discovered. subscribe to a documentary. i think there's been a lot of. misrepresentation when it comes to the double depressed we didn't extremely very well you ranked 120th out of 180 countries of glorious record is that when the still things a lot of ignorance and a lot of this chief law is something has to belittle covering up damaging evidence doesn't it it doesn't it is a true interest being taken care of despite promises to respect the rule of law nigeria's government stands accused by the international community of serious human

rights abuses my guest this week here in london is live mohammed the country's information minister how does he defend against the country's many critics when the evidence of wrongdoing is so compelling. like mohammed welcome to call himself thank you for the human rights record of your administration has been widely condemned by the un western countries your own lawyers international human rights bodies for brutality and the stunning lack of accountability why do you see this go on in the region why didn't you get a grip on this i think there's been a lot of. misrepresentation. by all these groups absolutely really working concert well or you know they're working constant and they're

working in not a lot but i know for a fact that's essential in particular as being very sensitive to the issue of human rights most sometimes terrorists politicians activities are confused with human rights so you put it all down to confusion i would do that because i do not know as a fact and i've been minister for almost 5 years that this any policy of my mistress. does deliberately targeted at infringing on anybody's rights missed the last september the un special rapporteur on extrajudicial summary

or arbitrary executions agnus kalama she launched a damning report on nigeria i'm sorry and the human rights abuses of your security forces she said that she spoke of countrywide patterns of abuses include the police military's excessive use of lethal lethal force in violation of the political international standards i'm sure you read the report page is not a person who makes these accusations lightly or indeed i did but i would up much more impressed even example was. i given now you must not forget that then you has been locked in in a war of attrition with a book for almost a decade and the kind of. war we're fighting is a war amongst people. and. even then the military has been very

careful to assure that as much as possible writes i know about it now i've also read about the reports of people who claim that their as an balloted simply because they have been arrested by any of the security agencies and they've been asked to go through or due process but i know their support is in this government does nobody today what is right if it's not a matter of policy why have there been so few investigations the un investigator spoke about the absence of meaning effective investigations the absence of meaningful prosecution all of which are compounded she said by the lack of transparency over the vast majority of security issues that accusation about lack of transparency and effective communication strategy goes straight to your door minister doesn't it you are the minister of information serious criticism here

but what i do know as a fact that. several. cases of abuse of you know rights kelly against soldiers have not only be investigated but people have been punished and have been made public how many how many people i don't know off yet but i knew the minister of information was of course i can't know everything but i know for i know that the military or so is very jealous of his reputation and they have set up many. piles and i think that officer either been dismissed or imprisoned. the international criminal court isn't isn't impressed by a record that says in 20000 there was a reasonable basis to believe that the nigerian security forces committed the war

crimes of murder torture cruel treatment outrages upon personal dignity and intentionally directing attacks against the civilian population but you have failed to cooperate with the investigators and failed to provide information that they requested and if you take these things seriously and you cannot but take the word of the international criminal court seriously you would have provided that information why didn't you how do you know what information they are asking for a lawyer provided by another would incorporate in with a brief history when they come to they say they weren't they weren't getting help from you they were getting them from the hay nor that the i.c.c. . met with the authorities had a career and we would have no choice but to cooperate they've been waiting for years to get your cooperation and it hasn't come minister maybe you're out of the loop here what maybe you don't have information about what's going on in your own

government and very. informed or go so my government and ourselves i do need to do take the trouble to ask and. i'm not i'm not aware that we have we don't our cooperation from the i.c.c. the u.n. special rapporteur speaks of countless allegations of excessive use of force by your police in particular officers of the special anti robbery squad or saw as you said you wanted specific examples there's a specific examples they've been accused of widespread torture in some cases leading to deaths in custody and extra judicial killings so the unit is clearly out of control isn't it because the un human rights committee warned your government to ensure that this group operates in accordance with international standards because they don't trust that it's doing that at the moment why would that be. i think i'm

aware of that and at a point in time when support came out the sas was disbanded and all little constituted and you know weren't that as forth they must. be sure that the operating within the confines of the know your own national human rights commission investigated their activities and even held public hearings but the results were never published were. not aware that the river i'm not i'm not aware that i was on what are published and i took my assumption has to be that you're covering up damaging evidence doesn't it with your friends i don't think so we have. some police men were dismissed their science was disbanded and reorganized there after. minister on the question of providing information to outside investigators you failed to provide

information to the u.n. under the international covenant on civil and political rights which nigeria has signed last august the treaty body accused you of failing to honor your reporting obligations under article 40 of the covenant and ignoring numerous reminders to do so why is that when you told me all cooperating so openly with these bodies why would they say that but the housing truth i want to know that they will say that but i know that we have never shown any international. we are very open as to the facts those who are not or she will use it much as possible for any country who is in no way gene and in turn out you know who supplied the internet you know is so jessie very open and we we operate with international you know regulations and laws well clearly you don't go into the

bodies that monitor these situations well it depends upon it it depends on from which perspective they're getting the information we're getting it from different perspectives and then we're talking about human rights organizations international human rights organizations we're talking about the u.n. we're talking about. all kinds of bodies the international criminal court they're all saying the same thing but you're not cooperating and you sit here in front in front of me minister says about simply not true it's like saying it's darkness outside when we can see it's very like no no no i think that knowledge is not correct i ignore the daily with receive entity and we engage all of these bodies. as a government and you're not going to move from that version despite the evidence that i have quite a level of i'm yet to see anybody any evidence that them. that is

so very unlike a white and official and that has not responded to it when he talked about associates admitted that yes it will be pursued report and we took action minister when you're not stonewalling on requests for information you are taking radio stations of the air 'd and having reporters arrested or beaten june last year you tried shutting down nigeria's oldest private t.v. channel as well as radio stations owned by a member of the opposition p.d.p. raymond dock pacey a federal court overturned your suspension but the nigerian guild of editors called this a barbaric crackdown on free speech why are you launching a barbaric crackdown on free speech i think is a lot of ignorance and a lot of this chief geddes just don't know what i'm talking about of read the press is station worked last dell because he ordered the national red little not because of the news he was pushing out and in january last year soldiers raided the

offices of one of your leading papers the daily trust and arrested reporters in march of journalists have been held for 2 years was rearrested you rank 100 and 20th out of $180.00 countries in the press freedom in their acts of reporters without borders it's not a glorious record is it minister well i think when it comes to the level of the press. we're doing extremely very well if papers run foul of the law on the must visit consequences but when you have back to the 100 newspapers in a country and a 2nd example one is pivotal squadron with here i think should be fair to us that's why we have a very robust free press amnesty international says that between january and september last year at least 19 journalists and media practitioners were attacked

those attacks including verbal and physical assault and indiscriminate arrest and detention by your security forces in the impression ministers therefore that your aims seems to be to stifle freedom of expression especially critical voices you don't like criticism that's the caret is it because i think many of these people don't live on that don't know the eco system of the media in injury virtually every major you know print media is owned by individuals and i can tell you that this they had a list of all 12 national newspapers and trust their literacy i thought i don't quite remember what the story was but you cannot take the example of one newspaper among about 20 to say that the country is stifling the media on the contrary at a point in time i thought that was the government it was actually at the receiving end of the media what has also worried people enormously his decision to submit

a bill which in its original form would have seen anyone convicted of so-called hate speech actually sentenced to death by hanging on the particular circumstances you actually wanted and you sort authorization from parliament to kill people because of something they said why would you do a thing like that extraordinary and shocking provision added what it is. as eager as a people there's what is cause oppression of power in or in most major democracies this particular be talking about is it bill submitted not by designating a budget or just measured by the state of arm of government so how can you accuse the executive you summited you submitted this we did not as is also the sort of ignorance we did not this this is a private member's bill by a senator with just the you have this and you're telling me you didn't want it to

go through is that we do have a choice in which bills to go through or not the bill has been discussed this public hearing what is it the government does not commit to when the bill has been passed and you didn't use any influence to get the sort out or absolutely none if this bill had gone through minister journalists could have been jailed for any article deemed threatening abusive or insulting and could have been hanged if their work caused any loss of life what you didn't object to this bill did you. see this was what is called the tree of subpoena power. the only thing you can do as president is refuse your asset such a lot the last law been passed the law to what was not our data but executive the law is still going through the senate so how is that how did i does mr president stop it with i've been accused of not dictatorship and muslim the you telling me

you wouldn't have signed the law with that provision in it i think this you can tell me that you had been speculating you can't tell me why when we went we get one yet that bridge right across it would look at what are the contents of that law in what form will it be passed but you see people rushed in order to history to judge to judge when you can't if we don't have one you said we submitted that that bill we did not we know nothing other than wanted submitted knew we don't micromanage the parliament really what about the protection from internet for sword and manipulations bill also carrying draconian provisions on the journalists could be in prison and who for publishing content all the author of that bill are you against this bill or not i'm not even aware of that bill you're not of the protection from internet falso the manipulations bill you're not even aware of now a bit. so i can't because it's causing it's causing an outcry internationally and

you're the minister of information and i know nothing about this nor thought bill before the house there is a bill to say that averted that it is really there is not such a bill before the house reporters without borders these bills talking about the prohibition of hate speech bill and the protection from internet falso the manipulations bill they said these bills contain extremely harsh penalties that violate international law and are likely to be used to gag the media and you are saying you know nothing about this one just the same with you were wrong in saying that the lives of me did the hit with bill. mr let's talk about corruption because in your country it seems to begin with the government doesn't and the international center for investigative reporting said last year that among 9 countries in sub-saharan africa nigeria has the worst managed sovereign wealth

fund based on accountability transparency and oversight why is your record so bad absolutely false. absolutely possible reported by the national resource institute's africa office based on data from 2017 said you had failed to regularly disclose publicly the financial interests of government officials in the extractive sector or the identities of beneficial owners of extractive companies despite making public commitments to do so the subsidy forces the 1st to do the 1st obligation as a minister a public official is way too little it probably declare ration of all your assets. and any minister or public official who does not do so risks being prosecuted and we know many who are not been prosecuted as a result of that too is to the courage of this administration that only if you months ago we passed you know we put in the in place a policy that compels every ministry every department to make public any

expenditure above 10000 past so that the public can challenge what is being spent for is altogether a position that nor government has ever succeeded in securing the condition of high profile politicians as an instruction as by those of them who belong to the ruling party we continue to fight corruption because and you for and you follow the rules do absolutely so in 2018 why in towards the close of president will his 1st wives of the auditor general himself raise serious concerns about the so-called excess crude account that you have this is an oil savings account which holds dollar reserves from crude oil that are sold above the assumed benchmark price and in july that year the auditor general warned you to bring your handling of this account into line with the more why if you tell me you follow the rules did he feel

the need to say this is precisely because. he said it shows how to correct the assertion is the other there are is an appointee of just how shocking he thinks your behavior actually is no us nor on the contrary relations the level of transparency in demonstration that an appointee of god plenty can't say this yet retain his job he noted there have been doctrines from the account which appeared to have been made illegally in other words deductions that apparently violated constitutional provisions why would that be and why would he say that if you're following the rules as you tell me you are everywhere in the world to live in the most well known democracies you have what it is generous you have what would it a generous yes yes and their duty is to monitor the excesses of government not the part that is allowed to do the job and the sciri mince in office i think the thing

is testament to the fact that we really belittles bit in the administration the effect if this is one congratulations for the always refer to our god for as good as or as good from you as as i was supposed to know not just as i'm from the auditor general who says you are not in line with the law but with that you don't think that matters are prejudiced to the. to the correctness or not of that you know and the fact that he can make that allegation submit it is bill clinton and his team are admitted that they are i think it's that will happen in a day and station that does not believe interest me said the audit team could find no legal authority for even the existence of this excess crude account so it's a sham and a slush fund isn't it but i don't buy don't you admit it. and. yeah there's no legal basis for this for this account and you know i don't think it's correct to

say that this normally would be as well because the. court could access a cult i've known about it even before we came to government. it said the audit team could find no legal authority for even the existence of this excess crude account how come you didn't order persistent warnings from the auditor general as he said year after year not just your government but the previous one going back to 2007 to bring this in line with the law again you tell me you follow the rules but it's not backed up by the auditor general we follow the rules and like even that allegation in that article is correct the all idea of an auditor general is to point out to you what you do wrong and for you to do it right i don't see any go beyond the war that is in all we always follow the law will do everything correctly but as he gave the fund that that original recommend the report and nothing else happen to him is still an office yes and what you continue to make illegal

deductions from the account what it depends what you may get a look at the illegal doctrine deductions that violated constitutional provisions it's not easy if if it does member list concessional provisions it is the little duty of parliament to take appropriate action but i don't believe that we do sponsibility the government if it cares about the people's money to mend its ways and oh of course and will but that's if you had lived that you have even belittled the loss but what i'm saying is and yes they are turned out with alfonso nominees the or lessons of a degenerate anywhere in the ward that they will be chosen balances and ali as does what we'll put out here is that the asshole regularities and then the appropriate you know i am of god plenty we didn't fall so what are you going to do in future about this i'm sure it has been iffy what are you going to do if those alligators are true and she has been taken care of but hasn't been in these been reporting and

complaining about the government's attitude to the sick since 2007 well just as the un has been complaining that you haven't been giving information about. and excesses of violence used by your security forces as the international criminal court has been complaining all these complaints are piling up minister what are you going to do in the future when we stone wall we look at every complacent we look at our things there and we take action like i've told you there been several. many many jobs as i've been guilty some have been dismissed and it's now interests global witness says despite a 50 year all boom which transform the jury's economy into the largest in africa 80 percent of your people live on less than $2.00 a day they say that an estimated $400000000000.00 has gone missing from state coffers are you going to tell the people of nigeria where the money has gone.

and our watch between 20152980 nobody can supply suffered in such allegation and i can only speak for when i became minister and i can see that between 25th and today nobody can talk about all the money missing. my mama thanks very much for being so thank you very much.

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