in the calls when we say they're about never getting up every weekend on d. w. as with so many african come fix, the latest fighting into don has brought this misery to huge numbers of civilians this time. even the un has been shocked by what zip code the unprecedented speed of this integration. whatever happens to africa's low loss promise to silence the guns, but we bring him 6 ounces to such questions. he's a sudanese born bridges millionaire. with the foundation, the researches africa's problems and rewards, those who tried the sofa. does he ever lose faith in africa that feedbacks in some

countries? unfortunately, one of them is my country. but we, we would find a way for one of the core of africa's problems. he says this via governance from why is it still so prevalent? how was it that african leaders voted themselves immunity from prosecution to the most serious crimes and what's behind the refuse or some states to condemn most goes invasion of ukraine? is it payback for the rows of colonial, occupies the mo, most welcome to come fix a thanks, dave, us, you've tried so many years to promote a governance in africa. in some countries you've had some success, but the violence never seems to go away. in sudan, the country of your bus decades of fighting another killing has become again, an honest how personal is this conflict to you?

is the very best instead of work. and i will be able to have this, i've done this. and what we have here is to size um to this fighting a button in, in our capital. each side wants power and with power comes financially as well as this is still a blessed story. and this is tory afford, yes, i made it to the cause is essentially old story unfortunately. and enough is enough for all those guys, despite the treasures by both sides to respect humanitarian principles. that hasn't been the slightest effort to avoid civilian casualties. why is that? they don't care. absolutely. i don't see the shift. each of them think they can somehow win this don't. they cannot be a, we're not here. they cannot be,

will not only lose us ever this find is losing. and so then these people are losing, the little frustrated we have is being destroyed, detective easy is in a mess. and most civilians are buying them, sold. yes. it's, it is, it is very sent. do you ever lose faith in africa? no. despite to this, that's going to get, but that's when can 3 out of $54.00 can cause on index. in the last, over the last 10 years, you know, we would use an index. so measure of governance in africa. the majority of episodes of applicants living in a bit of government countries that 10 years ago. so are moving forward. that's it backs in some countries. unfortunately, one of them is my country. but we, we would find a way for one. but this conflict is you've also said is taking place against the

really dismal tapestry of backsliding. democracy as the number of states, bad governments. you've quoted africa's own goal and you said we are responsible for how much of africa shit is your sense of responsibility for this? we okay, this the funding governor, governor society. i bought a number of, of, of deliverables. one of them, of course, is human rice delivery a bunch of dish and it's, it's not, i don't have boxes, you know, corner me then is a human developments. and the security and the picture, the bishop is really mix yes. to course, over the last 10 years, i forgot made the point of progress in the area of infrastructure and human development bits of educational based on hands of non secured, no security, i'm sort of low, is going down and actually why,

why is the connection between the 2 that the problem is marginalization of minorities and sometimes a, it's, it's inclusion, a creative assessment. uh. then you have also extend the effective as like climate change with your end up with conflicts between they have those of the farmers. and if that's not to manage, it ends up, it's a basic, a conflict. so that happened in the for i didn't have a claimant on legitimate, but she has been using vinnish just to sort out the probably that end up and see 100000 people get. so it is, it, is, it mismanagement also of natural disaster habiting because of climate. that's one element you, you said earlier this year we started to see cou data, which we saw it was something in the past. we started to see this phenomena of the strong man. it's something we need to fight back against. how do you fight these so

called strong men who are entrenched in the countries across our african, protected sometimes by foreign policy, often by criminal games that kill for the sake of it. how. how do you fight back against these? i think john, john, people are looking at what's happening in thoughtful weatherstone. banners. so that for the test he is in today shed general, but she was infection about $430.00 is created for this military organizational. now there's no time off for him to have an army. he committed to the support forces and called him him id. you know, it just hasn't. for him, it is my board section and the, the collision center is just have the army. his party has him an issue. he had ordered the stuff, which is just kind of just quotes. so to use, hit the same kids who grew up on the he's or go to the buys. what volume you this

city for the most a. this is a and b will will give us whole because they will not accept the soldier. they will not accept a tylen need. they will not accept the depth of ships and the width of just the need for 3, it is now going solution. so then, because the young people would not accept this or just you, you say, you say that you say that, but that's one of the more depressing by products of conflict and back governance is that africans are showing increasing tolerance for the role of military in politics. according to afro barometer report last month, that view is particularly strongly young people, 18 to 35 year old. after a barometer reported that over the last decade, opposition to military rule has declined significantly. now a slim majority, there's a majority, is willing to accept military intervention if elected officials abuse the past, that has to be dangerous for them. of course,

at least it is dangerous. and the problem is you take guinea, for example, we have to have, as the con, the ap using fall off his power and then trying to deal with the constitution. simplest, the, the, the, the position i'm fed and a guy who was a democrat before getting follow didn't power gets to his head. and now being the data. when electrical came again, is guy, you understand why people say, oh, as one definitely good to do for him. so don't know to be the supporting committee to the cool heavy to get rid of the really a quarter of a civilian who really using the constitution end up losing his body if uh yeah, its spectrum. good to me though. so, but then, but then the problem is you are, you are a blessing, the song was a different, i mean that, that is, it doesn't work like that. that's why i,

i us be we'll need to live that there is also the loss to to seek z for of the bad z that's. it's also important to know what you're going for. and this is, that is this sort of ended up meant as support usability. cool. again, is that somebody effort to the 2nd but the tim, tim, about about the, the, the, the strong man. unfortunately, this is something we can passion of work with only in africa. our guys in africa, lou cut out. i'm lucy or just string, been strong. mean all over the place. you know, and we have probably not states will have delta t last. russia will have china web for the beans. what. how many strong men of them we see this fraction of a strong board is,

is coming back again. what about this? and i was, i look at this and say all that is wonderful when it comes to do like, are all the button why i cannot be like to look at and why cannot be like yeah, this is a time for a strong man unfortunately. and we need to wake up to that is not an african phenomenon. it's a global phenomena. i'd like to talk back and go back to the bottom of this has taken precedence done at the moment um one to the violence according to the un, which should both sides trampling on humanitarian. go back in 2010. the new york times bureau chief, east africa, reported on how come back in africa have moved from soldier verse a soldier to soldier versus civilian the most domestic this fight is he said, what bevels with the cause stable predators. and for them, tara became not just a means, but an end. to what extent is that still it is. it is unfortunately, paper that

a number come with some countries are, but i think i'll have seen like a blank was in the list in the last few years. unfortunately, we thought we finished, i'm thought that was you. cool. you know the disease at a, in the 70 sixties and seventies where every morning we used to have a cool with i'm living. i think we thought that this finished unfortunate is coming back and something we need to be careful about this. then that gives us an extra division question. i mean, i know it is estimated to say this, but in all honesty, do we need armies elastic? why do we do that? what does the job of items the item is suppose to protect? you have bought the or who is it and the applicant can to be so i think that most of applicant can these 2 to have any was the between applicant countries. i don't record any why you need the arms. who's been though, is this money to get those guys, bags and guns an arrow blades when i want the one to come on to that and yeah,

i'm in a moment to, to, i, i just, i don't think we need, it needs this all nice. and those guys has been goals as many of them, and then they come much with us with the copy that. i mean what's his last week? so those government told the un human rights council that it was basically none of the u. n's business. what was happening inside to done was an internal affair. they said, and the student needs armed forces. so of course of launched attacks. and this strikes intensely populated subsidiaries in the capital, as you said, they were simply doing their constitutional duty. what do you say to a government like that? does it make you angry for the hobby bombing its own people in the capital is just doing its constituted in my textbook and government? that's not, that's not the shipment. what causes those guys government? it's the only government they have the address is people just took it by paula by guns. yeah. look you lifted that no to drive, look at it, but yeah, i mean, those guys just, you know, making. busy a lot of shows in general,

those on the f i never have active bouncing this while the african states that african union actually is, is, is suspended. so then that's it. that's all they've done. what else comes they do? what as the problem is applicant here and it hasn't well, just on the bottom me for a long time, english at this time, the force of the african union actually be finite and should be on then it is able to go and deal with all of those claim and as of categories and whatever, unfortunately, actually comes in and it hasn't been hasn't good. it has pentium good. you, the tensions doesn't fit, but it doesn't realize all the motor power. what. what, what happens assignments with guns by one and t 20. yes. what happens, what, what about the sort of the concepts? so get the plastic, i need to double check with you guys what it is including accounts. i think a lot of people have forgotten about the square to cause is defined by the veto is of the 5 comes, i guess it's by lice, with the whole bubbly order is in a mess. the whole public, the whole, or the whole world of this. you know,

all these global instructions, i miss you quoted accounts. it is important. cannot do anything. yeah. for can you ask me because this doesn't have the means to accept it. they've had all the extra bliss. i think he's more of the wage which included the codes have kind of even, but, and so we're not seeing much of that. that's where i saw it on the sidebar. this is that, did it in friend, this is that did it. we had the confidence 2 weeks ago, i had most of our keywords on the old guys in the conference and was clear what the stand once you want to do. that if it's your village comes to kind of to see what i can look even if, but it's on obedient and what's going on for them. shift for you have access all over the come to do you, have you talk to either of the generals that are causing this concept to sit down at the moment. i know i, i don't have enough common ground even to start the conversation. i believe was those guys have given us the should the date will they if i to i. ready i hope so.

what's the, what's the chance of? it was one day. it would come one day look. but she had ended up in prison. i live with said, oh, what? but, but she unnecessary, nobody could touch him. he wasn't prison. so what happened to court? what happened to african quotes, pushing for african solutions, and offering african accountability by what happened to that i thought from gimme and central african republic, where the trial i think is important to support the i. c. i o. projected to there is an attempt to replace icy without an applicant court. so i don't think that was the right decision actually. and again, you look at the way that go to is good you too, which is which is cannot. it cannot, but it's cute but is it is yes, i gave one cells in the other 2 for me. exactly. so i, as i said, why is i yeah. is this going to end up really was getting taxi drivers

and official men, but they're not my good. it's gotta do that. why was this special court? it's, it's, it just, it city, it just some visits wants to executive sense from vice and see. and that was a bundle of what to do a i'm sorry about that. so there's no quick fixes for this was done that's going on and it will spread to the region, so maybe spread to well west stuff. what has that? what about south? so don, is that next? okay, is it a different institution? so, so that i've come to it, but i think we cannot give up, but then we'll have to deal with it quickly before the fire splits. who is all these will continue to hold. what i mean? as it is very encouraging to see united states is involved. so you gotta be as involved wasn't done scientists or something, i think i knew and yeah, this involved and yeah, it does involve the cost is invalid. so our messages,

yeah. most of those guys would have that'd be conference in there will be our foundation. i know those guys was there and the message to everybody is we need to speak with one voice now or the other voice or the nearby can. so this was one voice, and we need to ensure that we would this fire out would need to buy in any x most of our to the division of death. and we need to, to be able to look either we have or we're going to go off to you to you to util, telling me about foreign armies being in african countries. i think there are 13 foreign armies actually at the moment in various african countries. how healthy do you think it is for africans to, to welcome in rushes less than the group? of course, um, 5 minute for instance, notorious in ukraine and not expanding its footprint across from tops of students that are acceptable. and you'll notice who invited them many of the ships

in the number of western countries. this being comes to nation, that some african countries have been ambivalent to, in the case of south africa, mutual over russia's invasion of ukraine. is this payback for the west for them, for the wrongs of the colonial era is that while i know the rule is the colona, the deputy it's deflect, judge illusion. america is usually called for the a, a good game in the violation of the silver and see what else i can see. have you create of your claim and many african people said choose me. what did america do? any of that was that could be good. was that not breach of security? so for the other countries. so why did they condemn both been hectic but from

us to woods. this is a jewish and for what was a little bit media and weiss, i think you had mentioned how was this, what is your solution because your money object it to the invasion of that i what is wrong for us to was is it is usually because any excuse me, you have him to correct that is neutral, really besides the, as it is kind of use your boy. i the, these items are the collection of rooms or those you give me or out of the rules only applies to russia. look us, let's look be hey, book this is appropriate. this is the problem we need to look at the middle or sometimes the relies. what do we say and what you do? what happens in libya? would them probes this country, we never put it together, but again, is that the excess doubled. what do you make? look, i, i, let's, let's be honest,

i did it with this stuff. so it looked like the width is in the wyatt on or romantic, nobody side. okay, so, so don't lift. you don't lift. you have other people and say, you look icon them. and i think it is a problem. it's unacceptable for russia to video created. and there's no question, but the simplest i've called the american envision of over that because this is, is equivalence. and we need to remember that, i just hope that people, when you talk about the natural rules, you should applies to everybody, you know, exceptionally while we bring. what do you make of america's charge? last week that south africa had loaded onto a sanctioned russian freighter. if you make of that chart i, i'm really confused. exactly as to why the bus,

the guys as well. we only have south africa's versions. so saying he apologized that he didn't know what was your tell, he didn't apologize in public. oh, i saw a guy who wrote that in bbc website actually that he didn't like know south africa says he apologize to that but, but then they denied the judge. but when it, when they did denied, the wording was on big us. they said we didn't approve any arms to russia. it wasn't sanctioned or approved by us. i suggest that was something to some place that i paid would would i'm afraid that south africa has a number of issues i think. and where is easy? where is the government? uh, i think in c, broberg we is losing it's, it's a grip on power effectively as it some somewhere today that is possible is that to

them before they even know that we have of what happened. they cannot admit that because they say ok then this instead of what if he's at with i'd say the light is also terrible. i've that made a comfortable song. i was also a medical rewards. now, a more accurate zone before the, i mean, drink acted as a web, as of mazda of a section on the which is became obvious, actually, budgeting, throat in the world. the amenities have been very accurate and they bought it. so i did it well, it's not, and i don't know what does it to. so what happened there? but i notice these are to innovation of governments in south africa. i was big public about this, right? in the time we have left, we talked a lot about what african countries have or haven't done. what do you,

what the west fate briefly, what do you want the west to 5. i think i think the west need really to we have in a much with our way, look at what is happening here. go with the game. i don't have the problem all you. it'll be under the last 20. you'll be at least an applicant, lee that was signed and that's out of published in 50. nobody see if unless everybody see if i think i need support, we need to $100000000.00 budget and then nothing happens. good with but no the, it's nothing done. then we will hold, holding coffee, it's an excellent nationalist. and the other thing, the guys, even our had surfaced the support, nothing. okay. and that was the, the bad behavior tv, but at this job, because then then let's see if i'm this everybody see if they know of that. so

right. know and gauge for the same as i know it's after he left for the summit. 60 you africa. so yeah, that's what this you have to confirm. it was good it, but you can see the different more. that's very important. look at the after got that. so there's no cover it $2300.00 out of sitting here everywhere. gentlemen, in america, us and, and bridget also seen the f $23.00 young dollars. i figured it's good enough to, there's any money. okay. and now does it say, what is happening when you create has a problem? when greece has a financial problem, the fund will it bank immediately search it out. now what's happening in zambia, what's happening instead of the other 2 years? does it act as you want them to close that? um and you want them to come down also on the list. it cash it doesn't find the

lowest, the $100000000000.00 a $100000000000.00 they get most. let me not advocate will wisdom companies like united pricing? i yes. and that's pricing and broke it down, you know, a lot of shifting and you know that i'm sick, i just want you to act. and so with these really the bits of the heavy i'm for my friends and the was really is a bit out of what it, all of them who did have a bit of financial institution because these financial institution, i'm not said of in this house that dominated by wisdom, most do know some ideas on the boards, etc. there's no voice in the board decision institutions from the guys and supposed to be the customer of the clients of this, of these banks. that's why these banks would focus on greece or focusing on your credit. right. but so the lack of where to submit to the board that doesn't know

what is what does that be a small avery and we run out of time. thank you very much indeed. come fix on that and see his thank you the

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