the story that matter to you, the whatever it take, i police and i we are here is actually on fire made for mine. in ukraine, the strategic eastern, the city of savior done yet. well, last week the russian forces mocking what some west the next code, a critical point in the complex. so where does it go from here? the weekend g 7 leaders restated support for key f. but with heavy weapons, they probably arrived in time to boost ukraine's fortunes on the battlefield. my guest this week has an unusual role in this war. upon my off one fact in the lower house of russia's parliament,

them became the only members to vote against the seizure of crimea. he's now in k f and says that e mail putins was a go way beyond ukraine. nato. that's funny in his sight. she wants to crush natal that's his strategic goal. crushed april, as for russia itself on my off as a civil war is inevitable. but one of the many russians who professed stability, however repressive to freedom. and what kind of russia will emerge on all the guns a silence that much more unconscious eye upon the mary of welcome to contact zone. thanks for having me. hello. let's talk. if we may about the latest developments in the war, from your standpoint, how critical for ukraine was the loss of surgery done? yes. can the dumbass that was not critical to my my and that was

a planned loss. the current tactics of ukrainian army just to suck as much blood from the invaders as possible to make them pay yearly for every single meter of the territory of the capture. so they slowly retreating, but well together the losses for last month and a half for they can be counted with just several kilometers of the territory, but they have been beach with thousands and thousands life. so rational soldiers, but this was the largest city ukraine still held in the lucon region. any hope that they could take it back once heavy weapons arrive in greater numbers from the west . the, no, it's, it is the large see to relatively 100000 inhabitants. they are, but 30 c charlie, which is right across the you are,

is the same 100000. so we just, life is smaller, but more or less they are same sites that they look major seizures the same or you will that was in video. christian for example, is 400000 people. how to get more than the 1000000, you know, if with 5000000 people. so then the large thesis is just the rational prop. i got the criminal ones look to make it look significant from the you mentioned the key s the renewed attacks on key f. we're seeing the attack on the shopping center in crime and choke yesterday. what does this say about a new phase in russia's tactics? is that how you see this? what are they moving towards? now? i think that these, that 6 exist from the very 1st b lee was to provoke ukrainians to revolt against federal government.

they want to provoke internal tensions within the country. so they just acted like terrorists which tried to disseminate, there are horror within the ordinary people. that's, that's the only thing because it said not the minute the objects, their ra, low stockpiles or explosives, they are the claim to be their. ringback military regiments, wykita to those trading centers. it's deliberate, back on the city when the structure. let's go back to february. if we may, just before the start of the war, you didn't believe the warnings from the americans. that putin was going to invade because you said he'd be signing his own death sentence. where now more than 4 months into the conflict. do you still think that best sentence is pending? absolutely. i think that the calm down has started. and i think the

last year or which was life, i don't know whether he will survive the next year. holidays may be yes. may be a lot. but so i think that his time on this planet is about what makes you say that the atmosphere in russia, not a lot of people are bidding much have to read what's going on, especially russian ladies, which are for unsanctioned, especially russian government. because the see the dead them believe me, the see the situation is not going anywhere the most. so we're circles the site the just compound is growing there as well. they are the main donors for this war in terms of people. that's where the recruitment is coming from

the same time, the suffering, the most from the raising prices of the deficit from the unemployment. so i think that that one point in time, those to discuss. ready for so will collide with create the major explosion last the social life and rush. discontent is one thing, but you've been talking in the past about a civil war inside russia being inevitable. russia is locked down in a repressive police state who's going to organize the civil war. but that's the reason for the civil war. you know, he will be political liberty as the rest of us will be able to participate in the election. so obviously they will turn ballots to get to the, the, with the middle in the legal way, but with the leg learn for some thoughts. russians

are accurately, is that there is no way to get him to the election. so that's why the one thing is a violent progress. because right now, in russia, there is a growing number of people who are trained that the fuels of war and which are returning, being very unhappy with what they saw in ukraine range of them are arms. so that's the direction goes, there's no organized political force in russia. you said there are people who are dissidence and political activists, and they're against bruton and what political change. but they are disorganized to turn disorganized groups into the kind of groups that would stage a civil war and could organize effective armed resistance to the government. what needs to happen in russia? confused to different things. when you're saying the word resistance, what i was telling you was somebody still stunned them. this position. yes,

there is no organized a position in rush. the route position, mind people, but there is more position they there. there are no political parties. there are low, non government is ations, there are no legal networks or people who are rigid, who you've a fight political fight, legal fight against the current government. they are either in the mail or in jail . but in terms of resistance, if we're talking about the violence reasons, this is growing right now. it's financial every single day. we see no new and new attacks in the restroom to refer as buddy good media groups. and course the police cars. recently, it was more serious thing. it was a suicide. droll that the back refinery, which belongs to the permit ritual,

one of which i was growing is, has actually been in the ukraine. and that's a major effect. that was the primary which, which was the blood. so i think that this month would be growing and it doesn't need to be now organized, right? a lot of groups that us cooper at the cross structure and the grass rules and that we see those effects that come in and go truly appreciate what you see to that. that really shows the political demand for an action like this. and that's why i'm very optimistic that this reasonable for so the button many of you these days, you run a media venture in ukraine code february morning with the express purpose of bringing down putins regime by, i suppose, reporting the news that russians can't get from their own genders and promoting active resistance. you said our job at the end of the day is an uprising of the

masses. how's that going? as i'm saying it's, it's happening in front of our eyes. it's, it's happening every single day. you know, we have more and more in use, like i just said to report, while classical liberal journalists are living in russia, we vice versa are spreads in inside the country. we currently have winches, 7, outposts within the country as well as we are opening more school bureau by these of equation where we are doing this because we have people fordable to praise or for being prosecuted. we're not afraid of being oppressed. who are fighters? how many people you think are tuning into your channel right now? was half a 1000000. that's more or less the windows. and would you take credit for some of the armed and attacks that you've been talking about?

some, some, your little right. you're a little reticent about that, look with the brand, the international terrorist. right. so we are helping people. we are not claiming the responsibility, but we are assisting them as the war has gone on. how far do you think putins ames have scaled back? he didn't get to key f, but he started showing it again. do you think he will push again towards the capital? i think he'll try. i think he'll try to think that's what he is trying to get on the little president shanker. i think that one of the possible things which is asking him is to go in between. yeah. so this swell key core door that connects the little with cleaning graph and one

flip with lethal. i think that's one of the directional stuff, which is really once lucas trying to get the goal was to learn to keep or do you think he wants to fight with nato? lucas shanker wants to win it, but which ones different? which helps that. it's an issue that he can't get rid of is that i will just in that she wants to crush nasal. that's his strategic goal. crushed april. the way it may happen, if you would provoke of the kind of conflict where nice would not broker in your response if you will for one of the members will actually have them like that, that quality quine. what's nice would look and go article 5, then late, it was redone, right. what will win? so if it's exists, like prove that it's redundant, presumably. yeah. so, so that's,

that's what you're trying to try to look. he thinks the germans, for example, would not be or white way, the lights russian and russian forces with a nuclear threat. and that's why for him, it would be really convenient for the sold will be made by belittle. so russia itself, because of the situation, he would be very much in degree. it is like from russia with another country about this country acting as rushes proxy. and it will create the local channels within the west, on the one to determine how to react them. that may result in article being this desire to provoke a fight with nato. is that why we're seeing the level of anti western rhetoric? mounting? i think that so more target to, to rushes audience because he needs to keep the society consolidated. he needs to

get the ideal i am alive behind his back that they will not listen or any me voices like us in february this morning. but she stops working. we see the russian, the lose interest. so the word military for income, they started to watch more and more questions about the domestic woman. and this is something that the august berwick, one of futons united, russia and bes, andrea go off said recently that they'd already chosen which western city would be hit 1st in the event of world war 3 scenario, not on a would go to london. is that block for a serious threat in your view room just in every parliament in the world? i think that there are some crazy people, like say different created things just to get more votes during next election. some

rational parliament right now is especially reach with such people from one guys it's still in about nuclear attack, london and other guys still in about me. not seeing that you can show will depend on so pretty to in, you know, if it gets in that, that was the same as the recognized independence of rush if they would been out. but he couldn't, you show me when you then let me start going to but sure, sure the back of the president of the country. but these guys are just completely out there now with their mind, but it's video. well, the. ready for a kremlin because which with, with such a lie, so looks like a video of the bowl game. and that's what he wants to build the web. you know, you better keep me in office because if not me, it would be those guys coming. let's go back if we make your time in russian politics and in 2014, you belong to one of the smaller parties in the duma,

the lower house of parliament. and you achieve notoriety by being the only member of that assembly to vote against the annexation of crime in 2014. did you not think in doing that that you might be signing your best sentence? oh, i had some ideas. yes. i was preparing to go under grounds, i was thinking that i would be physically depressed pressure me just. ready look in the height out of the thing, but looks like it was personal. which of these you would just say this. otherwise he decided to punish me directly, but to neutralize them. they are mine. like pushing me outside. russia was a way to neutralize me in rational, but you were featured on a billboard in moscow when you were labeled. you are

a national traitor. how do i feel, you know, and they should tracer. that's actually something that was invented personally by the keeper. this worked for the 1st time a year than mine come, we should old. well with. so it's a part of a can be a real respect with them. and the result of all his surrounding both is all his courts. yes. and that was a new words, and most folks and another teachers with my faith, but also some other nice places because they also are musicians clear st. brought a song some by actually like through. i like to tell you we're in good company. you were in good math, so i was, i'm very proud to have those for those with me. you know, it's something to make my heart stronger. you've suggested that the system in russia needs putin to survive. you, you pictured him, i think, as a, as a spider,

the sense of his own self constructed web saying that without him that web would die. why do you believe that isn't his system fully in line with the repressive structures that russians have had to endure for century? oh, actually, what so which law accomplished is destruction of all institutes of power? it was very visibly demonstrate that the in 1008th, when the switch places with mentoring me at the time, russia was very much the parliamentary public because the power should we lead into the government was like a partisan, brian minister very much like in great, you know, the sources, but in reality, knowing that you should work the parliament, there is no government there. and the security forces there is no,

we want the president just loading up with them and people who are is kronos, that's it. that makes the country very vulnerable, but also makes the system better vulnerable, which and have done the deliberately so that he would not be mixed because every budget, all the parts of the web, the younger his them say, understand how he keeps the bells so they understand that without him, they would not survive. and so they're interested in keeping him as a spider, in, in the sense that his personal security. but in a way, the russian, people still support him in very large numbers. it's impossible to say exactly how large the numbers are, but what does it say about the russian mentality that repressive stability is considered preferable to freedom. you know, it does not say much about russian policy. it says much about the

horror, the but the so $99.00 says where rationals were really here with the me calls with . we are with the destruction of the country and they don't let him know which. and that's what he's trying to push and never says to russians that i'm the best of the best deal. oh, well, it would be in his just telling me maybe not perfect, but others are worse than me. if you will take those up. are you sure guys, they all are people from 9 since even about they grew up from the stablish month of my interest, so they will return the you to the time. so what it feels there is nothing worse like that. and rational say ok. ok. ok. ok, maybe or look perfect, maybe even corrupt, maybe, but people on the on, but we have you them to go back in that direction as soon as russians won't see him

and sort of answer to this, which looks was it from their eyes? this vision would collapse yellow within the week the, the russian writer, the master of seroquel, says russians themselves to blame for putin and especially his wor, clever people, he says, have had 20 years to work out. who put in is in the early years, oil prices rose living standards improved, and people turned a blind eye to the autocratic excesses. they wandered in luxury. they traded their conscience for material well being. and now their reaping the reward is that fair comment was concerned. right? i think it's pretty much on, on, on target, but that's what makes me really said we have in ukraine, the discussion, whether it would rational to do this. and to my mind, there are no good russians the good the russia to the merch, when they will replace william, that of which and then those people who would replace him who would stop the war, who would stop the aggression from the blood ship? they would be the brussels and they feel very much for you migrate from which i

really love the door and bidding much respect me 3 more out of the noble price floor for 4 on the piece. the guy who just sold his lobel price medal know, raise 100000000 euros, and the needs of them to ukrainian children, mid, severe humanitarian, which i applause. but at the same time, he's rational. if you would believe the same $100000000.00 to replace was in the kitchen, maybe maybe let him know which would be gone already. but nobody is right now assisting in year activities to actually stop this region. and that makes me really make me feel whether, whether the rug with russians, you still offering a $1000000.00 to anyone who can bring putin dead or alive to

a war crimes tribunal. yes. and there were people who followed the lead them right now if. ready several announcements, so it's even higher than this 1000000. then they heard several announcements for different people in which is established one which also higher than them. emily and i think a, just a matter of time, such actions will start to be executed in rush. we talked at the beginning about current losses on the battlefield. how far does the public mood fluctuate? when people hear news like that is, is the will to fight as strong as ever. and you know, i think the morale is, is very high. people are going more and more disappointed with the position of the west than general probably, with the exception of great britain. but what we see are currently is our strongest,

the why, thanks to the prime minister was very popular in ukraine right now, but the general people out with the west because they feel like the west is given just enough weapons to resist russia, but not enough weapon to fight back and read the 2 or 3 of the country, that's how we've been seen within the ukraine. will be encouraged by the statements of support that came out of the g 7 meeting. i'm talking particularly about the commitment by the french and british leaders to work for russia defeat in the war that was explicitly said, and that seems to have been spelled out more clearly than before. is that of some comfort to people? do you think that gives? certainly inspiration, but difficulty weaponless will be more useful. i will do friends here. firstly, i think that the with the still shy to say public that we need to replace with you

which of without his replacement this water would not stop. i think that's pretty much just below it's like in the world war 2, you know, people will see lift separately from great britain and soviet union but would not say i think so. we need to say openly on the public which needs to be replaced. what kind of ukraine, what kind of russia do you see emerging in the end, from this conflict, franca speaking, i think that the end of the day, those contrasts would be very much alike. i think they will be democratic. i think they will be free or i think that will be very much decentralized with our people at the grassroots level, and i think they both will be members of european union. the board members will

sleep abroad if we can avoid world war 3. absolutely, absolutely. that's our joint. literally the area upon a matter of thanks very much for being on conflict. so thanks for having ah ah, with

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you go, mike speaking, how can this national hatred of a people be explained? a gold hon, go. a history of anti semitism is a history of stigmatization and exclusion of religious and political power struggles. interesting christianity wants to convert. that is why christianity used the figuring of the jew as little tesla. it's a history of slender of hatred and violence. is the book is smaller than on the jews were considered servants of evil. we simply told you by the most atrocious chapter. a 3rd of our people were exterminated 6000000 jews, like microbes to be annihilated. even 77 years after the holocaust hatred towards jews is still pervasive. a history of anti semitism starts july 2nd on

d w. b o. ah, this is dw news life from berlin. tonight in paris, a guilty verdict for the sole surviving perpetrator of the deadliest islamist attacks and french histories, 7 years ago. also coming up for the 1st time in its history, nato calls out russia as its primary adversary. and failing a revamped strategy with finland and sweden formally invited to joint and china mentioned as a challenge to the global order and cruise.