why is the opposition disappearing? point in 60 minutes on d. w. a thought they were great, he will be there been almost 5 months of virtual stalemate on the battlefields of ukraine. and yet, europe and america are clear that key f one gets the fighter aircraft and long range weapon systems. so what's the ground plan is seen from brussels? is the one my guess these shall michelle president of the european council. this is very clear that we do every thinking of guaranteed to retire your 17 digit of your

credit. it, me the victor, we create that be extremely clear. and what about the confusion over each policy on china? president macro says taiwan, isn't europe's business. europe's foreign policy chief says it really is whatever happened to unity in the european union. sanisha, welcome to conflict. thank you. let's talk 1st about the war in ukraine. if we may, for the past few months, has been very little movement on the battlefields of ukraine. the west, you included, has given large amounts of aid and weapons, but clearly not enough to move the war in key of direction. isn't the danger now that you're beginning to normalize a stalemate is very clear to all the you side yard determined to do everything to support your critics, which has retained. and you're absolutely right. it's a very tricky after the start of the food division by russia. we decided to provide

military equipment this the 1st time in european union history. the 2 took such a decision. and since then, together with our partners, our allies, across the world, we provide military support to ukraine. we provide financial means to ukraine. we help you clean my 3 sites to move you. i did one of the example 2 weeks ago we to the decision to work together. you members to produce ammunition because we feel that is needed to strengthen our defense industrial base . you know, the to speed up and you're absolutely right. that is important to do everything to, to accelerate the effort. this is really important that the ukrainians made the shows to resist extremely true edges and this tragedy for them. and this is what i would do t i responsibility is to do everything return, you know, the, to assist to, to support them. and of course,

they're not. they're not impressed with the relationship with you at the moment. ukraine's foreign minister dmitri labor has complained bitterly that the e u was failing to implement its own decision on the ammunition to purchase ammunition for the country. because member states were arguing over which suppliers they should actually and since, and sign a contract. and since that statement made by me for, for the fact we had your titian to clarify with you can authority, you know, that was wasted. we are, we are in turn to turn tact, prisons, winston, and was the ukraine authorities and itin. we assure you that the know that we are, we label friends and we label part, and also know that this is the magic bullet. we do everything to speed up. we take and significant political decision is very clear that there's a 20 political choice on this side to, to, to be asked to see no support to quit,

but that we ality. there was no magic bullet faces. we need to make sure that we will produce more ammunition in the weeks and months to come. mr. columbus, deputy andrew melnick says that war fatigue among you members is now the biggest challenge for his country. there's a feeling he said that now the tank issue has been settled. people can put their feet up. a lot of them still don't understand that the war is far from over. is the right to worry about war fatigue in the, you know, it is that we clear that we need to convince our citizens across, you know, what state is the future of the european union, the future of our citizens, our security, our prosperity. but look, if we look at the situation of a few months ago and absolutely trend is that a protein stipulation was the wolf a t y, the impossibility for the european union to stick together to be united in,

retook putting and a criminal by surprise because we are able to stick together, we are able to have the support of a public opinion across the european union. and we were able, we have been able to, to, to, to, to, to, to stick together with our, you know, that america allies and other partners across the, well, you say that, but your foreign policy chief, you as a barrel said, recently forging and maintaining e u. unity against russians invasion has not always been easy. some states complained others disagree, but in the end we maintain the unity. so you've papered over the cracks. what, what could open those cracks up again, this is, this is very clear that unity it, which was a lot of effort. but the fact all the facts we've been able for instance, to sanction russia. you remember that a lot has been set on some lists of from in taishan,

on the new side. we took decisions all together on 10 packages of sanctions. and we are implementing the speculations of sentence. we are working all together to localize the international community on the international stage who are working with africa within defense issues. is that in america, in order to explain, to argue, to try to convince sometime that you have done a lot on sanctions, can i just, you know, make a point here, but you're still using vast quantities of russian oil supplied mainly by laundromat countries. these are countries that loaned the oil from moscow and sell it on to you. china, india, turkey, you a and singapore, you know about this, have a look. we're buying wounded russian oil. what was, what was the situation in a few minutes to do only a few minutes ago, we were on the european so broadly, dependent on the russian forces fuse and only assume that we succeeded to 2 decisions, you know, the to,

to reduce dependencies. and the doors to and those dependencies on the russian aggression for seen fuses. why did we close? this is why didn't you close this loop? this is what we are doing. you are working very hard to close all the different loopholes with please, would you prefer the european union? nothing to position to guarantee the supply of energy resources for our businesses, for our host, or would you prefer the collapse of the european union? i suppose it is not what you are advocating for, and it's why we need to be reasonable to be rational and to be determined exactly what we are doing. on the one hand, we do not lose our long term strategy. we want more renewable energy on your side. we want, we want more independence in terms of energy policy on your site, but also to make sure that we defend our eternity based. and if you defend the social situation of our citizens,

you mentioned the risk of fatigue and you are right. these are important to work in order to avoid being victim of social, which is free, one to 2, to support for citizens. this is important to demonstrate that you are working, you know, the also to overcome the energy challenges, for instance, you know, but if you want to do something about war, fatiguing the time for a clear explanation of the use strategic objectives for ukraine in russia. plenty of generalized promises we've heard from the you, you told ukraine in february the european union will support you in every way we can for as long as it can. i can, i just ask the question, for as long as what takes, what exactly does this promise mean? this is clear. and the way you are often nutritionists interesting because it show that i'm not exactly following your approach in our approach, if not you. which has to respond simply to, to decide when it to but you made the promise to please please let you difference

between transferring attrition. i will, i will answer. we split your question which is the ukrainians. they have the responsibility be just, this is a suffering turn 3 to the site when and the way in which the enemies, you know, the to, to assist when this is time to, to, to, to, to open a new, a new chapter. and it's why we are supporting this piece formula developed in proposed diapers lindsay. lindsay. and it's why also support nice idea to have an, an international piece so meet in order to defend the ukrainian position in spite by what we believe in the move to throw older was boost international, older, the territorial integrity and sovereignty of the different of nations. because the work is the you scared of russia. you said in february, we're not intimidated and will not be intimidated by the kremlin because ukraine and the e u r. family. but the truth is that the west is very much intimidated by russia,

is that the only reason for not giving care of the weapons at once is your fear of escalation and perhaps of nuclear conflict. and this is really clear, you remember at the beginning of the war last by russia. this was important for us on the one hand to support ukraine. on the other hand, not to be part in 2015 to 20 votes and the we stuff escalation. and he's very clear, i take the example of the nuclear weapons that we are me firm when we induce china, for instance, in order to convince the international community china included to be very firm. and we clear the use and even the threat of nuclear weapons is not responsible. and we need to do everything in order to show it to not be used when we support united missions in separation, for instance, another to prevent any resources tradition. it shows that you are serious, we are responsible and again, the ukrainians people in the u. k. so they know exactly what you're doing to know

that to help them to resist. we're more than a year into this war, which may well define europe, security architecture for generations to come. and we're still not sure what the use objectives are. so. so what is the big plan? because what scenario do you envisage? eternal war, frozen conflict? after all, the killing and destruction, these 2 countries are not going to just shake hands and be friends. are they? what, what? what's the big plan for if this war, when this war finally comes to the bitch plan and the promise of european industries, security, and prosperity and the sufficiency extremely easy to use it and difficult to implement, just sort of the right. but it's also what we do to what we've been doing for ditches across the european continent. but it is very, very clear that what we face

a tragedy 1st for the ukrainian people. so didn't you test an impact on the security and prosperity across europe? and it's why i strongly believe in what we call the strategy to autonomy of the european. i think it to this to fit is showing that is really important. what in 3 different trends? first, energy, energy independence don't need to explain a lot why you saw in. and this is very clear was the $1357.00 point european defense together. we need to, we need to but he's very clear and we are acting that what we did in the past on the european. so when some members do decided to us, we use the investments in defense. we can see to do, we need city tours, you need to, to, to your tip abilities. it means that we need more cognition, the repeated level, and point 3, innovation it to them based on the, to go into the prosperity. these are the 3, the 3 major pillars, and we have

a vision. why? because we found that the future of ukraine and rolled over is we send you do this a very clear message. this is a very clear plan for the future of the printer. and wow, presence and ask is not getting all the weapons he wants. what, what if you claim stops losing? this was the contingency plan for that. what if russia against the old starts winning more battles on the ground occupying further territory? what if you wake up and it's too late to get, get ukraine, the weapons, it needs a russian victory cannot be an option. and this is why we support you create, and i've understood that you have your own impression about what we are doing. i tend to, in to you that all the members, this, all the european leaders didn't know what's it fit. i will say you will not let a, when are you, are you making that? this is so clear. just why you're making that from this is very clear that you do every thinking that a to guarantee, to return your service interpreter feel great. it means the victory feel create that seem to clean,

however long that will take longer as long as it takes. and i can repeat, repeated to several times, this commitment expressed by 27 had the state i can tell you, own the forget twice a very emotional moment. the 1st virtual meeting within a few hours after start of the 1st invasion, the $27.00. you can lead us were around the same table. we spend, simpson participate in virtually in meeting. i think to the all of us, all of us. we immediately felt the seriousness, the importance of the moment. and that's why, on, in a few hours we've been able to take from them until the soon in terms of support for you. quinn, infection against russia. you've spoken by phone to vladimir putin over the course of the last year. if you had to pick one concrete result from the conversation from the discussion, what would it be that when i had for processing after the start of the 1st taylor invasion, start out of the way?

i don't know. so we could do tuesday to, to focus on some human to insurances, and i can give you an example. one creatures. obviously this is, this is very important to allow some humanitarian agencies request, for instance in washing close to intact disorganization to make sure that they would have access to some territories in order to provide some support certain example descent of prisoners very quickly after the start of the tools started through some international agencies on the chair of prisoners. these are 2 examples and point 3, i think it's very important also to, to, to advocate because even when we saw the roof, the principal, and this is why we are so committed to make sure that they will get to the ability . there is no place where trinity are you in the camp that says, we shouldn't humiliate mister putin. these are not worth that i would use, because this is very clear that the putting this into humiliate

a big part of the worst starting research, ukraine's. and if you don't have much sympathy with monsieur macros, i wish mister colbert, i wouldn't use this word. what is very, what is there? we clear this is very important. also transitions the west of the world. this is really important because we have our own vision. and we have a very strong case with to intro principle that you need to, to, to defend the social, in your opinion, that letter cooperation. this once in brazilian potent also to induce africa to induce the can america to industry in the pacific region. that's another one we've others in order to counter the russian fit in for, for narrative. and what was russia narratives as well? just because i really like to move on to china because paging has been awarded a lot of face time by european leaders. you yourself met she jan thing last year. i

was struck by your comment on the meeting when you said that both the e u. n. china have an interest in a rules based world with the un charter at its core. really given china's illegal expansion in the south china sea of the massive human rights violations taking place inside the country. it's clear they're not working from the same un rollbook as you are. so why suggest as a common approach to rule face? well, when the clearly, when the truly is a 1st 1st i strongly believe in the military approach. i certainly believe in the you in shot. that was my question, but i will answer your question. my point is that look nice. we know we can observe that china would like to set the international ruth and ruth that wouldn't, that wouldn't be inspired by the same venue that you have on your site for, for, for, for instance, $93.00 points, you know, relationship research with china. first,

we will be always the we firm in protecting and defending the human rights in the democratic principles is very clear and systematically when i had to petition to taught was the change of treaties. i systematically your cation to, to, to, to explain our, our convictions on those questions. point 1.2, i'm absolutely convinced that you need to, we balance the iterate relationship between china and the european union. and this is the idea to the rich relationship. but in florida you flight that the with for the reason that all saying that they were, they did the same rules. well, this is, this is not serious to use. the word is nathan. just nathan. hi, i'm acting with regardless of china and point 3. if we are here use on the you side on climate change, if you i hear you. so on some sit with the challenges, we need to talk to china. we need to induce china. it doesn't me the, to your dream. all the stuff is research china. let's teach climate change. for

instance, he's only important to try to convince china to be much more active, to put in place a carbon pricing mechanism, for instance, listed to his name listed 2019, and henceforth. and if we want to address those, tell you the future, we need to talk with them and we saw that to increase into it. look, i'd like to come back to the issue of human rights, which would you stress? you didn't please everyone on your trip. can major human rights groups are incense that you've reopened, what they called the meaningless human rights dialogues, with beijing, which was suspended in 2019 after the you sanctioned chinese officials involved in human rights violations set point by those groups? isn't it? because the talks so far have changed, nothing will continue to change, nothing. you agreed to talk about, you agrees and talk about human rights and they agreed to ignore how we'd like to discussion. i would like to ask you a question. do you think that if we would stay in bruce, or if we would send community from research on to stuck it,

we would achieve something absolutely turn to the to with chief nursing. and it's like it's very important to induce. for instance, i'm very pro i am engaged with, i'm very proud. i'm very proud that after the meeting we had to prevention in december, we've been able to, we launch this human device delettre. we've been because it isn't for us to advocate to mentioned turn concrete changes into, to, to, to defense, to really different the, the human rights of principles, the democratic without a result and you without any results. i fully disagree you faint. follow your coach each me that we would be more efficient by a teacher here in brussel we saw the condition of course takes time, of course is difficult. i am not seeing that. we do live winter in one meet or in one soon, but time to visit if we do not induce absolutely certain that we will not deliver when we dish, we open the door in order to do ever seen to deliver just

a brief feel. the human rights groups attempt, major human rights groups don't agree with you at all. they say having a human rights dialogue with china cannot seriously be an end in itself. they want to just turn a log to real human rights progress, including in sion, janet to bash what you're doing. this is a very central point of exactly what you're doing. this is, shana, this isn't we saw in tub discretions. yeah. but can you point to a single aspect of human rights in china that these talks have altered for the better in the past? can you since target 19 those thoughts were put on hold and 16 to relaunch those. it's all before. yeah, but since $319.00 it was put on all in total and we did, we did a political space opposed to the last 2 industries though. so we've, we've history on all the topics that needs to be distressed and value in beggary

before my trip to china. i had your children to root menu present that you saw those from and watch the organizations. and just so important, it was just for me to listen to them and to use also the argument that the share earlier this year, china played host 2 from his peasant macro, who took a bunch of business with business men with him to sign tre deals. and then decided to open up a rift between europe and the u. s. over taiwan. the great riskier faces he said, isn't gets caught up in crises that are not ours, which prevents it from building strategic autonomy. isn't at the height of irresponsibility to highlight divisions with the most important ally, america at a time when both russia and china have joined forces to erode human rights. and the rule of law to, to top is there is a very clear european position like with native species. there was 20 and we are full digits, extremely clear, point one and point to untie one. there's also

a very clear european position. we do not accept do tend to to, to change in either to either way the status quo into one's tweet point point one. and we're, we tonight, the one china policy is the traditional european policy. nothing is changed, which we will talk with. policy chief shows the public to slap down unless you micro, by saying you members should actually deploy war ships to patrol the taiwan strait in order to deter paging aggression. how are you going to sort out these differences of opinion on china within the 2 different things? first is a proposal made. they usually pay behind to be the responsibility of the member states to destroy the topic. and he's the responsibility of the people have to put some proposals on the table point one. well that's going to hang, it's not going to is going to rosa and get in frost is

a reactive in the past attrition, which shows its forces that will interest for the, for the region. but let me tell you that i'm aware that in depression of media, especially in the recent days are always there is an impression of huge divisions on the european side on china entrenched reel, no dish with the reality. i will tell you because i think a little bit what are the sensitivities in the inter, chauncey, i think i can tell it in that. in fact, we are much more convergent and then very transfer them to, to the following 2 weeks, democrat, to date we have in europe, in the, in the, in which to come. we will have the occasion to, to clarify, into the coming position of china. we will have enjoyed this my responsibility to put took it to the gender in the you can don't feel a little bit on, on china. we are preparing the debate at the mystery level with a different estate order with our partners. we so thomas, we are alive. let me ask you just one specific question because we're running out

of time. what's the use plan? if china invades tiwana? what's your plan? you, you, the plan is to do everything to convince china not to matrix and stick. yeah. but if you fail, want to say yes, ok, what does this plan? he's been playing b a. i will talk with you to do what in any case, what do you do you remember the, the weights before the start of the war against russia. we worked in true story nation was all our partners are due to assess what would be our reactions and we will, we will do the same and we are doing the same set up and it didn't prevent the yeah . yeah. because in fact, you absolutely right there was someone in the kremlin, we sure who to, to the decision to start a tracy was the criminal saw. and we hadn't every scene to talk to, to make sure that you quinn because he's our interest. sha,

michelle. great. have you covered some things i watch a date with

ah, with to the point. strong opinions, clear positions international perspective. now give me a pull things approval rating continues to rise in russia. meanwhile, the last remaining voices of the opposition are being silenced. on to the point we ask russia under both,

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ah, ah ah, this is d w. news live from berlin. russian missiles and strike targets across ukraine. overnight, ah, at least 2 people have been killed. the attacks come as keep prepares a counter offensive, but we'll knew what western weapons and training be enough.