♪ host: good morning on this tuesday, october 15. welcome to the "washington journal", 21 days from election

day. your tone on the presidential campaign and possible outcome. here's how you can join the conversation. supporting the trump-vance ticket, dial (202) 748-8001. harris-walz, (202) 748-8000. if neither is your vote, dial in at (202) 748-8002. if you are undecided you can dial in at (202) 748-8003. you can text instead of calling at (202) 748-8003, just include your first name, city, state. or post your comments on facebook.com/c-span on x with the handle @cspanwj. before we get to calls, texts, social media posts, pew research did a poll asking voters your

thoughts on the tone of the campaign. 71% said that the campaign is too negative. only 2 say it is not too negative. 62% say the campaign is not focused on important policy debates. 47% of those polled say tt -- we can go to the next graphic. 37% say that it is focused on the right one. 19% say the campaign makes them feel proud of the country. 79% say dsn't make them feel proud. % of voters say that the campaign is interesting. 30% say it is dull. do you agree or disagree with any of these numbers? 14% of voters say that it's clear who is going to win. 86% say it is not yet clear.

your thoughts on the tone of the campaign and possible outcomes. the vice president, kamala harris, in erie, pennsylvania had this to say about the former president's phrase of "enemy within." [video clip] v.p. harris: he is talking about the enemy within pennsylvania. he is talking about the enemy within our country, pennsylvania. he is talking about that he considers anyone who doesn't support him, or will not bend to his will, an enemy of our country. it's a serious issue, he is saying he will use the military to go after them. think about this. we know who he would target. we know who he would target,

because he has attacked them before. journalists whose stories he doesn't like. election officials who refused to cheat by finding extra votes for him. judges who insist on following the law instead of bending to his will. this is among the reasons i believe so strongly that a second trump term would be a huge risk for america -- [applause] donald trump is increasingly unstable and unhinged. [applause] he is out for unchecked power.

that is what he's looking for. host: the vice president in erie, pennsylvania picking up on a phrase that the former president has iterated at campaign rallies. the guardian with their write up of the vice president's remarks. harris called trump a risk for america after the enemy within remarks. from the guardian's reporting in california on saturday, trump referred to democratic opponents as the enemy within saying that they posed a bigger risk to the country than foreign foes. targeted adam schiff, running for the u.s. senate in california. the front page of the new york times, a similar story written this morning relative to this conversation. this is the front page of the new york times. some believe in trump without believing him, doubting he will

carry out dark threats. that is the front page of the new york times this morning. we are asking you, what do you think about the tone of this campaign? do you believe the former president when he says what he says? deborah in florida, trump-vance ticket. let's go to you. good morning. caller: i believe he is going to carry out. he is strong, he has good policies, he puts in place good people, and he does listen. i don't believe the things that our democratic party are chanting are real. it's not logical. we need more safety. we need people in charge who know what they're doing. i run the hospital at cape canaveral.

i'm not putting people in charge of those who don't know the job themselves. very disappointing what's going on. trump will carry through. host: what do you want him to carry through on, deborah? what are you referring to? caller: how about safety? how about good schools? how about getting our prices down? how about all the things our forefathers came here to do and not pull on people's weaknesses? focus on their strength. we don't need 30 handicap spots at home depot. we need to be able to get people and get them moving again. bring them around -- bring the morale of. host: you believe he's going to follow through on his policy agenda. do you think his campaign is too negative? does the former president bear

some responsibility for that? caller: are we talking about the president that is in there today that has dementia that we were lied to for four years that he can't follow through? or are you speaking of someone in the future who has proven for four years? host: deborah in florida. the former president at a town hall recently was asked about the economy and immigration. deborah says that he will follow through on those policy platforms. here's what he had to say. [video clip] >> i was raised in a philadelphia democrat union household. as the mother of a blended family, my top issues are the same issues that face all-americans. illegal immigration hurts black americans. inflation hurts black americans. dangerous cities hurt black americans.

like my fellow americans, my grocery bill has not gone down. everything is still so very expensive. what steps will your administration take to help american family suffering from this inflation? fmr. pres. trump: it is such a great question in the sense that people don't think of grocery -- it sounds like not such an important word when you think about homes and everything else. more people tell me about grocery bills, the price of bacon, the price of lettuce, the price of tomatoes, they tell me. we will do a lot of things. our farmers are not being treated properly. we had a deal with china. it was a great deal. i never mentioned it because once covid came in i said that was a bridge too far. i had a great relationship with president xi. he is a fierce man. he is a man who likes china, and i understand that. we had a deal and he was perfect on that deal. $50 million he was going to buy for the farmer. the farmers are very badly hurt.

the farmers in this country. we will get them straightened out. we will get your prices down. you asked another question about safety and also about black population jobs and hispanic population, in particular those. when millions of people pour into our country, they are having a devastating effect on black families and hispanic families, more than any others. i think it will spread to a lot of other places. i think it will spread to unions. i think unions will have a big problem because, you know, employers are not going to pay the price. it is a very bad thing that's happening. so, they are coming in, many are coming in from jails, prisons, mental institutions, insane asylums. that is a step above, an insane asylum. whenever i go hannibal lector, you know what i'm talking about, they go to fake news. that is a lot of fake news back there, too. they always mention, you know,

it is a way of demeaning, they say hannibal lector, why would he mentioned? he was a sick puppy. when you have sick puppies coming into our country, i figure that is better than wasting a lot of words. you just say hannibal lector. they say, why would you say that? i do it for a lot of reasons. i do it because we are allowing a lot of very bad people into our country. host: the former president campaigning during a town hall recently on the campaign trail. we covered both the former and vice president on c-span. you can find all of our campaign coverage at c-span.org online on-demand. as we noted at the top, pew research did a poll that found that 62 percent say that the campaign is not focused on important policy debates. 37% say it is. do you agree or disagree with that? carol in wisconsin supporting the harris-walz ticket. good morning. caller: good morning.

i can't believe all the lies in this election. over 200 people who were in the trump administration, his closest advisors, especially the military, have come out against him, including his vice president. that is why i was calling. i was calling because trump's friend kevin roberts from heritage and jd vance have written a book called "dawn's early light." and that they will take the military and go door to door looking for immigrants. if they find an immigrant they will deport them. with the decrease in population, they are going to do away with birth control and abortion. even ivf because people might want to do ivf if they want to postpone having a baby.

it is just frightening. when he starts talking about the military used on civilians, it is frightening. he wanted, according to people in his previous administration, to use the military to round up his political opponents before, but they wouldn't do it for him. his next administration he is going to appoint people that wi ll. host: carol in wisconsin on her thoughts of the possible outcome if the former president wins another term. that is our question this morning for you. on how the campaign is going so far with 21 days left. the possible outcomes depending on who wins. dennis in hudson, indiana supporting trump-vance.

caller: i support trump 100%. your last caller is clearly listening to msnbc and cnn and getting her misinformation. he hasn't said that he will use the military against migrants, against illegal aliens. there is a difference between an illegal alien and a migrant in this country. harris will let millions more in to keep taking jobs away from americans, housing away from americans. she has already let 10 million in. now she is talking about she wants to go 3 million more houses. what, for the illegals to have? they are running the price of housing and groceries through the roof in this country. they are in our country illegally using our hospitals for their health care running up our health care costs. these people are destroying our nation and it needs to stop now. host: have you ever looked at

the economic impact of immigration in this country? caller: yes, i see it every day. 13 million illegals in this country. housing prices have tripled over the last few years. rent prices have, because of all of the illegals in the country. host: ron is in pennsylvania supporting harris. caller: these people calling up whining about how much the illegals are costing us, yet somehow biden didn't add $1 trillion to the national debt. people keep saying -- hello? host: we are listening to you. a trillion dollars to the national debt. caller: they keep saying that the economy was good under trump. it's not good now.

it's actually better now, except for inflation. everything else is better. trump had a bad economy just like the last two republicans before him because trickle-down economics doesn't work but it is the only card in their deck. they keep whining about emigrants. their whole party had a chance to shut the border down a year ago. they're just trying to keep him out of jail. that is where he belongs. host: what do you make of this headline from the front page of the new york times? harris fighting to bring back a bloc, black and latino voters have drifted away from democrats and striking numbers, according to a new york times poll. caller: if they think republicans are going to be better they are fools and they don't know history. there are more dumb cap likely

-- more dumb black and latinos than i thought. i thought it was more dumb white people when you think about he's getting 55% of the white vote. host: ron in pennsylvania. james, what do you think of this campaign so far? and possible outcomes? caller: well, this is the worst one i've ever seen. i hope my boy trump wins. i believe he'll do what he says he will do if everyone leaves him alone. host: what do you think he will do? caller: get the prize for groceries down, rent down, cut taxes. he will do what he says he's going to do. he's a strong man. host: that's why you're voting for him? caller: yes. yes, that's why on voting for him. because that lady -- i'm not

knocking nobody, but she needs to go back wherever she came from and leave folks alone. host: where is it that she came from? caller: i don't know. i don't know where she came from. but you can listen to her and see what she's all about. host: let me ask you about this rampage of the washington post. campaign takes stand against fact-checks.the former president nearly backed out of an august interview with a group of black journalists after learning they plan to fact check his claims are the following month he is allies repeatedly complained about the fact checking that occurred during his debate with the vice president. this month, trump declined to sit down with an interview with 60 minutes because he objected to the show's practice of fact checking. does that concern you? caller: yes, it does. yeah, it does. i tell you what's going to have to happen to our country, ok? we are going to have to go back to jesus before it all gets

worked out. and quick backbiting everybody and of the world and let the one that is the strongest be in there, in my opinion is donald j. trump. host: undecided, george in st. louis, missouri. you are undecided. why is that? caller: well, i'm unhappy with the way that both campaigns are going about stating their positions. i think generally speaking both of them need to be fact checked. one says one thing and the other says he is doing the opposite. i was in sales for my career, and i was always taught that you never knock another person's product. you tell someone what you are going to do to make them stronger. you -- a person who knocks

somebody else is a weak salesperson. they are both knocking each other. i don't go for that kind of nonsense. i will say this, though. when comparing, you know, hitler and trump, i think that is outrageous. i didn't see 6 million jews parish, or anyone else, when trump was in office. host: who is your candidate, then? how are you going to vote? caller: i might not vote. i don't really have a strong conviction. i believe that if trump gets in, democracy will be all right. if harris gets in, we are going to be all right. we've had presidents who haven't been good, we've had presidents who have been good, and we are

bigger and better than the individual. we will survive as a country because this is the greatest country in the world. everybody wants to come here. because opportunities. you go to other countries, you invest in those countries, and the next minute you know the countries are taking over the business and you wind up losing all your money. everybody wants to invest in the united states, because it is the land of opportunity and it will go on and it will survive no matter who gets in. that is just my thinking. host: donna in baltimore, supporting the vice president and governor from minnesota, tim walz. caller: absolutely. for me it is a no-brainer. if trump wins this election, we are in trouble. first of all, the gentleman who

said she needs to go back where she comes from, who was he talking about? host: who do you think he was talking about? caller: was he talking about the vice president? host: it sounded like it. she was born in oakland, california. caller: that is the kind of stuff that needs to stop. that comment. that is the kind of stuff that trump brings out. trump is a horrible man. he is a horrible person. he says things out of his mouth that are horrible. it's embarrassing that he's even on the ticket. the simple fact that he is a felon. if i was a felon, i wouldn't be able to get a job in the white house as a cook, as a housekeeper, or anything else. the fact that he is a felon, a convicted felon, and he can run

for the presidency of the united states is beyond me. i can't even comprehend it. if it was anybody else that went through what he went through he wouldn't be on that ticket. you think they would allow obama if obama was a felon to run for president? he says anything out of his mouth. they are eating dogs, they are eating cats, they are taking your black jobs. what are black jobs? what is that? it incredible. and people still want this man behind the oval office is just unbelievable to me. host: i'm going to leave it there. new york times state of the race this morning following up on donna's thoughts. the poll numbers, nationally harris is up 3%, within the margin of error for all of these polls.

look how it breaks down in the seven battleground states. pennsylvania, harris is of one. up one in michigan. even in nevada. north carolina, the former president is up one they are. as well as georgia. up two in arizona. this is a pole, a snapshot in time. these numbers will change. the headline, pulling averages show stable and virtual deadlock with 21 days to go. your thoughts on the tone of the campaign and possible outcomes. deerfield beach, florida. good morning, yvonne. caller: good morning. i have a few comments i would like to make. i'm sick and tired of the democrats -- [indiscernible]

the new york five, to me they were found guilty by their peers and half of the united states of america thought they were guilty. i'm so sick and tired of the talking points of the left. it's the same thing. i don't care what the topic is. you -- talking about climate change, they bring up trump. it's so unbelievably sickening. talking about trump would actually do what he said and the climate, as far as the actual campaign is concerned, and then the press started with all of

their hatemongering. tell them they are not wanted. get them out of here. get in their face. i am an african-american woman who used to be a democrat. i will never, ever vote for that party ever. i lived in california for over 60 years. i sold my nice, big, beautiful house to get the hell out of california because they have lost their minds. they have lost their minds. illegals are taking over. i don't care what anybody tells me. i know what i saw. they are flying them in. i listened to one of the shows a while ago where you told this young woman that the fact checker was correct about

venezuelan emigrants taking over. you owe her an apology because it is a fact. i have family in colorado. they are taking over. vance put a girl in her place at the town hall as well. 1000% vote for trump and vance because they are the only ones to make common sense. host: heard your thoughts. we will gto facebook. jane johnson posting that the economy decides the election. pele don't have as much jingle in their pockets these days, so the voters will elect the party not in office hoping for relief. it is really that simple. the candidates talking about the economy often on the campaign trail. here is the former president yesterday at the town hall in

pennsylvania, talking about housing. [video clip] >> my name is reid. i am a single father and iraq war veteran. i dream of owning a home for me and my son but the mortgage rates under the biden-harris administration have made that impossible. what can you do to make homeownership affordable again? fmr. pres. trump: it's a great question and a lot of people have this question. first of all, it's too expensive to build homes, they are building them and they cost a fortune. 30% of the cost in some locations is the cost of planning and certificates. all the nonsense they do. all of the zoning approvals, the approvals you need. we will get rid of a lot of that. most importantly we will get interest rates brought way down. we had interest rates to 2%. now they are 10% and you can't get the money. we had 2% and there was plenty of money for everyone. i called the home part of the

american dream. we will create the american dream for young people, and for old people too. i happen to be a very young man, but we are not going to forget the older people. we are not going to forget the older people. by the way, no tax on social security benefits. [cheers and applause] somebody said, he has a conflict of interest because he benefits by that. i will give mine up, everyone. we will do that for the older people. that is a big deal because you have been eaten alive by inflation and all i'm doing is getting you back to even. when we do that we are probably -- you have fixed income. you went up numbers like 40%, 50% depending on what they like to include. they like to say it was a 20% increase. it wasn't. it was 30%, 40%, 50% depending on what they want to include. getting back to you.

we are going to drill, baby drill. where will have so much energy. we will bring down prices because your prices -- don't forget, the damage is done. we have the worst president and worst vice president in the history of our country by far. she is worse than him. host: the former president town hall yesterday talking about the economy and what he would do uncertain economic issues. the vice president in airy, pennsylvania also talking about her economic plans -- in erie, pennsylvania also talking about her economic plans. here's what she had to say about seniors taking care of young children. [video clip] v.p. harris: far too many people who want and need to take care of family members either have to leave your job or spend everything you have to be able to qualify for medicaid. that's not right.

i look at the sandwich generation. we refer to folks raising young children and taking care of your parents the sandwich generation, in between. it's a lot of pressure. you need and deserve to have the support to be able to handle all of that in a way that we know you are adding so much to our communities, societies, and economies. my plan is to make sure that medicare, not that you have to pay down everything to get on medicaid so that medicare helps pay for home health care. [applause] so you can do the work you need to get done in terms of the seniors in your life. under our plan, we will lower the cost on everything from health care to groceries. i will take out corporate price gouging just like i've done before. i will do it again. [applause]

and give the middle-class tax cuts to 100 million americans, including $6,000 during the first year of your child's life. knowing, again, the vast majority of parents want the parent their children well but don't always have the resources to do it. so, by expanding the child tax credit that helps the young family buy a car seat, a crib, do that in the fundamental stages of their child's development just to get them on the road. host: presidential candidates on the campaign trail yesterday talking about the economy.you can find our coverage if you go to c-span.org online, on demand. more live coverage today of the candidates on the trail. this morning on the "washington journal" your thoughts on campaign 2024 and possible

outcomes. a pew research poll found 71% say that the campaign is too negative. ly 27% say that it's not too negative. 62% of thoseolled say that the campaign is not focused on importt licy debates while 37% say it is. 19% say the campaign makes them feel proud of the country. 79% say this campaign does not make them feel proud. 60% of voters say the campaign is interesting. 30% say that it's dull. 14% of voters say that it's clear who is going to win. 86% say that it's not yet clear. do you agree with these numbers or disagree? dial in this morning and let us know your thoughts. ed in ocean city, new jersey. caller: ed o'donnell. the speeches and ads for all candidates for president should be 100% positive.

they should urge the public to treat everyone with kindness, love, mercy, tolerance. the speeches by the candidates for president should be like a christmas eve in a beautiful church. all positive. host: how would that -- how would people be able to contrast the candidates to decide if it's all positive? caller: they would have to decide which one is more positive and which one will implement the positive. host: grace in north carolina. good morning. it's your turn. caller: good. several things. one thing i would like to say is, the former governor of south carolina should be ashamed of herself. she went out while she was politicking and talked about how bad donald trump was, now i'm

getting telephone calls from her asking me to vote for him? no thank you. host: are you talking about nikki haley? caller: yes. and the fact that the telephone call came at 10:00 at night when i was in the bed. the other thing is, the campaign is very dark. donald trump never says anything nice about anybody. i don't know, i guess he stays awake at night thinking about things he can call people. i'm a democrat. i will vote for the democrats. there are things that are wrong, but things can be fixed. i think kamala harris has got to do that. also, i have been watching both sides. all of these rallies and things. donald trump never comes direct to the issue he has been asked about. he goes all the way around, and

it all comes back to immigration. immigration didn't cause all of our problems. it might have caused some of them, but it didn't cause all of them. please, people out there, look and see all the rallies. make sure that you are doing the right thing and vote for the right person. go democrats. host: our campaign coverage continues on the c-span network this morning at 10:00 a.m. eastern on c-span, the state of the union organizing at the national press club. a conversation you can watch here and on our free mobile video app c-span now on c-span.org. 12:00 p.m. eastern, the former president is ierewed at the economic club of chicago. you can watch that here on c-span now, our free mobile video app, or online at c-span.org.

5:00 p.m. eastern, minnesota governor tim walz speaks to voters at a rally in pittsburgh, pennsylvania. our coverage on cpan, c-span now, or c-span.org. at 6:00 p.m. eastern, senator vance from ohio, thfoer president's running mate, is part of the mom vote town hl, moms for american fayette, pennsylvania. watch that on c-span 2, online at c-span.org, or our free mobile video app c-sn now. 7:00 p.m. n, our coverage of key debates, congral debates in this election cycle. balance ofow is at stake here. one of the key races is in pennsylvania in the contest between the incumbent senator and david mccormick. we will have livrage tonight at 7:00 p.m. eastern on c-span, c-span now, or c-spanrg

at 8:00 p.m. eastern, the texas sete debate willir on c-span 2, c-span now, and online at c-span.org. there is a piece in the wall street journal this morning about the texas senate race. here is the headline. senate race texas purple drift. ted cruz in a contest to close for comfort. 8:00 p.m. eastern, c-span 2, that congressional debate. you can find all of our coverage of competitive house races, senate debates, and governor debates online at c-span.org. you were undecided in november. what do you think about this campaign so far? caller: it is a tough one. i am really undecided on this

one, and i've never been that way in my life. i'm kind of leaning a little towards donald trump, and i never did before. i will tell you the reason why. it will sound kind of odd. businesses, companies, they have salespeople and the sales team. these sales people, sometimes they might do things that are, i wouldn't say unscrupulous, but outside the norm. but it gets the job done. sometimes i look at trump like that. trump might -- i might not like what he says, i might think he should have bit his tongue on that one, but when you look at the grand scheme of things and how we are presented in the world, i just think that other companies' leaders may respect trump more. when we get back to the company that has the sales department, again, we may not like the out-of-the-box way of thinking

or some of the things that he says, but we may have to look at that and say, let's overlook some things because if he is there to provide great economy, if he as they are to definitely say how he will do the border, i'm all for it. one of these candidates has got to say, how are we going to fix that border? there is a lot of finger-pointing and name-calling, but either side has to start saying what they will do and how they are going to do it. like my dad used to say, a commander and chief petty officer in the navy, where is this money going to come from? if you're going to provide a solution, provide the solution. where is the money going to come from? host: can i ask you, what is giving you pause about voting for the former president? caller: about voting for trump? host: yeah. caller: well, if i were to have a pause on anything, it would be

the way that he says things. the way he comes across the people. the way he might put down somebody or a race, or something like that. those would be the things i would like to see him clean up. again, he could be the salesperson of the usa. that is what we are looking for. someone to not just sell america, but get out there and be strong for america. i'm not sure if kamala harris has that backup. vice president, they don't do a whole lot. to have her get in there and say what she is going to do, that's all great, but let's be specific on both sides of what we are going to do, how we are going to do it, and where the money is going to come from. host: understood. long beach, california supporting trump-vance. hi, helen. caller: a vote for harris is still a vote for trump. let me explain. recently, as harris realizes

that it is a that is a n -- is a neck and neck race, she is changing her policies to resemble trade. -- to resemble trump. she is going to keep the tariffs. she will keep most of the cuts that mr. trump signed in on taxes. for energy, now she is supporting fracking. the biden administration, america pumped more oil and gas than it ever did before. it looks like she is borrowing parts of trump's first term agenda enter own campaign for her run for election coming up. the problem is with her is her stance on immigration. her recent comment is i reject the false -- i had it right

here. she said, the false choice between securing our border and creating a system that is orderly, safe, and humane. as the border czar, harris was the border czar, and immigration was never orderly, safe, or humane. the big problem will be with her informed policy. for the main reason trump has a bromance with putin who provides a lot of oil to china. she will continue backing nato. trump won't. she will continue and even harsher confrontational approach to china. she will increase tariffs and suppress any exchange of technology between china and the u.s., which is very stunting, intellectually something, and doesn't lead to innovation and technology, which is what an economy runs on. in sum, i am voting for trump.

as for the analogy of hitler and trump, jd vance announced in one of his first speeches to the public that was a false analogy. in a recent essay by condoleezza rice she made the accurate analogy. the analogy is the world of empires. that is what the world is morphing into. unless you have someone with a lot of strength to deal with foreign policy, and trump does because of his special relationship he has with russia -- host: i will leave it there. helen in california supporting the trump-vance ticket. you may be interested in the piece in the wall street journal. how harris tackles her immigration assignment. in fairfax, virginia, you are undecided. welcome to the conversation. caller: this is the first election i will be voting in. i wasn't eligible to vote three

years ago. with everything going on, i don't recall which candidate it was, but one of the candidates said they should use medicare money to bring nurses into houses. my problem is, my parents had me when they were 55. they are at the age when they need someone to take care of them. they are strangers. we don't know. in a hospital setting they are nurses, but i don't want strangers coming into my parents house. host: first-time voter this time around. tina in illinois. hi, tina. caller: i wanted to make a statement about the gentleman who called earlier saying that black man are stupid or dumb for voting for trump.

a lot of those black men are not voting for policies. they are voting for trump so that he can destroy america. a lot of black people want to see america destroyed at this point. you are going to see a lot of black people stop participating in voting altogether. host: how do you know that, tina? caller: i see it in my own area. we -- it doesn't even look like it is a campaign this year. no one is participating this time. black people have been voting for democrats for decades and they don't see any results. they know the other party is no good as well. you will see a lot of blacks totally stop participating. these black men are not voting for trump for policy. maybe some of them, but not all of them. that's pretty much the statement i wanted to make. these black men are not dum b, they know exactly what they are doing. host: yesterday, the washington

post conducted an interview with the georgia secretary of state, brad raffensperger, a name that many are familiar with because of what happens in 2020. he talked about new election laws on the books for georgia this time around. he also talked about ensuring that the election process is accurate and trustworthy. [video clip] >> a verifiable paper ballot. this year for the first time in america ever we will be able to audit every race cast. we have images after all of the 5 million ballots are cast on election day. we will have the images. we will be able to run this through a scanner with a company and read the human-readable text, not just for president all the way down to the county surveyor and county librarian. compare that with the machine totals. that is one way that we will re-tally that and give you a

100% risk limit to build trust with voters. we think that's important. reporting results quick is another thing. everything we've done is making sure that we can prove the accuracy and have suspenders so no matter what people say we can say we've already checked that. we have the cleanest voter list in the country for several reasons. one, we are part of a 25 multistate organization. our office here will exchange our voter list with 25 other states. it is a confidential and secure way of doing that to make sure we don't have people on two different voter lists. now, all 41 other states plus the district of columbia, all of them will get their drivers licenses. if you move from georgia to whatever state, massachusetts or washington state, we find out

about that and can reach out to take them off the list because they have a drivers license in another state because they moved there. host: the georgia secretary of state yesterday talking about the upcoming election and new laws on the books in georgia for campaign 2024. if you want to hear more of that conversation go to c-span.org. nathaniel in mississippi. caller: good morning, greta. host: your thoughts on campaign 2024 and possible outcomes? caller: well, i'm looking at it like this. i vote for the person that i be listening to and looking to do what they say they are going to do. i been knowing donald trump since 1974. i'm a black man. 1974 when all of this came up about condominiums, and he wouldn't let the black people rent. i am looking at this myself.

it ain't no hearsay. he said nobody wants to live by you. that's racist. the man has been a racist ever since he was put on this earth. i'm going to talk about my black peoples now. i don't understand how any black man can listen to how this man talks about the vice president, a black lady. i am married to a black lady, my wife is black. what he says about her, that offends me to because she is a woman just like my wife is. you lose, forget it. like biden told him, he lost his mind when he lost in 2020. people think this man can't lose. i don't understand that. another thing. he wants black people to vote for him, right?

project 2025 don't want you to vote, but he wants you to vote for him. that don't make no sense. host: all right, nathaniel. charles in texas. your thoughts? caller: yes, i have a question to ask to white america. i would like to know, what is it about trump -- i haven't heard one thing about what he says he's going to do for you, your family, your kids, your grandkids. everything he talks about is about him or the illegals coming in. they wouldn't be coming in if the bill that was passed went through congress, but he stopped it to give him something to run on. they haven't done anything to benefit ordinary people. tell me -- and then he said about the economy, the economy was good when he came in. obama's economy.

when he came in he came in, and when he left the country was going down that he tried to take credit for everything that's good and nothing bad. how stupid can you be to listen to a man tell you every day -- and i saw something on tv yesterday where he said with his next administration he will have all three of his sons, including the youngest one. it is all about money and power in his administration. if you think you will do something for you, i have a bridge to sell you, white america. host: john in louisiana. we are getting your thoughts on campaign 2024 and possible outcomes. caller: good morning. can you hear me? host: we can. caller: i want to know one thing. why does kamala want to give criminal offenders in jail sex changes? that is one thing. another thing i want to ask is,

why does cnn never fact-check harris? everything trump says they fact-check, but never kamala harris. why is that? that is what i would like to know. host: do you look at fact check websites to see what fact checkers have said about both candidates? caller: i don't have a computer. i listen to cnn and c-span. i used to have fox on cable, but i don't have fox anymore. every time trump says anything, he is fact-check, but harris is never fact-check. ok? goodbye. host: ok. lj in grove city, ohio. caller: lg. host: sorry about that. caller: that's ok. what i don't understand, number one, is why there was a

presidential debate before anybody was given a nomination. then, on a federal level, there is no time limit to run for president. but you have to have your paperwork in for every state, because state's run election boards. how can harris even legally be running for president and be on the ballot? legally beyond these ballots? -- be on these ballots? for the economy, you are going to put a prosecutor at 1600 pennsylvania avenue or a businessman? and, oil was at $26 a barrel when trump left office. oil was at $86, $90 today. oil controls the price of everything else in this world.

if the bread man has to pay more for diesel, he is going to charge more for the bread. everything is affected by oil. host: got it. lg in ohio. lincoln park, michigan, dave. caller: good morning. i am calling in -- obama's economy through trump. trump's economy now. i think they did a helluva job trying to pull us out of it. i don't understand people. i just don't know where people are. how they think. vote democrat. have a good day. host: you have to mute your television. just listen and talk through your phone.

adam is next in d.c. caller: just listening in. one of the reasons why i am not either way and why these conversations, all of the emotions that people have when they dial in, i think that is a beautiful aspect of this show. it shows the inside of how american's feel. but emotions are not going to sway anybody. for those out there like me, i would like to think that we are looking beyond the emotions involved in this conversation. looking at the world stage. what would sway me as a candidate that has a voice at the international stage, who has the ability to have those conversations, the difficult conversations, and what those adversarial countries would listen to. if anything, that would sway me this term. host: when will you decide? caller: it looks like it is going to be mid-november.

when it is time to watch the results. i'm not sure i've made that decision yet. i know i have to make it soon because my vote needs to be cast, but if it is not made by then it will be the next time around. host: david in california supporting harris-walz. caller: good morning. i would like to point out that when trump took over, he took over obama's economy. obama did not fix the economy overnight, it took some time. by the time trump came in it was great. then when trump ran, by december of 2020, inflation was already 5.7%. inflation started under trump. people need to understand that. biden didn't cause inflation, trump did. it took biden quite a while to

fix the economy that trump left him. he did a great job in doing that. everything is just great right now. inflation is down to 2%. it took a little while, but the economy is great now. host: all right, david. nancy is in evans, georgia supporting trump-vance. caller: hi, how are you? i am a little bit nervous today. i've called in before. it has been a long time. i am in evans, georgia, right next to augusta, georgia which got obliterated from the recent hurricane. i grew up on the mississippi gulf coast. went through the trina, so i have a lot -- through katrina, so i have been through this before. two people out there living in some un-reality of what kamala harris, biden, the government is

doing for everybody, they are living in a false reality. we are not seeing any people here. they are not giving anyone here help. but it is ok. we have people here helping each other. we are not looking at if we are white, black, green, or yellow, we are helping each other. if they think that the biden-harris government is doing anything for them, they are sadly mistaken. i've lived through this before. i lived under democrats and republicans, and they are not showing up here. trump actually came here. he didn't have to have cop cars coming in protecting him. he brought his own protection in. kamala harris came for one day. she had 50 cop cars around her. we didn't have any gas for anyone to go to work or help each other. came in, handed out a few fema checks.

they didn't even go through in the banks. people need to wake up and realize they need to quit fighting each other because of their color, and they need to see that things are not what they appear to be. host: georgia, our last call on washington journal. when we come back, a closer look at how the candidates spending plans and taxes would impact the country. we will talk with marc goldwein. we will be right back. ♪ >> as the 2024 campaign

continues, american history tv presents that serious historic presidential elections, the pivotal issues of different eras and uncover what made the election's historic and explore the lasting impact on the nation. this saturday, the election of 1960. >> and for those millions of americans who are still denied equality of rights and opportunity, i say there shall be the greatest progressive human rights since the days of lincoln 100 years ago. >> we stand on the edge of a new frontier, the frontier of the 1960's, of unknown opportunities and unfilled hopes. >> and a close and controversial election, john kennedy defeated richard nixon. elections saturday at 7:00 p.m.

eastern on c-span 2. >> c-span now is a free mobile app featuring your unfiltered view of what is happening in washington, live and on-demand. keep up with the biggest events with live streams of floor proceedings and hearings from u.s. congress, white house events, the courts, campaigns in the more from the world of politics. you can also stay current with the episodes of washington journal and find scheduling events for television and c-span news and compelling podcasts. c-span now is available at the apple store and google play. you can scan the qr code or visit our website. at c-span now, your front row seat to government, anytime, anywhere. >> "washington journal" continues. host: marc goldwein at the

table, the senior vice president and senior policy director to cost -- talk about the candidates' tax and spending plans. let's talk about the tariffs and trade policies and get into what each of the candidates has said could former president wants to impose a 10% to 20% tariff on imports from all countries. 60% on tariffs from imports from china. the vice president wants to implement eight targeted and strategic tariff to support american workers. can you talk about each plan? guest: fort 60 years essentially in the united states has been reducing tariffs to the point where president trump took office there were barely any. he implemented a number of tariffs in the first term, mainly on china and on certain goods like washing machines for

example. president harris mostly wants to keep the trump tariffs. president trump wants to dramatically expand the tariffs in the second term and talked about at 10% or 20% baseline tariff and 60% on china and retaliatory tariffs on us, 100% on autos. he threw out a lot about numbers but they do speak to a general direction which is you have to raise a lot of revenue from taxes on imports. host: how much revenue? guest: we have figured out $2.5 trillion to $3 trillion over a decade. it is a tremendous amount of money, anything in the trillions is a key source of revenue under his plan. host: what would be the economic impact?

guest: a lot of people would look at negative. when you increase the tariffs you increase from -- on americans. but the second is when we impose tariffs on other countries, they impose tariffs on american companies and that hurts the selling as well. so the tax foundation has looked at it and said it could be less if they are smooth or more if there is a trade war. host: what does that do to revenues? guest: we have a look at this, the first order effect is the 10% and then the 60% on china, 2.7% of revenue but produces output and then we his income taxes and payroll taxes but it won't eat all of the revenue so maybe it will eat out one

quarter or 1/5 of revenue gain. host: you said the vice president wants to keep with the former president did in the first administration on the tariffs. how much revenue did that bring in? guest: that was bringing in more like $400 billion over the same timeframe. the vice president says that is her base and talking about tinkering from their, where we were in 2021 president trump left office. host: what does that do to our national deficit? where were the numbers then? guest: i think the general rule is small taxes, small impact and big taxes big impact. the tariffs were relatively modest. we thought some areas like washers and dryers. we think we saw some reduction in the growth of gdp.

the best estimates are 0.2% or 0.3%. when they are a small, it is hard to separate what is going on from the tax host: cuts. -- tax cuts. host: where is the national debt now and what has been the biggest driver? guest: if you earn a lot of income, you can afford a big mortgage. you don't earn very much you can't afford a big mortgage. same for the united states. we can afford the debt with the size of the economy but generally it is half the size. today it is as large as the economy, 99% and within a few years will -- we will be at a record level. the record set in world war ii is a hundred and 6% and we've never passed it. and over time it is just going to keep rising. the interest rate will keep rising because we have a very expensive health and retirement

programs, social security, medicare and medicaid and those costs go up and as more people retire and health care rises. the tax revenue coming in is flat and in some ways has been declining because every few years politicians come in and cut taxes. host: what about the 2017 cox cuts -- tax cuts during the trump revenue? guest: we cut the corporate rate to 21% from 35% and cut individual rates and expanded the child tax credit. it cost to $20 over a decade. and the tax cuts in large part were temporary. most of us over an eight year period ended at 2025. if we were to extend those in full it would be another $4 trillion through 2035. host: what impact has that had on the debt? guest: if you add to trillion dollars of tax cuts, that is to

trillion more to the debt. if we do another at trillion dollars that is another $4 trillion. if you look at the candidates' platforms, huge reason both candidates are projected to add to the debt is that they want to extend large parts of the tax cuts. host: thiis from the former president's campaign. extend or expand 2017 tax cuts, lower corporate tax rate from 21% to 15%, eliminate federal income tax on tips and social security income and eliminate taxes on overtime pay. talk about those. guest: they are all very expensive. president trump started out as you mentioned with calling for an extension of the tax cuts. that is $4 trillion. then he got into going on the campaign trail and promising a new tax cut, no taxes on tips, over time social security benefits, no salt tax.

15% not for all corporations but corporations that produced domestically. on top of that, he wants more spending. this is trillions of dollars of tax cuts. a $20 to $9 trillion of tax cuts and not only will they add to the deficit but in some cases they will significantly weaken social security. those taxes help fund theocial security and medicaid programs. payroll taxes on overtime and tips help to fund social security. if the president's agenda would be enacted in full, not only would it at a lot to the debt but would shorten the life of the social security and medicare trust fund. host: in her life right now is that what? guest: social security is expected to round of reserves in nine months. and under the former president it could be eight or nine years. host: ensuring no taxesn

individuals making less than 400,000, eliminate federal income tax otips, raise the corporate tarate from 21% to 28 percent, raise capital gains rate and impose new tax on unrealized capital gains for those worth $100 million or more. what would this do? guest: vice president harris' overall tax plan, she appears to want to extend large parts of the trump taxes but for the 98% making $400,000 or less, she wants to extend them. that is $3 trillion. so the child tax credit right now is $2000, she wants to bring it up to $3000 and for some children, new ones up to $6,000. she wants to expand the earned income tax credit and wants a

25,000 dollars first-time home tax credit and no taxes on tips. this is a couple more $20 worth of revenue loss. on the flip side, she has embraced the tax credits from president biden's, this means higher corporate taxes, higher taxes on individuals especially focused on higher capital gains rate. it is not a wealth tax but attacks on wealthy americans on the unrealized gains of income. overall her tax agenda is much higher taxes on the rich and corporations to pay for lower taxes on some elements of the middle class. host: doesn't it actually pay for it? guest: if you remove the extension spot but we don't think it adds up. not just the tax cuts but the spending increases.

we think the tax increases follow $3 trillion short. when we looked at the plan as a whole, the base case, and there is a lot of uncertainty because this campaign and not legislative language. what we think she is saying is her plan would add $3.520 over the debt over a decade and we think president trump's would add $7 trillion. host: what would he do on spending? guest: he said we are going to cut on spending but short on specifics. he says he wants to eliminate the department of education. he has talked about prescription drug savings but says -- has removed it from his website. he is talking about the real savings and talking about reduce. and we know that his plans would

reduce some fraudulent reporting but it doesn't add to a whole lot. a lot of what he wants to do is increase spending on defense including higher pay for our troops including a u.s. iron dome. he has talked about more money for immigration enforcement. you look at president trump's overall agenda, spending increases and cuts but really it is mostly tax agenda and tax cuts and mostly tariff agenda. host: marc goldwein is here to talk about the candidates' tax and spending proposals. call in now. the republican line is (202) 748-8001, democrats (202) 748-8000, independents (202) 748-8002. you can text and include your first name, city and state to (202) 748-8003.

what do each of them propose on the social security and medicare and savings? guest: social security is only nine years from insolvency. the benefits have to be cut we don't have enough money. and we have to cut that and for one year for a couple that would be $16,000. president trump would make it worse by reducing revenue coming in and getting ready taxation in social security benefits and cutting various payroll taxes. he would also increase the tariffs that would lead to higher inflation and both candidates but especially president trump would restrict immigration. president trump would do significant deportation which would hurt social security. host: can you explain that?

how does it hurt social security? guest: some pay taxes legally and some pay illegally but the money goes into the trust fund to pay benefits and if you were to deport a million people from coming in, that reduces our payroll tax collection and would advance the insolvency data of social security. so president trump's agenda as a whole, we are still working on the mall but instead of talking about 2033 would be talking about earlier. vice president harris has talked vaguely about how the rich need to pay their fair share but has no plan to save social security. and no plan is the same as endorsing 821% cut in nine years. -- and no plan is the same as

endorsing a 21% cut in nine years. vice president harris has talked about doing faster in negotiations so we are currently negotiation the price -- negotiating the price of some drugs and she wants to do more and wants to get more generic drugs on the scene and things like that but is also talked about expanding medicare, covering vision and hearing and nursing care for people at home and that will cost extra money. so vice president harris has things that will cost money and save and president trump doesn't have anything in the agenda right now for medicare. host: how have previous presidents done, if anything, and medicare what happens to medicare of the cost keeps going up and up? guest: medicare is 12 years from

insolvency. so we are in trouble with medicare as well. the last three presidents or for president, maybe the last six have had plans to reduce the cost of medicare and it has been a lot of overlap between them. president trump in his first term and president obama both agree that we should pay hospitals and doctors offices the same for the same kind of care. they want to reform the weight part d is performed. there is a lot of agreement that we are overpaying providers in some areas. there is agreement on how to solve it but democrats and republicans essentially propose the same thing and it is rare that they come together and say

let's solve the problem. if we just took the policies both sides agreed to put them into law would help. host: jack in virginia, democratic caller. caller: excellent talk this morning. i see that you focus on the spending side. can you comment on the revenue generation side. heard donald trump say he is going to drill. how realistic is that in compensating for the spending plan? also analysis on harris. and in terms of foreign policy, and in terms of the foreign policies may help to pay or generate revenue or less spending to compensate for the plans. if you could speak to those things i would appreciate it. guest: both candidates want to cut a lot of taxes. both candidates propose raising

a lot of taxes. president trump mainly through tariffs and vice president harris through taxes on corporations and higher earners. you mentioned drilling for oil, something president trump talks about a lot. that could help elevate gdp and could generate leasing revenue for the u.s. government but we are talking pennies on the dollar's relative to payroll tax. income and payroll taxes is where it is mostly generated and most of the oil is either privately owned and privately refined at least. if you look at the state like alaska that is oil-rich and has a few people, it can be a big share of their revenue but for the united states at large it will not make up a large part of the whole. host: and aid to foreign countries? guest: we spend 1% of the budget , if you count military to percent on foreign aid but a lot of that is for stuff that we

actually need it domestically as well. let's say we cut that in half, we are talking about a couple hundred billion dollars of savings over a decade. it is not going to fix the debt situation. doesn't mean we shouldn't scrutinize. we should scrutinize every part of the budget but it is upsetting for taxpayers when the federal government is wasting money and so if we are going to do the tough things and say the income tax has to go up work social security benefits will have to change, we better be going hard after the waste. it is such a small share of the budget. host: and the big solutions will be what? guest: social security, medicare, medicaid and revenue. defense is a large pot and we have to look there as well. there is no reason to think we don't have tons of waste in the defense budget. host: and we don't have audits

of some of those. guest: the law says they are supposed to get an audit and they have not successfully done one yet. host: florida, jesse, republican. caller: to topics and i would like the guest's explanation. how can you have an import tax and not have inflation? it seems to me if you raise the price of goods coming into the country you are going to raise the price to the consumer and that is going to cause inflation again. m the other topic is the immigration talk. i don't understand how we could deport millions of people who some of them are contributing to the revenue of the country and not affect the economy. both of those issues are important to me. host: ok let's hear the

response. guest: you are exactly right. we have done the analysis of both the import taxes and immigration. when it comes to the import tariffs, given the size, they are likely to increase inflation but maybe not permanently but one time. if they don't it will be because the exchange rates have adjusted substantially or the federal reserve who has stepped in and said we are so concerned that we will keep the interest rates higher. and then instead of increasing inflation it will reduce. there is no way to get around it. either the terrace will increase prices are they will reduce output and the price of everything else will start to equalize. when it comes to immigration, we analyzed both plans and both want to restrict immigration in some way. vice president harris wants to strengthen the borders.

president trump plant will lose 350 billion. high-end estimates could be lower but the main reason is because immigrants take taxes. we have fewer people we will get fewer tax revenue. host: what taxes are they paying? guest: many immigrants are either once here get some kind of legal status so they can work for they have stolen a social security number or made up. the most common is 000's and sometimes they just are checked. and that person is owed a lot of social security benefits because maybe billions of dollars in taxes paid under that social security number. we are receiving income tax revenue but when it comes to the

federal finances, immigrants and up in the schools and hospitals and etc. but at the federal level, new immigrants are a big net gain to the finances. host: at the state level, what taxes are they paying? guest: the same plus sales taxes. and there also collecting more government services. there are not a lot of federal services that go to undocumented immigrants but a lot of state and local. host: ted is in minnesota, independent. your question or comment. caller: i am just curious, this exploded three and a half years ago and it has been running

wild. they are receiving debit cards and free medical and driver's licenses which will actually double as an id which will very likely be used for voting, let's face it, that was all by design the same is with the oil. exploration and drilling stopped when biden took office and the big push was electric cars and lithium and all about china. we have real turmoil here. i don't think it was a good explanation on his revenue versus cost. host: why don't you agree with the numbers? why are you skeptical? caller: we have millions of people coming in. the schools are flooded.

host: marc goldwein? guest: the schools flooded is a great place to start. that is local. that is state. we have looked at this and the congressional budget office has looked at this and you are right, we have a huge surge of immigration in recent years and that is why both candidates have put into a big part of their platforms stemming and in one point reducing that. what i focused on was the economic at the federal level and we have a lot of questions that need to be answered about what is the best immigration policy but it is important to know the numbers behind it. host: talk about childcare because both candidates are addressing that. former president suggesting tariffs can help fund raising

childcare costs and the vice president proposing raising the child tax credit is much as 3600 and giving families of newborns at thousand dollars. what is the impact and how did tariffs pay for raising childcare costs. guest: i am not clear what president trump childcare plan is. tariffs could help fund but we wouldn't see what it was funding. he did propose stuff on paid leave but didn't really propose childcare. child -- vice president harris has alluded to a childcare plan that was enacted by congress go back better and that would create subsidies. she said she would catch childcare costs at 7% of income. i take that meaning for some people it would be 7% of income. the legislation i reference cuts

off at higher income. but this could be a very expensive government program and we could talk about the five hundred billion dollars or half $1 trillion or more just to fund the childcare programs and not sure how it would work in practice. something like universal preschool, we know state and government know how to do that and have elementaries and preschools but it is about more buildings and teachers. the subsidy is creating new infrastructure and would be a tremendous challenge to get it rolling. what she said as she wants to cap childcare costs at 7%. host: degree feel, south carolina, democratic caller. caller: -- to greenville, south carolina, democratic caller. caller: i would like to ask one question about donald trump.

incident -- are you making the point that he is the former president? caller: your guests keep calling him president. i will enter the question, president of what. guest: it is traditional that once prison has been present or ambassador or senator, we use the name in front of it, sometimes we as former president but sometimes i shorten it and i would do that for any individual. host: what did president trump do on the debt in the first term and what was the impact of his policy during the first four years. host: we have estimated this. but president trump during his four years in office signed into law legislation executive action that audited $8 trillion.

to train was tax cuts we talked about. there was another roughly 2 trillion dollars of bipartisan spending increases on defense and nondefense and other areas. host: was that covid money? guest: that was before covid that was for 20 before covid for ordinary spending. if you cut taxes and you cut spending that is not what happen. we cut taxes by $2 trillion in in 2018 we increased spending by almost as much in 2018 and 20 in 19. -- in 2018 and 2019? guest: some of it was the bipartisan budget. the department of defense wanted $45 billion a year and president obama said we will give the department of defense 45 billion

and nondefense 35 billion. and that is what they were working on. they kept beating each other up and then when you put that over 10 years, that is a lot of money. it has increased dramatically. then covid came along. president trump did not want anything for non-defense but ultimately they bid it up to be 100 $50 billion, more anyone had asked for. president trump signed more into law in nondefense then president obama had asked nondefense by about double. he added $4 trillion plus before covid and then covid came along and there was unanimous support

for protection for businesses, unemployment checks and another $4 trillion. and that was a $20 trump added to the debt. host: let's talk about the biden administration. guest: president biden did not add quite as much but still pretty substantial, $4.5 trillion. he came in with the american rescue plan which was covid relief but late stage covid relief and at that point most with saint maybe we need a few hundred billion dollars more but not too trillion. we had the bipartisan structure deal that was not paid for and they said it was. we had the chips and signs act, not paid for at all. other increases in defense and nondefense spending, partially offsetting that we had the fiscal responsibility act which

put caps on defense and nondefense and affective mention all of the executive actions mainly around student debt. host: sheila in massachusetts, republican. caller: the question i would like to know, is we have something like 10 million in new arrivals here and it said the cause is $3000 a month from the federal government and ngos and whoever, it is our money they are getting, $3000 a month times 10 million people and add that up and times it by 12. where is that money coming from? and why is it always social security, medicaid going broke but you never hear about food stamps or anything else going broke. why don't we just cut down on the surplus given to the government for the extras that

they get for congress like when they gave the rays for people in congress to use more money for their office expenditures? host: i am going to have marc goldwein respond to you in and we will get your thoughts. guest: two different questions there. i am not sure what the $3000 a month refers to but it is possible it is state and local money and possible that some is federal. but when we look at the federal level, on net the average immigrant is paying more in taxes whether legally or otherwise than they are collecting in federal benefits. when they talk about social security and medicare going broke, some programs are funded in their social security, medicare party and highways. there are some finances. social security and medicaid are

supposed be paid for through payroll taxes but the issue is they are falling short and they are all running out of money. the cost of food stamps has gone up dramatically. one of the items president biden added to debt was to executive action he essentially increased the cost of food stamps and there is no question there are costs there. there are costs related to congressional junkets and the big money happens to be in the programs. host: when you say it big money because you save money for foreign aid, 1% of the federal budget. what percentage are we talking about versus the percentage of the budget for the big spenders? guest: social security is 1/5 medicare is 1/6. social security, medicare and other health care, almost half

of the budget those. host: half of the budget? guest: half of the budget for those and they are growing rapidly. defense is also large but growing at a slower case. the programs are large and growing rapidly. host: sheila, what do you think about this, programs or you want to see the savings are single-digit percentage of the budget whereas other programs when you at the up together, almost 50% of the budget? caller: it is a penny here and a penny there adds up to a lot of pennies in the end. this immigration thing has got to stop. we cannot afford to be supporting 10 million immigrants to the tune of $3000 a month, no matter where that money comes from. we are paying for it one way or another and it is wrong.

i never got an extra $3000 a month. it costs me almost $2000 a year more to support myself. i can't recoup that money. host: we will take your point. guest: i agree with the penny here, penny there. what we need to do could we have a debt approaching record levels, interest costs are larger than the programs. we need a whole of government approach would be take a serious look at waste throughout government and lower the cost of health care, hopefully by lowering the costs but not cutting benefits. where we look at again social security solvent. a lot of it will be a penny here and a penny there and i do agree with that approach and we should start with the waste.

how the american people going to access the bigger changes as they still see waste. host: why are the interest rates the third-biggest driver? guest: interest costs were low around 2020 because interest rates were low and they have exploded have exploded-exploding giveaway spend 900 billion dollars last year on interest. the first is interest rates have gone up. the federal government is paying higher interest rates and the second is we are paying interest on a lot of debt which has exploded. so the higher rate on higher debt means interest rates are killing the rest of the budget. host: who are we paying this to? guest: a lot of it is to americans who hold the funds and also abroad to if not friendly countries. our largest foreign debt holder is china. a lot of this is held abroad and domestically, it is americans

are giving money to the federal government by buying bonds and not by in the private sector in the private sector and that means less machinery, software and new inventions and over time that slows up growth. host: warren, silver spring, maryland, democratic caller. caller: what benefits do immigrants get at the local level or federal level. so i wolves from cameroon and until my asylum came through, i couldn't get anything from federal i got it at the state. i also have three people in my house that have filed for asylum and cannot visit a doctor's office and we have to pay out-of-pocket for them.

that is question number one. isn't it true that high demand and low supply because unemployment is so low. too many people get jobs. the stores are packed up and people are buying more so supply meeting demand. if we have to have term screaming that he wants to decrease inflammation that means people have to love their jobs so demand should increase in price goes down. host: let's take your point. guest: the state and local is

different for each state but most of it is the schooling. cost of inflation usually is demand and lowering supply. we had a huge surge in demand in 2020 and 2021, in large part to the american rescue plan and supply it wasn't there because of the joblessness and other supply chain chaos from covid. now inflation is finally coming down. it is not at the federal reserve 2% target both candidates risk reigniting inflation by adding a lot to the deficit in a way that reboots demand does not create enough supply to equalize out. host: let's go to rosemary in new jersey, independent. caller: something that always bothered me was the federal

government, the taxpayer ends up paying the salaries for the government employees. if you could explain that. guest: job numbers are estimated by an independent agency and they count jobs including federal state and local jobs. that is important for statistical purposes because we want to understand how many people are working and how many people are not working. what it doesn't tell us is the fiscal impact and if we were to have a huge surge in federal employment, that would have a big cost to the taxpayer but different sets of numbers. once that focuses on the overall number of jobs in the economy and a separate set is on federal finances. the federal finances are not doing good and that is not because the federal workers but the cost of the big programs

like health and retirement. host: here is jim in maryland, how much would be saved by eliminating the affordable care act? the affordable care act -- guest: the horrible care act had a lot of things in it. if you are talking about the spending associated with it, expanded medicaid in most states and also income-based subsidies for people who don't have employer-provided insurance, simply expanding that temporarily. probably a $20 over a decade if you would eliminate that. that would be real money but would come with real consequences. they tried to do that during president trump's first term in the famous john mccain thing but it wasn't to eliminate it but it was to repeal and replace.

if you are consider if there is no upside for replacement, how much would it cost? we can save money in all areas of government. there is a tremendous amount of waste. we didn't get the legislation right in 2009 but i wouldn't expect that would save the deficit. host: for viewers, you can learn more if you go to the committee for a responsible federal budget's website. we are going to take a break. later, pbs frontline premieres and new documentary examining a year long war between israel and hamas. we will speak to the documentary filmmaker coming up on the "washington journal. but when we come back from break , we will hear from calls in open forum. the numbers are on your screen. start dialing in. we will show you a portion from

last nights michigan senate debate where there was sparring over electric vehicles in manufacturing. take a look. [video clip] >> ev's and manufacturing, in competition with china, are we investing too much in battery plants and ev is that the majority of consumers are not willing to purchase yes? you have 60 seconds. >> i don't care what kind of car you want to drive. i don't drive and ev and i live on a farm on a dirt road but the fundamental question is who do you want to make the next vehicles and you better believe i want to beat michigan and not china. everyone knows china is eating our lunch on these vehicles. flute south america, they have 30% market share, 30% market share in europe. america knows we haven't always gotten it right seeing the next

set of vehicles. in the 1970's and 1980's, we didn't think anyone would drive anything smaller and they came in and ate our lunch. it also means saving auto jobs and making sure plants like lansing grand river we save the 700 jobs at the plant because we are upgrading it. i don't care what you want to drive, but i want to build them. >> mr. rogers, reinvesting too much in battery plants and ev's that a majority of consumers are not willing to purchase yet? >> this is important. what a candidate says and what they do in the office the last years is really important. voting for the ev mandate three times. as soon as about four weeks ago, doubled down on her position on ev mandates.

it is ruining our car industry. 5000 auto dealers wrote an open letter to the biden administration and said, you are killing the car business. please stop with the ev mandates. they mandated you have to drive that car and my opponent signed an nda that allows a chinese battery, company to go out of goshen to facilitate ev mandates and the same with the 500 million-dollar rebuild that the gm factory, you are promoting chinese technology in america. it is wrong. let's go to hybrids. people are buying them and you don't have to mandate they drive them. >> 32nd rebuttal. >> there is no ev -- 32nd rebuttal. -- 30-seco rebuttal.

nd >> we learned our lesson that we outsourced too far in china and we made a decision to bring them back. i want the manufacturing here and i don't care what you drive, i want to build them. >> 30 seconds. >> nothing has happened since my opponent has been in office on three need manufacturing back to the united states. she lost 29,000 manufacturing jobs and she has been in office, 29,000. so they talk about 700 jobs, they will cost according to a ford ceo, four hundred thousand manufacturing jobs in the state of michigan will go away with ev mandates. that is unacceptable. you don't have to do it. we can build hybrid cars in america and cars that people want to buy. >> "washington journal" continues. host: that was the last night michigan senate debate. one of the key senate races this november to watch.

it is all part of c-span's coverage of congressional races this fall. we are bringing in debates from across the country in key competitive house districts as well as senate races and governors races and you can find it all on our website, c-span.org. that continues tonight at p.m. eastern, coverage of the pennsylvania senate debate between the incumbent bob casey and mccormick. at 8:00 p.m. eastern time on c-span 2, will have live coverage of the texas senate debate between republican incumbent ted cruz and democratic congressman all red -- colin allred. we are in open forum. you can talk about politics and

public policy. frank in new york, republican. caller: i wish i had two hours to debate your post. he made about 10 misstatements. let me take just a couple. i am a republican and have been want all of my life. i don't think i have ever voted for a democrat. when trump was in office, exploded by a $20. $8 trillion of that is on trump's head but more than that because the tax code he did then is still on the books for the three or four years that biden has been in office. so a lot of that is being charged to biden is still the tax cuts that were put in place. i could have come up with 10

versions of the tax code that would have made more income for the country and less giveaways than the trump tax codes. host: will go to john who is a democratic color in new york. caller: my statement is because i was listening and he basically left out an important point and did not go into the clintons and how we had surpluses and in 2000, al gore wanted to save social security by paying down the national debt because we had surpluses and have a window of time to do it. so from what i have seen from what he was talking about, big pots of money like social security, medicare and putting

that in front of us, no. people ask how did clint have surpluses, and it was tax cuts. and they are thinking wealthy, big billionaires but tax cuts. when the middle class have spending money date by stuff and that is what makes the economy go and that is how we had surpluses. from what i see on the harris plan, she wants to give tax to middle-class people that will hate -- help make the economy grow. i think she can do better on that. when working people have spending money, they buy stuff. host: you are talking about bill clinton and what he did when he was president. what do you make of him being out on the campaign trail for

the vice president? caller: i think he should push what he was successful at, and he was successful at having surpluses. host: you think he should talk about the economy and vouch for the vice president on the economy? caller: that is what i am saying. her proposal on tax cuts does put money toward middle-class people and those are the people and there are a ton of us. when we have the money we will spend it. host: let's listen to bill clinton on the campaign trail in columbus, georgia on monday. on sunday he was out as well. [video clip] >> we started early voting tomorrow. and if you owe the recent georgia elections, we fought hard. they tried to break it so it

hurt us and there were innovative efforts in that regard. but you did well. we won in 2020. in you have raphael warnock and john hostile -- john hussell. and we did it. not just because of atlanta but when there was an opportunity outside of atlanta, we punched about our weight so if you want it bad enough you can win it and you will be proud of yourself for the rest of your life. and your children and grandchildren will be grateful. host: former president bill

clinton in georgia trying to persuade people to get out and vote. he talked about the new election rules, the secretary of state talked with the washington post yesterday about some new rules. here is what he had to say. [video clip] >> this year what we are going to do is the first time in america. we will audit every race. so we have valid -- ballot images and we will have them and will be able to run them through a scanner with a company and read every race from president down to the county library in and we will compare that to what you got with the machine totals. it is one way we will give you a 100% risk. we think that is very pertinent.

reported results quick is another thing. photo id for all forms of voting . everything we have done is to improve accuracy and no matter what people say we will be able to say we have checked it. we have to clean the voter lists. for several reasons. we are part of a multistate organization. our office will exchange the voter lists with other states and it is a confidential and secure way of doing that to make sure we don't have people on two different voter lists. other states in the district of columbia, we get there drivers license. if you move from georgia to whatever state that is, we find out about that and we can reach out to the voters and take them off the list because they have

moved there. host: that is the secretary of state in georgia talking with the washington post yesterday. if you missed it and want to see more about how georgia is preparing for a november, go to our website, c-span.org. if you want more from the campaign trail, you can find all campaign coverage. the former president be in chicago at the economic summit and we will have live covera at noon eastern time here on c-span, c-span now our free video app and c-span.org. at 5:00 p.m., tim walz will be at rally in pittsburgh, pennsylvania. also coverage on c-span, c-span now and c-span.org. at 6:00 p.m. we will cover ohio senate -- senator jd vance at a wn hall.

john in new york, democratic color, open forum. what is on your mind? caller: basically, if we can revisit the clinton tax policy we had surpluses basically if we could just learn how that was done and repeat history, that would be the best. take down the national debt. why are we not talking about this? we did it before and will do it again. host: jean in illinois, republican. caller: i was talking about the man talking about the taxes and audits. host: are you talking about at the pentagon? caller: of all bureaucratic agencies.

if elon musk it's in there, he will cut out the waste and corruption and then we will see where the waste is in who is putting money in their pockets. and another thing, with kamala harris pushing abortion, now that we take. we would not be out of money. we would have millions of babies paying into it all these years. now, i am on a fixed income. i'm 82 years old. i got a letter from a cardiologist. i will not be able to see my cardiologist. i am diabetic. i had to -- i had a bad knee. doctors recommend i not have it. now they are cutting me down on that.

i was going to physical therapy every three months. now i can only go twice a year. i am a lot older. host: stephen in kentucky, democratic caller. we are in open forum. >> i wanted to talk about politics. how are you this morning? i wrote something recently. it is not very long, but i want to share it with you all this morning. it is regarding the election and the war abroad. as we progress into the november elections, remember that toxic masculinity with donald trump as its poster boy is culpable for all these wars that the united states has been embroiled in over the years. a woman's touch could change that. how does one expect substantive reform with the establishment

devoured by the avarice at the helm? donald trump's natural habitat is his swamp. how does one expect butterflies emerging from their cocoons with an establishment dominated by stereo typical wasp men blocking our exits? society only evolves -- not patriarchy or matriarchy. for edible women and men -- formidable women and men collaborating, hence the moniker united states of america, need not necessarily reproduce to serve in the special capacity of godparents, surrogate fathers, surrogate mothers, foster parents, adopted mother, adopted father to express their natural intuition as guiding lights. in the words of a song, light of

the world, shine on me. love is the answer. with the dawn of election day arriving, we must remember that a vote for vice president kamala harris is akin to a vote for the contemporary nourishment of approachable and available maternal-ism. thank you. host: why did you write that? caller: because i am troubled by what is going on abroad and i think donald trump is the one responsible for the iranians having that pile of nuclear weaponry to begin with. i wanted to make people aware of this. this is not like vietnam. i know it has been talked about and compared to that. but humphrey did not have the freedom that ms. harris now has in her positions. people see her as an outsider, even though she is the incumbent, but this man for

years -- what i would like to know is, if he has all the answers, why did he not do what he was supposed to do for the years he was in there? it is just ridiculous. host: mike is an independent in michigan. good morning. caller: great show. your previous guest on the federal budget was excellent and clarified a lot of my questions. host: do you now know who you're going to vote for based on that conversation? caller: i was leaning heavily one direction and it confirmed a bit for me. host: can you share how you are going to vote? caller: i was going to vote democratic pretty much across the board. i looked at the c-span history

-- how the historians rated the presidents and it was fantastic. i would recommend everybody do that as well. anyway, i also wanted to remind everyone we need to be civil and respect every human and everyone's ability to think on their own. i wanted to ask the best way for fact checking. i like to do a lot of my own fact checking. i do not think ford even has 400,000 employees. i retired from ford and i thought it was around 200,000. host: fact checking for debates, i am not sure. if you google it, you might be able to find your answer. a lot of the newspapers and

outlets have fact checking on their websites. you can go to many of them. specifically on that debate, i am not sure. what did you think of that debate? caller: it was interesting. to me, it confirmed mr. rogers will probably be very partyline, so i do not think he will stray from the republican party line. which i think the country really needs. host: as an independent, that appeals to you, someone who is not partyline? caller: we have to get back to voting conscience as opposed to the lines of the party. the federalist papers thought

one of the biggest threats would be factions and divisibility of the country. real quick, i also wanted to clarify i do not think it is an ev mandate like they tried to summarize. it is a carbon mandate, so how the auto companies can get to those is not a mandate. host: mike in michigan talking about that senate debate. we showed a little of it. you can find that on our website. ruth in chicago, republican. caller: i was going to take exception with the gentleman just said. he called in on the independent line and all of a sudden he is going to vote democratic across the board. that is not what i called for. i called to take exception to the last gentleman with the

budget where he says the illegal immigrants are putting more into the economy than they take out. host: on the federal level. caller: i failed to see how this can be possible. in chicago, they said the average cost per student in the chicago public school system is close to $20,000. host: that is the distinction. he is saying they do not give a lot of federal benefits but pay into the federal tax system. hold on. on the local level, he referenced schools and hospitals. the money for that is coming from local and state. caller: so one pocket is ok but the other pocket is absorbing all the costs?

it is not direct -- address the indirect costs. we finance hospitals also and we put people up and i think the last figure in the last financial year, illegals cost this country $66 billion. and i know the bottom half of people do not pay federal income taxes at all. how can his figures be correct? host: your figure, where did you get that? caller: i heard it on the tv, the total cost of everything. we have extra police forces and everything because of people coming in and being let in by the democrats. host: kevin is a democrat in d.c.. caller: what the guest said about the affordable care act

and how it did not all eliminate it and the affordable care act took forever. it took until obama. once they get rid of it or get rid of coverage for pre-existing conditions, it will be hard to get it back. the fact trump said he saved it when it was john mccain -- it shows he was a good apprentice to roy cohen. the mafia lawyer that encouraged people to see the film. the scripted television version was fantasy. the truth was trump likes autocrats and mafia.

he praises china. you cut me off one time when a call to talk about covid when he said that president she -- xi was doing a great job. the director of disease control said it came from the protocol. host: i am going to move on to get other voices in. mike in d.c., republican. caller: i have a problem with obama with his speech the other night. he has some nerve. he did nothing for black people. kamala harris destroyed black men in san francisco. she destroyed san francisco.

policies under budget have been horrible. you look at chicago and the gangs of chicago and he let the venezuelans take over and stuff like that. he has done nothing. he is from hawaii. he did nothing to help the people of hawaii. obama is a joke. that is why a lot of black men are not voting for kamala harris, because they have not done anything for black people. it is horrible. host: and the question posed by victor blackwell of cnn, will obama's message to black men backfire? it sounds like you think it will. >> without a doubt. it is sad people are bashing black men. you got a problem with your mother -- are you serious? we can vote -- this is america.

we are allowed to vote for whoever we want. and if we do not something is wrong with us? do we say that about asians? no. they have their own minds. host: joe in new york, independent. caller: i'm hearing a lot of misinformation right now on your program and it is not being counteracted, so i cannot hear you right now because i have my tv muted. host: listen and talk through your phone. we can hear you. caller: i am not hearing you through the phone. i'm only hearing myself. i just heard your last comment. there must be a delay. thank you very much. there is a lot of misinformation going on, people saying that trump gave iran the nuclear

weapons. are you kidding me? the democrats gave them billions of dollars. come on. let's get real. they are still giving iran money by letting them supply oil to the world. i am telling you right now, there's a lot of misinformation. it is hard to decipher whether you are talking to a democrat, republican, independent. the last caller was right on. it seems to be black against white and that is not american. we are all americans. we should vote for the person that is going to do the best for america. forget about party lines. that is why i have been independent. i am 75. i have been independent since i was 18 years old. just because i do not want to vote party lines. host: what democrats have you

voted for for president? caller: for president? none. host: ok. arvin in virginia, democratic caller. caller: my name is marvin purvis. i am 87 years old. donald trump is 79 years old. we do not need an old man making decisions for this country now. host: patrick in florida, republican. we do not have patrick anymore. that does it for open forum this morning on the washington journal. we will take a break. when we come back, documentary filmmaker robin barnwell joins us to talk about his new project examining the war between israel and hamas. we will be right back. ♪

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coverage's's with the support of america -- coverage with the sport -- supportive america's cable companies. host: joining us this morning from london is robin barnwell, documentary filmmaker and journalist, with a new documentary a year of war, israelis and palestinians. why did you want to make this documentary? guest: i had been covering the war in ukraine. when october 7 happened, i was in ukraine and a lot of the news they ran straight away from kyiv trying to get israel as soon as possible. i was remaining there to make a documentary. i was horrified by the violence. and i thought it would be

important to come back to make a film following what happened on october 7. by the time i had finished my film in ukraine and managed to get to israel, the shift in the media focus understandably had gone toward also what was going on inside gaza with the war and the response from the israelis to october 7. so it felt important that israelis and palestinians, those caught up in the violence, i wanted to hear their perspectives and to look at how the events of october 7 and those that followed in the war in gaza had changed perceptions of israelis and palestinians about each other. so i wanted to convey these are ordinary people who do not --

they obviously have political opinions of some kind. they were moderates and people i felt i wanted to essentially humanize the victims to find people on both sides that, whatever the viewer, whatever their own perspective, political perspective, i wanted it to come across that these are human victims, ordinary people, and for the viewer to kind of relate to them and see the humanity of each side. that was important to me. and to get across the humanity because i think sometimes the news coverage on both sides tensed -- tends to dehumanize cut not purposefully, but you can capture these news clips

that do not bring out who these people are and what they have actually gone through and what they are really thinking. that was my aim and vision. host: frontline's "a year of war" for mayors tonight and will be available to stream on frontline's website and on the pbs video app as well. given this is ongoing conflict, how are you able to find the people that you spoke to and what was that like, to go into gaza and talk to them? guest: i had been to gaza before to cover events. there is no free and unfettered access to foign media still inside gaza, so while we waited for opportunity to go and visit

and speak to people ourselves, it became obvious around april of this year when we were needing to start editing the film that that was not going to be possible, so we had a started working with a carefully vetted team of brave journalists and producers. we started gathering footage and then when it became clear i could not go on the ground myself it became imperative that we actually asked the team to meet people we had found on social media. we had been on social media accounts and the idea was to find a small group of gazans, three in this instance, that had been filming themselves and their experiences and had gone through a great deal personally.

what they had actually experienced was, we felt, in the case that we had one young woman who wanted to be a -- in the solar energy business, she had gone through tremendous experience in the north of gaza, not knowing whether to leave her home at the beginning when the israeli army had warned people to leave. we were then looking at her family on videos she had found herself with a young photographer from northern gaza who had been filming quite a lot about his own experience of the war and then a doctor, the head of surgery at the hospital in northern gaza. we had found these contributors

through some of their own social media and footage filmed by others of them and once we had vetted who they were and made sure they were not -- that they were people we felt we could include in a film, within asked our team on the ground to meet them and gather more footage to try to compile visual looks at their experiences of the war and then we had to do these interviews remotely in two cases , the young woman who is 23 years old and we did interviews remotely in gaza and the doctor had an interesting story. he eventually left gaza and he is in sarajevo and we found him

ourselves. i was able to go there myself and film all of the contributors that we identified for the film. host: i want to show a couple clips from the documentary. let's begin with the young palestinian woman. here is a clip from the documentary talking about her family and being displaced 15 times. [video clip] >> [speaking other language]

[speaking other language]

[speaking other language] host: robin barnwell, what do you hope viewers of this documentary gain or get from listening to her story and the others? guest: i think i would like people to try to understand the different perspectives of those caught in the violence. some of those opinions have changed. some of the contributors we filmed, october 7 we have to remember was the deadliest for israelis in their country's history and triggered a significant trauma and persecution and holocaust and that deeply impacted israelis and their view of the future.

in some respects, those people who were living in the communities attacked by hamas on october 7, those were people more likely to be in favor of a two state solution or peace with palestinians, ironically. in the case of one of our characters, that deeply impacted her, one favor -- one person in favor of a two state pollution -- solution in the past. she is now worried a two state solution could mean one state thinking about annihilating the other. but i think it is important that viewers listen to people caught up in the violence because those perspectives will dramatically shape the future of the region for many years to come. i should add also for

palestinians this has also been the worst year in their history. and it has triggered historic trauma of 1948 and the events around the creation of israel and the war that took place around that time when 700,000 plus palestinians were displaced , 200,000 going into gaza. they either chose to leave or were expelled from their homes. that is a historic trauma which is now coming back again over the course of this year and the events that have happened. you hear this a lot from people inside gaza and you hear the historic trauma perspective from israelis as well regarding

israel was supposed to be there safe haven. it was supposed to be the place they were safe and they are feeling very unsafe in their land. host: back to the documentary. let's listen to a young israeli woman that was held hostage by hamas and talk about that on the others. [video clip] >> [speaking other language]

[speaking other language] host: talk to us about this young woman and the perspective she has.

guest: 17 years old when the attack on october 7 happened and she was living with family in a community near the gaza border, which was -- she was there with her family. she had been with friends that night just walking around admiring the beauty of the place. it is a very beautiful place next to the gaza border and her family heard the sirens go off in the morning on october 7. they huddled together in the house and after five hours of attacks, finally hamas fighters broke into their home and killed her father and then took her mother and her two brothers hostage and they killed her

sister. she did not see that happen, but she witnessed -- basically they were taken a short distance, about 10 minutes for them to then go into the tunnel system across the hamas tunnel system in gaza, which is extensive under gaza. she describes the shock of -- the sudden shock because she thought she was going to die and the last thing she thought was that she would be taken hostage and that was a shock and then she was taken over into gaza. there was a large commotion, people celebrating that hamas had taken hostages. she describes the commotion then ding up in the tunnel system and the orb are an shock of that.

host: we are talking with robin barnwell, the documentary filmmaker of "the year of war: israelis and palestinians." it will be available to stream on frontline's website. i want to invite our viewers to join in on this conversation. republicans, dial in at (202) 748-8001. democrats, (202) 748-8000. independents, (202) 748-8002. you can text instead of calling. just include your first name, city, and state. do you take a point of view in this documentary? guest: i try to stay objective as a filmmaker. i know you cannot leave politics entirely and people will always look at what is on the screen and try and interpret maybe

inapplicable message behind it all. -- a political message kind it all. my aim of this film was to show those caught up in the violence. it was to empathize with israelis and palestinians who have the worst year of violence in the conflict. and what has happened in the last year is going to have an impact for years to come. it has changed lives and views and impacted many lives, those who have lost loved ones. my aim is not to have a political message. it is try -- to try to show people.

it is just from the perspectives of those interviewed and spoke into and it has given them a voice and a chance to talk about what they have been through, what they see as the future, if there is a future for them. so that has been important for me. i am not here to give political views on the conflict. host: do you address in the documentary the role of the united states? guest: we do not. we entirely leave that alone, partly because the palestinians and israelis we spoke to, that was not the foremost thing on their mind. united states links to the region are important but that is some other film, another

documentary. we were not trying to look at the involvement or policies of the administration or the views of americans at large. host: joanna is up first in germantown, maryland. caller: if this film addresses the plight of women and children on all sides, then it is worth watching. i am not on the side of hamas. i'm on the side of women and children. i am sick and tired of these men on both sides posting and beating their chests like gorillas in the wild and the people that suffer are the women and children. i do not think they care about their kids. so i hope this documentary focuses on women and children. they are the real victims of this war on all sides.

guest: we do spend focus on women and children in the film here and there are a few men as well. i mentioned a young palestinian woman and her story losing her brother in tragic circumstances and her father and from israel you have the tragic story of her loss and also the story of a young hostage. the one thing that impacts you when you make these films, it is emotional to hear the testimony of people and what they have been through and is also sad to see the cycle of violence continue and without a visible end and the worry that the

children one sees in the film will cut when they get older, what will their situation be? will they be participants in continuing conflict? will they be victims of the conflict? it is challenging. we have focused on women and children as part of the film. host: here's one of our viewers. had just one point to make in this documentary, what would you want to convey to the world? guest: i think it is a slightly depressing movie. the cycle of violence -- i have been going to the region for 30 years. i have never seen israelis and palestinians so far psychologically from each other and one of the characters says

in the film we both have to -- neither of us are going anywhere. we are going to be here to stay. if we do not want to have a continuing cycle of violence and -- it is going to be -- someone has to figure something out. it is not going to be a solution which is comfortable for either, potentially for many. that is her perspective and what she shares in the film. i suppose it is the fact that israelis and palestinians are psychologically so far apart from one another and the war that followed in gaza is a momentous moment in the history of the palestinian and israeli peoples. it is worth reflecting on that and the cycle of violence that is continuing. and that does not seem to have an end. host: tom in illinois,

republican. it is your turn. >> the way this thing happened was -- caller: the way this thing happen was the palestinians came across the border and raped women and killed children. my question is, if it was our country and we have people cross the border and do this, we would send the fbi or somebody because they committed crimes against israel and i know they war is terrible, but i was watching this thing keep going. then the palestinians were going to try to get out of the way and they went to the egyptian border and tried to cross and egypt would not let them in. i was stunned. i thought, surely they would let these people in. they will not let them in because they're muslim brotherhood -- this is what is left of the muslim brotherhood. when they were in egypt, the

executor their leader and other leaders of the palestinians do not even live in palestine. they live in qatar. they are billionaires. i do not see the army of palestine or whatever you want to call them -- they built their defenses under hospitals and schools. how are you supposed to fight them? then they teach their kids to hate jews. host: how do you know that? caller: i have seen it on c-span. i have seen it on different shows. they have shown schoolbooks that the palestinians teach their kids how to hate jews. host: your thoughts? guest: i am sticking away from

politics on this. the egyptians have not -- they had originally -- they allowed 90,000 gazans to leave in the initial phases of the war, but then when the israeli defense forces basically came and sealed the border, nobody else has been able to leave after that, except in extremely mandatory and circumstances into israel. this is not part of the documentary. it is not something we have specifically covered on this particular point you are raising. host: this is another viewer in pennsylvania. why do gaza residents stay and not leave for better living

places? what did they say about that area of the country and what it means to them? guest: what gaza means to them? it is very conflicted. many causes have a strong and positive you of gaza in the prewar phase, though the conflict has been going on for decades. one of the characters talks about the fact that gaza for him -- it was his home and life. it is surprising how any palestinians will tell you they rather love the place and even though it has been under seizure for many years and there are hardships and difficulties and one of our characters make sickly or hamas does not allow freedom of speech or

opportunities for palestinians to air their views. hamas does what it wants, she says. she makes it clear that palestinians generally do not have democratic opportunities to express their views about anything else, but it is an amazing location. it has been enormously damaged by the war and the terrible destruction that has taken place. but before they wore -- the war a lot gazans would say they had an affinity with the place. host: he says in the documentary he has gone to other places around the world but feels most comfortable in gaza. what does ho mean given the

situation there -- home me and given the situation there for israeli ends and palestinians? guest: the refugee communities -- not everyone there has refugee heritage. some people were living in gaza anyway but these communities -- if you imagine 2.3 million people living in a confined area , there's a strong sense of community and close proximity to everything. that is part of their culture and there -- they are a close, tightknit community. that is one of the largest refugee camps in the world. 12,000 people have been living there for decades now, so there is a strong community spirit

there. on the border, these communities of people are also very close knit and there are farming and business communities, rather wonderful places built with strong spirit of israel in mind but also strong community spirit, so on both sides you are seeing israelis and palestinians from close to communities who have been badly impacted by this war and october 7. many of those people -- most of this people now cannot live in those areas and have had to move away. those communities have had

lasting damage, not only the hostages taken from them and those who were killed but also those who are now displaced. most palestinians in gaza have been displaced. most of that population has been displaced. those in the communities next to gaza and israel have been broken apart and forced to other places across israel and that has had lasting impact as well on those communities. host: tony is in pennsylvania, independent. caller: thank you for taking my call. very concerned about the guest's title but also the idea that he is not going to talk about

politics. i would say a couple things. one is more is always political. two is this is not a war. this is a genocide. if you look at the international court, israel is creating war crimes, so for two countries to be at war both countries need to have sovereignty and militaries. from what i can see come out the palestinian people have military but no sovereignty. the idea that this man is framing this as a war and saying he does not want to be political , it speaks of a type of propaganda that he is participating in. the next one i want to make is it upsets me when c-span repeatedly has callers call in and state miss fax like that baby's word is capitated or there were mass decapitations or babies. that has been debunked, but to

allow that to go on -- there was mass rape. you allow that to go on. c-span has one side presented and this man is masquerading -- his documentary is masquerading as some impartial thing. there is one people right now being slaughtered. this is not a war. you need to correct guests that bring up things like babies being decapitated. host: you just did what you're talking about you had the opportunity. that is the way we structure the show. you have the opportunity to call us and state your opinion. you can dispute what you have heard from callers and guests. do you want to respond to what he had to say? guest: thank you for your points. the documentary if you watch it -- i hope you will watch it and

maybe take a different view of what is about. i personally did not want to inject myself into other people -- we have interviewed israelis and palestinians. they expressed their views clearly. it is for them to talk about their opinions and issues. as a documentary maker, i the one who's obviously deciding some of the clips to use, but i do not think anyone would say they have been unfairly represented. the team in gaza is proud of the film and our team in israel is proud of the film in terms of looking at the issue and reflecting the views they feel are important and i think they gaza team -- maybe they would be

a bit hurt given the amount of work and effort they have put in to trying to convey to the world the situation and through the contributors we have interviewed, they have tried to show the reality of the war on the ground inside gaza, so i think they might be a bit surprised by -- you can remember they have been very much part of making the film as well as our is really team, so please do watch and maybe you might change your view. >> you can watch the entire documentary tonight at 10:00 p.m. eastern time on pbs and it will be available to stream on frontline's website. watch it in its entirety and you

can decide for yourself. carol in new jersey, democratic caller. caller: i was going to talk about jimmy carter made peace with both sides and he ensured that the united states would not interfere in either side. when trump came in office, the senate told them not interfere with israel, but he did anyway. he brought united states troops in. he brought our united buildings in and that was not right. now there was a war. after that, he started the war. but that is never said. host: did any of the people you talked to talk about the global

response and wanting more from any country, any other country in this situation? guest: yes, i think -- palestinians were concerned about how the rest of the world would view their plight. again, israelis the same. there is no specific instance where they talked about and said -- the focus of the documentary is not about how israel and the palestinian territories sits within the wider international sphere of international affairs. that is not his purpose. that is to say for other films and other film makers and journalists to do. it is focused on them looking at each other, so israelis and palestinians looking at each other and expressing how their

views of each other have changed as a result of the violence. host: en -- ian in florida. caller: i have not seen the film yet. it sounds wishy-washy because you have to take into consideration the politics to come to some conclusions. otherwise it is just meaningless. the fact is that the palestinians have been blown up on an epic which includes death. you interrupted and made an assumption also on the person who said palestinian kids have

been brought up to kill jews. they are. have you ever read the koran? host: you have read it? caller: i have read it. you can see there is death to the jews and death to christians. you have to make assumptions. otherwise, it is just wishy-washy nonsense. host: talking about making a documentary that shows perspective from each side, are you trying so people draw conclusions? what do you want people to get out of this? >> i think i wanted to humanize those who are caught up in the violence. i'm not denying that it is a very political war and wars are political.

i am not shying away from that fact. there are film makers out there who have made films focusing on gaza. there are those who have made films looking at october 7 and those who have made films or doing journals and writing books on the conflict as a whole. that is not what we have chosen to do here. we have chosen to come at it from the perspective of ordinary people caught up in the violence. i appreciate there are some people who make statements about the future. they do air their views. he airs his view about feeling that hamas -- he is not a supporter of hamas. he is strongly against violence of any kind but his perspective

in the film is conveyed. i am not coming at it from a particular perspective. i am putting people -- the contributors we have interviewed, they aired their opinions and views. it is not for me as making this film about israelis and palestinians to interject. i am a british filmmaker. i am knuckling to put my own slant or perspective into it. -- not going to put my own slant or perspective into it. i want to hear what they are saying about what they think about each other and the future. they do make some political statements in the film. it is for them to make, not for me to make them. i agree that wars are political and they are caught up and this war is complicated. the conflict has long historical roots and it is impossible to go

into all that in this particular film. when you are making a film or documentary, you have to decide whether you are making a history of israelis and arabs or a history of the united states and israel or the united states and the media or international affairs. you have to choose and select something. you have 90 minutes in which to air a story and you have to focus. it is impossible to do everything and impossible to please everyone. so we wanted to bring out the humanity of the victims on both sides. we wanted to look at how israelis and palestinians, their views of each other have been changed other have been shaped y

this conflict. i think that is important because this region has always it's an extremely important region in the world and what goes on there resonates and has an impact in a lot of other places. so it is important for us to understand basically what people are thinking and feeling there on the ground and why they are feeling it and how that might impact the future. host: people can watch this documentary tonight 10:00 p.m. eastern time on pbs it is available to stream on frontline's website, youtube and the pbs video app. we have to leave it there. a year of war, thank you so much for the conversation. guest: thank you very much. host: the house will gaveling quickly and go back out. they are not in washington this week, this is a pro forma sessio