ah ah ah ah, this is dw news live from berlin, germany inches closer to green lising, the use of german may tanks in ukraine. defense minister boris historian says allies can start training ukrainians to use this stalks of left tank. it's been a decision on whether berlin will supply tanks to keep is still being weighed by the chancellor.

ah, i manuscripts, mccann, and welcome to the program. we begin with the latest on the issue of supplying german made tanks to ukraine. poland has now submitted a request to transfer it's leopard tanks to key even earlier. the german defense minister encouraged allies with lap tanks to begin training ukrainian forces on how to use them. but berlin has not yet said whether it plans to deliver tanks, that decision rests with chancellor love shots. now we are expecting to hear more on this from the german foreign minister. and alina bab, who is speaking of the council of europe in the french city of strasburg, lawmakers from the organizations member states a meeting this week to discuss the legal and human rights aspects of the war and

ukraine. the council of europe is a body of $46.00 european countries, and it is separate from the european union. and we joined now by d. w. special correspondent abraham, who is standing by for us in strasburg. i am, can you tell us why the job and foreign minister is addressing the council of europe today? well, really addressing the council of europe is an opportunity to address the larger european community, if you will, since the beginning of the conflict. of course, the european union has been an ally to ukraine, has been standing by ukraine. but the european council includes almost double that amount of countries. and it includes countries like serbia who maybe have had, you know, a different approach to russia throughout this where it includes also countries like georgia who have, you know, had a, had experience with the russian aggression. so it really is a forum that includes the larger european community, if you will,

and i expect that she will be using this forum to further, you know, to, to put forth again her, her priorities as a foreign minister, which includes things like rule of law. the maintenance of rule of law throughout europe and the world. a big thing for and i believe we do have unfortunately some technical issues there. however, we do have our political correspondent, thomas sparrow, who is in the studio with me. and he can also give us a little bit of background on the speech that will hopefully be a hearing soon from germany's foreign minister i, i was just touching there on what's and alina babel is going to be talking about today. so, no doubt the speech will be dominated by the war in ukraine, potentially also any other foreign policy issue you mentioned in your introduction,

this idea of the legal and human rights implications of the war in ukraine. i think that's particularly important because the focus for a long time in particular now with all the issue of german tanks has been on the immediate situation in ukraine, but politicians within europe and within the wider european spectrum's not only the you but the castle of europe, which, as i said, comprises many more countries. i've also started to think as to what could happen after the war and ukraine ends. so for example, all the human rights issues are bringing those responsible to, to justice. so certainly this idea is one that i expect will be discussed by enter babel will be presented by an in her babcock. when we talk about these legal human rights implication, we're talking here about the council of europe, which is described as the main human rights european institution. and as i pointed out, it really comprises countries that go well beyond the you that have different positions that have different policies. but that as an elaine up by

a book has also stress in the past. i really part of this pan european unity. so unity that goes beyond the european union itself. it, it is an important speech that we will hear from an anna babcock. it is expected to also touch on issues specifically related to the council of europe. the cost of, of europe, according to germany, has been going through significant challenges political challenges, but also financial challenges. and something that from the german perspective is particularly important is the issue that there will be an important head of state and government summit, which is something that doesn't happen very frequently within the council of europe . but there's one that's being planned for the month of may. so this is again, something that i expect an enter burbock will mention in her speech. thomas, can you give us a little bit of background on russia's connection with the council of europe? so i think that's relevant at talk about today or even better, the lack of reaction. russia was indeed a member of the council of europe joined the council of europe in february 1996.

but last year, as a result of the war in ukraine, he left the council of europe. however, as we can clearly see from this current situation, the overall issue of russia's aggression in ukraine of russia's war and ukraine is one that is dominating also, discussion here. it won't be the only issue that will be discussed by babcock or even by other leaders will be addressing the forum. but it is obviously the issue that really dominates the agenda. another stressed earlier, it's not only about the immediate situation, it's also about the wider situation when it comes to those implications. economic implications, political implications, but very obviously important in this particular case, the issue of human rights. she's talking at, they say in the council of europe, which is the human rights and democracy institution in europe. i want to ask you, i know that their books office released a statement mentioning political, a legal and financial challenges. can you give us a sense of what she would be referring to? well, that's the idea that the council of europe has been facing challenges and that,

and i'm stating here what that statement said by her office that it has to be fit for the future. again, the key concept there being this idea of pan european unity, the german government believes that that pan european unity, something that of vladimir putin with its war in ukraine start trying to destroy under such it is something that germany would like to stress. and that unity that goes beyond the european union and such what babcock is probably going to be discussing. there is not only the idea of further voluntary money that goes to the council of europe, but also stronger political backing. and when we talk about stronger political backing, we're specifically focusing on this as a stressed, important her head of government and state a meeting that is probably going to happen in, in may, that being planned for made the situ, reykjavik, that is seen as a very important step for the council of europe, in particular, when it comes to that political support that comes from a different countries or at thomas. thanks so much for that. we are still waiting

for anna lena bear book to start speaking. and while we wait, we will go on and with some other subjects, but we'll come back to you once. once we know that, and lena babcock is, is, has started her speech. and for now, germany is, as we've mentioned, under mounting pressure to supply ukraine with its leopard tanks and to allow other nations to do so in the defense minister bar. as pastorius has said that germany still needs more time to decide of countries like poland can re export that battle tanks to ukraine. however, in a press conference here in berlin with the nato chief in fulton, bird historian said that countries with german made leopard tanks can star training ukrainians to use them. and the polish defense minister has that now confirm that germany has received poland official request to re export bela tanks to ukraine. and we can hear now from the german defense minister burress stories and

the comments that he made about training ukrainian troops to use leopard tanks. really partner countries that are already have level 2 tanks that can be deployed of training of tank teams from the ukraine can already start. and that is absolutely no question whatsoever. we would not a stand in the way that he got his chief political correspondent, nina. they explained to us why germany still won't commit to sending its own tanks to ukraine despite giving allies the go ahead to start training ukrainian forces on how to use their own german made leopards. it is a tricky communication phase that we're dealing with here in berlin. there is not one message, a united message coming out of berlin. there are several people who are participating in the discussion here. but of course all eyes are on the left shows

the chancellor. so he is ultimately the one who has to make that decision. officially, it is the national security council that everybody knows. it's really the chancellor. he's always made it clear that he doesn't want to take such a step alone. he doesn't want germany to become party to the war. everybody sees combat tangs as some sort of a qualitatively speaking a step up that needs to be considered very, very carefully. and such a step can only be taken says the german government. if allies are on board, if it's got the support gemini, doesn't want to be the only country seen as applying combat tanks to ukraine. of course, that argument is sounding less convincing with the brits already having announced that they wanted to send challenge a two's. the french have also announced their willingness but the defense minutes about the story said again that he was expecting a decision very, very soon. now on that topic of training, ukrainian soldiers by other countries who already have those leopard tangs, who still just need germany permission. that is

a statement that boris the stories already made last week when he announced that that was of cause up to every partner to train ukrainian soldiers already. and he also said that his defense ministry is now looking at which leopard twos would technically be available if the german chancellor makes a positive decision so that the delivery can then happen swiftly and in an efficient way. ok. now, in the same press conference in stoughton bird, nato secretary general stressed the battle tanks all crucial for ukraine to stay and independent nation. so let's take a quick listen to what he said. but things are, of course important, both to be able to repel a russian, a new offensive, but also for ukraine to be able to retake territory to, to wind onto a prevail as a sovereign in the pen nation in europe. at the same time, we need to understand that the allies have all the decide the to deliver both

battle tanks, but also to deliver more armored vehicles, including infantry and fighting wiggles. so what we need is heavier, more modern equipment. that's exactly what the allies have old it announced to, to deliver sending of what was yen shelton bags main message to day was, was he increasing the pressure on jenn me to make a decision about sending it st. hanks now does. again, start mag says there cannot be any waste of time and you want or so ukraine needs to be helped so that you can defend itself. nato's chief also wants ukraine to be able to claim back some of its territory that the russians have conquered. in this terrible war and but the main message of where i got the feeling that was vital for the german government as well. and from in stoughton back here in berlin was that he wants to respect partners and their considerations for whether or not they want to send which systems. and he essentially is keep kept stressing that germany has

been vital and has been really instrumental in aiding ukraine. so far, this is sometimes forgotten in the public debate where everybody's focus is so much on the left twos that people forget that germany is one of the most important contributors worldwide when it comes to military age as well. not just financial and humanitarian so that that was also a call by native chief or allies to not essentially give russia the pleasure of seeing the west, squabbling and fighting with each other. he wants a united picture, but of course he's an internet man, and this is angelina bear book and addressing the council of europe in strasburg. madam secretary of parliamentary assembly, members of the parliamentary assembly, ladies and gentlemen, when human lives i endangered, when human dignity is in jeopardy, national borders and sensitivities become irrelevant. these are the words

of eli diesel, the holocaust survivor and noble peace prize winner. his experience of the horrors of the show up and the 2nd world war made him a lifelong believer in the need to stand up for human rights. regardless where violation occur, and to whom visa was convinced that when human rights are violated, that this is a warning signal for what that is to come. the council of europe was founded in 1949 was exactly this in mind. as an early warning mechanism against human rights violations, to prevent new was human suffering and tyranny on the european continent.

and as a common european home for democracy, human rights and the rule of law. for all europeans, protected by strong walls formed by the convention on human rights and the court of human rights. the council also comprises more than $220.00 conventions entreaties. and probably if we are all frank, no one in this room, maybe except for the president of the secretary general's could name on with them. and feel free to do the mass on how many bilateral treaties it would need to replace them. with all these conventions, with the european court of human rights ended monitoring mechanisms, the counselors setting the highest human rights standards. through its rulings, the court has strengthens women in the fight against domestic violence. it is both

said that freedom of the press and it has obliged off as governments to build polling stations that accessible to persons in a wheelchairs and with other disabilities. moreover, the court is currently pushing to words. intergenerational justice in ground breaking cases. for example, on the climate crisis, this direct x is that innovate sills have to an international human right court is unparalleled in the world. and that is why germany has vate made available additional means for the court. and we call on others. and actually i would say it's very blunt and open. we urge others to step up their support as well. because if we want a court to run in the future,

it needs obviously sufficient financial sources. and let me be clear, the court of human rights is something we can be more than proud of. however, we are also committed. so social conventions and resolutions to a fair income. and we cannot expect that was more cases at the court. judge says, less justice would do the same amount of work. so it's up to us the government to strengthen the court, our court of human rights, also in the future. the court reflects our convictions as member states of the council of europe, that our governments must put that peoples fundamental rights 1st. still, if we are honest to our self, we also probably, i would say again,

all of us would have to admit that before we became parliamentarians and politicians, many of us might indeed head sometimes a bit confusion if they would have to explain the difference between the council of europe and the european council. and did we actually all know that the anthem of europe and the european flag, which is 12 stars, were 1st used by the council of europe. the president this morning reaffirmed me again that they do not really care about copyrights in this regard. as long as the you also copies or finally read to fight the european convention on human rights without joking. i believe that this is actually not a bad thing. even though as a journalist, you can ride low people confused,

the council of europe at the european council, and it shows the neglect of the council of europe. i think this is not the true story. i believe that young people and even people of my generation, i am being 42 years old. having been credible like to have lived my whole life in peace and not in a dictatorship because being born in western germany, we took freedom and democracy for granted. but not because we neglected freedom and are not democracy, but because our interested build this council of europe and we all believe that we could live in this house of freedom of peace all together forever. so the crucial point is not whether the council of europe also the osi has played a strong enough role in the past. the crucial point is what we are doing now. now

when our european piece order, when the council of europe, the o. c, e is being under a check. this is our responsibility as politicians of our generation of this time. because russians wharf aggression is not on the war against ukraine, it is a war against the common european piece order. so what we have done in the last month was crucial, and i would like to thing and applaud you also here in the council of europe. that you have shown touching that he would never succeed in destroying ukraine. but that he would also never succeed in destroying our common home of peace, the council of europe. but we have to be also self reflective because we have seen also what we neglected in the past. too much is the

early warning system of this council of europe. because when human rights are under mind or disregard it, they saw early warning signs. weasel was talking about. and ladies and gentlemen, we have such warnings have been there in the past. when our friends and partners in central and eastern europe and to particular in the baltic pointed to russia's aggressive, especially my country, did not listen carefully enough. when we saw the show trials against alex, say, novelty. when we saw russia ignoring judgements by the european court of human rights, calling for his release. and when we saw rushes refusal to sign the assembly convention and drastically curbing women rights. these were all early warning signs and we didn't see them. we didn't take action as early as in

2017 russia changed its laws on domestic violence. so that min husband's partners who beat their wives would get in legal trouble. not why they are beating their wife. but the law has been changed. you would have to be your wife, since 2017 in russia repeatedly. she has to be sent to hospital, and then the criminal coal law would act. that should have sent a clear and loud warning. because women's rights all yardstick for the state of all democracies. when women aren't safe in a society, no one is safe. and when human rights are not respected in a country than ultimately peace and freedom off at risk,

president putin has made this obvious his language of rape for years. his repression at home goes hand in hand with his attempt to destroy ukraine in our common european piece order. that is why i'm convinced that today the council of europe, s, early warning mechanism is more important than ever. it's work for human rights makes the crucial difference to people across europe. and to be clear, europe is bigger than the you. the court managed on human rights and the council of europe. they create a common european home for human rights and democracy for almost 700000000 people. 700000000 people. who, thanks god, do not look alike, do not dream alike. they have different tradition, different histories,

and different plannings for the future. but 700000000 people, all united by their firm belief in fundamental rights. i had the privilege of seeing what this actually means. fundamental rights. when i spoke with teenagers and heart cove, earlier this month, i was that different spots in the caucus and saw all the destruction. but actually what touched me most was my last stop at the heating point set up with so much care. and i would even have to say, laugh we were sitting around a table. there was a warm stove, and we were offered tea and cookies because it was minus 12 degrees outside. and i was sitting was different teenage shows,

their school had been destroyed in the early beginning of that war. so i was asking them, where do you go to school? and they looked at me and said, our school has been destroyed. so they haven't been to school because not only their school had been destroyed, but many schools in hog of had been destroyed for almost an entire year. because going to a makeshift school would be to dangerous. because hawkins is the place 35 kilometers away from the russian border. so if there's a rocket being targeted to hock of it the hock of school, like before. there is no single air defense system which can prevent that this rocket would not hit their school again. they 456 seconds to

height. and 45 seconds is obviously way too little to height. you can only pray. so i asked them, what do you do if you're not going to school? and impressive thing is that even in a partly destructed tone, they have online teaching and classrooms. and i said, what are you doing otherwise? if you have 45 seconds, only to pray, because you cannot height and ago, one of the girl told me, well, i used to play volleyball, but obviously old, so my volleyball pitch is being destroyed. and i'm 16 years old. i normally hang around with friends. but also this is not possible any more. so actually, even though these sure school children, these teenagers survived,

they are not living a normal life like teenagers. they hide every day and night, praying that the next rocket will not hit them. so when i asked them, why did you leave? why didn't you leave this girl? the 16 year old said, well, i left was my parents to italy, but obviously she came back now. so why did you come back here coming back to a neighbourhood of celtic law, which was wiped out by the bombs when we were driving through them? you could see still the coffee table in a house which has been partly destroyed. people just drinking coffee before their rocket hit their home. she simply said was teased in her high eyes because this is my home. even though my home is noah prison, because i cannot go to school,

i cannot go to volleyball. i cannot go out with my friends anymore. this is my home . this is where i want to be. this is where i want to survive. if i'm not dying. so the only thing this girl and all her friends were asking for is to live a simple, normal life again, every day life where you go out as a teenager, to meet your friends, to play volleyball, and to go to school. it is this girl simple wish for life in freedom, in peace and was basic human rights. that brings home to me. what our agenda here at the council of europe is all about. or if you want to put, put it big as german sense, chancellor. conrad, i dunno, said it here at the council of europe when it was founded. the council of europe

is the soul of europe. it is our duty to keep this soul alive. that is why we are here. that is why i'm speaking. he is the german foreign minister. that is why you are here. and you are coming back every month to work for our european soul to solve it. for every person in europe, for the teenagers, in hoc, if to make sure that we are not missing the warning signals of human rights violation that can lead to violence and war. and to assure that the fundamental freedoms of women, men and children are better protected every single day, their rights to live, to live for life in dignity and freedom. yes, i believe we need the council of europe to day more than ever to put the power of

those rights about the power off might. president putin wants to dress your bag in a past dominated by power politics. west states can tremble on individual rights in the pursuit of imperial glory, where rulers dispose of their citizens like horns in geopolitical chess games. that is why in the face of russia's wall neutrality was not an option. we had to make a choice between injustice and justice, freedom and oppression. between standing on the side of the aggressor and standing on the side of the victims, the teenagers in hawk, if and we did the council of europe, we all together adopted a clear united stance against russia swarm.