♪ host: it is the washington journal for july 5. we want to hear about the current state of campaign 2024 and who will become the next president. president biden and is expected to be interviewed by abc about his health and mental and physical acuity. former president trump letting the focus be on president biden for now. for the next three hours we will be joined by opinionists, but we

want to hear from you about your thoughts on the current state of the race for the white house and campaign 2024. if you support president biden, (202) 748-8000. if you support former president trump, (202) 748-8001. if you support other candidates, it is (202) 748-8002. perhaps you are undecided or you support neither candidate. call us at (202) 748-8003. you can use the same number to text us, and you can post on our social sites at facebook.com/cspan and on x at @cspanwj. president biden hosting a barbecue for active-duty members of the military. the topic of his run for another term for the white house coming up. this comes from reuters. with the president talking about issues -- military issues.

"i was in that world were -- war i cemetery in france. i probably should not have said that, before continuing his remarks. biden took selfies with guests. someone called out for him to keep up the fight. he said you got me, man. i'm not going anywhere. biden said he repeated his pledge to stay in the race despite growing calls to step aside." that was yesterday at the white house. the president travels to wisconsin today. keep close watch to her website at c-span.org for information on that visit. you can follow along on c-span now. it is during the time when he will be interviewed by abc news. that will air tonight. a couple of opinion pieces concerning mr. biden's intent on staying in the race. this was done by harvard university with american

university expert alan lichtman. "before we get to the model, biden's ability to handle the presidency at his age? sure, i have concerns but not about his ability to campaign effectively. he had some excellent energetic events after the debate. he delivered a great state of the union a few months ago and he could ad lib. a response of the audience." the question from the harvard interviewer. "look, i'm not a neurologist but neither the critics going after joe biden. they have no basis to a lot of her an opinion on his cognitive abilities and capacities. put all these folks share is not have a track record in predicting elections, yet they claim to do to win. debate debacle, great concern democratic headquarters. those are from after barack obama's performance in the first debate of 2012.

afterward a cnn poll showed 70% thought obama lost. mr. obama went on to win in a landslide." that is some of the results concerning campaign 2024. for your thoughts on the current state of t campaign, lets know. giphy ppt president biden, it is (202) 748-8000. if you are a supporter of foer president trump, (202) 748-8001. if you support other candidates, (202) 748-8002. if you're undecided or supporting neither canda at this point, let us know your thoughts a(2) 748-8003. david in washington state, a supporter of president biden. what are your thoughts on the current state of the race? caller: --

host: dan, a supporter of former president trump in ohio. caller: well, you know, the attorney general used the excuse when he said he couldn't bring biden the court -- to court for the save think he was charging trump with. bringing classified documents out of the white house. the attorney general said i can't charge him because he's a confused old man who can't defend himself. everybody, that was a republican, thought it was an excuse to charge trump and let biden slide on the same thing. now i think both things are true. i think that was true. he used it as an excuse.

but biden is also incompetent. if somebody is incompetent that you cannot charge them with a crime, which is what the attorney general said, how is he competent enough to run the united states? that doesn't make any sense. the democrats can't have it both ways. either he's competent he can run the country or he's not. host: a supporter of president biden. this is robert from baltimore, maryland. caller: good morning. joe biden [indiscernible] in 2020 by 7 million votes. he is going to be donald trump in 2024 -- beat donald trump in

2024 by 12 million. host: you are saying if that happens, president biden will still win another term? caller: yes he will. host: can you elaborate on why? caller: because joe biden against donald trump -- host: you said that the yc getting more votes now? -- why is he getting more votes now? caller: everybody likes what he's doing. host: go ahead and finish your thought, robert. caller: donald trump is not worried about the election but he's going to jail. host: william in baltimore, maryland. the light his support others -- on the line for those who support others. caller: good morning, pedro.

post happy fourth of july. i support kamala harris. i don't think joe biden is up to the task any longer. i don't think he can win at this point. i would like kamala harris to select a strong by presidential candidate -- vice president of candidate. maybe gavin newsom. she has to appeal to the white male voters of the democratic party. this election is very important. if donald trump wins, the situation in ukraine will get worse, because he's basically -- pardon mike's prescient -- -- my expression -- the situation in gaza will get worse.

benjamin netanyahu will be unleashed. he won't have any any checks or balances under donald trump's presidency. i support kamala harris. i think it is her time. i don't think joe biden can win. host: that is william in baltimore. your thoughts on campaign 2024. you can talk about the candidates, talked about the issues and all things related to the campaign. 02) 748-8000 if you support president ben (202) 748-8001 if y support former president trump. if you support other candidates, current vice president of the united states, (202) 748-8002. perhaps you are undecided on a candidate or support neither candidate. (202) 748-8003. during the program we will be joined by opinionists to give their thoughts. starting off with ed deen out of

florida. wbob radio. these joining is now via zoom. good morning. guest: good morning. host: thank you for giving us your time. where would you currently place the current state of the campaign compared to a week ago? guest: it is the 1986 landed confusion -- land of confusion. it is rapidfire. it is one-day day to another things changing. you have team biden reverently -- religiously putting out talking points. the poll numbers show that kamala harris is down by 2. others are down further. i think it's going to be biden out there. once voters see kamala out there, i don't know if her

numbers are better than biden's. it is a cluster. it's great to have a monday morning quarterback but the political scenery changes week by week. i don't know if the debate messes it up for biden. people don't watch that. it comes down to issues and how people feel. host: how does it change the field for the former president donald trump? guest: he didn't have the greatest debate last week. if your opponent is in the middle of committing suicide, don't for the trigger. joe biden handed him a decent win. i'm not sure they will have another debate. if i'm joe biden, i want another debate today.

i don't know. everybody is all over the map. what's going to happen here or there? if you are trump, continue the campaign. september -- they have a lifeline to campaign. he should talk about the issues and maintain it's about the economy. if you're worried about joe biden's mental capabilities, bring up that issue. 60% of the point of the act numbers said 60% can change their minds. that's a decent number. a lot of it is based on the economy. host: if that is the case, what is the messaging you expect the former president to deliver on that front? how will that be countered by the current president? guest: i think what will happen is you have more helping out joe biden counter the campaign lines by trump. if your trump, don't get overconfident.

they were overconfident and b -- in 2020. republicans have not been able to pull the trigger to pass the victory like. maintain a positive tone. don't get off on january 6 or 2020. talk about the economy. talk about gas prices, food prices, immigration. if he can maintain that people may go maybe i will give the former president another chance. it's like a skateboard. continue to coast. if he does that he might be able to win. host: back in 2020, the former president won florida. you think the margins hold this time rent? guest: that's a great -- this time around? guest: that's a great question. maybe it's within the margin of error. you have marijuana. huge abortion amendment.

it would make the state pretty much pro-choice. that number could probably spike up the democrats, whoever the nominee maybe. on the conventional wisdom it's a major landslide. i do think trump will win by 20% but is still benefits trump and 2024. -- in 2024. host: the state issue of abortion, what's happening as far as that constitutional limit? -- amendment? guest: i think they will get 50%. right now it does. when voters focus on the issue, and what is bad about the minute is you have restrictions such as parental notification. you have to bring in parents.

democrats will say we are pro-choice but we would like to have more parental involvement. we would like to see the restrictions stay in place. i don't know if it does pass the 60% threshold to make it to the constitutional limit for. -- floor. host: people are watching the vice president of candidate choice. who tops that list? is it marco rubio? guest: i don't think it is rubio. you go for a state that will help propel you to the white house. i don't think it's going to be rubio. maybe doug bergstrom. a lot of trump people in my show, i don't think they care. the biggest amount of support goes to ron desantis. i don't think desantis will take it. i don't think the maga committee cares. bergstrom. a kind of narrows it down.

i don't they a be told to gabbard or nikki haley. -- tulsi gabbard or nikki haley. host: a large spanish contingent in florida. anything changes? guest: difficult on the coattails of governor desantis, i think it does benefit team trump. here's the bottom line. the campaign speeches and major crowds do not win elections. it is the ground game. for some of the conservatives, biden has troops on the ground. the trump people hanging out at i-95, honk your horn, it's great. you have to knock on doors. last in georgia, last in arizona. they have to get the money

right now. biden has ground troops in the states. host: ed dean, working people find your show? guest: throughout florida and a few other states. download the app. wbob.com. host: that is ed dean. thank you for your time, sir. guest: good to see you again, pedro. host: we will be joined by opinionists all along the way on the state of campaign 2024. if you support president biden, (202) 748-8000. if you support former president trump, (202) 748-8001. if you support other candidates, (202) 748-8002. (202) 748-8003 if you support neither candidate or undecided. shwan in illinois. caller: good morning, pedro.

i am for biden. he has passed a lot of bills. host: ok. caller: i'm just saying he put through a whole lot of bills. he's the best person i can think of. host: what you think about the calls to have him replaced or to him consider dropping out of the race? caller: i think is full of crap. just because you have one fall down in a debate. you are looking at everything else that he did the three years -- he hasn't even made it to the

end. he did more than trump ever did. host: let's hear from anna in massachusetts, a supporter of other candidates. caller: hello, hello. host: go ahead. what do you think about the current state of the race? caller: i think this is one of the worst elections in our history. we have two terrible candidates who are running. both kennedy and trump. those are the candidates we have running. the more painful to see is the path the democratic party is going. i feel like the democratic party has certainly gone down the undemocratic path. they have completely interfered with the election from canceling primaries in certain states to doing everything they can to stop other candidates from

voting and essentially that is election interference. also, interfering with voters' rights to vote for the candidate of their choice. it was disappointing that the democratic party understood from the beginning the mental decline and cognitive state of biden. they continued to push for and convince people that he was ok. i feel the united states has completely been deceived by the democrats. i feel like with trump it's unfortunate we have him in the race. we all knew what we were getting in the beginning. host: if you're not satisfied

with either, who is your candidate of choice? caller: kennedy. 100% for kennedy. i feel he is the change that we need. certainly we will see the democratic party attack him the same way that we have seen them attack trump. they will pull every tactic on their playbook to make him seem like a nonviable option. a lot of people believe as a third party he doesn't have it choice -- doesn't have a chance. i feel that he is the third-party candidate we have seen in our lifetime with the greatest chance to win. host: agnes in florida, a supporter of former president trump. caller: hello. thank you for taking my call, pedro. i have something a little different to say. i think we are faced right now

with national denial. my husband died from dementia. i know the signs. i watched for years. i was in denial. this man, joe biden, is about as far as you can go into denial. the democrats are denying it. the media is denying it. people can see with their own eyes, hear with their own ers this -- ears this man is not right. wheher i've -- whether i vote for trump or another candidate, people have to wake up. host: what might hesitate you from voting for the former president?

caller: i want to see how the rest of his campaign goes. i'm not sold. i know in my heart -- i know what i saw. i know what i lived with. host: i understand your story but when it comes to the former president what has not sold you at this point? caller: well, my big problem is he has a big mouth. i think if he kept his mouth shut he would be a lot better off. but that is just my feeling about him. host: pam in florida, supporter of neither candidate. caller: good morning. i think biden needs to absolutely step aside. kamala harris should not be anointed. she could compete. it is time for a new generation.

the democrats have a deep bench. there are a lot of good people at their. let them all compete and then you get to an open convention. biden gives up his delegates and the money. i know that is against democratic party rules and all that but they can change those rules. the most important thing to me is that trump not be elected. we need an open convention. we need to let everyone compete. then let's see what we could do for our country going forward. host: why not automatically designate the vice president as the nominee? caller: because i don't think she can beat trump either. remember biden appointed her in charge of the border. all we have had a trouble with immigration. that's been a huge cudgel for the republicans. i can't say i disagree on that. that border should not have been left open the way it was for all these years. i do think she can beat trump

either. it has got to be 70 who can beat trump -- somebody who can beat trump. the rest is immaterial because if he is elected none of it matters. host: the peace and axios this morning about the scenario possibly vice president harris becoming the nominee heading into this november. this is how it plays out. this is from the article this morning. we gave out scenarios with the most experienced democratic operatives. most feel strongly that for practical reasons harris was all but unbeatable. if biden got there and decided that there with a towel, they would inspect them to endorse harris. the white house press secretary said wednesday it's one of the reasons biden picked her back in 2020, both because she's the future of the party. one reason to go that route is to avoid the mayhem of a wide open convention in chicago beginning on august 19.

that would take democrats' focus. harris is the nominee or become part of biden's legacy. he's been in public life or 50 plus years. there is the practicality. if you're eyeing the nomination you are thinking about space. do you want to torpedo harris's chance to become the first woman president of color? what are your real chances of defeating harris and her formidable apparatus when your less well-known nationally than she is and then beating the trump machine with its huge head start in the 75 days between the democratic convention and election day? more there at axios's website, taking a look at that scenario. you can weave that into the conversation. this is from mississippi, dave. caller: yes. i support biden. you don't really vote just for a president. you up for the platform.

he seems to surround himself with competent people. trump went through hundreds of people and they were the worst thing he ever did when he fired them or have somebody else fire them. you have a corrupt supreme court. they lied during their confirmations that they would never turn -- overturn -- they just legalized bribery by letting that indiana mayor off. the heritage our nation, roberts, he wants to overthrow the country and says it will be bloodless as long as we let him do it. you have the federalist society, judicial crisis network, leonard leo and his corrupt nonprofits. host: you said the president was around by confident people. to what degree is the president confident himself? caller: i believe he is confident. he's just not quick and witty and as fast as he was. i'm not either.

a lot of people say when you get older you not quite as quick. he makes good decisions. he passed good bills. look at your window at all the construction going on, all the highways in new bridges, the upgrades infrastructure. it's a lot better than it was when trump was trying to get everybody to shoot up lysol and listerine and have everything else. hydroxychloroquine and all the stuff he cap denying covid and it would be gone by easter. it will be gone in the next two weeks. host: let's hear from former president trump. tony in north carolina. caller: going to win by a landslide. host: ok. why do you think that?

caller: he's the best candidate. host: anything else? caller: nope. host: bob on the line for those who support others. go ahead. caller: good morning. i want to make two comments. a couple of things. concerning the debate, i have been watching joe biden since i was in college back in the 1970's. he's no stranger to me. his decline has been very noticeable in the last several years. anyone he's been paying attention to him could have clearly seen his decline. his performance was absolutely no surprise whatsoever. i think it's fascinating that 50 million people watching the

debate and all of a sudden for the first time they sat and listened to him. now they are shocked at what they see. that shows you have 50 million people who were not paying attention to joe biden's decline. it is not just mental. it's physical and it's quite obvious. the second point is that both candidates lie quite a bit. trump makes a hobby of it. biden does it in a hypocritical way. biden told a lie in the debate that virtually no one has reported on. no one has even mentioned this point. biden lied about the peace deal in israel. he said the anything standing between the peace deal and peace is hamas. that is completely false. that is what his administration has been saying all along. it is israel rejecting the peace deal immediately.

then trump corrected biden by saying israel also rejected the peace deal. but trump set out loud what biden has been doing. go ahead and give them what they need and let them finish the deal. that's exactly what joe biden has been doing. host: since you called on the support others line, who is the other? caller: i was going to support rfk junior 100%, except he's also in the israeli camp. i cannot support anyone who enables the killing of 50,000 people, including 15,000 innocent children. that's impossible for me to do. you ask you i will support? i'm looking at jill stein as the only candidate that is polling in any kind of numbers. she is opposed to the war. i have seen her demonstrations at the white house. she's behind cutting off support to israel.

she seems to be the only reasonable choice in this issue with israel. i will be looking for her. host: the first half-hour done of this three-hour program largely devoted to hearing from you on your thoughts on the current state of campaign 2024. you can talk about the candidates involved. other candidates if you want to support policy issues important to you. if you support president biden, (202) 748-8000 if you support former president trump, (202) 748-8001. if you support other candidates and you want to llis wife, (202) 748-8002 -- why, (202) 748-80. y're undecided or you support neither candidate, call this is from jim antal on the washington examiner talking about the postdebate polls. the biden campaign warned the numbers might be bad.

if we see changes in the coming weeks it will not be the first time overflow narratives have led to dips in the polls. negative headlines about obama's debate loss to romney. one major difference with obama in 2012 and reagan in 1984 was that biden was trailing pre-debate. a week after the debate polls show mr. trump's lead had grown to six points. president biden losing and all battleground states and trailing at several others not previously deemed to be so close. the dam has yet to break with the fishers are showing. democrats are going public with their concerns. jared golden whose whole state may now be in play in november wrote an op-ed saying it was

fine for the country of the former president returned to power. let's hear from jerry in virginia, a supporter of former president trump. caller: good morning. first off about this debate, the democrats hammered and hammered for donald trump to take a cognitive test. during the debate joe biden said i would be happy to take a cognitive test. he should do that. irregardless of all this, i believe the democrats will win the election simply because there will be eight million to 10 million immigrant boats in the ballot box. they are registering them to vote. host: ok. rena in new jersey, supporter of president biden.

caller: good morning c-span. thanks for taking my call. i support president biden. he passed quite a few bills during his administration and continues to do so. it's helped everybody in this country. he's a master negotiator. for those of you who i talk to president biden's suppose it dementia, you're not a medical doctor. it is quite disrespectful. we could say the same thing about trump and his cognitive abilities. i would like to mention that trump said he will be a dictator on day one. he's an existential threat. i would like to ask any veterans out there -- i'm a veteran myself -- why would you support someone who has spoken so just reciprocally about -- disrespectfully by veterans? you don't even believe the words are coming out of his mouth if it's recorded.

i want to mention that president biden brought a set of covid when -- brought us out of covid when trump advocated his leadership in that situation. fee probably would have been more competitive during the last election if he had taken -- the things he did to get the vaccine. host: back to president biden. when you hear democrats and the last few days talking about the idea of questioning if the president could run another term, what goes through your mind when you hear these things from democrats? caller: i consider this democrats fairweather. that is their position and we don't know if they have a motive behind why they are saying those things. what i like to have president biden can -- be 10 years younger? yes but we don't have that choice. we have the choice between president biden and trump.

trump will set it up so he never leaves. that's an existential threat to me. when i was in the military under trump it was not a fun time. this man's ego is such that he would probably put the military in a position that we don't want to be in. host: sean in maryland, supporter of former president trump. caller: it's evident to everybody who watched the debate. this guy is not capable of even picking what kind of ice cream he wants to eat. he won't remember it. this is sad that the democratic party has gotten so bad that you have to hold onto somebody that should be in a nursing home. i'm sorry. i'm watching it with my own eyes. that party has been running -- this administration, his advisors. biden does not make a decision

at all. he probably doesn't know how to put his shoes on. i hope they don't replace him. this would be one of the hugest landslides in the history of elections. we will look at reagan-carter type numbers. host: if they replace him what he think of former president trump's chances of winning if they replace him with the vice president or number -- were another democrat. caller: it would probably be closer. they have to go with kamalisa. there's no way they can get the money to anybody else in the party. biden is not going to leave. his wife one let him leave. unless they force amount with the 25th amendment and say he's not confident anymore, it might come to that if the numbers completely slide off the board. i think it is too late. they put themselves in the corner. they only have the vice

president to pick and her numbers are so low i think it is over for the democratic party. the longer they hold onto this the worse it is for the entire party. host: eric on the line for supporting other candidates in baltimore. caller: good morning, pedro. good morning washington journal and c-span. it's a choice between dumb and dumber. this is ridiculous that we propped up two candidates that are horrific for the country. i guess maybe cnn is hoping donald trump will be elected so that ratings can go back up because at least he is entertaining. this is a horrible choice. i'm supporting dr. jill stein. there is no competition. she has the economic bill of rights. host: what is it about her economic policies that interest you the most? caller: she's talking about

raising wages. that is fireproof. yes, she's talking about building more affordable housing. she talked about raising wages. capitalism as opposed to affordable housing. i had affordable housing 15 years ago and i pay $1500 a month for a two bedroom apartment. that was allegedly affordable housing because i made under $58,000 a year. they cost me $8,000 to move in. she's talking about raising wages. that is fireproof in this economy. raising wages. thank you munich millan said, rest in peace, the rent is too damn high. that is what the market demands. they went to live by the subway. i'm from long island. dr. jill stein has a plan. she has a plan, man.

host: that is eric in baltimore, maryland. the washington post looks at the proposals both president biden and former president trump are advocating in this cycle when it comes to the highlights. when it comes to cost, controlling inflation is the federal reserve's job. mr. biden the first to the central bank to finish the task. he's called a big box corporations and grocery chains to do away with shrinkflation. much of his focus has revolved around drug prices, including for insulin and inhalers. the colorado housing and that's one of the themes from mr. biden. president biden has targeted different slices of the market during the state of the union. credits for offsetting highmore to cost -- high mortgage costs

for first-time homebuyers. taking a look at former president trump's economic policy. tariffs. something the former president has talked a lot about. the fact that trade disputes were a hallmark of mr. trump's first term ands u.s. economy, including three -- and describes a ring around the u.s. economy that will cost more than $3 trillion in commerce. he is threatened a 100% tariff on ev vehicles made in mexico for china. when it comes to tax policy, the washington post highlighted the fact that mr. trump floated the possibility of replacing the income tax with universal tariff. in principle it would post major disruptions to the u.s. economy while bolstering the wealth of the richest americans. he suggested exempting tipped

wages from taxes during a campaign rally in las vegas. it was seen as an attempt to woo the crucial block of hospitality workers. there's more when it comes to policy issues from both candidates in the race. you can find that the washington post. susan in massachusetts, a supporter of president biden. go ahead. caller: good morning, pedro. i think voters should think of this in a different way. no matter if biden leads the democratic party are not, you have to look at both parties and what they are offering. the democratic party will not get rid of democracy. they will fight to keep it. they will put justices on the supreme court that will follow the constitution instead of

shredding it, which seems to be what this conservative supreme court is doing. look at what the -- what trump's party is offering. vengeance, hatred of the immigrants, and violence. he inspires violence with his words. we have seen it happen. if you look at it that way then you vote democrat, no matter whose on. also look at the republicans and congressman, the conservatives in congress, what they have done. we had a bill, the border bill.

both parties worked on it and agree to it and then trump said don't pass it, and they didn't. why? didn't they care about the border? no, they cared about giving trump something to yell about. did you notice when he was talking? every answer included these lies about the border. he's the one that told them not to pass the border bill. that would have gone a long way into solving those problems. host: carol, a supporter of president biden -- carol in west virginia, a supporter of former president trump. caller: good morning. i look at it as may be different than everybo else. as far as i have heard trump was reonble for che spent this much money,asally both

parties as far as spending money and covid. when covid first hit everybody wanted something to help them get through because the country was shut down. who was in charge of the purse strings? the ats. trp signed the bills that the democrats came up with. when biden came into office peleere still needing help, because we were still under covid. who was holding the purse the democrats biden signed the bill. both parties as f aspending money for covid, botharties have a hand in the pot for that. as far as the policies and stuff goes, both parties are to as far as my opinion goes for

the border. both parties ld to the elites ors this -- businesses. they lobbied for more visas, work visas. those workpieces do take american jobs. as far as the rest of the policies go, if my budget tells me i'm looking at what i have coming in every month and i'm looking at -- oh, i need to cut spending somewhere because i don't i'm going to be overdraft at the bank. i have to cut my spending. the republicans, some of them are willing to cut spending. we are not saying do away with spending. but cut funding on some of those

spendings. host: charles in new jersey, a supporter of president biden. caller: good morning america. i don't know what these people are thinking about. president biden has been there for over 45 years. he's got experience in the white house. he knows how to deal with the people. trump ain't nothing but a bully. you get them in there and you have a lot of trouble. if you put some but he also has place, you are automatically putting the election in trump's hands. what are they going to do in five months? host: even if it was the vice president? caller: peck park? -- beg pa rdon? she's in a good position right now. we don't want to move our president. if you do, trump is going to

win. a lot of the know this. some people are so dumb they will just say anything. thank you for letting me talk. host: sylvia from virginia on the line for undecided viewers. go ahead. caller: thank you. we have had president in wheelchairs. we have had president that were shot and had to heal. they were incapacitated for a little while. kennedy had a horrible back trouble. i think maybe they are giving president biden something for his mind makes him sleepy. that is what he's tired. it could be he had a tumor taken out some years ago. it might be affecting him some. we need to give him some time to see exactly what it is. i'm undecided who to vote for. i'm willing to be patient to find out what's going on with president biden. thank you. host: that is sylvia in virginia.

you can call and give your thoughts on campaign 2024 related issues. pick the line that best represents you. you can always text us at (202) 748-8003. post on our social sites. that is facebook.com/cspan and also follow on x, @cspanwj. president biden is heading to wisconsin to campaign. stay close to our website at c-span.org for information about that. you can follow along at c-span now, our app. we are joined by opinionists to give their take on the campaign. joining us is arnie artisan as part of the pacifica network. thank you for giving us your time. guest: always a pleasure, pedro, especially on this interesting july 5. host: tell us why. guest: i have been thinking a

lot about posting on facebook. i'm torn about what biden should do. i wrote a piece saying don't run. i wrote a piece saying i will believe in the policy issues and then go with biden. ultimately, i'm not picking biden. i'm picking the issues. then i would've piecing maybe he should not do this. then i watched the debate. here's the problem. biden does not know what he should do. what's the headline everywhere? biden does not know, should i stay or go? the members of congress don't know. here's the problem i'm having. everyone is talking about some people got sick or had a headache. biden is 81. every month as you get older it feels a year. it's not like he will be able to feel better. he will not heal from the wound.

it isn't like he has to walk somewhere. he's aging. he's been a good president. probably a great president. but that's not the question. not only what kind of a president are you, but are you capable of engaging in the campaign? especially a campaign now where you're running against a liar, cheater, are racist and now a crook. you also have a supreme court now aiding and abetting a president of the united states. i don't mean joe biden. i mean the former president donald trump. they are now in his camp. when you have the supreme court that is basically helping one of the candidates, that's a problem. when you have putin and netanyahu helping a candidate, that's a problem. when you're facing a climate crisis, that's a problem. when you're dealing with the increased cost of groceries, not because of anything you did that because of a pandemic, because of shrinkflation, corporate profiteering and people blame you and you can't expand like.

the most important thing -- you can't explain why. the most important thing is the dobbs decision. i'm terrified. it is not just about abortion and not just about women's health. it's about our ability to form families and live in an economy where we can all participate, to move forward. i nancy infant mortality rates going up. i'm seeing women fleeing states. i'm seeing doctors leaving states because they don't want to practice there anymore. they are afraid for their own abilities to actually provide health care. when you look at all these things, can joe biden articulate the message, understand the urgency and convey it to the voters? host: you posted on x this morning that elected leaders have two jobs. manage the nation for the benefit of the citizens and be a confident campaigner. if that is your thinking, the idea it is the president's

decision and he doesn't know what to do, what's a possible return to do should it come to that -- alternative should it come to that? guest: we can have an open or brokered convention. there are 70 people waiting in the wings. -- so many people waiting in the wings. when you paul any democrat -- poll any democrat, they be donald trump. it has nothing to do with who they are or the policies embraced by joe biden. all the things he's done on the infrastructure, the student debt, the climate, they approve of those things and they love him. his age is now getting in the way. his age is getting in the way. if that is the case, guess what? you have kamala harris, gretchen whitmer, the governor of california newsom. they could step in. all they need to do is move forward on the policies the

american people want and need and believe in. the person is the biggest problem now for this campaign is actually not donald trump. it is joe biden. host: a poll looking at the possible hypothetical matchups. when it comes, the one who could soundly beat former president trump if she decides to step in his michelle obama. guest: look, we all want to go back in history. michelle obama didn't even want barack obama to get involved in politics. stop using a familiar name or falling in love with someone that was a spouse. look at people who have initiated policy, government states, put together things that are important. we wanted oprah. come on, pedro. this is not about a movie star or a fairytale. i want someone who's ready to lead and wants to run.

that is not what michelle obama wants. we have project 2025, a fascist movement happening and we are understanding what that means. the supreme court is aiding and abetting project 2025. i sat on my friend's porch yesterday dressed up for the fourth of july. here's the sign in the wedding dress. wedded to democracy, not fascism. think about this. this is on my fourth of july. that is the sign i have in front of my house with a wedding dress in all red, white and blue. this tells you how terrifying this election is and this year is. "i can hear the fireworks in the background. it's finally dark. i look at my july 4 statement. wedded to democracy, not fascism. i start wondering what will i be saying and thinking next july for? never have such a thought entered my head before. we are living in truly

frightening times." joe biden has served the macon people well. he's confused about what to do. if he's confused, guess what? maybe it is time to pass the torch." host: the listeners to your program, is this what they are saying as well? how are they engaging as far as the president's future? guest: everybody is all over the map. if you go to my facebook page, there are hundreds of comments on both sides. people say he can't step aside. they say he must step aside. they are as confused as numbers of the congress are, as joe biden is. if there is confusion, the answer isn't for joe biden to stay. it is for joe biden to leave. there's a wonderful poem from 1776. it opens with john adams. what is the song? it says, sit down, john. for god's sake, just sit down. it is not that john adams is not

right. he wants to talk about independence. they can't hear it from him. they can't hear it from him. they need it to be delivered by somebody else. i want to sing to joe biden, step aside, joe. for god's sake, just upside. not because he's not right. not because he's not good. not because he's not competent. he can't deliver the message. he didn't screw up. he was basically showing his age. host: arnie arnesen, how can people find your program? guest: we stream live. there are podcasts. it is the attitude with arnie artesen. america is torn but we cannot be torn in november. we have to vote to save the country. host: always a pleasure to have you on the program.

thanks for your time. the first hour down. three hours on this topic of campaign 2024 and the current state of the campaign. whether as the candidates were the issu oother factors. you can ca uduring this time. (202) 748-8000 if you support presidenbin. (202) 748-8001f you are a supporter of former president trump. if you support other candidates, (202) 748-8002. perhaps you are in the camp of your undecided or you support neither candidate. (202) 748-8003 that is how you n reach out to us. you can post facebook or x. yocasend us a text at (202) 748-8003. let's hear from heorn florida, a supporter of president biden. good morning. go ahead. caller: good morning, pedro. that young lady you had on a while ago, i think she sounds

like she supports biden. her criticism is strange. i'm looking back at the state of the union to show how fit this young man is at his age. man is. he stood there for one hour, nine minutes, and had a speech going on get out of that, he spent 35 minutes shaking hands. secret service was budging him to get out of the place. that is one. two, this man has kept unemployment under 4% for over two and half years. that is -- that achievement of under 4% was a first in 50 years and i want you to fact check everyone who comes on give that is a fact. biden stood there for one hour, nine minutes. trump, in four years, spent $8

trillion. when you look at it, trump has over 4000 lawsuits. 4000. and another thing. everyone is talking about the polls. the polls are set up. because nobody in my family -- you talk politics morning, noon, and night. i watched this rogue room every day. i watched bloomberg every morning. for two and half years, every morning, they get professionals coming on, saying a depression in two years, a recession in two months, and they kept and going -- ongoing. it is too enough years, also, we will not have a recession anymore. but trump, $8 trillion in four years. -- host: ok. gary is next in washington, on our line for others. caller: good morning.

host: morning. caller: i listen to all these whiners on the phone, biden and trump. case in point, trump did a debate. he lied everything on the debate. he lied about the military, did so much for the military fear that is a lie. obama did a lot for the military. do the fact-check. another thing is -- all of these people crying about social security, all these people making under $50,000 a year crying about social security. wait until trump that's in and cut social security. we'll all cry. he says he will make america great for four years. his four years are up. he has got to sit down and shut up. host: you are calling on the line for supporting others. who are you supporting, then? caller: i am supporting biden. host: well, your calling on the wrong line. to show you the lines on the screen, pick the line that represents you give that others

line, if you're not supporting either of the two major candidates now, president biden or former president trump. if you call that line, that is where you should be at, as well as tell us why. if you are undecided or supporting neither candidate, it is that last line, (202) 748-8003. john is next up in california, a supporter of former president trump. hello. caller: good morning. i have a comment and a couple of things. first of all, the people that you have on, those guests that came on, the first guy couldn't even pronounce the name correctly. the second gal, arnie, she sounded hysterical, so why not get better people on? my mother-in-law has dementia, and she can sit down and read the paper every morning. she can actually read it out loud, verbatim.

but when you put the paper down and ask what it is, she couldn't remember a thing. it scares the heck out of me that joe biden can read off a teleprompter and can't talk outside the teleprompter. that should be really scary. the case in point would be the spy balloon's. he did not react for a week on that spy balloon, because he was incapable of reacting. so the big lie in the room was the democrats keeping joe biden's condition a secret, and then he rolls out in the debate and shocks everybody, because nobody was expecting joe biden to be so far down the road of dementia that he was incapable of completing a sentence. that's scary for america, and it is not that you have joe biden's advisors -- we need a commander in chief you that is what the presidency is.

it is not the advisors, it is the president. it is the executive branch. if you have a commander in is impaired, this is a very, very bad thing for america. so the big lie in the room -- and joe biden lied. he lied about israel. the big lie joe biden said is he said border patrol supported him, and they came out and said, heck no, we don't support joe biden. so joe biden is sitting there lying. he cannot complete a sentence. and the poor democrats, if they were really a democrat, they would have had a primary. like trump, he did not have to participate, but they got the other candidates out to show how good the republican party is. the democrats did not have a primary people -- host: ok. ok. that's john in california. this is emma in washington,

d.c., our line for supporting others. hello. caller: hi. i am supporting the american solidarity party this year. i am going to vote third-party for the first time. host: what is the american solidarity party? caller: they are socially conservative economically progressive. i am pro-life, by also believe we really need an economy that works better for working people. host: who was their candidate of choice? caller: their candidate is a guy named peter sonski, and their platform is basically modeled on christian democracy, so it is a good choice for christians who want to vote according to their values and feel that neither party really represents them. host: how did you come to the decision to support this party in this candidate? caller: well, i voted for bernie back in 2016. i volunteered for bernie. but i really care about the life issue.

i am a pro-life woman, and i've had many people tell me i am not allowed to be pro-life as a woman, and i just do not agree with that. but i also really want an economy that does not create this horrific inequality. so i do not really fit into either of the mainstream parties. host: as far as your candidate's concerned, is he on any ballots across the united states, or is this going to be a write-in option for you? caller: i believe he is on the ballot in d.c. i do not know about the coverage in all 50 states. in terms of voting third party, i think i always want to do that, and people always convinced me that was wrong, but at this point, i don't care, because i want to vote my conscience. host: that's emma in washington, d.c. on that line for other candidates did as she described, you can make that choice yourself and you can call in and talk about that. the wall street journal takes a look at president biden and some of the donors, wealthy donors,

in his campaign and reelection effort. it highlights the fact that netflix's cofounder said wednesday that he believes mr. biden should step away from his place at the top of the ticket. he has donated millions to the democratic efforts over the years. said biden needs to step aside for a vigorous democratic leader to defeat trump. hastings gave $100,000 to one of biden's fundraising outfits in june of 2020 three, according to federal campaign data. he also contributed nearly 3 million dollars total to super pac's working to make democrats the majority party in congress. among those publicly leading the pro-biden effort, the cofounder of linkedin, who has fielded hundreds of calls and other forms of outreach. some want hoffman, a venture capitalist and democratic donor,

to tone down, according to people familiar to the matter. you can see that in the wall street journal this morning. florence from cincinnati, ohio, a supporter of former president trump. hello. caller: good morning. i am calling because i just had to voice this opinion that i am voting for trump. if this is biden versus trump, it has got to be trump. i cannot see myself, as an african-american male, middle-aged, voting for somebody who cannot put together sentences. biden says he needs more sleep. that is why they call him to be joe. and the fact he will not do event after 8:00 dm last night last i checked, the debate starts at nine from his perspective, i do not

think there are any other debates. and i will not vote for anybody who is mentally incompetent in office. host: lawrence of there in ohio. again, you can continue calling in on the lines. as we have been telling you through the course of the morning, various opinion -- among them, ben deeter, a host for kwam radio. tell us a little bit about the audience. guest: 50% of them come a lot of them are not surprised, as we saw from the last caller. we have in seeing these videos out of washington repeatedly now. on one hand, yes, you have some people that were shocked by what they saw, but for a large part

of our audience in tennessee, they were not shocked at all. they were disappointed. they felt lied to by the media, by the democratic machine. who is actually running the white house? what we saw thursday night, no one is in control in that setting. host: so as far as the discussions go for the campaign, where are they with the former president, do they think the events of the last we cap them greatly or are they still on the fence? guest: i think a lot our listeners are more motivated to get out and vote or trump more than ever. something i noticed, as someone who has covered these things a little bit, is the discipline we are seeing out of the trump campaign lawyer if you notice, outside of that true social method -- message the former president sent out yesterday, where he did ring up the debate

performance, the possibility they will replace joe biden at the top of the ticket with kamala harris, possibly, he has been pretty tightlipped. that is one be in the bonnet for some of our conservative, right-leaning sinners. they like president trump, they like the four years he had in office. they do not like that rhetoric. host: so when you look ahead, when it comes to other issues in this campaign, what would you say those listeners of yours, what are top issues for them going into the election? guest: we broadcast out of memphis, tennessee. if you look at the homicide numbers, we are ranked as the dangerous, most violent city in america. so it is violence, no question. behind crime is the economy and inflation is heading folks incredibly hard. it is fascinating to see how both of these campaigns are tackling these issues.

i would say they resonate with any candidate, whether that be a joe biden or donald trump, that sets their partisan attacks aside and just speaks to them on the economy, on those pocketbook issues. host: let's take the issues in reverse, then. when it comes to the former president and crime and if that is an issue for your viewers, how is he addressing it, and what is he saying about it? guest: he has been on our morning show a couple different times, former president donald trump, and he will say, during his four years as president of the united states, he backed law enforcement, he had their back, for set to mulch was summer of 2020, where we saw violent protests across the country. after that, you saw a lot of knee-jerk reactions to that terrible death of george floyd, a lot of these -- defunding police department being one of them. anytime a candidate can get out

there and say we will fund the police department, whether they actually have that control, where they sit in washington, that is a good thing for a lot of listeners concerned that, when they are getting their groceries, they will come back to the parking lot and see that shattered last, which is all too common in these big, blue cities in america. host: i think the last time we talked, you're just gotten a new mayor in memphis. one thing he was advocating for is this crime issue. what is he saying, and is he backing up the rhetoric with actual action? guest: well, it is our job, as you know, to hold our public officials accountable. to say it has been cordial would be an understatement. we have gone back and forth. but he is coming on the show tuesday, and we will sit down and talk about the differences between restorative justice -- while it sounds wonderful on table, -- on paper, i do not

know whether in memphis or these cities, whether that be washington, chicago, baltimore, if you have the luxury of second and third chances when it comes to these criminal defendants. for so many years, what the public are dealing in these cities wrecked by crime, the victims are sometimes treated like criminals and they criminals treated like victims. i hope he leans into that campaign promise he made back in november, where we are going tough on crime. have i seen it? i am still giving him a little patience, let's say that. host: your primary in the state is august 1 give one of the things most states are dealing with, particularly after the last campaign cycle, is the idea of election integrity. what is the state doing? are there issues popping up of concern? guest: i do not think so, not in tennessee. i just had the chair of the republican party in tennessee,

scott golden -- they -- host: when it comes to them, what you are looking for in the days and weeks ahead, what do you talk to your audience about, and what are you looking for specifically for the campaign? host: every morning, i wake up at 7:00 -- i am off today, joining you guys -- and i sound like a broken record, but it is local and state elections. i understand what we are seeing in the beltway is so flashy. we are living in quite uncharted territory. but when it comes to what affects americans in their hometowns, in their neighborhoods, it is their mayors, their district attorneys , those prosecutors, those judges. i know judges on a ballot may not the most attractive thing when it comes to an election cycle, but when you look at august, when you look at november, there are some really critical state and local

elections that, if you want your policy acres to work you, you are in contact with them at the local and state level. yes, i will be covering biden, trapped, and what an election campaign so far this cycle. but my message is, if you really want to affect change, it has got to start with your city council number or commissioner on the county level. host: one more question about the campaign, the election campaign, we were talking to another conservative talk show host, the prospect of a vice presidential candidate. to your audience, are they that interested in the topic? guest: i think they are. it is really the only, on the republican side, choice that they feel like they have gotten this primary. while there were some other contenders, trump went straight to the top. he became the nominee so prematurely. so now they are like it is a variety, is it j.d. vance, tim

scott? a lot of them would be just ok with them winning in november. that is from my perspective. and i am ok with a nikki haley. i am ok with someone who -- maybe -- host: to what degree do you think they are with the former president at this stage? guest: there was polling after the president's conviction in manhattan, and they have not just run towards the former president, believing this is just a political witchhunt against him and his candidacy. in fact, they have leaned a little bit towards biden. i think, for a lot of these independent voters, they are just disgruntled, they are upset. they just want their politicians and those people who claim to be public servants to work for them. i would encourage any one of these two guys, if they are listening to the "washington journal" this morning, you have

got to talk about the economy, inflation, and bringing down that political rhetoric. because real americans, when they are out with their families for the fourth of july, we do not talk like they do in washington, and i think they should take notice of that. host: how can people find your show? guest: they can go to mighty990 .com and stream the show, 7:00 to 9:00. host: ben deeter serves as the host that network. thank you for your time. guest: have a good weekend. host: we continue on with the current state of campaign 2024. on our undecided line, this is robert in missouri. thanks for waiting. go ahead. caller: i thought about robert kennedy, and all of a sudden, he is not on. you can't hardly find -- host: you are cutting in and out.

could you get closer to your handset or move it closer to a window -- caller: i am on it. host: ok. caller: of course, i looked at biden. i really thought he was fine, minus the last debate. i should head and said no to that. but maybe somebody will come along -- host: i apologize, you're cutting in -- caller: the only thing left is the felon, and i cannot bring myself to vote for a felon. so i am undecided. host: robert in missouri. new hampshire, this is weighing it for those who support former president trump. hello. caller: hello, how is it going today? host: it goes well. go ahead. caller: i am voting for donald

trump because the biggest reason of all is our borders. joe biden opened the borders. it is not a secret. right now, women and children are being raped and murdered because of the people he is patrolling into this country -- paroling into this country. that is pretty important. when joe biden made a move that is letting this happen, this has to be stopped. and donald trump will close the borders on day one, so i have to support him. they've left me no alternative. we can't have this go on anymore. this has to stop. and one more thing. about that bill the democrats came up with on the border, that still let in 5000 people a day care that is why the republicans did not want it. what they were doing was they want to fast-track the illegals

to get in even faster. that is why they wanted more money for judges to let them all come in. that is my biggest reason. and that border bill was nothing care that is why the republicans did not support it. thank you. host: next up is games in michigan, a supporter of president biden. hello. caller: hello. i am supporting the president, joe biden, not because of what had happened 41 debate. one debate, all of a sudden, joe biden should be president. the thing is donald trump tried to overthrow our government with insurrection, telling his people to go down to the capitol to do insurrection, to overthrow the government. donald trump once to be -- have authoritarianism government.

he invited -- from the soviet union from hungary. he says putin is his best friend. donald trump is a liar. he tells lies, he is good at telling lies, -- when we open up, we all got the same organs. we are all one people, one race. donald trump is a liar, a cheater, a womanizer. anybody that thinks he is a good man, joe biden did not cause inflation, joe biden cannot stop corporations, stockholders at

all these supermarkets to make prices. that is one thing. joe biden can talk to these store owners, these corporation owners and say, look, can you lower their prices? they are not listening to joe biden. joe biden did not cause inflation. joe biden brought on great jobs, he backed all the unions, law enforcement says they have given up on donald trump, because donald trump is a convicted felon, and he is trying to become a king in a democratic democracy -- host: ok. that is james in michigan. in the opinion pages of the new york times today, this is nate silver, the founder and former editor of the site 538 that takes a look at polling data and what it means for the current resident. this is the headline, doing nothing about biden is the riskiest plan of all.

he writes the data is remarkably consistent. there are swing states that also have competitive senate races, arizona, michigan, nevada, pennsylvania, and wisconsin. in those states, there have been 47 nonpartisan surveys conducted since stir biden and mr. trump emerged as bear parties' clear nominees in march. in 46 of the 47 polls, the democratic candidate pulled better than -- which means mr. biden did not pull the candidates in any surveys -- if the pollster made one available. none of the 47 polls showed the democratic candidate trailing in the senate race, although two showed a tire. in contrast, mr. biden lead in only 7 of the surveys and was tied with mr. trump in two and

trailed in the other 38. more analysis there. you can find that on the opinion side of the new york times this morning by nate silver pa let's go to george on our line for supporting other candidates. george is in massachusetts. hello. caller: hi, how are you? host: fine, go ahead. caller: love the show. there is no way i can go to the two natural diminishing of faculties for the current president. anyone who has a sick loved ones can see the rapid diminishing. on the other race is a sociopath. i am for kennedy, robert f kennedy. host: why is that? caller: that is what i was hoping you would ask. the corporate capture of government, which we need systematic reform from taxes all the way to monopolies. replace the major department heads, whether it is the cia,

nsa, and all of those. food supply, we need safety, the pesticides is really messing our food supply up. diplomacy over the nic -- studies and statistics from medications and mandates that say that is what we need now. and the last thing is he wants to close the border. there are a few other candidates, but i cannot go with the top two. host: otis joins us from michigan, in detroit, a supporter of president biden. go ahead. caller: i am supporting president biden because even listening to this program -- i listen to you on a regular basis -- all the policies and things that biden and his team have approved, from infrastructure, reducing insulin costs, trying

to help students who have been ripped off, even from donald trump's face college, -- and also, i am tired of you talking about michelle obama. she has said she is not running. now trump is starting to put an attack on her. please let the sister enjoy her family. she said she is not running. stop putting her in studies and let her be. but those who said they support a third party and not support trump, you do not make any sense, because if you're going to vote for a third party, it is like voting for trump. so please make sense. and the african-american who said the only reason why -- i am an african-american male, vietnam veteran. an african-american male who feels like the only reason he is not voting for biden because he did not do well on a debate?

but he has not said anything about policies. it does not make any sense. you read off the things that biden has done and wants to do, and he read off things about trump, and people were saying, wait a minute, he is going to jack this country up here there is no policy in this plan. donald trump, get off the golf cart and come back on the trail, so we can find out what his policies -- host: ok. james up ok. james is next in california. supporter of former president trump. hello. hello? you are on, go ahead. caller: yes, i am u.s. navy, retired, and i am also african-american. under barack obama african-americans lost homes. african-americans are now last in homeownership. under the democrats. in the whole world saw biden.

you cannot hide it anymore. i cannot imagine how anybody could vote for a person who cannot put a sentence together. so, i did far better under trump. i gas was $3.50. now we are paying six dollars and seven dollars a gallon because after biden came in putin invaded ukraine. so that is why we are paying more for gas now. and that also led to inflation. so that is why i am trump all the way. host: ok. james in california. after the debate a group of governors, democratic governors, heading to the white house for a with president biden. that took place wednesday night. after that they became -- they came before cameras, talking about continued support of the biden candidacy. here is a portion from earlier this week. >> i had a great conversation

with the president. like many americans, we are worried. you're worried because the threat of a trump presidency is not theoretical for governors. we served, and the threats to our nations are real. what we understand was the trump presidency was chaos, destruction, a biden presidency was dealing with covid, using the science, investing in infrastructure, and working for the middle class. all of us at trying to figure out who want to make sure as governors, we are on the front line of many of these things. we are in states where folks care and are giving us feedback. feedback was, we are all looking for the path to win. all of the governors agree with that. president biden agrees with that. he has had our backs through covid. through all of the recovery, the governors have his back, and we are working together to make very clear on that, a path to victory in november is the number one priority. that is what we are trying to

get done. the feedback was good. the conversation was honest and open, and the acts that will come out of that, we are making sure we are getting that message out. host: that was earlier this week. today president biden is heading to wisconsin to campaign. also to take that interview for abc news that airs tonight. other campaign events also added to the schedule for the biden campaign. we can keep you up-to-date on all of that if you visit our website at c-span.org. you can find not only the latest events concerning the president and former president when he does offense, but all of those things wrapped up and it comes to campaign 2024 at c-span.org. you can always follow along on our app at c-span now. thomas in texas, a supporter of president biden. go ahead. caller: good morning, everybody. early to bed, early to rise. get your rest, biden. pedro, can you do me a favor?

read the numbers on the immigration, if it is up or down, and numbers on abortion, if it is up our -- up or down. read the production on that. is it better or worse under biden? what i'm doing, i'm voting against the policies that trump have, and the people that support them. steve bannon, could you imagine that? steve miller? are you guys crazy? i am voting to restore voting rights. she has to vote for something. not against anything, but for something. have you seen chevron? what it is doing to your drinking water? i'm voting against policies like that. you guys have a good day. vote for something. host: troy is next. a supporter of president trump. hello. caller: thank you, pedro, for taking my call, and i'm going to vote for trump. it is real easy. i reflect back on the trump

administration and what my life was like. i was paying $1.86 for gas in georgia, and i remember when biden took office one of the first things he did was dismantle trump's energy policy in this country that i kind of think was successful. the measure of that, the price of gas, that is real easy for me. i have not had less than three dollars a gallon gas since biden took office. it has hovered around three dollars since, going up from below two. also with the executive order he dismantled trump's border policy, and we have all seen the catastrophe that has been. so, in my mind it is really easy. we have had four years of trump. have had four of biden. i simply compare the two, and it is an easy choice for me. i would like to remind everybody too. i have heard people raise this

issue that trump is a convicted felon. and that is true, but i would like to remind everyone that biden could have well been indicted and tried for a felony, but he was certified not able to stand trial by his own doj. i hesitate to use the word imbecile. i heard one pond and say but he was certified incompetent to -- to stand trial. host: troy in georgia there. you can post on our various social sites. you can send us a text at (202) 748-8000 --(202) 748-8003, campaign 2024, if you want to comment on any aspect of that. we have been joined by pundits. joining us again, she is the editor-in-chief and chief columnist for the michigan advance.

hello, welcome back. guest: thank you for having me. host: remind our viewers about michigan advance. what you do and the approach you take. guest: we are a nonprofit newsroom. in all 50 states we cover the state capital and we are very much covering the 2024 election as michigan is a swing state. host: over the last week what has been of interest to you? also your state of the swing state? guest: it is no secret this has been a close election and president biden has been struggling in some of the states he won in 2020. and certainly in michigan. after the frenzy of the first debate in the president's performance there has been a lot of concern in michigan about whether he should stay on the ticket. what this means for the fall.

it has been interesting because the trump campaign has been rather why it is time. host: as far as the response you get when you post and the people that respond to you, what is your sense as far as what should be done for the biden campaign? how they should go forward? guest: it is interesting. i have been covering politics for over 20 years, and one constant is democrats panic matter watch. i think there is no doubt that there is widespread panic. following the debate performance there definitely has been talk about biden stepping down now for the election. but i will say that there are a fair number of supporters both elected officials and regular voters who want to stay the course with him, who think that biden has been the best president in their lifetime, and you don't want to quit on him. host: that support also coming

from your governor, gretchen whitmer. talk about her input into this and where she is coming from with that. guest: the governor of michigan is a strong ally of biden. she has also been widely talked about as a 2028 candidate. more recently, again, as a 2024 candidate. she was part of that governor's meeting. she went in person on wednesday. her response was really short after that meeting, which i did find notable. she just gave a short tweet. she was not parted that press conference minnesota governor tim walz was part of. publicly she has been a staunch ally. but i think it is pretty clear that she, like a lot of democrats, has some real concerns. host: to what degree? i'm sure you have seen as well that is the constant name that comes out as far as a possible replacement. in her interest in that would be

serious. guest: logistically i think it would be very difficult to replace biden with anyone but vice president kamala harris. we are so far into the process now. however, there is a lot of wish casting for witmer. her numbers in wish -- in michigan are great. they are far better than biden's r. there is definitely an argument to be made that the governor of a key swing state with a strong record would be a good contender this year. i just think that the main thing standing in the way of her or any of the other names being mentioned, like california governor newsome, who was just in michigan yesterday, campaigning for biden, is just, you know, what it would mean to get someone on the ballot who is not currently in the vice presidency. host: we talked about michigan

as a state. president biden struggles there. what do you think makes them struggle so in the state? guest: i think the top issues that have heard him are the the israel-gaza war. we have a large population of arab-americans, as well as jewish americans here. it definitely has caused a rift in the democratic party. certainly nobody is comfortable with the amount of bloodshed there since october 7. so, we have known that is an issue for the president. and concerns about the economy, which is strong by basically every measure, but inflation has slowed, but for many people, you know, basic costs are still higher than they were during the pandemic, where things completely bottomed out. and, you know, you were hearing a lot of concerns about the price of gas, even though it has been dropping.

and housing in particular. we have had one of the most affordable housing markets in the country, and so to see these kinds of drums we have seen in the last couple of years it has been fairly disconcerting for voters. host: your state's primary was in february. that is where we saw 100,000 primary voters who voted for this uncommitted vote. what have you learned from that and is there still that vibe today? guest: i think that, sadly, the israel-hamas war has been shoved off the pages, with all of the concerns to date. obviously there is huge concerns about what is going on there and the high death toll. but certainly for a lot of michigan voters that is still top of mind. and that was a driving factor for this uncommitted movement, although certainly there were a number of progressive voters who

had wanted bernie sanders to be the nominee, and they were never going to be satisfied with biden. so, you do have some fissures in the democratic party. host: your state has made key decisions when it comes to reproductive rights. how do you think that translates on a nationwide level? guest: michigan has certainly been a model for a lot of states where we probably will be seeing ballot initiatives this year, and that is expected to drive up turnout in states like arizona. the rna part is that michigan may be a victim of its own success, because it was such a popular measure. it ran ahead of any democrat on the ballot, and it certainly helped lift a lot of pro-choice democrats down ballot. but now that abortion rights are secured in our state constitution i have heard from voters that think even with the

trump presidency we will be protected. and, you know, there is not as much of a motivation to vote here as pulling has showed amongst democratic women because, you know, in their minds abortion has been taken off the table. that is white governor gretchen whitmer in her campaign for president biden has really been stressing that it trump presidency means a national abortion ban. host: you serve as a columnist for your publication. what guides what you write about and what do you think you are going to write about next? guest: i think i probably will write about the recent supreme court decision on presidential immunity. that was just an earthquake in terms of the structure of our government and where we go forward. no, i did write about the debate last week. i'm sure i will be revisiting that and what the situation is in michigan. and then, of course, i also write a lot about policy and

terms of what is going on with the economy and issues like lgbtq rights in the state. host: how can people find the site? guest: we are found at michiganadvanced.com. we are also on all of your social media platforms. host: joining us again, susan d emas. thanks so much for your time today. host: we continue on with your calls. this is from judy. judy is in illinois, a supporter of president biden. thank you for waiting. go ahead. caller: sure. i really like susan demas, is that her name? host: yes. caller: she brought up some really good points. i'm voting for biden because after the democratic convention there will just be 75 days to

potentially have a new candidate. and we know biden, and we know that he has good people around him. none of us knows the future, you know, about our mental health. he had one really verbal debate. the other thing i really want people to do is to look up project 2025. which is what the trump group want to put into action in this country. this past july 4, yesterday, was our year 2000 -- i mean year to 48. i want us to be able to get to 250 has a democracy. project 2025, funded by the heretic found -- the heritage foundation, is a very expensive plan to change our government. it is also potentially -- i just

realized, with everything that has happened trump could put himself in and never leave. and that would be sad. host: judy in illinois, joining us, again part of the calls this morning when it comes to issues related to campaign 2024. one of those will be economic issues. latest job for -- job numbers for june out just a few moments ago. the u.s. economy adding 206 thousand jobs. that causing the unemployment rate to raise slightly to 4.1%. a supporter of former president trump, this is leah in south carolina. caller: yes, sir. good morning. yes, i don't understand why democrats are not real happy or fond of robert kennedy. i kind of like him. i kind of like his ideas. of course, i could not vote for him because i am a republican, but they think of trump as a

felon. ok. we know that all illegals are not bad, and all americans are not good. but with the many women who have recently been murdered, kidnapped, and raped by a lot of these young guys who are living across the border, they have been in jail and other countries and they are mean dudes. they have been parts of the cartels. i live in south carolina and we have cartels here now and i lower income areas, they are living in groups. they are renting homes and they are mean dudes. so, the blood of these women are on the hands of mr. biden. and democrats in washington are for abortion. it is not women's rights.

it is to keep the population low. thank you. host: rose is next. rose is in south carolina, a supporter of president biden. caller: good morning. how is everyone this morning? i don't think we should be worried about biden or trump. we should be thinking about democracy or dictatorship. remember that trump has already said that on his first day it would be a dictatorship. i as an older person do not look forward to the younger generation working under somebody with a dictatorship style. because if we wanted dictatorship we would not have moved from england. that is one of the most outrageous concept of any american, to think of american as dictatorship. look at our supreme court.

they are moving so far to the right until you think of our president as being a king. and that we do not need. i think we need to stop, breathe, take a good look at what we have. let's not, please not, determine what happened in 90 minutes of the debate. host: that is rose in south carolina. it was the trump campaign taking that debate in using it in their latest campaign ad. here it is. >> when you think about the joe biden you saw tonight, ask yourself a question. do you think the guy who was defeated by the stairs got taken down by his bike, lost a fight with his jacket, and regularly gets lost makes it four more years in the white house? and you know who is waiting behind him, right? vote joe biden today, and kamala

harris tomorrow. >> i'm donald trump indictment this message. host: let's hear from tim. tim is in north carolina on our line for those who are undecided. caller: hey, pedro. how are you doing this morning? host: i'm fine. go ahead. caller: i wanted to go off topic. i'm one, you are reading from the new york times about the 47% and the senators and the democrats and all of this stuff. anybody that follows politics -- i have been following politics for about 48 years -- those that the new york times is a very left-wing, liberal -- i mean i'm a very liberal -- newspaper. so, i don't know if you take their talking points seriously or not. mean, i cannot judge you. a lot of people don't know that brian lamb started this network. i think he has gone to another side too, as far as going to the left.

it really astounds me that people talk about trump being a dictator. host: caller, before you go too far, since you started off topic, you are calling on the undecided line. is that the case as far as who you are going to vote for in november? caller: yeah, i don't like either one of them. it is the lesser of two evils. look at biden. he has never had a real job. you know, he has never really done anything. and, yes, trump has his problems. he is not perfect i any means. i wish we had another candidate, but it is what it is. my point is, the american public is very gullible. they listen to the news media and they don't know how to make a decision for themselves. it is bad. host: ok. rose is next in ohio. a supporter of president biden. caller: hi. good morning. this is rose from ohio. and i will be supporting

president biden and the harris ticket. i want to ask america, the voting public, a question. can you have a democracy under a dictatorship? trump has said he will be a dictator on the first day of office. you will not be able to vote. we just celebrated july 4, america's birth date. after 248 years. it may have been the last time we will celebrate july 4. so, if you vote for trump your rights will be taken away, as they were by the supreme court this past week. host: caller, do you think president biden stay in the race? caller: i will be voting for the biden-harris campaign, even if they roll him into the oval office in a hospital bed on life support.

that is how bad the trump administration will be. host: ken is next. can in new york, a supporter of former president trump. hello. caller: good morning, sir. how are you this morning? host: i am well. caller: these democrats, the -- did they forget that president trump was president for four years? did he do anything to be a dictatorship? they are throwing this word around like -- like he's going to take over the country. when i was -- i was a tractor-trailer driver. an owner-operator. are you still there, sir? host: go ahead. you are still on. caller: when i was an owner-operator in my company i could afford $2.38 a gallon for diesel. now it is four dollars or five

dollars a gallon. owner-operators are leaving because they cannot afford it. you know, it was nice when economy was 1.9%. 1.4%. when president was in there. i just don't understand how these people can say, well, 90 minutes of biden, that doesn't make sense. biden has been like this for over a year and the media has just, you know, they have hidden it. and so, all of got to say is, if you want to have another four years of what we are living in now, you go ahead and vote for biden. host: ok. our line for those who are voting for another candidate, this is mike in maryland. caller: i have a suggestion i think will work. the way it is now we have two extremes. trumpers and liberals.

the thing they have in common is their hate for liberals. you are not going to change the dynamic by putting more liberals, whether it is biden or harris, it is still going to be the same. you're not going to get any more votes. but if they put a moderate person it would work. i would suggest that this is different. i would suggest that the democrats run liz cheney for president and the vice president can be just about anybody they want to pick. here is the thing. liz cheney is a conservative that is known to stand up for the country in spite of all of the stuff conservative people are now saying. it is not the conservatives saying it. in fact, there is a lot of conservatives that only voted for trump because they think biden is so liberal. they would vote for liz cheney because everyone knows she stands for the country first and she would work with both sides. that is what we've got to have. the only way we could get her in

there is air for the democrats to put her in there. she might run third-party but she would split the vote. the only hope is that democrats would see that she is doing so well they would drop out and transfer the votes to her. if they win with her first they would pull the rug out from under the trumpers. do you see what i mean? she is the only type of ticket that will get more votes than just another democrat on the ticket. host: ok. sharon is next in alabama. a supporter of president biden. hello. you are on the go ahead. caller: i will be voting for biden, unless he has his cabinet all sat around and praise him before they can give out information about a policy. and i don't need a reality show. there is plenty of them on the tv. i don't think the government should not be ran as a reality show. host: to your former statement,

elaborate on that. what do you mean by that? caller: i am voting for my grandkids' future. and there is no future in any of trump's policies that will help my grandchildren. host: why do you think president biden is up to the task? caller: because he is working to undo the last 50 years of the trickle-down economics that anybody can look at and see did not work. you gotta go middle-out, bottom-up works so much better than trickle-down, and citizens united, just the whole supreme court the way it is now, it is just a set up for failure for democracy. host: you will hear from margaret next. margaret in wyoming, a supporter of former president trump. caller: oh, yes, pedro. trump, trump, and trump.

i'm still so disappointed with the talking points of the democrat socialist party against trump that when he was president that it was chaos. let me ask you a question. who was covering the riots that were taking place prior to january 6? all of that destruction? all of the burning? all of the chaos? all of the looting? shooting and killing and murdering police? who was covering that? they don't want to talk about any of that. host: how does one relate to the other? caller: well, they keep bringing up january 6. january 6. and they will not let it go. host: ok. beverly in wyoming, a supporter of president biden. hello. caller: yes.

i just wanted a good president, and i honestly know in my heart that it is joe biden and kamala harris. and the haters -- we are all haters, you know? but to demean people, that is beyond me. i think they need peace. with each other. host: ok. all right. jerry in arizona. a supporter of former president trump. caller: yeah. i support trump because, one, he knows where he is at. he is still with it. two, biden is just evil. people with everything, and that's all i got to say. host: again, for two hours now we have been taking your calls on things related to campaign 2024.

whether you want to talk about a specific candidate, whether you want to talk about policy issues in this campaign or other related issues, you have your chance to express your thoughts during this time. if you want to continue on in our last hour it is (202) 748-8000 if you support president biden. (202) 748-8002 if you are a -- if you support former president trump. it is (202) 748-8002 if you support others. if you support neither candidate you can call us at (202) 748-8003. and you can always send us a text on that number too at (202) 748-8003. we have been focusing on domestic politics, but also events happening when it comes to the united kingdom and their politics. fox news reporting that cure armor officially became the -- the prime minister of the united kingdom after the labour party's win in the general election. she sunak resigned as the prime minister. here starmer met with king

charles. the labour party won a majority. the previous prime minister, he held that job since october 2022. it is out of the prime minister's office like here starmer made remarks to the events of the last several hours, and what it means for the united kingdom. here are those remarks. pm starmer: our country has voted decisively for change. for national renewal and a return of politics to public service. when the gap between the sacrifices made by people and the service they received from politicians grows this big, it leads to a weariness in the heart of a nation. a draining away of the hope, the spirit, the belief in a better future.

so we need to move forward, together. now this wound, this lack of trust can only be healed by actions, not words. but we can make a start today with the simple acknowledgment that public service is a privilege. and that your government should treat every single person in this country with respect. if you voted labor yesterday, we will carry the responsibility of your trust, as we rebuild our country. but whether you voted labor or not, in fact if -- in fact, especially if you did not -- i say to you directly, my government will serve you.

politics can be a force for good. i have shown that. we have changed labour party, returned it to service. that is how we will govern. country first, party second. host: again, those are the events today in the united kingdom when it comes to the new prime minister, kyrsten armor. joining us to tell us more about what happened, c-span's westminster correspondent. thanks for your time. guest: thank you. host: how does the labour party find itself in this position? guest: the conservatives lost it this election. they lost it hugely. they lost a huge share of their vote, and labor were able to take advantage of that. by winning seat after seat and the other party and the liberal

democrats took hundreds of seats off of the conservatives. how they did it was by persuading the public that they needed a change. that 14 years of conservative rule have not gone well and it was time for a change. it points to the problem, the difficulty that all governments have at the moment if they are incumbent in staying in power. they know what to do, but not how to get reelected to do it. the remarkable thing about the voting pattern is that in england labor's vote share did not increase, and yet they got a landslide. that is because the conservative vote got shared around, and particularly with an insurgent party, the reform party, on the scene, and it was devastating. it meant that conservatives were

easy pickings for labor and liberal democrats to take. host: because you follow british politics so well, a sling to our audience the difference between being a conservative and labor when it comes to key differences. guest: oh, the parties are centrist, i would say. the centerleft is the labour party, and the conservatives, center-right bib someone argue with those descriptions, but i think it is fair. and there is not a fast ideological divide between them at the moment. there was five years ago, when boris johnson won the election. this time the emphasis was different in terms of the conservatives, saying they would lower taxes and lower migration to the country. but with a difficult record to defend because immigration has gone up and taxes have gone up, because of the covid period and because of the ukraine war.

so, you would be surprised, i think, how relatively small and few the ideological differences are between those two main parties. and yet it has led to a landslide victory for labor. host: a new prime minister, kyrsten armor. tell us about not only the policy positions he holds, his style of governing. guest: well, we are going to find out in less than two weeks time. there is the king's speech, which will give the program for government. he has talked about service and quieting down the style of government and avoiding the perception of chaos that there has been with so many conservative prime minister's. we have got through five of them in recent years. a huge turnover of ministers. so, stability and modesty of targets.

and a managerial approach seems to be what he is offering and what the public wants. host: when it comes to the former prime minister, rishi sunak, talk about what led to his downfall. guest: many commentators think never have a chance. that after the chaos of the boris johnson administration, which ended horribly, really, when it was discovered that when the rest of the country was in covid lockdown it was party time in downing street. then we had an unbelievably short-lived and chaotic administration from liz truss. so, rishi sunak had a very difficult inheritance, and he can claim some successes in his nearly two years. but it was going to be a very tall order if he was going to win the election. however, he has lost it really badly, and he is blamed for

calling it early. he did not need to call it this early, and for some pretty bad missteps in the campaign. perhaps the most notable of which was leading the d-day commemoration events early -- leaving the d-day commemoration events early to do a tv interview. host: we have seen the new prime minister meet with the king. it happens today otherwise? guest: i think people go for a sleep, to be honest. the journalists do, who have been up for more than 24 hours. the speed of events has been extraordinary. the polls only closed just over 12 hours ago and we already have a new government in place. the formalities have been completed, which means going to shake hands with the king and returning to downing street. there he generous, respectful speeches between the outgoing prime minister and the incoming

one. this speeches by the losing side were very civil and polite towards labor. it was quite refreshing, actually. they have very little time to prepare for a nato summit. it big summit of european leaders next week. in the king's speech on the 17th, which will be well worth watching, because that will tell us a lot about what they're going to do. but the civil service does not change over. there was not a mass sacking of civil servants and replacement by political appointees. there are some political appointees, but by and large the civil service says, we have new masters now, what do you want us to do? a huge amount of work starts behind the scenes, but a lot of people need sleep right now. host: you have seen events happened there in the u.k.. in france we are going to see the results of elections eventually. talk about those things happening in europe and the

differences that could take place as a result of the election. guest: yes. well, the french result, which may well lead to a far right government in france, cohabiting with president macron, poses a really big threat and question mark to the u and the european union operates. and it will be difficult enough for kyrsten armor, our new prime minister. it is interesting to note that when nigel farage, of the reform party, who made an enormous impact on the selection, although he only came away with four seats, and he was in the european parliament he would not do a deal with marine le pen. she was pretty cross about that. he would not go into a coalition with her. because he did not want his party to be associated with what he regarded as a racist party.

it is interesting how different -- because that party in france, though it has changed to some degree over the years, it looks like it is about to become the leading party. so, kyrsten are and the new prime minister here has got some quite challenging times ahead -- kyrsten armor and the new prime minister here has got some quite challenging times ahead. there is no difference between him and the outgoing government, the conservatives on russian aggression in ukraine. no difference whatsoever. host: peter knowles serves as c-span's westminster correspondent. nice to meet you via zoom, and thank you for your time. guest: thank you. host: thank you for waiting. for those of you waiting on the phones.

randall in north dakota on our line for those who are undecided. you are up next. go ahead. caller: thank you. my position within the past few days has changed. we have a supreme court that has said it is ok for the president to assassinate people. and in listening to other aspects of this judgment, this idea, whatever it is, i have decided that need somebody to come in. a new person -- or anybody. i will vote for anybody who will put these five supreme court justices in gitmo. i will support anybody who vocally, publicly says that that

is a stance they will put republican congressman like gae tz and goomer, whatever his name is, in gitmo for treason. i will support anybody who promotes the idea of putting senators such as hawley, or maybe mitch mcconnell, in gitmo for treasonous activity. host: cj is next on our line for others. hello. caller: yeah, is that me? host: yes, you are on. go ahead. caller: thank you. a couple of quick points. i think this week has turned my opinion away from biden.

i think he has been a great public servant. he has been a terrific president. i think the play would be to step down, have, harris become president, she picks her vice president, but then the democrats should have an open convention, because this country needs to learn what civics are all about. what a democratic republic is all about. it would be a learning experience for everyone, and i think we need that. i, you know, as going on elderly white dude, i would love to see two women on the ticket, because i believe that the biggest

issue, domestically is a woman's choice is -- as far as this -- if and win to have a baby. it controls the whole household. it is not a tax. it is beautiful if you want one. i have had a couple micelles, and it is a great, great thing. host: ok. cj there. let's hear from jenny in north carolina. a supporter of former president trump. caller: hey, pedro. i'm out there listening to all of these people, and every time i hear them speaking i hear the news media. they are spewing what they are hearing. i just want the news media to stop lying and admit biden had dementia before 2020. that they know biden does not

have four years left. half of the democrats want biden out. half of them want in. those governors are still saying, biden has a cold, biden is fine. did these people realize it is not age? i want them to realize it is dementia, and that biden is done. i'm listening to the jobs. do they realize -- listen to the media. i wish they would say that jobs are more part-time and immigrants. people are demanding full-time jobs. and where are they getting trump, that he is going to stay as the president? what person stays as the president? obama would have stayed as a president if that was possible, and thank god that is not possible. trump has four years and in 2028 all of you people can get out there and start trying to be the new president. but i'm just tired of the media.

i'm just laughing. you all know, and you too, pedro, you have to know he has dementia. you all have to know and have been lying, covering up the laptop, covering up dementia. now i'm listening to harris. she thinks biden is great. she is the borders are. she is the one that was in charge of the border. she is letting everybody in. god only knows if harris becomes president. host: charles in -- charles is in texas. a supporter of present biden. caller: i don't understand what is wrong with these people. i am 78 years old, ok? they keep talking about what trump is going to do for the border concern. if it was not for him he probably would have had a border bill, but he called johnson and said, i don't want that on there. i need something to run on. because they have nothing else to run on in the republican congress. number two, the only thing,

talking about biden on the teleprompter. trump don't need a teleprompter because this man never speaks the truth. everything he tells you is a lie. he came off the escalator and the first thing he did when he got to be president his first year, he said obama got them in a mess, which is a lie. if you check it he will see the upcoming war, see how he was. and he also said he's going to hire the very best people. all of the people he hired are either in jail, going to jail, or he would pardon them. for older people like myself -- and i'm 78, trump already told you if you watch anything other than fox news that he is going to have to do something about social security. that means he is going to cut discretionary spending. that is what he is saying. he told the oil company that he is going to do all of this environmental stuff that biden has put in, and if they give him a billion dollars and go back to

his policies. people better wake up. host: that is charles there. again, you can continue calling on the lines. (202) 748-8000 if you support president biden. (202) 748-8001 if you support former president trump. if you support others it is (202) 748-8002. and if you support neither, (202) 748-8003. we have been promising you visits with those who opine on various issues throughout the morning. mitch joins us from carolina journal. he is there a senior political analyst. nice to see you again. guest: thanks for having me again, pedro. host: describe to people the carolina journal. i suppose it is state-centric, but what do you focus on? guest: carolina journal is a publication of a free market think tank focusing on state government issues.

so, folks who are outside observers will say we are center-right or right-leaning. some will call us libertarian. it carolina journal is our publication focusing on largely state government issues. host: when it comes to the state and what the two candidates bring to state function, how would you describe that? guest: certainly it is going to be an interesting contrast when you are looking at biden versus trump. obviously we have a record from both of them now, since trump served in office for four years and biden served almost four years. you see a different perspective in terms of how much taxation to have, how much regulation to have. a different approach to how to fill vacancies on the court. i think north carolina voters are going to be taking all of those things into account when they go to the polls. of course, this is going to be a very big year for north carolina. not only our 16 electoral votes

up for grabs, and republicans have had success ever since the first obama election. he won north carolina, but ever since republicans have won every four years. i think if you had that money today you would say it is likely that donald trump would win. but certainly our electoral votes are in play. the biden administration certainly thinks so. the day after that to be a performance that was panned so heavily he was here in north carolina, trying to wrap up his campaign again. so, the six team electoral votes are important. we also have an open governors race that is important. roy cooper, a democrat who has been very popular in this state, or popular than other democrats up and down the ballot, he is no longer on the ballot. this time it will be an open race between two candidates with stark contrasts. all of those things will come into play as they are heading to the polls in november. host: do you sense a differing

mood when it comes to those potential voters and those who would potentially be -- intentionally vote for biden because of the performance last week? is there some type of change do you think? guest: i think there are some people who are certainly frightened about that prospect of having president biden on the ballot in november after that debate performance. a lot of things can change between now and november. he certainly could come up with some sort of plan, whether it is speeches, whether it is interviews, whether it is something else that shows he has the vitality to be president for another four years. i think right now there are a lot of people that are particularly scared about the prospect of president biden in the state he is in being on the ballot again in november. of course, on the others there is a lot of interest in making sure that biden stays on the ballot, because that could make it easier for donald trump to come back and have another term. i can tell you that one of the things that has been interesting here in north carolina is as the

talk turned after the debate about, who are the potential successors if president biden cannot be on the ballot? of course, you hear kamala harris, the vice president, but also a number of other names, including governors. some of those lists of governors include our governor, the one i mentioned, roy cooper, who has won in a purple, maybe more red than purple state. he has won twice. he has now won a total of six statewide elections if you count his races for attorney general. among democrats he is a popular one in north carolina, and i think a lot of people on the national stage say a guy who can win over and over as a democrat in a southern state that tends to trend more republican, we have to take a look at him. so, his name has cropped up occasionally in discussions about who is the potential successor if president biden cannot be on the ballot. host: i want to ask you about former president trump and statements he has made before

the debate, and maybe even before when it comes to tariff policy. it is high-level stuff, but what do you think about the approach he wants to take and what he can do to an economy? guest: one of the things we have just -- been disappointed in his the major candidates have been talking about tariffs and their support for terrace. we are a free market group. we do not like terrace because the people that pay are the consumers. it ends up hurting the economy more than helping, and it is a return to protectionism, or some might say mercantilism, the policies of the past couple hundreds of years have shown have not worked as well as allowing free markets to work. so, it has been disappointing to see former president trump talk about tariffs. it has been disappointing to see the current administration also talk about protectionism. by usa, make only in usa types of policies that end up hurting us in the long run. the policies that should be in place are the ones that help

consumers, because those are the policies that end up boosting the economy him and to the extent that the trump team includes folks who have more of a free-market perspective, that would be a good thing to look at. host: one of the things up for debate's tax policy, particularly policy put in in the previous administration. what are those concerns? depending on who wins the race? guest: tax policies going to be a major issue. the trump tax cuts certainly had a major advantage in terms of jumpstarting the economy. i think had we not seen the covid pandemic we would still be seeing the effects of that jumpstart today, and the ideathn wants all of the remaining trump tax cuts to go away is something that would retard the economy. is it going to lead us into a recession or depression? probably not. but it is certainly going to hamstring the economy, and that is a bad situation, especially

you look down the road at the federal government's finances. the more we are in the hole with these trillions of dollars of deficit and debt, the fact is we need to have a robust economy to help us get our way out of that. if not, we are going to be ending up creating. bad situations for our children and game -- and grandchildren down the road. we need an economy that is boosted by lower taxes, less regulation. we need that sort of thing to help pay the debts we have already accumulated. host: it was earlier today that the jobs report for june came out. 200-6000 jobs added. that unemployment rate going up to 4.1%. that is nationwide. take that to what it means when it comes to people's decisions about a president. particularly how they feel about the economy? guest: we have seen in recent years that the jobs numbers and unemployment rate seem not to have registered as much with

people as how much they are paying when they go to the grocery store or when they going to buy close for the kids. the inflation issue has seemed to be much more top of mind for people than the jobs numbers, and even though the inflation rate has gone down since its peak when it was getting almost into the double-digit range, people are still saying, wait a minute, i'm paying a lot more now than i was a few years back, even if that inflation rate has declined. it is still higher than it was when i could remember just five or six years ago. that, i think, is going to weigh on people's minds as they head to the polls. the job numbers, it is something that is interesting. to pundits and politicos, and to some extent the people who are casting votes. i think it means less to them then how much they are actually having to shell out, how much more they are having to shell out today or something they paid for a few years ago, and they can see right there every time they pull out the card for the cash that there is a difference

and public policy plays a role in that. host: i'm sure there are viewers who might be interested in your publication. how can they find out more? guest: carolina journal is available every day at carolina journal dock -- carolinajournal.com. you can also contact us to get the free print edition we put out eight to 10 times a year. we would be happy to have people sign up there. and also you can learn about the parent organization, the john locke formed -- foundation at johnlocke.org. host: thanks for your time. nice to see you again. guest: thank you, pedro. host: we have about a half-hour to go for this campaign 2024-related show, giving us your thoughts on what you think about the current state of the race, either it be to the candidates themselves or the issues involved. (202) 748-8000 if you support president biden. (202) 748-8001 if you support former president trump.

if you support others it is (202) 748-8002. or if you are undecided, (202) 748-8003. kendra is on our undecided line from richmond, virginia. thank you for waiting. go ahead. caller: good morning, pedro. i am african-american. i used to be a democrat. now i am undecided. and i may not vote because of the two choices. i felt the same in 2020 about not voting, but then at the last minute i did vote. with the democrats everything is always about race, and it is sad that biden's vice president was chosen because of race and vendor instead of competency to run the country. from what i hear harris is a fantastic prosecutor, and she gave a lot of lack men limpy jail sentences for petty drug charges. the democrats are seeing firsthand the negative results of dei, because they realize

that if biden were to step down harris would not be able to be trump. i think if biden had a different vp he would have stepped down a long time ago. since trump is still doing well in polls the democrats, the media, and even celebrities are trying to scare black people about losing voting rights and project when a 25, which is a bunch of nonsense. most likely i of nonsense. most likely i will not vote but i will wait until trump selects his vice president. host: jim is from michigan, a supporter of president biden. hi there. caller: thank you for having me on. i would like to give you three examples, quickly, of why i support biden instead of trump. at the debate, when trump was asked about climate change in the environment, he stated, i want clean water, i want clean

air. he did not put forth a plan. also, when, earlier, when he was asked about obamacare, he said he had a plan to replace obamacare and it would be so much nicer, greater, and we would all be pleased with it. never happened. the last thing i would like to mention is this week i went to the pharmacy and i bought four boxes of insulin and four boxes of needles for only $75, which was far less than i have been paying in the past, which tells me biden keeps his word. if he says he is going to do something he follows through. trump does not because trump never has a plan. thank you. host: anthony is in california,

a supporter of former president trump. hi. caller: i want to know why the media is not fact checking these people. the way our system is set up, there is no way we can have a dictator. why is the media letting these people call these politicians? it is a bunch of bull. you need to fact check those people the same way you fact check trump all the time. the second thing, how could any person of color vote for biden? for god sake, the guy voted against the civil rights act. the most important bill for black people in this country. how can you vote for him? i'm voting for trump. people need to stick to the facts and they need to do research. thank you. host: christian in south carolina on the line for others. caller: hey, i just want people to remember when they are thinking about biden's competency that he has every means to put as many judges on

the supreme court as he wants. he could have done the same thing trump did were trump putting in the judges he liked to get judges he liked. now trump isn't me and. so is biden now, too. he cannot put as many judges in as he wanted to get the women's rights locked in. he could have gotten education. he could do anything, but he doesn't. i hope people realize that. host: who do you actually support? caller: oh, i would like bernie sanders to run. i don't think he will. i think he decided he doesn't want to. i just hope that we don't go more towards -- i don't know, man. i wish i had a choice. host: why bernie sanders? caller: he seems like the most knowledgeable guy. he seems like he cares about the people.

obviously, he is very institutionalist. he has to play the game where he is leaning on israel even if he doesn't want them to be bombed over there. he is not always saying what he might believe. he is an institutionalist, but he is the best guy who comes to my mind. host: christian in south carolina. "the washington post" looks at the possibility of president biden deciding to step out. what the process would be. this morning, saying with biden saying he has no intention on exiting the race, he told campaign staff no one is pushing me out. elected officials are in growing agreement about the conditions required for mr. biden to step aside. the polling would need to further plummet. elected democrats would need to desert him in large numbers. donor money would need to show clear signs of drying up.

then a group of democratic leaders, like tech schumer or jim clyburn or nancy pelosi, would privately tell mr. biden that not only is he going to lose but remaining on the ticket will cost them the house and the senate. this piece also says that the other part of the pitch to joe biden, president biden, is to remind him that he ran to stop trump and the existential threat he believed trump posed to democracy. if biden loses and drags down the house and senate with him not only will trump return to the white house but there will be no bulwark against him and what democrats believe are his dangerous policies. several stories related to the fact in the last couple of days, but that is the washington post take on. pamela a supporter of president biden in upper marlboro, maryland. caller: i am a married african-american cap black female and the mom of two adult

black sons. i'm definitely voting for president biden. i am encouraging my family and friends to vote for by then because democracy is at -- just like the previous color from south carolina said, this is democracy versus dictatorship. trump and the republican party plan to destroy our democracy as we know it with project 2025. look it up. we have been down this road again with democracy. it is called the civil war. the confederates lost then and they will lose now. did you know they had their own president and jefferson davis? they created their own constitution? it came to an end when the confederate military collapsed and jefferson davis was arrested by the united states cavalry. it is no contest. i am voting for democracy and president biden, a decent, honorable, one-wife, family-loving man versus trump

eight 34-count convicted felon, wife cheating, narcissist. as long as president biden, even if he has to be wheelchaired in, he has my vote. he wouldn't be the first in a wheelchair, the last one was one of the great presidents of america with his legacy being the new deal. host: pamela giving her defensive joe biden. you can do the same on the phone line. one thinking president biden will remain as the nominee for the democratic party come november is the former governor of wisconsin, walker, writing in the pages of "the washington times" democrats will stick with biden. saying campaign finance law makes it nearly impossible to transfer the natural advantage that biden-harris has over trump's campaign. as i type this call them, vice president, harris -- vice president kamala harris could use the funds but i don't hear

calls for her to replace the president. sticking with the incumbent, a party dominated by identity politics cannot leapfrog the first black woman to serve as vice president with a white man or likely even a white woman. in my opinion former first lady michelle obama is the only person with the profile to replace mr. biden and win both the nomination and general election. seeing hillary clinton's fall from grace should be a reminder to misses obama to stay out of politics. she and her husband enjoy high levels translated into book deals and speaking fees, why would they lose these benefits after years of trouble? there is more from "the washington times" if you want to read governor walker's thoughts. alabama, a supporter of former president trump. hello. caller: hello. i am voting for trump, because we cannot elect a person with dementia to be the president of

the united states. we just can't do that. we are going into war. it looks like we are going into the third world war. so, i'm still supporting trump. i hope biden loses big time. host: stay with us if you want to get your thoughts in when it comes to campaign 2024 issues. you can post on our social site and always send us a text at (202) 748-8003. joining us from serious xm, serving as the host, a first timer for our program, good morning. guest: thank you for having me. host: i said your name right? guest: you did. host: tell us about the show. what is expected these days? guest: my show is on serious xm urban view the talk black radio

station and i talked politics and pop culture. i call it the cookout on a saturday afternoon. host: this is a saturday and people are around the barbecue, what would they be saying about the state of politics today? guest: well, i think that they would be saying that the state of politics needs to get back to the bread-and-butter issues. too much of the conversation is about whether or not president biden should stay in the race and the democrats are guilty of perpetuating that conversation and not moving the needle forward on how we will get these gas prices down, these grocery prices down, interest rates down and make it more affordable for everyday americans. host: president biden, the things he has been talking about, why do you think that that message is not translated? guest: i think they're focusing too much on the issue of donald trump being a threat to democracy, which is very true,

but the reality is what people are focusing on is how much they are paying for milk, eggs, cereal, and childcare. the democrats have excellent solutions to that. solutions that republicans are obstructing or in cases like some of the republican states, denying the ability to have food assistance for students in the summer. they could be focusing on that. there needs to be more contrasting on the economic agenda and vision for the future, and a little less talking about things like donald trump is now a convicted criminal twice impeached president. i'm not saying that to normalize it. i am saying that given that people know that already, what else can you do to move the needle forward? host: he is the other person in this race. those issues that you think need to be talked about do they effectively get pushed to the side from here to november? guest: they do if we allow it, absolutely. donald trump does not have actual solutions.

he is proposing an aggressive tax increase on all americans in tariffs. the fact that he is getting way with that, that his manufacturing record was terrible, his china policy was horrible, many things he did during his administration didn't work and there is no focus on that. i think that the messaging and emphasis needs to focus and move beyond just donald trump's criminal past and the how big of a failure his record was. host: the conversation, as you hinted at, is about whether the president should stay in the race overall and the vice president constantly being mentioned. give us your take on that conversation. guest: honestly, i think that it's a fair conversation. i think the democrats instead of trying to stifle the conversation should try to shift it against those bread-and-butter issues. but i think there needs to be a little less arrogance in telling people to just shut up about

whether or not the president should continue. this is a campaign. that goes for incumbents, that goes for president biden. he has the capacity to show he is up for the task and he needs to do that. his allies would serve him well by doing that as well. as far as the conversation about vice president harris, any notion that she is unelectable is absurd. she is one of the most winningist politicians we have. polls have shown that she is the preferred successor to president biden if you were to not be the nominee. new polling has shown that she can be donald trump. ignoring that is also a little foolish. i don't know how this will shake out. we will know soon with this abc interview coming up, president biden can prove that he is up to the task or get enough information to step aside.

either way, the democratic party should be solely focused on moving the needle forward with the voters on the issues that matter the most to them. host: to what degree are you surprised you're hearing voices from a lot of fronts, be it members of congress, pendants on media, or others about the idea of changing the nominee at this point? guest: i am actually quite shocked to hear that. we have known that president biden is old, to put it frankly. he was old when he was elected the first time. all of this was baked into the cake. on the other hand, maybe it is foolish to be shocked because 50% of the country has been saying they don't want a rematch of president biden and president trump. so, the debate gave that opening to say, we told you, we need to switch course. i support president biden moving forward and making whatever decision he feels is best, and i support vice president kamala harris if that is the path that they decide to take. host: we've heard president

biden talk about the policies that have benefited african-americans and the former president say that his policies benefited african-americans. what do you think? guest: former president donald trump has no leg to stand on in saying that his policies benefited the black community. there were hundreds of thousands of black is nasa's arete it in under president trump, unemployment skyrocketed, his criminal justice reform is hostile to black americans. they pretty much got rid of any kind of civil rights activism in his administration. he supported three supreme court justices that have now under the biden administration overturned many of the protections african-americans enjoy in this country. on the other hand, the biden administration has been a champion for our community and so many ways. i personally reported on many of these issues at the white house like homeownership appraisal bias. vice president harris has

championed black maternal mortality and maternal mortality largely expanding post part of medicaid coverage for 12 months as opposed to 60 days. i can go on and on about the environmental justice record, record low unemployment, but it is more about the deliberate lens that this administration has taken that has really helped our community. that is something that i believe they will continue to do and they should make that case. host: how can people find your show? guest: i am at reeciecolbert.com and you can favorite on the xm radio app. host: i hope you will come back. guest: i certainly will. thank you. host: continuing with your calls for campaign 2024 and what you think about the issues and people involved. this is in virginia a supporter of president biden.

andy, thank you for waiting. caller: the thing that i have not understood is why moore has not been said about the fact checking that went on after the debate. i understand that the average seems to be there were 40-something mistruths by trump and 8 mistruths by biden. his were the kind where you missed a number by a little bit where the things that trump talked about were having a lot of subsidence to them. i am 77 myself. i'm not as fast on my feet as i used to be either. the idea of debating someone who is willing to say anything, knows how to please, knows what people want to hear, would be a hard thing for me to deal with. i have to write down everything

and look it up. i could see biden when he was trying to consider some of these questions that he is trying to tell the truth about everything. that is bound to slow you down when you are against someone who is not, and there is a lot of proof to that. obviously, trump has gotten where he is now based on being willing to say anything. that is one of the reasons i don't like him. he is willing to set a bad example for our children. this is how you can be successful by not having any integrity. there are things, but he really slowed down those feelings with teaching kids what i think about values. host: andy in virginia, let's hear from larry in ohio as a former supporter president trump. caller: good morning. i support trump but more

importantly i support the republican party. i believe the democratic party has values that are pretty immoral. they do give the poor people more money but they tend to target that to the group of people who will give them the most votes. host: sean in north hollywood, california on the undecided line. hi. caller: hello. i am honestly leaning more democrat than undecided. i would probably sooner vote for kamala before biden to be completely honest, especially listening to c-span. the argument that he is more senile and older is a little ridiculous to me. as a 25-year-old and most people i know my age would probably tell you after seeing the debate that they are both of a certain age.

i find it shocking there is no one else in d.c. a little younger for both of these major parties. the problem is it is de -legitimizing both to young people, those engaged in politics. it makes it seem a little ridiculous over the debate where we wasted a lot of time wondering if it would be important to see video of transcripts and refusing a subpoena. it seems like a waste of time. i think for us now, for me as a voter, and for most to require a lot of foresight on technology and different social times, i would just love a candidate that is more tapped into that. honestly, out of i guess the three i think kamala is the closest to that. host: sean in northern hollywood, california giving us a call. stay to c-span.org as president

biden goes to wisconsin for a campaign today and at the abc interview that will air tonight and will be part of his day. you can always follow along on two fronts. the website is c-span.org. if you want to check out what we are following there. you can follow on your mobile on c-span now, our free baumol app -- free mobile app. diane is from florida, a supporter of president biden. hi, there. caller: hello. i was going to say the talk about biden dropping out of the race would be comical if it wasn't so confusing. one bad debate for the 81-year-old guy who just traveled around the world, but no one is talking about the 78-year-old convicted felon who is a con man and noted liar and he is not asked to drop out. anyone who listens to him, he talks nonsense. trump, we are talking about

here. the caller who said we should just vote for trump and and 2028 you can have a different choice should think again. once he gets in he will not have the guardrails he had in his first presidency. he probably won't leave in 2028. now, with the support of the supreme court with presidential immunity he can pretty much do anything you -- he wants. that is a scary thought that it could become a dynasty family. biden spoke the other night and said he could pretty much had presidential immunity now, but he would choose not to because he has morals and integrity. you know, it is just really sad that people cannot see the writing on the wall. they are so locked into their

emotions and their pocketbook that everything else is being crowded out. that is all i have to say. host: brandon in california, undecided line. caller: my name is raymond. i would consider myself to be a progressive supporter in 2020. but i'm not voting biden this time. i would like to keep my criticism of him -- you can get frustrated because you can forget that we are on the same side as liberal leftists. i three examples if you would let me be quick. in the debate, in the first 30 seconds, joe biden comes out and he has, he is clearing his throat. i am wondering, is his staff backstage not giving and water? not understanding that -- because he did not walk out -- he was immediately not doing well.

i found that to be very troubling. if i was on his staff i wouldn't sentiment like that, or i would make sure he had water, or even give him a water bottle on stage. anyway, after that, when they are coming out and saying that he has a cold, and then he does the rally the next day and is perfectly fine. does he have a cold? is he perfectly fine? is he taking medication for the cold? everyone can see that the lie was a very weak live. the communication is he is still running with it like it's effective. as an average voter, it's nonsense. i think that that trend can be seen in a lot of different things. especially in the israel-gaza policy. the fact that he comes out and says we have a redline on r afah. the next day they are stopping one shipment and sending other shipments. it is inconsistent messaging. it is just weak.

host: arizona on the line for others. hi. caller: concerning clearing throats, i have to clear my throat after dairy products. anyway, back to what i was going to say, i would like kamala harris as president and amy klobuchar as her vice president. they are both very successful in their career. i know amy klobuchar has done a lot for minnesota. i like the team. i think they would be great. that's all i have to say. thank you. host: a supporter of president biden, tony in indiana. caller: mid 60's. it seems like in this age of the internet we have so much technology, but people listen so much to internet, to the news,

and we don't listen to our common sense anymore. mr. trump, if everyone would just put all of this information that they are getting out of their heads and follow common sense, they would know what he is about. that is all i would like to say. i appreciate you answering my call. follow your heart and follow your common sense and listen to what this man has to say. host: a supporter of former president trump. go ahead. caller: i'm listening to these democrats calls. especially the bernie sanders colors. you guys are marxists. he represents communism. no choice of freedom, the opposite of freedom, the same way with democrats in joe biden. i don't understand where you guys are living. four years ago we had money, we had opportunities, the black community he created empowerment zones giving them trade skills.

what did the democrats do with that money? not a word. he makes racist comments, joe biden does, and the black community still loves him. the media has caused you guys to look the other way. you have jp or whatever her name is, she can't do her job. that is an affirmative action hire. i'm listening to the debate, all of the excuses they are making, it is like an excuse t-shirt. he has a cold, he went on a trip -- his mind has been on a trip for four years now and it is not going to last much longer. the callers are in a different reality. what is going on? this is not america as we know it. this is like barack hussein obama said, he is there to transform america. and it is for the worst. host: john in florida on the line for others. caller: the last caller wrapped it up for me.

c-span, there is no conservatives on your panel. none of your phone call answers are conservative. this is the only place that i have to call. i am a conservative. am i happy about trump, no. but i am scared about biden. host: you're calling on the line to support other. is that the case or not? caller: i am supporting others. is there another one? is kennedy a viable candidate? someone mentioned that liz cheney should run. this is not good. biden supports abortion. he supports changing the sexual orientation of minors. haydn, somehow someone got into his brain back in the 19 80's. biden was against this stuff and now he is for it. host: to the point of the line you're calling in, would you consider voting for robert of kennedy? caller: absolutely. host: why so? caller: he is a whack job, but

he is less of a whack job than biden and trump are. host: john finishes us off three hours of calls looking at campaign 2024. don't forget later on the president is traveling to wisconsin. look to our website and app for more information on that. you can follow along at c-span.org. another addition of washington journal comes your way tomorrow at 7:00 a.m. see you then. ♪ >> c-span is your unfiltered

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♪ host: it is the washington journal for july 5. we want to hear about the current state of campaign 2024 and who will become the next president. president