on any issue and not on this issue especially if you are not a. yeah i totally agree to him we do not see that although india has been saying that its about lateral issue and we have to talk to pakistan and only then we can solve it but after this after revoking article $370.35 it now there's not going to be any discussion and that is very clear and that belongs to this not it of that not in the modi gave even before he was elected in 2014 that he is there to bring about changes in the negative was that nothing has happened in the last 70 years congress was there and never did anything india is they have it it was a $947.00 and here comes the savior here comes the man who is going to change everything and that's a big change he would of course take credit for that nobody is none other government ever managed to do something as big as this and they found all the loopholes they found out the legalities and they did it which nobody had talked

about it came as a surprise the most interesting way to talk about the narrative or have mr modi came out and said that this week he said we as a nation as a family have taken an historic decision that's pretty telling language talking about the nation as a family it sounds there are real issues there about inclusive and exclusive but you know the indian opposition leaders have called it a historical blunder. as christine was saying there are serious concerns in india in the manner in which are just done for example that's going to break it down you know what has been done so one of the laws which has existed or all these years. give protection to native population in kashmir in terms of property rights and zones of thought that has been scrapped and that's not unique to kashmir there are other indian states very exist like. that are con job and that existed because there's

a particular dynamics there and the government wanted to protect that that's gone now and the biggest fear is. hindu pundits who had to leave. a job you know 2 decades ago will now be resettled and essentially the biggest fear is that the majority will now turn into minority. and this is political and social engineering and that more the more prime minister more david not stop there if he can get away with this one he will then focus on other parts of india where you know there are set. tendencies so for india internally it's true absolutely right that the majority is celebrating because a lot of the movie is popular popular populist nationalist yet there are worries in among journalists among opposition leaders among civil rights leaders that this could lead in the not in the long run unraveling of india's secular liberal inclusive character

a lot of nothing going on here but i thought we we're going to talk about the future obviously let's just go a little bit back in time the country a conflict has of course been raging for decades let's go back to the time when it started. the mountainous region of kashmir has long been home to hindus when it began to be islamist in the 13th century that something hindu nationalists have never accepted for them kashmir is the land of the hindu god. the conflict over kashmir began in 1947 at the end of british colonial rule india and pakistan both claimed the region as their own triggering their 1st war for control of muslim majority country. after the war ended in 1948 kashmir was divided between india and pakistan. the line of control has never officially been recognized as the border. pakistan has more or less openly

supported muslim separatist in kashmir ever since that's led to 3 more wars numerous outbreaks of violence. and terror attacks like the one on the indian parliament in delhi in 2001. and the mom by attacks of 2008. the stakes are higher than ever now that both india and pakistan a nuclear states. has kashmir lost its autonomy for good. as a goal it seems that very. specially because if you look at the world reaction to. hardly any major world capital. has condemned it in. august on essentially was caught by surprise that the prime minister of india can actually go ahead and do. all along that it was part of the party manifesto. it was

their desire for last 50 years but that actually he will do it and now that it's done box down his struggling to find out how it can react because now india is saying this is our internal matter the reaction has been described. what is going on below the surface. and. listen i mean there are secessionist tendencies in many other parts of the world right we know for example catalonia and in spain the scottish want to be separate from u.k. go back canada when you do it without involving the population in question there's always a fear that it will backfire for me right now is a dormant volcano we don't know how angry kashmiris are because there's a complete shutdown no internet no television no media. fuel for last 10 days if and when the curfew is lifted and it will have to be lifted right. we will find out

you know how upset midis are with the displeased violence or of a deal the government will divide and rule david you know bill get some politicians on its side and. take it from there. but i am i am fearful i mean i am concerned the world doesn't appreciate it at the moment but if this goes into violence and if bogs down in india or back on the brink of war and do nuclear omniscience then the world will have to take notice. and i hope it doesn't come down and meanwhile i'm sure india is being described as treating kashmir is a colony of being a fully fledged occupying force of being the master of a prison how do indians see respond to those kind of accusations by indians you mean the indian masses of men yeah the masses as i said been the beginning it's

a huge emotion people are celebrating everywhere other than kashmir and if i may just go back to the map that you've shown now we see this huge jail to be there left inside pakistan right inside china has a little part and internationally when we talk about it we think that the whole pot discussion me but as there is a bifurcation there you have me you have general you have been the smallest which is going to be a union territory now and there are only about $300000.00 people living there. who has about 6000000 and actually has 8000000 if i'm not wrong so basically just one it forms the major chunk and doctors by the most of the book this general has the hindu population kashmir has muslim so the whole conflict is about this is where the muslim population resides that is where there is the sentiment of we do not belong to india or even not being asked and if you are asking about what the government is talking about if you see how this whole. event is being covered right

now there are 2 very different narratives the international media is showing that. showing that there are protests there are people coming out in the street the indian media is showing that there are celebrating because they are going to get is going to thing the media is going to people there so obviously that things are happening so we have to consider. as a whole and then look at the picture. on many muslims now in kashmir who are fearing that there will be an influx of hindus changing the demographics of the of the region is not likely is not on the cards is i think this is certainly part of the strategy of the government in the mid to long term perspective to change the demographic scenario because with the evolution of. of the special status of kashmir it will become possible for people from me from

other parts of india to go to me and to buy land also for companies to invest so we will see and this is also part of the strategy that will be in best the summit of the indian government on kashmir in october and of course the government has also. has seen it has provided legislative assembly to do you need to do union territory of jungle and kashmir so we may also see early elections or we may see elections probably in the next year and then it will be difficult for the muslim parties so far that they will participate or not if they boycott the elections then the majority will of these new legislative assembly will be mostly hindus from hindu parties and one should also not forget the j.p. already had a strong position in this part of kashmir in the last election day we had 23 percent of the world's think in long term perspective the idea is to do.

fundamentally change the political. conservations one aspect is also that all the leaders of the major parties in the existing parties in kashmir has been put under house arrest which also shows and you say fundamentally changing when you talk about people being put under house arrest that can't go on forever more there has to be a resolution to the situation yes if i guess on that oh yes the resolution will be new elections resolutions will be does new institutional set up of the union territory which much more limited competence is compared to in a state the union territories. are administered by the home ministry so it shows that they will have much less space yes and the political solution is to implement some form of democratic representation which will be done with new elections but the protests will go on yes i don't think new elections will solve anything in all likelihood. muslim politicians will boycott it because they feel they have not been

consulted in any of this india has used its might to press ahead with this and if they do by court which is most likely as you said. the prime minister's party party party will form a government but it will be seen as a puppet government not representing the sentiment. and it will it will not solve anything we've seen this before in kashmir you know brought india politicians like mehbooba mufti like omar abdullah. who vote brought into government who formed government but they never really represented the will of the kashmiri people and now those politicians are siding with those who are are deeply upset with india are anti india now and to me that's the whole issue the whole toxic issue of demographics are i saw a quote from one elderly kashmiri woman the other day she said it's clear that mr

modi wants kashmir but not kashmiri people is that faithless or is that those that read that is the saddest part about kashmir that neither pakistan or india have really cared about the kashmiri people for the 2 governments it's a territory that they have been fighting over i am i have reported from the kashmiri line of control from the pakistani side i have seen and i've met families who live in perpetual terror in perpetual fear of crossfire and in so many lives have been lost so many lives shattered divided. and what baffles me. if the world doesn't care i mean you know vs sitting in berlin we're discussing it kristen is from a reputable think tank i want to know how come nobody's bothered about this. and will it will it have to be brought to a brink of a nuclear war for people to sit up and say well we could be going to take care of this it is really all remarkable why is the international community looking the

other way the international community is looking the other way probably because they say it's a bilateral issue. this is the problem that. united nations resolutions from the 1940 s. and fifty's have lost. out of various reasons. most obvious one is that since the fifty's china is also part of this problem 2nd point would be that we see in kashmir at least on the indian side there has also been a strong independence movement on the. kashmir is now the independence movement is not covered by the un resolutions so it would be difficult besides some other technical issues to make to make some form of a referendum when probably the most important movement and this is normally an independence movement which we know it from other parts of the world is not represented so in that sense $11.00 can understand the position of the

international community and this has also been by very close allies of pakistan even china has always you'd least you have a problem with india yes but solve it on a bilateral level we have seen this bilateral in that negotiations the most important one was probably in 2007 when the solution was there yes so this is why the international community says you have a problem you solve it on bilateral dialogue at the moment the indian government is not willing to go into any negotiations with india and pakistan and i do not see it coming up soon ok let's just break off for a 2nd there in the 2 figures of the center of this ongoing crisis are the heads of government in pakistan and india 2 politicians who could hardly be more different. and why did i did run into them i thought was. prime minister narendra modi india's fervent hindu nationalist.

parties revoked articles $370.35 a which guaranteed special status in autonomy from india's constitution. modi thinks this will bring him a step closer to his goal of a stablish in india as the 2nd major power in asia alongside china. article $370.35 a cave general and kashmir nothing but terrorism separatism dynastic system and corruption are. the superstar across the border pakistani prime minister imran khan a former cricketer and playboy whose been married 3 times once a fixture of london's high society he became a devout muslim and politician later in life he now espouses conservative even extremist views. on it it is it can't be possible that they attack us and we don't

respond what will happen next mission things will escalate when both of us keep reacting it could lead to war action. modi or can't who's got the upper hand in the kashmir conflict. certainly one interesting question the other question that i have is for christiane if you had the ear of either of the 2 leo both of the 2 leaders ideally have the say we want time what advice would you give the now on where you want them to push this crisis i think the easiest solution and the best solution would be to settle on the status quo and this is still not ruled out one can already in one can imagine like in 2007 for us explaining yourself that there is fatigue with the status quo no there isn't there is there is no disses a debate on the indian side that's that's a debate on the union side but between india and pakistan wants can still agree on a solution like having the n.o.c. as a soft border this is not new it depends on the political will on both sides as i said

at the moment i do not see the indians willing to negotiate with pakistan but at the end it has not changed the the overall setting for the solution within the existing territorial delimitation and and the status quo ok ish or your advice your wisdom for the 2 leaders. i think the best way i agree to them and i think the best way would be bilateral talks and one has to solve it like that but coming back to watch as it was saying i don't think that we are the brink of nuclear war i think both of these populist leaders not in the movie and none can none of them is so naive that they would get into a nuclear war. as far as their statements are concerned the v.m. runtime has reacted and then the very moody has said that there would be a new chief c.d.s. who is going to look after the defense maybe an air force.