by placing a warning label and music quote out. rock and religion a clash that brings many parallels to light. or the 2 really so irreconcilable. car. rock n roll storage june 17th w. o l a very warm welcome indeed support very good coming to you from the house of burlington something they did seems there is a new mood in german politics voters are going green in numbers in recent opinion polls the environmentalists have for the 1st time ever i was that angle americans conservative christian democrats as the country's most popular policy and there's growing talk there's a next chancellor could even be agreeing so our question this week on quadriga is

the greens germany's new number one to discuss that question i'm joined here in the studio by professor boyce gunbattle from the berlin social science center who says the green sulfur policy of the privileged and as such the natural limits maybe touch that 20 percent plus of witnesses prominent business journalist and commentator goes on a viking phelps who believes no other party has struggled as much as the greens to accept the spirit of the market column in an interesting and a very warm welcome to city w. so maximillian akashic who is a political correspondent at the door she really keeps a close eye on the greens and maxie argues that the greens must choose between purity and they can't please everyone and she it's interesting thank you for those free statements for the top of the show 1st question goes to maxi maxi how greek is germany. i think germany is guessing grain. free election now we see that in

especially the state elections the last couple years we've seen that in bavaria last year where the greens have become the 2nd biggest both in the american parliament which was traditionally very conservative and reined by merkel sister party the very end conservatives we've seen that also enhance their one of the other comes after strongholds where the grains gain significantly they're getting a foothold in almost every of german states the question is how ready are they going to be governing the states how willing are they going to be governing states and is this still a debate we only see in the west because we'll have a couple lessons coming up in eastern germany and the greens have again quite often they are going for the reason i'm asking about how green is germany's because you will know that there are people outside germany who are always asking whether they're very aware that germany has a long environmentalist green tradition and i wonder whether you believe that that to the image of germany still stands up and still violent yes of course of it is climate change protection has moved in the middle and into the mainstream within

the last month and that i think that the green party success is in some kind you can't you can't understand it as the movement off climate change protections within the families virgin. a broader society we have. professor. vic question is i suppose the success of the greens that has now been on the very been on the rise as marx he was pointing out for quite some time is it here to stay because they've been they've been here before in a faded back to becoming a 1015 percent party has to stay this time as one of germany's leading forces. i'm a bit more cautious about these polls reading and present polls of polls elections are elections and by the way european elections are different from national elections in national electorate people will vote more for part of the where

they're not only have trust and have sympathies but they must think that they are able to govern and if we are looking to 2 people at the top of the corrientes we would immediately say they do not have any experience in governing and to tramp from the top of the party into the main offices of the country it's a long way to go and this will be in the perception of the voters as well ok i want to talk about those 2 percent leaders in a minute but just to you you characterized the greens is a policy of privilege that sounds very dismissive no it's not and it's simply empirical the sissy empirical truth we know the koreans have the electorate where you find most of the formally very good educated people and this is one reason why i'm also skeptical that the koreans who are really at the top of our

party system they draw extensively on the voters in metropolitan and urban cities and where you find well educated middle class and this is a limited electorate they. do not have any crush on the walters of the lower 3rd of society programs ourselves there is a new dynamic in german politics he says the parts of german politics is training and he says the greens can harness the dynamic can create become a broader based polls yes and they will of just just 11 sentence yes they will try to do it and we cannot explain the rise of the queen's with out the steep decline of the to catch all parties c.d.u. and the s b d they are to some extent blocked dulness to understand to the crease and i think that what 11 of the one explanation is that people are

fed up with the 2 government parties say experience them 410-1214 years now and the 2 players that make up i'm going to see things are going to be illusions of the grand coalition and people are fed up with that done that want to run one part of voters turn to the greens and the other all the pot turns to the the right wing i think exactly the way we have to look kindly where the electorate is moving is going to give us an indication as you say how the greens can develop because as much as they're taking bloods if you quoted from the center left and right conservative and democratic parties they're also letting blots to the left so what we've seen in the national election 2017 is that as much as the greens have gained votes they're also lost a couple of votes to the left especially in these metropolitan areas and in these state elections where we have a much more rural community but we also see the greens of seeding we can feel it get a bit of a feeling for the potential they can have with

a lesser elitist part of the german electorate and i think that is why the upcoming elections in the east of germany will be especially interesting because there we will have the least of this classic green electorate and this is where they need to start their actual convincing of a broader electorate and if they will succeed that. but the time of big parties is strolling to an end and you and europe we will not find these folks part time i think you're searching there for the german word you're looking for the because catch this is a bit sudden said more negative event very much of a connotation we used to have for the fights at tion and this time is more or less all were you do not find very many in europe anymore and the greens will not become the new catch all party in germany much insult let's get some pictures 1st of all a man complex about theme because as we have seen the greens go right back to the 1980 s. them for many of those one moment in particular when they really established themselves

on the national radar here it is. white sneakers it's an unforgettable image yashica fischer taking his oath of office as the green party's 1st ever minister he was making a provocative statement with the shoes yet for many it was proof that the greens want to be taken seriously. but no one's saying that anymore while the party has enjoyed successes in the past it's now more popular than ever mainly thanks to its likeable leaders on alaina babcock and all that hot young feisty and trustworthy their politicians who aren't afraid of taking on responsibility for 2 new members are from entrepreneurs to the unemployed from young to old people are voting for the greens who wins for us that means it's our duty to communicate and operationalize our policies or develop when we were in a minority position so that they find broad public support of the american interest

in climate protection the greens fundamental issue is now a hot topic for people from all walks of life so are the former eco warriors on their way to becoming germany's next major party. is the question the next major party that soaking about what you were talking about commenting about these folks thoughts and i just give us another idea so that our viewers really understand how elementary that has been for jim in politics and explain why is the greens cannot be in your estimation of folks thought i have big tent policy flex time and. played to make sure role in the 2nd top of the 20th century but till then we see a steep decline and they are important for had the rich societies to keep them to keep it together on a political level they can only do it if they try all voters across

all social classes across all age cohorts. and all cultural milieu and this is not what the koreans are prepared to do they may exploit more and more this milieu of course will politan this be find an urban area they will gain a lot of world from the younger people but they will not get so many votes from the people above 60 which is a matrix share of our electorate with themselves more often as i think of what america is right we have from millions of somewhere else living in germany and not only anywhere else the green party is is addressing so i think we do have a deep do whiten society sort of you know what the difference between a 7 where i'm anywhere no way short term senator serving the person that had was well educated to come and live everywhere around the world who is mo bile and who is quite open to any forms of living on the social state some things like that some

well people who are in most time live live on the countryside afa job have a family and want to stay there they want to stay somewhere around have their home somewhere so and then millions of somebody else living in germany and they are not as attracted by the green party as be anywhere else and i think that this is 11 problem the other one is but the society is divided even in germany and in a different divided society you won't find political parties which cover the whole of the whole electorate next you say in the quota that's up for the show the greens must choose between purity and bret's tell me a little bit more about that because we've seen how the greens have been trying to branch out in the last couple of years they've been trying to get to the somewhere as of most consider they have to a certain extent been successful 150 percent other age groups they have moved into

other areas of society lower income areas it's it is possible. no sorra bus driver to be you to be a greengrocer surely interesting thing is if we look especially on the german state level like if we don't try to see it in the saddle and the broader germans perspective but on the regional perspectives how they learn to cater to different needs and different german regions so again coming back so the spectacular example of last year's election and the various we've seen that the conservative party the sea is you in the very air and the so stomach rats are both going very heavy on the immigration issue they were both majorly putting their campaign on their cards and they fell miserably both the greens for broadening out their campaign much more they were complaining a lot of different issues that not of not nationally green issues they're complaining also on the challenge of agriculture which you would think they would normally do with that organic angle they did and they were talking

a lot about the issues of conventional agriculture something you have not heard from national christian leaders are going to politicians so they are on the on the state level green the green party does turn to conservative issues preservation off of creation and things like that and addressing christians addressing people who aren't quite conservative in their mind i think in despite the fact that very according to you have struggles to embrace intellectually the markets and commentary struggled more than any of the policy you say yeah but but but but this is the economic part of green politicians they as a as an opposition party they just chose and picked small issues like come fireworks on. new year's eve or sugar in lemonade something and sings lebec and just went on these issues only to fight too much sugar too much things off of everything and that is and contrary to the understanding of social

market economy you're only. frame economy on the market and not go for special editions and the green party is the party which is most keen on into winning in small topics and not just giving a frame and let the market go within this framework american. mentioned an important point the koreans are in a position and if a part of the party is in a position it can claim some purity of its stance of its program if you if they have to go into government they have to make tradeoffs tradeoffs between the environmentalists to dance in places like heston in places like boston brought there's a clear why different thing because to start somewhere and that's the state they do not decide about economic policies not about tax policies not very much about labor

market policies but these are the areas where the tradeoffs will come up between a clear environmental policy and these kind of policies that have been for 7 years in gem government. for luncheon and incidentally wary much that you know are right that they were not punished. getting an interest for these topics that especially siskel policy i thought was quite interesting to see that on the us government on the federal level the greens have now prepares to attack one of the holy principles of the grand coalition the black 0 i mean we've seen a policy proposal that's an interesting line to corina's and this is something we would have expected from the social democrats by the grace to say we need to. address the investment gap we need to go away from the black sero policy and we need to think about structural investments in our infrastructure in our

telecommunications that works and we need to find a different policy for this and i mean for our policies deficit spending caps that is about as it came from the european level down to a trickle down to the to the german level and i think that the fiscal competence of the green party mainly is on the european level and not so much on the german level but on the other hand it is the only party which is. just prepared to stop the black 0 and i'm not so sure whether this is something many people in germany would agree to but the social democrats already recognize that this flex year or never have been a traditional social democratic policy yet they're fighting with my lip service to their factory i'd like to try that has been central leader this is not social democrat not social democratic policy that it is still the social democratic fine and right there is defined by they will recognize that this starts harm to the

party and they will change in these issues hopefully because they react to the other main competitors and i'm pretty much sure that this plex euro which has never been very welcomed among the rank and file and the functionaries of the party will be one of the 1st sekret pfizer's of the sort of democratic parties to catch up again if but that won't be an argument to to go forward for the expertise so it would be an argument for the left party or for for for for the for the 1st i mean it has to figure now to address these issues to not shy away they're not shying away from dish issues of security policy either their security policy speaker on the federal level in the german parliament and. she is being very outspoken off like challenging the ideas the greens have been thinking about security policy it used to be of our pacifist approach and they kind of left

tradition and they're now becoming much more realistic they're still staying and this is this is the point i think it will be interesting to see where on these hot issues that define as you say german politics will they make a decision for their principles worse is there broader appeal or can they make their principles broader appeal and you can omit policies on social policy it just mainly storytelling you're just not as detailed as reliable as you told it for for the interiors and strict security policies nevertheless it was a listen said that the greens have a very impressive skillful well briefed knowledgeable leadership do you are. yeah they do but neither of them had to have to govern a state or. city or whatever so we don't know how they would deliver if they were in responsibility and all but topics that all we have to deliver know now and he

has to prove that he's the time to do the write offs begins and this will do or harm to them or also talks in purists among their voters absolutely let me just come back to my point i didn't assume that when i listed the qualifications for leadership of the german green term to be you were going to say yes of course but her professor. to do that to green co-leaders have all the chancellorship material. this is not say all right also about who's potential dangers of the hear now from the studios that do not have experiences and they should have some experiences i cannot think about one. in our history which who did not have experience is in directing executives and they have not been at the top of of law in germany and even this is something which is so different from governing in

the federal system so i'm doubtful and i would say both have to collect experiences as well but on the other hand i do not think that they become the strongest party in the next and i think you have to admit that one has counsel as a chop you just go with the positions if you look at time would call i'm going to macklin no they have long it's their 1st year but in their 1st years it was not not not every time joy just to watch them on to experience that that kind of leadership the question is even if these 2 candidates. are these 2 possibly going to be the actual candidates because i mean will be seen now they've always been leading that parties have been leading these campaigns but obviously never with the intention of one of them becoming a lead candidate for an actual job because it's 2 people and there can't compel him to get now the national someone is that robot hollaback the charismatic male leader

but the comment and there's already been talks about well sudden maybe the woman and i mean a babel becoming the candidate i think it's quite interesting the more intelligent and. i mean i don't know which of the conversation was entirely more intelligent but if i don't rise to she's for example academically qualified she studied international law he has studied. liberal arts and just talk about these things there is fine distinctions but the question is does it even have to be a one of the 2 of them they have now a significant amount of members hiring can quite popular members that have executive experience on the european or on the other of the most of the federal or state of the most popular and to some extent the electoral success of the creedence can be traced back probably more to harbin again i'm hesitating to say this as a man and popularly so he is a real popular figure and

a pro-u. hasn't anything to say and because it could be the classical male chauvinist of white men year this is the reason but i do think she is probably even for term and stoned it's too young for it this is another reason the age 38 at this point in time is she i think will see things from rupert harbor just a church in 50. even 38 there will be a discussion and sure and you mention the word you mention the word charisma and clearly a lot of german votes i don't think this is just press hype i think a lot of people. really out there on the streets watching the t.v. programs are very impressed by robot hard work they are and they find him a compelling they find him a charismatic figure but i warn you again we've seen it's interesting to see it in direct comparison to the social democrats which have a lot of prominent popular figures like pop nuts of popular animal but

a lot of prominent figures of them on the national level that several germans like the germans know we have from the party leader to the cabinet ministers to the heads of the states with the greens it's quite interesting that they always seem to be concentrated on several small figures like the possibly dishes or maybe now we do know also the head of the poem entry groups but it's interesting to see i'm coming back to bavaria because it was very interesting it was a it was an almost copy of another in about book and. the topic that was running the campaign that i was little and. mr schultz and they they were quite the same team and in the end it was clear at that point that if they would be able to lead a government it would be the mayor kind of debt because they had already sorted out the qualifications he was the more qualified person and that's why i'm coming back to principle worse is appeal they need to find their decisions before they appeal with them to the voters they need to make these decisions now and this is something

that needs to be happening not based on polls but needs to based on their own convictions because they're a party that is very much about convictions of policies they started as a party that was only based on the ecological purpose and the liberal policy was a one issue francis and it in its infancy as well they then have an internal discussion who would be the candidate which brings most of the voters to the party they will also offer for the most popular figure of the party and then this is a method of appeal and parties are about. well to maximize our sort of what's going to happen next. but discussions within the green party on fiscal policy social parts and so on all these issues you have to address if you want to become a governing party and. probably. a party which has

the chance to be. they have to sort it all know and they have to say not only the most popular popular but also look most prominent on the most damage a person to go for it there's also a point think about the koreans step into government they start with their measures against climate change which is absolutely right and correct but we all know if the law change the climate germany is only responsible for 2 to sleep per cent of our carbon emissions so they change anything in the spring. but they cannot crap that is a big this is a. reality for the green voters as well ok. so we're going to have to linger thank you very much for joining me here today on quarter acre we've been talking about germany's potential number one in the green a lot of skepticism in the room without a prospect park but i come back next week. an

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a bit difficult. to link to school in africa the old story link to exception stories and discussions. of easy and while website dedicated poems much traffic traffic join us on facebook doubling africa. earth. home to millions of species a home worth saving. here's much of those are big changes and most start with small steps global warming 2 years tell stories of creative people and innovative projects around the world like news has. he took such pains to bring a true solution to reforestation. they created interactive content teaching the next generation about environmental protection and were determined to build something here for the next generation bloodiest the multimedia environment series on w. d t you know that 77 percent. are younger than

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