seem to tennis, tennis has she survived our spits, thanks to music. he was the nazi's favorite conductor. he is morally degenerate. ah, 2 musicians under the swastika, a documentary about the sounds of power, inspiring story about survival of the home. i don't get the tennis. i was the only one what night and look. music in nazi germany. watch now on youtube. d. w documentary. just over a year ago, the main russian attack on ukraine was launched from bella. ruth's a country long subservient to the cremeans will. but opposition still survives there, even though its leader is in exile in lithuania, convicted in absentia of trying to seize power. she svetlana t canoe sky routing for

a ukrainian victory that she said could propel her group to power in balloons. so is she ready for a bloody civil war? look, it over, might be one of the nearest. but sir, you know, if the year you say very casually, a lot of people might die. you ready for that? for now? valid email. the lensky is refusing to meet her. his officials have said bluntly, her movement is irrelevant. how much damage has that done her? but she have what it takes to stand up for europe last dictated in bella. ruth and the russians who protect him. ah, she atlanta taken with guy a welcome to conflicts own without him never one. let's talk if we may 1st about the situation in ukraine, you're obviously in touch with your supporters. people in the opposition there. what are they saying about the stage of the war has reached in ukraine? what is their opinion of that stage?

so people in the rules understand that the, the war in the ukraine was a huge pain for the people. because those are support and ukrainian in this war course. people wonder how long the war continued because people slides the truancy notice. and of course, our country is also influenced by this war. and people in business understand that it's focus shaneka who became co operative in this war, that our country became a corporate. despite the view, there were some people in our country about 86 percent. so good sense against the spatial builders in this war. but it became accomplished and he provided our territory for want me to to train. but of course, some people don't want to pray. can you connection with the of the ukrainians as

nation and the use of your country. bella luce and your supporters who are pushing for democracy. these fortunes are intimately tied to what's happening in ukraine. if you crane doesn't win this war, and when it decisively, you have no chance of ever changing the system and bellows to you. oh, of course not. you know, when the bills and people don't accept this, this regime and you more they want changes, they want to release our political prisoners. they want to, they chose a prayer pm way of development. these will be able to show this fight against the regime. of course, the face of the crane. i intertwined and i don't even accept the thought that ukrainians might lose, i believe in the victory. and i believe in the bill or some people over there.

we're sure, of course we can predict how much time it will take, but there are some people who will never agreed to leave onto the data she let's talk about the 15 year sentence 100 down by a court in bella. rue switch, convicted you of treason and conspiracy to seize power. you are now in exile and if you a near how want to you about your safety? you know, i'm under threat since 2020 and it hasn't changed for a day since then. i don't know how long there regimes hands off, and i understand that, you know, i can be hampton this or this way. and the my, remember the land in the, for ryan, they apply when 2 people have been kidnapped. but i know this high, i have to continue my work and until i am free until i have support or for and the protection of which i will continue to, you know,

i will continue my work. how do they affect you these constant threats? oh, actually not really because i really believe that people who fled to bill was because the repression they might feel secure want in, in the western countries. but of course be, have a lot of trouble because of these trials because of because of the trials and of santia and people might be in the regime. i plan to into pool for example, to extra addict people. but i see how the sense, you know, despite of this threat, they continue to fight your response to this sentence as being that your movement is unstoppable. and if lucas should go through it, otherwise he's wrong. it may not be the sentence that stops you, but the constant repression and bellows severely limits what you can do,

doesn't it? of course. so we can do a lot inside barrows because the level of repression, of course, influenced people a lot. and our movement went on the ground, and people actually show almost every day small acts of disobedience or harbor cache in the room. and recently, maybe had heard that russian airplane was pulled up by our partisans. so, building originals that they didn't manage to still bill or some people and even under huge weight or for oppression. people continue to resist and can't influence the mind. we are thinking of people anymore, and this is the most important. will you say that? but in 2021, you said if you want a beautiful picture of demonstrations of protest those we can call people to the streets. but how many victims will it cost us?

my question to you isn't the price for resisting, becoming simply too high for most people and bellows? ah, people are fighting for the country. people are fighting for a day independence. people are fighting for the rights. and of course, are what people are sick, refined the freedom, some sick refined with their lives. but the, this is the price or for leaving in the previous years and be see that to and have he has plots and people are still ready for, for this sick profile. and the day the history will show, you know, the future will show how much, how many victims won't be. we'll have but, you know, of course we would like to avoid all this. and the only question is the only person, and he say people around him are responsible for the victims. people are ready for these people are ready to fight. you have a wonder if it's all worth the heartache and the personal sacrifice your own

husband was given an 18 year sentence and you have no idea when you are going to see him again. do you? yes, i don't have an idea the same as the thousands of people in prisons and hundreds of 1000 say it was actually taken as hostages. but people understand the responsibility for all those who have read the 6 or 5 to be the they live sexually . and in all, for me personally, you know, this is my husband who is my motivator to continue this fight when they look at my children who are asking me every day when they are going to see they, they, it's a, gives me this push, you know, to go to continue because of course i'm from time to time. of course i'm sometimes frustrated and you know, it's torn to be these prison temps that's given to people. but you understand that if you talk, you know,

it will not change anything for years. so now don't think about yourself, don't think about too personal and sick for 5, but, you know, continue to do what you do despite all the repression in bella, luce, you paint a picture of a much more fluid political situation than others have done. you said a couple of weeks ago. look, shank, i can't control the situation in bella luce anymore. the regime is very fragile at the moment. it might seem monolithic, but it's not. where is this frigid lety that you see? and what is graphically is lucretia and not controlling. so the only thing that gosh, case control and is the actual repression and repression. he manages, you know, to keep people in stress, but not enough to control the repression. that's enough for him, isn't it? i wouldn't say so, you know, if your question can manage to change

a way of thinking of people that they understood. ok, you know, we had done the, i'm not going to do and yet the nails, but ever the weights in the, you know, for, for the sex of disobedience. so this more next of sabotage. you know, when the war has started, he will show us that his oppressed business decides. and then when the russian assures were coming through bill was a tips of sabotage, took place on railways. it was unexpected. the full question can, i have mentioned to read this book up on the russian plane and also conduct trust people around him anymore. he knows that people want changes that people even around you know, his birth. a couple of paul within the sense that there were smooth future with that she's unshakable in the world in western world, at least in the us say. and he will never be perceptive as a real leader or for years and people around him. they also like, think and all the time,

where was the power for their future will be not with caution. and, you know, after every act of sabotage, after every sign of resistance in bill, we get so many calls from, from the structure of the regime wants to cooperate with us. it, it shows that rigidity or for, for this vertical power, shanker, contrast, people around him anymore. he's always changing people around, you know, he, he's afraid actually of being betrayed by his personal will. if things are bad for him, why don't the people around him get rid of him then? because the question for 20 years he has been building vertical power. that was so focused on him, you know, and he made this through fear through black, male and people of course, in the regime they are also afraid for their lives or lives or they relatives and

you know, recently and you more a so called low was, was adopted by the regime that gives them christ, you know, to print people to death penalty for state prison. it was done because she is not sure if she has the meals for this round and people in the new court for the last week. you spoke of a leak rush and document outlining, rushes planned to occupy and colonized. bella roost by 2030. are you preparing to take the country by force to prevent that happening? no, of course. there was there can be such threats from russia because they don't see a mobile rule, small ukraine as a separate, independent contract. they want what conscious to be the c o for insulin. so the kremlin and the difference between ukraine and the other one is the shameka became

cooperative and this was so he'd like sale in our independence already now. so i want to talk about your so called victory plan, the, what's been described as the eventual mobilization of what your movement claims to be. some 200000 people inside bellows, many of whom are trained. so soldiers, are you talking about staging a coo and possibly starting a bloody civil war? ah, we have never talked about blood the civil war, and this would lead to that. that could be re victory plan. supposed to be peaceful. and we have to take, so there the piece will change. it's in our country. there is you don't want to have any victims to get any victims to, according to this plan won't leave peacefully what then it's all it has to make him live peacefully. and what if he calls his security forces

and the russian units that are based in belarus, what if they come to defend him? what then you're in a fight, don't you? you have a civil war on your hands. are you? are you prepared for that? so that's why it's our task. so create as much pressure on the question come now and we see the world is to create multiple points or for pressure on the kremlin to weaken them for them not to have a unity to use this. a group of field trip people against bill or some people you think that just walk away, give up fee the size of the crowds on the street and walk away. they didn't do that in february 2021. did they off to the violent crack down after the elections that you thought would top of the regime? you said at the time, i have to admit that we've lost the streets. we have no way of combating the regimes violence against the protest as they have the strength, they have the guns and they still do,

don't think they still have the strength and they still have those guns. yeah, absolutely. but repressions can not be endless. you know, it's difficult to ruin society, that's the one changes you know, and you know, now we see about 57 to 17 people are being detained, to be every day you focus on can you that you want this fight that he controls be or was it it will not be necessary not to suppress people every day, but she knows that he has to show that he's like, lead to hear that he's control and everything. but he not, he understand that our society has changed and he will not be able to make people love lucas. and again, yes, he can sustain for, for some time i don't know how much time it will take, but, you know, i'll walk constant pressure constant creating constant stress to shameka will make

him come to stand. that there is no other way out of the situation. only give up and you know, and step away, what if you want, if you are wrong, he's not a person who gives up he cemented in power by the kremlin, by the criminal security forces. and by the battle hardon troops, he's not going to give up and walk away. is he? so the, but times the time is changing, and we see that he is he's looking for support and prevalence. and this war shows that for some who russian army is not so powerful as they wanted to show all this time and for sure once one day. and you will see that caution will support from criminal because kremlin is to be the be the with what's going on

in russia. and they don't have to pay much attention to the question. because off also, it may be afraid that he can replace with the russian person, you know, who knows what question is or is also afraid. so huge gamble. this is a huge gamble on your part because if you are wrong and people take to the streets, then there will be a bloody civil war went there. if you're wrong, look, it also might be one of the nearest. but the, you know, if the casually a lot of people might die, you ready for that? look, it's cert responsibility offered shanker, you know, it's, it is here, you know, who are pushing our country to these possible scenarios. but from my side, again, they have to repeat, they can be a lot of if, if this is that we know what we want and we know that we are moving into

incorrect sites. we want peaceful changes in bureaus and we deliver this message is to caution cast. trawn is to she's meal tra, parabolas, you don't want blood? yes, one question can sacrifice with people. bureaus, can sick provis with people around him? but those people need to continue to support him in this case. ready this the question question can be sure in our written regular army, at least you know he for 28. he is. yes, he has been building this apparatus around him, but he didn't invest into regular army. and if our sold us, i don't know, we'll see this. shameka has crossed all the course will read us so they will stand on their sides of the people. but of course, i don't want any blood to see the civil war was and i come to the sky. ukraine is watching very carefully what's going on and then not impressed by your efforts or your movement. president zalinski doesn't want to meet you. his advisor

mckayla pollock, is on record as saying, we don't see any meaningful activity on the part of the opposition with all due respect. what's the point in meeting? see kind of this guy that's pretty damaging, isn't it? we understand they position their understand that a premium the government is rather cautious now because actually they don't want to open the 2nd trunk and they don't want to poor ill be on the day after 2020, they didn't recognize the elections that you're irrelevant. kia believes the bell or russian opposition exerts neither an organisational nor an intellectual influence on bell or russian society. that's a pretty poor review, isn't it? by anybody's standards. there are different people in the government. so if you pray, we are working very closely. for example, the, the full and rather the right group for democratic b, r o,

in nevada and to chiefs, all these true one person from a position and one person from a pot to gun that order. so, and you can see i, you know, who we don't know the cause of the sky, just appointed by what you heard from his advisors. it's not about disappointment, it's about, and the stands and why they're doing like this. but i always say that be reveal support to korean and ukrainian despite the presence or absence of political dialogue by refusing to meet you. isn't president landscape just reflecting what most ukrainians think they thought me and well disposed towards your country after it hosted the invasion forces a year ago. last week, a poll by the resume cost center in kiff said 2 thirds of ukrainians would support breaking all relations with bellows after the war is one. exactly the

same people that you would want on your side. so the idea of a common ukraine, bella luce, front against moscow, that's not going to happen, is that they're not well disposed towards you. i wouldn't say so look, i am sure that the korean problem, say the post speak very clearly. don't oh, well all in all, i know the korean governments, they distinguish builders and people and build and regime the same as ukrainians. you know, honestly speaking, when the war started, we were astonished. ukrainian. people don't understand the situation in bureaus. and in one moment, we became enemies for them, and it took us some time to explain the situation. our contrary about this humorous prizes are both atrocities about violence. and now the situation is much better

than at the beginning of the war. maybe because not all the people are still understand the situation inside billers, but of course the prayer of yours and potters on the pressure of builders and volunteers in ukraine. the show that there were some people on the sides of ukraine and i think that's built ukrainians. they understand that bulletin society don't support this war. they're supporting ukrainians. but of course, on not one emotional level, it's difficult for them to say yes we, we are happy with the sense we understand that they are our friends. when the warms be launched from the territory of the recent, our task information, informational space to explain that there are some people is not the same as look around. because regime, despite what you say about the bellows, you know, people supporting ukraine. the polls show that your country is really split on the boy and ukraine. an online survey last august by the chatham house,

think tank in london showed that there were 45 percent against the russian invasion, but 30 percent backed it. and 25 percent were undecided. it means over 50 percent of people in bella, luce, either for russia or undecided, if that's right, less than half the countries on your side do about that at the true. because i know that it's very difficult to hold and you pools inside was where people know that for like run on stocks, they can be sentenced to 510 and 15. yes, there's a western pole. this was a pole carried out by british thinktank. i understand, but he's from the terrace rebel rous nevertheless. so we had to understand how people, in contrast, we're like, lag is exist and how they're actin. you know, they, you know, more understandably, you know,

they give the answer that will not lead to repressions towards them and their families very briefly about your personal ambition. is it to lead belarus to democracy. what makes you a leader? what makes you capable of doing this? ah, you know, 1st of all, i have legitimacy from bills and people. though some people waters for me in 2020 and and it gives me the, gave me the mandate to leave contra, told them accredit changes officially confirmed. was it even despite the fact that the election then was widely judged to have been rigged by alexander lucas. shank official, it was confirmed, it took us or what, what? 80 percent. but we still have exactly officially how many you've got? do we know we don't but we had alternative count him. we had to be very inventive

because all the elections in bills had been prevalent and our i 2 special is develop to system of chickens off the results of their actions. but there was a list, you know, i still communicate with people and people who had to flee the country and they feel the support. and they know that majority of people haven't disappointed in my actions, haven't disappointed in me. and they, i know that i'm supported by the over sense. so this support of people gives me legitimacy and tried to present the opinion on the international arena. so very briefly, you're going to be, you think you're going to be liter bellows. moment it is to print bills to new friends and fair elections. i'm not going to expect a new elections because i gave some promise to build some people. but of course,

i will be there since i will use all my contexts to in favor of trivial errors to atlanta. and scott, thank you very much for being on conflict on ah with

who in the south. there are tourists and dream beaches in the north, armed conflict and flight, a land of treasures and turmoil

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