still a replacing fossil fuels with renewable energy around the world. is this really possible documentary renewables revenue jobs november 25th on d w. the turkey is a longstanding member of nato with the alliance, the 2nd largest army. but its president is becoming an increasingly difficult partner. defending israel, a specialist president, come us as liberators. that posted diplomatic challenge for germany's chancellor, as he prepared to receive the turkish leader. under outer ones, rule turkey has flexed its muscles near and far seeking to project power from the caucasus to the mediterranean. according both russia and china. the presidents, autocratic policies at home, and just a brace of action is abroad or alienating partners. none the less depend on hampton

is turkey on a collision course with nato. today we're asking between nato and tomas what is, are the ones in the welcome to to the point. it is a great pleasure to greet our guest starting with the like career fun. she is a visiting researcher at berlin, social sciences center, and she has also reported in the past for turkish media. i'm also very pleased to welcome to tell us of an aria season international correspondence for germany soup georgia sites on. he has been based in the middle east and recorded, also from east envelope. and with us is dental is the lead to more mine. she is an independent correspondent for both turkish and german media. also for dodge of ela, add, keep as to join us from this stuff. bob,

welcome to you. do like just before departing for a visit to germany, president out of one stepped up, his harsh rhetoric on the conflict in gaza, declaring is real to be quote, a terrorist state and more criminal. and calling the crisis a matter of cross and crescent. that practically sounds like holy warfare. what's behind all this venom? i mean, you know, sense he's being typical aren't on this. he has done this in the past and not just when israel is concerned, but he's speaking to domestic, constitute that that's his main targets. i mean, we have elections coming in turkey municipal elections next year. so he's trying to mobilize the base, consolidated in turkey, public opinion, opinion is very pro palistine in against israel. there's always this on ty, isabel sentiments that he wants to, you know, sort of mobilize and i think he's also counting on the fact that fits. he will once

again get away with it because he's always gotten away with it in terms of his relations with the west. he doesn't expect any of the precautions from nato and from your opinion wise, and it's pretty, let's tell us what you're hearing from people. there are these statements by otto on resonating with his political base, but also with other took her citizens. well, actually as we are divided into 2 nations, we as we are a huge, a pull rice country at last sentences broke for his audience. but for the, for regular people, what again seem it doesn't for as the like set of course, it's a pro palestinian a community in turkey, but as long as harsh sports are not being accepted by the whole community. and so that thomas, this rhetoric of this bashing of israel, comes just about 6 weeks after the turkish and is rarely leaders actually met on

the sidelines of the united nations general assembly in new york. and add one, held out the prospect of intensive cooperation between the 2. and he clearly had some very concrete economic goals in mind. so what's with the abrupt switch? what do we all know that as long as a very populous to leader and the religion of his rather than talk you have been just dropped before. so as he's just riding the wave and the switching positions, i don't know if you can get so easily know because he said is or has no right of existence. but he's also not only concentrating on the trucks, population is also looking on the wider, wasn't in the world. and we all know that the perspective of the white and muslim world is different from the west. and you'll be, or german, or the united states perspective towards israel. so i think in the way to move limbo, he's probably say making points at the moment. let's take a closer look at our other ones,

abrupt switch from court and use realtor bashing it. and to promoting hate rather than the regional cooperation that he was seeking just 6 weeks ago. when never talk, just president out one has spoken about the middle east. recently, he verbally attacked israel and the west israel. we will denounce you as a rule, criminal in front of the whole world. you don't got the main culture. it's behind domestic unfolding. and garza is the west alma how much is not a terrorist organization, but a group as much as dean defending the land. as you guys said, was that go down the well with many of kentucky and coal south region. the west adder one makes no mention of the east riley victims of the how much terror attacks someone connected to both the palestinians and east royal adder. one initially offered to mediate out of one house and the mess is right daily. prime

minister netanyahu in september for the 1st time about how serious well to you about this new friendship. experts have long rollings that turkey has been a safe haven for her mass members. as recently as july out of one received is may or honey is a political leader of the militant islam as the organization in ankara pro palestinian and pro her mas. what is the turkish president's goal? let me go over to you do lunch and pick up on the final point that we heard in that report about turkey being a safe haven for him us. in fact, it has been described as have my 2nd largest base of operations after gaza and is dental is a major possibly the major source of financing for her mouse operations. so would you go so far as to say that without turkey support,

how much would not have the capacity to launch operations of the kind that it did on october 7th? actually, that's not a fair a comments, because if somebody might be just that for, for them to just be a political base, we know that they're being supplied by cuts out and by, you know, even so turkey is not induct induction case to keep that a big issue for how much, but we know that all that will be shows most of the patients. what do you need? somebody not gonna talk you later. thanks to let me ask whether either of our guests in the studio would disagree without assessment. i wouldn't disagree. i would agree if somebody was the main base of the airport position all over the world. i mean, from all the muslim, from illinois i'm countries, people are based and assembled because there's no place to be at home because of the they can move around. so i think if you want to know who financially supports you wrong, you have to i'm us,

you have to look to iran 1st and then to cut the political support for sure. and out on the supporting the muslim brotherhood movements all over the air. gold. i'm us is an off spring of the muslim brotherhood, so it's more or less logical that he supports i'm us and is doing it now in a very loud way. do you like, is there an ideological affinity between the a k t party everyone's party in turkey and him us to? yes, certainly. i mean, i don't have, i mean, isn't it as to must it over. you'll also add on, sees himself as he aspires to be. the leader of the muslim world, of course the muslim world is also delighted in terms of political power, but he certainly is on the side with him us. and i think it is important to see that. i mean, he's on the one hand, he is, he pursues well politic with oldest anti is rarely by to look for example, he doesn't sanction israel. there are reports, uninterrupted, for media of shipments from turkey. continuing to go to israel, you know,

he's doing trade because you know, he wants to. so that's the way i put it to. but then we also have to see the ideological side of it could be an ard on, and that is, he definitely is a, you know, it's political, he's on as long as, and i think it's not just, i think we have to be careful about the character i says just against the current is really government, but that is a div sentiment also interpret society of um on titusville on ty semitism which i think he also personally shares and he's playing, you know, so he's playing a game of both that as long as, as i said earlier, he can get away with us. you'll continue doing this. let me come back to the game of both with you. thomas. actually shortly after the october 7th attack by him us on israel. the other one said in a telephone call with german chancellor shots that he sees a turkey as being ready to mediate in this conflict. and clearly that's part of the

game that you talked about about being a leader in the ass lumnick world in the region. how see now with his statements thoroughly disqualified himself for any mediating roll or, or his ties to her mouth perhaps exactly what's needed? well, i tried to explain that ad one is with type that we extra situations. so he offered to me, do it enough, got us on the offer to me did in ukraine. he's also really successful, but he's always offering because it sounds good. but, and know i'm, i'm, i think he stepped the red line. you know, to come to germany after you said, israel has the right of existence as a federal state. it will be quite difficult for him to get common ground, the soles, but he's playing that game quite quite systematically and bill. and if i can ask you, um it was mentioned uh by uh, by d like just now israel is a very important economic partner for turkey. trade between the 2 is expensive and

it's also expanding uh, oil weapons. and it just at that meeting in new york that i mentioned between that on yahoo and other one in late september turkey also held out the prospect of much stronger cooperation on tech and on uh and uh, and on energy as well. and the 2 issues. it's so important i'm talking nowadays now we have the election on much and we are suffering is huge economic price because of both issues. i'd like to not open that direct economical, financial war against israel. as you know, anything to reason is a huge crime. you will need to keep, and if you are calling the country as a federal country, like i said for you to have. and now every day term sheet time sheets are going from turkey. chevy and still carrying food, carrying petrol from turkish costs to his room. so she is helping that piece calling. he's the cruise country he's, i think the reason. right,

so it seems early. so he's just facing and using it for him through the politics to be able to use it in 1st time it. this is the best speech stuff, so it's all just he kept cups of ice. he was a when a turkish saturday has been stop 10 years. so what has been stopped by israel, the horses and step toward the still hoping to the same address farm was standing with his own ships petroleum reserves. so it's just a game. a double game. do like explain something else that appears that at least 2 outside eyes to be a contradiction or the one condemns the bombing of guys up by is real, yet he regularly the orders were planes to bomb the kurdish territories in northern syria, including areas near the us troops that are battling isis. how does he rationalize that he doesn't have to because he's not asked these questions and certainly not in turkey because he has to go to almost total control over the media,

but also not over the by the west. and i think that's one of the main to main fundamental problems here. we don't see coverage in the middle states and actually of what he's doing in northern siri up, which is under turkish. what your patients, i'm sorry, is what you're buying. actually, another country against international law and of course, using, as he said, you know, bombing it as it is. and that's if you would ask him, he was kinda surprised that of concert terrorism because he considers the people id which you know, represents the armed a kurdish groups and syria as opposed organization which is not shared by the west . and the us not by the you to, from his world view, it makes total sense because it's old terrorism, decruz arcturus and on isabel is also right. that's how be characterized as of these kind of questions about because he doesn't have to explain any contradiction . she just says it's and does it, it is the west that beat it needs to hold him accountable for all of these,

you know, he's violations of international law, but also his violation. so if you were pm nissan, north. so let's talk about the west in the form of nato, a thomas in fact, and a one is the only nato leader who has expressed open support of him by us. that has been widely reported and questions has been asked yet. nato secretary general strong about play that down this week saying uh, i quote, the terrorist to go support for the terrace group on the part of everyone poses no problem for nato because the alliance plays no role in the is really, i'm us conflict really? well, i mean, what show stalls and drugs thing and so it is the 2nd biggest on me and they to, it's a very well equipped and very forceful on me. so adam plays the game with nato for quite a long time. he's blocking sweden's membership and they to address just fully nato

and they to kind of to, for, to kick him out later. just need some, they just need strong kids in voters. russell borders, the caucasus has both of ukraine. so what's, what's the need to do? so spoken, doug is trying to avoid the problem present. it sounds like thomas is telling us that turkey has made over a barrel or i'm sorry, i couldn't hear you. it sounds like thomas was saying to us that turkey has nato essentially over a barrel. that nato is so dependent on turkey that it cannot call out of actions that clearly conflict with the alliance is principles. absolutely, and as we know that ad one uses every christ to, to, to, to create more power for himself. but in ukraine you try to be the mediator just to gain much more void just to gain much more power in by using the could you shoot if you try to use it as

a leverage. now he's trying to use the same size between how much in between is royalties, the price would be the main data, but it, please don't forget that off this is the 1st effects of from us, or after the 1st effects of us doing well. so of course for 2 weeks, the chart to be mid day to when use that to a wasn't accepted, then you start the harsh. they could start these routes. so he always wants to gain a much more power from duck pricing. now he's trying to do the same thing and they to try to block something to gain much more things for him. so in fact, uh deluxe. he did blame the nato into the sweden joining nato for nearly 18 months after the most of the rest of the allies had agreed that sweden and finland absolutely should join. he now has presented the succession agreement to the turkish parliament. so he seems to have climbed down on that one, none the less. clearly turkey is a necessary nato partner, but is it

a reliable one? it certainly is not, but i think it is. and i wouldn't maybe share what i said earlier. that need to is the, i mean, of course it is dependent on to our, to but this kind of feeling of, or on the part of the e, u. natal and european governments that they, they, they need to talk to only and boulders are doing further. and i mean, these are peace of mind. there's a whole history of a piece of policies on the part of, you know, you are open to us, but especially europe, um, towards our delani, the black mentioned the refugee deal earlier. there is made to a question. and every time when the west shows the weakness and fear from that, just put that just in bold is an evil disorder. i think the here, the bellow says, i mean it's clearly the west that's more powerful then along the church. it is very much dependent on the west, militarily, economically, financially, etc. i think is really time for, for example, tomorrow the shots to publicly show,

you know, sort of strength and signal to turn to add on, add to turkey. that, you know, the west will not keep tolerating this kind of unreliable behavior on the part of, from a financial number. clearly added one prepares for his visit to germany with a vision of himself as a strong leader of a 100 year old republic with a golden future. but in fact, at home sky rocketing inflation. a plunging currency and under orthodox economic policies are provoking doubt, especially among the young the sandals, 6 months then to president added once the term in office. more and more people want to leave turkey, especially those that are young and education. one of them is true saying the stop an english teacher or do any best of a country a you are valuable person in turkey, you're not

a valuable person because you can be at the traitor beat any time. people are in just the over the repression and add ones. so for terry and system, but also over the economic crisis and the high cost of living most recently, the official inflation rate was at 61 percent fonts. it is difficult to get a visa, some pay smugglers and make the way to western europe via the balcony roots. in germany, almost a 3rd of all asylum seekers now come from turkey in october alone and the owners $10000.00. the 2nd largest proof off the syrian refugees who say, do you also wants to go to germany? is the elite losing space and how to once promise of a tucker century. and will come back to that question in just a moment. but thomas,

let me ask you, 1st of all about this as a transfer shelves is going to receive or the one just by quite a bit of pushback from a number of groups in germany who say he should not be doing. so. one of the reasons is that germany and z you were looking to turkey to help stem migration into the u. on the other hand, we've just heard that turkey is actually, or everyone's policies are actually triggering migration to this country. why is chancellor schultz receiving that other one at this moment? well, i mean the, the, the, you need soon because of the rest of these emails, i'm not gonna isn't, isn't of booking. as you has expected it to work, it just doesn't go this way. and that was playing this game with it. and the 2nd thing is, um, would you refuse to receive that on the drum and what does it really mean? it's, it's quite difficult. put pressure on ad on, on the palestinian issue on the, the, the israel issue is very, very difficult. it is not so easy and i do not agree with the will that the west

and that's not thought about the west because the west doesn't exist. but to put pressure on them, that's not that easy. there's not even the mechanism to exclude someone from they to mean what do you want to do? and he's playing the russell game. so i think he's in a very, very strong position and able to show that strong position when he comes to, to berlin. and the bullets use shows that curtis demonstrations are showing that terrors can move around in germany without any police control. and that's then it will come from the homeless terrorism issue. and then do you like the last time that you sat at this table? it was just a few days before the election, inter turkey, where you and the others had a sense that possibly the opposition might topple him from power. when you now look at the outlook for your country, you see a report like that. then the describing the economic misery, you know, so well, what is your sense of fear? turkey is going and how the west can maintain relations with this country to be as

doubtful from here. it's just getting worse and worse. the elections were indeed attends for such things. to start to change for the better, but it didn't work. i mean, just, we now have a crisis, for example, between the high courts and turkey, where a high court of appeals openly. okay, he's a criminal complaint against members of the church is constitutional court for a judgement that they've, they've a deliberate step upset are the one so it is he is going to consolidate his one man rule more and more, you know, his complete control of the judiciary the judge, you know, the media economy. so the only thing is, i mean, the economy is not doing well. so that's one question. if there is a serious economy crisis, death might perhaps bring his end, but splits me his just so strong. and the other is of course, the west. i mean there are still things can, that can be done you expression for example, you know,

i mean there's no reason why churches still has the especial status. although of course, clearly biological kid, i can pull school criteria. i mean that's something that to do, i'm to use, you know, i mean sanctions except, i mean there's just things to be done on the part of the west and you and natal. um, but other, but i don't see that happening too because of this feeling that they're dependent on to receive my fish and etc. so i'm afraid torque is going to go. a situation is going to go. i'll continue going be back lea, until i don't know. maybe an economy, the bigger kind of crisis, but as long as he's alive and might see, i just do not seeing the short term how, how this is going to change your mind. if i come back to our title, as you remember, it is between nato and him. us what is, are the ones and from every thing that all of you have said, it's clear that his aim is to maintain and expand his own power. if that is the case should terminate essentially to be receiving and supporting him

at this critical moment when germany itself is striving to show solidarity with israel and fight anti semitism here at home, the same anti semitism, he is provoking with his statements. the cutting stars is not resolution, of course he can't accept he can be. and mister schultz said acceptance, i don't. and they, they do big company in contact, but the thing is, yes, it is west, let's say germany needs to, to invest and it's, so what does this thing starts add on? it's wristbands to form too much, especially in financially means. like if you, if you, if you're just support team, if you could just make your feel up to you just the strong guy, he will take it as pull mode. that's ad one's way as you all know. but at the same time with sometimes not sometimes actually should always be by a conduct sheet has to be connected with a democratic cruise. i'm sure you know,

meaning that it will butcher and that has been bending tricky. people cannot access the website without using vpn every day and other joining this is being the rest of it. i hope you'll start this to 20 bucks a couple of months ago. so things are getting boomers here and rest when they're having contract. having come with additional sidewalks, they should 3 my team and use do public, which they have a monkey. let me go quickly to thomas cutting ties. is not an answer says do that to you would agree this i would fully agree to that well depends which ties i can sometimes needs to be cut you accession process. present status, for example, should be listed sort of should be suspended from the council of europe. i think certain type needs to be broken. thank you very much to all of you for being with us. thanks to our viewers for to and again, do check out our youtube channel and let us know what you think. save soon, the,

the, the,

into the conflicts own. with tim sebastian foss, you may need to talk to many of stuff coughing. my guess this week is do we have to see the kind of how does it does this today? we may have no idea conflict in 30 minutes on d w. imagine how many portions of lots of turn out in the world climate change. the

story faces much less the way from just one week. how much was going to really get we still have time to work. i'm going or plus this sometimes a seed is of all you need to allow big ideas to grow or bring an environmental conservation to wife with learning facts like global ideas. we will show you how climate change and environmental conservation is taking shape around the world . and how we can make a difference. knowledge grows through sharing, download it now for the

the the, the, the respects the,

the business needs to be and who is coming to you live from burle. it is real says it has discovered a total shaft at the el cheapo hospital in guns of these really military says the own verified pictures suggest from us militants were using the medical facility to commend their operations claims as a must in honors. also coming up, israel says it has recovered the body of a hostage taken by him, us militants on october 7th. the body of the booty to the place was reportedly found by troops near the el cheapo hospital in scots.