is visa, so why isn't it happening to borrow today in 60 minutes, d w very well that will make the getting to the jail love and binding thing, step away from the fund. i'm not even allowed to go to my own car. everyone was later holes in every day. stuff, getting you ready to meet. the gentleman then joined me. rachel stood on dw, the temple hall feels a phone my apple turned pock in the heart of the city,

a place to let one's spirit, soul free. at least it is from marie and veronica. but how to bring that feeling into the catholic faith, women, priests, or blessings for queer couples? could these reforms become a reality in the 21st century. ready the . ready the 2 campaign as active catholics are committed to reforming that chunk. marie masha grew up in a liberal catholic. um, she's been involved with the local church for as long as she can remember. today she's employed by the german catholic women's association. fighting for women's rights and the charge is on life's work. the veronica guys, by it was not so straightforward. veronica partially grew up in

a use wells fan, how latest finding charge through a student community. often graduating, veronica entered a religious order for a year. now the activist is completing a ph, d, and theology that is involved in the out in charge initiative for quinn, catholics to must be for you to see it fast as of and then as i have the feeling that some things are the same as being a part of humanity, as ministry of topics are missing, but many perspectives on life are missing. if you see the church has a body of a mystical body to live in a part of that body, isn't i missing on the field? i'm sometimes the sly of us who by the name of spectrum, we don't want to take anything away from anyone. i think one instead be adding something. if we women can also become priests, the bishop system and, and of course, eventually f o i'm and i still haven't lost hope. i know it's hot, but even still the mid december 2022 at the st. can easiest judge in

ballon, marie anti fellow campaign is us be heading something of a catholic revolution here. father mindset her so makes is judge available to the group for worship. he agrees that women have too few rights in the church, so he's happy to provide his support with us, i'll tell from 2 of the fact that women don't allowed to perform baptism or lead a congregation to the fact that they have no right to vote in church bodies and can only hold advisory role as i find it unfair or does that's why i try to use the modest means at my disposal to give these women a place and my trying to i don't the home get marie and veronica are both members of the catholic activist group, maria, to point of it, demands full equality for women in the catholic church. about and campaign is received support from the protestant community that evening. micro

shift that is a protestant pasta for many centuries, such a pots of protestant women was not possible. we have suspicious because it is important to me to stand by the side and support them in taking stat and fighting the fight. i'm able to, i can stop, i want to support my catholic brothers and sisters are interested in the catholic church. women are generally confined to the pews, but in today service they going to stand in front and preach as women in protestant churches are already permitted to do. the name of the protest group, maria, to point to reflect its focus on mary, the mother of god and today service does 2 do not be afraid, mary. you sound favor with god and behold, you will conceive and give birth to a son.

see she has regarded below the midst of a handmaiden and behold from henceforth full generations. so call me blast. we mean preaching is unacceptable to many conservative catholics, taught the members of maria to point to do it anyway, toys. so it was a great, really nice experience, the congregation and the atmosphere with the music. the fact that i was allowed to be here in this church today was something very special for me. because for the 1st time i stood in front and was allowed to read from the gospel of luke and the catholic touch, it's not customary for women to read from the gospel. and i'll send this a new v. as in mike, a shifts a, the protestant pasta is headed to judge cheese opponents catholic sisters. because in the past,

we mean we're not allowed to become pastors. in the protestant judge, either women have only had equal rights in german, his protestant church since 1998 the microsoft that it was a divine calling. yeah. and these are the kids to dislike of mine, but i can now be a pasta in this church in this congregation of these are all, and i hope that this place will become a diverse and lively place. are full of people who are welcome to come as they are and can celebrate, live and worship can lead. and that's my 3 listening cousin of mine to monica is also an influenza. about 25000 people follow on instagram. she's been often the i'm on my way to the put cost studio to record a new episode of my post cost. and i'm a little late and let's see if the others are they get an update on that as well.

take you along with me is me much moment. this is a new generation of religious women, mauldin, confident and reaching across religious lines. and had found cost 331. the christian pasta talks to a muslim woman and a jewish woman about feminism and matters of faith. the poet cost is financed by the house of one an inter religious project in belin health, which welcome to a new episode is 331 i 3 women, 3 religions, one topic, the interlude just put cost from the house of wanda. this is rebecca speaking and i am back with my wonderful co host cooper and micah hello, nice to be back. design is for me. i'm excited to today. we have another serious topic about we're talking about the revolution any wrong. so let me on each of them is fighting for women's rights and one of the 3 major well religions succeed in the

address, stereotypes and prejudices. ma, well for example, that anyone who thinks that coupla is headscarf is that on. so with a feminist podcast, the host set the record straight in the people who bought it just quickly. the pointed question for you. would you say that the tool compulsion in slum, for instance, the compulsory head, scotty and cops or something? somebody should be there. it's not, you know, is on, has no composing at all because there is a very clear principle. okay, no composing in religion since i think it's mentioned, there are people though who instrumental as religion and want to carry out their own agenda through it to you and in the provision line and also abuse it. do you know, kind of the women advocate for diversity and tolerance in and between the major world religions this women lead religious movement is the one about empowerment, respect and solidarity. so it goes without saying that marie,

a catholic, took part in the demonstration, supporting women in iran, the young activists think about reforms and women's rights to reach bob. beyond that, um community is god of this to own. and we women have different religions and stand together in this already exists in full wild religion, but this support must grow. i don't district, especially like tween different religions issues. so she and the money to we christians were stand up for muslims as a jewish people worldwide. and verified the just me, i wish there was even better corporation because i'm united women of all religions all and i love it and that's my dream. and the women and quit people over the dense united to another. go and find the story. we saw the veronica supports germany's green potty, the activist campaigns,

even when it's cold and raining good evening. can i give you some election info? hello info about the election to see. veronica is known binary and identifies is positive center. the german acronym stands for women, intersects non binary friends, gender, and age and individuals. veronica ones to deepen understanding all tony in the church, i bought in society as a whole spent space and stuff. i think it's important that we as people are shaping society, perhaps, especially as people who bring a certain amount of experience has been to individual. i think a party like the greens offers a very good way to help define and shape society size. so how do top religious leaders in rome? see these issues the vatican is the administrative sent to the catholic church and home to the pope. the judge, his spiritual lead to german calls for reform done seem to be taken very seriously

. and however, po process is committed to strengthening into religious dialogue and the number of women in leadership positions that the vatican has grown significantly during his pontifical, on the other hand is previously made clear that the ordination of women is not a question open to discussion. the back in cold berlin, the young catholic marie is not willing to accept this. she argues that jesus had women disciples. she believes the judges tradition of only ordaining men had to do with the times. not the will of god, the world is changing and she wants people in her church to re think they have used to exercise best spiritual freedom, quite high, productive, to finish, and saves, push to move on to buy me freedom means self determination and openness. i rarely experience back to my church. i think this is my ideal being free and the church to

do what i want to do about this. and of course the following good rules and in a meaningful way. yeah. it's in effort. the old as a catholic church was marie spiritual home throughout childhood. it seems sometimes that feeling of home is at risk of slipping away the german catholic women's association when the re works as being campaigning for women's rights. but over a century, the association has around a 180000 members in germany. so mary is certainly not alone in her desire for change. as pontiff of maria to point out campaign protest is hung that demands to the dose of that and churches in a gesture reminiscent of mounting loose the. but unlike the found to protestantism, these reform is one to remain members of the catholic church. they want to change

the institution from within marie anti fellow campaign. those don't understand why that charge refuses to step in to the 21st century. the confounding to protestantism isn't an option marie considers ida is has been dos, go back to the catholic church as my husband and i grew up in it and feel at home that i understand the language in the services and the litigious. well that's what i don't want to do is make room for the people who wouldn't leave under any circumstances. like a couple of these at the right wing catholics. most of the men in the us stay as long as i can make a difference. i am so long you're supposed to let me, and i'll try to make sure that we really make progress. ms. answer. explain this with you because i won't give up my place so quickly because that would be nice

leaving without to find that i went to the slide off i left in the last a few weeks later. there's a show down in frank font. it's the last day of a meeting of send a double pulse, the reform project of the german catholic judge. late people and bishops have been discussing reforms. the rights of women and queer people ought to have the most controversial issues. the votes are still pending. one of the bishops advocating reform is hi, nicole. the archbishop that fell in marie and veronica hoping that his boat is, i'm just like it's exhausting. just goal oriented. there's pressure tonight as many people as possible simply because the necessary process is that note i'm as convinced of that. now, as i was in the beginning, i was able to, we have to go through this the most, but we must pursue a path, but it's open ended and perhaps we have wanted to achieve too much in a short time. i'd give all that content over rhina, maria and funky opposes the reforms into

a small group of patients almost ended the whole process at the last meeting in september 2022. because if the, if the bishop's vote against emotion, it's defeated to now it's a protest group has gathered in front of the conference. whole they call themselves the catholic youth movement for them to send it the policies, the wrong power. they want things to stay the way they are for them. quinn is, is a scene, and women priests are against the will have gone. it's been yet um, towards us news to 05. yet when i'm here with the catholic youth movement from invest because we are very concerned about the direction in which the senate will path is the middle of our positions are being adopted here. that clearly contradict catholic due to the question of this threatens to split the church, the thoughts of, of, to make your thoughts and phone numbers. just my him. the conservatives believe

that the risk of causing a break away movement and splitting the charge must be avoided at all costs. despite the protests, a clear majority of german, they representatives and bishops vote in favor of the reforms. the 1st title of the day is the text to allow the blessing of same sex unions in german catholic judges . it's a practice the vatican has forbidden then the vote on the role of women in the catholic church. philip, as that has been vocal in supporting the idea of women being ordained before the final vote. she was optimistic since when antics nations, even if the text is not adopted. it's a house in the world and everybody can read it. we won't give up on this issue. it's so important. the question of women is simply the most important issue for the future of each piece to get to kind of just to avoid

a 3rd of the patients blocking the motion. the reform proposals are continually warranted down the women who feel called to the priesthood. discouraged, you know, the wound of it as tight and effective and feeling. so what happens when such is so my inner wound will only here when we have full access to all ministries and offices in the church. i like living my vocation as a non for good, but i can't live part of my calling before god. this is not a felt calling as an experienced calling, and i'd like it to be tested. not just passed over because i'm a woman on me. she will be back on the title and coughing of the in the end it becomes about women being ordained deacon's to assist the priest and that due to his still it's only a recommendation. ultimately, the pope designs this compromise motion is accepted for some it is bought too

little, but others believe it has opened the door to the priesthood for women. up to the vote. philipo gotcha. and a fellow campaign is set up, right? so he believes but a decisive step towards the ordination of women as being achieved. spin, yes, even on the face time. 67 now. so if i live another 20 is, i hope the total experience, the 1st student ations is not. do you guys fine. any facility will pump resolutions on the declaration of intent. in the end, each bishop is free to decide whether he wants to act on them or not. occupation call from bowen says he's taken a lot out at the meeting. the villain village police company got teeth on the with inside there's the will to break new ground life in terms of communication with

deliberation and decision making. and there's the courage to broach issues where we don't degree things. my great concern is how we can stay together in the one church, even if we have very different ideas about the church. of them have ideas about what comes next and how we move forward over how you provide. so again, shortly afterwards, the vatican issues a clear veto the resolutions of the gym and reform project on not recognized by the pope. about 2 years ago pope fronts is launched a world wide pro sense of listening and dialogue about the concerns of german catholics received little attention. ringback pressing the same sex unions and relevant the ordination of women. not on the table. pessimists be a schism in the german catholic church. ultimately want to keep the discussions going. the definitely the best as we get to this website that we thought it would

happen now that the pope would do it. he's great interest 4 months then came to statement, we were a little disappointed. those are arguments from the seventy's ago. however, the archdiocese of berlin is still sent on their roof phone calls. the most visible sign of this is the catholic cathedral. it stands in the middle of the city and is being completely rebuilt. the battle and dying serious who's trying something new here. the strict hierarchy of clergy at the front end to believe us that the bank is being completely re imagined the entire child. she's being gutted and rebuilt and this is how it should look when it's finished. the ulta in the middle freely accessible, the believe us on the same level with it. the

orange bishop meets with the to maria, 2 point o activists in his office. he wants to answer the questions about the changes that have to come in by then says take is the occupation pine of calls faces a dilemma. the pope 1012, the german reforms, and there are people in his diocese don't either, but also to i'm and catholics on ega for change. now. german historian josefina phone via has also joined the discussion at the archbishop's request. she wants the charge to keep its traditions. that's in the quote. can i ask a provocative question? why do you want reforms advantage? so doesn't make any sense to take the and to reform is with you. hold on, i say no, it started and i guess it was a note i'm was that if we don't see that the church needs to be renewed,

then we're not filling its mission symbols, it will become a museum, but as to the direction. but what is the progress versus a step backward? so that's the key question that we have to discussed and reflect dyslexia. and we take everyone with us. it's been my task in the past. or, you know, i hope that we can take as many people as possible with us advice. i know it'd be easier to say. good bye. let's split out in orbit. create a department store with everything under one roof on each person with their own shop. i don't want those mission lines all already drawn at this meeting. josefina found via is opposed to women being or dang, deacon's, all priced state. i know i want to be of service. i don't have to be ordained for that. i don't want a status endowed with power that's totally twisted for the it doesn't like as i'm the busy the being the service may be the right thing and work for you. but i know a lot of women who say it doesn't work for me. as i know that i'm cold, i have an in a certain d suffice. this is something up to another good beside if it doesn't to by showing

me slow, but i think it would be enriching, and it's quite possible just size. and i think it would be a good sign if there were also women in the ordained ministry serving at the altar by it installed the means women as deacons assistance to the priest. but archbishop called requires permission from the vatican to ordain women. however, he could allow the blessing of same sex unions and his dice is at his own risk. yes, i'd be interested to know what the time table is. one thing when you think of places will be set up and were queer couples who wants to be blessed can go and ask for a priest to bless them, picked up a common gun is most of it needs to be an issue in the parish models. i don't want to impose anything on anybody, but i'm determined to see it happen. my name is my current position is that it will work and i'll do it. doesn't get rid of out to the blessing of queer couples has been discussed in the german catholic church. but he is thought that it should happen now is still too hasty. in josefina phone via as view loving,

this is been one yet. so that's why we want to send target as well as i see that is throwing us under in the works and you are finding them good people for some the changes go too far and too fast for all those. the changes on the zone over to you is for design decision innocence. so 1st i'd say that i'm speaking for at least 50 percent of german society. and the berlin is here not oxidized this to see themselves as catholics. when i say that if nothing happens, now the doors not only calling us, but the departure could happen. what's inside of the? it's a the we shouldn't let that put us on depression. and because the history of the churches 2000 years old, we have to look at how cool our route accountable from the votes of the archbishop is caught somewhere in the middle of all of this call. i really deeply trust that god is guiding us. and the god spirit is here, don't say so this, i'm quite sure that he will lead us to more than that gives me courage and strength and difficult situations keeps you not only to inter those situations,

but to see them as an opportunity. funds that something veronica and marie leave the meeting with mixed feelings. the reality of their lives no longer fits the cause prescribed by the vatican, but who needs to give way? the charge to its members or its members to judge? the 2 active is reflect on them, mind sense in town valid, proceed up to miss the most likely one for have so little confrontational, combative we optimistic. i think we can already see that these resolutions came about, partly because there was pressure from believer, leaving the bishops probably wouldn't have moved so far in their own. that's why it's necessary to continue fighting and pursuing this just kind of focus albums. not so. how does this been, i know the domestic, i think we've established a good new culture of debate deficient that late people and bishops are in dialogue, and the bishops realize they can no longer be assigned to each of the chats on the road. i think the resolutions that we've cost on mostly compromises,

but we must not retreat behind them having us of course, keep fighting and i think we can do a lot for our church. it's my church to the cases, to the, to some veronica and to marie, all divisive and dangerous to others. they all pray for a foam, is that it's not at all clear where these palm will lead them. next. the

or the energy. everybody wants it. everyone needs it just to make it sustainable, please. changing to renewable energy sources is feasible.

so why isn't it happening? to borrow today in 30 minutes on the w 2 to be online bank again the known alicia. here's the lease oldest influencer. she shows how you can be a social media success even as a great grandmother. take a look. 16 . the hours are we can we must of course carry restrictive climate change. i mean,

or a station in the rain forest continue, carbon dioxide emissions have risen again. the young people over the world are committed to climate protection. what impact because change doesn't happen on its own. to make up your own mind. a phone lines. journalism to help us in overcoming divisions. for the dw global media on 2023 in germany and online the increasingly fragmented world with a growing number of voices digital. the amplified where disclosure can lead. we really need overcoming divisions and

a vision for tomorrow's journalism. register now and join us for this discussion at the 16th edition of d. w's global media forum. the . this is the, the news live from berlin. pro ukrainian russian fighters step up their operations inside russia. arms groups loyal to keep say they've captured soldiers and russians . bells or rod region residents or bank birds to flee as and border area comes under attack. also coming up.