am a gen z voter. you probably don't get a lot of them. i'm supporting biden to run again at this point. i think he is been a pretty good president and i think he is the strongest chance of beating a republican challenger at this point, but i really like gretchen whitmer as well. i'd like to see her run if biden decides not to. host: is your support for adam schiff based on the idea of impeachment or are there other factors there? caller: he is very well spoken and i think that he's got the support of the big hitters in the democratic party, so it wouldn't be a very nasty fight. he really stepped up during the impeachment, and that is why he's got my vote.

host: zach in san francisco. the announcement by dented -- senator feinstein yesterday prayed we will hear more on the senate side going forward. stay close to c-span as we go forward. nikki haley will annoceater today her desire to become president of the unid ates. that will be at 11:00. you can see that on c-span, c-span now and c-span.org as well if you want to see it there. karen in pennsylvania, republican. hello. caller: first is the caller in rhode island his book about insurrection on january 6. unelected bureaucrats run the justice department and the fbi. as well as the irs, going after the service. trump supporters with unequal justice are highly apparent among anyone who has common sense.

likewise, unequal coverage of reality of truth, and i am a republican committee person here in central pennsylvania. overwhelming victory for trump and all of these areas because there was no cheating or recount votes. in a frank and honest manner. the recount is necessary. unfortunately, philadelphia and pittsburgh and ear and desk area and allentown are where elections are stolen in the state it repeatedly. it is a tragedy. at 10:00 in the evening on the night of the 2020 election, trump was ahead by a minimum of 650,000 votes. they stopped counting thereafter. they began counting at 3:30 a.m. in a back alley way. [indiscernible] host: what do you base this on?

caller: truth. host: what is the source of truth? caller: fax. i saw this firsthand. host: you saw this firsthand? use all of these things you are describing firsthand? caller: on tv. i witnessed it. it was covered on fox in particular. they showed them backing up that night, and giuliani was prevented, and his cohorts who were there as election observers were ousted from even witnessing the counting. host: will go to david in california, independent. caller: host: he hung up. let's hear from the democrats line in cincinnati, ohio. good morning. caller: good morning. i love c-span. i watch it all of the time.

i will speak briefly on crt. up call activist -- a political activist i love, toni morrison, who won the pole surprise was removed from the curriculum because it gave nightmares to her adolescent son. this mother argued it was better to suppress this story she called a woke story of a woman who fled slavery and kill their own child rather than subject or child to her experiences in slavery. the problem, this is what i'm getting at, the problem of whitewashing history is that it leaves no meaningful context. there is no meaningful context for understanding political behavior. a good example of that is january 6. that is mike comment on crt.

it's a big issue and they need to stop whitewashing history and tell the truth about what happened in this country. host: do you think the truth is you are describing is not taught ? caller: where i grew up, i remember hearing about w.e.b. dubois, george washington carver and booker t. washington. that was pretty much it. in terms of black history when i was growing up. i'm almost 70 now. this is what they are doing now. they are trying to eliminate completely -- and i'm not sure what they are teaching. it was supposed be a high level, college-level course, but i think that it's probably not a good idea. we need to teach people about the history of this country and african american history. you don't need to wait until

they are in college. we need to learn early on because that is how you are raise. host: you don't think those things should be examined as people take high school or middle school history when it comes to african-american history? caller: when you save those things, i don't know if it is completely -- they don't give a comprehensive view of things. they are not showing the good and the bad. the things that african americans deadline grew up which were on a positive side. the things we need to talk about. i always said this, but even back then, it was too inflammatory. history teachers -- i only have or had an african-american history teacher, but they didn't want to get into the language of

the history because of the inflammatory nature of it, and that's when it should be. that is right around here what they're trying to say this is not -- they talk about wokeness, but critical race theory is just what it is. history of this country in terms of how black people are memorialized. host: that is will in cincinnati. we have about 10 minutes left our program before -- for purchase meeting and open forum. you can also post on social media. i want to show you this from the association of counties. a lot of topics are being brought up, and one of this acres was president biden. he took some time to talk about a mass shooting at michigan state university. here is from the speech yesterday. pres. biden: three lives have been lost, and five have

seriously been injured. it is a nightmare happening far too often in this country. far too often. as we gather more information, there is one thing we know to be true. we have to do something to stop gun violence from being a part of our communities. [applause] today marks five years to the day that 14 students and three educators lost their lives in the department of florida. everyone of those families, i met and spent time with. a lot of you hear confront violence every day. we took a big step towards passing significant gun legislation. ghost guns, background checks, but there's more work to do. i am committing to get it done with all of you. host: that was the president

from yesterday, and he took -- travels to maryland this afternoon. you can see his comments at 2:30 p.m.. they are on our website at c-span.org, and you can also follow along on our app on c-span now. connor in ohio, republican line. you're on. caller: good morning. i just wanted to comment on ending the covid-19 emergency. i wonder what the impact will be. [indiscernible] sometimes i think we have things we don't like because of the pressure from outside sources. c-span should really interests relationship with alan block. he is violating a judges order to follow the law.

thank you. host: paul in iowa, independent. caller: hello. i would like to comment on nikki haley entering the race. i used to be a democrat, but their policies left me. i will be happy with nikki haley. i also like ron desantis. i never was a supporter of donald trump. i just don't like the way he talks a lot of times, and the democrats will never leave them alone. i think we need somebody -- ron desantis would be great. nikki haley would be as well. i would be happy with the governor of south dakota. host: what sets them apart from previous presidents?

caller: nikki haley, i love the way she was working at the u.n.. i think she was the best ambassador we ever had. she doesn't take any crab. she's not afraid to tell them what she thinks, and put them in their place. that's what i like about desantis. and who was it that -- south dakota. i like her attitude as well. she lays everything on the table and calls people out when they need to be. she's basically -- i don't think they would support the woke agenda. that is totally wrong. we need to stop that. that's not good for the country or the future. host: will go to, in kentucky,

democrat. caller: i would just like to comment -- it seems like to me that the publicans don't debate with anybody. all they talk about is phones. nikki haley, she wears high heels on people. she's got her high heels ready. look at how she talked about russia from her back porch. everything we talk about is nonsense. they don't bait. i worked all of my life in the coal mines. i spent three years in the military. i work from the time i was 11 all the way until i got colon cancer and everything that's wrong with me. [indiscernible] talking about taxes and all of this -- the way i see it, i pay

taxes more than trump did. i paid over $700 just working in the coal mines. how did he get by paying that much. host: tommy in kentucky -- i think sarah palin was a reference to a saturday night live sketch rather than the previous governor or. let's hear from patty in connecticut. hello. caller: hello, good morning. i would just like to mention, it's kind of sad in this country that all of a sudden, florida wants to push through people being able to carry concealed weapons without training or a permit. don't we have enough gun violence? the republicans, they all want

to be able to carry guns on the senate and congress for now. it is outrageous. they are showing how ignorant they are to gun violence in this country and they will not vote to ban assault weapons. i live right next to newtown, and connecticut. there is an article in our paper today about a girl that attends michigan state now, and she was in newtown. it is kind of sad that she has to relive newtown all over again. just going to college, 10 years later. people have no idea how dangerous guns are.

my brother and father were both hunters. we had guns in the house, but they use a hunting rifle. host: sorry to stop you there, but were about out of time for the program. for the rest of the callers during the course of this hour, thank you for participating. if you're interested in budget matters, the congressional budget office director will later on today talk about the budget and economic outlook. if you're interested in following along and learning about that, c-span is where to watch. visit c-span.org. that is it for our program. washington journal comes your way. will be seeing you then. ♪

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