take a. look at the plans to. special. trip . to. w. . britain's foreign secretary has warned of brecht's it paralysis in the u.k. but there are frantic efforts underway to prevent that happening my guest this week here in london is nigel mills a member of the progress it european research group which has consistently campaigned for a tough deal with brussels tougher than the one currently on the table or no deal at all last week though mr mills changed his mind and decided to support to resume

a's agreement other diehards finally calling it a day. by john mills welcome to conflict zone thank you have you finally accepted that the european union is not going to blink when it comes to the deal on the table they finally mean what they said this is the only deal that they love for the day has not changed substantially since november so aside from some clarification i think we have to accept that that's the way they like the situation i think you could rule out them trying to help the prime minister at the summit by offering a few more clarification from old media interpretations but i think the substance there is going to change in the state so your colleagues in the european research group fundamentally underestimated you didn't. well i think it saying it was going

to blink i mean we had this return to britain didn't we the e.u. will blink at the eleventh hour but we're not there yet we need to hold our nerve they were never going to blink for ever estimated only your shouting abilities in our situation were estimated but our effort i think we and i think any of us when we set out on this after a referendum for we end up in this situation of you know having no idea what the future partnership is being asked to sign a transition which restricts our future partnerships and you know not really having anything in return for it but i think the have held firm to their positions about that may not have been a sensible tactic for them we haven't quite know how the next week or so will go you know we still haven't agreed a deal we still haven't agreed an extension you know there's still scurrying around if i do agree that the government agreed to do you agree a deal you haven't gone through parliament to mean that's the key thing but this that this idea that the e.u. always blinks which we've heard from many of your colleagues this it was a fundamentally force assumption wasn't it that somehow britain had equal cards

with the e.u. it didn't it never did in this negotiation i think once it became clear the government weren't really serious about us leaving that a deal then we didn't have equal cards now and that point your asking for something in you could almost take what you've given haven't you but they're the is the largest trading group in the world they hold all the cards it's their club that you're leaving they will decide what rules apply should you wish to take advantage of some of the. privileges on offer. with that club you are i think what i thought we had in our manifesto eighteen months or so ago was that we wanted to create a comprehensive trading arrangement with them they would read on those have come under every one of those with japan i'd be quite happy just to replicate the terms of that i'm not asking them for anything that's the largest trading agreement in the world currently which britain is walking away from but he signed with japan the largest trading agreement last not the arrangement that we have with the currently

walking away from a political union with the european union are not walking away from trading relationships they would be quite well you won't be able to take advantage of that deal with you but we can create a similar one with japan i mean they've said they want to have various discussions it won't be the same for me will be a summer one but i think if you're. contention is that there was nothing here you know what we have to agree to anything you are ever going to offer us and you know i think we would have been quite happy many of us to take your an agreement will you often other people who are further away who are less big market and we don't have a hundred billion pounds a year surplus which we did have some cards to play think we played them pretty badly the european research group seems to be now doing the blinking we're seeing former minister estimate say that she's going to vote for two reasons deal even david davis the former minister and now jacob riis mug says he's undecided he's the chairman of the group so the die hards are finally calling it

a day other while i voted for the deal last week so if i was a diehard i call it a day but i you know i think you have to look at the facts as they are on the day you make your voting decision and you know i don't like this there is a lot of great situation to put the country in mr constraining ourselves in a way we we shouldn't be doing but some of the options have now left the table within. the government to until last week having said a bit of a would do you know deal more not if a deal failed now made it perfectly clear that they don't want to you know the apartment may be clear the parliament wouldn't approve no deal breakers it so the choice is now the prime minister's deal or what looks like a long extension and i think it's clear to me that the deal is the better better boast you talk about facts but it's been hard to sort of some of the fantasies that you broke city is sold to the public in twenty sixteen before the referendum hasn't really like the promise from david davis himself to have negotiated a free trade area ten times the size of the e.u. by the autumn of twenty eighteen where did fantasies like that come from lighter

remember that fantasy but. we voted to leave. should have been able to have a constructive dialogue with the new machine be able to leave by now in future partnership but no longer have i think it was that. i mean might go for instance that they asked that we vote to leave we hold. all the cards and we can choose the path we want what was that when it was there was something hopes wasn't we could have chosen to say we'll leave without a deal here's a draft free trade deal take it or leave it we didn't choose to play the card in that way we've been trying to secure. the government been trying to secure what looks like a hybrid half in half out relationship we just need to think with cherry picking but you know reg city has sold fairy tales to the country you sold the public a pup didn't you think we did i think i think we've resolved in the vision of an independent country that can make you same decisions the wanted to have a cooperative trading relationship and it's the nearest neighbor i think people watching this i would be a little bit confused as to why the us stock so long to the line and they can't

negotiate the future arrangement until we left and what people wanted us to do was leave a move into the new relationship seamlessly image just a crazy situation to say to your nearest market we've approached sellers are going to even talk to you about your future relationship until you've actually walked out the door you know where the logic you know about one of things is driven to this simply don't matter whether it's logical to you it's logic it seems logical to them and again as long as they held although even here we are leaving date without a deal in place with our law still being to leave that's not gonna be you a thousand days of disunity in among the tory party factional disputes fantasy promises and almost criminal failure to consider the. good of the country and the national embarrassment i will i think everyone can look and see but a little i think everyone gerson's for the good of the country when i see only the single biggest thing we've taken in more than my lifetime and probably from a decade of anybody in partner's voting for anything they don't think is in the national interest and i mean that's just for the unfair thing to suggest well if

they had been working in the national interest we would have seen people ready to compromise ken clarke the father of the house that the public holds the house of commons in their contempt for the fusion they see not only is opinion polarized here lots of factions are pursuing their own preferred ways but the public are even more polarized than at the time of the referendum. he's basically saying look what you've done to the people of this country what you've done you confuse them you've polarized them and you want the result we had a referendum we thought implemented decision i think what many of us have been doing is saying we had a manifesto we went to the country here for a referendum and said here is our break that plan we will not be in the customs union we will not be in the single market we want to be one of the new generation to do even that you are going to run you should talk to the well during this period you talked you argued amongst yourselves but he wouldn't talk to us until we formally triggered article fifty eight it wasn't possible to greece and before we started that two year journey to q one but it was possible to associate with them

it was possible that the number of people throw away when you can is not like conversation three years of factions inside the tory party arguing amongst themselves that's what the british public was treated to and as a result only six percent of voters see parliament in a good light now don't you hang your head in shame and that sort of figure i mean it's a terrible for you as a six for the sense approval rating this is a really hardest decision anybody's have to take the most difficult negotiation no one wanted to be this drawn out you know i think that it is a. parliament reflects how divided the country is on this situation. given if you don't know never compromise you the people's representatives can't compromise and you haven't been able to compromise for most three years what are you doing in politics anyway i politics is supposed to be about compromise there's no it is just like compromise most especially bastard thing to principle the numbering decisions that the people take in a referendum so knowing when to leave them behind in the national interest

absolutely but i asked why i think most prigs it is have accepted we have to have a twenty one month transition which effectively results in staying in the new next to two years would take us to four and a half years after the referendum most of us accepted that we should pay some sort of divorce below even though. and nothing in that situation i think most of us would accept that a trade deal would have in some restrictions on what changes we can make to our own regulations i think we've been all manner of compromises made but what we couldn't compromise on was not taking back our independence and being free to control our own affairs the irony is that your group the g one of the most divisive in many people's views actually promised to look for consensus in britain and in twenty seventeen your former chair so elephant and as she was then described the group as supporting the government to deliver which works for everyone there are two broken

promises in that statement on the first you were so intent on supporting the government that you tried to get rid of the reason you tried to force around and. since then you have fought tooth and nail to insist that only your breath was the real bret's it so that was hardly in the interests of our whole country i don't think that's was it offered him and if you look through the history certainly since the general election of war or as happened in parliament you'll see that in the e.r. g. most members there lonely support of the government all the regs approach going trying to get rid of right is unknown but they won't let me finish you the whole time i got up and until the check is policy announced last summer which fundamentally change the nation ship the prime minister was proposing for us to have with the e.u. compared to what he promised in our manifesto momentary one election which is the mandate on which were meant to be governing now that cause the first wave of resignations to break cities from the cabinet in that situation yet again there was no challenge to the prime minister everyone was clear we wanted to see a change in the policy not a change in the person it was only after but why did you always take it was only

a you were the only people who knew what really meant the question in the referendum was should the u.k. remain a member of the european union or leave the european union that was the only question that the referendum but you since then have set yourselves up as arbiters of what the true bracks it actually is full i think one has to take their own view on what it is but if you are i think what we've been doing is trying to actually deliver the brags that we promised the people in the manifesto we had a general election on and if you can go to the country and say this is what brags that we want you to vote for here's the vision that we have vote for some will deliver that and then trying to lever something completely different that's not honorable politics that's not principle politics and that is effectively misleading the the people so i mean it's regrettable with the prime minister chose to change the direction of the future nation ship last summer and that's what brought most of this problem around until then she had almost complete support from the g. and it was the people who wanted to remain here because and big problems in the party why did you change your mind and vote for two reasons well there are two

reasons that i mean i always say if the facts change you have to change how you face them so that i thought some of the issuance of she got last week which were legally binding. a clear commitment he wouldn't try and force us into something akin to star well that was important to me and yet many of your colleagues still cling to the view that this is a bad deal worst possible deal but i think it should be clear it's not ideal on the what is your group is very divided like every i think you are going out of fashion and you know this is not a great deal people are very worried about whether i should be here in here we can't leave i mean at least when you need you can you can trigger article fifteen leave it's not clear you can do that from the backstop neither but there were some reassurances last week that the backstop would not enjoy the you have no intention of meeting during the winter and forced into something that we didn't want to have if that's what parliament decides in future that and the fact it was very clear by the start of must rely upon the would never agree to a no deal drugs and there was a clear majority for an extension meant that the choices now are not between

promises deal improving the prime minister's deal having a no deal begs the or second referendum it's pretty clear now that the choice is leaving with a promise to deal in a few weeks time or having a very long extension more resistance is crumbling or are you just fighting like ferrets in a sack but with a difference is reducing because you can see that mean fifty others voted for the deal last we we didn't vote for it the first time it was very thoughtful it clearly is a change in my knowledge of mills this whole process has done britain enormous damage doesn't it in the specially to the health service when the pound sank after the referendum result and it shows finances were hit by a huge sums wiped off its balance sheet by the collapse of the present. the additional cost so far from bracks according to the british medical association an extra one hundred fifty five million pounds never admitted or factored in to your calculations was it why. the country voted to leave him out of. the history of the pound your exchanger and it's going up and down but white but we still have one

hundred fifty five million euros of the carried out on the national economic growth is still one of the strongest in europe i mean i don't think you can say that it's pretty decision has destroyed our economy just from that i didn't say it is destroying the economy and saying i think i was sitting down to the one organization that you painted as one of the great beneficiaries from breck so we have left here and you haven't achieved our lesson yet and one hundred fifty five million led you to their costs while we spend you know we spent two hundred sixty billion plus a year on the n.h.s. i mean you can in oh so sometimes i was so that's all fine and the national health service was to become one of the major benefits of the royal college of physicians doesn't see it that way government's lack of clarity over how the u.k. is immigration service will work they say off the bricks it could leave the n.h.s. spending up to half a billion pounds per year on international recruitment again never factored into those some of the uplands that you might offer to the british problem of the

increased government have been clear on the time gratian policy will be skills based people from all around the world have the right skills and cost half a billion pounds of only an international recruitment scheme that's crazy this is a royal college of physicians we are i don't know just make it up in just my views on barry that i suspect i'm going to tell you i mean there's no you just got these figures from c. i do then i mean do i think coming to work in access will be hugely attractive people from around the world behind me we already have a lot of employment in the n.h.s. from countries outside and inside i don't think you need to spend half a billion up to three in the year following the referendum in the year following the referendum almost ten thousand european health care professionals quit the n.h.s. . by november twenty seventh in the number of e.u. nurses registering in the u.k. was down ninety percent fabulous result. doesn't design you remember the time it was very clear other explanations for why put up some of that was a procedural issue at the time of the name for example but you know i think when we when we have a clear integration policy based on skills people people whom we need to come here

be able to come here and we'll welcome them it's clear that n.h.s. and catheters will still need lots of immigrant labor i mean it's it was just no way we can train people in a short period to for to feel like the problem is also in our universities cording to the royal society and i don't think anyone has suggested that they peddle fake news the u.k. could lose access to over a billion pounds a year e.u. research funding even with the government government's guarantees u.k. based research is and small or medium sized enterprises will lose will lose access it says the half a billion in research funding having an immediate impact on research underway in the u.k. find a price worth paying feel the government of being clear that we want to have continued research corporation with a lot of ring i would think net com to be a lot i mean we are the result is another reason why we can't offer the amount of money that we need we need to do to a place that the royal society says it could take years to develop alternatives to the e.u. funding meaning that valuable research could be stopped immediately why don't you

except that in the in the spirit in which it's given that i do it when i was twenty i would all i would happily have this country's research effort is going to be with damaged severely damaged i would happily there's no is anybody here in benghazi who voted to end research cooperation with the european countries with lot of unintended consequences should i'm not for that but there's no surely more realize that this was going to be a no reason why we don't think we want you we want to research corporation much wider than twenty eight countries don't we so there's no reason why he should refuse to have us cooperate with them isn't it time that there was another general election here in the country needs to hold you all to account doesn't it for the for the broken promises and the way that the whole e.u. negotiation is being conducted we had an election not that long ago people want to cling on to to have to have that one i'm not sure what to. in the one in which you lost your majority in the one in which we got the largest share of the vote that my party's howard dean twenty something out but you still lost a majority so what's the great result was it wasn't

a great result now but you know i think you can see when you vote share goes up from thirty six to forty four percent of the people we're. going to live in dawson and they promise to liberate that as well i'm not sure what a general election would change i mean what proposals would be for main parties be standing on what would people who then went to vote think they were going to achieve by the person they're voting for and it doesn't look clear from the opinion polls you wouldn't get a very similar component when you would go i think we need to fix it in this parliament in the obvious fix now is to vote the prime minister's deal through and move on to the next stage of these talks and you can do that kennie. well i think we can i think people will i mean as we've been so long in the stable we're talking about the last elections strong and stable was what the prime minister promised in their election campaign we've seen anything but strong and stations thought we've seen weak vacillating we've seen divisions we've seen you saw at election time on the basis that he needed a strong majority to deliver on something at a few of his brags in public didn't give us that strong majority there's

a growing view that your party is because of the disagreements and the tensions over europe which go back decades in your party that it's a luxury that this country can no longer afford i have recognized that is worth i mean the issue of europe has divided the country not just one party ever since we joined him before that. but the people decided they wanted to leave and we should deliver that if you look at the opinion polls my party is still enjoying healthy lead in most of the opinion polls i don't think you can say we become some people don't want any more. whatever happens with bret's it's going to take years to find out the true impact of it isn't that i mean most economists who look to the post-breakfast future didn't have much good to say about it you in your group you pinned your hopes understandably on one academic who did a man called patrick min for it from cardiff university this is a man who recommended the heart breaks it and abolition of all tariffs which could do enormous damage to agriculture and industry in this country but he was your main

linchpin wasn't he. he wasn't my main interest at all i mean i think we are economic future will be best served by having a good comprehensive trade arrangement with the without any tariffs on a so response what you have looking to switch to for brics and looking to expand our sales around the world we would be pretty shocking exporting outside the e.u. that all the growth in future will come from outside be having having better trading nation ships were outside will be positive for the country and i think if we can get a sensible trade go along with this is the group that you do sixty percent of your trade with us not where sixty percent of our exports go us i mean you saw this when i was sixteen i was saying goes into this where we have a summit sixty percent where we haven't seen a look at that there is no your close i don't trade being part of the any of the largest trading block in the world and i think any sensible person wants us not to have a good preparation with the the constitutional chaos that we've seen accompany the whole debate in this country should worry everyone shouldn't it labor pierced you

it would says the whole process has shown that britain's unwritten constitution is basically broken do you agree with that. yeah i think if it isn't as difficult as this without a majority in parliament and with subtly too many public problems to it but to me parliamentarians not wanting to respect the will of the people in a referendum on the lights on your side well i think i think it's i think you have to say it's been mainly people who didn't who do not accept the result who have been trying to frustrate this process that has brought us. to this position yet but we've seen contempt for parliamentary procedure from the government itself this is may's government is the first to be found in contempt of parliament for initially refusing to publish its legal opinion on bricks and no government has ever published legal advice and i it was the writing of this in fact in contempt of parliament for those very good reasons why you don't generally publish legal advice it means you don't even mean you can't take the advice of the minister been a pretty unique situation when the two main parties got eighty three percent of the

vote in the election promising to respect the result of the referendum and here we are still. with large numbers of people who will not accept the people voted to leave the turn of the street in any way they can either by transparent various or by frustration through the process and i think many people in the country are absolutely furious that poland has an aim to actually deliver and leaving within ways nearly three years since the referendum are now facing making that nearly found they believe you and your colleagues i think the public trial is going to be very difficult it was a boy isn't it that they want to blame people who just will not accept the result will not accept any kind of deal for us to leave us who they need to blame well and that includes people from the european. well i. say we had a manifesto we went out and died hards who are unlike you are still refusing to buy into the reason a stable i mean state. people who have stick up for them but i would say the choice now is to leave with this deal or to risk not leaving the top i think we should

have these people your principles more important trust well i think if a vote how the national interest is clearly being to get a consensus to stand before the us this is our great position this is something in three years that britain has been unable to way we should have achieved that consensus was to have a general election and then have the winning party manifesto be that consensus and accept that's the thing that has the mandate from the public that's what some people in parliament including sadly some in the cabinet just have not accepted that mandate that plan that we set out to look country the common people in behind closed doors in smoky rings to try and change that manifesto plan and that's that's the what the public gave us the mandate to go and deliver britain is going to merge from this process a more damaged more divided nation that has been in modern times. well i think how do you how do how do you mitigate that you are defined as that unites us . i think the way we heal the world and this country's been fired on this issue for a long time we gave back to the public with the final decision should we stay or

should we leave the only way we can unite the country is to is to move on leave and then get on to on the governing the country on the issues that they care about and making a success of this vision people have taken i don't think you can unite a country that still we are where we're arguing about it that's a decision was made should be implemented that's what parliament should be doing if you give decisions to back to the people you have to implement what they decide and the question the question is how and you're still not agreed on. well we have one deal on the table that gets us out of the in the next few weeks i think that is the is the best way forward i don't think anybody really wants another couple of years where we can stay in the you are now argue about this and try and work something out and even then if you won't change their mind then they go shooting a future promise it was to them we'll have two more years of arguing about how to get out and then when at the start in the future party that's not a healthy situation i think this needs to be resolved quickly now i hope in the summit that we have. at the end of this week perhaps in

a couple of clarifications and concessions can be made and that can be enough to get this deal over the line and we can get on with approving and ratify new budget moves be good to have your conference or thank you.

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play. play. play. play. play play play. play. this is the w newsline from. says she supports. with conditions that germany. crushes out of the e.u. until the very last day even the very last hour we will be pushing them sure enough and the agency plan is never actually needed to the german chancellor was addressing.