tv To the Point Deutsche Welle February 24, 2023 8:30am-9:01am CET
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the early days of the war and in may, it finally fell to russian forces. the city that had been home to 450000 people, lay in ruins. but russian victories remain few and far between. in september, ukraine's military surprised russia with a lightning offensive that took back the city of hark, if, as well as hundreds of square kilometers of territory, ukraine then proceeded to liberate the city of cas on 2 in a major humiliation for the russian army, russian troop morale was said to be low. meanwhile, ukraine was benefiting from an increasing flow of high tech western weapons, including the high mars multiple rocket launcher. this allowed key of forces to hit far behind enemy lines, cutting off supply routes and hitting ammunition depos. since retaking har give, and her son, the front line has been mainly stable with russia focused on capturing the city of bar malt. this is part of an effort to take the entirety of the done yet so no
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hands provinces, one of russia's original stated goals. so what's next? russia has pulled hundreds of thousands of new conscripts into the fight. but the latest offensive pushing along the front line in the dumbass has so far yielded no major gains for russia. meanwhile, ukraine is also gearing up for a counter offensive. and as expecting deliveries of dozens of advanced bottle tanks from germany, poland written on the u. s. ukrainian soldiers are also getting training from nato on sophisticated military maneuvers that could help them punch through the russian lines and take back more territory. how far they can go is another question. it's clear that key of can only keep fighting as long as the weapons keep flowing from its weston allies. and dw is funny for char,
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as in key for us. i asked her how the atmosphere in the ukrainian capital compared with last year on this day. i really, one year ago, people really were passive packing up scared, trying to leave, and ukraine and military vehicles, rule and rolling here through the city today. i see a lot of people actually just had to work and traffic is building up because people, a lot of people actually have moved back to the capital. and when you talk to them about to day, many of them don't really want to be reminded of this anniversary because they're being reminded constantly every single day. but they're bloodshed that plays out in so many parts of ukraine. people are nervous today, but it's not like it was a year ago, or people really in chaos and in panic. just trying to get out of the capital. but at the same time, of course, if there's anything positive that people can take away from that fatal day february 24th 2022 is the fact that rushes attempt to take over key of to take over the government here basically,
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and control this entire country failed not on here and keep, and the region during the north, but also in many parts of hockey region. and also ukraine was able to liberate hair, so city, which by the way to date was the only regional capital that russia was able to temporarily control during the past year. so people as they wake up and go to work right now. yes, they are nervous, but at the same time, they just want to go on with their lives, hoping that this war is going to and that there is not going to be a 2nd anniversary coming up. but meantime, ukraine says that it thinks that russia is preparing a new offensive. are people expecting it now? we just returned from a frontline town on there. people obviously are living through that offensive already did. they are urging everyone who is able to deliver weapons, but also to deliver piece to, to do that. so the atmosphere along the frog lines is of course, much different than in the capital ray. i'm right now. yes,
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people are nervous because they just simply do not know what it is going to be. may be an air strike or any air offensive by russia to mark this very grim day. they're hoping that's not going to happen, but at the same time as i say, to have to live with this uncertainty every single day. and so often. in fact, during this past year, you've heard this word defiant that ukrainians are very defiant in these. they are the also very resilient. but with one year of this war, aging, all the also very tired and simpy traumatized there really hope that the war is going to be brought to an end. even though obviously nobody knows. and we have just heard in that report how the dynamics are just going to develop as ukraine enters the 2nd year of this brutal war and funny today, in the past weeks we've been saying high profile visits from world leaders and overwhelming show support from the un general assembly billions more and aid
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fledged by the united states and others. how does all of this international good will affect people that you speak with on the ground? they definitely see this as array of full, not just in the light of the fact that they want to believe that that military age, but also humanitarian aid is not going to a cease to sell because they say here, if that stops that also probably ukraine is going to stop to exist as we know it. now, at the same time, of course, they really won the as this war age is on. whether there's going to be some sort of an apathy setting in, in the mines publicly across europe, but also in many parts. of the world where people, how ordinary citizens are struggling with inflation struggling with, in fact, various governments who are using a different narrative on what's happening in ukraine, which is because of sanctions or they are, there is an increase of prices, energy prices, et cetera. so they're really hope that the interest in what's happening here is not
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going to vain and, and, and, and vanish in some sort. but they really hope that these all the symbolic remarks by president biden, for example, by you leaders. but also, as we have play seen, play out in new york yesterday, the you a general assembly that all of these symbolic steps that actually go to translate into our hands to make sure that even though life is probably never going to be the way it was before the 24th of october last year, but at least that there's going to be piece rebuilding both physically but also mentally here for the people that of ukraine funding for char and keith. thank you . immediate, complete, and unconditional withdrawal from the territory of ukraine. that is what the world to man's, from russia. it is the wording of a resolution that was passed earlier, resoundingly by the united nations general assembly. the went, took the rare step of calling an emergency special session to vote on the 10 point plan to end the fighting. just ahead of the 1st anniversary of rushes invasion of
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ukraine. draft a solution, a slash yes, 11 slash l 7 is adopted. the message to moscow from the majority of the world's nations cease hostilities with ukraine and withdraw your military immediately slash the resolution drafted by ukraine and was passed by a 141 of the u. n's $192.00 member nations ocean on the eve of the wars one year anniversary for us l. the result is not binding. evan, but it shows the wide support ukraine has around the world. we are satisfied with the outcome and the message is clear. it doesn't matter what russia thrice and how it attempts to undermine international order. and the coalition in support of ukraine suited tauriel integrity. it fails one time after another is as
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follows. only 6 nations joined russia in voting against the resolution, which also calls for investigations into serious crimes committed in the course of the war. russia's ambassador had little comment. he called the resolution useless on twitter and said it would only prolong the quote, ukrainian tragedy. china, whose foreign minister pledged a deeper partnership with russia just a day before the vote, abstained along with 31 other country, he says g, beijing's ambassador said his country supports the territorial integrity of all nations. ha ha, but opposes arming ukraine. woodville means all it's also g, t oc, the stance true criticisms inch from several of keith's allies. woman including berlin, i've heard also to day. some of you had said that by arming ukraine, we are adding fuel to the fire. but the truth is,
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if russia stops fighting this war, and if ukraine stops fighting ukraine and binding or not the resolution as a sign of rushes, isolation one year into its war on its neighbour. but moscow hasn't given any indication that it's willing to stop how strong a gesture is this un resolution. i put that to nicole rembert who focuses on foreign and defense policy at the german council on foreign relations. where it sends a very strong signal to the world, because the way the members of the un voltage this here, it's not any different from the way they voted a year ago. so it shows an overwhelming support for ukraine. and this is more than just shows an attitude when it comes to the violation of the country. and it's a border china abstained from the vote as it's done in the past. but in the hours
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after the resolution was passed, beijing released a much anticipated 12 point piece proposal to end the fighting in ukraine. what is your reactions about plan? how is it being seen? trying to place an interesting role here. and in providing a 12 point plan, the content of the plan was known before because many of the of the issues in the plan has been, i think, your latest communicated by china already. so we didn't see anything new here and we didn't see it on the nation off the wall. but again, it shows that china place an interesting role and one to be seen as a mediator in the conflict. nicole robert from the german council on foreign relations. thank you so much for providing that perspective. we appreciate it. and the ukranian city of butcher, a suburb of cave,
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is known for the trail of death and destruction left behind after russian military occupation. human rights experts say that it is a possible war crime scene with evidence of summary executions, torture, and enforced disappearances. he w. a special correspondent, abraham met one booter resident on a quest to find justice for his family. all that alexander check mary of ever wanted. was to keep his family safe. he brought them to boucher after rushing back forces attack their home town in eastern ukraine in 2014. the check mary of spot a house and made it how much them we lydia. so it was said that we could escape the war here to be, but we did not put in, found us even in butcher, and was telling us say you couldn't full scale war and ukraine. february 2022 brought russian troops to alexander's doorstep. his children could no longer
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take the sound of shelling. their father brought them here, a shelter under their home and planned their 2nd escape. well to the chick mary off left one early morning in their car with their neighbor holly up behind them. they barely made it out of their street when they saw a russian armored vehicle where you will osgood, mom, you know, at the end of the rita, my wife shout. let's turn around. we didn't and managed to get away. you see that other parts of this shooting begun at my car, caught fire with o'denza. alexander was wounded, but when he looked back, his wife and children were dead looking shows stood only. this is the end of his story. the story of my wife and my children. the sidewalk is still charged from when alexander's car caught fire, marking the exact spot where he last saw his family alive. alexander
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story is sadly that if so many here in boucher there are reports of torture, rape, an extra judicial killings where i'm standing right now. this actually used to be the sight of a mass grave of civilians. they all had to be exempt, identified and re buried when ukrainian forces retook the town. almost a year on. the question on everyone's mind is, where is justice and can it ever be delivered? ukraine's prosecutor general has set up a web page where anyone can report a legit war crimes committed by russian forces. authorities have received almost 70000 cases, a number that goes up every day in the key of region alone, which includes boucher, that numbers 10000. a prosecutor for the jurisdiction tells me really low liquid with the odds of we are identifying the names of persons soldiers investigating preparing charges and bring them to coach was left on approaching
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a oh no one hug through the full of william such as limitations does not apply to will crumbs or working non stop principle. so far, nationwide, 25 russian troops have been convicted for war crimes. the international criminal court and the un have also opened up their own investigations. but justice can be slow, often taking years to examine crimes committed in minutes, minutes. that will stay with alexander forever. he spoken to both ukrainian and international investigators, hoping it might help with the pain, with them to worship. i want to look this people in the i that's when i will know god, they have been punished. thus i am sure i will feel much better law when there are results with and not just legal procedures. but the thought lenses, people who have been given a shock, he to knew the book,
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what i'm for now. he's kept his family home exactly as it was. the children's toys are still in their drawers. the bet sheets are fresh and their pictures are everywhere. it's not always easy being surrounded by reminders of the life he's lost. but until alexandre finds justice for his family. that is all he's got. you're watching date of the news and we will continue our coverage of one year since the russian invasion of ukraine began to the point is up next. it's hosted by my colleague belinda crane. the focus is the war and ukraine. a war without ent coming right up. i'm sarah kelly and berlin. stay with us. ah. a year after russia invaded ukraine, it has seen serious setbacks. ukraine is holding on,
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but the price is high. many subsist in a landscape of craters and ruins. thousands of ukrainian civilians have been murdered. women raked children deported over 8000000 refugees have spread across europe. more than half of them seeking shelter in e u countries. well, joe biden became the 1st u. s. president, in modern history to visit a war zone unprotected by us troops. russia's leader once again lashed out against the west and sought to prepare his people for protracted conflict and ongoing sacrifice. so were asking ukraine one year on war without end were without a winner. hello and welcome to to the point. it is a pleasure to greet our guests. alex say you super heads,
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the russian program at germany is free to reach a budget if don't. marcos kime is a senior fellow in the security policy division at the german think tank s w p. and my colleague senior pasco, is originally from ukraine and works in detail abuse brussels bureau and senior. let me begin by asking you what's uppermost in your mind as we mark this 1st anniversary of the russian invasion. i am very worried as a ukrainian up. i am just worried that the suffering is going to continue and that, ah, there will not be enough help in order to counter further aggression coming from russia. and there are people who are saying ukraine will when it's inevitable. and i know that it sounds very good,
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but it's too early to say that because nobody knows how this war will end. and when it will end, i know that you told me if you actually did expect that russia would would invade. what were your feelings when you woke up that morning and, and heard that in fact it was happening. i expected it when at the press conference with the all 4, it's 14 mentioned the word genocide. for me, it was clear that something was wrong and combined with the, with the troops on the border. i, you know, it's like at one plus 2, i was able to calculate it. but being a ukrainian, i did not did not want to accept the reality. and i was hoping that i was wrong. so on the day that it happened, and i had to, you know, do a seminar, i was preparing for it was looking forward to it. but after several minutes of the
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seminar, i just, i just, it was online. so i, i could crawl on the couch and i, i found myself on the couch crying for hours shaking. ah, and thinking about the black hole that has torn itself all pen. it's a black hole to the worse, a human atrocities that we can imagine. it's a, it's a gateway to the worst things a human being can commit in this world. and i felt all that at that moment without really knowing what was going to happen. alexi, letting me put in has claimed from the outset that he launched this invasion in order to unite ukrainians and russians. who are a single people, hasn't this war done far more to divide than to unite? well, at least it's safe to say that the russian aggression probably has sped up the creation of for ukrainian modern political nation. i think there are some polls recently
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they're showing that people who identify themselves as ukrainian politically have been increasing steadily over the last years. but after their aggression their way up, the 90 percent lions. and so let him, he wouldn't actually, even if there was any question, i don't think there was any question about the existence of ukrainian nation which is completely separate from the russian one. but even if there was a chance, 2 boys this question about which has ended this discussion. yes. put a big, fat dog and said, well, the aggression gives those who have lead, lives of intertwined and mixed back grounds. language wise, identity wise economically gave them a very clear emotional stimulus to understand themself as ukrainians and the not as that on the russian. me, i, if i listen to some of the sound bites that we heard from people leaving the big celebratory concert that was held out this week in moscow, russians. and they seem to believe at the continue to believe the propaganda about
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being one. when people did the one thing we need to understand about the russian state propaganda is that it operates in a very smart mode of conduct. and this is the big difference to the dictatorship of the 20th century. we're used to having an authoritarian regime. it defines a new truth, which is very often not connected to reality, and then it's hammered down the throats of the people who consume the propaganda. in russia, it's a little bit different. you have everything on the board. if you're a communist, then this war is about beating back the high pro capitalists in american imperialism. if you're a russian chauvinist, then this is your sound bite of saying, look, finally the peoples of cuba. ruth's i reunited on the leash of moscow. if you're a person who tends to think and geopolitical, it's, you don't really care about your crate. it's about a rebirth of russia is a superpower. if you're an esoteric person, you will have other arguments again. so what we see in the tv is just one offer to
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keep a certain percentage of the russian population satisfied all of the things contradict each other. that's not a problem. this is made on purpose. marcus. and then let's switch to the west. how would you say that the war has changed if at all, europe, the u. s. germany, i, what i found most interesting and to be honest, most surprising, was last year, the clear commitment of the united states for european security. they have returned as a last provider of european security. i mean return is not the proper word. they have not been told in the way. but i mean, we have to keep in mind what happened. the key signals of the 1st year, the foreign policy of the by mistake, the 1st sign or the 1st paradigm to put it this way was priorities the in the pacific. it's about atlanta, china and the 2nd paradigm to put it. this was u. s. foreign policy for the middle class or the years
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a whole for us foreign policy. it's more conditional. it's not in the give, it's not a given anymore. the classical us international in this role. and given this background, i think it could not really be expected that united states would play a role would follow this commitment regarding european security. and i mean, it's quite substantial to thought $20000.00 and sort of having, we've deployed more to europe as far as the $80000000000.00 of help for the ukraine . 8 and 8 grade. this is quite something. let me just ask you to look at the other side. now, europe, germany has a also been changed in a way, in a complimentary way. i think, i mean in particular, germany has since 906 is always been torn with the security policy between the european orientation and the transit. then the orientation,
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i think this has been decided for the foreseeable future. the united states has presented itself as the last provider of security for european in europe. and the european union has never minute, despite all efforts to develop into a credible, effective, sure to ride in europe. and therefore, what i see is a trans atlantic gift of german trends. a cigarette in defense policy with on the road would have expected mill littler kennels room for the last, let's say 2030 years. and we're going to later on, dig a bit deeper into whether that can last. let us 1st, however, look at the high price that ukraine has paid over the past year. villages and cities have been reduced to ash and rubble. thousands of civilians have been wounded or killed, millions displaced and yet many go on trying to preserve a semblance of normality. a kindergarten in cromwell tours,
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an apartment building and car keys, a clinic in harrison, all targets of russian attacks milledgeville, who from you. i know there's a chance i might die last night, a shelf flew into my garden. all the windows were blown out like a bullet wound to my house this morning. it could have hit me in the head issue, reward i live in the ruins with no water, no light. oh, we need peasy. it's essential in ah, buried sirens and keys for it's part of everyday life. even far away from the front lines. people shelter in bunkers or subway stations, places that not only provide refuge but also serve as classrooms. this is also the new normal person. it's not that comfortable for the children, but there have been so many alarms in september. so they've gotten used to this
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kind of school with, with glory, took heroes things the crowd war is also pervasive in this club. and keith would be a year. this is the link between war and peaceful life. it allows us to switch off for a moment and remember what life was like a for more and what it would be like after our victory. what is the war doing to ukrainian society? and let me pass that question straight over to the senior. what are you hearing from friends and family in ukraine? what is the war doing to ukrainian society? ah, many people are extremely tired. they are exhausted. they are reluctant, you are hide themselves from no attacks even because the sirens sounds so often that sometimes they just want to go on with, you know,
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whatever daily business they have. because they say i have a list of things to do today, or they cannot really continue their work because there is no electricity. there is no light. so they can not give classes on line. they cannot make phone calls over, you know, messengers and so want. so some of them do is try to escape in, you know, whoever can work and escape into their work and just continue as if it were a normal life, you know, going to sports, doing mana cures, you know. but of course, you can see that all the people want, it's a common desire for any anniversary for any birthday, any new year. the only thing people wish is for to have peace, but they don't want peace at any price. they say we want this to be over with a victory. that would be ours. alexi, let me return to putins claim that the war is about uniting to people how much
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compassion do russians actually feel for their ukrainian breads are and how much do they know about the daily lives of those in ukraine? i think they know quite little, it's safe to say that the war has also marked em separation of the informational spaces and rounds. it's very hard for even if you're interested, if you are politicized russian citizen, maybe even critical of the government of the regime. it's very hard for you to come by um and to get access to the same informational stream as we consume here. a good example is if you say the word boucher, every one knows in germany in ukraine, obviously. but also in europe, everyone knows what it is and where they were crime, say exactly, it is all world night. exactly. so it's clear, it's connected to the atrocities, but the russian troops, the pictures, other and so on. if you say the word butcher in russia, it's not that people, some people would deny anything happen,
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but many people just say and doesn't really ring a bell. there was something, but i'm not sure. and this shows you that the informational space and the agenda is controlled by the russian government a completely different way. and when it comes to compassion, there are even people in russia who would say that they have a lot of compassion with ukraine butts. and i'm coming back to this buffet of propaganda narratives. one of them is that this is air defense war. it's a defensive operation. sure, it's preemptive. but it claims that if russia wouldn't have strike 1st, it would have been target of the attack. obviously this is bogus, but for people it's easy to combine their general compassionate and maybe even pacifist outlook within necessities of the big bullet can saying it's bad, people are suffering. but this is what war means and it had to be done. so it's hot, it's very important to see why actual looking at their societies very fragmented. um, there is no access to free information. and in general, there is also this idea that it's about politics and between people will come by.
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and so fortunately, we don't see a genuine societal into ukrainian sentiment among normal population. yet it might come because the government might want to start to fuel it. but at the moment, i wouldn't say this is the case senior data, me putting recently, but constantly refers to russia within its historic borders. that being one of his ration aus for the invasion is, is this war ultimately, perhaps more about russian imperialism than about russian. brotherly nurse. definitely. ah. because we don't see any foundation to his claims. what, what is he talking about when he refers to the russian empire? or what is he talking about when he says that ukraine is ruled by nazis? you know, one of the favorite narratives of russian propaganda. ah.
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