[ ♪ theme music ♪ ] >> gavin: hello, and as always thank you for watching the show. this week on current tv we've been hearing a lot about feeding the needy, it's our week long series looking at hunger in our country and the world today. we want to go beyond looking at the problem. we want to look at solutions. one of them is dr. dean ornish using food as preventive message. you can't miss his insights on making a mild lifestyle change can make a huge impact on your life. and then bill shore, founder of a non-profit that works tirelessly to end hunger in the united states.

joining bill, a national partner in the program. we'll discuss discussions to hunger here. and then raj patel. some call raj the rock star of social justice writing. we'll begin with dr. dean ornish ornish. doctor, it's great to have you on the show. thank you for coming on. two-thirds of americans are overweight or obese. half of us are on diets. close to 50 million people struggle other the year to get adequate nourishment. what do you make of this reality, this polarity when it comes to hunger and disease. >> one out of five people go to bed hungry here tonight even

here in the bay area that is oh affluent. there are problems of over nutrition and under nutrition. and it's not just how much we eat but what we are eating. we found the average person who goes through our program loses 18 pounds on average. we know what to do. it's a question of making it possible for people to do that. >> gavin: what is it? we've seen the number of food stamp recipients up to 46.4 million people, dramatic increases over the last five years. when you think of public policy and you've been a leader in terms of exercising your point of view and influenceing policymakers of all stripes in making policy. when you look at hunger and disease management $2.8 trillion is for chronic disease. how do we address that disconnect. >> you're right.

healthcare costs for chronic disease that is are largely preventiontive and reversible by changing diet and lifestyle. we just had an election and on one side are people who say raise taxes and let the deficits go up. others say dismantle medicare and privatize it. neither are very good. there is a third alternative. if we can treat the underlying causes why people are sick which are those diet and lifestyle choices we make each day we can provide care for lower costs. >> gavin: you make this argument over and over for lower costs. so it's much easier to get a prescription for a pill. >> right. >> gavin: than to get a prescription to eat better and exercise and dramatically change your lifestyle. or am i other stating that? >> no, you're right. the idea of taking a pill and everyone will do it, but changing lifestyle is difficult and impossible.we're getting 85% adherence

to a much more intensive lifestyle program in places like pennsylvania nebraska. taking a pill is fear based. take this pill to prevent a heart attack down the road. but when you change your diet and lifestyle most people find they feel so much better so quickly it refrains the reason for changing from fear of dying to living. global warming is caused more from livestock than transportation combined. you know, so it's easy to get overwhelmed with what we're going to do with global warming the healthcare crisis.% the simple choices we make in

our lives etch day like what we put in our mouths can make a big difference. not only in your life but everyone's lives as well. >> gavin: two-thirds of americans are obese or overweight. you've been offering statistics on diabetes which is staggering. pre-diabetes and diabetes being half the population. >> it's about a third now. within eight years half of the american population will be diabetes and it costs $3.3 trillion clearly that's not sustainable. >> gavin: what are we doing? what is it about the american diet and the work that is--where we have fallen short in terms of reconciling this. in policies-making perspectives, but individually, why are we not taking heed of this reality. >> we need to stop subsidizing foods that are not good for you. change the farm bill making it less expensive. i work with the ceo of

mcdonald's to put salads on the menu. the burgers are subsidize. if you have a fixed income you're going to go with the cheaper food. the costs do not price into the real costs to society and health. what we're seeing there is a convergence of force. high tech medicine, angio angioplasties don't prolong life. we spend $60 billion on those. we did a randomized trial here at ucfs with the late chief of urology. what we could slow stop and reverse the progression of prostate cancer by simply changing diet and lifestyle.

we can reverse heart disease by changing lifestyle and diet. it's not like one diet and lifestyle program for heart disease, diabetes and prostate cancer. it's for all of these. over 500 genes were changed turning on the the good genes that protect you and turning off the bad genes that hurt you. and telemers, the ends of our chromosomes that dictate how long you will live. >> those arewe have found we can grow them longer. your brain can get bigger.

your skin grows. to not only live longer but to live so much better so quickly. it's worth doing. >> gavin: what are those practical steps. it sounds too good to be true. 90 days, dramatic improvements without going under a knife surgery without taking some pills that may or may not work. you may not be motived by. massive exercise sacrifice exercise excessively. the foods that we will be delayed and live the life of scarcity. >> am i going to live longer or will it seem longer. if you're trying to reverse heart disease but for most people one of the interesting findings in all of our studies the more you change, the more you improve the ways we can measure and the more you change your diet and lifestyle the better you feel. when you do this, i feel good,

when i do that, i don't feel so good. now if you have heart disease mostmost people within a few weeks have pain free. >> a few weeks of doing what. >> eating a healthy diet. doing simple yoga meditation, managing stress better. walking 20 minutes a day. having more love and intimacy in your life. >> gavin: if it's that easy and not denying necessarily offering an alternative that is liberating and impactful why are these trend lines going in the wrong direction in terms of americans? >> well, they're going--it's changing. finally after 16 years of review medicare is now covering our program. we've been training hospitals and clinics around the country. we've trained 55 and we'll train many more. if it's reimbursable, then it's

sustainable. why do people take so many pills? where are they prescribed those. if you're trained to use drugs and surgery as a doctor, that's what you do. but if we change reimbursement we use a paradigm of healthcare that is healthcare not just sick care that is more carrying and compassion. >> gavin: as we move towards the second term of president obama with the affordable healthcare act we'll have a different debate less access now and more of these points of principles, prevention and focusing on healthy lifestyles, the way to change--is that your hope. >> that's not only my hope, but that's what is happening. president obama appointed us with public health, and it's working. it's the only way to get out of

this mess. we can't keep doing what we're doing. >> gavin: what are the one or two most important things you can do to improve your health. >> it's really four things. what we eat. move towards a plant-based diet. there are protective substances in fruits and vegetables lemuems walking 20 to 30 minutes a day. not even all that fast or all that once. stress management, yoga, for example, and spending more time with your friend, family and loved ones. we feel like that's an luxury after we do the important stuff but that really is the important stuff. >> gavin: finally on the motion notion of hunger. i think the example of mc

mcdonald is a perfect one. the hamburger versus the salad. how do we reverse that? is it dramatically changing. subsidies or does it require something more than waiting for washington, d.c. and lobbyists and policymakers moving in that direction so we can address that issue, that disconnect between the have's and have not's in quality food. >> it's on a number of different levels. the first is from the stand point we live in the united states. our politicians, enough people care about this, we bring that to the forefront. these are human issues. it doesn't matter if you're red state, blue state republican or democrat, if you have kids, you may feel this is the first generation where kids live a shorter life than their parents. i would jump in front of a train for my kids. you would, we would do it if it would help them. michelle obama has done a great job in bringing this to the forefront. we need to change the agriculture bill and the food

bill and change the incentives because those don't really take into account the real costs of eating unhealthy foods. the third thing is you know, one of the most ways of healing your own self is to do something for someone else. that's why i'm on the board of the san francisco food bank. they're doing an amazing work feeding the hungry is primal thing. when you help someone else, it helps you. am i going to look out for number one or am i going to help other people? when you help someone else, helping those one out of five people in this country who go to bed hungry every night it helps you. >> no one stand taller than one when who bends on one need to lift someone up. >> exactly. >> gavin: dr. dean ornish makes it seem simple for adults to make modest diet changes for

lifelong results. but when you're poor you're likely to miss out from the beginning especially for a nourishing a developing brain and body. but first a quick break.

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ann, bill. thank you for being on the show. it's the theme of the week for us, and it you should be more than a week, but the issue isis hunger. overmany suffer from hunger and many suffering from obesity. what are do we do to reconcile this, and bill, start with you. the motto is about partnership scale and leverage. tell us about your efforts and how optimistic or pessimistic we shouldshould be. >> hundred we'rehunger in most countries is because of war or drought. we don't have those issues.

we even have programs in cool, cool lunch breakfast why are kids hungry. they were lacking access to these programs. a big part of our no kid hungry strategy is figureing out how to get kids enrolled for school breakfasts, summer meals, those types of things. >> gavin: it's from your perspective, it's not that we don't produce enough food. it's distribution. it's the ability to scale the ability of the delivery system. >> and poverty which does not get talked about much any more in politics. but we have 46 million americans on food stamps for the first time in the history of the country. half of them are children, and so when families are that low income they need this type of support. fortunately, we've got the programs in place to make it difference for them. we just got to find the ways to connect them. >> gavin: your success is leverages and partnering. one of those partners is open table. online reservation which has

taken off based out here in san francisco, and and a restauranteur i'm intimately familiar with the work you're doing. when did you decide it was in the best interest of the kids and the best interest of addressing this issue. >> we've been working with share strength for nearly a deck bait in various capacities but did not formalize that with a corporate relationship until a year ago. when we decided we really wanted to focus our philanthropic efforts on one particular cause. for us, you know, a company that celebrates dining out and the fabulous experience of sharing a meal with somebody, the cause really resonates. there are one in five kids in america believe it or not who don't know where their meal is coming from. we believe we can share our strength to help with something

like that. >> gavin: bill, you've been partnering with folks for years the american expression partnershipamerican express president.you've machine marketing many partnerships. open table and the context of that. what is the inspiration for those kinds of partnerships. it's a new frame in many respects for a non-profit to think a bill differently than a lot of non-profits think. >> when we started our organize we had a gut instinct that even if we were really good at getting charity dollars there wouldn't be enough charity to get what is needed on the skill that exists. what if it was a tax status, what if we could about a non-profit that instead of re redistributes wealth, creates wealth. we work with 15,000 chefs and

restaurant eueurs. we realized we had created an asset that had a real marketplace value. so let's say $350 million that we raised and spent since we started at least half is for marketing partnerships which means we're not competing with brother and sister non-profit organizations for philanthropic dollars. there are no strengths attached to those dollars. it created a different kind of model. non-profits can create wealth just like businesses can but it goes to the community in a different kind of wealth. >> gavin: president obama announced the ambitious goal in 2015 to end--not manage, not manage to reduce, but to end childhood hunger. an audacious goal of sorts especially in the winds of the

macroeconomic down turn. where are we in advancing thatl, the president's and yours. >> that's a great question, we don't talk about it as much except for open leadership at the open table. we're doing a program with walmart calls shopping matters. it's a nutritional education and planning program. if you're a family on food stamps and you're shown how to carve up a chicken you may carve a chicken whole and save $2. walmart in maryland, they trained 45 of their store managers in maryland to conduct tours for low-income families to go through the grocery section. they're the largest grocer in the country now. but to go through their grocery section and understand unit pricing and nutrition label and if they're on a limited income

what is the best healthy choice they can make for their family. this is the contribution to this effort that we wouldn't have thought otherwise. >> gavin: are you really that optimistic? we missed it in 2015 is that demoralizing from your perspective? is that an opportunity to address where what went wrong? is it possible to deal with this without dealing with the issue of poverty disease unemployment etc. >> i think it is possible. at one point seniors were the most vulnerable and lowest income demographic. we thought that wasn't right and we should change that with with social security and medicare and other things. i think we can do the same thing with kids. that doesn't mean that their families won't face issues of poverty. that doesn't mean that once we solve social hunger we won't

climb another hill. we'll need to. governors across the country businesses across the country saying we want to be part of this, and we know we can succeed. i'm very optimistic about childhood hunger. >> gavin: bill thanks some of for being here. ann for being here. your words to my mouth. big enough to matter. small enough to win. >> thank you. >> gavin: the paradox of obesity and starvation is a common theme tonight. as raj patel puts it, it's the battle between the stuffed and the starved. rage joins us right after a quick break.

>>there's not a problem that exists in america today that hasn't been solved by somebody somewhere. >>(narrator) share your views with gavin at politicallydirect.com, a direct line to the gavin newsom show. >>focus on the folks that are making a difference, that are not just dreamers, but doers.

>>(narrator) join the conversation. [ ♪ theme music ♪ ] >> gavin: remarkably for the first time in history there are more people fighting obesity than starvation. it's a stunning fact, and baseline for raj patel's best selling book "stuffed or starved." raj, thanks so much for joining us on this special show about food and hunger. "stuffed and starved." the book did extraordinarily well. we have close to a billion people who are malnourished of some sort. but over a billion some estimate 2 billion people who are obese over weight. how is that possible in a world of abundance to have that? >> it used to be the case, and you're right governor, this is a weird moment. it used to be the case if you

were rich, you were fat and there was this image of people had their flesh coming over the collars, they were the fat cats. they were rich. these days most people who are most likely to be overweight or obese are the low income ladder. this is a common finding in united states italy spain most of the developed world we find the similar correlation. the reason for that we have a food system where there are millions of farmers around the around the world, billions of consumers but there are a few corporations that control the food situation. they operate by the rules of the market. they want to buy cheap from the peep who are poorest people in the world. the poorest people are the farm workers. when you think of the almost billion people who are going hungry, the majority of them live in rural areas and they're

starving. on the other hand these corporations look to make a profit. what is profitable? foods that are rich in salt and fat and sugar. high processed foods are incredibly profitable because our bodies make us come back for more. the cheap foods are the basis a strong part of the diet of people with low income. and that leads to the outcomes of higher exposure oh foods that result in obesity and being over weight. >> a couple of thoughts in that analysis. where the fast food, the processed industry, you made some comments and i've read the prices are dropped significantly over the years where the cost associated with fruits and vegetables have increased. but the cost of those processed

foods are relative cheap to the individual who are on fixed or low income. how is that possible? is there externallalities related to that or are those the legitimate costs or subsidies that are in the system that drive those lower costs. >> that's a great question. you got to wonder why a dollar can buy you 400-calories of cola but only 40-calories of lettuce. the processed food has been getting cheaper. there has been a grand bargain. in exchange for stagnant wages for working americans, you have seen low food prices and low gas prices. in other words cheap food is the camaraderie of low wages. that has been achieved by driving down the wages of people who work in the food systems. the top worst paying jobs are in

the food system whether it's working in the fields or working for tips in the food service industry. part of the ways that our food remains cheap is by paying workers very little. but as you say there are environment externallalities as economists like to call it. the ways in which the food companies push out the environmental costs of what it is that they produce. they push out the healthcare costs, when we buy a dollar burger built into that dollar is not the long term healthcare cost of eating foods that is high in salt and fat but these are the ways that corporations manage to avoid the full costs. >> gavin: you talked about $200 hamburger. has there been actual work through the economics of a hamburger? >> yes the 200-dollar burger is an idea that came from a bunch

of researchers in india. if this burger comes from a cow that was grazed on land that once upon a time was rain forest we can factor in the loss of ecoservice and that's just the footprint. that does not include the low wages that are paid in the food industry or fields where even today we have workers who are living in conditions of modern day slavery. they're growing the tomatoes that end up in our burgers. the $200 hamburger is just $200 because of the environmental costs. if we factor in the labor costs it would even be hire. >> gavin: you talk about a small number of companies and corporations that disproportionately impact the distribution of food. i want to talk about that, but first i want to challenge with this question. do we produce enough food to

feed 6.8 be billion people. if we do, is it the distribution problem that gets bottled up with the decisions of a few companies. >> i want to quote greg page. he's the head cargill. he said we produce more calories per person than ever before in human history. there is more food on the planet than there ever has been. there is not a problem of insufficiency of calories but distribution. we do have enough food to feed 7 billion. but the way we distribute food is through the market. again you have two separate rules. if you have money, you get to eat. if you don't have money, you starve. if you're in that low income category particularly in rich countries, the choices are limited and the limitation of those choices is what we need to

look at politically. >> when you look at distribution of food around the world, asian countries, latin countries. >> we grew up here eating while there were children starving in africa. and what do their parents tell them. eat up because there are children starving in india. and they're right. but hunger seems to be concentrated in asia and sub-saharan africa. those are the countries that have it pretty bad but hunger--i mean, hunger is an insufficiency of calories to live through the day tends to be confined towards the poor countries. but the phenomenon of food insecurity, not knowing where your next meal is coming from, which can be psychologically devastating is global. we have 50.1 million people last

year who didn't know where their next meal was coming. >> gavin: more with raj patel when we come back. trickle down does not work. in romney's world, cars get the elevator and the workers get the shaft. that is a whole bunch of bunk. the powerful may steal an election, but they can't steal democracy.

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>> gavin: we're talking to activist economist and best selling author, raj patel.

before the break we talked about this 50 plus million people in the united states that are malnourished that are not food secure. it's a staggering number. disproportionate of number of them being chirp. same principles apply in the united states that apply internationally as it relates to the distribution versus the actual production of food. do we in the united states produce enough food to feed those hungry. >> absolutely. no one would pretend--go to your local supermarket and you'll see aisles toppling over with foods that are rich in fat and sugar and then you'll find a sign saying they're homeless and hungry. that's actually what is happening internationally as well. even in a situation of famine. the nobel prize winner economist found even in famine, the worse possible situation in food there

is food in the area but the food is being held by the rich because they think it's going to go up in price. that's the sage principle in this country. we have plenty of food to feed everybody many times over. the problem is it's not mall nourishment. there are fewer people who don't have enough sal calories to make it through the day. parents will skip meals so their kids will eat. we have female-headed households that are affected by hunger and food security. food security is where you don't know where your food is coming from. that's not an occasional phenomena but something that happens a lot. >> gavin: one out of every two children during the course of their childhood will hit that

point of food insecurity in the united states. >> that's right. i was staggered when i found out that at some point in their lives one out of two kids will be on some food assistance programs in order to feed them. that's the indictment of the richest country on earth. >> gavin: let's talk about that political choice. this begs the question: what to do. how do we begin to turn the tide? how do we fix this? how do we scale the solutions and what are the solutions. >> we're still struggling to keep our heads above water. there was a big fight i'm sure you remember earlier on this year. >> gavin: newt gringrich. >> he was saying this president has overseen the massive expansion of food stamps, and that's a bad thing. it's true. 14.2 million people have joined the rolls.

>> gavin: not so dissimilar under the bush administration. >> less than under the bush administration. it's also important to remember that both presidents have followed an economic course that is essentially allowing large corporations to have their wicked way. and i think what we need is a much bigger thinking of how we address hunger and poverty in this country. >> gavin: and one needs to address the issue of obesity an it relates to food choice. we talk about food deserts the urban map where there are no grocery stores and a lot of inner cities, the lack of local locally grown foods. what else can we be doing outside of snap or what we refer to food stamps. >> it's important to unpick what we need by food desert.

when people use this term, and i'm not sure if you're familiar with it, when you think of it, you think of tumbleweeds and there is no food at all to be had. but if you go to communities where inner city communities where there is plenty of food available, just that the food precisely the wrong--it is not terribly nutritious food. there is a local food economy there. it is not one that is healthy long term for those working in those communities. >> gavin: with regard to schools and our children. what kind of policies would you advocate for? would you advise local governments and school boards to be advancing as it relates to getting our kids getting off to a healthy start. we talk about school programs and after school programs, what would you like to see in terms of shift of consciousness and create a framework of lifelong nutrition. >> stop marketing of food to children. i have a young kid.

he be exposed to billions of dollars of advertisements by the time he's 16. he'll be exposeed to foods from food companies looking to buy his taste buds. we know that the purpose of advertising is what? to give us choices to inch us as consumers. but kids are no rational consumers. that's why we don't let drive vote, carry guns, but we do allow them to be exposed to things where they are--they pester us into making us buy one thing or another right? >> gavin: yes. >> as parents we often say, well i'm an advocate of banning advertising to children, not because i want the nanny takes to rule but as a parents i want a fair chance to teach my child to eat properly. but for every dollar spent $500 is spent promoting junk foods. that's not a fair fight. i don't have billions of dollars

with which to educate my kid to reclaim his desires and his taste buds towards something better. i only have limited amount of time with my kid every day and kids are whereschools are where kids spent the majority of their times. if we're serious and studies are saying similar things if we're serious having kids brought up with healthy ideas about food, why are we poisoning them from childhood. >> gavin: what will things that have been advanced controversially. when i was mayor we did a lot of things that offended some and were embraced by others. michael bloomberg recently for the big gulp dealing with calories in large formats? good idea?

bad idea, eliminating salts fats. >> it's absolutely important. we've seen in denmark, for example, that attacks on trans-fats has had a big affect on public health. now you see the food industry saying trans-fat free. who put the trans-fat in there in the first place? you're like the vacuum cleaner salesman who comes to your house, dumps the dirt and then cleans it up. this is not a spectacular virtue on your part. even in new york it's hardly the state where you're now limited to 16 ounces of soda. if you want to drink an amount of soda the size of your head, you can. you have you ever the indignity of buying 206 these things. the soda industry has its front groups, the association of consumer freedom and we can

fight on that ground. if we're interested in liberty then my liberty as a parent is to have my kid grow up--right now one in three kids borne in the united states will develop type two diabetes. my kids have a 50% chance of developing diabetes. no small part to the diet he'll be exposed to. i want a fair chance of stopping that from happening. you may say this is the daddy market is taking over my kids. i want the freedom to raise my kids the way i choose: >> gavin: wonderful place to end end. raj. thanks for coming on the show. when we come back i'll have my thoughts and how we can fight hunger across america.

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and i sea food differently. [ male announcer ] you like who you are... and you learned something along the way. this is the age of knowing what you're made of. so, why let erectile dysfunction get in your way? talk to your doctor about viagra. 20 million men already have. ask if your heart is healthy enough for sex. do not take viagra if you take nitrates for chest pain; it may cause an unsafe drop in blood pressure. side effects include headache, flushing upset stomach, and abnormal vision. to avoid long-term injury, seek immediate medical help for an erection lasting more than four hours. stop taking viagra and call your doctor right away if you experience a sudden decrease or loss in vision or hearing. this is the age of taking action. viagra. talk to your doctor. see if america's most prescribed ed treatment is right for you. >> i want to focus on the folks that are making a difference. (vo) here's how you can connect with the gavin newsom show. >>i'm an outsider in the inside.

ideas are the best politics. >> gavin: it's pretty remarkable. the numbers speak for them but they bear repeating. nearly 900 million people around the world are starving. more 1.5 billion people are overweight. you've heard it from our guests tonight. we have to change our food system. it's not just about better information. it's not just about diet and nutrition. the world's food and food prices are closely linked to droughts, the floods and fires caused by climate change. so finding better ways to grow feed and feedfood and feeding the older is essential. use of food stamps at farmer's market. when i was mayor of san francisco, we started healthy and sustainable food programs. it was the first of its kind. the first of its kind that focused comprehensive on food

from production, distribution consumption and recycling. we didn't solve our hunger or obesity problems, but at least we moved the bar. we moved it in the right direction. the creation of a san francisco food council was just one example. i'm hopeful we can continue moving forward i know it will take more than just individuals. it will take a village to help change food systems but i know it can be done and it can be done on a global scale. have a good night and have a great thank you. continue the conversation at our facebook twitter and google plus. the powerful my steal an election but they cannot steal democracy. ♪ just put a little bit of yourself ♪ ♪ in everything you do ♪ [ female announcer ] add your own ingredients to hamburger helper for a fresh take on a quick,

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