coming up on washington journal we with look at recent challenges to the social media companies over claims that they negatively impact mental health. with fair's executive director josh golin and in our spotlight on podcast we will talk to james lindsay. host: good morning it is saturday, 10/28/2023. there is a communication

blackout as israel expands its ground attack. the suspect in maine has been found dead. the new speaker of the house mike johnson has begun settling into his new role. we are looking for your top story of the week. our republican line is (202) 748-8001, for democrats (202) 748-8000 and indepents (202) 748-8002 and if you would like to text us (202) 748-8003 make sure to include your name and where you are from. we will start in washington with mike johnson who moments after his election as speaker of the house delivered remarks about his plans for the role. [video clip] >> i think all of our parents

are proud of what we are called to do here. all of the american people had great pride in this institution. right now, that is degenerating. we have a challenge to rebuild and restore trust. this is a beautiful country. it's a beautiful american dream where a son of a firefighter can strive together what lincoln referred to as the best, best hope on earth. the world is in turmoil. a strong america is good for the entire world. we are the beacon of freedom and we must preserve this grand

experiment and solve governor. we are only 247 years into this experiment but we know the founders told us to take good care of it. i want to tell my colleagues here what i told the republicans of the room last night, i don't think there are any coincidences. i believe scripture is very clear that god is the one who raises up those in authority and i believe he is ordained dated allowed to be brought forward here for the specific place and time. we have a responsibility today to use the gift god has given us to serve the people of this country and ensure that our republic remained standing as the beacon of light, hope it freedom that our world desperately needs. host: we do want to hear your thoughts on your top story of the week.

our numbers are (202) 748-8001 for republicans, (202) 748-8000 for democrats and (202) 748-8002 for indepents. some of the story we are talking about is mike johnson becoming speaker. the mass shooting in maine. house democrats need phillips who launched a campaign as well as the plea and immunity deals in the truck trials. let's start with richard in new jersey on the democrat line. caller: i am in a conundrum. it's hard to pick a side and still be on the moral high ground.

if i flip the coin i have a solution for everyone with the same problem. how about instead of israelis and arabs we divided between those who want peace and those people who are ideologues, religious crazies who believe god gave their religion. real estate exclusively. that is the enemy on both sides. the israelis and arabs who are against peace. they are the enemy and the people who want peace are the ones i support. now, i feel like i'm on the moral high ground. host: from michigan, on the

independent line. caller: good morning. it is a real difficult time right now, you get your news for a corporation and you think there is a conflict. if you avail yourself of the technology we have in the 21st century which is the internet and social media. you can see a literal genocide going. israel bombing children left, right and center in our tax dollars support that. i like how the new speaker wants to give all this money to israel so they can do more genocide. that's not america first that is israel first. host: next call from arkansas on the independent line. caller: i'm not sure with the

main discussion is. is it on israel? host: the top news story of the week, whatever it is for you. caller: well, it would be peace in the middle east. israel needs to go on a do what they need to do. i don't think anybody should be saying stop. nobody said oh stop to hamas. what does hamas mean? is there a definition or is that just a name like democrats. death and discretion --

destruction for any for their own means. the people who talk about free palestine. they are actually the same people. you go back to judah. those names over and biblical times. i am from arkansas, they need these people, these people who are for nothing but death and destruction. israel gave them land and these people they are not looking for land they just want to kill god-fearing people.

seriously, if the palestinians want to be free. go to the southern israel and get out. host: i want to bring in a piece of tape here. after offering another declaration of support for israel at the white house. president biden also delivered remarks about the safety and future of palestinians. here's a portion of that from wednesday. [video clip] israelis and palestinians deserve to live side-by-side and safety and peace. there is no going back to the status quo. that means ensuring that hamas can no longer terrorize israel and used palestinian citizens as human shields. this also means that when this crisis is over there has to be a vision of what comes next and i

argue it should be a two state solution. all parties put us on a path towards peace. in the past few weeks of speaking to leaders throughout the region. just yesterday with the crown prince of saudi arabia about making sure there is real hope in the region for a better future. the need to work towards a greater integration for israel while insisting that the aspirations of the palestinian people will be part of that future as well. i am convinced one of the reasons hamas attacked when they did is because of the progress we were making towards reintegration of israel. we can't leave that work behind.

i continue to be alarmed by extremist settlers attacking palestinians in the west bank's, pouring gasoline on fire. this was a deal, and they are attacking palestinians and places they are entitled to be and it has to stop. host: back to your calls with michelle and auburn, maine on the republican line. caller: good morning, i wanted to talk about the mass shooting here in maine. thank goodness they did find him and he is deceased. our community can finally be out of lockdown that we've been in for a couple of days. it seems like since it does happen, the focus is on guns.

i agree that guns are big part of the problem. if you look at oth countries they don't have these mas indiscriminate shooting episodes like we have here. there is not just onon there seems to be some void in our society, they are men. they have access to guns and they have some kind of mental health issue and grievances and we have to think of it is a big puzzle and figure out how to fix all of those pieces is not just one. host: what was it like during that lockdown? caller: here in maine is one of the safest states in the

country. it's not easy to live here. its high cost of living, it's cold, low wages. most of us we don't have an easy five. the one thing we always save to each other is we are saved. it hit us really hard that way. and of course, it is small and everyone knows everyone and is connected to someone who was shot. it hit us very deeply here. host: doris in pennsylvania on the democratic line. caller: my opinion about this war is so confusing.

with israel, i don't understand the situation. what how moss afflicted on the israelis was a terrible thing. they had no right to do that. i don't understand all the bombing that is going on in gaza. when you mix innocent palestinians with terrorist i don't know how you can differentiate the two? how do you know who is hamas and who are innocent palestinians? that is number one. number two, this guy that they picked for speaker of the house

is a joke. a total joke. this guy is running around with bibles, quoting scripture. we don't want no doggone preacher for the speaker. we want to guide that is about taking care of the problems of the country. not some man running around with the bible quoting scripture. that is the wrong place at the wrong time. host: let's go to michael in napa, california on the independent line. caller: i am calling until largely agree with the previous color. i am disappointed in the new speaker. bible thumping is not the solution to our problems. he is completely off base when he says guns are not the problem.

a very poor beginning. thank you. host: let's go to florida on a republican line. caller: hi, good morning. this is in regards to the issues with ballantine. -- palestine. i always wear my dog tags because i take pride in my service to the u.s. army. there were three buildings in brooklyn, new york. one of the sons of not building he would see me come down the stairs and he would see me with

my dog tags and friends come to visit me. he came down and told me, what are you guys doing in our countries? your shoulder should not be there. when he told me that i got upset. i said if you don't like it here why are you living here? they hate our country but they are here. if you don't like it here why are you here? why are all these people demonstrating in manhattan and brooklyn, they demonstrated against israel. burning their flag in our country. you don't do that. our hands are tied. our authorities are not doing anything about it.

why don't they send these people back to palestine? they should have respect for the united states. for them to tell us in our country that america is head of the snake. i used to go to utah state university. if you go to the restroom you can read on the wall death to america. kill americans. right now, i am talking to you and the hair on my arms are standing up. this is not the country that i was brought up in. but that's what's happening in our country. these people are taking advantage of us. why is this president so close minded? host: larry on our independent

line. caller: i would like to continue on that theme. i think the media has failed america terribly. the antisemitic riots that are taking place on the main college campuses throughout america have been broadcast very widely but they've been unable to interview the people who were conducting these riots. i think any cursory examination of the people who are upfront in these riots will disclose that they are foreign students. most of them are foreign students and the ins has full authority to withdraw their foreign student visas. i'm sure their parents will be glad to see them back home where they don't have the privilege is

extended to them in the united states. i would ask the president to look into executing an order that allows for immediate expulsion of foreign students that endorse antisemitic actions. host: ed and laurel, maryland. caller: first of all i would like to send out a prayer to the great people of maine. it's a terrible situation up there. what i was calling about is the new speaker. and how did we get here? how we got here is through gerrymandering. the southern states and republican controlled states. they gerrymandered their way in

to the house. they have cheated their way in. senator warnock was talking about this. the greatest threat to democracy right now is gerrymandering. you are silencing people's voices. and that is the hard-core truth. the speaker of the house in my definition is not legal. that is the way i look at it in the supreme court is biased and they decided they're not going to help us out. host: from san diego, california on the republican line. caller: i would like to talk

about this issue with main and how many individuals were killed over the past 10 years in vehiclar accidents and compare to those killed in maine. therefore we should lower the speed limit to 40 miles per hour and that would elina or bring down the amount killed and vehicular accidents. host: there is a newly elected speaker mike johnson reacting to the shootings and made during the fox news interview on thursday. [video clip] >> i want you to know that all the members of the house are deeply concerned for the families and we pray for the law enforcement officers. >> you talk about the human heart if someone wants to kill

innocent people there's a lot of ways they can do it beyond using a gun. i'm sure this will become a bigger issue throughout the day moving forward. is there any specific on lot that you would look at or any new legislation you would look at? >> i've been on the job for 48 hours, we will see. the point is well taken. in europe they use down vehicles some mow down people. i think we need to address the group problem. mental health is a big issue and we have to serious address that and there are lots of measures pending on that as well. host: frank in tennessee on the independent line. >> there is an issue that i can't square and it's been this

way for the past few weeks. i've wanted to put it out there to see if we could get some comments on it. host: must not use that kind of language will go to the next collar. caller: there are issues in turmoil. i think we need a fresh voice like that. i do respect president biden and what he is trying to do. i just think we need fresh or

voices. i hope people get out and vote. i don't want the anger and hate, it was just do better. that's all i have to say. host: we have an article from the associated press about that announcement. representative dean phillips announcing a primary challenge saying similarly to our collar that democrats need to focus on the future and calling for the torch to be passed to a younger generation. that's in the associated press. let's go to ed and ocean city, new jersey on the independent line. caller: many other nations that have had mass shootings and they had handfuls of gun shootings. and these gun turn in days are a

step in the right direction. mandatory mental health courses in all schools starting in kindergarten. i started with my nieces when they were two-year-old on mental health. host: let's go to a comet from facebook from lc who says another mass shooting of nont people in america. when will it stop? l countries have people with mental healt issues but they don't have mass shootis. high-powered capacity guns are a major part of the problem. and now let's go to ed in clarksburg, west virginia on the independent line. caller: i am glad to hear that the people and maine no longer have to worry.

they found the man dead they committed these horrible crimes. number two, on the guns, let me tell you. i would rather have one and not needed then need one and not have it. number three, i know know a lot of us can't remember it but we passed a law that banned alcohol in the united states and it would stop all this terrible drunken behavior. in 10 years or so they got rid of that law. you can't make laws and pass them that does not give you a result. if a person is a criminal and you want to be a criminal.

i found out in 1974i was going blind and i finally ended up blinded 2005. i had to depend on the news. i hope all these people who are having all these problems. you should be able to be considerate. that doesn't mean you have to be happy about it. but i don't think we need all this foul mouth and bad mouthing. host: thank you for calling. kathleen in new york on the democratic line. caller: first of all i would like to start out with the speaker. once he said the other day that he would not be an assault rifles and he was done for me. that is a weapon of war, of mass

destruction and where was i going? please don't hang about me. with the guy in maine, let me finish off to what i was saying. the only reason i think they won't be on it is because of the white militia. that's why i think they won't ban it. going on to maine, how mentally ill was this guy? you know what i'm saying? before they found him i thought they're never going to find this man or they will find him dead. and sure enough, they found him dead. how mentally ill was see he took his own life? so how mentally ill was he?

as far as hamas and israel, gaza. it hurt so much when i see the news. it hurt so much when i see the video of innocent children. it was wrong what hamas did but at the same time, they were throwing rockets over to israel. what were they supposed to do? bombing hamas like crazy and hurting and killing innocent children. no, no, no. two wrongs don't make a right. they say are they bombing hamas. really, you are bombing hamas? i see beautiful, innocent children being hurt and killed. it's not good. host: we had a similar comment from andrea on x who says the

story of the week was told in the video of hamas barbarism. it wa a genocide to which israel should respond. let's go to david in riverside, california. caller: good morning kimberly and america. israel was attacked in a way of terror that's hard to imagine an america. the hatred you see toward israel has to be evil because it's not logical. islam and the middle east has allowed themselves to be violent and cruel. there is no corollary to the restaurant world. hamas and hezbollah are the nazis reborn.

colleges across america are taking their side against israelis who just want to live. if you side with the murderers, rapist and torturers over the jewish people what is that say about your soul? the government of iran is the head of the snake. they must be overthrown before they get nuclear weapons. just as the nazis before them. before we go to another call i want to remind people of the topics were discussing today. the top news story of the week, we are following several stories including israel expanding its gaza operation. there are intensified airstrikes in gaza during a communication blackout.

there is an expected invasion thus supposed to end 16 years of hamas rule. we are looking for your top story. republicans can call and that (202) 748-8001, democrats on (202) 748-8000 independents on (202) 748-8002. let's go to jacksonville, north carolina with dale. caller: all the news is really awful this week my heart goes out to all the people in israel. the thing with the shooting in maine, i have family up there. history shows that bill clinton was a president that banned

assault rifles in 1993 and it was good for 10 years and in those 10 years, mass shootings dramatically decreased. and then the republicans took over and they would not renew it and after that the mass shootings went up. i feel there has to be a ban on weapons that kill so many people. just like in uvalde, those children were unidentifiable because of the weapons and the republicans all they care about is the second amendment. but when they wrote the second amendment, it wasn't about ar-15's it was about people protecting themselves in their homes.

until we get rid of some of these ridiculous republicans, they are a joke. they don't want to do anything for the american people. all they want to do is backstop and do revenge and nothing for the american people. even in north carolina that are cheating right now and they will make north carolina have three more republican seats because of it. when is donald trump going to jail for violating his gag order? i will leave it there, you have a blessed day. host: going back to the topic of the main mass shooting, the main congressman was a democrat who enjoyed an a plus rating and he has reversed his opposition to an assault weapons ban and he

regrets his past opposition to the band and he will now support it. let's go to pat and stuart, florida on a republican line. caller: good morning america. i just want to say that open borders, these riots in the street with these young college students who should be in school learning about the constitution. as a matter of time when our country will be looking like gaza and israel. wake up, close the border. we don't know who is in our country at this point. thank you democrats. as far as the assault weapons and guns and gun violence, the

consequences going back into schools need to be stricter. defund the police, that is what the democrats want a nasty issue. have a great day. host: anna scullion on the independent line. caller: i called and c-span 10 years ago and my comment was they need to tell the palestinian side. for years they have never told the palestinian side. now i think there is more anger. if they had told palestinian side maybe we wouldn't have been so gung ho about israel and been more fair to the palestinian. the jews take the palestinian land and they continue to take

it for their settlements. host: allie in virginia on our independent line. caller: i want to talk about the new republican leader. i am a christian but one thing i believe in, i don't think religion belongs in politics. the reason people don't like about religion is because it's been politicized and i don't think religion belongs in politics. for the man who said palestinian should not demonstrate in college towns. welcome to america. caller: we talk about assault rifles which is terrible. the thing that happened in maine

is terrible. school shootings are terrible. but they don't take into consideration that cities like chicago, new york and detroit. every summer there are young black children killed by handguns. one weekend there were 13 young people killed in chicago. i bet you in the city of chicago , there are 30, 35 young people killed by handguns. it goes on and it's like a normal thing. assault rifles are bad but is it any different than getting killed by a handgun? in all of these major cities, there are young people killed and a lot of these kids are bystanders and they are like so

what? it goes on and they let it go on. they don't worry about these young black people in these cities taken their lives and not doing something about it. i appreciate you listening. host: in axios they have a story about the new house speaker saying the problem is the human heart and not guns. under his leadership he will be responsible for dealing with efforts who are urging action in the wake of the shooting in maine. he believes it is inappropriate to talk about gun control during the crisis. let's go to andrew and brooklyn, new york, a democrat. caller: what i'm calling about

is israel. the way i look at it, this is my first time calling. i'm fairly nervous. if i come into your house tell you how to live, for 75 years, israel has taken advantage of the palestinians and the american government should be doing more for gaza. they are giving israel everything they want but nobody is talking about what is going on with the kids and adults and gazans that have nothing to do with the moss. host: next up is george in maryland on the independent line. caller: hello, am i on? host: go ahead george. caller: i want to talk about what is happening in the middle east.

you look at the 6:00 news last night. this is historical. if you don't have the historical background to see anything you won't see anything. we see children being bombed indiscriminately. it is terrible. you look at the definition of terrorism. i am not taking sides, i pray for peace. you don't take sides. you don't go in and create a country for people. the british i've been doing that. everywhere they have gone they've done that. they've gone into africa, they pull areas together and make countries and their still

fighting today. they did it all over the world. if israel is god's people then he will take care of them. that's what he does and let men be men. children being killed and those children you see today, when they turn 15 or become teenagers, they are going to remember how their family got killed and when they act you will say why are they doing this? you should be saying that now rather than looking at the place being bombed. i am not saying what they did to the israelis is right. i'm tired of this. we have to do something. the only fighting machines they have -- fighting chance they

have is to join hamas. host: we have dennis in massachusetts. caller: good morning, how are you doing. i'll we could been talking about hamas and the war. i want to bring up a point to the american people that was left in the weeds earlier this week about joe biden crime family that they had more stuff on the family being caught ran head in -- red-handed. in performance to the fbi and then covered it up for 12 years. it was on conservative tv. i can see why our country is so bad. you take political sides and hate everything.

donald trump can comb his hair the wrong way and go to jail. it's time to put biden in jail too. that's all i've got to say. the war is bad, the vietnam era was bad. let's hope and pray that god straightens this mess out and we need donald trump back in office. host: let's go to charles in kalamazoo, michigan. caller: i just want to say a lot of opinions and newspeople that don't really follow history or anything, they have a big mouth. uninformed opinions, go back to school. or do some research. some of these callers are

ridiculous. they are one-sided, uneducated and it's just ridiculous. do your research. host: from georgia, on our democratic line. caller: goodness gracious. i have one call every 30 days. i am a history freak and i am fluent in hebrew. i have been talking to friends of mine in israel for a while before the attack by gaza. netanyahu was attempting -- the only way we can compare him to someone else you can compare him to donald trump. he was trying to get rid of

supreme court and under investigation for all sorts of things. he was also invading the north. getting israelis to go up there, kill palestinians and take their land. that is just a small, small thing. i'm a history freak. if somebody wants to go back, again, they want to go to the founders and so on. i would remind folks that ronald reagan said that he believes in the second amendment that everyone should have the opportunity to own a gun but that no one should have an ar-15. that is a direct quote.

to all of those folks, just look , it doesn't happen and the rest of the democratic world. it is simply doesn't. i was in the army and i know what those weapons will do. you can take a car and kill a bunch of people, that is so crazy. host: there was a cop and from marine inassachusetts, can we own sses? can we own nukes? no because they do too much weapons. no more automatic or semi automatic guns. let's go to pennsylvania on the democratic line. hi there, rick. caller: first of all, i grew up in the 60's. i saw people protest the vietnam

war and beaten into the ground when they did. i remember kent state when four people were killed. and now these people who are protesting on campus are being blackballed. the united states ought to be ashamed of what's going on. they say they cannot control israel going in and killing those people and actually slaughtering those people. those people are like myself and other americans. all we want to do is be left alone to liberalize. you can keep taking people's homes. this is ridiculous what's going on. i am afraid is going to escalate into a war. i set a long time ago, like the woman said earlier, she called 10 years ago.

she said that what was going on in gaza was an outrage. i think it's going to escalate into a war over this. host: gloria in minneapolis, and independent. caller: my top news story of the week here is the war on the gaza strip. if you can call it a war. it's sad to say, israel is the elephant and they have people thinking gaza is an mouse. in world war ii, we only got into it because japan bombed us. if it were not for pearl harbor we would've never gotten into world war ii. but when we did we saved europe

but we wanted something for it. we got nato. what do we have in israel? we bought and paid off israel so we can have some control in a place to store our weapons. israel can't be stopped. we had time to stop it. 72 years and we didn't because we paid them. and now, they are too big. they are a monster we grew. joe biden can't do anything he should be doing a cease-fire. host: jackie in florida on the democratic line. caller: hi, ok. i'm a little nervous. the first president i voted for was jimmy carter. he tried in the early 70's to

have a peaceful resolution to the israeli/palestinian issue. he was not reelected because of the post by the israeli government but did not want this to happen. now, it's total control. the palestinians are living in an outdoor prism. no electricity, water or medical and they are being bombed. they have sticks and stones. i am appalled that my government is supporting this. where are our values? 1000 palestinian children have been killed. i understand that hamas started this but this goes back over 50 years of destitution, horrible conditions for the palestinians

that brought this about. this needs to stop in my government needs to step in and stop the slaughter of the palestinians. thank you. host: in dodge city, kansas. lex on the republican line. caller: yes, good morning. i would like to say to the lady and florida and pennsylvania, please get into a nondenominational church. study the bible. if you want to study history, study the bible. go back to where it all began and look at it. jesus was king of the jews. do you realize that? god gave that land to the jewish people. it is their land. leave them alone or you are going to be an egg trouble.

-- in big trouble. even the arab countries don't want that land and that's because they're like a wild donkey on the mountain. host: the un's general assembly has asked for a humanitarian truce leading to a halt in israel's fighting. notably, not in the un security council. 193 member body adapted the resolution of 120-14 after rejecting a canadian amendment back by the united states that would've condemned the terror attacks and demanded the release of hostages taken by hamas which is not mentioned in the arab

draft resolution that passed. the un security council failed for attempts to reach an agreement on a resolution. let's go to another caller, david in new york on the independent line. caller: i was calling because i am third-generation. when my grandparents came here they needed to learn the language and they assimilated and left behind the old traditions. i work in brooklyn and that is just the opposite. a lot of the things we are seeing in the news. you can call it antisemitism but is a lack of assimilating into america. when we see these folks talking about the chosen people. i feel like they bring this upon themselves.

they assimilated more into american views and values. host: gary and florida on the democratic line. caller: i would contend that the second amendment is obsolete. everyone i know who's the second amendment supporter always leaves out everything before the,. comma. for the purpose of maintaining well maintained militia the people should have the right to bear arms. militia is a 1700 word for militia. we have a military therefore making malicious obsolete. host: stop acting likwean't have a second andnt and not

ban military style weapons. this is a false narrative that is used to manipulate voters. let's hear from laida in holyoke, massachusetts. the independent line. caller: i am calling because my top news story of the week is the ohio state documentary. as we know, -- host: what was the name of the documentary? caller: it was awesome. i went with my mom. it was a true story. you had fbi whistleblowers, different people that are part of our congress, our senate.

explaining to people what was going on in regards to how our three letter agencies are compromised. it was unbelievable when i saw, i can't remember the name of the guy who was one of the mass shooters. he was an fbi agent undercover. they played the actual audio of a conversation. he was promised money. he was given weapons. these are people the fbi no. when i was amazed when i got back from the movie i didn't even know they had chosen the house speaker.

why, because the news was inundated with the mass shooting from maine. i understand this important and i pray for all the victims. at the same time, our government is so compromised. host: i want to give some information about this film. ed mother jones which is an online news organization that leads to the left. if i can happen simi aiken happe -- if it can happen to me it can happen to you and is called police state. that was what our guest was just referencing. it appears to be available online. let's go to stan and scottsboro,

alabama. caller: good morning. our senator from alabama commie tommy tuberville. -- she started out the week starting to support israel but not ukraine. he has held up military appointments. the reason he is doing that is he is a putin supporter. he is not from alabama. i have been here all my life. he went up there from florida appointed him and support host: trump. just charles in south carolina on art republican line. caller: good morning. what i wanted to talk about,

first of all the reason we have the second amendment is because americans need to have guns. we need to have guns to protect ourselves because we do not want to end up like hitler's and germany. once they got all of the guns out from all of the people, then they just moved that dictatorship. also, some of the people that are calling in, they do need to go back and read the bible. like it says in the bible if you pray for the peace of jerusalem and if you bless israel, you are going to be blessed. if you curse them, you will be cursed. we need to support israel as much as possible, because the

united states, our blessing has come from the lord. and it is all because of israel. had israel, had those jews excepted jesus at that time, then we might have that today. host: that is all the time we have for calls at the moment. coming up we are going to hear from fairplay executive director josh golin who is discussing recent challenges to social media companies over claims that their platforms negatively impact youth mental health. and then we will hear from the council on foreign relations senior vice president, james lindsay who will discuss his podcast "the president's inbox." we will be back soon. ♪ >> the honorable mike johnson

having received a majority of the votes cast is duly elected speaker of the house of representatives. >> the battle over the house speakership is over. house gop members elected mike johnson as the new speaker of the house following the move -- the removal of kevin mccarthy. we brought you every moment as this historic election unfolded. continue to stay with c-spa as the house reconvenes and gets back to legislative business. you can also visit our video library where you can find more about how mike johnson -- more about mike johnson's career in congress with more than 215 appearances since 2017. c-span, your unfiltered view of government. >> monday, watch the series in

partnership with the library of congress, books that shaped america. we will feature the novel "my anthonia" part of the prairie trilogy that tells the story of a friendship of an orphaned boy from virginia and the elder daughter in a family of bohemian immigrants who settled in nebraska. it addresses the immigrant experience and women's issues at the time. an english pressure -- professor of the university of nebraska have taught about the book for many years and will join us on the program. watch book shaping america monday live at 9:00 p.m. eastern on c-span, c-span now or online at c-span.org. be sure to scan the qr code to listen to the companion podcast where you can learn more about the authors of the books featured. >> a healthy democracy does not

just look like this, it looks like this where americans can see democracy at work, where a republic thrives. get informed straight from the source on c-span, unfiltered, unbiased, word from -- word for word, from the nations capital to wherever they are. because the opinion that matters most is their own. this is what democracy looks like, powered by cable. >> washington journal continues. host: welcome back, we are joined by josh golin, executive director of fairplay. and the website is fairplayforkids.org. welcome. guest: thank you for having me. host: we will hear your calls a little bit later. the numbers for calls will be 202-748-8000 for people in the

eastern and central time zone. 202-748-8001 for people in the mountain and pacific. and 202-748-8002 for parents and caregivers. first, why don't you explain airplay -- fairplay's mission and how you are funded. guest: it is to keep kids safe when they are online and also to ensure that they get the off-line time that they need to thrive. we advocate for policies that would protect children and keep them safe or on social media and other websites and for policies that would make social media less addictive because kids are spending the majority of their waking hours on these platforms and it is having a serious effect on their well-being. we are funded entirely by foundations and individual donors. we do not take any money from social media companies or any corporation. host: who do you work with when

you are doing your efforts? guest: so, we work with pediatricians, psychologists, teachers, and groups concerned about privacy, and children's well-being. one of the most powerful constituencies that we work with is parents. including many parents who have lost their children to social media harm. parents who have lost their kids to suicide that was partially caused by social media platforms who have attempted viral challenges that ended up in accidental death. that bought fentanyl through snapchat and ended up dying. lee's parents understand that the role that social media played in their parent -- and their children's death and they want some meaning to come out of that and they want to make sure that this does not happen to another family.

i was just in washington this week with a group of 12 parents who lost their children to social media harms advocating for the kids online safety act, a bill that would transform the internet for young people and i cannot emphasize enough the way that these parents are changing the conversation when it comes to regulating the internet for young people. host: i want to talk about that legislation and bit. but first, what are the biggest challenges and concerns and it comes to children and teens online today. guest: everything i am concerned about stems from the business model. the business model for all of these social media and online platforms is to design your platforms in ways that will keep kids on the platform as long as possible so you can collect as much data from them as possible to serve as many ads as possible. and it turns out that both the amount of time that kids are

spending and the ways they are being manipulated to stay online longer are both harmful. that leads to things like mental health challenges like anxiety and depression, self-harm, suicide, eating disorders, cyber bullying, the sexual exploitation of children by adults. these are all problems directly related to this business model of trying to keep kids online as much as possible. host: you mentioned the children and teens online privacy per -- privacy protection act, what would that do and where does it stand? guest: the children and teens online privacy and protection act is an important bill that would disrupt the business model. it would limit data protection -- limit data collection from children and teenagers. and give teenagers their own special privacy rights for the first time. one of the things that is interesting is that the only law

that we have to protect children online was passed in 1998, that was over 25 years ago before we had smartphones and before we even had social media or tablets or anything that we do online today. we are desperately in need of new laws and regulations. this act would limit data collection and would ban personalized data-driven advertising for children under the age of 17, so they would be worth less to the platforms and less reasons to manipulate them and keep them online longer. i want to mention that that bill advanced out of the senate commerce committee in july and we are hopeful that it is headed to a floor vote in the fall. there is another bill that advanced with it called the kids online safety act, and that bill would create -- would make the platforms responsible for

preventing and mitigating serious harms for things like eating disorders and suicide and exciting, depression, cyber bullying, the purchasing of illegal drugs. it would create a duty of care so that the platforms would have to look at the way they are designed and how that is affecting young people, and if it was causing serious harm, they would have to change their design. host: i am looking at a headline from "the washington post" this week, 41 states sued meta claiming instagram and facebook are addictive and harm kids. what is behind the suits and what are the legal claims that they are making? guest: the reason we are seeing these is because of a couple of things. one, the overwhelming and mounting evidence that spending too much time on social media is extremely harmful to young people, to their mental health,

to their physical health. the second piece is that meta knows that their platforms, particularly instagram is harmful and has concealed that information from the public. what it alleges is that instagram in particular is specifically designed to be addictive and they choose products and features that they know will cause compulsive use and for young people to check instagram over and over again to spend even more time and that they know young people say that they wish they did not spend so much time and then it makes them feel bad in serious ways. it makes eating disorders worse and mental health challenges worse. despite knowing this and despite people at meta bringing this to their supervisors and their own internal research that said there platform is harming young people and making them feel bad they have not done anything to change the platform.

in order to change, if they were to make the changes that would make the platform less addictive it would've flecked their revenue. meta chooses profit over young people's well-being every single time. host: earlier this year the u.s. surgeon general argued that excessive social media use as a child might lead to a higher risk of poor mental health, but the american psychological association released a rat the same time and i want to read something. using social media is not inherently unoffic harul to young people. adolescents lives reflect and impact their off-line lives. in most cases that impact is dependent on the aent's own personal psychological christs and social circumstances intersecting with sit -- with specific ctent, features and functions afforde within the many platforms. in other words, the effect on

social media likely depends on psychological characteristics anwhat teenagers can do and see onli. teens' pre-existing strengths and vulnerabilities and the context in which they grow up." when you hear about all of this research, where does it fit in the arc? how much overall research has been done and what has it been focused on? guest: there is a growing body of research and the research areas. some of it looks at how much time young people are spending on social media platforms and what are the rates of anxiety and depression if somebody is spending two to three hours versus six to seven hours. and what we consistently see across the research is that heavy users of social media have the worst outcomes. so it is the users spending four to five or even more, some spit

-- some kids are spending 10 hours a day on social media that have the worst outcomes in terms of mental health, eating disorders and suicidal ideation. there are studies that are longitudinal, and what i think is really interesting is that right around 2010 you start to see this enormous strike -- spike and all of the mental health outcomes we do not want to see. anxiety, suicidal ideation, eating disorders. 2010 is around the time that social media became so normalized for kids and teenagers. and so, there seems to be very clear associations between social media use and poor mental health. and i would agree with the american psychological association that social media is not inherently harmful. the idea of having teenagers connect online to their peers and giving them another way to

meet new people and to explore new ideas and topics and to be exposed to people outside of their immediate community or to connect to their and real-life friends when they are not able to see them in real life, like during a pandemic. those are things that can be beneficial. but, as i mentioned at the outset, it is the way the platforms that are designed -- the way the platforms are designed that make them harmful. the fact that even when kids try to get off they struggled to do so because they are deliberately designed to be addictive. host: we want to hear your thoughts on this. we have special line set up. for callers on the eastern and central time zones, 202-748-8000 . from the mountain or pacific time zones, 202-748-8001. and if you are a parent or a caregiver we have a special line for you, 202-748-8002. let us start with mary in

michigan -- wisconsin who is calling on the parent line. caller: i do not know why you would even consider social media given the guidelines of the government. the parents need to model good behavior. in schools you can start with the schools taking away computers and schools and only have children use flip flown -- flip phones because kids do not want to work together anymore. they do not work together because they are on the computer and they do not know how to communicate with each other and solve problems because they are on the computer. and when kids are being bullied in school, those bullies do not know the person. it is going to continue to be more bullying in schools because nobody works together and cares what happens to one another. they do not think this is a nice

person and i worked with him in a project today. and kids in second grade are given tablets instead of learning how to read. that is a problem. phonics. it is not the computer. the teachers do not even know how to teach kids how to read. a computer will not be able to help a child. they need hands-on and they need to be learning to read at home, and at school. my daughter was in first grade and they were having her teach kids how to read. we had to pull her out. host: we had a similar comment by text message from jt in new mexico whoai"i know there is an increasing amount of charter schools with all online programs and no playgrounds or sports programs." and your thoughts on that? what are your thoughts on the role of computers and tablets and how that react to your concerns on social media?

guest: i think the caller and texter made excellent points. i think there is far too much use of computers and a reliance on tablets and online programming for children in schools. we know from decades of research that children learn best when they are doing hands-on learning, as your caller mentioned. when they are collaborating with peers on projects. i think that one of the things that has happened in schools in that -- is that these ed tech companies see a gold rush going on. schools are being sold the false promise that more technology is always better. if you want to have kids better for 20 job markets that you have to get them online as early as possible. what is so important is the hands-on learning and collaboration when you work

side-by-side with a partner. i certainly think that kids are getting far too much screen time in schools and not enough hands-on learning and it is part and parcel of the same problem. if the kid is online the same -- the entire time at school and then online the entire time that they are home, that is displacing so many activities and things that we know that are good for kids. things like reading books, playing with their peers, things like exercising, things like sleeping. we know that kids are sleeping less right now and one of the huge reasons is because of social media and phones. people are weight -- kids are waking up in the middle of the night to check their notifications. i completely agree and we need to think what is best for kids not how to make money off of them. and really, it is part of the same problem. social media companies see kids as a market and the ed tech

companies see schools as a market. and instead of asking what is best they are asking how to make more money? host: there been hundreds of lawsuits by school boards across the country citing the internet liability shield and the tech companies are citing the internet liability shield to block some of these lawsuits. can you talk about what these lawsuits are claiming and why the tech companies think they should be exempt? guest: share. i think this is one of the really exciting developments that along with the attorney generals suing meta, we have all of these school districts suing social media companies. what these lawsuits are claiming from the schools is that these platforms are deliberately designed in ways that are harming children's mental health, that the harms to children's mental health is creating an enormous impact on schools and the resources.

they are having to devote more resources counseling and kids are not learning in the same ways because of their distraction and mental health challenges caused by social media. what we are seeing with the social media companies is they are getting all of the profits and then pushing the problems onto other people, parents, families, and schools. what economists call externality. the schools are paying for the cost that the social media companies are causing. what the social media companies are claiming is that there is a law called section 230 that says if i post something on instagram or on tiktok, tiktok and instagram are not liable for what i post. but i think there is an important distinction that the schools are making and the attorneys general are making,

and that is maybe those platforms are not liable if i post something horrible. but, they are liable if the algorithms start pushing what i say out because they know that that terrible thing i said or the terrible picture that i posted is more likely to keep kids online longer. this is not about free speech or just a presence of pernicious content. it is about the way that the platforms deliberately use algorithms to push out pro suicide content, content that teaches kids how to have an eating disorder and hide it from the parents. they know this is what keep kids on longer and allows them to sell more ads. that is not protected speech, that is design choices. we need safety legislation for social media just like we have for every other product in existence. you know for toys, we do not

have small parts that kids will choke on. for cars we have seatbelts. for social media we have -- we need guardrails that hold against these pronation techniques. host: we have quite a few callers. linda, pennsylvania. caller: hello, thank you very much to c-span. i have some strong feelings about this. i do not agree that the main spear or focus should be suing the social media companies. i am a parent, my kids are in their 30's. i used to teach in schools, i am currently a mental health counselor. i do not believe that social media causes mental health. i do not believe that social media should be linked to eating disorders. i think that is unfair. i do believe though in a parent's role when kids are

spending too much time on social media. for myself as a parent, i know both my kids were helped to learn to read because they watched sesame street. it is a different type of screen, but these tools can be useful. think about a child who for some other reason has a phobia to leave the home. this student can do at home learning. i think during covid some of the at-home learning did not -- was not successful with kids. so, i think there needs to be a critical eye and possibly some research. but i think it is wrong to blame big business and let us look at 30 or 40 years ago instead of kids on social media, teenagers that were on the telephone at 1:00 in the morning.

we have to be more aware of the social development of youth and take that into account. and really we need to ask what is best for the kids. i do agree with that, make it a conversation, but the suing idea and getting lawyers involved, i do not like that. i would ask a question. my question is what is the pernicious content? could the speaker, i am sorry i do not see your name right now, but sir, with what respect, name three pernicious content areas that cause mental health issues? guest: sure. i appreciate the question and i would just say that respectfully, if your children are in their 30's then you have not experienced what it is to parent a teenager in the social

media age. it is considerably different. and you mentioned sesame street not causing eating disorders and that is true. but what is different about sesame street is that is content created for the best interest of children. and, i was actually -- when i was in washington meeting with members of congress alongside the parents we had a young 15-year-old girl with us and this was a girl who during the pandemic got on a tiktok account because she wanted to keep in touch with her friends. she was in sixth grade at the time and that was understandable when a sixth-grader in lockdown would want to keep in touch with her friends. and this is a girl who is an athlete who plays basketball and soccer. so when she got her tiktok account she started looking for sports highlights. and so tiktok understood that

she was somebody interested in sports and probably an athlete and then it center fitness videos about how to be more fit. and then soon those videos turned into how to have an eating disorder. she was barraged with videos how to survive on 500 calories or less per day, how to starve yourself and how to hide it from your parents. and not just one or two videos, but hundreds of videos coming at her encouraging her to have an eating disorder. this poor girl got an eating disorder. she was hospitalized for 16 days and missed six months of school. she will be in recovery all of her life. and that is because she was not asking for how to starve herself , she was not asking for videos on how to hide an eating disorder. she just wanted sports videos, but the algorithm understood

that this content is something that would might appeal to her and then it bombarded her with it. this happens over and over again. the algorithms are designed for one reason only, to keep kids on the platforms longer. it is the worst content that frequently what kids -- what keep kids online longer. host: i want to pause you there because we have a lot of callers who want to ask questions. let us go to rj and oklahoma who is a caregiver. caller: i am a retired therapist and i am raising my grandson. and you know this deal, everybody is addicted to it and i think it could cause many disorders. i had many kids commit suicide over the phone and video games. i do not know where the last lady looks but she better open her eyes. it causes real bad anxiety.

my ex-wife, his grandmother bought him a phone when he was 12. ok. it went all right for a while and then i would catch and talking -- catch him talking to a girl when he was asleep and then he would have it on all the time. we almost got into a fight for me taking it out of his room. i had sen. young: men that i had -- i've had several young men that i had to take down over phones and video games. and in 1999 i was working at a methadone clinic and i predicted that this would happen. this is just a money deal and they do not care about kids. host: josh, what kind of roles do parents and caregivers had for kids in terms of when they should intervene and how? guest: first of all let me say

that it is hard. i am a parent of a 14-year-old. and as parents of adolescents we face a terrible choice. we can try and keep our kids off of social media and that means isolating them from their peers, and that is something that is incredibly hard because kids live on social media. if you are one of only a couple of kids in your entire school not on social media you will miss out on all sorts of things. or you can let your kids go on social media and you will be subject to these algorithms and this pernicious design and addictive design and risk mental health harms and addiction that comes with social media use. it is a terrible choice and should not be that way. parents should be able to know that kids are connecting with the peers in safe ways that is not undermining their mental health. as for what parents can do, first of all my advice to

parents is to avoid getting your kid a phone as long as you can possibly hold out. i have never met a parent who said gosh, i wish i had gotten my kid a phone earlier. many regret how early the kids get phones. that can be hard. one of the things is good to do is when your children are younger talk to other parents and come to community agreements because it is much easier to hold out getting a phone if you are doing it together then if your kid is the only one in sixth grade who does not have a phone. the other thing i would say is there has to be times of the day when kids do not have their phones. at dinner, everybody should have their phones away, parents and kids alike so you can have a conversation. establish the dinner table as a phone free zone and we have to take phones away from kids before they go to bed. at the last caller just mention kids are sleeping with their phones and staying up way too

late and waking up in the middle the night to take -- to take conversation -- to check notifications. they are sleeping a lot less and that is why this is so hard on their mental health because adolescents are at a time of rapid brain development where kids needed a lot of sleep. when they are waking up several times in the night to check notifications and research shows this, they are getting less sleep. host: we have a comment from michael thorton who says "you not protect kids from drowning by keeping them out of the water, you protect kids from drowning by teaching them how to swim." what role do you think parents have in terms of teaching their kids how to navigate social media as a way to protect them from some of the harms? guest: you know, of course parents have a role to play and they should have conversations with their kids about what is appropriate to post, about how

to treat people online, because it is so easy even among adults to treat people horribly online and forget it is a real person on the other end of the screen. or that that thing you are saying in order to attract attention and get likes and go viral is having a real impact on another person. parents should have that conversation, but i have to say the culture that the social media platforms have created make it really hard for parents to successfully have those conversations. let me give you one example. i can tell my 14-year-old daughter every single day, every single day that she should not accept friend requests from strangers and she should not talk to strangers on the internet because bad things happen. in fact, 25% of nine to 12-year-olds say that they have had a sexual interaction with somebody online they believe -- with somebody they believe is an adult.

that is unacceptable and horrifying. i can tell her not to talk to strangers, but the platform is telling her every single day, every single minute and second that to be successful at social media is to collect as many friends as possible. that you are a more successful and cooler person if you have 500 friends than if you have eight online. if that is what social media platforms are teaching them and if that is what the culture is teaching them then of course kids will be tempted to accept friend requests from strangers but because they want to be cool and popular. so, we need these platforms to be designed in ways that reinforce the message is that parents are giving their kids about how to use social media instead of doing everything possible to undermine them. host: shelby in tennessee. caller: yes, hello. i am a retired nurse, and i

worked in all areas of nursing, also psych and rehab. i always felt that when i was in nursing, for at least 20 years, that the mental health side of, which should be part of everybody's total health care, was neglected. they always looked more to the physical. the health system, to me was failing us. the insurance companies did not want to pay for people that needed the mental health. and some people, they do not even know that they need help. they do not realize that they have a problem. and if they are admitted to psych or rehab, they are lucky to get two days to 10 at the most.

host: are you experiencing any of the people coming in dealing with mental health issues related to social media, especially among children? caller: well, at that time i did not -- we did not have social media, ok? i am 71 years old. but, the thing is, i believe social media has done so much damage too. because these children and adults, some of them, they are looking for answers and help. they should not even be on the computer. any kind of help that is suggested for them because they do not know that person. host: so we have a question for michelle in linois who says " there is no way to minimize the pain caused by the internet. shouldn't the goal be to mitigate the amount of time

society spends online?" which is similar to what shelby was saying. guest: i think we need to do both. i think we need to hold deplatforms accountable when they are deliberately pushing harmful content, which encourages eating disorders, self harm or other mental health harms. but absolutely, we need to reduce the amount of time that kids spend on these platforms. one of the best ways to do that is to force platforms to change their design. if they know that a feature will cause a kid to spend too much time online and encourage compulsive use or addiction, they should not be allowed to use that feature. that is the goal of the lawsuits. the attorney general and the schools, they might get some monetary damages but that is not the ultimate goal. the ultimate goal is to use the lawsuits to force the platforms

how to change they are designed and i could not agree more. we need to reduce the amount of time that kids spent on social media. the more time they spent more mental health harms so getting at the addictive nature of the product and making it less addictive is really important. host: let us go to eric in hagerstown, maryland who is a parent. good morning. caller: i just have a question for your guest, i have a couple questions actually. the first one is is does your guest know what a sim card swipe is? guest: i do not. caller: ok. i say it is a lot more dangerous than social media. it is like let us say i know about your mom, or your mother's

maiden name i can call into at&t and say hey i lost my phone. i have blah blah blah phone number and i have some security question i can give to you and i can -- and i need to activate my sim card. and that has everything that you have. host: can you bring us to your question? caller: my question is he constantly keeps talking about dangerous things on social media. my kids play roblox and they get messaged by people who are not kids all the time. my kids are six years old and you know how he knows the difference between a child and adult? the speed in which they replied. a kid -- an adult will type back faster. he is six, that is media literacy.

now, can you tell me how it is that we have a whole bunch of adults that think that there are secret tunnels that lead to a pizza parlor underneath the white house that the democrats are using to take kids back and forth? host: so i wonder, you have on your website, fairplayforkids.org, several kids for parents and caregivers. i wonder if you can talk through some of the resources that are available for parents and how they can be used to help avoid things like what the caller is talking about? guest: and again, we think this is a multifaceted problem that needs multiple solutions. so in addition to changing how these platforms are designed, there are things that parents can do. we have resources that talk about when the kid gets the first phone and how to manage that. we have resources that encourage

parents to be activists because we think this is a societal problem, this is not a problem that will be solved one family at a time. for instance, some of your callers have expressed concerns about the overuse of computers in schools. we have resources for parents to go to the school district and how to talk to the school district if you are concerned about the amount of time that kids spend online in schools. what we think we need is not just for parents to think about their own kids but to really see this as a societal problem where they work together to create change whether that is in the community, school district or by advocating with us for legislation which would change the way the companies act. host: i am having a look at the resources page on fairplayforkids.org, and i see that you have, as you mentioned schools so screens in schools action kit, a guide to choosing

tech for your preschooler along with several other resources. matt in somerville, massachusetts who is also a parent. caller: i wanted to call into thank the guest. i am surprised at all these people calling in and they have an issue with controlling social media. i really do not get it. most of these people seem pretty old like 70 to 80, so just completely disconnected calling in with their feelings and talking about how this is all on the parent. i really wish the old boomers would go away. let us run the society. the cultural disconnect and the generational disconnect is so big that i do not even want to sit here and listen to these old people talk about nothing and give you crab for doing things -- crap for doing things that

are obvious and make sense and i are -- and are data-driven. i am so tired of the boomers. host: i am wondering if you see a generational difference in the response to some of the strategy is your group suggests in dealing with social media? guest: i do but with all due respect to the caller it is different than what he says. as a matter of fact we see grandparents, they are among the most concerned people. i think one of the reasons for that is because grandparents can remember a different time of raising kids. they remember a time of when kids came home from school and threw the backpack down and did not come home for dinner and in some cases well after dinner and they got into trouble. so, i think that grandparents understand that there was a time before the screen took over everything and are deeply concerned. they might understand the

technology a little bit less, but i would not disparage the boomers. many of them are some of our most passionate advocates for children because they are not addicted themselves. that is one of the things that we face that some teachers and parents are addicted to their phones as well, and that makes them a little blind to what is happening to their kids. host: the last caller is demetri in north town, pennsylvania. can you turn down your tv, please? caller: yes, can you hear me? host: yes. go ahead. caller: i guess i have to say i am a boomer, i am in my 70's. back in the 1990's i did research on pewter use in teaching -- computer use in teaching immigrants the english language. i made critical observations

that will be a breath of fresh air in this conversation, and i want to hear the person's comments on this. it is also been used by the khan academy. what it is is putting two students on a computer screen, and if two students worked together on a computer screen, they are working together and communicating and using the computer as an electronic book from which they glean information and discuss. if you get on luck -- if you get online and look at the khan academy all of their students are children on one screen. i noticed in my research back on the 90's when they were using reader rabbit that two computers -- two students on a screen

stimulated discussion and as a teacher of english having students talk and use the screen as a stimulus i found extremely useful. host: what was your question for josh based on the research that you had? caller: excuse me, i cannot hear you. host: what was your question for josh based on what you heard in your research? caller: is it possible that we could affect this horrible situation of our children being prisoners of programs by instituting some sort of way that two young people work together on the computer? or on the telephone? host: let us get you to respond. guest: i think the caller makes an excellent point, and i think one of the things that is so discouraging about the way that schools use computers it is always one person on one computer. you go into a second grade

classroom and they are on -- all on an ipad and it is quiet. maybe that makes the teacher's job a little bit easier if they are quiet, we do not want second grade classrooms to be quiet, they want to be places of exploration and noise. i certainly think that there is a place in education for computers, of course there is. and i like what your caller said, the computer should be used to connect people and work in collaboration as opposed to essentially what a lot of kids are doing in schools, playing games and have -- that have an educational component but they are doing it by themselves and there is not that collaboration. so certainly the more we use computers and technology to connect people as opposed to sending them down rabbit holes and isolating them, the better off we will be. host: we will have to leave it there.

josh golin is the executive director of fairplay. thank you for your time. guest: thank you for having me. host: later we will hear from the council of foreign relations senior vice president, james lindsay about his podcast, "the president's inbox." up next we will return to our topic with more of your comments on the top news story of the week. it is your time to lead the discussion. the phone lines are on your screen and we will get to your calls right after this break. ♪ >> american history tv exploring the people and events that tell the american story. douglas brooks discusses his book "the mysterious case of rudolph diesel" where he recounts the life of the inventor of the diesel engine and his 1913 disappearance.

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him. his stature eventually became so high that he became known as -- known by friends and emies of that name. book nes plus is available on the c-span3 -- on the c-span mobile app or wherever you got your podcast. >> a healthy democracy does not just look like this, it looks like this where americans can see democracy at work. when it citizens are truly informed a republic thrives. get your information straight from the source, unbiased and word from word from the nations capital to wherever you are. this is how democracy works. c-span, powered by cable. >> washington journal continues. host: welcome back, we are looking for your top news story

of the week. the republican line as usual is 202-748-8001. the democratic line, 202-748-8000. and independents at 202-748-8002 . quite a few big news items this week including the economy. new gdp figures show that the u.s. economy grew 4.9% in the third quarter and the national economic council director commented on the figures earlier this week and here is a portion from thursday. [video clip] >> a year ago the consensus view was that unemployment would need to go up to 4.5% and the economy would need to stall out in order to get inflation down to where it is today, and it turns out that is wrong and you can see that in the chart. u.s. growth has been much

stronger than the naysayers believed, unemployment has remained below 4% this entire time, but inflation has fallen in line with that forecast. in fact today we learned that gdp grew by 4.9% in the third quarter, even as core pce inflation on a quarterly basis fell two point 4%, the lowest level in nearly three years. that is a testament to the resilience of american consumers and workers supported by president biden's plan to grow the economy by growing the middle class. [end video clip] host: some of the other top news stories is the election of a new speaker of the house, mike johnson, the republican from louisiana, and the israel-hamas

conflict that is ongoing. the mass shooting in maine as well as dean phillips launching his presidential bid and the plea and immunity deals in various trump trials. let us start with sharon, hanover pennsylvania. on the democrat line. caller: good morning, regarding the horrendous mass shootings in our country, i have followed multiple news sources for many years. i do not recall anyone being out in the streets demonstrating whether small or large groups demanding ar style weapons. meaning they were satisfied, whoever the gun owners, with what they had. apparently, it was policy plus greed that introduced the is

weapons. and now we are paying a terrible price for it. thank you. host: jamie in mississippi. republican line. caller: hello. i want to comment to the young man in the previous section who was talking about wanting to get the boomers out of the way. i have news for you young man, you look at society today compared to one of boomers were children, just take a look at that. you are one of the reasons why the world is in the shape it is in today. second, i would night -- i would like to make a comment about the economy. i am 70 years old and i am a middle-class person. i worked all my life. i have a nice life, i would say.

yesterday when i got out of the grocery store i was almost in tears because the prices are so high. i do not know how middle-class and lower-class people are going to survive. and then we hear the reports about how great the economy is. it is a joke. to all of the democrats who think that people believe the lie that they are spewing every day about how great the economy is and how we can afford to send trillions of dollars to other countries when we borrowed the money, i have a question for you. why can't these grocery prices borrow the money? i am sick of wars and i have been involved in wars all my life starting with the vietnam war. it is always stating that we

have to take care of it in another land or it will come here. i think it is hogwash. i am an old boomer and sick and tired of it. thank you for listening. host: we have a text from elaine in washington says "hous democrats did not need to for or against mccarthy, they could have just voted present, i think it was a huge mistake for them to vote with mager republicans who wanted him removed. the maggot agenda -- maga agenda would be defeated without the democrat vote without empowering their extremist agenda." one of the many stories we are following. philip and jackson -- in jackson, mississippi. independent line. caller: good morning morning young lady. there are so many things going on in this world, where to start. i would like to begin with some

logic to the gun issue that we seem to be having. we are the only industrialized nation where you have to worry about where you go considering that you do not want to be shot. in the day or night wherever, you just do not want to be shot. but a weapon like an ak 15, it does not make sense for pedestrians to have a weapon such as that. if you want to have a weapon, find. why don't we have bullets that put you to sleep? why do we have to slaughter so much to show that we are the best at shooting ourselves. one more point and look, they must not be serious about climate change because the amount of military combustion that goes back into the

atmosphere. by the way stratospheric aerosol injections are calling -- is causing the dramatic shift. look it up for yourself. at the end of the day, one more thing, please avoid the civil war. we have people still living in the confederacy thinking that black people have a problem and white people are all of that because they are white. this is the same. all of the things we are dealing with just borderlines on insanity. because it does not even say educate yourself. there are a lot of educators who are crazy people. host: i want to take the story you brought up about the mass shooting in maine. vice president kamala harris address the shooting during an event with the australian prime minister this week. here is a portion of that from thursday. [video clip] >> last night, lewiston became another community torn apart by

senseless gun violence. once again, routine gatherings, this time at a bowling alley and restaurant, has been turned into scenes of horrific carnage. doug and i ourn -- mourn for those killed, pray for those injured and grieve so many who were impacted and changed. the biden-harris administration will continue to provide full support to local authorities. as we gather details we must continue to speak truth about the moments that we are in. in our country today, the leading cause of death gun viol terrorized and traumaticized so

many of our communities in this country. let us be clear, it does not have to be this way. host: let's hear from phillip in jackson, mississippi, on the independent line. caller: thank you so much for that. she is absolutely correct, the powers that be use fear to keep us all divided, to keep us oppressed -- let me say this. i went to florida recently. i guess i don't have to say why but that is becoming the most autocratic place in america. people wake up, get away from your ideologies of hate. host: to sidney on the democratic line. caller: yes, i agree that one of the things that is happening is

people keep talking about guns and the reality is the thing that contributes to a lot of the mass shootings is fear, hate, anger, and it festers in people and is transmitted even in the homes and goes to the children. that is a mental illness itself. you don't have to go and look for schizophrenia and all of that. all you have to do is get fear people that are angry with guns or knives. even in their language. and it is also supported by what is happening in the government. you have a president with an agenda and the recent economic report says the stuff is working. but it would be working better

if it didn't have to contend with a whole other arm of the government spewing ridiculous hate and anger and frustration talking about ending the country and turning into socialism. it is ridiculous over a couple years. and a lot of the inflation and stuff is based on greed and stuff pertaining to something that has nothing to do with the present. those are things that i look at that are frustrating to constantly hardware people saying these things and evidently have some type of intelligent to foe that the price of eggs and gas has nothing to do with the president. st: this ys the economy grew and so did prices. gas here is $5.89 to $6.55.

this is art in miami on the in-line. caller: i would like to hear from someone with military experience as to why the items that are built in gaza, why can't they be flushed with something to force them out. i think water would do the job but i would like to hear from a military person. host: charles it cleveland on the independent line. caller: i'm calling to express my outrage at the western media and how they are reporting this , the main line media. they are not giving the story of what is happening that basically

bolsters the idea [inaudible] host: are you referring to the maine shooting, israel gaza? caller: when the united nations indicated that this attack just didn't happen in a vacuum and he basically was saying the settler state has basically committed so many atrocities to the palestinians over a period of years. it has been going on and on, didn't just start in october. the raiding of the mosques, just the human appearanceance appreciation of the palestinian people. a lot of things going on that

the media is not reporting. so, therefore, this insurrection -- i don't call this a war. this is not a war. this is a people who are tired of the treatment they have been getting from the israel -- israelis and the israelis know they have the backing of the united states. my objection is the way this is presented. and there is throughout the world a lot of people see that this is not something that is going to end well because the congressman in ohio says he is looking inaudible parking lot so the kids will continue to be killed, external fate --

exterminated and i think native americans can give us a good style wave is about to come. host: i want to point to an article that gets to some of the latest news of the war. israel has moved to a new phase of war with that mass with a major incursion in gaza saying that the israeli late friday expanded ground operation in gaza and ramping up the bombardment of the strip targeting what were said to be hamas tunnels and gaza's more than 1.2 million people remain largely cut off amid a communications blackout. let's hear from mario from palm peach, florida. caller: yes. i'm losing faith in the

politicians, congressmen and senators because they are not doing anything to fix this and what more affects me is the killing of our own people. how can it be fixed? if we start suing everyone who has to do with letting this happen because we see things coming up, people being sick mentally and still need those powerful guns so let's start suing these people who have to do this for starting this and letting it happen. let things happen to make a boom. i don't respect that. i'm losing confidence about the politicians for not doing what they have to do. thank you and good health for everyone especially mental. thank you for your program. host: kathy in newark, ohio, on the democratic line.

caller: i'm totally opposed to israel bombing gaza and those are not targeted strikes. they are over the air bombs. they are not going in tunnels. and these people, the 7,000 palestinians killed now, 1,000 and something israelis. i'm not anti-semitic, i'm not ante humane and i don't know how america can back this kind of action. it is just not right. thank you. >> deirdre in richmond, virginia, on the independent line. caller: good morning. i agree with charles people here can teach us about land in connection with what is going on in israel an palestine.

the last caller said over 7,000 and counting have been killed in this so-called war against hamas but it is a general know side against american people and it will come out america perpetrated this. i want to say about the person that asked about the tunnels. look at what happened to united states in vietnam. i wonder if the shooter in maine focused on that community and if people are so concerned about youth online they would be concerned that black children have been seeing black people die by the hands of law enforcement and vigilantes for decades. host: eric, in kings port, tennessee, on democratic line. caller: yes, ma'am.

i'm so thankful that mike johnson is the new speaker of the house. he is such a pro life person that the elections in 2024 will be such an advantage to the democratics on the apportion thing. he believes that aborted children would help social security because they would be able-bodied to work in the workforce. what a farce! can i talk about one more thing? host: go ahead. caller: all the people talking about israel, they haven't been there. i agree the israeli government is as corrupt as donald trump but israel is unlike america. 1400 israelises were absolutered three weeks ago. they won't sit still for that. they will go after hamas and the phreufrps who won't get out of the way are being used as

shields to handle -- hamas. i don't agree with what happened in 1947-48 when israel was created. i don't know whose brilliant idea it was to give people who survived the holocaust a country in the middle east we they were all from europe. why not divide some of germany and austria and they could be the jew western home. this is ridiculous. the israelis came and pushed the palestinians out. there have been six or seven wars sense then and there will be continued war this will everyone is wiped out. i feel sorry for the palestinians and jordan can't take them in but they are scared the hamas will come. host: dan from florida on the republican line.

caller: as far as everyone talking about how gun control is the leading number of children deaths, that is a fact, but do they talk about, like, even if there were gun control laws bad people will still get the guns so that won't help anything as far as ar-15's compare to pistols. some use ar-15'sor hunting or different things. either way gun control won't help bad people from obtaining those gains. either way it will happen so it doesn't matter what law you put in. i definitely believe in the amendment. second thing, as far as the war in israel, they are bombing the

crap out of gaza because all the bad dudes are in a tunnel. and terror using people as shieldsment so they don't really have a choice unfortunately and there is going to be casualties and i wish people would stop listening to one side of the spectrum on the news. there's two different sides. if you look at bbc right now, it is talking about how, you know, israel is bad, israel is bad. if you watch news maps, israel is great. so there are always two different sides. i wish people would expand their horizons and look to other news medias other than the mainstream ones because they have one side. it is only one side. they don't say anything about joe biden or anyone else. it is all donald trump, donald

trump, donald trump. and it is getting old. host: speaking of the presidency, at noon eastern today 2024 republican presidential hopeful donald trump, floridaernor run desantis and tim scott and nikki haley are among those speaking the republican jewish coalition 2023 leadership conference in las vegas. ll be able to watch live coverage today at noon eastern on c-span, c-span now our free mobile or video app or online at c-span.org. that is unanimous eastern today. let's hear from bob from petersburg, virginia, on the independent line. caller: good morning. bench netanyahu -- benjamin netanyahu knew that attack was coming. he could have prevented most of those people from being killed

but he wanted war. the only thing that can save this is for netanyahu to resign and for the hamas to let the hostages go and they have to get the rest of the world to mediate this and make it fair for both sides and i'm going to tell you something else. as far as it goes, this guy who said something about mike johnson being so good, mike johnson is a liar, he is taken up for trump and his false election claims. people like him will be the first to snatch a baby out of a woman's belly and put it on the barbecue for the mega -- host: let's go to bob in petersburg, virginia, on the under line. ok, we will hear from diana in oregon on our democratic line.

caller: i just want to say this we will fight in phaoeupb r palestine and israel it is going to say your god is better. it is like children to fight in a sand box. we need people to reprimand these children who are running their world and killing us all. host: up next on "washington journal" we will hear our spotlight on podcast series and today won't have james lindsay of the council on foreign relations to talk about foreign policy news this week and his podcast "the president's in-box". we will be right back. palestinian

>> book t tv every sunday has authors discussing their latest nonfiction books. at 6:30 a new york university proffer shares her book where she recounts being taken as a 12-year-old in 1980 by a palestinian resistance group. at 8:00 p.m. young turks founder argues that america is a support progressive country and offers his thoughts on how to advance a liberal agenda for his book, justice is coming. watch book tv every sunday on c-span 2 or watch online at booktv.org.

>> this week the house and senate are in with both chambers continuing work on 2024 spending legislation to fund the federal government for next year. the senate will vote on the nominee for u.s. ambassador it israel. then anthony blinken a lloyd austin testify before the senate propositions committee on the $106 billion emergency funding for the support of israel and ukrainand other national security risks. al secretary of homeland security and the f.b.i. director testify before the senate homeland security committee on threats. wednesday federal reserve chair jerome powell holds a news conference following the federal open market committee. watch next week live on the c-an fleshes or c-span now and

c-span.org or stream video. live or on demand. your unfiltered view of government. >> if you ever miss any of c-span's coverage you can find it online at c-span.org. videos of key hearings, debates with markers that guide you to points of interest. they are on the right-hand side when you hit play. this makes it easy to get an idea of what was debated and decided in washington. scroll through and spend on points of interest. >> a healthy democracy doesn't just look like this. it looks like this where americans can see democracy at work where people are influenced and republic thrives. get informed.

unfiltered, unbiased, word for word from the nation's capital to wherever you are. it is the opinion that matters the most is your own. this is what democracy looks like. c-span, powered by cable. >> "washington journal" continues. host: welcome back. i'm joined in studio with james lindsay who goes by jim senior vice president at the council on fortune relations and hottest of the president's in-box podcast. guest: thank you for having me. host: can you tell me about your podcast? guest: it is a weekly interview show that has me sit with experts for about 30 minutes talking about the foreign policy challenges facing the united states and will end up on the president's desk, hence the title of the show. the goal is help people make sense of very complicated international scenes.

our emphasis is on information analysis as opposed to advocacy. we are interested equipping people to make sense with what they see in the news. host: there's so much going on in the news. how do you decide which topics to dig two? guest: that is an excellent question and there are sort of two kinds of shows we do. some are in response to what is happening in the news. so, recently we have done two episodes on the israel-hamas worry. we did a episode on the battle over the house of reference and speaker. so some are reacting to events. other shows we are looking at issues that are happening that are important that will be consequential but may not be breaking through because they are sort of slowly building. we have done shows on the build-up of china's nuclear

forces. we have episodes looking at climate change and how it is playing out in different parts of the world and fueling conflict. we looked at the advent of artificial intelligence and what was meaning for america's elections where there is a potential to do things like have targeted appeals to people from either political party or foreign hackersment jew mentioned your episodes on the israel-hamas conflict. why did hamas attack knowing it with likely result in such a master response from israel? guest: we don't have good insight into the motivation of hamas. a lot of speculation has been put out there. architects that hamas did this to disrupt the ongoing aprocedure maintenance between

israel and saudi arabia that. could be a side benefit but it is hard to be seen as a drives force because as best we knew the planning for the attack had been under way before the conversations between the israelis and saudis and picked up steam. the fact that the attack was on the 50th anniversary of the october war and yum kapur war and ramadan war suggests that it was done in essence to be symbolic, to put down a marker of hamas's resistance. host: what capabilities does hamas have compared to israel with technology, funding? guest: in terms of technology israel has a decided advantage but the kind of fighting we are talking about now is not in which technology can be decisive. our understanding is that israel

has now moved into gaza and that we are seeing urban fighting, that is the most difficult, complicated, deadly kind of fighting that militaries can engage in which many of the advantages of technology are negated by for example you can't get signals bass they are blocked by buildings. so close quarter fighting can negate a lot of technological advances. host: that was not the case before the attack and hamas's attack was from land, sea, air and they had been planning a long time. why was it such a surprise to israel and why did intelligence agencies miss it? guest: thank is a question a lot of israelis are wondering and it is against a back drop of a country that experienced attacks. it is on the 50th years of the

surprise egyptian attack of 1973. the most likely explanation for why the israelis were caught flat-footed on this is they didn't believe and attack of this magnitude was possible. you look at intelligence failures historically, hindsight is 20-20. you can always see there were plenty of signals that people don't assemble the bits and pieces, connect the dots. one reason they don't is in the case of 9/11 and the frames phrase is lack of imagination and i think the fact is israelis didn't think hamas would launch an attack like this because it would bring about a catastrophic retaliation, which we are seeing. host: another area that the intelligence doesn't seem to be clear is the role of iran. why is the u.s. still unable to

figure out or publicly acknowledge whether iran was involved? guest: that is an interesting question on it depends on what you mean by involved. the united states government understands and has been clear that the iranians are involved in a general sense. the iranians have sponsored terrorist groups throughout the region. they have gotten weapons to handle mass, provided guidance, news reports of some hamas trainers fighting and training in iran. i think the question people are focused on now in this specific instance is what extent did iran have a direct planning role. did the iranians plan the attack? did they provide intelligence? or is it merely they provided general support to handle mass and were themselves surprised? it is more complicated when you realize it may be the case some

people in tehran in may have been in the dark and others might have known what is going on. host: on tuesday's white house press briefing. john kirby responded to a he request iran's -- question about the iran knowledge. >> the assessment that iran did not directly play a role in this attack. >> i never said that iran did not play a role. what we said and there's been no change, that iran is certainly complicit here. without them there is to hamas or less blah or groups firing rockets at our troops in syria. we recognize iran is monitoring these and in some case

encouraging some of these attacks, no question about it. >> [inaudible]? >> we still haven't seen any direct specific intelligence that says they were waiting or participating or directing the attacks of october 7. but, as i said broadly complicit to question and i'm sure our israeli counterparts will in due time take a harder look at the intelligence picture but i will let them speak to that. >> last week no one with confirm on the record that [inaudible] were coming from iranian top-secret but it was said the u.s. holds them responsible. is the u.s. taking the signal that iran is trying to widen the war? >> you see they are backing these groups, no question. we have sent a strong signal of

deterrence. there's no indication right now that any other nation, state or actor is preparing or imminently to escalate there -- this conflict but i want to be clear nobody is turning a blind eye to iran's complicity. their support of ma lisch groups -- militia groups we have addressed it through additional sanction and military force and we will do what we have to protect ourselves and troops. nobody is turning away from that threat or their support. host: we have iran has warn

hezbollah could destroy tel aviv power for power. is there a possibility of a secretary front with hezbollah attacking israel from the north? guest: very much so. i would imagine israel military and government are deeply worried about that. hezbollah as a group separate from hamas has closer ties to iran. it is based in southern lebanon. the israelis in the past fought wars with less blah. they have been quite bloody and costly for both sides. the great concern that the israelis have is if a second front is opened up it will put greater pressure on the israeli military. it is also the fear hezbollah might overwhelm some of israel's missile defenses. hezbollah is believed to have as many as 150,000 missiles and

rockets. they appear to be more sophisticated than those that hamas had in using in the attack october 7 and using sense then. so there are concerns like the israeli system would be overwhelmed and for the israelis there's great concern about a third front. what happens if you have unrest in the west bank where there have been growing conflicts, a lot of settler and palestinian violence and then what happens within israel in terms of the citizens of israel and what they do. host: what you are talking about is the potential spreading of this not just into different parts of israel and palestinian territories but in the region. can you lay out what other countries in the region are saying about their potential involvement or desire to stay out of it?

guest: the nightmare scenario is if the war spreads and you get interstate war. the big question is will we see a war with iran. that gets back to the complicity question which is why the discussion of what level of complicity the iranians have is so great is why if you get a second front from hezbollah because of their close ties to tehran that increases the chance of military strikes not necessarily by israel but by the united states. we have already seen the biden administration put american forces in middle east on high alertment we have two air force carrier groups going, one u.s. tpaefrl ship has shot down missiles aimed at israel. we also in u.s. strikes in sir why against iranian proxies that have attacked american troops.

so this is a very dangerous situation that could escalate and it would skate in a way involving not just issues with the united states but iran fighting in syria, lebanon and potentially jordan and part of the focus of the biden administration is to try to prevent that from happening. host: let's hear from some callers john in sedalia, missouri. caller: i want to bring up a few things. it seems like we forget so much about politics but it a very short period of time. the prime minister had stated over and over how democratic his society is there in the middle east. he says he is the only democratic society there. back in july there were so many protests and we taught they were just, well, stated, they were just people from school, they

were rebels so to speak, but the majority of people that protested in july were ex-military, professional people that were stated -- and there shouldn't be building on the west bank and should be -- host: jim, can you talk about the role of internal israeli politics and what has been happening? guest: israel is deeply divided society, not much different than the united states. prime minister netanyahu commands a narrow majority in the knesset. there are many israelis who dislike the prime minister. so, the caller is referring to the protests over the summer about a judicial reform bill which the prime minister and his allies argued would improve the

judicial system in israel and the critics said was attacking one of the fundamental pillars of democracy in israel and it was quite controversial. i think that whole conversation has been put to the side because the issue front and center is the war against hamas and how that plays out. again the potential for that war to spread. host: if you have questions for jim or comments call us our republican line is 202-748-8001. democrats on 202-748-8000. independents at 202-748-8002. let's hear from bob in illinois on the democratic line. caller: hello, sir. what i would like to know i have three real quick points. in israel, when they had that contest they even said their

reservists would not get involved with helping netanyahu become over the court and they had that protest, i think that they started to plan to talk and for them to attack then. then a heard a woman say help her during when gaza attacked -- we the palestinians attacked israel and said i can't help you because go for yourself. they allowed them maybe to hurt many people to have a reason to eliminate hamas, which is terrible. hamas is terrible. and my third point real quick, i hate to see these people die.

it is so sad. you can hold me or i can get off and listen to your response. host: let's allow jim to respond particularly to whether hamas used the protests in israel as an opening to plan there. you addressed that a bit earlier but if you want to touch on it again. and the caller asking whether there was any incentive by the israeli government to allow the attack two happen to take action in gaza that they maybe already planned to do. guest: i can't speak to all the points the caller raised. what i would say there is no evidence or good reason to believe that the israeli government wanted this attack given the consequences of t., first point. seconds, the caller is quite right there were robust protests that the previous caller in the summer and spring about the judicial reform bill which in

many ways paralyzed israeli politics and you had reservists saying they would not be called up for duty because they were protesting the judicial reform bill. i don't think any of that played into hamas's calculations. none of us has transparency on the thinking of hamas leadership. but given the amount of time that went into planning the operation, the planning began long before the judicial protests or strikes by some reservists. so i wouldn't want to make that connection. host: let's hear from james in manfield center, connecticut, on our independent line. caller: hello. i'm calling just as a concerned person a half world away from israel and i can't imagine what

the israelis are going through after this horrible thing happened to them. i'm hoping our president, when he consulted with netanyahu, brought something up, and that is be careful about the response. and i'm hoping that maybe he suggests special forces instead of a grand invasion. if things go wrong here and it turns into something like a general know side that is going to turn into a battle cry for future enemy states. so, i think wisdom should prevail over the who is right and who is wrong thing and strategy. guest: he brings up a point of

what people are seeing is sad and the costs are a paid by people who have no say over what is happening. i think the biden administration has signalled to the netanyahu government perhaps it should slow down and not react out of white hot anger and think of where do they want to be down the road. i think it is important to keep in mind that israel has a right like any country under international law it retaliate when it is attacked. i will also note that israel face as major challenge in that hamas is a terrorist organization co-locates among civilians essentially using them as human shields making it differ to go after or to degrade hamas's infrastructure without killing innocent people. but i do think the administration is suggests that

if israel loses state of proportionality they are going to run into the trouble of decreasing support elsewhere. and for everyone there is the issue of what is going to come next. israelis, asness it does not want to reoccupy gaza. they left in 2005 because of the challenges of trying to hold on to gaza. but if you leave gaza totally ungoverned, bad things are going to happen. the united states discovered that in afghanistan, in iraq and in libya. so, i think for the biden administration and also other governments in the region, not just the israelis they are trying to think of what comes next, who is going to govern gaza? will that government have legitimacy? can it function? can it deliver services for the people of gaza? those are very difficult complicated questions.

host: let's hear from peter in new york on the republican line. caller: mr. lindsay, we haven't really discussed america's foreign policy regarding this situation in the middle east. isaac newton's law of reaction is an equal and opposite reactionment during the trump administration they put on these strong sanctions on iran. every expert that i heard all say the same thing. that iran is financing hezbollah, hamas, the houthis and it is their money that is responsible for training and equipping all of those terrorists. now, during the trump administration they put these heavy sanctions on and the iranians basically were almost bankrupt. they only had like $6 biological

in assets and oil sales were down to 400,000 barrels a day. under the biden administration at the relaxed the sanctions didn't eliminate them but were not enforcing them and today iran is producing 3 million barrels of oil a day and they have $80 billion in assets plus the $6 billion they were going to release because -- host: what was your question for jim specifically? caller: the question is, the biden administration helped to precipitate this action that is happening by hamas because we allowed iran to become emboldened with money -- host: jim, let's take that point specifically. guest: i think it is an unfair characterization as just laid out. i would make the following points. the various groups that the

caller spoke about, houthis, et cetera they have their own grievances and aspirations. they were not just created by the iranians. very important point. seconds, even during the trump administration when we had tis policy of maximum pressure on iran those groups all behaved badly so to speak in a number of areas. i think that the reality is that hamas would have been capable of carrying out its attacks on israel regardless of how many barrels of oil the iranians would be able to produce. host: i want to switch gears it talk about the relations between the united states and russia which have been deteriorated for decades. earlier this year russia said it

was at an all time low. i wonder if you think in that relationship is it possible for the two accountants to shift from adversarial relations to more of a constructive rivalry as some have called for, and what would that shift look like? guest: it would be healthy if we could have a constructive rivalry or cooperative rivalry but i don't think that is in the cards soon. because we have the war in ukraine. the russians invaded in ukraine, violated international law. they continue to wage war against the ukrainians. president putin, whatever miss strategic calculation was, it backfired. rather than dividing the west it united the west. it led sweden and finland to join nato. it is very hard looking a the that situation to figure out how you can have better relations

with russia when they insist on their aggression against ukraine. host: so, it was like we have been so absorbed with what is happening with israel and hamas tanks has been diverted from ukraine. what is the latest on the ground in? guest: the ukrainian counteroffensive continues. the progress is very slow. it comes at a very lie cost. we are essentially at what people refer to as the fighting season which is a misnomer because fighting will continue. but as it gets colder, snow falls it is hard to carry out major operations. the reason the ukrainian counteroffensive hasn't achieved what people hoped for is because the russians have dug in and in military warfare the defense inherently has advantages because they can build fortifications and make it hard

to reclaim land. the big question is, what does this set up for next year? and there is a military part of the question and a political part of the question. the military part would be, will ukraine have suffer military supplies and gain a suffer foot hoepld that perhaps next spring or summer it can punch through the russian line. the political question is will with respect support for ukraine continue? will ukraine get those supplies it needs to fight, or will the united states or other countries either decrease the amount of support they give to ukraine or halt it all together. as you know well, kimberly, this is a big issue not far from here in the united states capitol as democrats appear republicans talk about whether and to what extent the united states should provide military materiel to the

ukraine. host: i feel like we are jumping around topics but i gather this is appropriate given the nature of your podcast. china, last week the pentagon released a new report showing china may be accelerating its efforts to develop a nuclear arsenal. what do we know about their current nuclear capabilities guest: two. were smaller than the russian or united states but they are increasing it quickly. historically they made a decision in the 1960's they were not going to try to match the united states or the soviet union in building nuclear weapons. where the united states and soviet union had tens of thousands of warheads the chinese was content with 200 or so. it was minimum deterrence.

the notion was i just need enough to retaliate. in recent years they have made a decision that they want to have more nuclear weapons. it is unclear what they are hoping to gain by that. it raises big questions about the potential interplay of the various nuclear arsenals. in the 1960's and 1970's a time of great superpower tensions, it was easier to plot things with two countries. now you are talking about the united states, you are talking russia, china, india, pakistan, potentially a country like iran could join. you have the issue of north korea. so all of a sudden from a military planning point it is more complicated because you have to worry about others ganging up on you want a big

thing to pay attention to with u.s. china relations if the president of china meets in san francisco with president biden you mentioned it would be nice to have a constructive rivalry with russia. i think it is more important to have a constructive rivalry with the chinese. the biden administration has been seeking to try to put so-called guard rails on the u.s.-china competition which is very real. not that we have had were success building those guard rails but obviously even given that they are the two largest economies it is that you have two major super powers finding a way to live with each other that is acceptable to both sides is important. host: we will get a few more calls. on tan in albany, new york on the end line. caller: good morning.

two things. with regard to the hamas and -- i just don't know how they ever hope to get any advantage by slaughtering people and taking them hostage. if there is no rationale, how can you negotiate with people like that? and as far as iran goes, once that nuclear genie is out of the bottle, i fear for the world because to me the only way to stop iran you have to tell them you are going to cease and desist or we will take out your first oil refinery and if you keep going we will take the second one and you will have no economy because if they get a nuclear weapon they have promised to annihilate israel off the map. host: two points. what possible scenario hamas

thought they could use this attack for leverage and what hope there may be remaining for those hostages, then the nuclear risk from iran? guest: again, we don't have a lot of clarity of the thinking of hamas leadership, what we thought they were going to accomplish. it is quite possible they have achieved sort of a catastrophic success if i can describe it because of what is happening in response. partly for hamas is a matter of showing its opposition to israel. its hatred of israel as an organization despite talk of having watered down its charter and israel's right to exist. i also think there's an element of the hamas leadership of rally ing palestinians to their cause and positioning themselves as the only group willing to stand

up to israel. there was some public opinion work done in gaza before october 7 by happenstance that showed that hamas was not terribly popular with most people in gaza because they wanted their lives improved and didn't see hamas doing that. but now that you have the reaction of the israelis one of the consequences is likely to be a rallying in the palestinian community behind hamas. host: and it has also called changes in the political dynamics and public support in the united states. guest: here and around the world. this is very difficult situation. i go back to the point israel has a right to retaliate, but israel has to recognize that people watch tv and have their opinions influenced. and it is not even in the sense that the attack of israel is

already done and those pictures are not being played over but we are seeing live coverage from gaza. host: what about the point of the nuclear risk from iran? guest: i think that the nuclear risk in iran is great and i think policy makers in the united states and elsewhere worry about it greatly. they worry about it less in terms of appear immediate iranian attack on israel. keep in mind, israel also has nuclear weapons and could retaliate which is again why nuclear weapons aren't used because of basically mutually assured destruction. a more immediate concern is, if iran deploys a nuclear weapon there's going to be increased pressure in the region for other countries to get nuclear weapons. here we are talking about assault and battery retain -- saudi arabia, turkey and potentially egypt.

now, all of those companies would have limitations in building a weapon but it is possible they could buy nuclear weapons from other countries. there is talk of pakistan provided saudi arabia with nuclear weapons. as you have more countries with nuclear weapons, amidst very real geopolitical rivalry, you then run into the concern you would get a nuclear attack growing out of conventional conflict. host: let's try to get one more question, mike in ohio on the democratic line. caller: yes, that is lick skillet, ohio. host: hi. host: i think our foreign policy and tax cuts for the rich have brought us this $32 trillion

deficit. there was a twice decorated marine general who wrote a book called war is a racquet and eisen sure warned us about the military industrial complex. so, i have an idea for you. what do you think about a peace department with a pentagon budget and blackwater, i understand that he has the sniper skills and air drill -- >> let's take the first point because we are running low. the idea of a peace department or even if you could comment on the role of the military and defense contractors in this. guest: the caller raises a very good point we historianing look back at the last 30 years and where we thought we were in 1990 to where we ended up in 2023

they are going to talk about a squandering of an opportunity because after the fall of the berlin wall the collapse of the soviet union we had great hopes of international politics on a different footing. and i think part but not the only part of the story is going to be a harsh judgment about america's decision to invade iraq and consequences and cost of that. i think that is a very real point. i think beyond that if you are talking about a peace department we have one. it is called the state department. here i think the caller is quite right. we don't invest in the state department, in diplomacy, the way we do in the military. it is not just me saying this. this is what a lot of senior military officers. general james mattis was fond of saying if you are not willing to

invest in diplomats then you better give me more money for ammo and i think the united states has short-changed its diplomatic corps. that includes not just things like not having enough fortune service officers or enough offices overseas. it has to do with things like aid. we get back to this talk of how we have to stand up to china. well, china has been going around the world recruiting friends, investing money in countries around the world. we haven't been doing the same. so, we can't be surprised when other countries look at us and say what have you done for us, look what the chinese are doing for us. with that sense there is a competition. host: the chinese just celebrated the anniversary celebrating with countries all over the world. we will have to leave it there,

jim lindsay hopgs of the president's in-box podcast, senior vice president of council of foreign relations thank you for your time. that is it for the program but please join us tomorrow at 7:00 a.m. eastern for another edition of "washington journal" and enjoy the rest of your day. c-span -- c-span c-span c-span [captioning performed by national captioning institute] [captions copyright national cable satellite corp. 2023] >> "washington journal" involving you to discuss the latest issues in government, from washington and across the country. coming up sunday morning

democratic strategist and republican strategist discuss campaign 2024. mike johnson's election as house speaker and government funding deadlines. then the u.s. military and defense aid to israel. "washington journal," join the discussion at 7:00 a.m. eastern sunday morning on c-span, c-span now or c-span.org. >> 2024 republican preside hopefuls former president d trump, ron desantis, tim s and former u.n.mbassador are among thos speak at the joeish coalition in las vegas. today on c-span, c-span now our mobile app or c-span.org.

>> next week on the c-span networks the house and senate are in with both chambers continuing work on 2024 spending legislation to fund the federal government for next year. the senate will vote on president biden's ambassadoto asia and anthony blinken and lid austin testify before the senate appropriations committee on the $106 million ergency supplemental funding for israel and ukraine and other national security ringsment also on esday the secretary of holand security and f.b.i. director testify before the senate homeland security committee on threats to the homeland. wednesday federal reserve chair holds a news conference following the federal open market committee meeting. watch next week live on the c-sp insurance or c-span now our apand go to c-span.org for

scheduling information or stream video. live or on demand. c-span your unfiltered view of government. >> c-span is your unfiltered view of government fund the by these television companies and more including charter communications. >> kphraert is proud to be recognized as one of the asbestos internet employers and we are just getting started with 100,000 miles of new infrastructure to reach those who need it most. charter communications pports c-span as a public service with these other television providers giving you a front row seat to democracy. host: good morning, it is sat october 28, 2023 the gaza strip is in a communications near bl