>> coming up on c-span's "washington journal," we will take your calls live as we commemorate the anniversary of september 11. then, politico's caitlin emma previews the spending battles on capitol hill this fall, including the september 30 deadline to fund the government. and turning back to the 22nd anniversary of the september 11 attacks, we take a look at current threats against the u.s. with daniel byman, a former staff number of the 9/11 commission. "washington journal" starts now. host: good morning. today marks the 22nd anniversary of the september 11 attacks. nearly 3000 people died at the world trade center, the pentagon, and a field in pennsylvania. you will spend the first hour

remembering and reflecting on 9/11. how do you mark the anniversary? what are the lessons of that day? we will take your calls by region. eastern or central time zones, the number is (202) 748-8000. mountain or pacific, (202) 748-8001. we have a special line set aside for those outside the united states. that is (202) 748-8002. you can send us a text to (202) 748-8003. be sure to include your first name and your city, state. and we are on social media, facebook.com/cspan, and x and instagram on @cspanwj. welcome to today's "washington journal." a couple of programming notes i want to make sure you are aware of. president biden will be coming back from the g20 summit, and he will be giving remarks about 9/11 in alaska. we will have live coverage of that at 4:15 p.m. eastern here

on c-span. the pentagon's 9/11 commemoration ceremony will follow this program at 9:00 a.m. eastern, and we will carry that live on c-span. new york city's 9/11 commemoration ceremony will get underway at 8:46 a.m., when the first plane hit the tower. that will be live coverage on c-span 2, but we will show you the beginning of that here on this program. all of those, also, you can watch on c-span.org and c-span now, our free mobile video app. take a look at this article from usa today with a headline, how many people died in 9/11 -- firefighters, passengers, and more who died 42 years ago. this september 11 marks 22 years since the terrorist attacks on the world trade center and pentagon. an event that changed americans

live forever. united airlines flight 100 75 and american airlines flight 11 departed from boston en route to california before hijackers crashed them into the north and south towers of the world trade center in new york city. american airlines flight 77 hit the pentagon, while passengers attempted to overtake knighted airlines flight 93 from hijackers before it crashed in pennsylvania. it left 2977 dead across new york, washington, d.c., and pennsylvania. that total includes the 2700 53 who died after the planes struck the twin towers, 184 at the pentagon, and 40 people who died when flight 93 crash landed in pennsylvania. the youngest flight passenger who died was christine hansen, a 2-year-old on her way to disneyland. the oldest was robert norton at

82. the 19 hijackers from the militant islamic extremist group al qaeda also died. then-president george w. bush was at an education event with second graders in sarasota, florida. here are a portion of his remarks moments after learning about the attacks. [video clip] >> ladies and gentlemen, this is a difficult moment for america. i, unfortunately, will be going back to washington after my remarks. i do want to thank the folks here at the booker elementary school for their hospitality. today, we have had a national tragedy. two airplanes have crashed into the world trade center in an apparent terrorist attack on our country.

i have spoken to the vice president, to the governor of new york, to the director of the fbi, and i've ordered that the full resources of the federal government go to help the victims and their families and to conduct a full-scale investigation to hunt down and to find those folks who committed this act. terrorism against our nation will not stand. and now, if you join me in a moment of silence. may god bless the victims, their families, and america. thank you very much. [applause] host: that was 22 years ago today, september 11, and we are spending this first hour remembering that, asking you how you remember it, how are you commemorating this day.

this is a gallup poll asking how concerned are you about being a victim of terrorism? here, you can see the numbers here going all the way back from 1997 to 2021. here is the spike just after 9/11, going up to 58%. these are the numbers that are either very or somewhat worried about you or someone in your family being a victim of terrorism, coming down here to 36% most recently. i also want to show you before we start taking calls very soon -- the numbers are on your screen by region. eastern and central time zones, (202) 748-8000. mountain and pacific, (202) 748-8001. for those outside the united states, call us on (202) 748-8002. rudy giuliani, of course, was

the mayor of new york city at the time. he gave remarks on this day 22 years ago. [video clip] >> a situation like this, a tragedy like this, instills lots of feelings about anger and hatred. i ask of the people of the city not to have those feelings right now or ever. the reality is hatred and insanity and prejudice caused this situation, probably. and we have a lot of people in this city of all different backgrounds and diverse religions -- they are not responsible for this. whoever is responsible at this -- for this came from outside the city of new york. i am sure the ics government will figure out who it is and we will make an example of them, but that should be left to law enforcement authorities, like the police and the fbi and the military, not the people of this city. nobody should react this way. we have no reason to expect anyone will, but i thought it would be a good idea to remind everyone of that.

hatred, prejudice, anger, and irrational reaction to things is what caused this tragedy, and the people of the city of new york should act differently. we should act bravely, act in a tolerant way. we should go about our business and show these people they cannot stop us. and they can't. host: that was rudy giuliani, of course. he is in the news still. this is an associated press article about him. it says the fall of rudy giuliani, how america's mayor tied his fate to donald trump and got indicted. the article says this, that rudy giuliani glared across the washington hearing room as a lawyer seeking his apartment after the january 6 insurrection act how did this man, celebrated as america's mayor after 9/11, become a leader of an attempt to overturn a national election? it is like they are two different people.

this is what the lawyer said last december -- i do not know what happened to you gianni -- to rudy giuliani or what. he has seen his reputation eviscerated, and now his liberty imperiled for his steadfast assent to donald trump's claims. let's go to the phones now. dan is in saulsberry, massachusetts. caller: good morning. thanks for having me on. i have called into this show -- i started to call into this show because of 9/11. i started watching this show because i really started to become very concerned about the activities of our government, but i had not spent enough time

looking into how our government acted. i knew i never wanted to be a democrat or a republican. i knew there were issues, but after 9/11, it compelled me to really take a deep dive into the activities of our government, which we, as united states citizens, are responsible for our government. and i tell you, that was a very difficult, eye-opening look. it changed my worldview, because i decided, as a human being, i needed to stay with the facts, stay with science, regardless of propaganda, rhetoric, and persuasion. and, boy, it revealed a lot of

things. and i will tell you, since taking a deep dive into how our government operates since 9/11 they have really gone overboard with propaganda, that is actually legalized domestically by this thing called the smith mann drowned act that was slipped in the 2012 defense authorization act. that is where we are getting the media completely lying to us, and there is really no repercussions. i just wanted to shout out all the victims of 9/11. of course, i feel for them. there is only a couple people left in the world who have the capability of suing the united states government because they have had direct relatives who have died. they have been denied, year after year after year, any court

time. and there is a group of engineers i also want to shout out to, architects and engineers for 9/11 truth. they have thousands of licensed structural engineers talking about how impossible the events that happened in new york city were -- host: all right, dan. and speaking of grievances, here is the full text of bin laden's letter to america, where he outlines his grievances against the country. this was released just after the 9/11 attacks the following year in 2002, calling on americans to embrace the religion of islam as well. i will not read it here, but if you would like to read it, it is at theguardian.com.

lou is in tampa, florida. caller: good morning, c-span. good morning, america. i think that it is a sad day. and, you know, we can't put our finger on everything that transpired before this horrible act happened, but a good friend of mine up in new york -- i was up in new york at the time. a good friend of mine, his father, worked for -- worked on campus fitzgerald. he was never found. i feel bad. i feel really bad for all the people that lost, the fathers, the mothers, everybody. it is a solemn day. i could never go to the museum. i went to the pools. and all those firefighters and ems, police officers, all those

ray people. and they are still very brave. we've got to come together. i know this country is divided, but we got to persevere. we have to come together in this country, because we are ripping ourselves apart. worse than maybe another september 11th attacks, we have to come together. thanks for your time on the phone. i appreciate it a lot. host: and lou mentioned the fire fighters. abc news is reporting that the 9/11 death toll continues to rise 22 years later. the fdny continues to feel the impact of that day. the fire commissioner said that they have got a memorial wall of those killed as a result of 9/11, and the search-and-rescue and additional numbers are being

added to that. a new ceremony unveiled on wednesday revealed the second largest group to be added to the memorial wall since it was created 12 years ago with 59 names. teresa is in ormond beach, florida. good morning. caller: yes, good morning. god bless all the victims of 9/11. i just want to say that no iraqis on those planes that bombed the towers, and yet my favorite president, george w. bush took us to war and had so many of our soldiers killed and so many people over there just for some show. i will tell our governor here of florida, he wanted to sue the saudis a few years ago because of the people that were killed on 9/11. but you know, there is a long connection with the saudis and the bush family.

there is a book called "house of bush, house of saud," in the way -- we are not supposedly sending them weapons, but our present president is still sending them weapons. so anyway, i always wished al gore, who rightfully did win the election -- we would have had a different world right now. but still, it is a sad day. and i agree with governor graham -- the saudis have not paid yet. they are due. host: and a few posts here on social media. on facebook, tony says, after all these years, i still cannot talk about it without shedding tears. all the heartbreak, misery, and fear on that day still gets to me. in the aftermath of that day,

there was so much bravery and sacrifice by citizens pulling together to help. marks said, also on facebook, it should be a national holiday to remember the people who died that day. albert said god bless the new york firefighters that sacrificed their lives for honor and duty. douglas in new hampshire, good morning. caller: yeah, hi. i am calling to say that we will never get the full truth of what happened that day, just like we are never going to learn about what happened to kennedy. the commission was rigged from the beginning. we looked at every engineer worth his weight in -- or they will tell you buildings do not collapse like that, especially when trillions went missing a couple weeks before. it's fishy. host: douglas, did you ever read the report done by the engineers at nist regarding the collapse

of the towers? caller: i did not, no. host: so there was an extensive, years long study by the national institute of standards and technology that you may take a look that that explains why those towers behaved like they did and collapsed in the way that they did. and james is in lawrence, massachusetts. good morning. caller: good morning. i would like to express my soup of the to anyone who lost their lives or connected to losing their lives to this terrible disaster. i would also like to thank c-span for shooing -- for showing their true callers for trying to smear rudy giuliani or anyone. i am a democrat, man, but what you just did was the most disgusting thing i've ever seen on television. this station is just going down the toilet with the rest of the country and the bidens.

thank you. host: all right. and let's take a look at thehill.com. this is headlined pence swipes over 9/11 comments. it said republican presidential candidates exchanged barbs after the former vice president was deeply offended by comments not believing the 9/11 commission. -- when he was asked whether he believed the government about the september 11, 2001 terrorist attacks, "i don't believe the government has told us the truth." ramaswamy said, what i've seen the last couple of years, we have to be skeptical of what the government does tell us. he said, i have not seen

evidence to the contrary, but do i believe everything the government has told us? absolutely not. he said, do i believe that 9/11 commission? absolutely not. pence responded, said those, stiffly -- deeply -- said those comments deeply offended him. he said he was probably in elementary school, i was on capitol hill. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call. i would like to reply to the person who just called prior to me about giuliani and new york city. i've lived in new york city my entire life. i was actually on my way to college when what happened -- it was a tuesday morning. the skies were blue. and it is called the southern train. it connects queens to manhattan. i just want everybody in the united states listening to this

to understand what you would have seen that day. i will be brief, and i will finish my point. have you been on the train, the southern train on that day, you have probably seen people from every culture you could imagine, every religion, every caller -- color. that is what democracy looks like. democracy is not easy. it is about tolerance, it is about accepting, and it is about being in a room with people you may not agree with. we were stuck in trains all day, and that is not easy. but that is what it looks like. democracy is not waking up and looking at yourself in the mirror every step of your way across the day, looking at news you agree with, looking at people exactly like you. and on that day, when those towers went down, it is a sad and tragic day, because after that, all we saw were pamphlets everywhere of people missing,

and the streets were closed down, and there was a sense of union that giuliani was a part of. he allowed the city to move on from this tragic event. it united us, and it tried to move our city and country forward. sadly, what happened on january 6 was an extremely sad day, because no matter what the taliban did on 9/11, the ideal of the united states was not stride. on january 6, the ideal of what this country is was shattered. and the people that support, the people who look at alternative stocks, the people who look at us and say this was just a parade, this was just a march, people who have been arrested because of this, people coming up on stage -- the candidates

that came up and said they would pardon trump for what he did, that has done what they never could do. anyone calling talking about that they are sad, look at what is happening now in this country and see that democracy is threatened, and we have to take a real look at ourselves in the mirror and say what is the real future of our country? thank you. host: let's take a look at then-president george w. bush addressing the nation on the evening of september 11 from the oval office. [video clip] >> good evening. today, our federal -- our fellow citizens, our way of life, came under attack in a series of deadly and deliberate terrorist attacks. the victims were in airplanes or in offices. secretaries, businessmen and women, military and federal workers, moms and dads, friends

and neighbors. thousands of lives were suddenly ended by evil, despicable acts of terror. the pictures of airplanes flying into buildings, fires burning, huge structures collapsing, have filled us with disbelief, terrible sadness, and a quiet, unyielding anger. these acts of mass murder were intended to frighten our nation into chaos and retreat. but they have failed -- our country is strong. a great people has been moved to defend a great nation. terrorist attacks can shake the foundations of our biggest buildings, but they cannot touch the foundation of america. these acts shattered steel, but they cannot dent the steel of american resolve. host: that was president bush 22 years ago today on 9/11.

we are taking your calls about this day and the remembrance and how you are spending the day, how you are marking the day. john is in cleveland, ohio. caller: good morning. i really liked -- ramaswamy. i do not put -- promoted by practically the entire media and government in this country. i think people that -- a phrase i device myself. cia controls media and movies to demonize countries for u.s. attacks against them. cia controls media -- host: so, john, what do you think happened on 9/11 then? caller: i believe it was an inside job that let it happen or made it happen on purpose -- host: for what end? caller: for the invasion of

countries around the world, from afghanistan to iraq, of course. and if the d -- and the draconian diminishing of our civil rights in this country and the guys protecting us -- host: couldn't that have been done without killing 3000 americans? caller: well, exactly, the people within the government, the necon variety around the bush-cheney administration talked about their grand designs for u.s. hegemony around the world could not be accomplished with out a second pearl harbor attack to galvanize public opinion in the united states. and there is a word you can look up, anybody can look up -- operation mockingbird. it was a plan of the pentagon to kill americans.

operation mockingbird, look it up. and they smugly said in this document, that was released by james van peart inside the national security agency, a conspiracy to kill americans with terrorist attacks to justify a worldwide intervention around the world, and we have seen that ever since. i think people should look that up, operation mockingbird. it was actually released documents -- host: we got that, john. and here is a text we got from mike in santa monica, california. he says it should not take an attack or an act of war like and 11 was tonight us as a nation, meaning we are divided or united as make up our minds to be. this is also a text from larry in chicago. i hear all the time about china being our biggest threats.

to me, the biggest immediate threat is still al qaeda and all their cohorts. no one even talks about 9/11 anymore except on 9/11. maybe this threat will be thought about at least today. and on x, rr says "i will never forget the sadness, the the wilderness, the fear, and confusion from that day. trying to get in touch with people who worked at the towers to see if they were alive. watching the towers collapsed was surreal. it was a horrible day, and the not knowing was the worst." martin, harrisburg, pennsylvania, good morning. caller: yeah, martin crawford. i worked at that navy demo in pennsylvania outside the base was a 7-eleven store. it was owned and operated by a guru from pakistan.

i was a security guard at the time. --were all in the store. i reported to the fbi and the secret service. i'm sick and tired of not getting anything done. my full name, your listeners, please record this. my full name is martin hufford. my number is 717-562 -- host: anthony in miller place, new york. go ahead. caller: thank you for your expert help in resolving all these affairs in american politics. building 7 was not hit by a plane. it collapsed a half-hour if not 45 minutes after having been reported collapsed. the news reporters in england had been reporting it the same time that it collapsed behind a

news reporter, it was a live feed from london. they couldn't explain what the building was that was pre-following behind the woman in the newscast because it was 45 minutes before it was reported to have fallen. also, sandy berman went into the national archives and destroyed document on various occasions, and nothing was ever exposed about that other than sandy got a slap on the wrist. now you say to yourself -- and, too, i was involved with the air traffic controllers on that morning. the five controllers, if you heard them converse about what transpired, you would be deeply concerned, because we had been on a red alert on that morning. if you remember, it parachutist got caught on the statue of liberty a week earlier. we were on the highest level of code alert, and we said, the controllers amongst us, we said he was lucky he did not get shot

out of the sky -- he was carrying a banner about landmines. they did not shoot him out of the sky, but they rescued him because he got caught on the torch. then a week later, 9/11 happened. we were ready. he had an hour and 45 minutes lead time. norad was called five times, and they stood down. someone in dick cheney, bush's administration had their finger wherever, and they did not allow norad to respond here they responded to the parachutist. three planes were up there. and on 9/11, there was nobody to be found. now sandy berman -- host: are you saying that norad was not called on 911? because it was. caller: we called them five times -- host: but they did scramble jets. there were jets in the air. caller: if we are under attack and i call norad to respond.

regather -- and -- regardless whether it is practice -- host: but they did respond. caller: excuse me, i am sorry. host: i said they did respond. they scribbled the jets. caller: 45 minutes earlier. they could have responded earlier, but they did not care because the air traffic controller on duty picked up on it. the cockpit transponder was turned off before the tires left the runway. and the air traffic controller handling the first flight called supervisors, called norad. he called and called. he is watching the scope and sees they are not responding here he says what is going on? and the girl he spoke to says we have to find out. nobody listened to him. and they recorded all those tapes. they recorded all the controllers that morning, the five of them, what transpired, because they knew they would not be able to come back to work the next morning because of the stress levels. the union requires they take a

few days off because of an accident. and that is another protocol in aviation. so the supervisor recorded them all on tape. and after, they were told to save that evidence. seven months later, they destroyed in the evidence. the supervisor ripped up all the tapes, he shrugged them, burn some of them, flushed some of them -- host: and just to be clear, anthony, you are an air traffic controller? caller: robert totman handled the first plane, gave them an hour and 45 minute lead time, and -- host: i am not clear on your connection. you're just reading about this? caller: i worked out the golf airport, try concentra, robert totman. host: got it. lee in charleston, south carolina. go ahead. caller: yeah, everybody's got advice but no true answers.

the problem is everybody is somehow confused. when those planes went through there, all that fuel, jet fuel, of course it can incinerate everything, for that matter. it is just unbelievable, some of the people. and it seems like the republicans who are the ones asleep at the switch. it was george bush, and now, all of these republicans talking about conspiracy theories -- it is ridiculous. host: ricardo is next, dominican republic. good morning. caller: good morning. yeah, a lot of conspiracy theories today. i actually like to look at information we have, things that we have evidence for. for example, operation cyclone, which was by the cia and mi six,

in which we supported -- from 1979 through 1992. matter of fact, there was a news article -- i forget which newspaper, but it was like anti-soviet warrior puts his army on the verge of peace, and it had a picture of osama bin laden. i wish you would show that, actually. but all that to say is we brought it upon ourselves. all of the things that has happened is all due to imperialism that we have at in the middle east, and many other countries as well. which is why i am saying america deserved 9/11. host: dan on facebook says the destabilizing and already --

killing civilians is not worth -- caller: hi. i'm really glad so many people are calling in and telling the truth about what happened on 9/11. people have done research about this. architects and engineers from 9/11 truth have done great research on this. it was physically -- and according to physics -- incapable, jet fuel, of melting steel girders and causing a collapse into its own footprint of the buildings that were actually hit by planes, much less building 7, which no plane hit. people need to ask these questions. we have a project for a new american century that said, exquisitely, that absent a catastrophic and catalyzing event like pearl harbor, we will not be able to pursue our foreign policy agenda. this was done by bush -- they

murdered americans to justify imperialism abroad, and we do not talk about this because it was some guy who came into this. it was not osama bin laden who did this -- host: so i just have a question about the guy on the cave. bin laden, he is on tape bragging about 9/11. caller: that is a lie. that is not true. you are spending a propaganda and lies that has proven to be false, because you are just parroting -- you know what the worst, most idiotic conspiracy theory is the one put forth that stupidest summary of what happened on 9/11. it was a lie, complete and total snow job, and everybody knows it, because people are not more on. we do research. if architects and engineers for 9/11 truth -- these are people who are scientists -- host: but also scientists said, nist also did an sensitive

investigation. did you read that as well to compare it? caller: people inside the bush administration said they couldn't pursue their foreign policy agenda unless there was a massive loss of american life on american soil, that magically happens as soon as they get into office? look, this blatantly -- what plane hit building 7? tell me that? host: jared, wilmington, delaware. good morning. jared, are you there? caller: yes, i'm here. sorry about that. can you hear me? host: yes, go ahead. caller: yeah, this is really crazy to hear. i was in fifth grade when this happened and watched it live in my classroom. since then, i've been doing research. a couple of things i am hearing i want to address. yes, the government was aware there would be some type of attack. the type of attack we were

unaware of. the twin towers had already been attacked before, so the reason that they put out even a document was -- the twin towers were in the crosshairs was there was already an attack previously. i do not believe the u.s. government had anything to do with that. i believe they were aware and you something would happen, but one and where it would happen they were unaware of. the people that we hear spouting these conspiracy theories are the same people who believe antifa was in on january 6 so that nancy pelosi told the guards not to come. we have got to get past these people. it is time for them to get an education. ramaswamy talks about learning physics and getting back to our roots as a nation. why don't these people read and actually be dedicated to our

nation and not dedicated to donald trump and conspiracy theories with these 10 hats on? it is ridiculous. everybody thinking they are smarter than the next guy is just ridiculous. host: all right. let's take a look at the speaker of the house at the time, dennis hastert, leading members of congress in a moment of silence on the evening of 9/11 22 years ago, after which both parties start spontaneously singing "god bless america." [video clip] >> our thoughts and prayers are with the families and friends of those injured and killed in this attack. we also remember that thousands of rescue workers. the ask that we bow our heads in a moment of silence.

thank you. >> you ok? >> ♪ land that i love stand beside her and guide her through the night with the light from above from the mountains to the prairies to the oceans white with foam god bless america, my home sweet home

god bless america, my home sweet home ♪♪ [applause] host: that was the steps of the capitol 22 years ago today on 9/11. we are taking your calls for the next 15 minutes. sandy is calling from ohio. caller: hello there. thanks for taking my call. i cannot believe i got on. also, from what i heard and understood, there was warnings as blatant as "watch out for planes going into buildings." we brought them over here and we trained them in florida, how to fly a plane. not how to land one, just fly one. we kept them in our motels, we

let them get on our planes. there was such a gap there that our government was not taking all these warnings. so, sadly, they let it happen. it had to be. they get paid big bucks to protect us. they did not. host: you think that was intentional? caller: that they did not investigate it? well, we get so many calls, we cannot follow up on them -- i've also heard that. i do not know all of this is true, but i've always felt that we just let it happen. we were warned, and we let it happen. why? who knows. but it is very, very sad that they did not follow up and do their job. and that is why it happened. host: all right.

austin, texas is next. benjamin, good morning. caller: good morning. i was just calling -- thank you for offering a levelheaded memorial type of program this morning. i think the fact that there are others who think there is a conspiracy is just a strong indicator of how traumatic it was for all americans and how traumatic it continues to be, and that we need to remember that, regardless of what you think happened, it happened. we lost thousands of americans, went into a 10 year war. and osama bin laden is dead now. i think that is a great thing. i do not believe the conspiracy theories. like i said, people have trauma for that and they tried to find an answer for that does not exist. because sometimes the truth people do not take, and that is just the way it is. thank you for taking my call, and thank you for your journalism and questioning

people on the basic facts of reality. thank you. host: all right, benjamin. fred is next, philadelphia, pennsylvania. caller: good morning. a little bit of history i think people really forgot. back during the clinton administration, the terrorists tried to bring down the world trade center than with those vans that were in the parking lot and all. i think that was the beginning. i worked in the world trade center back in 1982 and 1984 for a communications company. our communications were in the buildings -- i forget which one they were but the one with the antenna, and communications were on the 10th, 11th, and 12th floor. we had to run data cables in the ceilings there. once we took those panels out, you could actually see the outside part of the buildings, which was very, very -- you can

see the i-beams and everything. i do not think it was too much of a problem when the buildings imploded. my wife and i, back in the 1970's when they were building the buildings, we were going up the jersey turnpike to visit an aunt in brooklyn, and we could see a select of them building the buildings. i am not saying that they were easy to come down, but i don't think -- first of all, it was not built like the empire state think of the empire state building had a plane, i believe it was 1952, a bomber went in there, and it did not come down. the reinforcement of the empire state building was a whole lot different. but it was a very sad day. i can remember it like it was yesterday. i've been retired now about 15 years. on that day, we have to shut everything down. i just wanted to say, for all the doubters out there, don't -- i can't say who actually did it,

but i know there was a terrorist attack. that is all i am saying. thank you for taking my call. host: let's talk to kitty next in california. caller: hello. i just wanted to call in and give so much love and honor and respect to all of the families who are hurting so deeply today, and all of the extended firefighter families, all of the first responders. my husband is a fire chief, my son is a firefighter engineer, and my other son is a lifeguard under a fire department. today is such a somber day. all of the souls who ran in to save people, those are the people we need to remember today . all of this talk about who did

it, why they did it -- we have gone over that a billion times. all of these kooky conspiracy theorists just put a stain on this day that is sacred for so many people. and i just felt -- i never call in, but i just felt compelled to remind everyone that everyone who was alive on that day -- there are so many young people who weren't. all of these people spreading misinformation and soiling such a sacred day is beyond a vile and disgusting, and i want to extend my love, my prayers to all of the families who will never be home again, to all of the collateral damage done on that day, and we need to measure it never happens again.

with a country divided like it is right now, with people believing anything on the internet instead of real facts. 9/11 changed us all. and for a minute, it was for the better, and now, i see so many things that are separating us, and it is heartbreaking. i decided to become a journalist on 9/11 to make the world a little bit better place, but, somehow, there is so many people who are hellbent on spreading hate instead of love. and i just wanted to call and give love to everyone who is hurting today and honor our heroes, who ran in knowing -- th ey knew that building was going to come down, and they just wanted to save as many people as they could. and from the ordinary heroes to help -- who helped each other that day, names we will probably

never know -- host: all right. caller: sorry. host: i understand. kathy in fremont, california, go ahead. caller: hello. i appreciate what the lady just said. that was wonderful. one of the things i remember from 9/11 is that planes stopped flying. i remember looking up at the sky here, and there were no planes. maybe you could go over that, how long that happened. thank you. host: ok, we will look for that information, that there was a complete stop on all air traffic in the country. all the planes that were in the air were asked to come down and land wherever they could. i will get you more information on that. george, louisiana. good morning. caller: good morning. thank you for taking my call.

i have just always been -- i am not a particularly conspiracy-minded person. maybe there was a second shooter who killed -- sorry. but that -- host: you still there, george? ask like we lost him. try to call back if you can. hill grove in johnstown, pennsylvania. caller: good morning. there are a few people who should be recognized. coley rolling and dashing line were whistleblowers for the fbi. kenneth williams was in phoenix. they notified the bush administration of the flight school training that these saudis and the bush and cheney

administration did nothing, no investigation at all into these flight schools. i think they are complicit in the 9/11 attack -- host: what you mean there was no investigation? caller: no investigation of the flight schools, or this attack probably would have never taken place. host: so explain that a little bit more. are you saying that the flight schools accepting these students? caller: yeah, the flight schools were just doing their jobs. they were training these saudi arabians to fly these planes but not to land them. host: right. caller: they were notified by: raleigh and kenneth williams -- by colin raleigh and kenneth williams that these things were going on, and the bush and cheney administration were notified and they never did anything about it. host: as far as what? caller: that is a fact now.

you want to learn about war profiteers, blackwater, halliburton making all kind of money after this 9/11 attack. sometimes you have to wonder about the motives of the administration. host: ok. john in costa mesa, california is next. caller: good morning. thanks for c-span. i was in new york on 9/11. i saw what happened. i was in queens. my wife is japanese. she got a call -- i usually watch c-span in the morning. she came and said some building got hit. i slammed my hand, my fist ot the table and said "those

s.o.b.'s," because i had seen e bush administration -- were painful times, the bush admission. -- the bush administration. i went to the staples center -- but not the stable -- the javits center. there was all kinds of people from around the neighborhood, all people, everybody. they had cutters and welders -- every 9/11, i would find myself crying while i worked. the people that work closest to the center of that thing were the most impacted. i had a client that was around the corner from them. i talked to him, and he said he would not really know unless you were here. and i lived in the city. those people who got hammered, so don't tell me i do not understand 9/11 when i am skeptical of what happened

there, and i believe it was an inside job. look where we are now. 22 years later, and we are swallowing all this crap about this clown that wants to be an authoritarian in our country. i don't know how the far right controls all the radio, but you can feed the american public all kinds of crap, and there has got to be truth that comes to the top. i will tell you something, the planes hit them. we were standing on the ground, my wife saw when the second plane hit and she went to work, and some other people in the city stuck around. you know, something real happened there, but the accountability for it, i still don't understand completely why colin powell was fed a bunch of b.s. and we went to iraq and did

all this stuff. look at us now. look at the geopolitical landscape. host: all right, we are out of time here we will end with this text from dave in orlando, which says 22 years later and we still have callers with grand conspiracies. that is such a shame. that is all the time we have got for this segment. up next, we will switch gears and talk to politico budget and appropriations reporter caitlin emma about what is and is not happening on capitol hill to avoid the september 30 deadline to fund the government. and daniel byman, senior fellow at the center for strategic and international studies and a former staff member of the 9/11 commission, he will talk about today's 22nd anniversary of the september 11 attacks. ♪

>> gargensler testifies. the rules and bylaws committee will meet. on friday and saturday, coverage of the prey, vote, standard summit in washington, d.c.. watch on the c-span networks on

our free mobile app and head over to c-span.org for scheduling. he spent, your unfiltered view of government. -- c-span, your unfiltered view of government. >> healthy democracy done -- doesn't just look like this, it looks like this where a republic thrives. get informed, straight from the source on c-span, unfiltered, unbiased, word for word from the nation's capitol to wherever you are, the opinion that matters the most is your own. this is what democracy looks like. "washington journal" continues. host: welcome back to "washington journal." i am joined by caitlin emma.

welcome to the program. guest: thanks for having me. host: the recess is over for the house. the senate returned last week. where are we in terms of a possible deal to avoid a government shutdown? guest: recess is over in a big way. there are only a few weeks to avert a government shutdown which would kick in on october 1 the house and senate can't figure out a way to find common ground and fund the government. we are no closer to that goal of averting shutdown. a lot of people this time around feel like it might be more likely than not given the dynamics. you have a senate trying to pass a small package of bipartisan funding bills this week. those bills have been advanced out of committee largely along

bipartisan lines. you have a house that is kind of in turmoil. no speaker mccarthy have to walk a narrow tight rope between his conservative detractors and moderates who are both demanding different things. mccarthy is hoping to's -- to pass a few spending goals but both sides will have to settle for a short-term funding hatch to keep the government open past october 1. even that path this time around is fraught with a number of different problems and it will be interesting to see how things shake out. host: let's look about the senate, an article you cowrote in political with the headline "senate looks to get on the minibus." explain what is going on in the

senate and what we should expect. guest: as soon today, possibly tomorrow, the government expected to take its first procedural vote toward passing the minibus which is essentially a small package of government spending bills. the senate is hoping to pass three of the least controversial bills as soon this week. looks to buy senate leaders a lot of leverage. looking at us, we have our stuff together we can pass bipartisan funding bills. this is in stark contrast to what is going on with house republicans, which is a chaotic mess. the senate will try to take that

step in passing three funding bills to send a message saying, we have our stuff together, it is time for you to come to the table and a stop making crazy demands and fund the government together. host: does that mean if it doesn't happen it is on the house, politically taking the blame for not getting a deal. in this case the house would take a lot of blame because the discontent, you have the senate, the two women currently in charge of the appropriations committee, patty murray and susan collins, hell-bent on restoring regular order, bipartisan process, getting things done in a timely action. they are big on touting the fact that for the first time in five years they passed all of the spending bills out of committee largely along bipartisan lines.

speaker mccarthy is facing a real dilemma and possibly even jeopardizing the speakership if things go really poorly. you have conservative members who are demanding spending cuts that are wildly unrealistic and far beyond the bills they have already drafted. they have members frustrated that the speaker keeps capitulating to the conservative members. if anything will go wrong it is probably going to go wrong in the house in terms of what does it ultimately bring to the floor and doesn't have enough votes to pass it? host: reviewers, if you like to weigh in, you can do so on lines by party affiliation, democrats (202) 748-8000, republicans (202) 748-8001, and independents (202) 748-8002. you can also contact us by

social media. there is an article by political, house freedom caucus rolls out demands to avoid shutdown. you mentioned they had mentioned demands. can you give us more detail about what exactly they are looking for if they have single -- signaled any willingness to compromise on those demands? guest: there have been no -- has been no willingness to compromise and the freedom caucus. this all began earlier this summer when speaker mccarthy and president biden negotiated a two-year budget deal to essentially lift the debt limit and avoid a much bigger crisis that would have occurred than a government shutdown. a debt default is untenable. you have a lot of conservatives who feel firm that the fact that

mccarthy teamed up with democrats to stave off this crisis. it required democratic help. they feel the speaker sort of went back on his promises he made in order to get elected speaker earlier this year and we remember how chaotic that process was. now you have the freedom caucus members saying, this is our moment, stand our ground and make demands. already we have seen house publicans draft spending bills -- republicans draft spending bills, tens of millions of dollars that could be utilized in many different ways are serving less on the table. conservatives demanding steeper spending cuts then what have already been negotiated and the appropriations bills, you have any number of other demands that

have to be met. have folks like congressman chip roy saying he is not going to vote for any kind of continuing resolution to fund the government unless the speaker mccarthy attaches republicans southern border reforms. he is saying funding the government should be conditional on the secretary of homeland security basically resigning. others are saying a few defund the justice department and fbi. a lot of lofty demands that would ever have a shot of making it the senate or white house being made and how mccarthy navigates that with his conservative factions is what everyone is lunching at the moment. host: talk about previous government shutdowns and with the economic impact has been and the impact has been.

guest: either party wants to shoulder the blame for a government shutdown. it never looks good we saw that with the last government shutdown under former president donald trump. republicans bore the brunt of that with the border wall. it does not a good look and it is one of those things that starts out innocuous and gets worse and worse as it continues over time. definitely saw that with a 35 date shutdown a few years ago where maybe initially -- 35 day shutdown a few years ago where you maybe figure out him off rate with an without funding which are essential and who still needs to be here. the longer it goes on the more people get furloughed and paychecks start getting delayed and it becomes a huge mess that

spirals out of control. host: the white house has asked congress for an additional $16 million in emergency spending. talk about what that is for in where that is right now. guest: this is a very important request. it is going to states that have been affected by disasters like wildfires, hurricane and the island of maui which is recovering from devastating wildfires. all these dates need money and they need funds to continue the recovery efforts. that request includes, initially included -- included $12 billion for the disaster relief and now as an additional $4 billion in disaster relief. there are also broader quests

that deal with border security funding. you have a lots of opposed to giving ukraine more money. you have republicans like senate leader mitch mcconnell who say this is probably the most important thing we can be talking about and doing to ensure that country can continue its war against russian aggression and that we are not turning our backs on a country like ukraine. the findings members -- the funding to avert a shutdown will be critical in negotiations and could help get more embers on board, maybe republicans who are wary of where they really need disaster relief and it can be used to get folks on board when

you have fractions in the house the way we do now. host: tim is first in michigan, republican. caller: just have a comment and maybe a question also. the government -- i don't understand how they can provide money for people in all of this when we send all of our money into the government but then they get to choose where they get to spend it. that doesn't make any sense to me because we just give it to them so if they shut down, they aren't doing their jobs so white with a get to keep their jobs? i guess that is my question to you.

guest: federal workers certainly don't want to be in the position of losing their jobs. a lot of these folks want to report to work and shutdowns in their life is not a good thing. a number of workers would be affected over the country. you have federal workers in paul states all -- although i think maryland see had the most that would be affected. when you work these jobs you rely on congress to keep sending you to work to ensure your agency is able to function with an operable budget. these rural workers are sort of at a loss in the sense that if there is a shutdown there isn't too much they can do aside from being it gets resolved quickly and hope it doesn't go on long enough that they won't be missing paychecks.

host: mitchell is calling from new jersey, democrat. caller: my read on this whole shutdown talk is the hard-core right of the republican party is really furious about what happened during the debt ceiling negotiations and i think the large incentive on their part as they were outnumbered by the biden administration and they want another bite of the apple with shutting down the government. as far as the democrats though, they realize the republicans have lost their leverage because even though a government shutdown isn't perceived as a good thing it doesn't have nearly the weight as fault --

defaulting on national debts. and if we look at past history, the blame to go down with the party that instigated the shutdown. that is my comment. i would like to hear your reaction to that. guest: i think that is exactly right. we discussed how a number of conservatives feel like they were burned by that deal and speaker mccarthy gained ash teamed up with democrats for what you described as a catastrophic default. it is a scenario that has never happened before and the stakes were really, really, really high. in this case a government shutdown is something we are dealing with here every year it

is a new fight. the stakes are high and a number of government services would be jeopardized. it is one of those scenarios where conservatives, like you said, can get another bite of that apple and wheeled their influence and try to gain as much leverage as possible. you have a lot of conservatives saying they are not afraid of shutdown and this is something that they feel like the government can handle. it is unfortunate consequence in the fight for making sure if are on a fiscally responsible path, i think a number of tis would be ok having a shutdown be a casualty of what happens. host: charles in texas texted, the funding deadline, i think there will be a government shutdown because the unrealistic demands of the fritos caucus --

freedom caucus embers and speaker earth he may lose his speakership. andrew is in middletown, new jersey -- speaker mccarthy may lose his speakership. andrew is in middletown, new jersey. caller: does congress still get paid during shutdown? guest: i believe they do. i know there might be legislation that has floated around to ensure they are not paid if there is a shutdown. that is something that has been on the table and incentives to ensure that doesn't happen. our and number of members in congress that rely on their paychecks. host: the house, andrew? -- anything else, andrew? caller: since ash we have had paper money we have nothing to back it up.

host: federal workers would stop getting paid and essentially be furloughed so they will stay home. what has happened in the past is they aren't paid at their backpay from the point of the government shutdown. so there is an economic impact very directly on that. they are not going to work but taxpayers will end up paying their salaries in the end anyway. guest: certainly, and it is the question of how long can they go without the back pay. during the 30 hi -- 35 day shutdown, we saw that not everybody has the funds to miss a couple of a check ash of paychecks. something comes up, a medical situation and people, some people don't have the savings they can rely on for weeks and weeks to ensure they are going to get that backpay.

it is a tricky situation and we are gambling with the lives of everyday people work with the government because they would be the ones most directly affected by a shutdown. a number of republicans aren't afraid of that consequence and are willing to risk it and shoulder the blame for what they see as a worthy cause. host: let's go to kevin in florida, democrat. caller: actually, i am a republican. host: it looks like you called on the wrong line. 2 caller: -- caller: it was a federal employee during one of the shutdowns and i would like to explain my situation. host: go right ahead. caller: i was not able to work during that time and my wife was a teacher and we met with an educator and when we picked that educator up we ran into a couple

of -- from australia. please told me that an armed guard prevented them from being able to get to rushmore. i drove up there and the park service at armed guards preventing people from pulling on the state i wake. the point was, the government used the shutdown to punish the american people as hard as they could to make us put pressure on our politicians. in your own budget, if you spend beyond your means, you are out of luck. in this case, all you are doing is laying off a bunch of overpaid employees that threaten american people. that is how it appears to meet. host: you felt that you were overpaid? caller: yes, i think most federal employees know they are overpaid fear they get every federal holiday off.

they get comp time off. if you got into the paint where it is ridiculous. host: let's get a response. guest: i think you are right in that you were one of those workers who wasn't able to do your job. as you described during the shutdown, things like national parks. a lot of d.c. would shut down, those would close, that all closes. so there is a direct effect on what remains open. host: i was going to ask about social security checks. would they go out to stiller with a stop? guest: this of security checks would not be affected. social security and meda tear -- medicare and medicaid is part of the federal budget not discretionary which is what

happens in a shutdown. the funding that directly goes to federal agencies is known as the discretionary part of the federal government. it is a very small part of the federal budget that everyone is fighting about. rest of the critical services and benefits would not be affected by shutdown. as we saw earlier this summer, a debt default, there are many other implications for that. social security beneficiaries and things like that come that is not funded by the kind of money we are talking about. caller: back is next on the line for democrats, harrisburg, pennsylvania. caller: first of all, i don't think it is that these guys are

noble and stand on principle when it comes to shut down, they are basically living because being gerrymandered they don't have to worry about it. it cost the economy $8 billion. i have a lot of friends and family who work for the federal government and by no means are they overpaid the services they provide us. of those guys wind up going to the food bank because some of them also live paycheck-to-paycheck. we have these guys who go to d.c.

green called biden a liar when they knew they were coming after peoples social security. it is ridiculous. it is creating chaos. is chaos, i am looking at what is happening behind the scenes. these guys, when the boston marathon bombing abend, we were looking and they were writing bills that allow them to trade on information that they learned in congress. host: let's get a response. guest: you made a good point when you mentioned food banks which is something we saw with the 35 day shutdown with federal workers turning to food banks and appealing for different

federal and state aid and anything to sort of help them get over the hump until they could get backpay. like we were talking about, a lot of people don't have the funds to be able to miss paychecks. things come up, payments have to be made. a lot of folks are relying on critical money to get by week to week that is something we saw in the shutdown went on so long during the trump administration that people were turning to help to simply get through the day and be able to eat. host: looks is in st. paul, minnesota, republican. caller: thanks for taking my call. i used to actually work for the federal government for a couple of years. i left. but i think they would be

entirely within their right to shut down the government and i understand why people are conserved about the average federal worker. the truth is that right now, the managerial path in the federal government just don't listen. you can listen to the oversight hearings where they lie and misdirect. they didn't give answers about the withdraw from afghanistan. they don't give any answers. yet emails from nih that were heavily redacted. and it comes out when you get the unredacted version that they were functioning -- they were funding gain of function research. host: you are going in and out so we will try to get a response. guest: i think you get at eight

sentiment that a lot of folks feel when we are talking about federal workers not being able to get by during the shutdown, especially the longer it goes on. there are a lot of who would be fine with the government shutting down. there is mistrust in the federal government. you're getting it from that. i think a lot of republicans feel the same way in that the government is broken and bloated . and would a shutdown be such a bad thing? that is not my personal feeling but that is sort of the sentiment. the continual discussion of is the government going to shut down, not shut down, can congress fund the government is the type of fight that comes year after year and it feeds that. it feeds the mistrust in government and the ability for the government to really be able to serve the country.

it is a discussion a lot of people are tired of. a lot of people are wondering why can't congress do its most basic function and fund the government on time without it being a huge problem over and over again. that feeds the sentiment you were getting at. host: what are the next steps? what are you going to be watching for in the next few weeks? guest: both chambers have a lot of interesting things going on. the senate will try to pass a government funding at this week and say, look, look out functional we are. the art doing our job and that is in stark contrast to the house. i think what ever but he is really going to be watching is house speaker mccarthy navigates the next few weeks and how he navigates his conference on these issues. certainly there is interest in

passing the house republicans defending bill is the same vein as trying to lay down a marker in the standoff with democrats. the thing that everybody is really going to be watching is can mccarthy keep his speakership through all of this. any government funding measure to avoid the shutdown could involve a good number of democrats. just as we got to the debt limit crisis with bipartisan help, while no republican has taken the steps to directly threaten the speakership, that could be different this time around. you have republicans saying in not-so-subtle terms they are not afraid to go there. politically everyone will watch house speaker mccarthy navigates the next couple of weeks and will there be a government shutdown.

a lot of people think it is more likely than not this time around. host: we will definitely be watching that. caitlin emma is a budget and appropriations reporter for politico. thanks so much. guest: thanks for having me. host: of next, daniel byman discusses today's 22nd anniversary of the september 11 attacks and current threats against u.s. homeland. we will be right back.. >> this week on the c-span networks, the house and senate return with both chambers taking up federal spending bills to avoid a shutdown theovnment september 30. the 22nd anniversary of 9/11, live coverage of commemoration

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host: we are back now with the former 9/11 commission staff member and a current center for strategic and international studies transnational threats senior fellow, daniel byman. let's start with what you think is the legacy of 9/11 and the broader war on terror. guest: the 9/11 attacks shaped a generation and had a profound impact on u.s. foreign policy and also u.s. policy at home. when we think of foreign policy, two things stand out when is the work in afghanistan and the overthrow of taliban after 9/11 and the 2003 invasion and occupation of iraq. the second was politically made possible in an environment where

americans were thinking about terrorism and concerned and iraq became enmeshed in that. it also had an impact on u.s. day-to-day foreign policy around the world where the primary issue wasn't russia or china, the primary issue was would you work with the united states against al qaeda and starting 10 or 15 years later, would you work with the united states against the islamic state. it a profound affect. -- it had a profound effect. the war in have ash in afghanistan joined with the u.s. withdraw. the best majority of americans see the invasion of iraq as a mistake. it shaped the attitude peered the costs came in trillions of

dollars and also american lives because many americans are very leery of intervention, especially in the middle east. the attacks shaped america at home and created an environment of concern and fear about the next terrorist attack. right after 9/11, the bush administration was operating with concern that the next attack was right around the corner and many of the policies put in place were put in place with that in mind and this shaped things like various fbi and broader government programs to go after suspected terror suspects in the united states and shaped americans' attitudes toward immigration, especially around muslim and arab countries. so the effects shaped a generation but it is important to look back because i think we are moving forward both in

policy -- foreign policy and domestic. host: you talked about how this shaped americans' fear of a terrorist attack. do you think americans are safer now from international terrorism than where we were on 9/11? guest: yes, and let me explain why using the 9/11 attack as an example. if you go back to what we now know about 9/11, it was an attack that was plotted from safe havens in pakistan and afghanistan, where al qaeda was able to really gather. in the 1990's, thousands trained in al qaeda training camps and they were able to take what they thought was the best of these to use for terrorist operations. the leaders had a safe haven. individuals would come and go

from these areas without disruption. and then for 9/11 it self, they were able to recruit people not only from the arab world but also from germany and they were able to travel to afghanistan and they subsequently held meetings in other countries without interference. and then they traveled to the united states, where there was at best a very confused and limited effort to try to discover jihadist linked terrorists in the united states. five years later, we see all of that has changed. the haven in afghanistan and pakistan was disrupted by the invasion. havens around the world are under pressure, this could be in the form of drone strikes taking out terrorist leaders as happened a year ago with the killing of the al qaeda leader. and also in the form of special

operations happening around the world to go after suspected terrorists. the united states is going after various groups linked to al qaeda and the islamic state and there is an intelligence campaign, where the u.s. government is coordinating with governments around the world to put pieces of the puzzle together. when people go to and from war zones they are on the screen and being watched. and the united states, a much more aggressive effort from the fbi in particular to go after suspected jihadist. so it becomes much harder for a group like al qaeda. i want to be clear we are talking probabilities. the chances of success for a group like al qaeda to do a spectacular terrorist attack in the united states especially are

greatly diminished. host: let's talk about the role of the patriot act and government surveillance in general. guest: after 9/11, one of the concerns the u.s. government had was that there were large numbers of americans and in this case american muslim -- muslims linked to al qaeda and trained and that concern too. to be false that this was an operation perpetrated by people coming from the american muslim community turned out to be exceptionally loyal to work closely with the fbi. but the changes that the patriot act and other legislation did were actually profound and in many ways quite necessary. a lot of the u.s. apparatus for surveillance was dated. to pick one example, it used to

be that when you had a warrant you got it before cell phones, it used to be that if i had one own. but people have multiple cell phones and you can easily change numbers. part of the changes in legislation were just catching up but a lot of changes also concerned that access the government had to information gleaned by american technology companies. as we all know, these are giant companies and they have huge rings of information. the legislation was designed to give the government easy access to that. also related to the changes was there was a lot of effort at the fbi and apartment of homeland security to put resources to the problem of individuals in the united states who might be linked to terrorist.

there were people who analyzed the information. this meant there were a lot of programs in place that enabled the government to get more information on americans much quicker and to keep it in ways that would help u.s. government go after suspected terrorists. host: section 702 will expire at the end of the year and there is a reauthorization fight going on. explain what it is and what does it do and where are we with the reauthorization? guest: section 702 of the foreign intelligence surveillance act was a large change that enable the u.s. government to collect information on foreigners living abroad without a warrant or any sort of oversight if there was a national security issue. this has allowed the function of vast amounts of information.

what makes this controversial is that foreigners living abroad might be in contact with americans. and so that percent abroad might have say 100 phone calls and in 90 of them are to other foreigners but tend might be to americans. and this sort of collection is called incidental collection, not the target. if the goal had been initially two after the 10 americans, the u.s. government would need to go to a judge and get a warrant. however, there is now concern because those 10 americans keeping with that example are now in contact with someone who is on the radar screen of american intelligence, presumably for some concern, let's assume terrorism in our case area 702 is incredibly powerful because it is the government access to this information and under certain safeguards the government can

query about those americans who showed up on the radar screen, look at their names and social security numbers and whatever mission -- information they have and learn more about them. this is extremely controversial right now and i think for good reason. it is set to expire at the end of this year and must be renewed by congress. it has been renewed in the past usually in a bipartisan way because it is so incredibly important for both intelligence in general and counterterrorism. it gives a huge amount of information cap on the unsuspecting terrorists but on unknown people who might be linked to them and that is one of the biggest challenges in terrorism is not finding someone who is already on your radar screen but finding someone you don't know is in danger in this often reveals it but this has tremendous civility for abuse.

so instead of going to a judge to go after an american and getting a warrant, that the government instead uses this ability to have a link to a foreign terrorist suspect and avoids the judge through 702 authority. and there have been abuses that are clearly inappropriate depending on what side of the political spectrum you are on there have been reports this has been misused to go after people in black lives matter and to go after people involved in the january 6 insurrection. in these sorts of cases, the fbi should have gone to a judge to get approval rather than use 702. the fbi claims mistakes have been made but they have put in significant safeguards and that in recent years it is the

numbers of queries that have gone down 93%, an extremely large numbers of the safeguards are having an impact but there is the question of whether there should be further restrictions on the types of inquiries done on american citizens that must have some degree of judicial approval. this is an example of broad power given to the government in the years after 9/11 that is being considered in a different light. host: if you would like to weigh in, we have our guest until the end of this program, a little before 9:00 eastern. the lines are bite region, (202) 748-8000 in the eastern or central time zones, (202) 748-8001 if you are in mountain or pacific. outside the united states, call up on (202) 748-8002. you were a special staff member on the 9/11 commission good can

you remind viewers of what the commission concluded about what happened that day, intelligence failures and the recommendations? guest: mission had a number of recommendations, some related to the threat itself, urging the united states to focus not just on terrorism in general but instead on al qaeda. and rather than treat this as a broad danger with enemies everywhere but a lot of the response concerned integration. one of the problems in the pre-9/11 era was the distinction between threats at home and threats abroad. it seemed like a clean bureaucratic line where the fbi were focused at home and place like the cia and national focused abroad and there would be some sort of handoff. but with the 9/11 attack showed that sort of distinction doesn't work. you had a group based in

afghanistan and pakistan but operating in the united states and there was concern there were terrorist networks in the united states that were responding to foreign direction here one of the goals was to integrate foreign and domestic intelligence here that was done to a fair degree. at 702 is one example, where there was greater power to go abroad and individual suspected of terrorism abroad to investigating individuals at home. they were designed to integrate a wide range of terrorism and try to bring together people from different iraq were seized to work together more effectively. one of the hopes is better foreign and better abroad coordination. related to that was better data sharing in general. one of the problems the 9/11 investigations found was that the fbi in particular was often

not fully sharing information. let's fair to the fbi, there were parts of this that were bureaucratic and they had different field offices that often were keeping information to themselves and then the fbi as a whole was often not sharing formation with other parts of the government in a timely way. at the time the fbi had very bad information systems and was partly a technique -- technical issue there there was also emphasis going back to the 1990's and looking at things like waco where the fbi efforts were seen by many americans as abusive. there is concerned that they should not be sharing information. it should be treated as widely shared but closely guarded. the 9/11 attacks show that has

consequences for national security as well. and another recordation was on foreign policy that counterterrorism be elevated as an issue of importance that shaped american foreign policy with china, and the russian's rural invasion of ukraine, but with after 9/11 and the islamic state there was a strong sense that this is the primary foreign policy threat and american needs to optimize itself to respond. host: standby because we are going to show the begin of the ceremony happening right now in new york city at around zero. [bagpipes playing]

[reading names] host: at is the beginnings of the ceremony happening right now in new york city at ground zero, the reading of the names. if you would like that, it is

over on c-span2 right now. you can catch it on c-span.org and on our reit mobile adl app. we are going to go back to daniel byman. we will start taking calls from him, luke is up, kingston, new york. caller: i am a 9/11 first responder and got disabled from the events of that day. this is a day for me never to forget. when the planes hit the towers and the towers went down, i was there within 24 hours. people were running all over. it is really rough. i work 16 hour shifts with the army national guard. they packed us in rooms of 25 people in a room. we didn't have time to take

showers. we were so exhausted. it was such a sad day. i also worked the pile. the body parts total in the tens of thousands. there are things of like to see happen. i would like to see those who finance this to pay to the victims and first responders. i would like the airline companies to pay their part. they walked away. the third thing i would like to happen is i would like to see all the federal funding that has been given it out, to stop giving it to the lawyers and doctors and give it to the first responders. i worked at homeland security. i've had plenty of briefings and i understand the world trade center is a financial center

that was part of the port authority. i understand they moved into singapore and i understand it is hardly economic structure. saudi arabia has not been our friend. they have been cutting production with russia to hurt us. i think they need to start paying these families. host: what do you think of that? guest: let me begin by saying thank you. one thing i think all americans learned or relearned was how much we rely on our first responder community for so many things and to see the heroism of people like you and many people view worked with, even many years later is still incredibly moving to me. this was the terrible attack but many of the people who did the

most to respond in the immediate aftermath of the tragedy are suffering health effects and psychological effects and not getting the support they need. when we talk about heroes is often involved in rhetoric but in practice we need to do more. on saudi arabia i have a slightly different view than the caller. the situation is quite complex. the saudi arabian government did not finance the 9/11 attacks and repeated investigations have shown that. al qaeda itself. consider a support from wealthy -- itself got considerable support from wealthy citizens. saudi arabia failed to crack down on the danger. there is good news, wherein post 9/11, especially after 2003 when there began to be attacks in the kingdom, saudi arabia became much more aggressive about

terrorism financing but it has a lot to go. we saw that when the islamic state emerge when there was funding from states and this is outrageous. part of the response from the government is to ensure that people under their jurisdiction are behaving appropriately. in my view, the appropriate response is u.s. pressure on saudi arabia to stop terrorism financing and there have been some good works but more needs to be done. of course funding point, but it has many differences with the united states. we have seen this on fresh and we need to recognize that the u.s. and saudi relationship will be complex for we should also recognize there are significant

differences in the united states and saudi arabia will also be on front sides of important issues. host: john is in germantown, go ahead. caller: i think the best thing that ever happened with the whole situation in the middle east was when president trump started drilling for oil and drilled and drilled and drilled and took us off the saudi oil. i do think the saudis were involved in 9/11. the prince was the bad man gave the money to the pilots who flew into the buildings. now i believe he is the king of saudi arabia. the families tried to sue for information 9/11. they were rebuffed by their own government. now the saudis want to take the world off the petrodollar which

is the u.s. dollar and go to some other currency. well, guess what, we fought a lot of wars to defend that. host: we are running low on time. guest: the saudi government was not funding 9/11. there were individual saudi's who played a role but the government did not. more broadly, i do think the united states needs to recognize that the energy market overall is something that has tremendous national security vulnerabilities and present buying has encouraged a wide range of alternative energies is something we cannot only do for the environment but for national security. host: he is the former 9/11 commission staff member and also at the center for strategic and international studies.