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or online at c-span.org. ned by peniel joseph, the center or study of race and democracy director and lgb school at the university of texas in austin. thank you for joining us. welcome. professor, july marked 60 years since the 1964 civil rights act was signed into law. what would you say is the legacy of that landmark gestation? guest: well, the legacy is really profound. the 1964 civil rights act passed into law july 2 by president johnson, and is the most sweeping civil rights legislation since civil rights construction, and it and racial discrimination in theaters, in

hiring, in places of business, but it also protected folks from gender discrimination. women who would use the legislation to gain access to collegiate athletics, sports, and push for pay equity. it is really a transformative moment in american history in terms of citizenship and dignity, which is what the civil rights movement was all about for all people, and it provides the context for what we are going to see a little over a year later with voting rights act on august 6, 1965, so it is a sweeping game changer and provides the context of things like the americans, the ada, americans with disability act, it provides the context for gay marriage. it provides the context for more freedoms for groups of people

who have been marginalized. it really is legislation that is inclusive of race but goes beyond it, as well. like i said before, it prevents this clinician based on six, as well. it is a game changer. and when we think about the civil rights act, president kennedy proposed that legislation, and it is within the context of both simultaneously the assassinations of people like medgar evers, the assassination of the four children in birmingham, alabama, and really two young boys who were killed alongside the four girls, and then president kennedy's assassination in 1963 provides the context for the bill to be passed. host: professor, what would you say specifically change the

lives of lack people at that time and that was signed into law? guest: i think the act is connected with social movements that are purses -- that are precipitating it. 1963 was a pivotal year in american history. we see the most of people in the most demonstrations for social justice, so there will be citizens, colons, and we remember birmingham, alabama in the spring of 1963 and dr. martin luther king's letter from birmingham jail, but there is really a protest happening in oakland, california, los angeles, new york, new jersey, st. louis, and that is i when john f. kennedy comes on national television on june 11, 1963, he said to the american people that there was a revolution happening, and it can be violent or peaceful, so when we think about the legislation

passed in july of 1964, paralleling that legislation are continued movements for dignity and citizenship. the student nonviolent coordinating committee is organizing freedom summer throughout mississippi, and they will be over 2000 volunteers. many of them who work with local people, many of them jewish volunteers who are trying to bring small d democracy to the magnolia state. in fact, a few weeks before the passage of the civil rights act, three civil rights workers, two white and one black, andy goodman, james cheney were murdered outside of philadelphia, mississippi, and their bodies are not going to be recovered until august 4, 1964. it is not an instantaneous

success in that way. people are literally dying. all comics is about to go to cairo when the civil rights act was passed and is reporting on the harlem rebellion that happened late july. host: professor, i wanted to ask about when you mentioned it was president kennedy here initially announced he was going to be pursuing civil rights legislation. what was the initial reaction to that across the country? guest: for those who are for civil rights, it will be very positive. when he announces it at the same time there is momentum building for the march on washington, which happens august 20 8, 1963, for southern dixiecrats, democrats and republicans opposed to racial integration, it is a very negative announcement. in a way, that announcement

means that the past that happened after reconstruction where it really falters because the government refuses to intervene and intercede on behalf of human rights or black people, kennedy's announcement is that pack is falling down. so the announcement is going to be greeted, it is with cheers and black communities, but there is a lot of trepidation in white communities that feel it will transform their way of life in a way that they do not want change. host: we have a portion of president lyndon johnson moments before signing that civil rights act into law. this is july 2, 1964. here he is. [video clip] >> our generation of american has been called on to contain the unending search for justice within our own borders.

we believe that all men are created equal. yet, many are denied equal freedom. we believe that all men have certain unalienable rights but many americans do not enjoy those rights. we believe that all men are entitled to the blessings of liberty, yet, millions are being deprived of those lessons. not because of their own failures, but because of the color of their skin. the reasons are deeply embedded in history and tradition and the nature of and. we can understand without rank or hatred how this all happened. but it cannot continue.

our constitution, the foundation of our public, the principles of our freedom for bidding. morality forbids it. and the law i will sign tonight for visit. host: professor joseph, can you talk about lbj's role in getting this past through congress, despite opposition? guest: certainly, when we think about lbj, we talk about him as the master of the senate, the former senate majority leader who goes through his own evolution on race matters. as vice president, he is very close to this issue in many ways, especially by 1963. he does a terrific keynote address at gettysburg,

pennsylvania, talking about black citizenship and dignity. once he becomes president on november 22, 1963, the next few days, he's talking to roy wilkins and dr. martin luther king jr., whitney young, and many other civil rights leaders about what needs to be done. he really uses the president's death to galvanize what he envisioned as a great society, a society that is a continuation of fdr's new deal that enhances freedoms for everyone and all people. and, certainly, lyndon johnson, alongside the lobbying efforts done by king and thousands of grassroots organizations is very, very pivotal to getting the votes needed, especially in the senate because you need 67 votes in the senate at that

time, not 60, to get legislation passed. so he really uses the presidency in extraordinary ways, but he is also the washington insider who had worked for franklin delano roosevelt, who had been a congressman, a senator, he understands the hard driven transactional politics that are behind the scenes in washington, d.c., and he does everything in his power to make sure the legislation is successful. host: we are taking your calls for peniel joseph on the line by region. in the eastern time zones, (202)-748-8000. mountain or pacific, (202)-748-8001. he will be with us until the end of the program at 10:00 a.m. eastern. professor joseph, what do you say -- what is your assessment

about where we are today and how the civil rights act has aged up until this point to the present moment? guest: in certain ways, we can see the deep progress we've made the past 60 years when we look at aspects of our politics. certainly without the civil rights act of 1964 and voting rights act of 1965, we would not have the first african-american president and barack obama, vice president in kamala harris. there is real progress that has been made. at the same time, we can see after the 2013 decision, the throwing out of section five, we have seen more efforts successful at voter suppression in the united states, gerrymandering, which really hurts voters of color in the united states, and there has

been all kinds of assaults and attacks on the civil liberties of people who were not just black, but people who were queer , women, people with disabilities, so we are really at an inflection point where the very strength of something like the 1964 civil rights act is been called into question. there are people who would like to end birthright citizenship in the united states, which is connected to the 14th amendment and the end of slavery in the united states, just like the civil rights act is a continuation of the 13th, 14th and 15th amendments, and the civil rights act. so in a lot of ways, where we are at today is a crossroads of how do we both protect this legislation from 60 years ago,

but how do we expanded? there is a george floyd justice policing act yet to be passed, a john lewis voting rights act to both restore section five but also expand access to voting, so there is still a lot of work to be done, but i think the reason why people focus on the 60th anniversary is because it was such a watershed moment. and i would add today is the 100th birthday of james baldwin, the writer and thinker and activist who did so much to also hope that civil rights act be passed. and lyndon johnson or john f. kennedy talk about him. he met with robert of kennedy, the attorney general, in may of 1963 and had a seminar discussion about civil rights, and his best-selling book in

1963, published as the longest essay, published in november of 1962, is one of the game changing documents for the second reconstruction, right there on letter from birmingham jail. he really transformed how we think about race and slavery and the american democracy and citizenship, and the very idea of the war on political groups in the united states forever. so baldwin is someone very key when you talk about the 1964 civil rights act, and today would have been his 100th birthday and it is important to recognize and remember him. caller: good morning, dr. joseph? guest: yes. caller: good morning, dr. joseph.

i'm an avid fan -- i holly. and i follow your work. thank you christina bobb james baldwin. he is one of my heroes -- thank you. i follow your work. james baldwin is one of my heroes. with the 60th anniversary of the civil rights act, too many times people do not realize all the time in america, african americans have had to struggle. we all know about blackwell street, -- black wall street, but that was an anomaly. african-americans were driving all over america until they were brushed aside, and i wish you would name a couple more of the african-americans who were driving and they were cut off at the knee because of racism. guest: absolutely. thank you for the call. when you think about the civil rights act, this is a

culmination of a long history of struggle. you alluded to tulsa in 1921 and the black wall street, but certainly there is st. louis, chicago, atlanta, arkansas, rosewood, florida, there are really going to be hundreds, really thousands of small, large and medium-sized cities going back to hamburg, north carolina, and mississippi, and new orleans , and tennessee, where there are these racial programs that are anti-black but also destroy areas and freedom colonies were black people had built up at times thriving businesses, and had built up a measure of wealth through agriculture, through ownership of land, and through

collective mutual aid society. and that is often under discussed. i think and aftermath of george floyd and breonna taylor, we talked about it more as a nation. since then, there has been a huge backlash against talking about that 6019 project and all the efforts to talk about this. when you think about the civil rights act, what we have to remember is that at the time, it is hugely even revolutionary legislation, but it does not go far enough in this sense. this is what i think that caller is discussing. when you think of racial slavery in the united states, racial slavery in the united states is the expropriation of black wealth, not only through the labor of 4 million enslaved african-american people, so they are not just slaves but enslaved

human beings with hopes, dreams, poetry, and genius like all of us, so it is not just the recreation of their wealth but the united states turns them into commodity, so they do not physically build up ivy league schools and universities and build up wall street in new york city, but they are used as commodities, just like when we think about mortgage interest rates. they are used for speculation, and enslaved people in the united states, the caribbean, all across the world, become used as commodities to create undreamed of wealth locally in the united states, so it is not just caught and tobacco and sugar. it is putting out life insurance policies on enslaved people. ideas enslaved people who create whiskey distillation, and all

that wealth is extracted from them to whites in ways that ending a jim crow sign does not fit, right, and saying, hey, you can go to the university of texas does not fit. so a huge wealth gap we face in the united states, and in a capitalist society, a wealth gap is a life cap. it means you will not have the same intergenerational health care, the same kind of access to education, and you will not be able to utilize the political system in the same way that communities who are wealthy can. so, historically, we have been perpetually disadvantaged in perpetuity in ways that president johnson did not understand. i think baldwin understood. i think king overtime understands. certainly people like ella

baker, richardson understood, malcolm x understands. when you think about the legislation, it is the tip of the iceberg. i love that president johnson talked about history and tradition. in this country, through history and tradition, capitalism works one way. it is anti-black, based on the expropriation of lack labor and black jeans -- black labor and genius so it can be transferred into white hands. that is the way this system works. it should not work that way, but that is the way it does. the civil rights act to not in that. it could not because you would have to be much more innovative -- the civil rights act did not end data. it cannot because you would have to be much more innovative and radical. thank you. host: best talk to eric, virginia -- let's talk to eric, virginia.

caller: good morning. i see like to fact check, so i would like for you to check and see how many democrat senators voted against the civil rights act as opposed to republicans. also, there is something not being told. i'm 85 years old. when [indiscernible] mr. biden made the statement that he did not want to send his kids to the jungle. i will never hear that from you or anybody else, but that is a fact. and you can check that, too. host: let's talk about it. go ahead. guest: a couple of things, i'm sure biden could have said something like that.

many politicians were anti-bussing. bussing was very, very controversial, and blessing was just one way to achieve balance, but a better way would have been providing equal funding for districts if they were segregating based on race. bussing was one of the ways in which certain renovations felt if they did this, they would be able to send their kids to schools that were well resourced. when it comes to the democrat and civil rights act, a lot of republicans did something confused. and this is what i mean, the democrat send republicans, they have switched. they have changed places. the academic view is called realignment. what i mean is the party of lincoln, antislavery and abolition was historically the

republican party. the party of segregation was historically the democratic party. in the 1960's, this changes. it starts with roosevelt in the 1930's and 1940's, but by kennedy and lyndon johnson, the party of abolition and the party of human rights becomes a democratic party. the party of pro-segregation becomes the republican party, but within the democratic party, there is a group of southern segregation. colloquially, they are called dixiecrats and they vote against the civil rights act, but the idea that somehow contemporary republicans are the party of lincoln is ludicrous and a fantasy, right? so you have got to own who you are, so all the republicans out

there who would like to say it was a democrat who did it back in the day, yes, that is true, democrats were racists back in the day, but when we talk about the 1960's, it is the grand old party that is the party of racism, that is the party of unapologetic white supremacy before trump and trumpism. so the 85-year-old caller, those are the facts that you should embrace. there is no got you moment in terms of joe biden being anti-bussing or certain democrats being anti-bussing. yes, that happens but the contemporary republican party as the party of pro-segregation, the party of murdering, killing and lynching black people, and it is fine if people would like to vote for that party but that is morally reprehensible and politically indefensible, and everybody who votes that we should own up to it and stop lying to themselves and their children and grandchildren. host: let's go to chicago,

illinois. good morning. caller: good morning. good morning, dr. joseph. hi. i am a teacher. i'm a direct action is and organized mutual aid, and we will be hosting an event tonight in chicago, but -- they're going to be free clothing, decor, learning. what i've always tried to do, i take a lot of inspiration from ella baker. i learned more from her than most other people, and barbara ramsey's book is deeply inspirational to me. i was wondering, because there was such wealth and wisdom and learning in the time of civil rights movement all the way down to today, and i'm wondering what idea, strategy wisdom you might

want to share with us to help us like it there this moment and help us build a culture of democratic dialogue based learning that can change the world and help people understand each other better. thank you. guest: thank you for that question. i think the three things are always educate, organize, agitate, and i think you learned that from ella baker, who is the organizer of the student nonviolent -- nonviolent coordinating committee, snicc would be joined by others who are trying to bring small democracy to southwest georgia, arkansas, alabama, and other parts of the united states in the 1960's. this idea of education is important. i think the story that we >> for conversation -- we are

going to leave this year for conversation on u.s.-africa relations with olusegun obasanjo . this is hosted by the wilson center in washington, d.c. live coverage on c-span.

once again, we are live at the wilson center for a conversation on u.s.-africa relations with former nigerian president olusegun obasanjo. again, this is that the wilson center. unfortunately, we are having audio difficulties. we will stay here and hope to bring this to you live on c-span.

unfortunately, we are having difficulties, technical difficulties with this conversation on u.s.-africa relations happening at the wilson center in washington, d.c. we are working on the prob lem and hope to you live

coverage on c-span. in the meantime, a look at this morning's "washington journal." two members of the commission on the national defense strategy. ambassador edelman is chair of the commission. jean harmon testified yesterday before the senate armed services committee. she says he thinks he macon public has no idea how grave the national defense threats are in today's world. can you start by putting those threats in perspective for viewers? guest: sure. thanks for having us. it was good to be able to testify yesterday before the senate armed services committee what we had a good turnout of members who are concerned about these set of threats we are concerned about. i think the main thing is that the united states over the last 20 years has been decreasing the resources for defense while

accumulating challenges have gathered around the world. we first saw some of that with the russian seizure of crimea and 2014 -- in 2014 and the renewal of the war in ukraine in 20 by vladimir putin. in october, we heather renders hamas -- we had the horrendous hamas attack on israel and the subsequent fighting in gaza. we also have had an intensifying strategic competition in the indo pacific with the people's republic of china and concerns we will leave this "washington journal" conversation and take you back to the wilson center in washington, d.c., for coverage of a composition on u.s.-africa relations. >> over the last few years we have seen rapid economic growth across parts of the continent. that growth has not