>> coming up, after a look at the news and phone calls, washington examiner samantha joe roth and nicholas wu join us to discuss campaign 2024. review upcoming congressional spending deadlines. then plan to cancel -- atlantic cancel john herbst discusses the latest of ukraine and russia. "washington journal" starts now. ♪ host: good morning. three hour "washington journal" is ahead for you.

we talk about campaign 2024 and the latest on ukraine. but with 435 days to go till america decides who occupy the white house, we want to know who is your favorite american president and why. give us a call on the phone lines split by political party. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. you can text us at 202-748-8003. please include your name and where you are from. catch up with us on social media. on x,@cspanwj. facebook.com/c-span. one of the reasons that we are asking this question this morning stems from an exchange that took place last week during that gop presidential debate. when chris chris -- chris

christie and vivek ramaswamy were discussing donald trump's legacy. [video clip] >> whether or not you believe the criminal charges are right or wrong, the conduct is beneath the office of president of u.s. this is the great thing about this country, booing is allowed, but it does not change the truth. it does not change the truth. >> you raise your hand. >> let's speak the truth. president trump believed was the best president of the 21st-century. host: vivek ramaswamy calling donald trump one of the best presidents of the 21st-century. we ask you who is your

favorite president and why. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. from the pew research center last week, looking at americans favorite president the last 40 years. also -- they wrote in their recent version when asked to name u.s. president less than the best job the past 40 years majority democrats named barack obama. republicans divided between ronald reagan and donald trump. four out of 10 republican leaning says reagan has done the best job, slightly fewer 37% say trump has done the best job. nearly six in 10 democrats who responded say obama has done the

best job. fewer named bill clinton or biden. that is the pew research center. we want to know who is your favorite resident and why. phone lines split by political party. we start on the line for republicans. daniel. who is your favorite president? are you with us this morning? not hearing daniel. we will go to john in palm beach gardens, florida. daniel tried to stay on the line. we will come back to you. go ahead john. caller: i am an independent and trump is the best president we have ever had because he got things done. israel is our friend. north korea is afraid of us. i rent was afraid of us.

. -- china was afraid of us. they tried to build a wall. therefore, we do not have a huge immigration and drug problem. we had no inflation. best interest rates we've ever had. plethora of reasons. host: this question often gets as and historians get pulled on c-span and has their own presidential rankings survey you can see at our website at c-span.org. historians tend to rank donald trump low in this latest survey he was ranked 41st, not too far above buchanan. why do you think historians rank him low? some like yourself

income at the very top. caller: not the normal american population. they think they are above everyone else. it is simple. host: john, thank you for the call. from florida, -- ohio, duanita. caller: for me, it is lyndon johnson. because he had only served in the senate but he knew how bring america together. he did that with the civil rights leaders. we are talking about civil rights tomorrow. the 60th anniversary of the march on washington here in bc, legacy of presidents and civil rights in this country. what do you think? caller: the saddest part is i

did not go because -- the thing is, until we get a president that is willing to open their eyes and deal with the civil rights of all people, not just black people, not just people of color, but of all people. we are lacking. host: what you are looking at their a second ago, washington post with their special section on the march on washington. a quarter million people gathered on the national mall august 28 of 1963 for the march on washington for jobs and freedom. we will talk about that tomorrow here on the "washington journal" on the actual 60th anniversary. in this morning to name your favorite american president. -- we are asking you this morning to name your favorite american president.

let us know who's your favorite and why. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. bill, norcross, georgia. independent. go ahead. caller: yes. my favorite president i think was franklin roosevelt. i think he had nicest president we ever had in that was one of the most critical times when he became president. i would say though president biden come in my opinion, has done understanding job and i will have to rank him as number two. -- has done an outstanding job and i would have to rank him as number two. donald trump is a shameful man.

people that sit important, i full sorry that not wised up. host: a lot of folks have lincoln, washington, and fdr as top. and sometimes they rotate in the c-span latest historian servant we took create end with lincoln, washington, roosevelt. the server they came out last year went roosevelt, lincoln, washington. you put biden ahead of lincoln and washington? caller: franklin roosevelt as number one we've ever had in my time. i would also add to that president biden has done a more outstanding job than i can think of any resident -- president in the near future. he has really had a lot on his plate. he has pulled us a serious crisis.

i applaud him trying to keep peace in the world and continue with domestic programs to get people back. the economy is great. i think he has done an outstanding job. agree or disagree, that is my opinion. host: this is jaden in florida, west palm beach. what do you think? caller: hi. i believe ronald reagan was the best president. host: why reagan? caller: he had a great substantial economic growth for the country. he provided with ending the cold war. he played a pivotal role. the tax cuts he provided. also lowered corporate tax rates. it is important to have an actual economy. unlike what is going on right now with bidenomics. host: what did you think about

the colleybille before you? he put president biden pretty high in his rankings. caller: yes. i completely disagree with his claims. i did not get to hear the whole call with what he said. i cannot come to an agreement with him. host: that is jaden in florida. when it comes to ronald reagan, c-span has done this historians survey four different times over the year doing it after a president leaves office, sending out this survey to well over 100 historians. these stories rank the presidents on characters of individual leaderships likability public persuasion, crisis management, economic management, moral authority. we combine those scores. ronald reagan in the latest survey rank ninth. within the top 10 and stayed around there the course of the

four surveys we have done dating back to 2000. in the year 2000, ronald reagan ranked number 11 by historians. moved up to 10 in 2009 and a state at nine the past two surveys we have done, 2021. is all available at c-span.org. we want to hear from you. who do you think is your favorite president and let us know why. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. eddie. atlanta, georgia. mccright. good morning. caller: biden is my favorite because i see he get out there when it has tragedies.

he go to the tragedies. he was good when my health care is needed to be take care of. my bank account is good. when he got in office i had $2000 when trump was in office. when he got in office my bank account is $16,000. he is doing a great job. i love him. he ain't like trump always blaming someone else for his problems. trump, i hope you never get back in office. host: you say it one the reasons you like biden, he is there when there is tragedies. i wonder your response to the fires in hawaii. the editorial from las vegas review journal, the response was not his best moment. that coming out this past week. some criticism for how long it

took him to go in the initial response. what did you think about that? caller: he went. the people going to the money. -- going to get the money. he is not stingy like trump, lying essay you going help and not help. tragedies help and all over the world. all over the u.s. it is not the time he took to go. he went anyway. everything can't be done in one day. we all know that. it is going to take money to build back all these tragedies we have. we've had so many tragedies with ukraine, all over america, different tragedies happen. it takes money. it takes time.

the man is not god. he is our president and he went. i praise him for going. especially i want to say this when desantis -- he going to come in the back. i hate white people. host: las vegas review georgia, talking about joe biden's response to the mall eat fires. this is some of what they wrote. americans come to expect leaders to visit scenes, the victims of such strategies made comfort and sympathy and the president's present signals that the nation cares about the recovery and will unite to aid in reconstruction. the maui disasters qualify as such an event but from the start the demonstrations response has been odd as a reporter asked

about the death toll responded with a personal comment. two weeks after the fact did the white house offer has been a shoe that the president had not heard of the question and editorial goes on from there. the las vegas review journa taking the president to task over his maui response. rhonda, sacramento, california. who is your favorite president? caller: my favorite is john f. kennedy. i believe he is the one president who first stood for civil rights. i was exactly four years old in 1963 when he said that i sent the national guard to alabama to stop wallace -- in 1963, when he sent the national guard to alabama to stop wallace . i believe he was the first also

to stand strong and making public announcements in television. i remember standing there watching talking about how every man, no matter what colors or what they are, are equal and should be treated as such. i believe after john f. kennedy was assassinated, i believe bobby, his brother, would have made big steps in pushing for civil rights, going beyond the call of put his brother was able to do. in my mind, i would say john f. kennedy and again, bobby, i loved bobby and what he stood for. it is to candies for me, john. -- kennedy's for me, john. host: there historians poll had

jfk at the ninth that the president of all time coming in at the end. historians credit most for his public speaking skills writing he rates well for crisis management and handling of international relations. he stood up to the soviets and successfully diffuse the cuban missile crisis and inspired americans vowing to put a man on the moon and supported progress on civil rights. he was assassinated barely 1000 days into office. 435 days until election between 20. we are asking you your favorite occupant of the white house of all time and let us know why. marsha, democrat. good morning. caller: good morning. my favorites are roosevelt.

absolutely fabulous. host: franklin or teddy? caller: franklin. and biden at the moment because biden is tackling such difficult problems. he is trying to tackle guns. he is trying to tackle climate change. take that on because most americans are not sufficiently well educated to understand climate change and the danger that it offers to our nation or to the world. he has also been very consistent in supporting the ukraine. and it's battle against russia

and russia trying to take back what used to be his colonies all over the world. host: read going to talk more on ukraine in our 9:00 hour today. we are joined by john herbst, former u.s. ambassador two ukraine. stick around for that discussion. can i come back to fdr in the c-span historian survey of presidential rankings. fdr come in three behind lincoln and washington. you have them at number one. your thoughts on this link it washington, -- lincoln, roosevelt, washington debate. seems to be the gold, medal, silver, and bronze. caller: their accomplishments were so different. i do not think they should be compared to each other.

they're all great, fabulous men. incredible. incredible leaders and view of the nation. and the world. they understood the role of america in world politics. host: marsha, inc.'s for that this morning. sean in cleveland, independent. who is your favorite american president? caller: i would say richard nixon is the greatest president of all time. host: why dixon? caller: people look back in 1972, he's the only president where he won the entire country beside one state that went to mcgovern and one that went to an independent. he is also the only president during his time that we went to

the moon. the moon landing started under richard nixon and ended under richard nixon. he did the salt treaties to stop with nuclear weapons. he went to russia. he was first president to do that and sign those. he sighed he been of chemical -- signed the ban on chemical weapons. there has been a lot america has gained because of richard nixon going to china, cheap goods we got. he inherited the vietnam war. he ended the vietnam war. he ended the drive in 1972. he passed the clean water act before richard nixon was president. you could get dirty water and would not know it was in your

water but he put it in place when he was in office. they put the marine mammal protection act under richard nixon. before that people could hunt walls and do whatever they wanted. -- hunt whales and do whatever they wanted. you listen to him talk about his mother, grandmother, aunt, how he was mostly influenced by woman throughout his life. host: lots of people probably saying how this sean escort the legacy of watergate and nixon's -- square the legacy of watergate at nixon. caller: that is the biggest problem with the watergate scandal. richard nixon was not -- it was not an order he put in place. look at what happened.

it happened -- what is that guy's name? i'm sorry, i lost that thought. there is a show on hbo called the plumbers about the watergate and what went down. i encourage people to watch that to get more and see what happened. that had nothing to do . richard nixon was not in jeopardy of losing the president. mcgovern had no business running against richard nixon at all because -- humphrey would have been the only one to actually stand a chance against him. they knew create the nixon -- they knew and the next demonstration new mcgovern did not have a chance. host: do you think richard nixon should not have resigned? caller: no, i think it was messed up. they wiped away his legacy over

one single thing and that is watergate. he did not set watergate in motion. he did not have to. i challenge people to go and look at the whole debates and everything going on in 1972. he was not in jeopardy of losing his president. he was loved by a lot of people. host: richard nixon ranked 31st by historians in latest c-span historian survey of american presidents. his numbers have been falling since that first survey in 2000. he was ranked 26 in 2000, felt a 27 our second survey. 28 and now 31. jeremy in maysville, ohio, democrat. good morning. caller: good morning to you host: who is your favorite president?

caller: my favorite president is bill clinton because i think he was the president during a good economic era. everyone thinks about the 1980's and the great times we had. nobody talks about this and that happening. we had a few bad things here and there. but everyone talks about how great it was in the 1980's. he is my favorite president. host: what is more important for president, foreign policy or domestic policy? caller: domestic all the way. i do not believe in giving money away to everybody and anybody that needs a handout. i think there are problems going on in our country. we got homeless people on the streets. we are handing out to go fight somebody else. host: on foreign policy, the

former president will clinton spoke this past spring about good friday agreement on island. his it demonstrations rick -- about the good friday agreement on ireland. [video clip] >> use st. patrick's day as an excuse if you will to invite people there and then to to talk to each other and to me individually until we can get everyone together but we tried to find venues in which people would feel comfortable, not embarrassed, and could get cover if they need it. i think it is important because yes, it is important people talk to each other but they have to be able to say what they think. outline what the problems are. one of the things i must say

that i had no experience with therefore i got up to my ears in this was multiparty democracy's. we have two main parties in america and usually the third party gets going, its main consequences is to screw things up for the main parties because they cannot ever win an of those in our system to win the white house or very few senate seats or congressional seats or governorships. so, i was literally fascinated. the whole time i was there i was fascinated. why people were in what party and what it meant for them, i found every single one of them i talked to had a good reason. that went well beyond any kind

of personal ambition. i belong to this party because of a. i belong to that party because of b. i found it enlightening and i found if we are making headway with some of the parties that may not have had such big numbers, it is still affected the chemistry. because if we had a reputation for listening and trying to respond to problems. host: that was former president bill clinton from earlier this year back in april. this morning the "washington journal" about halfway through the discussion it is a question we are trying to asking you favorite president is and why. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002. we will also look for your text

and social media. if you text us, 202-748-8003. include your name and where you are from. a few comments from facebook. john saying -- steve fox saying john adams because he is one of my early cousins. davis saying trump, to dollar guys come close the border, peace and no new wars. bob saying ronald reagan because he believed in us and in the goodness of america. axel saying it is calvin coolidge who assumed office upon the sudden death, that of a heart attack and calvin coolidge got the news while he was on vacation with his family. the vice president then sworn in by his father who was a justice of the peace. that was 100 years ago. the back to the message saying

because he is really underrated and the last of truly to understand presidency should not be a major factor in your life and he supported prohibition which is cool is what axyl said. james saint franklin roosevelt. he was a man from probably she became a champion for working class. the size legacy of social security and fair labor standards act, left his vast fortune to the warm springs rehab center he started and so dearly loved. a few of your comments from facebook. will the -- we will look a more from you. want to hear you on the phones. perry, republican. good morning. caller: my favorite president is teddy roosevelt. host: why teddy? caller: i do not know. anybody that has seen the mini series on pbs called the

roosevelt's. the first three episodes. what a great president teddy roosevelt was. host: ken burton series? caller: yes, it is. this is when the good of the nobel peace prize in his case. -- the legitimate wending of nobel peace prize in his case. how he made it easier for people in the world, in this country to get ahead in life. all the things he did with the national parks and protecting all these areas that could have been just run over. then, of course, the best think and i will love -- may have done this before, a little bit of a program about alice, his daughter, who i think is the most interesting child of any student we've ever had. host: thank you for that suggestion. i knew i remembered the ken

burton series. he came on the program to talk about the roosevelt series. 14 hour, seven part pbs documentary. roosevelt's: an intimate history. you can watch his appearance in "washington journal" back in september 15, 2014. anymore on teddy? caller: just his whole life. people do not realize he lost his mother and his first wife. alice, his mom. in a 14 hour period when he was running up and down the steps, just a tragic story how he retreated into the west for a few years and there was able to pick himself up. ended up being a major player in near politics and rising to the presidency. i do not see any president who can match that. host: what did he write in his

diary the day after the steps of the two women closest to him? the light has gone out of my life or something like that? caller: i believe you hit it exactly right and also. host: that is when he took the trip west. caller: the longest time when the word alice could not be spoken in his presence. he could not get with it yet he turns around and he picks himself up. i think he is the greatest. i think you paved the way for his cousin. i'm not taking anything away from fdr but teddy open a lot of doors for him. he followed -- there both secretaries and i just see that whole family to me, teddy roosevelt was the shining light

and when he won the nobel peace prize for stopping the war between japan and russia. you see the picture of nicholas the second and that the emperor of japan and teddy roosevelt in the middle of that crazy picture. it is historically a mind bender. nicholas the second. you think about what his future was. it is just history. host: teddy roosevelt i should note on c-span historians survey of presidents always comes in at number four. four times we have done this survey, teddy roosevelt rank four behind the usual top three lincoln, washington, and his cousin, franklin roosevelt. romaine in virginia. independent. caller: my favorite president was jimmy carter. he was a moral, honest president

who had ethics and integrity. he was a believer. a sincere christian. i say this as a muslim american. he believed in human rights. unfortunately, his presidency was done in by the iran hostage crisis, but he redeemed himself post-presidency as a private citizen. in humanitarian and philanthropic endeavors. i have a lot of respect for him. i think he is a greatly underappreciated president. host: it is about one week ago jimmy carter's grandson given the health update in the final chapter. jimmy carter has been on hospice for several months now.

it was earlier this year that the family announce he had gone and i hospice. when it comes to jimmy carter. his book from 2001, an hour before daylight, is featured in this washington post. one of the editorial aides writing about how the book was picked by her book club. she writes anyone who knows anything about our 39th president has probably heard he started his life as a peanut farmer in georgia. wondering how such a man came to be a humanitarian and statesman people cms today. my book club chose to read an hour before daylight memories of april boyhood. the opposer finalists. -- a pulitzer finalist. jimmy carter going on to write 17 more books in the years afterwards.

very prolific in his writing. an hour before daylight came out in 2001. liz in new jersey, democrat. good morning. caller: good morning. i think my favorite president started it all, george washington. he really knew what it was to be a public servant. he first took on the british empire when we were just a bunch of little colonies and i think -- i have read enough about him that i think he set up the nation for becoming a greater country. i agree with his ranking. fdr more recently because of his four terms, the great depression , and all he did to try to improve things, then he got hit

with world war ii. he had a difficult presidency. so, those would be my 22. the bill clinton i think is underrated -- supposedly my top two. bill clinton i think is underrated. he is still living under the cast of the scandal that did nothing to harm the the american people. he was not trying to steal elections. i think he was very capable when he was in office. host: lots of discussion when it happened at the time. what do you think of franklin roosevelt breaking the two term president said by george washington when he stepped down after two terms? caller: it was not a law yet. we put the amended in. republicans wanted it because

they knew they could not defeat roosevelt but it is best to stay with two terms, however, the great depression was a significant part of his presidency. we only started digging our way out of it when we were gearing up for world war ii. he had tried many things and they help people sustain life and having food in her table. there were not pulling the economy out of the gutter. herbert hoover had left it in. he did the best he could. host: thank you for the call. george washington was number one. jill biden, 46 president of this country, although i should note, only 45 men have held the office of the presidency because grover cleveland was both the 22nd president of u.s. and when he fourth president of u.s.

bridgeman harris between those two terms grover cleveland served. marvin in georgia. who is your favorite president and why? caller: good morning. i would like to give you my first five. i have three graduate degrees. i have studied history throughout my lifetime. i have been an educator for 27 years. in high school and higher education. number one i would say it would be thomas jefferson. he established the framework of this country. number two would be james madison. who was the architect of the constitution. number three would be president eisenhower because he ended the korean war. he is also responsible for the interstate highway system. number four would be teddy roosevelt because of the park

system. number five would be john f. kennedy because he diffuse the cuban missile crisis. he encourage people not to be depended upon the government. also to try to put something into the government itself. that is it. host: can i come to thomas jefferson in? i want to get your dolls and how historians rank his various -- get your thoughts and how historians rank his various characters of leadership. when it comes to public persuasion, thomas jefferson ranking high, seventh. crisis leadership, eight create economic management, 11. moral authority, 11th. administration skills, six.

performance within the context of his times, six. the ranking that holds him down significantly is this character of leadership pursuing equal justice for all thomas jefferson rank 20th in that category. what do you think of that? caller: i think people should take into consideration the fact that he establish the university of virginia. i know there is a lot of talk about him having interracial children. i think that is one reason his rankings have been held down. host: the key for the call. -- thank you for the call. kathleen in maryland. good morning. caller: good morning. host: hoosier phrase it -- who's

your favorite president? caller: franklin roosevelt. he established a new dell. social security. also, his wife, eleanor, was a great humanitarian. he did great things for this country. even though he was -- andy truman -- and truman decision to drop the atomic bomb was very courageous. we just had to do what we had to do. host: digging a little bit deeper into fdr's ranking in 2010 characters of leadership. the two places where he is ranked by historians as number one ahead of any other president and again he comes in third

overall but of the places where he's number one in public persuasion, likely due to his fireside chats, famous conversations with americans over the radio and international relations. the place rank the wires, pursuing equal justice -- the worse pursuing equal justice coming in at night. steve in south dakota. good morning. who is your favorite president and why? caller: my favorite president is donald trump, by far. but the second is teddy roosevelt. the caller did not have time to mention the panama canal.

sometimes he was making a speech and somebody shot him into the book he had in his pocket. he stood there for an hour and finish the speech. host: it happened as he was going in and started the speech and gave the whole speech after that happened there. caller: yeah. he went to africa. i read a few books about him. anyway, i am real glad to talk to you. i'm all pro-trump. host: you are from the mount rushmore state. do you think we pick the right four for mount rushmore? caller: teddy roosevelt is on there. host: yes, sir. caller: and i think trump should be on there. host: add a fifth phase to mount rushmore and make it donald trump?

caller: you bet. host: andrew in virginia, independent. good morning. caller: my favorite president as barack obama. he saved us from the 2008 financial crisis. he saved the automobile industry. he opened relations with cuba. he eased tensions in the middle east with the jcpla. host: what do you think the legacy will be of obamacare, the affordable care act? caller: how could i forget that? i think that is one of his iconic, achievements when he

expended health care to tens of millions of people. i think that is amazing. i did not know how i could forget that. that is his number one policy achievement. that is what he will be remembered for. i think it is amazing and i hope it is built upon and they can expand health care to millions more americans. host: barack obama making the top 10 of the presidential rankings. see special story rankings. -- cspan historian rankings. in 2016, came in 12 but cracked the top 10 when we did the survey most recently. in 2010, president obama address a joint session of congress in september 2009 calling for a need to change health care in this country. [video clip] >> first, if you are among the

hundreds of millions of americans who already have insurance through your job, or medicare, or medicaid, or the v.a., nothing in this plan will require you or your employer to change the coverage or the doctor you have. [applause] >> let me repeat this. nothing in our plan requires you to change what you have. what this plan will do is make the insurance you have work better for you. under this plan will be against the law for insurance companies to deny you coverage because of a pre-existing condition. [applause]

>> as soon as i sign this bill, it will be against the law for insurance companies to drop your coverage when you get sick, to water it down when you need it the most. [applause] >> there no longer be able to place some arbitrary cap on the amount of coverage you can receive in a year or a lifetime. [applause] >> will place a limit on how much you can be charge for out-of-pocket expenses because in u.s. no one should go broke because they get sick. [applause]

>> insurance companies be required to cover, not your charge, routine checkups because there no reason we should be catching diseases like breast cancer and colon cancer before they get worse. host: former president barack obama. we are asking this morning who is your favorite president and why and looking through social media posts. stephen saying in my lifetime it is clinton because they're are not enough to choose from who are deserving but without a doubt not in my lifetime i have to go with lincoln. donna saying jfk because he believed and practiced in separation of church and state. believed in science and technology and gave greatest speeches among so many other accomplishments. derrick saying it barack obama. he broke the mold. brian saying i like ike, the

interstate highway system. joseph sang carter because he cared about people and the environment. joe in the bronx. democrat. caller: i have two. let me start with jimmy carter. the reason why jimmy carter is one of the best is because he has no blood on his hand. he did not lie to go to the majority like brown countries, kill them to build weapons. amen. number two, joe biden. oh my god. first hired a black press secretary. first a higher -- how your company manager black when he was running for president. first to have a black vice

president. first to have everything you can ask for to bring this country towards what it is supposed to be. amen. have a good day. host: that is just in the bronx talking about president biden. andrew in ohio, republican. who is your favorite president and why? caller: who the best president of all time? that is easy, calvin coolidge. he said it best the business of america is business, not government. if you look at his record. income tax rate dropped from 65% and then he dropped it 20%. he balanced the budget every year when he was president. if you look from 2001 we ran

deficits every year, bush, obama, trump, biden. now if you look at just the gdp, it increase about 4.7% every year in 1920's. that is why historians call it the roaring 20's. if you look at his record, he signed in 1924 the citizenship act. he was just a fantastic president. host: i was going to notice and the's rankings they came out last year had him -- siena college rankings they came out last year had him at 32nd. they wrote he is rated poorly for leadership, lack of imagination, and failing to work for equal justice for all americans. refused to use the countries

economic boom to help struggling farmers and workers in other industries. what are your thoughts on that? caller: that is very upsetting to me we see the record, i think fdr ranked as the best president and we had a 10 year depression. you see everyone who suffered under his reign. in -- they lived a life they cannot fathom. it was so amazing. so fantastic. they blame him for the great depression which did not happen under his watch. it was the federal reserve that inflated the currency. they deflated the currency with the banks -- when the banks failed. the democrats try to rewrite history but the facts are the facts. host: calvin coolidge, 100 years ago this month was sworn in to office after the death of one or

who would you put as your favorite president in more modern times the last 50 years? caller: that is a great point. i would say bill clinton because only after 1944 because they work with congress and balanced the budget and bill clinton actually set the era of big government was over. unfortunately, it is not create you see the departments, education, transportation, labor. there is too much government. bill clinton working together. internet boom and they really fix the country i thought. looking back at the 1990's and my childhood. there is that nostalgia for american greatness. host: this is david in akron, ohio. independent. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i have two favorite presidents

equally. franklin roosevelt and jfk. i like fdr because he taught us, demonstrated government is not our enemy. corporate government is where we have the problems. he used government help working people. his projects and administration, national parks, federal land. he gave people value and restored their pride. he helped develop medicare and social security programs. he was called a communist backed event by their republicans and his enemies and those programs are still very strong, doing fine today. also, jfk, i like jfk because of his famous quote, ask not what your country can do for you, ask what you can do for your country. that to me encourages our citizenship.

let us know don't just ask what the government can do, try to give something back to the government. he broke up the cia created in my mind come as a student of history, the cia is used to protect wall street investment. they say they are for they care more about the dollar. it is the greedy side of human nature being use. jfk broke them up. he did not want to go into vietnam. i think that was why he was assassinated. that will come out later. why aren't any of our presidents opening up the jfk files? both trump and biden refused to do it. host: we had a segment on the latest values disclose from that -- latest files disclosed and he can watch it on my website c-span.org.

you are from ohio and virginia. two states that produce a lot of presidents. what about the presidents from ohio, harrison, grant, hayes, garfield, taft, who is your favorite ohio president? caller: i guess i would have to think about that one because they have to be seen in the context of their times. i know one of the -- i think one of the ohio presidents presided over the dome scandal i believe. i really cannot think of an ohio president that stands out. but i'm sure they are worthy of respect. i would give them the benefit of the doubt. until i studied them in more detail. host: i would love for you to watch on c-span american history tv. we have a program called

lectures in history. we went to the university of akron where you are in ohio. kevin kern is a history professor there and did a lecture on the ohio dynasty of presidents. you can watch it online at c-span.org. i would love for you to watch that lecture and then at some point when i'm hosting down the road i want to get your thoughts on that lecture and presidents from ohio. does that sound good? caller: absolutely. i appreciate that timely recommendation. host: thank you so much. we are running short on time. i have a couple more colors. crystal in north carolina, republican, good morning. caller: i would have to say george washington because he set the tone. before, the only way was a military coup but he set the tone for diplomacy and being a world leader around the world

with this new country just being formed. we are looking at everyone after that copied that. the other one is teddy roosevelt. he said if it were not for the experiences he had in north dakota, he would not have run for president because it helped him recover from the death of willis' wife and his mother. host: on washington, david auburn agrees with you. "it's washington. without him, this conversation today would not be happening. there's plenty more to talk about this morning. up next we will be enjoyed by samantha joe ross and nicholas wu for a conversation on campaign 2024.

later john herbst, former ambassador to ukraine, will join us to discuss the conditions there. stick with us. we will be right back. ♪ >> tonight on q and a, in her book generations, san diego state professor jean twinkie discusses the differences between the six generations currently living in the u.s., silent, baby boomers, gen x, millennials, generation y, and generation z. >> we could see a real division

showing up with more people identifying as the extremes of ideology, more polarization between democrats and republicans on various issues especially around race. i think it is good to know what does this really look like over time not just in a poll at one time but we can look at this across decades. >> jean twinkie and her book generations tonight on c-span's q and a. you can listen to all of our podcasts on their free c-span now app -- on our free c-span now app. ♪ >> this fall watch c-span's new series, books that shaped america.

we embark on a journey with the library of congress to explore key pieces of literature from american history. hear from featured, renowned experts who will shed light on the impact of these works. we will travel to locations across the nation. among our featured books, their eyes were watching god by zora neal hurston, and free to choose by rose friedman. join us at 10:00 p.m. eastern. ♪ >> this yearbook tv marks 25

years of shining the spotlight, on leading nonfiction authors and their books from author talks, interviews, and festivals book tv has provided viewers with a front row seat to the latest literary discussions on history, politics, and more. book tv, 25 years of television for serious readers. ♪ >> c-spanshop.org is c-span's online store. browse through our latest collection of apparel, books, home decor and accessories. there is something for every c-span fan and every purchase helps to support our nonprofit operation. shop now or any time at c-span shop.org. >> washington journal continues.

host: a sunday political roundtable now with 2 congressional campaign reporters. we are joined by nicholas wu and samantha-jo roth. before we talk about congress, let's talk about campaigns. what do you think was the most important moment in campaign 2024 last week? was it the on stage debate or the mugshot? guest 1: that is a hard question. some people would say that mugshot was historic. a president has never had a mugshot before. a lot of people were really focusing on that. also the debate was a huge moment as well to see what some of these candidates will be like as they debate.

will they fizzle out? will they make it to iowa? will they make it to new hampshire? those are some big questions in my mind. host: several will not make it to the next debate where the threshold to make it onto the debate stage is higher than this one. guest 1: correct. some of those lower polling candidates may not be on the stage in california. this was some of their shots to make a name for themselves. host: nicholas wu, bigger moment, the debate or the mugshot? guest the mugshot -- guest 2: the mugshot. trump stole the entire news cycle and as my colleagues reported he raised over $7 million since he was booked and had his mugshot taken and that was released. that is a huge amount of money.

it shows the degree to which trump is still a front-runner. host: who got the biggest bounce from the debate in your mind? guest 2: in my mind, it was either nikki haley or vivek ramaswamy. what every candidate needed to do on that stage was break out and show that they could be the center of attention, that they could be a credible alternative to donald trump. not everyone did that. for folks like those two, they showed that they could hold the tension, that they could make a credible case to voters. host: does getting a bounce from a debate mean anything if trump is up 30, 40 points? guest 1: may be for the second-place person, but it is going to be very hard for these candidates to break out especially when some of them are not taking a stance on the

indictments and everything else. they are just letting it all play out. some of them are hoping that something will happen with the former president, and maybe they will become the front-runner. that is the strategy going on right now. obviously, a bounce is not going to overtake somebody who is leading by so many points. host: are we not expecting donald trump to show up in california? guest 1: it sounds like he probably is not going to. the voters in wisconsin were really hoping to see him at this debate. obviously, he had made a calculation that it was going to be something better to skip out and let the people below him to get out. -- below him duke it out. dominating the news cycle a day

later and he was an even on the stage. host: just about 9:00 a.m. eastern, republicans can call in (202) 748-8000. democrats, (202) 748-8001. independents, (202) 748-8002. nicholas wu, september 27 is when this next debate will be. that will also be a week of crunch time on capitol hill, congress up against a major funding deadline, possible government shutdown. remind us where we are in these funding questions that need to be answered, if we are going to avoid a government shutdown. guest 2: all signs are pointing towards a very probable government shutdown. if they cannot come to any agreement, that is what would trigger a shutdown. the main problem is the house. leaders in both parties talked

about meeting to do a short-term extension to give all sides more time to negotiate, but the republican conference has signaled that they are not willing to support a short-term funding extension, or that they need very fringe demands attached to -- what i am watching to see in the next few weeks as members returned from theis -- from the summer is whether they feel any stress. host: you are not seeing that in conversations with members? the twitter videos, the encounters with politicians at their town halls, you are not seeing that? guest 2: no, they are very pessimistic about a government shutdown.

host: what are you watching in the weeks to come? guest 1: the stopgap measure was a big moment of few weeks ago. it was not clear that it was something kevin mccarthy and schumer were looking at days prior. the house of representatives need to be on board with whatever the senate is going to do. the senate, historic having two women leading the appropriations committee.they were able to mark up all 12 of their bills, which we have not seen in years. that could mean absolutely nothing if the house is not going to agree to whatever they are going to pass. it is tough, but it is their only solution with so little time left, just a couple of weeks before this all goes down. some of the senators i have spoken with think that a shutdown is a possibility, and some are a little more optimistic.

it will count on what we see in the coming days and weeks. host: that is the fiscal 2024 funding. president biden has also asked for emergency spending, $24 billion for ukraine. there are $4 billion in therefore border security. i would love for you to explain that. what is the status of that emergency spending bill? can congress deal with that at the same time they are dealing with the larger government spending bill? guest 1: they are hoping they will be able to. they were not super happy with the deal that came out of mccarthy and the president when nate comes to the ukraine funding. this is a huge priority for them, especially some of these hawks. that makes it more challenging in the bigger scheme of things

when you have some of these far right people in the house were not happy overall with the spending,'s when you add this on top, it is a recipe for some -- spending, so when you add this on top, it is a recipe for some trouble. guest 1: host: -- host: nicholas wu, emergency spending, what other deadlines are we watching for when they get back here the following week? guest 2: there is a lot of legislation they need to wrap up before the end of the year. all different funding bills, is looming large over this congress. the house and the senate still need to come to a consensus on it. this is the kind of thing -- it is normally a bipartisan effort, but it might need to go to a conference committee.

host: is an impeachment inquiry possible? guest 1: that is -- guest 2: that is something a lot of republicans are talking about, but it is not clear to me that they have the votes to move forward with that. people in biden-won districts are not keen to do that. they would much rather the conference be doing things on taxes or economic issues. host: speaker mccarthy on foxbusiness last week talked about a potential impeachment inquiry. [video clip] >> to all your viewers, the only reason you know of all of this information is because we took the majority and we are holding the administration accountable. it is appalling what we have learned. it is different from what president biden had told us. he told us he has never been

involved in his family's business. we now learned while he was vice president, the family created 20 shell companies. they received more than $1 million from china, and he did call in to th business meetings. they got a porsche. the most compelling thing is there is somebody lying. we wanted to have a special prosecutor back in february, but we were told by garland there was no need for one. what david wise has told us privately with the irs agents and what he told publicly, somebody is lying in this process. the only stories that have not changed are the whistleblowers from the irs. their story has held up time and time again. it looks like there are two

justice systems here. if the biden administration continues to fight to withhold information, we would have to move to an impeachment inquiry, which you know gives the apex of power to congress to get the documents we need. show us where the money went. show us where you are taking money from outside sources. that would clear most of this up. host: speaker mccarthy on foxbusiness. that was on tuesday of last week. samantha-jo what are you, watching on the impeachment front? guest 1: obviously, we will have to see what the voters are thinking about this. this is something as nicholas

says, this is red, meat for some republicans specifically those who are very much looking for a fight when it comes to weaponizing the department of justice. that is something they are bringing up over and over again. s io think we will just have to wait and see how it all plays out but a lot of people are wanting to see this move forward and then you also have a lot of republicans who want to focus on the economic issues, the kitchen table issues. those are the points some of them thing will be -- think will be most successful when it comes to voters. host: "can your guests explain what they think donald trump's campaign will look like against the backdrop of endless court appearances?" guest 1: a lot of what we will see over the next year will play

out in court rooms. it won't be like what we normally see with him going to rallies. his mugshot became such a huge centerpiece of his campaign, the fundraising, the t-shirts, everything we saw, we will see more of that. it will be a lot less traditional. we will not see as many iowa appearances, new hampshire appearances. a lot will be focused on his legal fight. it has proven to be successful for him so far. guest 2: it will be a campaign like we have never seen before. the switch between appearances and rallies and court appearances, which will fall -- and court proceedings, which will fall right in the middle of primary season as well. trump has showed skill for

turning negative press into a boost. for many of these republican primary candidates the ability to totally dominate the news are not is something many of these candidates could only dream of. host: post mugshot, donald trump was getting back on the plane, and took some time to travel over to the reporters that are always following him. here is what he had to say. [video clip] >> thank you for being here. i believe this is a sad day for america. if you challenge an election, you should be able to challenge an election. it was a stolen election, and i should have every right to do that. you have many people over the

years you have been watching who have done that, whether it be hillary clinton or stacey abrams. what has taken place here was a travesty of justice. i did nothing wrong and everybody knows it. i i have never had such support. that goes with the other ones too. they're trying to interfere with an election. this is their way of campaigning. this is one instance, but you have three other instances. it is election interference. i want to thank you for being here. we did nothing wrong at all. we have every right to challenge an election that we think is dishonest, and we think it is very dishonest. thank you very much. i will see you very soon. >> could you pardon yourself? host: former president trump back on thursday. amanda-joe ross, do you think

that will be -- samantha-jo ross, do think this will be normal for him? guest 1: this is what we have been seeing over th paste couple months, years. he loves talking to the press. he gets an energy boost speaking to them. whether his attorneys want him to do that is an open question, but this is certainly something we will see over and over. host: this is josephine from livingston, new jersey, line for independents. caller: good morning. i see all the issues, but the one issue i think will be dominant is going to be women's issues. you can ignore it, you can hide

it, but it is women's issues. they put it under the guise of abortion. that is nonsense. i remember the time when a woman cutting get a credit card. we are becoming second-class citizens. more importantly, the mortality rate in birth for women is going up. we are becoming a third world country. this man --and i am talking about number 45 --has no concept of "us the people." it is his pocketbook. unfortunately, their idolatry to lucifer, they keep giving him money, fine. he says he will be able to cure the ukraine. you want the ukraine? take it! no more war.

71% of republicans are against the ukraine. host: got your point. nicholas wu? a lot there. guest 2: i think josephine's comments about women's issues being decisive in this primary is very interesting. as someone who covers congress, i am seeing it played out a lot whether it is congressional candidates making abortion an issue or the broader range of social and economic issues that can be folded into that. the question for a lot of republicans will be how the rhetoric of candidates like trump will affect them. we have seen weakness with trump over the past few years among independent women, particularly in the suburbs. the test for republicans will be whether they can win that demographic back.

guest 1: i want to add in the debate that we saw it was interesting to see nikki haley talk about abortion. her views were significantly different than a lot of the other candidates talking about how being able to pass a nationwide abortion, and a kind of legislation, they will need to get lawmakers here on capitol hill on board. that was a starkly different view we saw versus some of the other republicans on the stage. host: "why didn't we hear any talk regarding the immigration crisis?" immigration and campaign 2024. guest 1: i think it will be a huge issue. i have covered arizona, the senate races there. it will be a massive issue. if you look at some of the polls there has been some polling conducted in arizona that has showed immigration is the number

one issue for people there. that is certainly going to be a huge issue in how the -- issue and how the administration continues to handle it should be an issue as well. host: nicholas, you have karen in alabama. caller: trump does not have to go to the debate. he is out there holding his rallies all the time. it is obvious the fbi or biden are politicizing the justice department against him. i wish they would shut down the government until they shut down the political investigations of trump. one of the comments your guest made is that the government will probably shut down because the friends of the republican party want to have these obscure reasons for shutting down the

government -- they never give specifics. they went to reduce the spending level of what mccarthy agreed to. teuy one -- they want to build the wall, and they want to stop the blank checks to ukraine. the majority of americans agree with that, so how is that right fringe? host: you want to take up the debate over the shutdown? guest 2: i would say that the demands being made in congress are coming from the hard right of the republican congress, the freedom caucus. folks are asking for a whole laundry list of demands in exchange for government funding. those are things the majority of members in congress do not want to go along with, if they are going to try to avoid a shutdown of congress.

given the numbers in congress, it is not clear they can do that. host: your story from earlier this month " house gop weighs the escape hatch." explain. guest 2: this is a fear a lot of republicans have that mccarthy will have to cut a deal with democrats. given the extremely tight margins in the house, this is a real possibility. mccarthy will lose republicans on this vote no matter what, some democrats think that there could be some sort of mix of moderate and centrist democratss who could step into over to -- in to avert a government shutdown. democrats i spoke to said they would only do this if they were presented with mostlya -- with a mostly clean spending bill.

the question for mccarthy will be what kind of bill is he willing to put out. host: it is just about 8:30 on the east coast. if you would like to join our conversation, republicans can call in at (202) 748-8000. democrats, (202) 748-8001. independents, (202) 748-8002. samantha-jo ross, you have a color from tennessee -- caller from tennessee. caller: what worries me most is the collusion between -- we now know that jack smith's aide met with white house counsel nine weeks before he indicted trump. we no david weiss used to work

with hunter's brother -- we know david weiss used to work with hunter's brother, and leslie wolf warned the biden brothers that they were about to search the household of hunter biden. all of these announcements come down two days after something else came out. they are going to find out that that woman, fannie, and georgia has used federal money to bring these indictments against this one, big spiderweb. it is the justice department that has been politicized. host: what do you want to pick up on? guest 1: i think that it will be interesting to watch some of the indictments coming out and how the court cases and georgia are going to move forward.

we have watched some of the folks being charged like mark meadows trying to challenge it out of the state court. they want this to be a more federal case so i know that is coming up on monday. we will watch some of those proceedings. that will be really interesting to watch moving forward. >> in terms of what we are what -- host: in terms of what we are watching moving forward, i didn't want to touch the congressional races happening in 2024. your story came out yesterday in the washington times. guest 1: republicans have been very, very careful in these last elections. they saw some mistakes that played out with the and rsv --

the nrsv. w our seatinge and a number of states some things are not going to plan. in montana we see matt rosendale who previously ran against jon tester the vulnerable democrat there. he lost the race. he is considering jumping in after kim she he has been recruited by republicans, somebody they feel will be a candidate to watch. we are also watching west virginia, jim justice a very popular governor there is facing a race against mooney. host: congressman. current congressman, sorry. guest 1: he has backed by the club for growth, which is a powerful group coordinating

money. some of these republicans will have to face primaries and races that some republicans were hoping were not going to happen. we are also looking at arizona, a totally different question where there are a lot of rumors that kari lake, the former gubernatorial candidate who loss is going to be the front-runner if she gets in. a a lot of republicans they are concerned about that because she lost her gubernatorial bid after embracing some of the same election conspiracies the former president had. host: let's go back to west virginia. you mentioned groups putting in money they are against the more establishment candidate, the governor jim justice. here is an ad targeting jim justice. [video clip] >> this is the definition of the swamp. >> jim justice, the hand-picked

candidate for congress, recruited by mitch mcconnell. payback for the $100,000 justice and his family gave to help mcconnell? a down payment on his loyalty. who knows what deals were cut, but we do know that justice is mcconnell's man, not west virginia's. host: is jim justice mcconnell's man in west virginia? guest 1: that is what they are hoping. jim justice is someone they see as the most qualified candidate to win. we don't know if senator joe manchin will run, the venerable -- vulnerable democrat in a very red leaning state. jim justice is a very popular governor. he does have some issues he will have to contend with as were laid out in that campaign ad.

his family has an empire that has been dealing with a number of issues, whether it be a violations, they haven't paid their taxes. whether the voters care about that or not is another question but that is something the club for growth is trying to point out, trying to psyche as a swamp creature that he is not going to be working for you. that is something they will continue to point out. host: nicholas wu, you have mark in gainesville, florida. good morning. caller: good morning. at this point in time i have not heard anyone mention trump's mugshot looking like his eight-year-old self after he got spanked. he is not a fierce man. he is a coward. he is a liar and a con man. the republicans have been

brainwashed by the right-wing media. most of them have not had their civics class so they do not know what brainwashing is. host: nicholas wu, do you think former president trump is going to stand trial in any of these cases for election day 2024? guest 2: i think you will stand trial and many of these cases before 2024. they will bring this squarely in the middle of the primary season and the general election season. this is going to be a lightning round for members of both parties. this energizes democrats who have been waiting to see some kind of justice for the former president for some time ended is energizing republicans as we soft from some of the other callers who are fired up by seeing the prosecution of the former president. host: this is clairton,

pennsylvania. samantha-jo, you have ken. caller: i just want to say, i have been calling as a democrat just to let you know they are not answering the phone. trump is transparent. he tells it as it is. everybody sins. you have to go with the lord. he made the country better. look at what biden did in 2.5 short years. host: we had a discussion earlier in the show about americans' favorite presidents of all time. a lot of callers focused on more recent presidents, specifically on donald trump, democrats

focusing on barack obama. polling showed that when it comes to presidents of the past 40 years, it was trump and reagan on the republican side, and obama on the democrats' side. surprising at all to you? guest 1: i don't think it is surprising. republicans for the most part are still very much behind former president trump. we are seeing it in polling time and time again. they like what he did for the country. they like the economics behind everything. they are pointing to what they think was a better country under the former president. i'm not surprised by that. a a lot of folks also liked what obama did for the country, obamacare. host: how much are we going to see former president barack obama on the campaign trail in the coming year? guest 1: we can expect to see

him a lot. he has been democrats' best surrogate. he is very popular. michelle is very popular. we even saw during the midterm obama going to states where biden was not doing very well and stumping there instead of biden. we can expect to see a similar strategy. it work to during the midterm elections so they will probably do that. host: nicholas, you have frank, west palm beach, florida. caller: my biggest concern with the government is the attorneys. these people are ruining washington. they always have. it is made up of 80% attorneys and the problem is that they make the rules and this is why this country is in such chaos. that is what i wanted to say. host: is that all lawyers?

do you know many lawyers there down in west palm beach? caller: i know lawyers. i have dealt with lawyers my whole life. there was one thing my father told me when i was eight years old. "stay away from attorneys and stay away from doctors when you get old, if you can." my reason for saying this is everything is a hearing or a lawsuit, and guess who is involved in that? it is all attorneys. host: nicholas wu, attorneys in the federal government. guest 2: it is probably a good thing to have people trained in the law of writing the laws, but all that being said, it is a very common complaint that there are too many lawyers. host: this is john in west virginia, line for democrats. caller: good morning. my question is, why would trump

need to lie if they are so righteous? host: what is the question? caller: why do they need all the lies if they are so righteous? if they have all this to offer, and trumped all these good things then why all the lies -- trump did all these good things then why all the lies? guest 1: i don't understand the question. host: it is about lies from our politicians. guest 1: politicians on both sides of the aisle spin the truth, embellish the truth. in the spin room, they are trained to do this. the key is just for voters to be able to see through it. it sounds like our caller here

has identified what he thinks is a lie. host: guest 2: do you think the news -- host: do you think the news media is doing a better job of fact pecking? postdebate last week there was immediately a fact-check of what candidates had to say. is your industry getting better at it? guest 1: i would argue that we are. trump really changed the way we cover presidents. we were live on air reading tweets. the twitter part of covering trump really made us all fact checkers in real time so we have all learned how to adapt and do it a lot quicker. we have seen that over the last couple of months with this campaign, specifically with the debate, fact checking all of that. host: agree? guest 2: i would say that the role of media in democracy is to fact-check. that is something news organizations have tried to remain vigilant about especially

in the age of trump and with so much disinformation spreading across social media. host: trump and media is something that gets pulled on a lot. i was trying to find the most recent gallup poll. near record low of all time just 34% of americans have a great deal or fair amount of confidence in the media. how concerning is that number and what can you do? do see it as your drop to boost that number? guest 1: i'm concerned by that number because this is our life's work to report the truth, to seek truth to right the first version of history. i -- truth, to write the first version of history. the people tuning in -- there

are plenty of networks that have both sides they are portraying, especially in the late-night hours, those are the opinions. it would be great if some of our viewers and readers understood that. a lot of these news organizations are doing great work. host: nicholas wu, a question i always come back to, should newspapers have an editorial board? should there be a lead editorial? does that make your job harder? guest 2: i am in an outlet now where we do not have an editorial board, and i think that helps eliminate some of the confusion it often causes among readers. that dynamic you are alluding to can be confusing for readers.

i think something that news outlets have got a better rat in recent days, in recent years -- better at in recent days, in recent years is to make it more clear what is fact and what is opinion. host: this is bernadette, scotch plains, new jersey. caller: finally i got through because they were not answering the republican line. host: i promise, we answer all the lines. it only works if we have calls. caller: my question is please ask nicholas wu if there are any fringe democrats. he is talking about fringe republicans all the time and right wing republicans. can you ask him if there are any fringe democratss. i can help him if he would like -- host: who in your opinion are some fringe democratss, bernadette before we hear from

him? caller: the squad, the old man from minnesota -- oman from minnesota, aoc from new york, the to from massachusetts. they are very left wing. they hate israel and there are many jewish senators and congresspeople who are jewish. there are also democrats in favor of nine-month infanticide. the governor of north carolina says after the baby is born, he checks with the mother to see if she wants the baby to live. if that isn't infanticide, i don't know what is! host: let me stay on the fringe of the parties. her question was specifically to you. guest 2: bernadette raises an

interesting question, which is why are the leftmost parts of the democratic caucus not as much a factor in these negotiations. that is because democrats are not in power right now in the house. normally, during these spending fights, the squad and the left-wing of the democratic party would cause problems for leadership. they would threaten to vote against these big, must pass bills. for example, dhs funding was always a problem for democrats when they were in the majority, because the progressive members of the caucus did not want to fund more beds for dhs. now now the democrats were more influential in these discussions are the moderates. the squad were probably going

to vote no one the legislation from the beginning. host: we talked about abortion a little bit this morning. the biden campaign putting out an ad last week on the issue of abortion. here is that ad. [video clip] >> reproductive health care decisions are among the most personal a woman will ever make. they should be made between you and your doctor. >> i am the one who got rid of roe v. wade. >> governor desantis finally signed into law when of the nations strictest abortion bans. >> if i was president of the united states, i would sign the most conservative pro-life legislation they can get through congress. >> do you believe in punishment for abortion? >> there has to be some form of punishment. >> for the woman? >> there has to be some form. >> president biden and vice

president kamala harris are determined to restore roe v. wade. as long as they are in office, decisions about your body will be made by you, not buy them. host: that was the biden campaign da last week -- campaign ad last week specifically talking about a national abortion ban. it is likely to be part of the debate heading into 2024 as well. guest 1: this is what we saw last midterm election. it was a huge issue republicans did not count on, and i think democrats see this as a major problem. they are going to use that as the backbone of so many of their campaigns. we are already seeing it with the senate campaigns, congressional campaign and this all starts from the top with

biden releasing that ad before the debates. host: just 5 minutes left. it is just before 6:00 on the west coast. this is larry in l.a. caller: how are you doing? i would like to say a couple of things. hopefully, you will let me get it in. we do not have the rule of justice. what we have is the rule of power. if you understand the difference, he who has the gold makes the rules. i firmly believe today that if nixon was a democrat, we never would have found out about watergate. that is really profound. i am really, really -- i like what i see now with the

republicans having control of the house, where you see the whistleblowers come on. you think for a moment that the whistleblowers would have ever been put up to say what they said? do you think for a moment that the parents of the kids who died with fentanyl what have ever been put in front of the members of congress? all of this stuff, what you have in this country is if you have the power you control the narrative. that is very dangerous. then what happens is you are not seeing what is going on in the country. that is why people do not trust what is going on, not only in the media, but in the government. host: i got your point. whistleblowers and these hearings that are getting a lot of attention. guest 2: the interesting thing with these hearings the republicans are putting on is it

gives them the opportunity -- we see these probes into hunter biden and alleged involvement of biden ramping up and talk of an impeachment inquiry, all of this legal trouble engulfs the former president. i think this is something we will only hear more about. host: samantha-jo, is there an upcoming hearing or whistleblower you are looking forward -- that you think will get a lot of attention when the house comes back in september? guest 1: a lot of these hearings will get a lot of attention. as nicholas talked about the counter programming is very high. that is what they will be doing. it is what we will be seeing in the house playing out. as we go back there are a lot of things that need to be settled with funding. we also have faa

reauthorization, so there are a lot of issues that need to get accomplished, but certainly we will see some of these whistleblower things play out. host: 30 seconds on faa reauthorization. guest 1: there are some issues with pilot retraining, the dmv, a push from lobbyists who went to see more long-haul flights. and a lot of the dmv related lawmakers do not want to see this happen. they don't think reagan is big enough are equipped enough to have more flights. as we saw the deadline coming up very shortly, along with these other issues. host: ohio, this is mary, mind for democrats. == -- mary, line for democrats. caller: good morning. i was looking at january 6

liars. everybody, a lot of people don't believe that happened. i don't understand how you can see something on tv going on right in front of your eyes and don't believe it? we have a former president indicted 4 times. to me he is not for the people. he is for himself. we have a lot going on here in the united states that are congress needs to be addressing. so much focusing on what donald trump did. it is not about donald trump. it is about the country! we have a lot of allies we got back now. if he gets in there, they are gone again. host: marian ohio with her

thoughts. --mary in ohio with her thoughts. we have a week before the senate comes back. what will you be working onat politico ? guest 2: is there any movement at all between the parties and a resolution for the looming shutdown? guest 1: i will be working on some similar aspects up in the senate. that a lot of the decision-making will designate the house in the drivers seat. a lot of the senators will be on the sidelines. host: washington examiner.com is where you go to see samantha-jo ross's work. politico is where nicholas will is a political reporter. up next, time for your phone calls. we we'll return to this question

-- who is your favorite president and why? give us a call. phone lines are on your screen. republicans, it (202) 748-8000 democrats, (202) 748-8001. independents, (202) 748-8002. we will get to your calls right after the break. ♪ >> live on sunday, september 3, mary eberstadt joins book tv to take your calls on religious freedom and the sexual revolution in amica. mrs. eberstadt, an expert on christian culture is the author many books, including "adam and eve after the pill

revisited." join in the conveation with your phone calls, facebook comments, and texts. ♪ >> listening to programs on c-span through c-span radio just got easier. tell your smart speaker place c-span radio and listen to washington journal daily. importing congressional hearings throughout the days and weekends at 5:00 p.m. catch washington today. listen to c-span anytime. just tell your smart speaker play c-span radio. c-span, powered by cable. ♪ >> greg nelson in his book v is

for victory reports on the number of casualties from world war ii. he writes "the military casualties were 1,785,000." according to the bureau of labor statistics there were over 8.9 million american worker sualties. 75 died between 1942 and 1945. across history the arsenal of democracy has come to mean this miracle of manacturing. when president roosevelt often used the term, he meant the miracle of the american people. >> author craig nelson on this episode of book notes+. book notes+ is available on

c-span now app or wherever you get your podcasts. >> washington journal continues. host: we have 20 minutes to hear from you on who is your favorite president and why? we are doing this question today because it was at last thursday's debate where vivek ramaswamy deemed to donald trump the best president of the 21st century. that was the fox news headline stemming from the debate. who is your favorite president and why? let us know on phone lines split by republ -- by political party. republicans, (202) 748-8000. democrats, (202) 748-8001.

independents, (202) 748-8002. this is jerome out of wichita, kansas. you are up first in this segment. caller: beyond a shadow of a doubt, it would have to be barack obama. we went through eight years of barack obama, not one strip club incident, not one financial impropriety, no skeletons in the closet, no offshore bank accounts. barack obama, the truth was known. barack obama, they should put his picture on the five dollar bill as a role model, a standup both under investigation. we are talking -- this is twilight zone level insanity. the two leaders of the country, both under criminal investigations. that is nuts. host: that is jerome in kansas.

this is the pew research service , they update this question they ask about who is the best president. they hold it to modern times, the past four years or so. this was the responses they got to their latest survey earlier this month. when asked to name the united states president who did the best. the past 40 years, a majority of democrats name barack obama. republicans are divided between ronald reagan and one currently running to return to office, donald trump. about four in 10 republican and republican leaning independents say reagan has done the best job as president. nearly six in 10 democrats and democratic leaders, 58% say obama has done the best job as president in the past or the ears. others name bill clinton and joe biden. missouri, republican. good morning. caller: good morning.

host: who is your favorite president? caller: donald trump. host: why trump? caller: because everything was so much better under him. we did not have open borders. this is killing our country. we did not have open borders. everyone was happy. no wars. there is no question. there is no question in my mind. i heard that other guy say that barack obama -- well, he is not under investigation, but i think he ought to be. host: ought to be for what, carolyn? caller: for all the stuff he has caused in this country. it started with him. host: that is carolyn in missouri. this is patrick in georgia, independent. who is your favorite president? caller: i would have to say my favorite president right now is president putin of russia. host: we are talking about american presidents, patrick. caller: i understand that.

personally, i think putin because he is fighting against the -- host: alright. that is patrick in georgia. this is diana in arizona, democrat. good morning. caller: good morning. i believe right now in our time, biden. there has been an unfairness in this country where the rich gotten so many benefits. biden is trying to have a middle-class again. he is doing things for lower income. we need that child care. people can't afford to go out and work, because they are paying over $1000 a month for child care. biden has all kinds of plans. he is not finished. he needs more time to implement

these great things he once to do -- he wants to do in our country. he needs more time. he has done a great job with covid, our economy is getting better, our stocks are better. i just believe biden is the best right now. host: one of the more recent polls that came out, the siena college research institute poll of american presidents, that one came out last year ranking all of the 45 individuals -- they have been men -- who have held the office of the presidency, including joe biden. joe biden came in at 19th on that list. here is the cbs news wrap up of joe biden in his spot at 19. it is always difficult to acklin -- to accurately rate a president still in office, but

historians like biden for his ability to compromise and his executive and court appoints. he scored lower in his relationship with congress and his abilities to communicate. that is the cbs news wrap up. i should note the c-span historians survey that we do, the most recent one that came out in 2021, we do not include presidents when they are in office. we do not rank residents until they are out of office. the one in 2021 came out after donald trump left office. you can see our rankings there. we compiled a list. we send it out, individual historians rank presidents on characters of leadership, things like public persuasion, crisis leadership, economic management, moral authority. rank them in those categories, we add up score and that is how we come up with the list of presidents, the rankings of the latest survey franklin, roosevelt's number one -- i am sorry, that is in international

relations. let me give you the numbers overall. abraham lincoln's number one in the latest survey. george washington, number two. theodore roosevelt, four. eisenhower, five. thomas jefferson, seven. ronald reagan came in at ninth. barack obama, 10th and that latest survey. this is chuck in alabama, republican, good morning. caller: good morning. can you hear me? host: yes, sir. caller: i would rank trump probably way ahead of obama for a lot of reasons. most people forget the newspapers and the media and all of that destroyed trump with lies and all that sort of thing. they did not touch obama. people forget about the tax stuff he did against conservatives. holders saying he was obama's boy, senate guns to cartels in

mexico. you should be investigated. he is probably -- no, he probably knew about biden getting off of people for these countries and did not do a thing about it. how could you think obama was a good president? trump is a mess, but at least he got things done. thank you. host: that is chuck in the yellow hammer state. to the ocean state, jimmy, maine, independent. caller: i like the lady before. biden is the one. when he came into office, for oil, i was paying $1.97. now, i am paying four dollars 97 -- $4.97. the border was closed. he opened that up. now, we've got more homeless

people in this country that we cannot take care of. i agree, the earlier caller did a great job describing what a great job he is doing for the little man. everything is so peachy keen right now. he is the greatest president. if he is the president. maybe we will have a press conference one day and find out who is running the show. host: got your point. this is john in tampa, florida. republican. good morning. caller: yes, the best president so far is donald trump. ok? obama allowed vice president then biden to do all his dirty work. the other problem we have now is, how come this president allowed all these people into this country unvented, not wearing masks -- we do not know what kind of diseases they have -- and where are you going to put them all? it is like a father letting the

kids go up in the bathroom and turn on the tub water and allow it to keep on running until it overflows. host: would you put trump ahead of lincoln and washington? caller: that question is not where we are at today. back then was one story. today, we are at a different story of corruption. ok? and nobody is really paying attention to it. biden is off the wall. everything he is doing. he turns around and threatens our money. a are not going to get the billion dollars and call the president. come on. he says this on television. he is an insult to this country. he is a disgrace. host: that is john in tampa, florida. a few social media comments this morning, been looking for them on facebook and twitter.

robert saying, donald trump because he is the opposite of a politician. he is our greatest leader of all time. richard in oklahoma, favorite president, george herbert walker bush responded quickly to the situation in kuwait. should not have lost the -- to bill clinton. margot saying abraham lincoln, he freed the slaves. truman, says francis in alabama. he day -- he desegregated the military which led to civil rights, legislation, he was independent and humble and like eisenhower, a military veteran who experienced war firsthand. thomas saying, george washington based on his stance on permanent alliances. then, ronald reagan based on his stance on limited government. alex, mountain grove, missouri, you are next. caller: yes. president biden and vice president harris are doing a great job partly because they

are so courteous. they are courteous and polite to the reporters. they have morally great -- they are just so courteous and not just loud and abrasive. they are telling the truth. i would say 100% of the time. host: -- a moral president? caller: who else do you think was a moral president ? a moral president is someone who tells the truth, who does not manipulate and try to twist the election and threaten people that do not agree with him. host: on moral authority, that was one of the characters of

leadership that -- in the c-span historian survey of presidents, one of those criteria we asked historians to rank presidents on. when it comes specifically to moral authority and how authority -- and how they defined that issue, the top 10 president to lead in the moral authority category, abraham lincoln, number one. washington, two. dwight eisenhower, four. teddy roosevelt, five. barack obama, six. jimmy carter, seven. john adams,. harry truman, nine. john quincy adams comes in at 10. that is on the issue of moral authority. at the bottom of the list, the bottom five. warren harding, richard nixon, andrew johnson, james buchanan and donald trump coming in last in the rankings of moral authority according to the latest c-span historian survey. this is carmen in florida, independent. good morning. you are next.

are you with us? if you are, you have got to turn your tv off. this is peter, dallas, texas, democrat. caller: good morning. host: who is your favorite president, peter? caller: my favorite president is barack hussein obama. host: and why? caller: more character. that man built the economy. that man being a care to all america, what republicans fight against. as a black president and other presidents tried to give america -- i do not care what they could not do. barack obama can. he made that promise and he kept it.

he had no investigations. he did everything by the book. our republicans do everything to bring him down. but, he goes into the white house and came out with a clean record. host: that is peter in texas. a few more comments from our text message service. if you were in tampa, florida saying bill clinton. he eliminated the national debt. teeth saying, fdr your extra points for elinor. his positive impact on american life is still being felt today and he was disabled -- a neutral selection would be william harrison. not saying he is my favorite president, but if you are going for a safe bet, he did not do much damage or good, for that matter. that is ryan writing and on facebook. this is ken in connecticut, republican. good morning. caller: hello.

good morning. host: who is your favorite president? caller: trump, definitely for our time in history now, has to be president trump. my favorite president definitely was lincoln. trump will have to be the second choice. then again, if you look at history and time, we will have to go with trump. host: four lincoln, y lincoln over washington? it is usually those two on these lists of rankings, one and two. how do you compare lincoln versus washington? caller: lincoln to washington. lincoln basically brought -- try to bring our country together, but we still have idiots in our country who basically are racist people. you only have a small percentage of idiots that cause problems for all us loving americans that love americans of all colors. basically, today, what we have

going on -- i know your question is about the favorite president. today, what we have going on in our country is, we have government that is too big. we have politicians that do not care about us. what we need to elect again is another businessman. business people or business woman. business people know how to run businesses make countries great and keep countries a flow. when you get politicians who have been stuffing and lining their pockets with all our money all these years and they do nothing, this is what you get. if you are going to vote in a lifelong politician, you are going to have your country basically, most likely, destroyed. host: our last caller and the segment. it didn't want to note on the link in-washington debate, c-span has done there historian survey four times over the past 23 years, the first one done in

2000. george washington ranked third in that survey behind lincoln and roosevelt. george washington, second since abraham lincoln has ranked first in every one of those historian surveys that were done. if this list interests you, there's plenty to click around in there on and hope you do. you can find it at c-span.org. that is going to do it for this phone segment. about 45 minutes left in "washington journal" today. we will be joined by the atlantic councils -- atlantic councils john herbst to discuss the latest develop in's and ukraine. stick around. we will be right back. ♪ >> c-span's campaign 2024

coverage front row seat to the presidential election. four coverage of the candidates on the campaign trail with announcements, meeting agreed, speeches and events to make up your own mind. campaign 2024 on the c-span networks. c-span now, our free mobile video app or work -- or anytime online at c-span.org. c-span, your unfiltered view of politics. ♪ >> a healthy democracy does not just look like this. it looks like this, where americans can see democracy at work, where citizens are truly informed, a republic thrives. get informed straight from the source on c-span. unfiltered, unbiased, word for word. the nation's capital to wherever you are. the opinion that matters the most is your own. this is what democracy looks like.

c-span, powered by cable. ♪ ♪ >> since 1979, in partnership with the cable industry, c-span has provided complete coverage of the halls of congress from the house and senate floors to congressional hearings, party briefings and committee meetings. c-span gives you a front row seat in how issues are debated and decided with no commentary, no interruptions and completely unfiltered. c-span. your unfiltered view of government. ♪ >> if you ever miss any of c-span's coverage, you can find it anytime online at c-span.org. videos of key hearings, debates and other events feature markers that guide you to interesting and newsworthy highlights. these points of interest markers appear on the right-hand side of your screen when you hit play on

select videos. this timeline tool makes it easy to quickly get an idea of what was debated and decided in washington. scroll through and spend a few minutesn c-span's point of interest. >> order your copy of the 118th congressional directory now available at c-spanshop.org. it is or access to the federal government with bio and contact information for every house and senate member and important information on congressional committees, the president's cabinet, federal agencies and state governors. scan the code on the right to order your copy today or go to c-spanshop.org. it is $29.95 less shipping and handling and every purchase help support our nonprofit operations. >> "washington journal" continues. host: a conversation now on the war in ukraine with john herbst, former u.s. ambassador to ukraine during the george w.

bush administration and abbasid are herbst, what was your -- and ambassador herbst, what was your reaction to killing prigozhin? guest: it was not a surprise. surprise -- perhaps the surprise is he lasted two months after his mutiny. that reflects the fact that pollutants control in russia -- that putin's control in russia is not as firm as people have us see. even the way that he died with a certain amount of ambiguity host: points to that. host:the new york times, running his obituary on the front page. we will start with russia before we get to ukraine. what does his death mean in russia before we get to the battlefield? guest: what it means is putin's control is not rocksolid in russia. the fact the same day that he launched his troops towards moscow, putin described that is treason and 12 hours later, he

made a deal with them. that deal was for him to be in belarus. goshen was kicking around russia -- pre-goshen was kicking around russia. -- he was seen as the guy advancing in russia after the coup. these things were a direct attack on putin's authority. that is why he had to go. but, the fact that putin did not arrest him and try him suggests he was afraid of challenging him to rightly. he can deny he had anything to do with prigozhin's death. they know he is responsible. host: the march in moscow two months ago. at that point, new york times rights, herbst's fate -- prigozhin's fate was sealed.

mr. prigozhin would display total fealty. the march was an open rebellion against mr. putin's role and the president's first public reaction was to warn without -- four prigozhin that those secretary -- that those that prepared the mutiny have -- mr. putin's russia. guest: if things were as clear-cut as that, why was prigozhin arrested and put on trial? putin, uncertain about the amount of support prigozhin had. handled it very differently. again, he let him parade around for two months. and, relatively prominently. in contradiction of a supposedly deal he would disappear to belarus. then, he died in a way that putin can say, he was a great

man, he had flaws, i had nothing to do with it. of course, he was indicating he had something to do with it because they wound up dismissing a powell of -- a powell of prigozhin on the same to hey. what this suggests is that pollutants control over russia is not rock firm. host: what it means on the battlefield and the wagoner forces there? guest: it might have a small issue -- small-ish. i am wondering why putin treated with gloves. we are taking him out and so on. it is because prigozhin remains a little bit of a hero in russia. we all know that the russian army has flopped in ukraine. we all know that the victories that russians have achieved their have been largely due to wagner and prigozhin.

that is understood. beyond that, prigozhin treated his mercenaries who were not conscripts from prison relatively well. he paid them here it he made sure they had adequate clothing and weapons. we know that is not true for russian soldiers. there is a certain sympathy in the russian military for the way prigozhin treated his troops. all these things point to the adequacies of putin's rule. host: what is the ukrainian number of offensive tell us about the state of this war and how long it may go? guest: the offensive has turned out pretty much the way i expected it. i have got some things wrong in the past, but not this one. guest: you did not have high expectations? i have been coded since march, given the timidity of the biden administration sending weapons to ukraine, the only thing we can be certain of is modest

gains, which i defined in as several hundred square kilometers of liberated territory. they have already done that. it is conceivable they may have more success. we cannot expect it since we are not sending them the missiles, the f-16s -- though we seem to be inching toward a decision to give them f-16s and various other equipment. host: the biden administration asking congress for an additional $24 billion for ukraine. the congress will take that back up next month. if you were taking that request to capitol hill, what is your pitch to members of congress? guest: it is a simple pitch, which i regret is not being made except by senior republicans in the senate. russia is pursuing a policy designed to seriously hurt american interests. if moscow were to succeed with this war on ukraine, we would have to worry about moscow extending its control into the

baltic states and our allies. therefore, the smart way to defend his by american interest. the stability and security of europe is to give ukraine a means to defeat the russians in ukraine. if you understand putin's objectives, he has not hit these objectives. the 40 or so billion dollars we gave ukraine last year and this year represents around 4% of our defense budget. that is a wise and economical investment in american security. host: when did it get to be too much? is there limits, and is there a weapons system that is too much of and ask? guest: if you believe that stability in europe is vital, not just to american security, but american prosperity, then $40 billion a year -- 4% of our defense budget -- is a small cost to ensure europe remains strong and free and stable. host: what about weapons

systems? should we be getting them f-16s? guest: of course. that is the whole point. if we give ukraine these things, they will take back significant parts of their territory. they will probably force moscow to give up its aim of subduing ukraine. that is the smart play for us. the administration is halfway there. they need to go all the way. host: the war in ukraine, you can do so. now would be a great time to do so with john herbst, former ambassador to ukraine. democrats can call in at (202) 748-8000. republicans, (202) 748-8001. independents, (202) 748-8002. he is with us until the top of the hour, start calling in. the defense department spokesperson responded last week to the possibility of u.s. training ukrainian pilots on the f-16. i want to play about a minute and a half of that. [video clip] >> what does the administration

think of long-term implications of the f-16 delivered to ukraine is going to be? what is the ultimate long-term goal depending on -- out of this? >> in terms of for ukraine? when the citizen -- the decision was announced in may in terms of providing ukraine with the f-16. we highlighted that this is part of our long-term commitment to ukraine's security and defense. so, we have clearly a focus on the near term, the battlefield situation, which is what our pdas and usa i have been focused on. the f-16 is really intended to be part of that longer-term commitment. host: john herbst, can you dive into the near term versus the long-term commitment? we have had conversations with abrams tanks on when they hit battlefield, when they make a

difference. we are hearing the same thing with the f-16. guest: it is very similar. essentially, the administration has been slow and timid in responding to ukraine's request for weapons. we only agreed to send abrams in january. even now, i do not think they have arrived yet. they are about to arrive soon. we should have taken a decision on the abrams, we should have pushed the germans on the tax a year ago so it would have arrived in ukraine in large-ish numbers by march or april of this year to be ready for the offensive. the ukrainians do have a couple hundred tanks now. host: what is the most effective weapons system we provided at this point? guest: in terms of impact on the battlefield, it is when we finally sent time bars with the himmler's which gave a range of 80 or so kilometers in june of

last year. that stopped immediately. it enabled ukraine to take over the counteroffensive. the russians were not expecting it. it hit the battlefield in a way the russians had to adjust after losing territory. if the attack were four or five months ago, it might have had a comparable impact. by refusing to send the weapons and being slow one tanks, we gave russians the opportunity to prepare for the counteroffensive. host: what is the arrange -- the range of attack again and what is your concern about providing ukrainian weapon systems that could strike deep into russia for fear that it could escalate this conflict to something much bigger throughout europe? guest: ok.

the attack guns have a range of 300 kilometers. you cannot strike deep into russia with a weapon system that has a range of 300 kilometers. the ukrainians have shorted washington -- have assured washington they would abide by that restriction. that is .1. .2, attacking into russia should not be an issue. russia is creating great damage in ukraine. russia's attack on ukraine has been an attack on not just ukrainian soldiers, but ukrainian citizens, intentionally. putin is an indicted war criminal by the court. genocide scholars are saying it is genocide. morally and strategically, there is no reason why ukraine should not be willing to strike into russia. regarding our fear of escalation , any time dealing with nuclear power, this is something you have to consider.

the biden administration has been intimidated by moscow's nuclear threats in ways that no american administration since the nuclear age has been intimidated. we have been dealing with a nuclear russia since 1950. we have over 70 years of experience. you go back and look at previous major crises between us and moscow. cuba in 1962. you never had senior american officials say, we do not -- we cannot do x or y because moscow might go nuclear. that is not consistent with our nuclear practice. that is not consistent with our interests. we only convey weakness with it. keep in mind, if putin by threatening nuclear war prevents us from giving ukraine what it needs to win, he will do the same thing when he comes for east dona or poland -- estonia or poland. other russians have said, that is their intention. host: let's chat with some

collars. peggy is waiting in washington, line for democrats. go ahead. caller: yes, good morning, john. i just went say i really admire the ukrainians. amazing people. they are fighting brilliantly over there. i just was so worried about the republicans here that seem to favor putin. i do not know what is going on in this country, but i tell you, i am perplexed. i never seen anything like this. we should be so behind them. so behind them. but, we are not. we are more afraid of putin. i do not understand it. i just want to say, bless your

heart for everything you're doing and bless their heart. hang in there. thank you, bye-bye. host: john herbst. guest: i agree there is a populist movement, which you see in part of the republican party, which simply fails to understand how important this war is to vital american interest, to american prosperity, to american stability. some of these folks claim they want to make america great or strong again, but when putin launched -- when russia launched cyber attacks on the united states two years ago, which led to serious problems with our food supply, serious problems with our petrol supply, we did not have any criticism with russia coming from those quarters. this is dangerous. this is dangerous. i think there are maybe some reasons for this ignorance relating to our failed policies under bush, the younger.

under obama, even under trump. but, this is different. we have a vital stake in making sure that putin loses in ukraine. if you believe america, if you want america to be strong and prosperous, you should understand this. host: here is a republican on capitol hill, andy harris, a senior member of the republican party from maryland. this is his quote i washington times last week. think the time has com realistically call for peace talkskrai and russia. i know president zelenskyy d not wantt, but president zelenskyy, without our help, you will abjectly lose the war. with our help, he is not winning it, it is a stalemate now. guest: if congressman harris, who up until that statement, had been a strong supporter of our policy, understood that putin's

objective is not principally ukraine, his objective is to restore his influence across the entire territory of the former soviet union. he is coming for america's allies, nato. if you understood that -- he understood that, he would not formulate things this way. he would say it was vital for us to make sure russia fails. if russia cannot win in ukraine, it is not that he can create mischief directly with our allies in europe. the $40 billion or so a year we provide to ukraine in economic and military assistance represents 4% of our defense budget. that is a good investment in american security. putin is coming for our interests and we need to stop him. host: sam in virginia, independent. you are on with john herbst. caller: good morning. i 100% agree with your speaker.

the only thing people basically benefit from is [indiscernible] . the gentleman has not demonstrate for us so far, it is all the money we are spending in this corrupt government, what we have accomplished. also, they could not blackmail the south and that is why they established -- 40% of the economy on the war is this dividend. the gentleman needs to stop and provide some facts and tell us about the victorian unit and our role and how we sabotaged the

democratically elected people and all this nonsense and -- host: let me let john herbst respond to that. guest: i did not hear everything you said. forgive me if i do not address everything you sent. what you need to understand is that, again, putin is pursuing a strong anti-american policy. this attack on ukraine would be a step towards taking attacks making advances against american interest farther west in europe. if we allow that to happen, europe is going to become an area of four again, not an area of peace, stability, essential for american security. you seem to think the united states overthrew a democratic government in ukraine. this is simply wrong. i know about the phone call that

victoria nuland had when she was assistant secretary under the obama administration. the president of ukraine whom you are referring to has been sitting comfortably in russia since he fled ukraine in 2014. after he permitted snipers to kill over 100 peaceful demonstrators on the streets of ukraine. he left ukraine because the ukrainian people were tired of his authoritarian practices, not his democratic practices -- his authoritarian practices. he left not because victoria nuland had a phone call with the ambassador of ukraine, but the people of ukraine rejected him. host: huntington, west virginia, pat. line for democrats. you are on with ambassador herbst. caller: good morning. let me start with a little history.

in 1972, shortly after the -- allowing people to vote at the age of 18, i voted in my first election. i voted against richard nixon, who many thought would not get reelected because he had supposedly secret plans and the vietnam war. my question is this. with the politics right now, it is obvious that donald trump is going to be renominated as the republican standard there, even though he has been indicted. he has promised that he will end this war in 24 or 48 hours as soon as he gets into office. people were saying, he is never going to get reelected. i am here to tell you, i am watching very carefully. he has 70 million at least who are going to vote for him as soon as they get a chance. all he has got to do is continue

stating he has got his secret plan, being the war. he may get enough independents and other people that are tired of this to vote for him. my question is this. what do you think about his suppose and plan to end this war in 24 hours or 48 hours? address that please, sir. thank you. guest: there are two ways this war could be ended relatively quickly, not necessarily within 24 or 48 hours. the good way, the smart way, the way we defend american interest, is to give ukraine all the weapons it needs to defeat the russians on the battlefield, which would prompt eventually a negotiation which enables ukraine to exist as a strong, sovereign and stable country. secure country. the other way to do it is to end all american and western eight

to ukraine so that russia wins -- aid to ukraine so that russia wins. if trump does one or the other should he become president again, you could have a relatively quick ending to this war. one of those options is very much in american interest. i wish the biden administration would do that now. the other would be a disaster for american security and american prosperity. host: is there any situation where you see a negotiated settlement where russia holds onto some part of ukraine and that is still a victory for western interest? guest: the short answer to that is, yes. right now, putin's objective still is to establish political control in ukraine. western does not usually talk

about negotiations right now. they encourage putin to continue this war. he believes the west is evil, he believes that not just regarding president biden and the democrats, but regarding the trump republicans. he thinks they are fools because they will not let him achieve his objectives. they are useful idiots to him. talk about negotiations now, we encourage that you on the part of putin. but, if ukraine were able, with our support, to deliver decisive -- a decisive blow to russia on the battlefield, for example, if we send the f-16s and additional equipment, if they were able to reach the sea of ours off and break the supply line from russia to occupy ukraine to crimea, putin has a terminus military problem, supply in crimea and a tremendous

political problem. as a result of something like this, he were to say, ok, i am ready to have peace talks -- he suggests negotiations -- maybe ukraine will be willing to some form of territorial compromise. a compromise which includes security guarantees from the west, may be joining nato, includes continued western military support for ukraine. ukraine can achieve stable peace. the predicate for that, the essential condition for that, is that decisive, military defeat or moscow on the battlefield. host: jack in alabama, republican. you are on with ambassador herbst. caller: good morning. i do not know what is worst, your guests historical literacy or his audacity. how can you on tv and say figuring in the russian nuclear

response to any kind of military action has never been a concern in's 1950? did you live through vietnam? you know that was a lie. second. i am hot. i love guests that have never been so much in a high school fistfight trying to talk about a war as if it is some kind of parlor game. there is half a million ukrainians -- dead ukrainian so far, buddy. how much longer do you want this thing to go on and how come you think a couple of squadrons against the world's best air defense is going to make a difference? host: i want to give john a chance to respond. guest: you have a great deal of heat. you need more light. the reason why we did not attack north vietnam is not the fear of nuclear weapons. we did not want the chinese to come into vietnam the way they went into korea.

so, if you were historically literate, you know that. you would know what i said regarding our nuclear policy is truth. that we have had 70 years of nuclear practice and nuclear diplomacy and nuclear doctrine. we never had a senior american officials saying we cannot take divisive steps to defend our interests unless the other side may go nuclear. we are a nuclear power, too, and we are far more powerful than russia is an respect to military. the question is, do you understand the prudent is dangerous for american interests? you showed a great deal of outrage about what i said. are you outraged when putin's folks launched the -- on the united states two years ago which led to disruptions in our food and petrol supplies? if you believe strongly that the united states should be secure,

you should understand that stopping rogue actors like russia, like china, is very much in our interest. we are not talking about a parlor game. we are talking about defending the united states. i think you are a strong, american patriot. you need to understand things a little bit better than you do. host: a headline, the atlantic council confirms herbst fell ill among possible russian link poisoning. what happened? guest: the atlantic council issues statements which i refer people to. the point is, i had a neuropathic incident to and a half years ago. it was never clearly determined what led to that. poisoning was one possibility. i am not saying that is what happened. host: how long did you serve in ukraine? guest: i worked in ukraine for three years. host: when did you leave? guest: i left in 2006. host: what were your impressions

of the country then, thinking about specifically the idea of one day, possibly, joining nato and being part of a nato alliance? guest: at that point, ukraine pursued something they called a multi-vector policy, meaning they wanted good relations with russia, the united states, the you and so on. -- the e.u. and so on. the man who was present when this began -- president when this began, that was his policy. the ukrainian constitution, when he was president, said ukraine will follow a neutral foreign policy. when moscow launched this war on ukraine in 2014, it had nothing to do with ukraine joining nato. ukraine had no interest in joining nato. they lost -- launched the attack on ukraine because ukraine was considering making a trade deal

with the european union. there is a great deal of misinformation regarding moscow's policy towards ukraine, which speaks to -- which hides the fact that moscow's objectives are aggressive and not just related to ukraine, but coming again from united states. host: about 10 minutes left in our program with ambassador herbst. this is kaz -- tab, minneapolis, good money. caller: thank you for c-span. i'm enjoying the conversation. i just wanted to respond to a caller a few back that mentioned donald trump has a plan for ending the war in 24 hours. i still find it mystifying that trump supporters believe that donald trump has plans. they might recall, he had a massive health care plan.

he had a plan to have mexico pay for the wall. he had a plan to solve social security. none of that came out during his presidency. thank you for your time. have a great week. host: donald trump in ukraine. guest: again. trump has never understood that russia is posing a threat to the united states. he almost got china right, but he got russia wrong. he continues to get russia wrong. if putin succeeds in ukraine, we have to worry about him moving on our allies, especially the baltic states, poland, romania. if he were to win ukraine, we would have to spend far more on security in europe. so, a wise investment to make -- to keep america strong, to make it stronger, to make it greater,

is to give ukraine what it needs to defeat putin in ukraine. host: michael thorne on twitter, the conversation has been happening throughout our discussion this morning. saying, referring to our nato discussion, putting nato on russia's border with ukraine will be seen as an existential threat by russia. that is what increases the concerns about russia as a possible -- russia's possible use of nuclear weapons. guest: that is a well -- let's see -- a well spread myth. prigozhin gave a talk before he launched this mutiny in which he said the reasons russia gave $1 billion to ukraine are nonsense. ukraine was not going to join nato in 2014. only now do ukrainians want to join nato. serious russians are saying, ukraine being joining nato is not an existential threat to russia. keep in mind, baltic states ordered russia.

finland is now in nato because of moscow's big invasion of ukraine. you look carefully at this, you see it is a myth. it is a myth designed to intimidate weak minded westerners. it is surprising that americans who say they want to make america great and strong again have been -- these russian threats. it is ironic. host: what can finland and sweden bring to nato? guest: they have advanced militaries, which i have understood for decades that russia can be dangerous -- but understand, now, russia is so dangerous to them they need to become members of nato, which underscores my point. these are two countries which, for decades, were prominent and proud neutral countries. so, why do they suddenly need to join nato? host: to california, jim, republican.

good morning. caller: good morning. mr. herbst, thank you for your service to our country. my question is, do you think that biden's were involved somehow in their business dealing with the war between russia and ukraine? they had business in ukraine and russia. remember, russia gave them money , also. what is your opinion? guest: i do not think that those business dealings, whatever they were, are related to american policy towards this war. i think the biden administration deserves credit for the support he is giving ukraine, for allowing international reaction to moscow's aggression. i also think the administration has been timid in sending the weapons ukraine needs to win

this war. they have been partly intimidated against american interest by prudence nuclear threats. host: if they get the f-16s and additional tanks and attack drones, some people ask, what is the next ask? guest: i cannot be certain because i am not a military man. i do not know what the military situation would be. there is no reason why we should hesitate to send ukraine what it needs to win this war sooner. host: what if the ask is a battlefield tactical nuclear weapon? guest: we are not going to give nuclear weapons to any country. i am not advocating that. i work with lots of very smart people. several use to have many stars on their shoulders. none of them are advocating that. any conventional weapon -- there might be something i'm not thinking of right now -- the answer should be yes. host: matthew, north carolina,

independent. good morning. caller: good morning, how are you doing? host: doing well. caller: [indiscernible] this idea might be of interest. what if the united nations were to form a division that was solely dedicated to the -- leader, get that leader attacked in another country and the united nations coded to [indiscernible] that division would automatically -- host: you are going in and out. a u.n. fascination squad is what he is asking about? guest: i think that is probably

not a workable idea. also, probably not a good idea. host: two pennsylvania, linda, democrat, good morning. linda, are you with us this morning? caller: yes, hello. i support ukraine. i hate war. my parents are survivors of world war ii. here it is, my generation and the effects are pretty obvious, still. i support sending ukraine because russia invaded ukraine. they were the aggressor. as much as i hate to think of thousands of russian young men who are now deceased and the ukrainian men and people displaced, i would like to see this war over as soon as

possible. thank you. host: john herbst, that is our last call. a sentiment that maybe a lot a people feel. i will give you the final two minutes. guest: it is pretty simple. a senior ukrainian official told me, you know, it is bad to live under russian bombs, but it is far worse to live under russian occupation because the aim of the russian government, which senior officials have said multiple times, is to "destroy ukrainians." that means they intend, if they can -- if they take control -- two insist on, to take strong, oppressive measures against ukrainians who identify as ukrainians and want to live free as ukrainians. that is why genocide scholars

say that what russia is doing in ukraine may well be genocide, not just the bombings in the torture and everything else, but the aim to wipe out a culture of people. the crane has no choice. -- ukraine has no choice. american interests dictate our strong support for ukraine as it fights for its life as ukraine, because putin's objectives go beyond ukraine. they are coming for critical american interest. if you put america first, you will understand this is a smart way to protect the united states. host: john herbst is the senior director at the atlantic council , a former ambassador to ukraine. that is going to do it for us this morning on the "washington journal." we will be back tomorrow morning at 7:00 a.m. eastern, 4:00 a.m. pacific time. ♪

and russia. "washington journal" starts now. ♪ host: good morning. three hour "washington journal" is ahead for you. we talk about campaign 2024 and the latest on ukraine. but with 435 days to go till america decides who occupy the white house, we want to know who is your favorite american president and why. give us a call on the phone lines split by political party. republicans, 202-748-8001. democrats, 202-748-8000. independents, 202-748-8002.