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save up to 30% wide site wide, save on hoodies, accessories and more. there's something for every c-span fan and will support our nonprofit operation. c-spanshop.org or scan the code on the right. >> supreme court chief justice john robert paid tribute to sandra day o'connor for her work at an event at durham, north carolina. duke university to celebrate the life and legacy of associate justice sandra day o'connor. the 2024 recipient of the carl and susan bulch prize for the rule of law. president price asked me to share his deep regret that he could not join us this evening due to the travel delays that are affecting so many people right now.

but we are delighted that so many distinguished guests are here with us. the chief justice of the united states, john g. roberts, and his wife, jane sullivan roberts, justice o'connor's son, scott o'connor, and his wife joni, susan -- [inaudible] cofounder of the institute, and many current and former members of our federal and state judiciaries including chief justice paul m. n if ubc of north carolina -- nuby. i'm also lighted to see so many friends, faculty, students and alumni of cook law school. peter khan, the chair of the advisory board and a former trustee of duke university, is also a here along with several current and former members of the advisory board, all of whom have helped make the institute so successful. but this room is so full of so many distinguished people, it's

a testament to the enduring legacy of tonight's honoree. justice o'connor was a dear friend, colleague and mentor to many in this room, and she was an inspiration to all of us. tonight we celebrate her impact as a path-breaking mix servant and justice -- public servant and justice of our highest court, a model of civility and bipartisanship and a founding force behind a civic education renaissance in our country. many of us know something about her incredible life and work, but i think we will see this evening that justice sandra day o'connor still has much to teach us. the vulch price for the rule of law is a result of the generosity and dedication of carl vul lch jr., a 1967 graduate of duke law school and his wife susan, a graduate of georgetown university law center, who established the judicial institute with a generous gift to duke law school in in to 2018.

they charged the institute with a specific mission, bettering the human condition by studying and promoting the rule of law. this mission has inspired an array of educational programs, scholarly endeavors and the creation of this prize or, all of which aim to strengthen and support the judiciary and judicial systems here and around or the world. we regret that carl couldn't be here today, but we are please pleased to have susan with us. susan, we owe tremendous thanks to you and carl. [applause] thank you for your vision and determination to advance the rule of law. i'd like to briefly introduce the first few speakers you will hear from. policer first, lisa kern griffin, distinguished professor of law at cook law school where she -- duke law school where she

teaches procedure, evidence and federal criminal justice. professor griffin clerked for justice o'connor in the 1997-1998 term. following professor griffin, we'll hear from if judge paul grimm, the david f. levy professor of the practice of law and director of the vulch institute at duke law school. the judge retired after 25 years as a federal district judge in maryland before joining us here at duke law last year. he will present the vulch prize to scott o'connor who will accept on behalf of his late mother, justice sandra day o'connor. scott o'connor recently retired from a career in commercial real estate in keeping with the lessons instilled in him by his parents, he is also a lifelong public servant having served two terms as city counselman and a volunteer in organizations, all while working continuously to preserve his mother's legacy. following remarks from mr. o'connor, david f. levy will

introduce the remainder of our program. david is the former dean of duke law school, the former director of the institute and a former chief united states district judge for the eastern district of california. he is now the president of the american law institute. thank you very much to all of our distinguished speakers and to all of you for being here today. now i will turn it over to professor griffin. [applause] >> good evening, everyone. it's a tremendous privilege to be here and to have a few minutes to say some words about working for justice o'connor. well, justice o'connor is rightly celebrated for expanding what was -- how remarkable she

was up close. she was more interesting than the icon that everyone could see from a distance because she contained some contrasts. she was, as a everyone knows, diligent and driven, but at no point did she ever exhibit any stress or urgency. as the chief justice said at her memorial service, her most common if piece of advice was just to get things done. she was incredibly focused and present and preternaturally calm. but calm and relaxed are not the same thing. [laughter] i would not describe justice to o'connor as relaxed. even the annual outing with her clerks that many people have mentioned to see the cherry blossoms at the tidal basin was a scheduled forward march

regardless of the inclement weather. [laughter] she was disciplined and precise, but she was never dour in any way. she was warm and joyful with a mischievous sense of humor. she loved a wicked joke or a silly skit. she laughed often, and she smiled with a sparkle in her eyes. she threw herself with vigor into riding horses, climbing mountains, playing sports or cards, cooking, entertaining and, of course, going out dancing with her beloved husband john. she was incredibly vivid, and every place she entered got a little bit brighter. so she was often called a force of nature. many of her clerks were reminded of this at an extraordinary moment that i want to share from her homecoming to the supreme court in december.

she loved the supreme court building. though she was a person of faith, her biographer, evan thomas, aptly described it as her marble temple. on this bright, cold and blustery day, she was carried up the steps for her lying in repose, and she approached the equal justice under law engraved on the west pediment of the court. her clerks, almost a hundred of us, lined the steps, and just as she reached the top, an enormous gust of wind swept over all of us and was later remarked on by almost every person standing there. it felt somehow fitting because justice to justice o'connor had momentum -- justice o'connor had momentum. she never looked back. she wasn't bitter about december advantages in the past -- disadvantages in the past. she didn't dwell on any can disappointments. she did not extend disagreements from one case to the next. she was always moving forward,

and she carried other people along with her. of course, she was a pioneer, but she was not a loner. she was generous and collaborative. she gave other people both the credit and the benefit of the doubt. her parting message was that we should all try to help others along the way. she really believed and she often said that we do not accomplish anything in this world alone. as just one example, when she received the assignments to draft a decision requiring the admission of women to the virginia military institute, justice o'connor immediately suggested that justice ginsburg write the landmark if discrimination opinion instead. and she said this should be ruth's. she was a connector for all of her colleagues. she got the supreme court justices to have up lunch together, and they still credit her with that tradition. she set an example for how to

engage with other people and sometimes find your way to a compromise. she was so vibrant that losing justice to goner even after -- o'connor even after a her long illness felt at first as though a light had gone out. i am grateful to have had the chance to stand in a little bit of that light for a little bit of time alongside my co-clerks. it was an extraordinary blessing, and i know that i am only one of so many because her example was amplified over thousands of people who knew and loved her. at a perhaps a disspiritting moment in our civic discourse, a spark of her optimism is a light that she left on. and that is icivics. she founded this resource to teach about the protections in our constitution.

she wanted school children to become committed citizens and not to take democracy for granted. and it now reaches almost 10 million users a year. i think the vul lch prize is an especially fitting honor because it recognizes how she advanced the rule of law by modeling for us civil discourse and by continuing to teach citizenship even now. i want to close by mentioning a second transcendent moment from justice o'connor's memorial in december. a gorgeous rendition of "america, the beautiful," was sung at the conclusion of her service. per her own request and plan. it was both moving and hopeful because though she was a clear-eyed pragmatist, she was also the most idealistic of american patriots.

she chose that song because she cherished her country. she embodies its sense of opportunity, and she left behind a road map for upholding its ideals. that is her true bequest to all of us, and it's what we are here to celebrate tonight. thank you. [applause] ♪ ♪ >> icivics is my most important legacy. i care about it a great deal. i think it matters. over half of u.s. middle school and high school students, is and that's great, i want to reach every one of them if i can. i want to see it used as an

educational tool for every student in all 50 states. i want students to learn how to -- [inaudible] works and how, in essence, they're part of it, they're part of what makes it function. but if they understand how it works, they can more easily become part of it. we need civic and political leaders in every level to take the up the notion of sieve ec education and make it -- civic education and make it a priority for every sunt in this -- [inaudible] it really is the key to keeping boeing in the right direction. we need teachers to consider the resources and to the expand on their methods of educating young people about how government works and how their participation will be critical throughout their lives. ♪

[background sounds] >> good evening. if each year the carl and susan vulch prize for the rule of law is a awarded to an individual or an organization that has demonstrated extraordinary dedication to the rule of law in advancing rule of law principles around the world. through this prize, we draw attention to the hard work that must be done to protect and fortify the constitutional structures and safeguards that undergird a free society. this is the mission if of the vulch judicial institute, to strengthen and sport the rule of law -- support the rule of law, to defend judicial independence and study ways to improve the law and our courts all as a means to better the human condition.

the institute builds on duke law school's strong and longstanding ties to the judiciary and the work of our extraordinary faculty. our work is both practical as well as scholarly, and it's an example of how we at duke can make a difference. by bringing together the generosity and vision of philanthropists like carl and susan, the curiosity and interests of our faculty and students and the leadership of people like you withp bring the academy and the real world together to achieve meaningful results. the recipients of the vulch prize reflect the same creativity and commitment to improving society through the rule of law. associate justice anthony n. kennedy was a recipient of the first vulch prize in 2019, and

if you look at your programs at the front, you'll see he is succeeded by an incredibly distinguished list of judges and organizations. today we are immensely honored to add the late supreme court justice sandra day o'connor to that list. justice o'connor was an extraordinary public servant, a lawyer, a state legislator, a judge and, of course, the first woman to serve on the united states supreme court. tonight we particularly honor her post-retirement work that was the capstone of a life dedicated to advancing and protecting the rule of law. finish justice o'connor realized better than most of us that without civically, a civically-informed public, the rule of law cannot thrive. and in order for the public to have faith in our judicial system which itself is essential

the maintaining our democratic form of government, people must first understand how the three branches of government work together. so in 2006 she launched the civics education movement. since that time it has engaged millions of young people and adults in learning about a america's founding principles and government institutions. through icivics, the nonprofit organization she founded in 2009 to to provide free civics resources for students, teachers and families, justice o'connor revolutionized the teaching of sieve ecs for students of -- civics for students of all agings. icivics now reaches nearly 10 million students annually with an array of games, lesson plan, stories and videos. we are pleased to have molly morrison, the chief development

officer of icivics, with us this evening and to recognize the outstanding work that icivics continues to do in educating young people and inspiring and leading a national coalition of civic education organizations that are carrying justice o'connor's vision forward. we are so proud to honor justice sandra day o'connor's lifetime devotion to advancing and protecting the rule of law. both as a political and i judicial leader and as the architect of a renewal of civics education within our country. and so it's with great pleasure that i ask her son, mr. scott o'connor, to come forward and accept this prize if on her behalf and then to share some remarks about her remarkably inspirational life. scott, can we get you to come forward? [applause]

>> thanks to paul grimm, melinda meyers and erin -- of the vulch institute for carrying on the work here, the importance of which is pulley appreciated by too few americans. i was delighted to learn that paul had experience as a jag officer just like my dad did with some time near where mom and dad lived together in post-war germany almost at the same time, when he was very young. terrific coincidence there. our deepest thanks from the if o'connor family go to susan and

carl vulch. the description of the vulch institute and its goals appears to me as having possibly actually been written by mom if as her dream for a legacy institute to carry on her most important interests. your gift creating the institute was made the same year that mom's dementia caused her to withdraw from the public eye. otherwise, she would have happily traveled to durham to meet you and thank you personally for what you're doing. i'm honored to accept the award for her. thanks to chief justice john roberts, who happens to be here tonight, the current court term has been unusually quiet and uninteresting -- [laughter] leaving him with plenty of leisure time for travels, right? [laughter] all right. we'll move on from that. we won't answer that one. [laughter] rhetorical question. the chief was gracious in

hosting mom's lying in repose ceremony at the court in december and giving a beautiful, heart felt eulogy the following day at national ca a three drag. our family finished that week in december knowing that mom was bid farewell in spectacular fashion with due respect for her place many history as a friend -- in history as a friend and role model to many here and abroad. others tonight have already addressed mom's stunning success with icivics. if i wanted to the add to the record on a couple of other topics. very briefly on my role in all of this is that when mom left the court in 2006, i told her that if she were to go on the rubber chicken circuit giving speeches for money, i could make a very comfortable living as her agent. [laughter] we both laughed knowing the answer. she said that doing so would

diminish her own legacy of -- and that of the course itself. she had no idea then of icivics and where that would lead her and our country. so she made a very wise choice there at that fork in the road, and i want to emphasize most of you probably would just assume this, but the rest of america doesn't know this about mom. she never took a dime from icivics. she has 10 million customers a year, that's a big business. she wasn't interested in being paid. she did it because that was the right thing to do. that's how she was wired. she wasn't -- none of this sufficient she ever did was because of the money. it was because it was the right thing to do. so on mom's years in the court and well into her retirement, more than any other person she carried the message here and abroad that we need to treasure the rights that are guaranteed

by our constitution and recognize that jewish do additional independence and the rule -- judicial independence and the rule of law are in her words tremendously hard to create and easier than most people imagine to damage or destroy. for years we marveled at the time and energy she was willing to spend doing whatever she could to help both established and emerging democracies. her travel and efforts were legendary. many know that she spoke in all 5 50 states here, but those speeches spanned the globe. why did she give so much, and how was she able to do it? it wasn't required by her job on the court. she did not benefit financially. she didn't do it for the pleasure of the travel. her trips were often physically and emotional ally demanding. she did all of it to further her deeply-held belief that we are entitled to be governed by a system of democratically-enacted laws that are applied fairly,

uniformly and transparently by impartial courts. much of this work was done under the auspices of the american bar association's central and eastern european law initiative, ceeli, which began after the breakup of the soviet union and those satelliten countries had to create new legal systems outside of the communist regime. ceeli is now renamed the rule of law initiative. mom was the very first outside board member when the bar association launched the project. the man who had the task of recruiting a board thought that if mom, who was -- and he was a partner of dad's in washington. so he had an in. he thought if he could get mom, other board members would follow. so mom understood that, said yes. she never missed a meeting in about 20 years whether in the u.s. or in country, overseas in

eastern europe. speaking in 199 7 at one of the ceeli events, she described in her usual clear style what countries need to construct, a system based on the rule of law. there must be guarantees that action cannot be taken by a government against its citizens except on the basis of clear laws properly adopted and publicly available. provision must be if made for free and fair if elections of legislators and leaders. a wall of legal protection if must be built to allow citizens to live, to speak, to worship, to work and the travel -- to travel as they see fit without fear of the state. the legal rights of citizens must be enforceable in fair and competent courts of law. this message wasn't new, but the fact that the message came from her made a difference. of course, her position mattered. she was a justice on the united states supreme court. but she brought more than just

the title. she brought her sincere, deeply-held belief in the importance of the rule of law, judicial independence, and their impact on human rights. it was apparent to anyone who spoke with her that it was a position based on principle and not a position taken for personal or political gain. equally important to her effectiveness was her unique act to establish real connections with those whom she met. lisa touched on this. her impact depended as much on her personal warmth and ability to relate to others as on her professional expertise. she traveled not to lecture, but to discuss and learn together. during meetings she listened intently, yesterday effectively, took copious notes and gave advice, not directives. she understood that the judicial approach and practices that worked best here in the u.s. may not be the best for others, and she conveyed that i

understanding -- that understanding and its acceptance. some of you may have been present during the her meetings with colleagues and leaders in other countries, and you know that as the discussion went on, it became a real exchange among colleagues, not a lecture from the visitor from the u.s. supreme court. her meetings with others were as impact ifful for her as for others in the meetings. many colleagues recall speaking with her on occasions after she'd been to the an emergence democracy and came back home, describing these rips focusing not on -- trips focusing not on what she had done, but on the a may amazing bravery and dedication of those she met. ..

[applause] good evening. it is special for me be here. we are on who admired his so much. introducing our next speaker in jane roberts is here, chief justice roberts grew up in indiana from the college and

harvard law school. i'd like to think i met the chief justice when he was a good undergraduate. following that is the cofounder from the judicial institute here will offer closing remarks chief

justice roberts. [applause] [applause] .net. [applause] >> thank you for that kind introduction and congratulations for working the rule of law justice o'connor. i met justice o'connor 43 years ago at the department of justice where he played a minor role preparing to join the supreme were. she was on the bench for mike supreme court argument showing little regard for all that i've done to get her there.

february exposure to smoke together on the court o'connor with o'connor, that included direct engagement. i felt that she felt she had a response ability. the in this position to be out

there in the world engaging with all that is there. it became a lot bigger. one in 1930 o'connor grew up in arizona. 1950 enrolled in law school became a member of the law review. the two women in the class many years later.

important is. [laughter] forty-six years later just as o'connor said it and for law school. for law school students, let me assure you just as o'connor's expression is not will look into so good her husband to germany, they made a splash on the social circuit was appointed to the senate and 69 and one reelection.

then she became a judge in 1975 and she is to become arizona court of appeals. she was captured in this famous picture in pictures of her now i will and she will look like and will still say it. [laughter] ronald reagan nominated o'connor

to be associative the supreme court to help with the confirmation process the attorney general systems, this photo was taken in the attorney general's conference room, attorney general stanford grad by her side. on the bottom left and 43 years. next to me is the assistant general the legislative affairs and cannot identify the person across from me in the suit. normally could have gotten away with that suit. looking just as o'connor in the country got into seeing her at work prove we have zoomed in on

the book in the back and you know it's her first day on the supreme court because what he says mock guide to the supreme court that she learned very quickly. she is typing away sizable machine get an idea of what you told me about. supreme court building initiates the ranch on. white water rafting with her clerks.

the worker went to extra curricular activities when i would build and the guards will offer they are in pasadena just after she tossed the going of the 117 rose bowl parade. flyfishing and alaska they each declared in the background. you tell you, walk away calmly.

the one who nominated her but and justice sandra happy new year's eve and the closing the one george w. bush and barack obama will middle of and the pilgrim because she sometimes quotes and for all film footage to follow. she was out there doing things got a lot more professor, the most powerful woman in america is the most powerful woman in great america looking happy

enough but not generally mark elizabeth the second and vice president cheney. specifics conversation called freedom swing. it has complied. here she is with berkeley. sir charles and seems unsure about whether to return to high-five or not. [laughter] king john at the shakespeare theater. have no idea what it signifies that i will justice breyer i

shared it with everybody here. [laughter] justice o'connor visiting chief justice from their insisting they needed to see it to understand our country and that she needed to take him there right away. but of course what made practice of our special wish he had time for others regardless whether they were famous. he or she is a good handle on the shoulder of a young girl working on a computer.

such genuine smiles on the picture in the whole hand on the shoulder active doses in 2006 size sitting on federal courts around the country to an extent justices have since the earliest days of the republic and she traveled the world see the fire others expanded to reach going digital walking isaacson 2009 at serving the democracy is not passed down, they must be taught and learned by each new generation. today it is so fittingly stowed

on getting that done. in celebration of life's work close to the supreme court building and justice o'connor spanish. and expanded the public image of what it meant to look like a

judge. what it means to be a citizen to do something about that. i would like to end with one for the final time remember justice is passing the buck rising o'connor's contributions to our country, i would like to express appreciation and get to public service during her lifetime. so glad have our thanks.

thank you all very much. [applause] [applause] >> next week we bring you live a moral argument from the supreme court starting monday when the justices consider a case regarding the fda's rejection of flavored vape products. that is live at 10 a.m. eastern on c-span. lateinhe week, there is a case questioning the constuonality of a tennessee ban on gender affirming care. you can follow tha live dnday at 10 a.m. eastern on c-span three. and a reminder, these orel

arguments are also available on our free mobile video app, c-span now, or online at c-span.org. >> according to brown university professor corey brettschneider the following presidents threatened democracy. " john adams waged war on the national press prosecuting as many as 126 who dared criticize him. james you can included with supreme court to deny personhood to african-americans. andrew johnson urged violence. woodrow wilson nationalized jim crow by segregating the federal government and finally richard nixon committed criminal acts ordering the watergate break in. he teaches constitutional law at

brown university. >> professor brettschneider with his book the presidents of the people on this episode of book notes plus. it's available on the c-span now free mobile app or wherever you get your podcasts. >> c-span is your unfiltered view of government. we are funded by these television companies and more, including charter communications. >> charter is proud to be recognized as one of the best internet providers. we're just getting started. building 100,000 miles of new infrastructure to reach those who need it most. >> charter communications supports c-span as a public service, along with these other televion providers, giving you a front row seat to democracy. >> a former inmate who gave

birth while incarcerated testified in a senate hearing on the mistreatment of pregnant women in prisons. the senate judiciary subcommittee on human rights and law also heard from the mother of an inmate who gave birth to a newborn in a prison toilet. this hour and 45 minute hearing was chaired by georges senator jon ossoff. conversations] >> the subcommittee on human rights and the law will come to order. welcome all got in particular to our witnesses. and before we begin i want to take a moment to acknowledge your bravery and your courage in testifying today. we appreciate what it takes for you to be here, addressing a very difficult and personal subject in a public forum like this. at a do want to advise those in

attendance and those tuned in across the nation that this is difficult subject matter, and viewer and lesser discretion advised for that reason. in february of this year as chair of the human rights subcommittee, i launched an investigation into state prison and jail conditions for pregnant and postpartum women. the subcommittee conducted site visits and interviewed more than 100 formerly and currently incarcerated women cos civil rights and criminal defense attorney, medical providers, advocates, dual was caught and academics. our also reviewed federal lawsuits and relevant public reports from the last six years, find what i i believe to be significant and pervasive abuse and mistreatment of pregnant and postpartum women behind bars.

the subcommittee has identified more than 200 reported human rights abuses against pregnant and postpartum women at state prisons and jails nationwide. we've heard from mothers forced to give birth in prison showers, hallways or on dirty cell floors. mothers who gave birth into toilets after being told they were not in labor and that they should call quote call lie down and go back to their cells. mothers who gave birth in their underwear after prison staff refused to help them and told them instead, quote, don't have that baby. and, quote, you're not even pregnant. in all cases we reviewed these women repeatedly requested and even begged for help, but help

came too late, if at all, and in several cases their babies did not survive. we heard from others whose infants were immediately taken away from them. the subcommittee received numerous reports that generally infants born in the facility are taken from their mothers within one day of birth. and that their mothers often went months and sometimes even years without knowing what happened to their children. we heard from postpartum mothers who were placed in solitary confinement within days of giving birth without any medical care or mental health support. we heard from women who were shackled around their stomachs, wrists and feet during pregnancy and birth, reportedly causing injuries and miscarriages. while 41 u.s. states reportedly have laws that prohibit or

restrict such shackling, the subcommittee identified apparent violations in at least 16 of these states. the rights of women to humane prison conditions and adequate healthcare are recognized under the u.s. constitutions eighth amendment, the international covenant on civil and political rights, the united nations convention against torture, the nelson mandela rules of the bangkok rules, among other international standards. the testimony and evidence we will here today, however, presents a shocking and horrifying picture of pervasive abuse and mistreatment of pregnant women in american prisons and jails. the subcommittee will or testimony from a woman who endured appalling conditions while pregnant and postpartum, including weeks of solitary confinement within days of giving birth. the subcommittee will also hear testimony from a mother of the woman who gave birth into a prison toilet, after her pleas

for medical attention were ignored by prison staff. again i want to thank you both sincerely for your courage in sharing what you and your families have experienced. we will also hear from an ob/gyn physician who can speak to the inhumane conditions faced by pregnant incarcerated women across the country, and the tragic consequences for their health and safety. this is an active and ongoing inquiry by the subcommittee. we will continue to investigate human rights violations against pregnant and postpartum women in george's prisons and jails, and nationwide. i would like to thank my senate colleagues who have worked tirelessly to improve the conditions of our present engines, including chair durbin, senator booker, and senator blumenthal. i'm grateful that we have all three distinguished senators with us here this afternoon, and i'd like to yield now to chair

durbin for his opening remarks. >> i do want to postpone the actual testimony, but this is a continuing challenge. we all know that famous quote which said basically you can measure the degree of civilization in the country by the way they treat people in prison. my feeling is that every member of congress, house and senate,, should visit the prison at least once every two years. we end up passing laws that relegate people to live in these institutions. we should know what's actually going on. senator ossoff, you have been a real leader on this and want to thank you and senator booker and senator blumenthal and senator klobuchar, the whole democratic side of the committee has paid special attention to this issue. thank you for this hearing today. >> thank you, chair durbin. senator booker, chair of the crime subcommittee for your opening remarks come up with. >> thanks much, chairman ossoff. i want to thank the chairman of the full committee whose u.s. welcome, who's been a part of

silly of these issues. it's frustrating to me because our society is turning a blind eye to the treatment and experience of incarcerated individuals. it's stunning that things have been allowed to happen in our prisons and jails throughout our country that do not align with our values. an often put us as outliers in the developed world for how people are treated behind bars. we are especially culpable for overlooking complex challenges and barriers faced by pregnant and postpartum women while incarcerated. i came to this issue many years ago from honestly a place of ignorance. i-40 since i was a law student in prisons and have been visiting prisons regularly since then trying to reform our system and going to jails and prisons. but one day it was pointed out to me by a woman formerly incarcerated woman that i've never ever in my 20 years of visiting prisons into facility specifically for women. so i visited.

when i visited that the suddenly was shaken to my core. i sat down with women who begin to tell me stories that were unacceptable, things like making their own tampons so they could save money to be able to call their children when those calls were charged in user berates. in particular with the facility i visited shirt because i will never forget this tough warden looking at me when i asked her how many of the women here were survivors of sexual violence? and she said 95% of the women are survivors of sexual violence. the united states, this land of the free call is home to one out of every three incarcerated women worldwide. in the past four decades the number of incarcerated women in the united states has increased by a staggering 585%, an issue that directly compounds of this is a fact that united states has already has for all women the highest maternal mortality rate

amongst all income, high income nations. but this problem is obviously worse for pregnant women in our prisons. studies show they have a higher likelihood the non-incarcerated pregnant women of experiencing adverse maternal health outcomes like maternal mortality and morbidity. this and the reality is that exist in our system right now or unacceptable. every human being, especially those in the united unit, should have quality healthcare. that right does not disappear when we go behind prison walls. this is why when i first became a senator a decade ago i fought to improve the treatment of incarcerated women who are pregnant. back in 2017 2017 i introde dignity for incarcerated women act with a group of extraordinary champions from elizabeth warren to then senator kamala harris'. we fought for and secured the

addition of a criminal piece of legislation in the first act that prohibits the shackling of pregnant women in federal custody except in certain limited cases. and more recently i teamed up with representative pressley, lauren underwood and alma adams agreed that justice for incarcerated moms act. this bill will incentivize states to follow our lead in the first act and in the practice of shackling pregnant women once and for all. it provides funding for pregnant and postpartum women who are incarcerated to access do lose, mental health counseling, healthy food and nutrition education come maternal infant bonding opportunities and more to support a healthy pregnancy and birth. this bill is an integral piece of the mom the legislation introduced with lord underwood and alma adams that would -- of death in the united states and make critical investments and addressing the social

determinants of health and disparities in mental health care and outcomes. as today's hearing will illustrate in painful, wretched realities, pregnant women in prisons are subject to great injustices. what gives me hope is that more than 80% of pregnant related deaths are preventable. we have the resources to save the lives of pregnant women and and the maternal health crisis, and help for the birth of healthy children. you cannot say in america that you are pro-life and allowed the horrors that are going on right now in america prisons to continue. federal action is needed to ensure that we treat incarcerated women with the dignity they deserve. action is needed to save lives. thank you, mr. chairman. >> thank you, senator booker. i'll now introduce eyewitnesses and then they will be sworn in.

thank you again for joining us today ms. jessica umberger is a mother and care navigator at the policing alternatives and aversion initiative. she survived pregnancy, giving birth and postpartum recovery while incarcerated in her home state of georgia. ms. karine laboy is the mother of schiano laboy the gipper inside the york correctional facility in niantic connecticut. and dr. carolyn sufrin is an associate professor of obstetrics and gynecology at johns hopkins school of medicine and an associate professor of health, behavior and society at the bloomberg school of public health and a fellow at the american college of obstetricians and gynecologists or if you would all please rise and raise your right hand.

[witnesses were sworn in] >> let the record reflect all witnesses answered in the affirmative. you may take your seats. and when you're ready, ms. umberger, we will begin with your opening statement. just a friendly reminder to the witness to make sure your microphones are active when you're speaking, and don't feel pressed for time. we want to hear from you. ms. umberger, when you're ready, please. >> okay. good afternoon, now. first i would like to thank you all for allowing me this time to speak in this space.

my name is jessica drew umberger. i am a mother and proudly working at policing alternatives and diversion initiative, also known as pad, in atlanta, georgia. in 2017 and 18, i was pregnant while serving a five-year sentence at home facility and what they call the medical facility for the georgia department of corrections. those nine months pregnant in prison, and everything that followed, was the worst experience of my entire life. at helms, they treated us like animals. i was there for nine months and i saw several babies born in the hallway when i was there. i remember women screaming for help and praying out loud for medical attention. all of us were scared, stressed, and vulnerable.

i remember a woman in the room next me screamed, help, i'm having my baby. the nurse on duty shouted shut up, you will see a doctor in the morning. the woman ended up giving birth on the bathroom floor. sometimes people got lucky and the doctor would get there just in time to catch the baby. i remember praying god please don't let that be me. the officers played mean tricks by announcing at 4:00 am, wake up. you've got breakfast from waffle house. we would rush down the same hallway only to find there wasn't any waffle house. they'd laugh at our confusion and disappointment. they also didn't properly feed us at all. our food consisted of watered down greens and soy patties

which left us all very hungry. this food tasted awful, and the cheese bread was extra food we got because we were pregnant with so bad i still can't get the taste out of my mouth. i was most scared the morning i was to give birth. i was told by prison staff that because i had a c-section 18 years prior it was georgia department of corrections policy that i had to have another one. even though i told them i wanted to have a vaginal birth, they told me it was not allowed. it is my strong belief that the prison staff wanted me to have a c-section to fit my birth into their hospital transport schedule. god had other plans. i ended up with pre-eclampsia and had to be rushed to a hospital.

this is where my trauma turned for the worse. i was dropped off with officers i did not know at the hospital and was in a surgery room surrounded by strangers, doctors who never examined me and nurses i never met. when i explained to the doctor that i was told i had to have a c-section but that i wanted a natural birth, the doctor said it sounded like coercion to him. my beautiful jordyn was born august 15, 2018. i had only two short hours to hold and look at my baby. this would be the last time i would see her for a few years. three years, about three years. we were then separated, she was taken to the neonatal unit and i was taken to a dark basement. where they kept the incarcerated

people. in the basement, i was transferred from the rolling bed to a stationary bed. i had to be helped by a couple of nurses as i could not feel my legs. i remember the nurse asking the male sergeant to step out so she could clean me up, and he replied, i can't do that . she looked me in the eyes and quietly said -- she said i'm sorry, and proceeded to clean my private areas while the male sergeant watched. the next few days i remember random men looking every hour into the small window of the locked door.

i remember seeing feet of people walking by my cage window and thinking, if people only knew what was happening down here, what would they say? would they even care? i was being transported to lee arrendale state prison three days after giving birth. i asked if i could see my baby and tell her goodbye, but the transporting officers told me it would be in my best interest not to say goodbye. they wouldn't even provide an update on how she was doing. once i arrived at lee arrendale i was placed in the infirmary and in a room with a woman who had mrsa. this made me very uneasy as i had a large open wound in my abdomen. i asked for cleaning products

and was given a thumb nail sized amount of bleach in a pill cup. i was not given my property and therefore could not shower properly. i had been wearing the same underwear from the day i gave birth and did not have a change when i would ask for pads, i was given one, maybe two if i was lucky. i must have complained too much about the room being unsanitary because i was told to grab my bedding, and then i was taken to lockdown, where i was left for three weeks. i was put in solitary when my baby was only five days old. in solitary confinement, i had no medical support, the staples in my stomach from the c-section had not dissolved, and there was no air conditioner.

hot, laying there in august, trying to heal, my c-section wound became infected. i didn't know how i was going to make it. to tell the truth i didn't think i would make it out of there alive. no one ever checked on my mental health post pardon. my six week check up consisted of a doctor asking, how are you? when i said fine, he said, ok good. when i was finally sent back to the general population, i spent a couple weeks in a cell where i had to sleep on the floor because i physically could not climb into the top bunk. i came home in april of 2022 and it was clear that my kids have been serving time, too. they had five homes during their three years in foster care and they were traumatized.

i was desperate to sit my family back together but finding housing, finding housing something that was necessary if i is going to get my kids out of foster care was difficult with a criminal record. i must have applied for over 30 apartments, and have repeatedly, was repeatedly denied before i finally purchased my home. i had a mission, to get home and get my children back. i achieve my mission. today we are living together and we're all healing. write it was so clear my kids were punished along with me. they never had been roller skating, never learned how to ride a bike, or swim. they tell me they'd sit in a room all day in foster care. no opportunities, no activities. nobody took them to the movies. i served my time, but my

children and i will never fully be finished with my sentence. i am hopeful that my testimony will make a difference and that we might work together on alternatives that heal instead of harm families. >> thank you so much, ms. umberger. ms. laboy, when you're ready. >> good afternoon, everyone. and thank you for the opportunity to address you today. my name is karine laboy, and i reside in new britain, connecticut. my daughter has been incarcerated at york correctional institute in

connecticut, since august 2017. my daughter was around six weeks pregnant when she entered your correctional. i stand before you today as a mother and grandmother to tell you about our family's experience. from the moment my daughter entered york, her pregnancy added a layer of fear and uncertainty to our lives. communication with her was very restricted, and i was denied contact for several weeks. when i finally heard her voice, she expressed a lot of distress and fear of being alone. she told me about times where she was denied adequate nutrition and medical attention. she was even threatened with solitary confinement for requesting to be sent to the infirmary. the prison staff forced her to

choose between phone calls and recreation time, a cruel decision for any expecting mother. as my daughter's pregnancy progressed, i attended every court hearing, hoping to see her and reassure myself of her well-being. every time i saw her in court, she looked sick, sweating a lot while hunched over. it was heartbreaking to witness her in heavy metal shackles around her belly and ankles, a practice that continued throughout her pregnancy. the darkest moments began in early february 2018 when, for two agonizing weeks, i received no word from my daughter. the days that followed were chaotic and deeply distressing. the connecticut department of children and families called me

and informed me that she had given birth. dcf asked to meet me at my home to fill out paperwork so i could go meet my granddaughter. shortly after filling out the papers, i learned that my granddaughter was in the nicu for being born premature, underweight, and malnourished. when i went to the hospital, dcf met me there so i could meet my granddaughter. during the custody process, i learned that my daughter had been medically neglected and that my granddaughter was born in the prison, not in the hospital like i thought. i was confused and scared. i knew my daughter was nearby because a nurse told me she

had put a big red bow in my granddaughter's hair. i felt relieved to know my daughter saw my granddaughter but nobody would tell me anything about my daughter or granddaughter. i could not see or talk to my daughter. i later learned that she was shackled to her hospital bed for four days postdelivery, a practice that is not only inhumane but also illegal in connecticut. in march 2019, i learned for the first time the full extent of how my granddaughter was born, when my daughter initiated a lawsuit against the prison. the lawsuit settled a year later, revealed the horrifying

truth, my granddaughter was not born in a hospital as i had believed, but into a prison toilet after my daughter's desperate cries for help went unanswered. on february 9, my daughter started experiencing labor symptoms, abdominal pain, and discharge. medical and correctional staff dismissed her pleas, providing only a heating pad and instructing her to lie down for four more agonizing days. she told me she felt like a caged animal throughout her pregnancy at york, which pains me to this day. through the lawsuit i also learned that on february 13 my daughter began bleeding while using the toilet and called for help, but nobody responded. security camera footage shows my daughter placing a t-shirt between her legs and grasping

the prison walls for support as she tried to walk to breakfast. when she came back, she sat on the toilet. the t-shirt was completely bloody, and she began to scream for help when she realized her baby was coming. nobody came. my granddaughter was born into the toilet bowl. she was unresponsive and not breathing once she was outside my daughter. if not for my daughter's quick thinking and her cellmate's help to pat my granddaughter's back and get the water out of her, she would not be alive today. when prison staff finally arrived, their response was cruel and insensitive. they joked that my granddaughter took her first swim and proceeded to cut her umbilical cord inside the dirty prison cell, disregarding the dignity

and well-being of both mother and child. my daughter should have received proper medical care and support throughout her pregnancy, and my granddaughter should have been born in a safe and sanitary environment, not a prison cell. this experience has left us scarred and deeply distrustful of a system that failed to protect my daughter's basic human rights. no family should endure what mine has suffered. prisons must do better to ensure families are informed throughout a woman's pregnancy and to prioritize the health and well being of both mother and child. my daughter was deprived of the medical care she desperately needed. no human being should endure such cruelty and neglect. no mother or grandmother should feel as helpless as i have felt. i urge this subcommittee to let

my family's ordeal serve as a spark for change, and compassion in our criminal justice system. i want to thank you for allowing me to share my daughters and my granddaughters story today. thank you so much. >> thank you so much, ms. laboy. doctor suffern, your opening statement, please. >> good afternoon, senators, thank you so much for the opportunity to speak with you today. my name is carolyn suffern. on the board-certified obstetrician gynecologist and a phd researcher at johns hopkins school of medicine. most of the with the american college of obstetricians and gynecologists and i spent the last 17 years working to understand and improve care and conditions for pregnant and postpartum incarcerated women. i provide clinical care inside r joke conducting extensive research, publishing over 80 peer-reviewed articles and writing national guidelines on

best practices for care for this population, and the fuse on expressing today i have my own and do not necessarily reflect those of johns hopkins university or johns hopkins medicine. so i got into this work was called to a delivery when i was a first-year ob/gyn resident doctor in training in pennsylvania. everything about the ring was as usual. there were ivey poles, fetal heart rate monitors and a mother about to push the baby into the world. but one thing was different. the mom to be with shackled to the bed. nothing in my training had prepared me for this moment. and since that night 20 years ago i contacted dozens of research studies that have revealed systematic decision deficiencies in care for incarcerate, pregnant and postpartum women. as i begin to provide ob/gyn care any county jail i tried to find out how many pregnant women aren't frustrated and how many give birth while they're in custody. what i found was shocking. there were no such statistics.

this was in 2015, less than ten years ago. so my team at johns hopkins conducted the pregnancy and present statistics, or pits study, from 2016-2017, 22 state prison systems, the federal period of prisons and the five largest jails reported monthly pregnancy outcome data to our study. we found that in just that one year there were 3018 admissions of pregnant patients to these facilities, and over 1 million of these pregnancies ended in custody with 897 births. now when we extrapolate these data nationally we estimated there are nearly 58,000 admissions of pregnant women to u.s. jails and prisons each year. and yet pips was a one-time study, could not include all 50 states or all 3000 plus jails. and so the remains today nofo

national account of pregnancy and birth in prisons and jails. so if we don't know how many pregnant women are behind bars, and people think they don't exist. if people think they don't exist, then it makes it easy for prisons and jails to neglect their healthcare needs, as you heard so tragically today. and indeed this is what my and others' research has shown and what you've already heard from ms. laboy and ms. umberger. there are no mandatory standards for pregnancy care of prisons and jails must follow. some research has shown access to such care is variable, often substandard, or even absent. for instance, in a survey my team conducted of all u.s. jails, only 31% did routine pregnancy testing within two weeks of arrival. so if jails don't test for pregnancy, then they can proceed as though there are no pregnant women in custody. this means many pregnant patients will have time sensitive medical needs that go

unaddressed. my research is also documented alarming deficiencies in life-saving care for the estimated 8000 incarcerated pregnant women with opioid use disorder. although the long established standard of care in pregnancy is treatment with methadone or buprenorphine, international survey of jails, only 32% of them provided pregnant women with access to these medications. and even at the subtleties that did provide treatment in pregnancy, three-quarters of them forced patients to go off medications after the baby was born. this puts mothers and babies at risk for severe harm, including deadly overdose. and we know that opioid overdose is a leading cause of maternal mortality in the united states. now when it comes to the issue of shackling pregnant women, its well established that this increases the risks of medical arms during labor and threat pregnancy. as we've heard, 41 states and the district of columbia now have laws prohibiting the

practice. however, they are not always followed. in the pips study four department of corrections have policies or practices that violated state law and allowed shackling. i'm obstetrician colleagues in states with anti-shackling laws tell me of officers shackling pregnant patients all the time, over applying the exceptions that these laws have. the fact that in 2024, pregnant women are shackled while giving birth, putting them and her babies at risk, is a profound assault on their dignity, safety, and human rights. the time is long past due to change conditions for incarcerated pregnant and postpartum women. they deserve and have the right to access comprehensive quality medical care. we must recognize the connections between the mortality, maternal mortality crisis and incarceration, and we can start by collecting national scale data that link maternal

health outcomes with incarceration. he does without data we cannot know the full scope of the problems, and their solutions. our nation's conscience must see that what happens or does not happen to pregnant women behind bars is a human rights issue. the time to act is now. thank you. >> thank you, doctor sufrin. want to begin with a few questions and expression again of gratitude for sharing these incredibly dramatic and difficult personal stories with the public and the subcommittee. ms. umberger, did i hear you correctly that you endured solitary confinement for three weeks after giving birth without access to your infant? >> yes, sir. that is what happened.

in this room for solitary for three weeks, so many things were going through my mind. it was so hot in there, no air-conditioning. i would like at the bottom of the door for air. obviously i couldn't shower properly. i didn't even have my property. nobody would, could give me any, providing updates on how my daughter was doing. tucci passer hearing test? you know, did she, is she okay? yeah, i was scared. >> and you're still in the early days of feeling from surgery. >> absolutely. >> you testified that you are able to hold your newborn baby for just two hours after giving birth and that you didn't see her again for almost three years.

is that right? >> yes, sir. i had two hours to hold and look at her. i remember thinking just a pretty she was. like, i didn't deserve her. and i carried that memory. that's what i hold onto. >> ms. laboy, did i i understd correctly from your testimony that your granddaughter was born into a prison toilet after the prisoner medical staff ignored your daughters cries for help as she went into labor? >> yes, sir. prison staff ignored her for hours, four days. that particular morning she gave

birth into a bowl. she was ignored. my granddaughter was unresponsive. if it wasn't for my daughters quick thinking and the soma, i don't think my granddaughter would be here. >> and your daughter and her cellmate had to resuscitate -- >> yes, they did. my daughter did. the cellmate was behind the wall. she heard my daughter screaming for help, and she, , my daughter didn't know the baby wasn't crying. she was unresponsive, , so the summit was able to tell her through the wall to tap the baby and get the fluids out. >> and when the prison staff finally arrived, they ridiculed. >> it was too late. when they arrived -- [inaudible] >> they made a joke.

she took her first swim. >> after granddaughter have been born into prison told him that was response of the prison staff? >> yeah, they were very insensitive. they make jokes about it. >> when you learned as a parent and as a grandparent the circumstances of your granddaughters birth, how did you react, , how did that make u feel as a human being? >> it hurts. it was painful. she, actually my first grandchild, my daughter's first child. i felt helpless to know that my daughter was scared, alone. that they ignore her. they disregarded her. they were very insensitive. so it really hurts me as her mother to know that they treated her like this. >> dr. sufrin, the subcommittee

received dozens of reports. i want to emphasize that for my colleagues on the subcommittee. we are hearing some very powerful personal testimonies. the subcommittee has received dozens of reports from currently in formally incarcerated women that he went into labor and then they were told they needed to wait sometimes for days or a a week just to see a physician. you testified that access to health care may be variable substandard or even absent. i presume this means, doctor, some state prisons and just don't always have any qualified medical staff on-site? >> thank you, senator, for your question. and yes, that is true. many jails especially small rural jails genetic medical staff on-site 24/7. and in those cases it's the custody officers who should always refer pregnant women with

issues such as labor to a qualified medical provider or call 911. but that doesn't always happen. a 2019 report from from the prison policy initiative reviewed policies at 50 state department of corrections and the federal bureau of prisons. they found 24 states the not even codify that if they had pre-existing arrangement for where they would take pregnant women in labor. imagine that, no formal policy or protocol for where they would take a pregnant woman if she went into labor. they also found that 23 states policies didn't include screening and treatment for high risk pregnancies. but even at facilities that do have medical staff on-site, the correctional officer still the first point of contact. you can't just pick up the phone and call your obstetrician or your midwife or get yourself to a hospital labor and delivery unit. so correctional officers are tasked with triaging and being the gatekeepers to medical care,

and their sort of tasked with acting in the role of the nurse when you don't have any medical training to know when someone is having a pregnancy emergency or when they're in labor. what that looks like, you've heard what that looks like, is that someone could be neglected either intentionally or due to the lack of knowledge of the custody staff and she delivers in herself. >> thank you, dr. sufrin. chair durbin. >> after the drafting of the constitution, the decision was made to would be the bill of rights. ten provisions that are so basic and fundamental to the united states that there are set out in detail as part of our constitution. the eighth amendment to the constitution provides excessive bail shall not be required nor excessive fines imposed, nor cruel and unusual punishment

inflicted. what have we heard today? is what we've heard is not cruel and unusual, god help me, can't imagine to endanger the lives of a new infant, to endanger the life of the mother. dr. sufrin, it seems to go beyond the physical, trying to measure the mental distress that ms. umberger, ms. laboy.org and others are going through at a time when they should be joyous, bringing new life in this world. can you speak to that issue? >> thank you, senator, for your question. and guess i can. 70% of incarcerated women have mental health conditions even before they go through, if there pregnant, the trauma of birthing behind bars. so when you add to that the trauma, the degradation, the physical harm, that compounds and that can cause additional

harm and psychiatric and mental health conditions as well. >> we think we are so enlightened, this generation of political leaders, myself included, because we speak and honest terms about mental illness, treating it, making sure that her health insurance covers it, being open about the aspect of trauma in what it does to a person's mind. we go through episodes of violence, crime, murder, and much of it is traced back to trauma that these young people experienced in early life. what i hear described today is trauma to these two witnesses, one, her daughter, and ms. umberger personally, have gone through in their lives. her daughter was facing a a s, ms. umberger as well. that sentence did not include trauma and mental distress and cruel punishment. in fact, there is a

constitutional guarantee that would not happen. ms. umberger, it's painful to even ask this question. but is your daughter put in foster care during the time that you didn't see her? >> yes, sir. >> and what is her status today? >> she's home. she's with her father. she lives with him full-time. they gave him full custody while i was still incarcerated. >> is it customary for the children to be put in foster care in these circumstances? >> i'm happy to add to the question, durbin. it depends. if there is a family member who is able to care for that infant, then that is what happens. but many people do not have a trusted individual who has the resources and ability to care for a newborn. and in that case, yes, , the default is to come