the, the is the state of the, near as long from berlin evidence as mounting. the lager change you've gaining for goes in is dead. prussian authorities say the mercenary leader will challenge the kremlin, was on a plane that crashed near moscow with no survivors. his death could have wine reaching consequences, but there are doubts about the trustworthiness of the report, the

outcome fairly. it's good to have you with us. yes. can you prove goshen was once one of letting me pull is most important allies. now the leader, the wagner mercenary group, is believe dead. russian authorities say from goshen, was listed as a passenger on a flight that crashed on route from last down to st. petersburg. all 10 people on board private jets for a ford at lee county. a telegram channel affiliated with lager is also sayings and goes in dine and the crash. none of these reports, however, have been independently verified. this all comes exactly 2 months after wagner fires launched and a board of new me against russia as military leadership. it was same as the most serious challenge to president vladimir phone. and since he took power, all sounds that short lived for valley and promotions were about, have been unknown. and his faith has been a subject of intense speculation. it was initially saw and have gone to bella, ruth's as part of an amnesty deal about 2 days ago. he resurfaced and

a recruitment video circulated online that appeared to show him and ask for a wagner maintains a strong military presence on the continent. and in the video from goshen seemed to indicate it was business as usual for his mercenary. for you guys, are we going to be something i got? is our russian affairs analyst and joins us from villainy. is now constantine. good to see you. now this is of course, very much still a developing story. what more do we know at this point? we do know that the vault group headquarters in st. petersburg, live top of the facade of the building, with a huge cross dusk, indicating that some of their top people died of speculations, indeed intense as to what happened to the play and a lot of russian commentators of point to the fact that the plane was shrunk,

down north fall from peaches, one of many pollutants, a residence is in russia. and this time between moscow in saint petersburg in the area of fall died there. indeed the c s. $300.00 of defense systems are installed to protect fruits. and so basically if it is true that they play pretty gardens playing shut down by the air defense midsize it is very difficult to imagine that a, a need kind of major defense unit could have up to rated there without a full coverage and full knowledge of the russian forces, as to the uh, as to regarding himself of the russian invasion authority, published a list of people that were allegedly on the line and a pretty gordon as well as a wagner himself. his real name was to meet the vote. king of the creates of the

formal officer created an agreement before a precaution to cover his financing was also on board. so it seems that's essentially what we used to know. as a buckley group was a very indeed dead was decapitated by these crush. what have reactions and rush of in to the crash. oh, it's interesting uh, some people registered the lots of above that there is lots of lots of video to prove to that. that for example, in a cafe that was frequented by a big garden in saint petersburg that are flowers keeping man a sheepy up at the doorstep. uh, there is a game in town speculation. the russian telegram channels on twitter, everywhere as to actually whether the garden uh, really was so strange that this put a, put it like that as to fly in a plane together with the leadership of the group i. e, in case something happens,

uh, the group will indeed be decapitated by the the government could have undertaken this of this step. but the most interesting thing that's been turned in the last few hours is that it seems that's pretty garden indeed returned from africa because he wanted to reach out to the russian, meet at the leadership, and probably to put some a to come to the move by the g r u, the russian, a defense um you have sort of minister ministry of defense intelligence directly at to t k. well, the home, a mercenary business in africa, if it is indeed. so it is indeed, so then probably pretty garden was like watching a lot of hobby. but again, this is just pretty much it has been exactly 2 months now since that fail, me, me launched by the wagner mercenary crew. why do you think for goes and was allowed to, you know, pretty much carry on as normal after that. presumably, until today,

a lisa, this is the question of the questions because protein was seen by many all does that including inside of the russian ruling class regime, whatever you call it, is actually weak for the 1st cooling resort bending and asking this order. it is the, the army to nip it to the budget is if you hours thing while okay, everything, fine, we settled the issue. so the main theory is that this is the way the grab it and go back while we're at the garden, but late. so it's interesting that another comment side saw a russian diplomats that effected from russia last year, but he's going to said in his to the comment tree, that's if you think that this prove strengths then your role in just tells the future coup waters. if you really want to machine, you change something, so you go all the way they've got to read the compromises,

you contrast. so i think that this kind of the bank is going to continue in the garden in some way. we'll continue to haunt the russian horizon because there will still be people saying it was a double. he never died to disappear in africa. he disappeared in the caribbean. i'm sure that in this respect, this sort of urban legends, we've gone limits what really happened regard. as let's talk a little more about, that's a sense of weakness that, that emerged after that fail near me. you signed and one commentator there, but fulton very much plays to a domestic audience. doesn't he? so does that fact that he looked so weak after the rebellion? does that change now that the man behind it is presumed dead? a look if the main theory behind it, as it is now, actually in russia is that's a, this was an act of vengeance. but boots and then of course it, it doesn't,

and the story of weaknesses doesn't. and to some extent, the story is put this on reliability with regard to the hundreds of thousands of millions of bustle, the science bureaucrats that are running the country on his behalf. because a she waited for a long time and be if it is indeed the kremlin, the granite is operation, then the decision to do it is such a strange way using army. aaron defense in on public. uh, it proves that put is breaking into that room. if it is indeed, so for many people in a rush, especially those when they have to really very turbulent by tonight is it will look more like a muffet keeping them. uh, basically a political dispute. frankly speaking, i don't want to sound cynical, but i think you said all mobile russian social media people are saying. busy including beating commentators that if uh,

regarding the dog in the mysterious cock brush or even in the mysterious accident of his airplane, then everyone would have understood, okay, maybe it's score settling buttons down in the more or more or less sort of the usual way. the way puts you in usually operates. she does something then tonight, but this time it's public. and it's very difficult to imagine that anyone can operate in their defense miss. so uh, within the radius. so, but now future long distance from uh, put in a residence, uh with impunity. uh so i think that this speak take you a grotesque all of this uh, all of this. well, mysterious crush definitely will give a lot of people if thoughts, whether this is a reliable regime, even actually speaking of the partisans of this region as konstantin and i've always great to get your view on on this. thank you so much. i thank you.

now so many years you've been in for goes that was lottery and fruitless trusted ally here rose from humble beginnings, owing street food in saint petersburg, to chef and kate, or for improvement of the kremlin. his leader role as head of the long and mercenary group became clear as rushes invasion of ukraine on folded. here's a look for goes as rise, improvements, power circle, and his phone from paper. for a few hours that looked like you've got any pre grudging posed a real threat to russian president vladimir putin sold on power. the world watched in suspense as precautions, wagner mercenary group seized control and rushed upon, done one of southern rushes biggest cities and then dance north towards the capital must go then several hours later, pre collision suddenly called off the operation. he said he wanted to prevent bloodshed and that his intent was never to overthrow the government. that's the way

up until that mutiny. pre collision was seen as a loyal ally of the kremlin leader. after serving a prison sentence for robbery, pre collision worked his way up to a successful restaurant owner in st. petersburg, earning him the nickname, put in chef, eventually led to catering contracts for the russian government. his next business venture was quite different. the founding of private militia, known as the wagner group in 2014 the same year rush legally annex crime jo from ukraine frequency and also established a media group including a troll factory. the united states and other countries accused of trying to interfere in the elections as after rushes full scale invasion of ukraine faltered . pre collision began hiring thousands of soldiers, including convicts to fight and wagner units eating the crumbling wherever they are . perhaps the biggest triumph was taking the eastern ukrainian city of buck mode.

after months of fighting and in which watches regular army had been unable to prevail over ukraine out for some of those automatic lot. but his pre cushing found himself more and more in the spotlight. he used it to rail against the rushes, military leadership and its conduct of the war. so that the, including the accusation that was not providing his mercenaries with ammunition. i want it and he's pretty green. skewed with the civilian leadership escalated when he refused to let his biters be put under defense ministry command. when i bought a new model and so pre collision is launched. what he called a march for justice. i mean, we came here to put an end to the disgrace of our country. this year is a 1st step. what we're doing is right. it's to save russia. in moscow, a shocked vladimir putin called it treason, a stab in the back in the middle of war. can you give me 3 of any internal turmoil use a deadly threat twice, statehood for me to be to us as

a nation domestic. this will get the most, this is a blow. so russia, so all people, but not from one of our actions to protect the fatherland from such a threat. if you did, you will be talking to the with the, just with his mutiny aborted. pretty goes. you loved ross step on don to cheering crowds, but the weekend of chaos had looked at precarious future for himself and his wagner empire. and we want to dig a little deeper and bring in brian whitmore. he is in atlanta council, senior fellow for russian politics and joins us from washington. good to see mister whitmore and us presidential bible says he's not surprised by today's events. are you? oh, no, i'm not surprised at all. i mean, i, i expected from the moment that pre goshen aborted his, his march on moscow back in june. and he was effectively a dead man walking. i mean, the way you have to look at the way politics works in russia is to throw out your,

your political science textbooks and read the godfather. um, or watch good fellas are watching f 3 a watch a couple of seasons of the sopranos. this is a regime that operates like a crime syndicates, improvements the godfather, intrigue. goshen was a capital who obviously didn't understand his play. what of what is placed with us? and to quote, you know, the immortal character, omar, little from the, the us television series, the wire, you come at the, can you best not missed well? well for goes and came with the kid. and he miss we, i think this was just a matter of time and i think good. so you know what? i thought the risk of stating the obvious. this was a delta, this was an accident, this plane crash, the kitchen. um, so yeah i, i am not surprised by this one bit booms famously been decked if he bided his time and this is what a menu was expecting to see sooner or later. you say for goes and came with the king any mess, but it wasn't really a threat to fulton even after he had left russia as well. i mean, he, he,

he was a threat to put him in the sense that if he got away with this, then this can give other people ideas is the regime that, that is largely based on fear. and if you take fear out of the equation and if per goes and can come with a king and get away with it and continue, if you need to continue about his business that set a dangerous precedent. so i thinking again, we have to think of the logic of an organized crime syndicate. what happens in organized crime syndicate when a capital comes of the godfather is unsuccessful. that capital is not going to be one for this earth. and i think that is that's effectively what, what we saw here. so no, he was not an immediate threat to putin's rule in the sense that he was gonna overthrow to me tomorrow or even wanted to do that. but the fact that something went wrong and he couldn't get away with it if he got away with that, that would have damaged the machines legitimacy and you wrote very shortly. i.