when there are do look at the bigger picture. india a country faces challenges. people are struggling to sustain future. clever projects from europe and. india d.w. . up today don't miss our highlights. programme. w dot com highlights. this is far from formation we have an awesome even if you know you saying the us is badly informed yes i think the president or are you worth saving is the government are you really worth of course 8 years after the overthrow of the gadhafi regime libya has descended into almost continual conflict between its rival centers of power my guess this week here in paris is akhmed might speak deputy prime minister

of the un backed government of national accord closely allied to groups of armed militias which have been credited with serious human rights abuses does a government like that still does the support of the west. welcome to called it so i know right last april donald trump showered complements on your main rival in libya only for half which clearly shocked you and yet you claim to come back with a message that the u.s. was still behind you what's the evidence for that well pretty we believe that we've been a us ally for quite a long time we were fighting side by side to fight isis and libya times change the kurds thought that as well. well i'm

a changed because we cannot apply what happened in syria and libya and i'm talking about how alliances come and. mr trump said that he appreciated mr have to a significant role in fighting terrorism their shared vision for libya's transition to a stable democracy high praise from the leader of the western world for your main enemy isn't that standing by you it's a pretty lukewarm way of standing by to. say those things about you know we still believe that. the administration of united states that mr ation of the white house believed down some wrong mistakes so long messages have been around about have torah and his fighting terrorism i think the force in the us is badly informed yes i think the britain and by inform and i believe that the message passed yesterday from the foreign minister of would libyan foreign ministers and the libyan internal

ministers that they want to see libyan stable and the problem in libya settled through a political process yeah but they don't necessarily want you to win anymore the. the issue is not winning a war we are fighting for what you want to talk to have to really be ruled out talking to no it's not the relations between the june a government and have to order a government of national yes then after our government we believe that the libyan people should went for bringing libya to stability to have a democratic countries to have a country which rules by law and not getting back to a military rule and for the good you say this is so in june that just as life illiterate you flatly rejected the idea of talking to have to have stuck can't be trusted you said talking with after is out of the question we need about as what you said when you go to peace process you need the bottles and it was after he wants you to talk so you. on the same page there well why should want you to talk

know why she said that washington story wasn't a did not say that we want to they want us to talk with after and wasn't and say that the political process should be peacefully not through a military. you know attacking tripoli is not the solution they did say the state department official said in april the u.s. is consulting with a broad range of libyan leaders as well as our international partners to print press for stabilization and bring prime minister else iraq and general have to back to the negotiating table so they want you to talk this you think they stay in the same position after 88 months of fighting around tripoli after all the attack on hospitals and schools after all their lives there we lost from both sides on that i think the u.s. message is completely different today i think they want to look at who are causing this war in libya and who's. because in this brochure world you hope it's different

but you have no evidence that it's different in june we had the acting u.s. defense secretary patrick shanahan also saying what we've said before what i do support is field-marshal have to support in terms of his role in counterterrorism but where we need to support is in building democratic stability in the region so there talking still talking about multi players talking to each other yes but at the same issue have to send a clear message to everybody that he don't want to democracy in libya he want to rule libyans for quite sometimes until he see that libya stable to go for democracy i think this is a conflict with in what you project to say from the foreign ministers or. the defense minister you've been pushing the message for a long time the d.n.a. has been pushing the message for a long time that you can win and that you will finally beat him

back outside of tripoli and he knows the game is over it doesn't seem to know that the game is over why have you misled people like this will you think we mislead people i believe after 8 months he did not succeed to get into tripoli after 8 months of fighting with all the support that have to be getting from outside libya he didn't win that he didn't get a libya in tripoli he said that i will be in tripoli in 2 days and he said that repeatedly the g. and a is above the past now we are since the 4th of april was almost for 8 months he did not succeed and as you look at the way around this matic what's driving this conflict isn't just the failure to hold talk it's the fact that the war economy developed over many years has made libya's militia groups absurdly rich and they refused to give this up and that includes militias that are allied to your government as well when we had

a clear program. to clean up tripoli and clean up libya from militia and our program star you haven't got very far have you well we started in the in february with our turnaround ministers but unfortunately i have to attack and the 4th of april and make all disappear of ram and just stand and stop so it's clear that he want to cause he want to use any excuse to attack tripoli does not a problem for militia not a problem for comics windage in a government came to power the production of oil was just 120 better the day to day we are talking about one to 1000000 200000 barrels a day when we came to bowen in libya the libyan currency had a lot of problems thanks well let's talk about these militia groups because in october the world bank said there was now an open war in your country for power and wealth capture and report after report has suggested that only the militia groups hold sway in your country that the prime minister has little if any real power over

the whole country or indeed the forces which are stenson under his control power rests mostly in the hands of the militia cartel this is the view of the small arms . well maybe one side and one side the whole ward standby the cheney politically in public announcement but under the table many of this country's supporting this militia and that's why we have the problems we want to clearance from the rest of the world and country who are helping us in 2011 that there really stand by the governor austin and world is peeling you to cut your links with these corrupt militia groups who you continue to ally with yeah but the still we're going to show him something in this country is they make the will of the militia strongest and this is exactly what we're looking for that in better lean process they'd stop helping different than the government of libya who's

helping who's up. in this many countries which european countries our neighbor countries and some arab countries so so you're blaming it on the on the europeans that you have close ties with murdering militia groups who extort who fire off their weapons against civilian areas it's all europe's fault is it and that they are deeply involved in the corruption of your administration well they don't trust the government. they believe that some of the militia are stronger than the government and they made good will they improve haven't they well they don't prove it when they have to attack tripoli everybody was aligned with the government to different the capital from the military rulers who want to rule the country take the back are a battle and it was ordered by the g.n.a.t. disband after its leader repeatedly involved in fighting tripoli he took no notice the special deterrence force this is a group that detained 2 journalists for questioning and arrested others without

warrant one of its commander said we can't act as if the government were in a position to give us orders in other words they take no notice of you so that's how but some much influence you have on these militias we need time to bring our military together we need time to make our security better you shouldn't have got into bed with these deeply corrupt violent also those aging issues being bad and with this militia disposition was existing before the general government even exist we came and boehner would with more than 30 or 35 militia in tripoli now we have only a few more less than 3 or 4 in tripoli and now under your government a cartel of 4 major militia groups have gradually divided up the capital between themselves and they now hold you and the government of national accord ransom to their changing demands and the endless feuds and corruption when i think you have some good information but some of your information is quite old since that back after of tripoli everybody is united under the umbrella of the jenin we don't have

militias who are as both for as your reporter explain your own interior minister busha. he blurted it out during an interview in january he said his interior ministry budget forced under the control of militia groups by force that's what he set the ministries expenses have reached 300000000 dinars and widespread corruption was found so he said it minutes. budget belongs to when when mr bush of our our ministers say that the holy war should say that he started his program to clean up his ministers from this corrupted militia training and you're government is rotten to the core with these people involved in your budgets taking over your budgets by force it's rotten to the core is no that's why we have a new ministers that's why he started his book around the last mars so everybody knows that you cannot clean up from 30 militia in one day you wake up and you have

all things done you need dimes and the process. and the extortioners going on and you've let it happen and they have over the years the last 2 years they have extorted in attempted to extort huge sums of money from the government you have to look at the whole story the government of genie came to power in 2068 was outside to tripoli came to tripoli clean up a tree body from a lot of militia started this war against diet and i says insert after all after he says he is after reading your. analysis have you just have to say you have to say that you clean a bunch. of them there but never mention that the insert he done the job we done the job after only 4 months of arriving in tripoli at the same time as your militia groups are extorting from you you know that exactly when the country is divided you have to work 1st and you have to have priorities which hour by hour to cleaning up

the country from isis or fighting the militia mr moti if you don't stand for law and order and an end to corruption you don't stand for anything at all no we really don't we do but we get to a country and our country had a long war with isis for more than a year and a half once we done with isis we started up to rebuild our financial institutions and when we get to our financial institution we find a problem with asia and we have problems with our oil production at the same time we find have to attacking oil field and we don't want to go in conflict with him because we have our internal problem with the mission so we have a by your routines as i explained to you we have ability isis issues arise in the production of oil making the life libyans better and of course we have to clean up our country from british air and they are controlling of our many of those are

usually wrong way round because these militia groups have carried out extrajudicial executions they have attacked civilians and civilian properties. and abducted tortured and disappeared people maybe you should have started with them we have a problem and the hold and the hold they have on your government is we have a problems with our borders we have a broad rooms with refugees we have a problems of illegal immigrants we have a problems to make our libyan currency for the 6 millions flippy and their life betters to improve their economies we have to find a way to have you know step one and the time we cannot do it all at the same time. how can you claim them to be any kind of legitimate to authority when you're an affiliate murder and steal their way around your country with absolute impunity none of these militia groups have been brought to account there's no intention to bring them to account is there of course you could have taken some of the leaders

you could have put them on trial if you were really serious about doing something yeah and you bet your capital your own capital at the risk at the same time there isn't a terrorist attack in either city in libya so but there are people going to ask at the end of the day are you worth saving as a government are you really worth it of course we're worth it to make the life to have been better we saved a life people uncertain when if we make the life of the libyans instead of having what one dollars for 40 dollars today is for dinners for one do you know what when will you live better than a 3rd of your people want to leave the country well one of them want to leave your country well because the people who are out of the country who are helping the other side attacking the capitals and making the life of libyan war and causing a proxy war in libya and what about cleaning up the appalling treatment of many thousands of migrants in your country in june the un high commissioner for human rights urged you to launch an immediate investigation into the disappearance of

more than 150 migrants from the al comps detention center under the oversight of your department for combating illegal migration fact is that 203 people were delivered on may the 23rd by june the 7th the facility reported that only 30 were left what happened to these people when we have a lot of immigrants from libya who was not staying there and that that center since particularly disturbing that we are in the light of the fact that immigrant migrants are being sold into forced labor to smugglers who promise them transit to europe and they're being sold from the other homes and that libya alone cannot deal with the immigrants or ship. disses you can't deal with slade this is no no you can't do is lay this is a report had done we have no proof of it ok and we work closely with our you know ministers you have no evidence you know this is going on you've known for the last 2 years it was good no this is not right this is not this is false information we

have no slavery in libya we have no what so called a slavery issue or libya we have to work with international community what is their interest can or is it illegal and you well you know when i was on your i was not what all the reports have been saying they don't all are being sold to people trafficker traffickers and women are being sold for sexual exploitation you denial that you we have no information as a government otherwise we do our job how come they have much more information than you they are better informed. whereas they are when the government is working closely with the international community to save the lives in the middle of the mediterranean seas where does this reports when our coast guard would just very few visitors that we have we saved 1000 the fly every morning and every day where dissident boards when we try to help this immigrants and the middle of sahara desert bring their life to more stable and leave libya we have more than 800000

women into libya live close to what libyans with all of the reports we've been do you know a lot we've been working a lot to save the life of immigrants we believe that we should have bitter reports and bit of understanding of the problems of the international community is committed and willing to work with the libyans not sending audio messages about steven in libya we have been promises a lot on the lot from europeans but nothing been done many of the sense to so your denying responsibility for this so i'm not denying responsibility if something happened and we are responsible for it as a government of libya we will do our best and we are committed to work with the international community and. the life of the immigrants is better but what they will be and what the international community done or this is why they are accusing the libyans as the way why they did not do what they have to do with the libyans when we as it is of we ask for help to do our rebuttal graham they have they've been giving you plenty of training in no has been given nothing of training and you

and you and your kind are yours european and european committee many times a commuter community many times that their promise is it's very very very low than what they already brahmas us if you were doing so much yourself why do you continue to employ people in your coast guard who've been sanctioned by the un i'm thinking of one of your coast guard officials until. according to the sanctions in the sting from june last year he heads the regional unit of the coast guard in zawiya that is consistently linked with violence against migrant and other human smugglers why do you still employ these people i think there is a report coming from our minister of interior saying clearly that he is not an employee for minister of internal the u.n. panel of experts claims that he and other coast guard members directly involved in the sinking of migrant boats using firearms the u.n. says this coast guard is consistently linked and you say you know nothing about it no i said our minister from terminal and they have

a clear statement that this man is not an employee by the minister of internal. so who is employed by the coast guard then well he has the coast guard coding according to the sanctions listing says that he collaborates with other migrants smugglers such as mohammed catch lafe who sources suggest is providing protection and him to carry out illicit operations related to the trafficking and smuggling of migrants several people in criminal investigations have stated they were picked up at sea by armed men on the coast guard ship called tele ill used by millet and taken to the detention center where they are reportedly held in brutal conditions and subjected beatings he of course denies any wrongdoing. of course if something collector's happen we as a government condemned all of this kind of actions and if he's working with our minister of interior or our coast guard he should do band and killed in 2017 the

u.n. secretary general appealed to your government to investigate reports of slaves being sold in libya and you personally you personally announce the setting up of a commission of inquiry to investigate where is this commission of inquiry commission the un has never heard of it yeah they're your own had on the whole report about it and i want mr instead of just us lead this commission and have a clearer ground that's why so that's all you know is nobody you know we talked to including the un has never heard of this commission that was set up you say no we said that and the headed by them our minister frontier know and they done to public announcement about the whole report about slavery about what there is don't think it's liberty in libya and this is was afforded as simply in direct contradiction to all the reports that have pointed to it well for a city of report maybe you got only the 1st part of the report you don't follow up

with the rest of the you can't even tell me where these people incomes went when you were contacted by the un and asked pacifically earlier this year where did these people go to well you are talking about disappeared you did not disappear and they went out of their center well they said there is more than 800000 immigrant live in libya outside the centers so you cannot claim disguise as went out of the center and they're not leaving good condition in libya. the u.s. embassy says that the endemic corruption in your government and the militia influence over government ministries has contributed to your inability to address trafficking effectively you have some responsibility for this you have responsibility for these migrants many of whom are kept in the pool in conditions indefinitely subject to abuse beaten up some in conditions that amount to torture are you prepared one day

to go into a court of law and justify why you kept people in these conditions as long as we have information about what's happening in this interests and that's why we have a regular visitor from the commissioner from new and different places we are doing our best to keep this up to standard it's not so i don't see that it was but sometimes sometime it is difficult to deal with this when there's somebody attacking hospital and school in your town and your country you cannot. talk about immigrants and their problems i know it's an humanitarian tragedy and we're pretty if we will do our best despite that there is nothing being done from the international community there is nothing being done there is no need help what you hear it's easy always to blame some no i'm not blaming them we're not blaming them with you we have

a large window of the responsible we are we we are an african nations and arab nations and the mediterranean and there is a responsibility lie on our shoulders as a government of libya but we are in time for and conflict and that's why we need the international community to stand by us helping us to manage this fight it's a big fight libya cannot deal with this fight alone and that's why we ask the international community standards to get rid of the militias of course we need to wait what we did get the flu shot we need to get rid of the military rulers we need to have a better life of libya when the government of national called has been look at what the government of national call did look in 34 years name one government in the world then. liberate a city like sirte from isis without any water on the ground helping the libyans the libyan did it alone the government beyond the war and that

tack of half tours of the capital as we have a bitter financial. and you have a long list and you have a long list of failures as well of course there is fear here long i'm something i'm not found go to even use the back is a big reforms i'm not you agree last year yeah i think fuel subsidies all the thing unifying the central bank failure to settle the teachers is not our failure to invest in basic services no electricity no no i suppose i said it's very clear for me that we had a lot of success stories and we have a failure. we have a success story that we can brow different we are very proud for the government but the same times we have a problems because there is there is very limited time to do always there is a problems with conflict in libya there is always that the country has or doesn't want to be stable and there is

a big challenge for government overall during a conflict and during the present of isis and terrorism in the country ok i quit my take good deal conflict so thank you very much we think out of time thank you. to to to. get.

to it. in a. searching for identity and recognition . of turkish citizens with african roots. their forebears were brought to the ottoman empire as slaves. even today their descendants are treated like outsiders. know they're demanding change.

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time. again across the city. these latest developments of course. the battlefield. all up and. are fleeing from. the expectations are definitely there. for a family that's not very much because they never seem. to. make.

business news live from berlin syrian forces pound. residents flee for their lives government troops backed by tanks are non-singing ground assault on the last pockets of resistance hundreds of thousands. people in rebel held areas have taken to the road with nowhere to go but makeshift camps where conditions are squalid. pope francis delivered his christmas message from the vatican the pontiff told thousands of worshippers packed in st peter's square to let the light of christmas pierced the darkness and human hearts also made.