kennedy also said that nature is not acting together and i dare say that nature will be pleased to hear that because one thing they too doesn't want to be seen as is a party in this war as an alliance. that is not only a defensive alliance, which it keep stressing. berlin has been accused of by ukraine time and time again of not doing enough and not acting fast enough. that was that spectacular turn around from not supplying any weapons to now supplying weapons. but of what i hear from what we just heard from ukraine's foreign minister, that is, that there seems to be a lot less reservations now about delivering not just heavy weapons, but also offensive weapons. he stresses that any weapons and to ukraine right now is defensive in nature because the country is defending itself against an aggressor . i'm not sure everybody would share that you when it comes to the exact details. because from a german also historical perspective, it does seem hard to imagine that for instance, german tags could be pointed at russ russian soldiers. this really is a historical issue here in germany as well. but more and more reservations are

crumbling away and caliber and they're criticized that it one. all these rules need to be broken one by one as you put it. first of all, no weapon supplied. now, heavy weapons, now an offensive weapons. what i found interesting is he was asked about security guarantees. this is also something that german chancellor raised in his parliamentary question time yesterday. yes, these debates are taking place to labor here, criticising partners for not mapping out to vision and the germans just to share with you what german chances said there as well. saying nope, who will not oppose or we will not to press any kind of vision for ukraine's future on the ukrainian president. this has to be a ukrainian decision in itself. so clearly still criticism of the partners, but also certain amount of gratitude, but also fear that and we've already seen evidence that there are many beaches, there will be more images arriving here. and, and most importantly,

that action is not happening and the weapons are not delivered fast enough to prevent more and more as such as those atrocities. and just to take a historical detour, if there was one bit of soul searching from the former yugoslavia from the casa intervention, it was that accent came too late to prevent something like 70. you mentioned terry, before we come her back to you, i just wanted about on here for diploma taylor. you said the, the factoring, i think that sums it up quite nicely. the reluctance of germany to deliver heavy weapons so that we could end up of german tanks shooting at russian soldiers. and i would, has of which has a very nasty precedent of course in world war 2. but is that kind of symbolism still important for germany's thinking it still is. but what i read into what we've just heard from ukraine's foreign minister is that those reservations are gone. we

heard from the german chancellor yesterday, that anything that makes sense and is deliverable should now be delivered. there was no carvette in this, and we now here have the ukrainian foreign minister saying, yes he is getting weapons. and that, that last reservation seems to have been dropped by many partners. he wouldn't name them. and we heard the german defense minister say that she does not what want to go into details of what is being delivered. so that suggests to me that even that reservation is at least crumbling at this moment in time. a terry shows in brussels story boucher happened a just a couple of days ago or a movie or evidence came to light color a couple of days ago. has boots are changed the thinking in the corridors of nato therein. brussels we've certainly heard expression after expression of shock and horror, disbelief, and anger at moscow that something like boucher has happened and that we know that

it's not the only one. we know that there are going to be more images from more cities and that the death toll is nowhere near known at this point. and that's something that to me, to recall about ukraine. foreign minister said time. and again in his press conference he said it should not have taken a boucher for people to act for people to agree to send us weapons. and in fact, it didn't. but he still says that they're moving too slowly. he said, you know, as, as mckayla said, we've broken down that wall where they said, oh, we can't send offensive weapons. because obviously, any weapons you send to a country under attack will be used defensively. but he said now the problem is that they're saying, well, it will take us time to send you more or to send you exactly what you're asking for . and we've seen these hitches in, for example, poland willingness to send its mig 29 fleet to ukraine. but they couldn't get it there. they haven't agreed on a way to to transport it so that it wouldn't provoke a more direct conflict with, with moscow. so those planes have gone nowhere, despite poland,

willingness to give them all the $28.00. i believe it is of them to ukraine. so he said now this last while to be broken down is time. he said we don't have any more time, so don't sit there, you don't understand what it's like to be. us. don't sit there and tell me that it's going to take time because we don't have any for talked with. my mother was a pretty emotional statement there from a to me. true cooler, but at what would constitute a success for him. when he leaves brussels, we know that he is no longer asking for a no fly zone. for example, that's something that nato said from the beginning is a non starter. there will not be nato planes in the air space of ukraine. there will also not be nato boots on the ground. it will not be any nato soldiers going there. so we're not hearing ukraine res, that any more here at nato? i think. fast to deliveries of weapons, he would not say exactly what's been promised to him of anything. he said that that doesn't seem to aid the process at all, but they definitely need more major weapon system,

anti missile systems. they've asked for these things this morning on, on his way, and he said we need warplanes. as i mentioned earlier than the 29th, i have gone nowhere from poland. so i think that what you crane wants to see is some of this very heavy weaponry delivered as quickly as possible, delivered yesterday. because as you said, you've seen with boucher. it's too late for many of these people, and many more people will die unless you hurry over here. let's have another look at the german situation here. this war has seen some trudy. seismic shifts in german policy foreign policy. first, the government refused to send weapons tool was on that was a given for many, many years and came around on that next. it refused to suspend old stream to nordstrom to the gas pipeline, to pull to pluck on that as well. and still it has refused to hold

a port. so from gas at the next big milestone, don't you think will it happen? now the next milestone is really germany agreeing to coal and then oil. and then potentially even gas. i think we're far off from any kind of gas span and hold to gas. oil still is a very long stretch for germany, and there is children reduction tons of coal. but we do understand that this 5th sanctions package that was already underway before we saw the 1st image coming out of booter has been made tougher, more robust since and here we heard the cranium. foreign minister agree that it would make it. he expects that to make a change, but what he still demands and he says is still too slow and that would be the next bill to be broken. is to go the full way. have it all at once, have heavy weapons and have more assertive weapons delivered fast. and at the same time because he stress at that time is of the essence, a complete energy band. and that simply is not on the cards. yet i caution from the

european and from the german side here. okay, now here in berlin, partials of brussels. many, thanks to both of you. of course, we'll bring you more on the nato, a meeting that is wrapping up in brussels. later in this program, we are waiting for a press conference from nato secretary general. yes, store back. and as soon as it happens, we'll have it live here. but 1st, it's invading ukraine. russian forces have attacked more than 100 medical facilities. the world health organization says more hospitals and health care facilities have been a doctor on the globe this year and ever recorded. or while on world health day, the un body as calling on competence to avoid targeting health facilities. ah, the momentum bomb exploded in the city of mary awful and

this is what was hit the maternity and children's hospital since the start of rushes invasion, more than 90 health facilities, including hospitals like this one in the city of him have been attacked. according to the world health organization, brutal bullock, and for some more than once at the start of the war, the main hospital in the town of bo nova, with hit days later, it was attacked again. and then again, while dozens of civilians were hiding inside, trying to escape the shelling among them was andree key and hint of head of the hospitals trauma center who was there with his wife and children with

the experience still haunts him. a shilling lasted about 20 to 25 minutes with you was clear and the kids just removed. it may just be my children and i didn't make it to the basement. we spent all this time in the corridor of the hospital. we experienced all the shilling 1st hand i should given this beer. pavlo cove, tony oak, is ukraine's foam, and deputy health minister. he now runs an organization that's trying to document each and every hospital attack or our main and primary goal is to help our content. our international community to hold accountable

those people who would do those, the work cracks. and this is what really makes our team really, really want to read it because they feel that they're doing something very important for this war. which asked the war use to do the attacks of prosecutions seem a long way off and joining us now for more on the stories you williamson, he's the director of the europe and central asia division as human rights force. you give us an idea of what is needed in terms of investigation, evidence witness, testament testament is in so on in bring a prosecution for alleged war crimes to trial. thanks for having me. yeah. i mean, a variety of sorts of evidence is needed on the high quality witness testimony from survivors of alleged crime. forensic evidence is very important to ukraine

investigation in boca, for instance, at the moment north of kia in both forensic expert in this claim to the you in the us said those experts to ukraine was you need to be looking at open source material as well. videos and photos and verifying those materials really were made where the video maker said they were made. so these sorts of things coming together and, and being seen through the legal framework of the law of war, the geneva conventions, which define how parties behave in war conditions. now, earlier today we heard from a counsel to the international criminal court at the hague. if he suggested that n g o n journalist or reporting on this was a good country view to witness fatigue before the case comes to trial. what's your take on that? that's an interesting perspective. we pay that sometimes from legal experts. we see

our role as gathering evidence as quickly as possible, but men take us to be as possible and not producing a not creating witness. but we are very, very careful when we're interacting with witnesses, not to reach home and tied them to ensure they have social medical, psychological support. so we think they should have a, have a role playing alongside, obviously, the patient investigative. now, could there be grounds for crimes against humanity or genocide as president zalinski is alleging against humanity is a broad term. and what crimes fall within that genocide in the very specific term used for an intended eradication of our own or part of a, of a group. in this case, probably the ukrainian population, we don't think they get the evidence is not there. so that's why we think it's important to focus on what is evidently that the widespread will crimes with human

rights watch and others have been event buying, plus the bones attacks on civilians execution and rank by by russian soldiers, but also abused by the ukrainians. i just mentioned that you published to report about abuse either the prisoners of war, russian fishes of war by ukraine. now, the international criminal court has already opened an investigation, but russia is not a member of that organization. could we see other countries trying the crimes that have been committed in ukraine under the legal principle of universal jurisdiction? certainly we encourage other countries to do so we're in germany. we encourage germany to a serious investigation that is announced in principle. universal jurisdiction is an incredibly important legal tool tool that enables a country traditional system to bring to court. people commit serious crimes such as war crimes outside their jurisdiction. we saw it effective in the syrian case in

the last year and in january this year. so we think it's an important tool that could be used more she williams of human rights watch. thank you very much. thanks, allie, me. in poland, almost 30000 volunteers have joined the territorial defense forces. that's similar to the us national guard. we meet one of the volunteers who wants to be prepared just in case he says, the war has made him rethink things, even if poland is a member of nato. a soldiers from a native battle group training polish volunteers as going out and working urban warfare tactics in case an emergency required volunteers to defend.