[000:00:00;00] ah, it could very well be the last time this year that native leaders come together to discuss the russian invasion of ukraine christmas and the new year are just around the corner. but there will not be any holiday for this war. and that explains the message to day from us. secretary of state entity blink in our collective support is as strong as ever. he said, the winter, the cold, the russian air strikes will not change that to night words of comfort to go along with weapons of war. i'm forgotten berlin, this is the day ah, for meeting at a critical juncture. as you can continue to seize,

all meant or on the battlefield, we need to type thanks, and the decision must be unlocked as soon as possible. we know presidents, playbook, freeze, and start ukrainians. decisions must be made before pregnancy, secure. to prevent register, this brutalization of ukraine's people is barbaric. the method is simple. give patriots as soon as you can also coming up, it's known as the hello to more a devastating famine that struck you. crane in the 19 thirty's. today the german parliament recognized it as a soviet orchestrated genocide. the great famine, deliberately provoked by stalin kid of a 3300000 ukranian women, men and children be sent united and stating that hunger must never again be used as a weapon. ah, which of our viewers watching on p b s in the united states and to all of you around the world?

welcome. we begin the day with a promise to keep a promise. there, there has been one constant in the messaging of the west since the beginning of the russian invasion of ukraine. we stand by ukraine. as nato reps up its meeting this week, that message has not changed. it's meaning however, that meaning is evolving. while the u. s. the u. k. in european countries such as germany continued to sit weapons to ukraine. the emphasis at the moment is on what civilians meet russian air strikes of damaged much of the energy grid in ukraine just in time for winter. u. s. secretary of state antony, blank in today, took aim at moscow for trying to freeze and starve the ukrainian people heat, water, electricity, for children, for the elderly, for the sick. these are present putin's new targets. he's heading them hard.

this brutalization of ukraine's people is barbaric. russia savages tax on ukrainian civilians are the latest demonstration that president putin currently has no interest in meaningful diplomacy. the best way to actually hasten the prospect for real diplomacy is to sustain our support to ukraine and continue to tilt the battlefield in his favor. well, ukraine is welcoming these promises of support from native allies, but it's also pushing for that support to come faster. of speaking, after the talks, de ukraine's foreign minister listed his country's main priorities for the difficult winter months ahead, equipment to repair the energy grid, native style tanks, and advanced air defense systems. one type of missile in particular, the message is simple. give patriots as soon as you can, because this is the system that you carry needs to protect its sevilla, civilian population and critical infrastructure. this is not an offensive weapon. well,

patriot missiles surface to air missiles would certainly market major advance in military aid. from the west, ukraine says that it's trying to convince germany to allow delivery of the systems via a 3 way deal with poland. but for now, ukraine has received native commitments for more defensive weapons and energy. here's d. w. alexander for not it is crucial for ukraine as to country is facing constant attacks on its energy infrastructure. and russia has said, bombed one 3rd of this infrastructure over the last few weeks, according to the u. s. administration. so it's clear that to ukraine urgency needs what nato allies are offering generators, power, transformers, other equipment, the you ask alone has pledged to provide you queen with more than 15000000. you asked dollars. however,

we also have to say that the ukraine in foreign minister was also present here, made to clear once again today that what ukraine also wants is for instance, you ask are, for instance, you asked mate patriot to missile defense systems and data, something dad's elyse will talk about, according to nato secretary general, it's tolten back. but a decision on that on whether those systems can be provided to ukraine has not been made yet. there was alexander phenomena reporting from bucharest. i want to pull in now, christine bra, xena. she is a senior fellow for security and defense policy at the german marshall fund of the united states. she joined me tonight from washington, christine, it's good to have you with us. i want to ask about patriot missiles in just a moment. but 1st, this nato meeting, we, we saw what's your take on that, what, what's the biggest take away? the meeting is in many ways symbolic, because it allows nato leaders to come quite close to ukraine in

a frontline nato state along the eastern blankenburg. rest to establish methods for and, and get everyone on the same page for supporting ukraine and also reinforcing nato defense in the future. bucharest, a symbolic because this is where in 2008 or ukraine and georgia were told that they will be able to become nato members. and so to have that conversation again before this hard winter in bucharest to reinforce those commitments and to have partners there to have the ukrainians, bosnians, george and mo, dolan's there. in addition to soon to be nato members, finland and sweden shows a very big nato family committing to future defense, current defense, before a rough war. yeah, a big family with big missiles including patriot missiles, not too sure that much. they want to share those missiles with ukraine and how key are they for ukraine? and will the ukrainian military ever have there is a lot of hope that the ukraine will have

a longer range defensive air systems. now the patriot as a long range air defense system, we've seen that the high mars do a good job. there are good german systems that are in place in ukraine, but they can't shoot very far. and the need is to have something that can reach much further. the patriot system can do that. but there's always a question in certain countries across nato. what will these missiles be used for? and there's nervousness that what happens if ukraine uses these systems, potentially for shooting into russia? this is a long range question. and is crimea, russia? ukraine doesn't think so. yeah. but there is a question. what happens if you, if crimea is struck because many of these missiles attacks against ukraine are happening from crimea? and what happens if russia, the internationally recognized version of russia is struck by dismissals. and the things id has put a pause on long ridge systems. but you can't rebuild an energy grid every week. and the more russia attacks, the more you have to have a solution. yeah,

and we know that ukraine's foreign minister said nelson, germany as a potential supplier of patriot missiles, take a listen of what was said. if germany is ready to provide patrice to poland and poland has nothing against ah, handing this feathers over to ukraine than i think that the solution for the german government is all this is little convoluted. the way this is going to happen. but let me just ask you, can you see germany allowing this deal to happen? there's a lot of pressure on germany to make this deal happen. i think we're closer to making it happen because again, you cannot rebuild all the infrastructure in the country every week. and the aim of this book crest meeting was to try to talk about reconstruction and moving forward . there are no guarantees. again, there are lots of sensitivities here, but germany is moving into a more sharing direction than it has been fixed. so because you see germany

eventually saying yes to this deal, i think somebody across natal saying yesterday, the steel, the need to put you created a better position and to make this misery and is very high. germany seems a good candidate right now, but there were also reports that the u. s. is considering also sending patriot missiles, although not right away. big they who sends it how and what kind of merry go round the weapons transfer is happens to make it happen is not yet clear, but the impact if they didn't pay the impetus to make sure that something changes that these missiles do not hit all of the infrastructure every week is there, but as with many of the things, they're bureaucratic, their convoluted, the germany would provide a simple solution. and of course, the ultimate goal still remains ending this war. take a listen to what the nato head. yes, doctor, what he said today if a crane does not prevail as independence over those states, then of course

a membership issue is not on the table at all. and what ever you think about when you can come home, a member, a pre condition for the issue to be at the table at all, is that the ukraine prevails. ukraine has to win the war. then we can talk about joining nato. that, that's the message the right, don't try to turn your car in front of the horse. is that what he's saying? absolutely, that ukraine has to be successful, which also means that russia has to lose. and this is where the conversation about weapons comes in. ukraine can't be successful in getting back its territory unless it beats russia back and then ukraine needs the tools to do so. and i think the clarity that this won't end until ukraine forces and ending on its own terms by having a territory back. that this is square one and we're seeing more mobilization to give you creating the tools to make that happen. you may do has also valve to

support while dover, ga, in bosnia. we've all been shaken by russia's invasion. i mean it is extending its security umbrella. very wide, or at least the hopes of being under this umbrella alpha can it stretch before it stretches too much? well if the hope of the umbrella right. because if the umbrella had extended to give in february we wouldn't be where we are today. and so this hope for countries to be able to enter remains the symbolic nature of bucharest, and best summits there themselves, bosnia, moldova, georgia, have the hope of entry, but that hope rests on ukraine winning. because russia is trying to stop this process, stop countries from joining nato in ukraine. and so the proof is going to be in this victory in this fight run out of time the,

the inflows of weapons to you. great. what we've heard from everyone is that these weapons shipments have to continue unabated and perhaps a year or another year, another 2 years. do you see that happening? there is of course, a tremendous demand. the amount of ammunition that is used in ukraine is tremendous . and really unlike what many western countries were expecting from a more of these days, there have been ammunition stockpiles. but they're not that huge. no one was think, expecting a year long, traditional 20th century style military conflict. and so there's a need now to really produce weapons. yes, the weapons are there, but industry and countries have to catch up and start making more now. yeah, it's hard to believe that we're having a conversation now with 2023 just around the corner. christina rosina with the german marshall fund of the united states. we appreciate your time and your insights tonight. thank you. thank you. russian human rights activist, say that 9000 russian soldiers have died since the war. you grade began. it is

impossible to verify that number, but what we do know is that russian state media are pushing in narrative that these soldiers did not die in vain. for president vladimir putin, this message is vital, not only to the war effort. you could also be key to his political survival, w corresponded theory, rachada reports confusion about the reasons for going to war, few gains on the ground and the chaos of mobilization. the war ukraine is not going well for russian. the withdrawal of troops from henson at the beginning of november was moscow's biggest setback since the rule began. hotline, as in moscow, have been grumbling, ever since 3 of the loudest have been businessman yevgeny pretty goshen. chechnya. leda graham's uncut dear of and former president dmitri meant the adf

promotion when a flat m. f. curtains close, his confidant is making himself especially noticeable. for years he denied the existence of his mercenary army, the volcanic group. but recently he changed his story and said, he's been in charge of the paramilitary organization since 2014. how global warming irrigation has 2 political instruments. you the wagner group and the media outlets that have helped him gain popularity and status. i had to know latanus to switch to nebraska him on his bones all. no, sure she couldn't from she goes, he's a kind of external service provider for the state, and he has some of the power in the state and acts as a political figures providing you brought in mid september, a video came out that showed a man who looked like promotion,

recruiting russian prisoners to fight in ukraine, dealing with him in thought. it was their mouth walk, their reward, freedom, war and money is going to be feasible. another putin ally who has been all over the headlines since the war began is rums on career of chechnya. leda has publicly criticized rushes generals for being too soft on look under her arm of the medina cad year of his using the media to broaden his influence and to show everyone that he is a major player or chrome. we're still on dozer, still don't regroup. chechen soldiers a fighting on russian side in the dumbass region. cook, children's kitty are of is being used by potent just like promotion to recruit fresh troops for the front lies. ment did us who served as president and prime minister has been stoking the fires of anti west and hatred and making optimistic

predictions that russia were when the war and ukraine you would. he is even said that nuclear weapons are the way to give russia back. it's for my imperial glory. obviously she was throwing in yeah, sure. what is the lemma short new or used to? so he has a need for admiration of the former president who has become a nobody yesterday i think he wants to an political capital. he seems to still have political ambitions, and it's just how much precocious dedira immediate. if a putting president putin under pressure, is unclear. but 9 months into the war in ukraine. displeasure is growing in russia over its course and that was d over usury rachada reporting there. remember, if you can't catch us live, you can always watch today's edition on demand online. just go to our website at dw

dot com slash the day. aah! germany's parliament has recognized a famine in ukraine, a famine that happened 90 years ago as genocide perpetrated by russia. ukrainians recently commemorated the laudable, a famine, deliberately engineered by soviet leader of the stall. at least 3900000 people died of hunger between 1932 in 1933 while moscow targeted ukraine with increasingly repressive measures. several countries have already condemned the hello to more as genocide against the ukrainian people, including ireland, moldova, and were me the here is the green party politician, robin wagner. opening today's debate. when he's a hoa, i design this horror. it was not caused by

a force of nature not by fateful crop failures on ukraine's fertile land. uh huh. his horror was caused by the kremlin thought of the dictator made the cruel decision there to impose collectively zation by force and coast of ation. and the killing by starvation also aimed at the political suppression of the ukrainian national consciousness, ukrainian culture and language some to you. my next guests, alexander shabba, is a former ambassador to austria from ukraine. he's also the author of ukraine versus darkness. a collection of essays based on the 2 and a half decades he spent as a career diplomat in speech writer for ukrainian leaders. ambassador, it's good to have you back on the program. i had to ask you, your country is in the midst of a war, a 5th of the territory is occupied right now by russia. another 3rd is being bombed into darkness and in frigid winter coldness. what can the recognition of the hello to more as genocide by the german parliament?

what can that do to help ukrainians right now? well, once you understand the scope of this tragedy, you mention 3000000 people. when there was a bus there in austria, i was explaining the stores trans. imagine that during one winter, the whole young gods leaned from clogging for would die the most horrible, slow humiliating death. ukraine is a traumatized nation, a nation that's what's heard deeply by the kremlin, the very force that we are fighting right now. every family has stories about you know, what's, what's happened in those in that the terrible winter or in the case of my family when ever had the year old girl marina,

who survived like the whole family of the winter. but when the tree blossoming time came, she saw a cache blossoming and she started eating. she, she just ran for a start. if you think we'll just pop and if you use too much blossom, you die because it's bouncing. every family has stories like that. so for us emotionally, it's extremely, extremely important. also, the whole bill comes tribute to, for, to, for germany on to other countries to understand better, why we don't want to give our poor to this a bar called the cram. we're, well yeah, there is a connection, isn't there between what happened 90 years ago and what is happening right now. i mean, does the meaning of the more, has it changed or is it stronger now in the collective memory of ukrainians because of the current russian invasion? well, we for the realization of the scope of this cor,

was with us all these years, especially under president fusion coffee, dedicated a lot of effort to, to us tardy. what's happened? what's important for us is be this political dimension. quite frankly, i remember from my career diplomatic career how long the united states were absolutely clear about armenian genocide, but didn't recognize that because turkey was a strategic partner of the united states wants to know wasn't the strategic partner . there was a recognition. so on germany as far it's sure sides of this, you know, side on ground, the turn of time. that's finally the succession of russia, not there anymore. and the message from the outside also seems to be a, a confirmation of what you already know to be true. that is, ukraine is

a nation state because that fact has been put into question by russian president vladimir putin with this invasion. right? absolutely. it's just, it's a story. politically psychological, it's huge it's, it's important, but 1st of all, quite frankly, i me personally, i expect germany to understand smoke. we are right now why the 5 will because it is the same power that kills 3. and how many people, 9 years ago, the kremlin hasn't changed much sooner than at least at the beginning of this war. they published the article called what to do with ukraine and describes what they want to do, their plans. and it's important, every thing is in this method, the cues from different pools, it's included, you know, read occasionally, bring them culture and language. it was as falling, you know,

who your documents. and it was funny how little russia has changed edison. i'm going to sound like a like a cynic here, but there are some people who could say that the german parliament voted to recognize the whole lot more as a genocide because of its own guilty conscience. because germany did not act quickly enough when the russian invasion began back in february. is that possible or is that just a cynical view of seeing what happened today? i hope it also includes the fact that these 3000000 ukrainians died for europe knowing and care and 90 years ago. imagine such a tragedy going on and this, you know, information lee came to europe. well joe, money had you know, special time during those years. so i didn't know, but johnny told care about things that are happening outside the country,

but the whole euro must have bad conscience about because because, because all these, you know, in that some people died 9 years ago without europe really caring. and europe certainly cares. now, at least that's the message that includes germany. what does ukraine need and want from germany right now? you claim these weapons to prevent a new genocide and you genocide, that would be inevitable in this scope and smaller scope. but you know, any compromise with a genocidal. many is a compromise with a genocide. so stop pushing us and stop seem stubborn ukrainians. who enjoy this war? we don't but we know to well what it weighs us if we lose. so please give up air

defense. please give us up and please give us leopards. your wonderful, wonderful, thanks for joining produce. it would be historically a good thing. on exam the chevron, the former ukrainian of acid, or to austria, ambassador. we appreciate your time and your valuable insights tonight. thank you. thank you. ah, and finally the blessings of thee baguettes these slender loaf of bread that it's so typical of france has joined a united nations list of culturally important items. whitelow is crunching on the outside. soft on the inside. many french people buy one every day and can't imagine living a day without. the bagget is thought to have been 1st developed by bakers working in the army of the emperor napoleon. bonaparte long bred for a short leader. the day's almost done. the conversation continues on line. your flight is on twitter, e w. news. you can follow me on twitter at brent gov tv. remember,

whatever happens between now and then tomorrow is another day. we'll see that with a neutral by 2045. germany's public transport system is going green. is it goodbye to be old,

but when you know they're converting to electric energy which present a technical challenge? is it worth it for the climate? absolutely. but what about for businesses made in germany? on d. w. in awkward reunion on the cook zia and cranium, more refugees come face to face with pro russian oligarchy from their home country . they all flayed here. but whilst most of the refugees left everything behind the oligarchy block, there's 2 cases full of money. the situation is difficult to bear. focus on the europe. in 60 minutes on d. w. o. aah!

shell filled with explosives, a symbol of power, rebellion your sensuality with wound by royalty and icons like a magic wand to grounds for divorce. guy with accountants, full cultural history, secret weapon lipstick, dos, december 3rd on d, w. ah, ah, ah. lights at the flick of a switch and heating with the press of