and investment into renew with chris cobra. welcome to the program. you as president joe biden and china jean payne, met and bali today to discuss and set guardrails for future relations between the 2 countries. tensions between the wells to top economies have been increasing sharply in recent years with beijing becoming more powerful and more assertive about replacing us lead order that has prevailed for decades. you as the so being for the meeting to establish, quote, clear rules of the road and help avoid escalation of an ongoing political and economic match for more. so bring in my colleague cartoon and here are china analyst clifford. of course,

there are multiple political hot bought new issues in taiwan, ukraine, north korea's nuclear ambitions. one of the economic areas over which the u. s. and china are at loggerheads currently. well, this is the world's most important economic relationship. it's the world to biggest superpowers. and so it's very important for the global economy that they at least find a way to an accommodation with each other. maybe if they can't get along that they can at least find a way to, to keep the relate to get the relationship going. again, at least and the economic issues are primarily related to the fact that they are systemic rivals. these issues that you mentioned at taiwan, north korea, all of these set them up a systemic rivals. at the same time they have to find common ground on the economy . so what they're trying to agree is some way that they can deal with at major trade issues that they're dealing with as semiconductors, tech, 0 cove,

all of these economic issues that are setting them apart and they need to be resolved. as we heard a person by hoping for rules of the road to be set there, what could they look like? well, these guidelines, we've had red lines. we've had various descriptions coming into these talks. and i think what they will, they will probably do is that they will have to find somewhere where they can make concessions. china really wants to semiconductors from the u. s. this is very, very important for them to help the economy grow. and but the u. s. needs the 0 coven rules to be relaxed, and it wants more reciprocity from, from china. it wants more of a, it basically, they need both sides need to relax a little bit while at the same time, maintaining this systemic rivalry. so there's going to be a lot of juggling going on, but so far the signs are positive. he ws clipper. conan resident china analyst to for thank you. now before heading to the g. 20 summit in indonesia, german chantelle, all of shawls,

has been visiting vietnam and singapore to gauge opportunities for german business . there. germany wants to reduce its heavy dependency on china and geo political tensions. earlier, my colleague richard walker, i spoke to z mense c o rowland bush asking whether it's time for german businesses to diversify. it depends on how you define, define it. if diversity cation means doing less than china, instead of doing more business and others, i don't believe this is the right thing to do. i think it's doing additionally more in other countries. the point is that if you will think about when you allocate and euro of investment of a dollar investment and you added into an existing running machine on a big market, which is fast growing returns faster than if you start in new in new areas, new markets so, but we have to acknowledge that resilience is all of a price. so therefore it is worthwhile investing now in new markets and to

diversifying. but on top, on top of what we're doing, china. so for me, this is of the strategy of siemens is doing that you can continue investing in china. we want to keep or even increase on market share there. there's nothing bad about it. taking the chances we have. but at the same time, looking to other markets with a stronger focus and grow our business there too. but having quite cautionary notes about china at this conference, i mean the former australian prime minister, kevin, but just speaking earlier today, talking about china moving to the marks is left on the economy and to the nationalists, right. in terms of security under see jim paying as we've just seen at the recent party congress. what does this mean for a company like siemens which has significant investments in china? young number one is um, as long as we take our make our return, we make a profit. tegler, chances are it, sir, it doesn't really change our strategy. and if there's something disruptive

happening there, then we have to deal with that obviously. but until then, i don't, i don't believe it's a good idea to say pre cautiously i pull out of a market which has used opportunities for us because you never know the same time. and what we do definitely is working or supply chains, which is another dimension. there are 2 dimensions of diversification. one is the market access and number one, supply chain. of course, we are diversifying our supply chain very much so, so that in case something happens, you have for an export control regulations that we have double sourcing and we can keybo operations running in other countries, of course. so therefore, i do believe that is the right strategy and term and we feel quite comfortable with that. i would subscribe were sort of description for of mr. rod yet you would agree with that. yeah. so, so, and you say in case something happens, i mean that, of course, the big sort of scenario that people are worried about is chinese aggression against taiwan. we have seen what russian again,

aggression against ukraine has meant for the world economy or a company like siemens. what are you doing to prepare for a scenario like that? you must be factoring that into risk planning? yeah, i mean number one, as i said before, and we are analyzing our supply chains and see where, where is supply coming from. deliveries between countries and hol, can be diversify, so that we have in case a double sa, sick. so this is one thing we gonna do, and the other one is diversifying the markets, which we are working on, that another element. and the last point is that i'm a little bit more optimistic here. i hope that rational prevails at the end of the day. because there will be only loses the men c o l, and bush talking to the others. richard walker there. now how to balance energy security and climate protection has been top of mind for many people and leaders this year. whereas energy security seems to have been the more pressing issue,

rushes worn ukraine has triggered an energy crisis, which many countries, including germany, are trying to mitigate with a comeback of coal. and countries like south africa, a profiting from a global rise and demand they're on their way to a 12 hour shift in the mines here and implemented banga in the north east or south africa. coal is a big part of life. nearly a 100000 people work in it and it accounts for 80 percent of electricity production, but it's future is uncertain as of africa tries to taco climate change. oh, i should i did it. it's sad because there are a lot of minds which employ many people. if a close, a lot of people would struggle the mind, the very important in our lives, and also coal, because we even make fire with it. it is very useful. last here to help sold africa switch its power production from cold to renewables. you are promised at billions,

but that has changed since the west sanctioned russian coal amid the war in ukraine . cold prices have sword and south african coal exports to europe have increased nearly eightfold since the war began. it's a dilemma. i also own entity energy which will in his capacity was, wasn't seen as the megan company with them. wonderful. should also with the reserves that us, that in the countries did a lot of his to me this the white out and then been going to south africa and fossil fuel companies are profiting from record cold prices and soaring demand. so for now, moving away from polluting energy sources is once again on the back burner or from or in the spring in simon miller, he's an energy transition expert. are welcome to the program,

simon. what does it tell us about the green energy ambitions of industrial and emerging countries? when being confronted with this emergency scenario that we're seeing right now, every just falls, everybody falls back and they're heavily carbon emitting ways well, i think it's very important to distinguish the short term immediate response and the structural consequences. when we look at the short term response, it shows us that we're still deeply dependent on fossil fuels. but if we consider what does this mean structurally, i would say it's very, very robust, that we will see a dramatic acceleration of renewable energy's. why they have the cost arguments on their side. they have the energy security argument on their side and the sustainability argument. anyway. however, if we look at the immediate response to the crisis, of course, we need to rely on existing facilities, existing assets, and they are there and can burn fossil fuels. so around the world this consumption

has gone up. however, the price is very high, the reliability is very low, and this provides a strong structural incentive to direct investments into renewables and energy efficiency left saw briefly about the here and now what are the consequences, the immediate consequences of this resurgence of coal? well, 1st of all, what happened through russia's aggression against ukraine is that the largest fossil fuel exporter has shot down, partially, or been shut down. so this explains why there is a scramble to substitute those export. so essentially, we're trying to mobilize other supplies, but on the global level, if we look at the coal consumption, there's multiple reasons driving this effect. one reason also is a severe drought in asia, which is led to a reduced availability of hydro power. so we see the consequences of the climate

prices as one element. what needs to happen now is very clear that the investments for new generation facilities go into renewable energy, for example. it's also a huge opportunity for a country like south africa that's been struggling structurally to meet its electricity demand. and when it comes to these investments, the international energy agency says that a global funding and clean energy sources could rise by 50 percent in the coming years. if investments go ahead as bland. is there enough incentive for these plans to materialize briefly if you could? yes. why? because fossil fuels currently are very expensive. the supply is fairly unreliable . vast number of countries experiencing this right now, coal deliveries aren't coming. and so this provides a strong incentive for switching over and that's why the international energy has come to the conclusion. simon miller and j transition expert. thank you so much.

thanks. and his reminder of our top story of the sour. yes, president biden is meeting china's liter g shipping and indonesia to discuss issues ranging from beijing's aggression towards taiwan. 2 world trade assault me and the business team here in berlin, thanks for watching. through

to morrow to day and 30 minutes on d w. ah,

this is dw news live from berlin, joe biden tells china there must not be another cold walled b u. s. president spoke off to meeting his chinese counterpart, teaching ping, and volley ahead of the g. 20 summit for the 1st face to face. soaps, the 2 nations are far apart and issues like taiwan and ukraine.