just click away, find out best documentaries on you to see the world already right now. t d w documentary the warren ukraine, got a powerful international spotlight this past week, almost exactly, year after it began high level politicians math at the munich security conference to discuss more and foster aid to ukraine. and to try to cement their unity and commitment to the countries victory. my guest this week is the ukranian m. p. alexei gone to ranko, whose fort tirelessly to secure promises of international support for his country and more powerful weapons that hope that the decisions will be made and ukraine will receive everything we need and we will finish it quicker. the whole world is

suffering. not just your brain. did he get what he came for? ah, electric on children are welcome to come. so thank you very much for invitation. you got a lot of promises, but the music security conference. what were they? promises weaponry, promises for very long support, as long as it takes how it was said, no, by the way, it is very, i understand the importance of this signal, which was given by all chance social is president micron. vice president harris. first of all, to put in that the free world is ready for a long fight. and that is important also for people of the free world to explain that it can last long. but for ukrainians it sounds disturbing. regards the every day is very painful for us and we don't want on the war. we want to finish it quickly and we know that we can do this. that is what we definitely know. that's

why i appreciate that it was said as long as it takes, but i hope that the decisions will be made and ukraine will receive everything we need and we will finish it quicker. there's the whole world is suffering, not just ukraine. insulation cries is food, cries the fuel crisis. refugee cries is all of them worse than every day. because of what's going on in ukraine. one of the most important issues for you did you see any movement in the red lines governing what the western alliance will give you in terms of weapons, those red lines that you've spoken a lot about in the past? did they move? they move. i see that they move definitely 10 clare parts hymer. everything was red line. and then when we did that, hobbits or it moved along. well. yeah. but anyway, this last week, it moved way in ration as soon as yesterday told about the lawn ranged weaponry. and that is very important for us probably the most important today. also he

answered my question on the main stage about their training if you're green and pilots and he said that they start the process. now that is very important. and also after i had a possibility to speak with him a little bit in private. so that is a good signal. i see that the red lines are moving, but still there are some red lines in the heads. and the main red line is that many people here, they want ukraine to win the war. but at the same time, they're afraid of freshman, of russia to lose. i want to get into that in a moment. but what exactly was your was on your shopping list when you came here? one of your colleagues has spoken about trusting munitions, cluster munitions, banned under a convention that more than 100 countries of science. yeah, it's not something you want to know. the most important, when you asked the westphal customer, ah, yes,

we asked it's previously there and i just say it's similar right of the convention . that's all we are not just the signature of this convention. we will not have qualms of seeing a weapon like they're using it against us every day. so they may not make it. ok, yes it that they are killing us with these every day. so we have all the rights, all the moral right to use it because we are defending ourselves and we're using it, not like them against civilians, but just against army. we never tech to russian civilian objects. so we have all the right to use them. we are not signatories, so we have a jury to all right, to do this and in the united, that's very controversial. these weapons that very controversial. you know, i think when you are saying this, you just don't realize that every day ukrainians accused by russians when our own soil in our own homes, our women and children with controversial can be we have all moral right to defend ourselves with everything we can. if you will be checked on the street by somebody,

and if you will have a stone lying on the just under your legs, will you take it and use it to save your life? and oh, it's controversial to you stolen on the street. i think it's after it's absurd to say that there is something controversial for you. grain. we're not offended anybody. we're not attacking anybody. we don't want any inch of somebody's territory. we just want ours. we just want to be alive with our families on our land. and russia is committed, genocide against ukrainians and our occupied territories. that was said, kamala harris yesterday said about thousands of ukrainian children, which are taken from their families and sent to russia to make from ukrainian children rations. what more awful walk crime can be. i know speaking about rape and murder is and what is everybody knows? so i don't agree with you that there is some controversy. we have the right,

you ridiculous, we have the right morals, but that was not the most important in our shopping list. the most important was long range missiles at tech, and 1st of all, for hymer says by you and you're going to get those. ah, no, we don't have these as a clear promise. we're here. there are discussions, but still no decision. what if i say, what about fighter aircraft again, there is no decision to deliver them to deliver these weaponry to grain. but there is a decision to start training our pilots. that is the 1st step and very important because without training for us west and 5 to just as a piece of metal on wheels. so we need to train people to operate in them and the process reaches. so next said yesterday, answering my question, we start the process. now. you talked about the west and it's exaggerated fears about russian escalation. why, of the fears exaggerated new of you know, it's not about exists about russian escalation. there is a fear that russian defeat on the battlefield will lead to collapse afresh for

duration. and then move to manage challenges. why is that exaggerated? it occurred? could lead to the collapse it good? and there will be the challenges who will control me as destruction rep henry, what will be in russia, maybe bloodshed will be and see what will be not caucasus. but the problem is that today challenge is bigger. so the russian empire, life, russian empire is much more dangerous than what will be after collapse. the other will be a lot of problems after collapse. but it's better, it's the same. always soviet union would have to do. so get, you know, just imagine what would be, it would be not points invasion to ukraine. that would be pollutants invasion to poland. so it's better that soviet union does not exist anymore. but where the challenges of collapse the soviet union the years ago. definitely they work and also was bloodshed in not because it's in moldova, in many places. the west is also talked about the danger of nuclear escalation by

russia. you think that's exaggerated to know. i think that is a legitimate concern, but it's not to ukrainians. it's not for us to do something with this. what is the difference for the grain, you know, how to be killed by the ballad from russian soldier, by nukes by, i don't know chemical weaponry by missile fallen and all has already drone for us no difference. but the world should stop put in and this to prevent it. and i see that there are very important signals yesterday also that here in munich, we're speech of van e, who is their lead had of the chinese j needs external policy. yeah, absolutely, excellent. yeah, and oh, he's not an expert. you. the main guy is the policy guy. he's a member of dura and that is the senior person. and he said, clearly, no nukes, no chemical, no biological. that is very important signal that was signal to russia. he said he would put forward a piece proposal on behalf of china you interested in china's proposal. certainly,

why not? we're interested in all these proposals. we're ready to any business associations, but about what the subject should be if it is about russia live in ukrainian territory. we are very interested. we are very ready. we are eager to go ahead. if it is about some concessions from ukrainian side, that is not kind of negotiations very interested in years, it will mean that the international order is still violated and destroyed. that international law is not respected, even if one inch of ukraine and territory will be taken by russia. it will mean that countries can move borders by physical force that will be the end of international order, and there will be blotch it on the whole planet. let's talk about the situation on your front lines. the extreme urgency of getting ammunition ammunition, so by speeded up. how bad is the situation on your front lines? it's very difficult. on the eastern front line,

russia is just not counting people. they're sending wave by wave, as a con. cannon fodder will also have losses. not such highlight russia. it's comparable in general. but still for us, it's very painful. and russia meter by meter, but they have some gains. and yes, situation is difficult. that's why for us it's urgent to have a speed of delivery of ammunition of weaponry is when we hear, we will give you albums, but they will be in the end of the year, just where we are, where we are. and where is the end of the year? you know, so it's not just the promise to give it to it's the capacity of the west to be able to deliver it. absolutely, and here is a great challenge that the whole world meeting here in munich for years, the world we're meeting for security and just talking right. europe did militarized itself. the military, militarized itself,

is now united states of america would not be involved. where will be put him? i mean, what is the strength of wound just for? what is the strength of i missed of you even if there is a problem for them to send several dozens of operate in battle tanks. but just imagine, so europe delivered its security to the united states. but what would be some day? hopefully these day will never come. but if some day united states of america is election, it will be in there. and they will states not trust nato boss yet. stokeland buck has said that some delay on some types of ammunition has gone from 12 months to 28 months. that's not sustainable for you is absolutely that is that is, is that your biggest worry, my one of the biggest one or the biggest and you know, i, i can't understand. i mean one year it's one year of big war in europe. okay. we're

not speaking about mistakes which were made before. i am not speaking that everything was clear from 2008 when i started the war in georgia, then absolutely clear from 2014 when he started the war in ukraine. ok. even i'm not speaking about this but one year. why and one year that reduction could not be really like widened and organized in b quantities. icon to understand this, there are in ramstein for a month where these, you know, around staying military base. the reason meeting of ministers of the american bank . yeah. american ha support and you great. trump stand for month. if you will. you will take countries from stand forward together that g d p is 50 trillion dollars. it's normally, i mean it's, and in this country for one year, kennedy agonized, the process of production of a munition is concerned. go, if you do get what you need and quickly, you said the war could be over in

a matter of months. yes. are you talking about outright victory on the battlefield? yes. as a possibility. you really believe that? absolutely. i was the 1st month after invasion. i joined territorial defense and i saw everything by my own eyes when we were defending you. in march of last year, we would have hi mar, says harvard service and everything else we received in may june. we would finish everything in april. then the same was in summer before ash immobilized. then the same was after russia mobilized, but really conscripted people still had not arrived and all the time, which is enough to put him. so the less than these let us mixed up ahead of him and we will finish everything in month. the american defense department doesn't seem to agree with you on that. the chairman of the joint chiefs general mcmillan said last week, he still believes the war will end with neither side likely to achieve their military aims. neither side sounds like fail me. you know, i am just,

i was just one month soldier to return defense in general, nearly respect to general, but he wrong. yes, i think so. why? because one year ago the same people in tempting them said that ukraine will fail. you will fail in 3 days whether right or not. they were wrong year ago. why we should be sure that they are not drawn to day? do you trust western governments to, to back whatever demands you are going to make to get to a peace deal? i trust our partners, we trust our partners and alice, when does tend to that they have concerns, we need to work with these concerns. but in general, yes, the restaurant between ukraine and the west and the free world. absolutely have any of the countries said they want to say in the piece, negotiate options we want to. yeah, definitely. i think because this war is not just because between ukraine and russia, not just about ukraine and russia, it's much why the context more countries will be on the negotiation table better?

absolutely. do worry about public opinion worldwide. you worry about war fatigue outside of ukraine. i ask because global public opinion is showing some signs of that fatigue according to an ip south pole. in january, in 28 countries, 42 percent, say the problems of ukraine and none of our business. and we should not interfere. that number has gone up 3 points since last march, april. does that concern that concerns me? but you know, when we're speaking about pulse, it just means that we're not doing enough job because it's about people, we just need to explain why it is important. that's why i'm so thankful for you that to you that you invited to me. just explain to people. that's not about ukraine and russia. if fortune will not be stopped now, he will go ahead and then they to soldiers will fight already need to territory. d runs, i like joe political man. yes. they can stop. they only can be stopped. and if you

would be successful in any way that will be a message for the other dictators in 2 rooms in the world to attack, and that can be absolute disaster. and the last thing i just want to remind all of our listeners in years. so 2 years ago, ukraine was the 1st country in human history, which voluntarily gave up nuclear weaponry, under guarantees of united states, united kingdom and russia, but guarantees which meant nothing. absolutely. but tell me what is because you will let bout, you will not. yeah, absolutely. but what will be the message to the world if after ukraine gave up nuclear weaponry, our territorial integrity would not be restored. that will mean just one thing to all countries in the world go nukes. yeah, you should become nuclear power. if you want to have security, nobody will help you. what will mean these in future in 2030 years, we will have nuclear war, or are they in south america? oh, in asia, oh, in africa own in europe. so this is war is

a crucial moment of the 1st half of 21st century. that's something we need to explain to people and i believe this 42 percent you told about they will become 32 than 122. that's what we should work on. you tried after the invasion of crimea in 2014. you tried to get the west interested in the subject to tell them how dangerous it was to tell them that international order was being ripped up. nobody listened to that. yes. i mean, tell me about some of those conversations. i mean, you went to the council of europe, you went to brussels, you talk to the americans. nobody was interested. why not? what did they tell you? they were telling, let us not escalate. les, let us find peaceful solution. let us speak with russia as better have negotiations and all this stuff. but you see the lesson is clear, same people, you're talking through almost the same. it's democracy. it's not like pushing who is the tunnel? these people changes and that good thing about democracy is that we're,

that politicians changes and other see the mistakes of their prentice. there's, there's and can not repeat this mistakes and that's, i hope, what will happen. we can speak about what happened in 2014. we can speak about what happened in to 1008, but in reality, is it really frustrating that even after 2014 germany was sold, it was increasing, needs dependence from rush and fossil fuel. when it was clear, the food and we'll weaponized it one day. why it was a great mistake, but no sense to speak about it now. now there is a chance to speak about the lesson, but just that, but just one lesson is the west have acted in a more concerted way and a tough away. do you think they could have prevented as a little from? absolutely. if there was a chance to stop it in 2040, absolutely. if the free world would stop it in 2014, 2022 would never happen. that i can tell you absolutely,

for sure. fujen felt himself irresponsible. he felt that he can do this, and he felt encouraged and emboldened. that's that was a huge mistake. that affected your view of the west today. you say the politicians have changed and they don't stay forever. there are democracies, people get voted in and voted out. but isn't there a residual feeling that the west could still let you down? know i will explain away. that's the big changes. that's a big change and why i will explain it's not about petitions. because these are democracy. it's about societies. and when it's hard for me to speak about it without emotions, when milan, so if your grand women and children, we are running away from the country, millions of polish people, german people, romanian people, opened the doors of their houses to take people whom they never saw in their life, it means that the west is alive. this, him, humanity, in the west. this idea of this civilization is alive. and that is the strength of

the civilization. politicians can make mistakes, but the values they're really here, it's not about consumer is know this about humanist. and that's why i believe in 3 won't and i don't have any residual feeling. let me take you back to february the 24th. when the invasion started, you, you joined the civil defense unit? yes. you in case you had a gun. yes. you are prepared to use it. yes. what was morale like? on that day? it was very difficult day. i hope it will never repeat in my life. my wife called me, it was 5 o'clock she was in odessa with our children. i wasn't here if she called me and said that she heard explosions. that's in the invasion started. we voted for marcia law in the parliament and then i realized that i have only 2 options. the 1st option is to run away from here. the 2nd option is to take weapons in my arms.

were you scared? yes. so now it was clear that in sir, and when we were listening into their prognosis with a west that you will fail in $34.00 days. and i came to defend you if it meant that maybe in $34.00 days, that will be that. but that was an a choice which hundreds of thousands of ukrainians made. they said we will not runaway, after that day, what did you find out about yourself about your country that we have very strong that you have values and that we will definitely when have you allowed yourself to think ahead to what it might be like to live in a peaceful country again, do you allow yourself to think about why the war breaking? you know, i can, i can see you, many people have these trial maps and i will traumatized. so ukrainians definitely

. but many people are saying how you and you, what is, but the question is you need to do something all the time. there was a moment in one month after start of invasion when i had it almost free day. and that was the, the worst today. during the all the time, why? because all these, all these emotions images, all these thoughts and motions they came to me that was very difficult. and i couldn't just stay in my apartment. i just came out on the street and i was just working like several hours just one just just working. and that is the answer all ukrainians we're doing today. everything we can to when and when you are working 247, you don't have much time to things to regret. and we don't have time even to cry or tears. we will do it later. when peace does eventually come, there are so many people who've been vital to your society who won't be there. yes,

they've gone. yes. we're talking about doctors teach us soldiers, policeman cards, we're talking about battling people like a should professionally, came to to the front line and dine there. that is great problem. and but i believe that all of these wars not without sounds. i believe that. yeah, we are paying huge price, but we should do this because 100 years ago ukrainian ukraine lost its independence also against russia. and after this, russia organized genocide of your grain followed them a lot more than the awful 2nd world war, blood lambs, the salvation survey, everything. i mean, like millions of people died. so yesterday we're losing thousands, but we're losing thousands not to lose millions. you've put a lot of emphasis on postwar justice war crimes tribunals. yeah. you really have

hope that you will be able to prosecute or see prosecuted russians have committed war crimes. what a lot of people get away with a lot of bad things. a lot of serious crimes these days don't think what is the sense to live without hope. and it's not just about hope. it's not just about justice for you grain. why this trip? you know, so needed is to prevent such things to happen in other parts of the planet. everybody should know and should have a lesson. you couldn't act like this. that's the aim. that's why we're pushing. it's so hot. and you think you'll get results. i'm sure about this. i'm sure i don't know about putting himself well, he be sentenced by history or by tribunal, but i am sure that many biggest part of his on thrush will be on the bench in the courts, and they will play that price. as you know, your president followed him as a landscape, become something of a hero in the west. in october,

you told the key of post that he was bearing his responsibilities as commander in chief with dignity. but that didn't mean you had no questions for him, only that the questions would wait until after the war. exactly. sounds like the moment the guns stopped firing, the politics will begin again. the political battles, because we are democracy and political battles use iraq like russia shows, dos, political battles in democracies is the only way to prevent physical rail battled on the front line. and you're ready to battle him when the past take a look again again, i can repeat it. he bared his responsibilities but how dignity and he's great as a commander in chief from february 24, but have a many questions about how we got to february 24th and how we were prepared for and all these questions i will race. after all. i look say concern i got it's been good having you in conflict. so thank you very much for your invitation. ah

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ah ah ah, this is dw news live from berlin, a returned to find justice in the ukrainian city of our special correspondent this there to see how one man is coping with the devastation left by russian occupation last year his families attempt to escape left him alone. his wife and children dead can just be served or so coming up with a pattern traffic landslide and an open page. coal mine in china at least 4 are dead with some 50 people, missed.