let's ride, ah read in 60 minutes on d w. ah, oh, what people have to say matters to us. mm. that's why we listen to their stories. reporter every weekend on d w. it's time for another edition of the 77 percent. sure. i am your host wednesday camara and to day you are watching a very special sure we are talking about drug a. my colleague it is kamani and her crew visited nigeria capital a butcher to discuss the issue. young people there,

talk about it very openly. so they not only know the causes, but they are also aware of the solutions. over to you, edith. ah . hi, and welcome back to another episode of the 77 percent this week. we are back in a bull janae julia, and we had to ask an age or question. is it possible to win the war on drugs? i want to ask. mr. mohammed a j is the commandant of n d l e a. this is the national drug or legislative body here in the country. the most recent reports by your statistics body indicates that about 14000000 people have used drugs at some point. why do you think this number is so high compared to the rest of the world that you know, if you look on the face of nat geo, your book mission was were over 200 and some to 1000000 people. so 14 is what a fraction. then what still it is too high. 14000000 people use using rock is too

high to the local factors are, can be a deuce as to why the, why they are using these drops. will it be lack of employment into society? will it be ah, lack of parental cheer? will it be broken? who parents are normal together? default one and wife are normal together. so nobody to counsel the kids here who need b. ah, a lot of pressure in the society that is through employment. a lot of use i have graduated from the university, looking for employment will do, will not get one. so a lot of factors can be a deuced why a lot of use artic into school. okay, so let me find out 1st hand from somebody who was a drug user, but it's kindly reformed ah, beep. thank you so much for agreeing to speak to us so that things that muhammad is talking about there. those factors that lead people into drug use and abuse. does this sound familiar to you? very familiar. so can you tell us a brief history of how you got into drugs, what you are using and how long is all about peer pressure in high school?

find people who are into drugs and the parents and no chicken up to do free and you can get to eat easily. and now on to the same time criticizing the fact that your fight against drug in nigeria is to me is almost impossible. they are just scratching the surface. mm hm. because recently, i'm a police officer, a very prominent for this i just, i was, was caught in between the line of drug abuse. i am trafficking to tell me if this high profile people are in vo intuitive drop. how can it be soak? okay, so before we go, because it looks like we are going into the ocean and i wanted to stay by the show a little bit. so let me introduce half. so who's an investigative journalist? tell us what the biggest challenge is, what people consuming, how are they getting access to? it's one thing that we should firstly, focus on is the way i believe or whether from what we've done from the reports that

we've done on drug abuse. most drug abusers do it as a pray for help is not that they just woke up and decided to start doing drugs, but rather there's always some sort of stemming reason why they chose to do it as a, as a sort of relief. yeah, he mentioned unemployment, of course it's one we'll also need to look at the aspect of women, many women resort into taking drugs from what we have reported because of their being married at a young age or because they're divorced. and in northern nigeria, being of the customer is such a taboo to the point that some parents would kick their daughter out if they could cut out obviously. where do you think you'll find refuge? yeah, it's either she find someone or be friends, someone or gets her boyfriend that will eventually pusher why influenza into starting drugs, right? yeah, i want to come to you hums because you come from a region in this country called poppy. can you tell us a little bit about it? first of all, i think us digital poppy. i'm talking about drug abuse. i think you're going to go anywhere from each other to go out to the streets. you see

a very young dudes walking on the street stage and has, like i said, it's like awesome. it's normal and parental support or social security number and social coastal siding forth inviting from rey calling from are really influenced using sabrina's with drugs. okay, let me ask phases here because we're hearing a lot of peer pressure being repeated. but surely there are people who stuck consuming drugs when they're much older. and i mean, in their twenty's perhaps in their thirties at that point they know better. so it can't just be pre a passion, a peer pressure, issamotto fucked is not just peer pressure under the pressure. so society, there is a nature, no job influence legacy. you know, a place where you, you, you grew up and, you know, the conditioning which would be, can, can push you to, to, you know, indulge in drug abuse and dependency. yeah. oh, okay. i made you've been quiet for a while. let me bring you into the conversation. what is your experience are with drug use and abuse? knowing full well that at the more mentoring

a relationship with somebody who is currently fighting addiction, everybody has something to do with the use of drugs either you use in you have used, or somewhere close to use use in, or someone in your family use it here i don't think there's a home in la jolla. okay, let me just do a quick survey of what he's saying. any of you know, somebody who is directly or indirectly affected by drugs can raise your hands. so it's very, very wide spreads are okay, so tell me what your experience was. your personal experience or let of oliver as to why you would do drugs. so multi am into hard label i used is fan killer to walk in. tom will tell you he's been a hardy, i can sleep when they get home. there's no light new drugs miss. so needs to be a week only. just to walk, probably moving unit trucks to the to one. we order the easy. it gets us coming back to the use of jokes. okay. yeah, i want to come back to you mohammed because a lot of the drugs that are used in this country specifically and also in other parts of west africa, north and central africa tend to be pharmaceutical drugs. intended for use afford

illnesses. so how are you able to regulate something that is the legal against any legal use? these are drugs are supposed to be dispensed by pharmacist or no account should you dispense diaz upon, for example, trauma dog, for example, a patient or somebody that does come to a shop to buy must produce this prescription demand that is not description and you dispense it with that individual you up automatically on administering to drop outside or singers and critics here such that pharmacy should be homeless was. is it really possible to keep track of every single one and make sure they're operating above boards? it's not really possible to keep track of these on every pharmacy. we have numerous meals. i will see you when we go. yeah, we are told also pharmaceutical schools or do we have isolated tissues? pharmacies that are into money. they want to make money by hook or by crook. so

would you dispense these kind of control drugs? did you come to germany without doctors prescriptions. but you know, we're talking about pharmaceuticals or control drugs as we're calling them. but people are getting more creative with what they're doing to get hi. can you tell me some of the things and ways that people are employing to get that high? who have the low drugs legs at the rest of them? can you explain what those are? the unnatural leisure of plans for when you take them you feel is feeling and we're minute. you're high yet higher side so high. it will go to extra length leg getting highs from the soccer. we and it works from the watch soccer. we like the soccer. we gotta go to, you know, people get high from the see which water to see which got our soccer. we end with soaking nails. there are the things you do to get soaking steel. kneel, yes, still nills and you go roast and drinking the water in drugs that are not that

nigger and when you use them a lot use live in a high quantity. yeah. i've had home for can somebody explain to me this phenomenon of had called guttural water? let me ask comes that because he said that in his area you've seen this persistent use of drugs and it's normal. yeah. are you seeing these cocktails that we're talking about and can you describe some of them? yes, definitely. like i still remember the 1st time i saw one. how was i was surprised. i was like, oh, i think i was working over my friends of the day. i saw she was bending our the soccer we cause in helium is always like, what is it doing? i felt like just gets in high. i was like high from dad. i was like, yes, it's also a mental it from. we still get high and it's, it's ron pines from my please be okay. let me come to you have so because we're hearing that a lot of the people are doing what i would consider quite honestly crazy. and it is said that many people go into this without really knowing what the effects are. are

you finding this to be true in your investigations, or are people aware and quite simply they don't care. hm, definitely. i think a lot of them don't know. but then there's also some of them don't know, but just choose to feign ignorance and decide to tell themselves that okay, am i die by the end of the day? i have to take these drugs like i can't survive without them. a lot of people that he's not to go into the sewers or you think shall you show, which is the glue and other avenues that were to be honest, i've heard and i don't like valley, there's so many different avenues. and this was because they can't afford the industrial drugs. yeah. so mohammed is your job then an impossible one. why you set up to fail because if people are going to literally go to the gutters to get that high and who knows what's left them there? you can't possibly enforce that. you can't control that. we, we, we really have a problem with the india outs cobra's, so no one conventional drugs internationally known. it is of resend that we begin

to see use getting high when they've been unperceived the order of pit lucky soccer we is on. since this is so baffling to me. so this is common carriers who have a problem. there has to be a legislation that will also cover this kind of low contracts. now that the at you much movie wendy and dearly ups was actually inactive. those, these were not put into consideration what, what, what do you do with your skin? what do you do? do you arrest them off? cause more mentally temporal. you are as they're what are the end of the day? you cannot prosecute him because dad is, is not covered under our legislation at all. we have difficulty the f fees are, let me come to you as a psychologist because i think it's really easy to castigate. people who use drugs and say, hey, there are menace to society. they're the problem. but we failing to understand the deeper issues. yes, actually there are deeper issues to drug abuse and dependency. you know,

any turned up loses the brain, the brain or like to have a repeat of it addiction doesn't, it doesn't just you just can't get addicted to a drug. your buddy system has to tolerate, the drug is tolerance. that leads to addiction. so psychologically this people are using these drugs. they are, they are chained because they can't stop themselves from taking the drugs. ah, there's this neurotransmitter among the 7 major, newer transmitters in the buddy system. if you don't take the drug or whatever is going to come you down, you're going to start or, you know, behaving somehow you will. you must have shaken us that chevron once you take it or you simply do anything. you're going to fill this, you know, you'd be so calm. so in that process, the individual is not even if today they are going to keep a trapped lot of them. and the idea of he says in a place and somebody wants to get the and was so when you did that, that particular newer transmitter is going to keep wants to critic until he finds

or he, she points our way to go and get this drug. yeah. and listen, of course there is a psychological impact on this individual and then needs to be rehabilitated the right way. because even when you go back to rehabilitation in this country, there's a big thought in the rehabilitation system of nigeria. we have to say the true, okay, we'll get to rehabilitation shortly, but i just want to tell our viewers that we had invited somebody who used to be a drug dealer. but unfortunately, he wasn't able to come here because, you know, the crowd didn't feel particularly comfortable with that, but this is what he had to say about the issue this and move to that have to do. and i love amazon, and i was no reason to sort of 22 of being with no one who sometimes people came to play phone can been all connected on going to do milton. do i, will she like she's on that you know is go over to just want to know if you do need to do anything special in the little you want to know. i don't

was it is when had listened to scott. it's lesson cold. yes. all right. so we thank mister x for his contributions and i want to come back to to, to you are med because we're hearing, look, it is completely out of their control. and i know that addicts will get to desperate measures to get the money to get their supply. have you experienced this with your loved one where it becomes crazy, violent or simply toxic, where she's only, she's come when she's not only, you know, small things tend to be issues. yet more things. i've been calling you and you're not entry and i need, do i need to? and if you don't pro, does she go somewhere else to get when you walk in with people who inject drugs? yeah. okay. be the we'll id. know, some of them come to 2 stages where you don't have money to afford you, what your partner afforded and has used already to what do you do know,

get some of your blood insurance and give it to your, your partner and injects your job. and he gets home. yeah, let me just explain to our view as the phenomenon that are met is describing is called flush bloods. yeah. so have you seen this happen with your own eyes? a lot of times. yeah. a lot of times. oh okay. so obviously high risk to injectable and drug transfusion diseases at the point of addiction and phrase out you had mentioned this before, but perhaps i wanted to answer this question for me. how accessible is rehabilitation and treatment? because that's the next logical solution to a person who's suffering from addiction. so rehabilitation in nigeria is not as straightforward as you would think. it is better than medical you true new herbs, where you can go and get some psycho social hope that you need therapy. and all those medical interventions, but then they're also the locality haps we've done reports on how we've seen so

many cases encounter where drugs are tied up in chains like animals, all in the name of your hitting them. me well this does not help. it does not work at the end of the day once that person break speed is going back to his old ways. but if they are actually enrolled in rehabilitation centers with people that are very well versed or, you know, professionals where it comes to mental health addressing these issues. hospitals need to have sections where are these there? there's some sort of supports where come from mental health and also more, and we have the patient centers where these people can go and get to them their help. they require. yeah, let me ask kabibi, i'll get back to you in a 2nd habib when you wanted to get clean, did you go to one of these rehabilitation centers that house is describing, or what, how, how did you get kin? like you said, my own face is very unique hours. miraculously you it just by the grocer. what do you mean? like you woke up one day and you decided ok, i'm no longer doing this and that was it?

yes. wow. as well as you know, we're talking about rehabilitation in nigeria. i don't think we have any rehabilitation center in edge area. we only have one in open joe which is good. this is local facilities. just like to present in nigeria. around prisons are leg danger, and for criminals you just purchase some criminals and the get to be more few fearless under comments to society. they become very notorious. so that's why i said there's no rehabilitation center in nigeria. so ahmed, is this what you are going to to comment on where you go into a rehab center and you come out hardens year? that's it, like go a high institution because all of learning, yes, because with drugs, drugs, you use our tape and you get into this, we have to get introduced in substances that are not outside. and this this reality health facilities, they're quite expensive. what have been my nora?

can you tell me how much they are? they are like a 150000 from moulton. probably you could still kareem want, so there's no facility for 4 months. yeah. no to drug i decide the same. yes, they may have. they may be taking the same drugs, perhaps have similar symptoms, but you can just lump them altogether and call them all drug addicts and try to keep them all the same. you need to sit down and evaluate, okay, what stemmed the drug abuse in the 1st place? but obviously he's the mental health specialist. yeah. let's hear from him. what she says something very important. you're not going to give the treatment of someone who would take some cocaine. you know, there are different forms of tara p. there is cognitive behavioral therapy. there's systematic desensitization. so you would give the different tara piece, but different individuals with different cases. so there are a whole lot of being that, oh, on the ground that you know went when psychology isn't to be sincere. you know, psychologists are not really bothered in this part of the country and as part of

material like goes on really well. let me come to the commander because i saw you. it's shing, the moment face all said psychologist, not valued. you even hailed your way. so tell me what you're thinking. look, absolutely what do you say this? but i feel, but it's not in all cases. the national dropping forestman agency surgical man, we have the rehab center. i mean, the rehab center does would be rub latigion claims, but that's one for 14000000 users out of a lot. that's why i see a lot if we have scenarios where in the rehab center the those that are supposed to but hopefully teach their clients are the people that are so blind, those glanced drugs doing this will be sued to court. do you have no alternative other done to close that kind of rehab center. okay. i mean, this is the worst case scenario where the person who's meant to be rehabilitating becomes a dealer, but we're hearing that they're like prisoners. i've heard situations where people go for rehabilitation in publicly funded rehabilitation centers only to be changed

to what she was seen like in the because she was in conway. we have traditional rehab center work. yeah. why religious? yeah, leaders were you was c declined been she and all sort of didn't even have the expertise . okay, let me, let me ask half. so because she seems to have just hold on for the microphone please. you mentioned spiritual m interventions. another thing is that a lot of these cases i misinterpreted into spiritual cases, and that's why be, how do you mean? okay, so genes, people believe that a lot of people have the impression that it's not the doing of the person, but rather diligence influencing them to go into drug abuse. so ordinarily they would decide to take this person to really just need also co religiously, to either merge or the school and try to intervene maybe by beating out the spiritual elements. and then, or when you say, just me like the spirit. yeah. okay. yeah. so me,

well that's not what the needs then to show that the person is possessed in any way and if they are the way to get rid of them is not by beating them. we're changing them. there are other means, but obviously they do not know this for they just, they just improvised bit. yeah, he just improvised. okay, so let's come up with solutions. now. there's the reason why the war on drugs was started because there are far reaching consequences to the abuse of some of these substances. so what can we do as a society to cut this given that there's so many young people who are into this habits hasta, provide a support system to listen to them. i think it's better to nip it in the bud before we begin. then after i think it's also very important that we have therapists, that you can use any walk into not you don't even have to be like fun, that's medically trained even so now home you should be able to a child to be able to go to his parents and literally told them what they're going to, it's not a parents, a sister, an aunt, someone within their society that they can easily go to and let their hearts out

completely so that they know that at the end of the day, there's someone there for me drugs isn't on you think that's been from yeah. okay. i'm sorry. let's hear from you because you are very keen on police officers besides enforcement of laws. what else can be done? i think then it's a year is that mine says that has been created before the fear of the full use of someone has to make the police officers our friend and they need to show it from the outward perspective that will give you our friend then it's the builders relationship between the boost buses. so the comments would have been showed a hub, not so brutally. yeah. not aggressively. what are you coming to the picture? get those bits and make the person knows the and nor does what you. we are going to help you sensitize that person, and also not only the addict i use the appearance also need to be sensitizing. they also play a very big rule in, you know, corbin this. yeah. hi george. so

a holistic approach to word sensitization and education are med. let's hear from you. first hand experience having used the drugs yourselves, the now senior golf and battling with this. what do you think it will take to finally put an end to it within an empty joke senior to the sites to corruption. first corruption in the sense of this, this lawyer. first, 1st men, agencies. i'm not in the corrupt, but you have to check it down there and the police people you're, you're put in this responsibility of fighting this war. i do really fighting the war or are they just pretending to fight the war? good question. because you, you confiscate a whole lot of drugs, we do seed on tv and you just with some bags of weed and put it on fire already as what happens to the rest of it drops the coffee. so before we combine this war, we have to combine ourselves. we do this 1st for look internally. yeah. then

secondly, i think the end you should do more like we have the 10 users and put them in the system because when i think when you know the system you can do better. you don't need nobody to tell you. so i see nothing wrong, but i don't know if i'm right, but i think if you have drug cases now you can be, i told the india. so what i was just thinking you could have me say this people, well we have the data. if we could get them and put them in the force, and i think they'll do more more, more, good day more. hm. okay. and so using fire to fight fire faces. let's here you had one more solution for me before we go to the commander. before a youth in this country is going to become a political thought unit to things, unit, drugs, and unit weapons. so now this politicians also do not want a situation where they go into drugs is going to be out of the society because they use this youth as political talks. nobody in his right says it's going to go and, you know, pick a ballot boxes and run with it or to stop somebody, you know,

during the election when somebody's actually exercising his franchise. so you have to be, you know, under influence of some certain drugs. so now the, you know, the, the ball game, it moves back to, you know, the, the, the society and the system. something needs to be done, the executive, legislative and also the other arm of government. ok. let's wind up with mr. mohammed here because i started with you, i don't know whether you think is a valid solution, but i'm also curious to know what more you can have in order to be further empowered to do your job. we are in a situation whereby for example, agencies on the funder i know got me strength best there are so many agencies are ministers and our government all need funding. so annually it's not an exception is an urgency that truly we're talking now. the truth is been under funded,

so govern new to do better to fund agency provides us with all that is that we need and so that you will see our best foot offices will be able to get in to put their best foot forward. you yeah, well, i thank you for the comments and i think that's a great place to wrap up this debate. now at the beginning, i asked a critical question. is it possible to wage a war and drugs? i don't know the answer to that, but what i do know is that from the discussion here, it is clear that the focus should rather not be on drugs, but on human beings. thank you for watching. ah ah ah ah ah ah

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